Guild Wars 2

What’s the general consensus on this one?

I decided to try a warrior in pvp since, to me, they are one of the easiest to kill. I got no less than three people in three matches telling me how OP wars were with very unfriendly diction.

When I responded that I thought in spvp, tpvp warriors were not considered very good, I got an explosion of expletives on how noobish I was and did not know a thing. So, is this true? Did I play an OP class? Or is this just poor sportsmanship that I would be getting more of if I played a thief or mesmer?

I used an axe-mace-shield. That’s it. I didn’t even take another mainhand weapon.

Eviscerate can be traited and built up to be a very powerful attack. I’ve seen Rifle’s Kill Shot crit for 15k. Warrior’s are a bit like Jack-of-all-trades, Master-of-all. Their ranged attacks some say are better than Ranger. They have high defence, high HP, high attack, have that stupid nyerking 100 Blades skill (which as a Warrior, I can’t stand! Only noobs use it), invincibilty for 5 seconds, block for 5 seconds, can support with shouts and banners, and out of all the professions, have the least amount of bugs with their traits.

Some would say they’re OP. I personally don’t think so. I just pity those who spam Frenzy + Bull’s Charge + 100 Blades. It requires no skill and ruins the game.

When people play one character profession, every other profession that kills them is OP. It is the grass is greener scenario. The way you are playing your warrior most likely wouldn’t be considered OP. A lot of people complain about 100 Blades warriors (Greatsword) Because it puts out serious damage if specced glass cannon. Speccing this way opens the person up to an array of faults. CC and mitigating the initial attack, usually makes the defender successful in thwarting these builds. The 100B senario you just roll out of the way and you are good to go.

Warrior is considered one of the more powerful classes at taking out a single target with a specific build. They have good defense due to heavy armor and the ability to use shields. Depending on the build warriors are highly susceptible to kiting. Greatsword/rifle warriors are not as susceptible but they have a major lack of defensive abilities and can be brought down much easier than a greatsword/X-Shield warrior.

If you played a thief well, you will get much more complaints due to stealth and peoples inability to find flaws and weaknesses in the glass. (you blow on them and they die)

If you played mesmer, you have every tool in the tool belt to be successful. I would argue that you have less burst than say a D/D thief or Greatsword Warrior but you have many more abilities that allow you to be successful in pvp.

Of course build is everything but in my opinion on power of these classes from strongest to weakest (not account for WvW):
Mesmer
Warrior
Thief

As someone who plays Warrior/Engineer exclusively, I’d say the warrior is the weaker of the two. I feel they’re fairly one-dimensional. Though that could be because Engi has so many skills compared to everyone else.

I am MASSIVELY jealous of the Warriors Rifle 1 on my engi. They’re basically the exact same skill, but Rifle 1 is I believe literally twice as good as Pistol 1.

The warrior suffers from being the jack of all trades but master of none. This makes them a very good class for hot joins, but they suffer in tourneys. The only viable role they have in tourneys is the glass cannon greatsword, which is very good at killing unsuspecting foes, but top tier teams tend to have good awareness. This is probably why the warrior is the least represented class on the qp leaderboards.

ajlee.2607:

Eviscerate can be traited and built up to be a very powerful attack. I’ve seen Rifle’s Kill Shot crit for 15k. Warrior’s are a bit like Jack-of-all-trades, Master-of-all. Their ranged attacks some say are better than Ranger. They have high defence, high HP, high attack, have that stupid nyerking 100 Blades skill (which as a Warrior, I can’t stand! Only noobs use it), invincibilty for 5 seconds, block for 5 seconds, can support with shouts and banners, and out of all the professions, have the least amount of bugs with their traits.

Some would say they’re OP. I personally don’t think so. I just pity those who spam Frenzy + Bull’s Charge + 100 Blades. It requires no skill and ruins the game.

Actually their ranged attacks ARE better than a Ranger…

obsolete.4879:

They are very good bunkers

…
really…
This is why they were dominating position on TPvP teams as bunkers, causing the massive flood of tears about unkillable bunkers ruining the meta…

Owait, that was guardians and elementalists. Necros and engis are also far better bunkers than warriors.

Actual defensive mechanics such as blocks, dodging, evasion, blinds, knockbacks/downs etc, health regain through regen/healing, movement abilities are what make good bunkers. Not armor type. Warriors make terrible bunkers which is why high ranking warriors don’t try to spec for it and you see basically 1 successful pvp build being run in tourneys if you even see a warrior at all: GS/x.

@OP what you saw was a result of hotjoin pvp being terrible, players there being terrible and spec’ing poorly as glass cannons without stunbreaks and such. After you play tourneys for 20+ ranks (JUST tourneys for 20 ranks or more) you will see almost every opinion thrown around in hotjoin is based on terrible players with terrible builds making terrible decisions. Warriors are great at blowing up bad players so in hotjoin they do well. Warriors begin to taper off against average players and full on suck against good players because it doesn’t have the same quality of utility and tools at it’s disposal to keep the class competitive vs other classes being played at high skill level.

what it comes down to i think is that results matter:

warriors are the LEAST represented class in the leaderboards, this is not because people dont like play warriors

warriors in tpvp are very 1 dimensional, sure they can deal massive damage, but to do so they have to spec glass cannon and have to give up their tanking and cc

also, dont let the hp and armor fool you, warriors made terrible bunkers: guardian, ele, necro, and engi were/are all better bunkers than warriors (warrior comes in a poor 5th out of the 8 classes here)

Maybe someday the meta will shift and teams will need someone to lockdown targets or interrupt ressers. Warriors do have a ridiculous amount of cc.

Warr is nowhere overpowered. Actually whatever you decide to do with your war, be it DPS, condition damage or bunker, you can find at least one other class in the game that can do it better. And that has ALWAYS been the case – the jack of all trades is never very popular. What you want in your team is classes that can do their job the best. Anyone who says Warrior is OP really has no clue about this game… And I’m not saying Warrior is useless either, I just can’t seem to find a role for them that I would feel good about playing it in tournaments. The best role I found for them for now would probably be shout build with hammer and maces.

Appart from 100B build that I don’t even want to try because it’s just stupid to me having to blow 3 skills for something that might end up in a kill. It’s a stupid weak build. If I wanna burst people down I might aswell go thief…

Maybe if there weren’t thief and mesmers warrs would be op. However, warrs get completely dominated (like all other classes) by those two.

Warriors are not OP.
Sure the burst is one of the best damage wise, its also worse than a thief if you miss the intial hit.
A theif can miss the opener, and still force the win in a 1v1, a warrior can, but the skill and effort increases dramatically to allow it to happen.
Plus 1 for jack of all trades, master of none.
Personally I like running Hammer + Sword/Sheild for mass CC in hotjoins.
Nothing makes me giggle quite like shutting someone down for 8+ seconds.

Warriors not OP. Mind Wrack Mesmers and D/D Thieves are still the OP builds/classes and Warrior is far from these two. Dodge mechanic simply doesn’t work against these two last builds while dodge works perfectly fine against the best Warrior builds.

Warriors are one of the most versatile and strongest classes in the game. The #1 player in the world is a warrior, he just hasn’t put in his information.

Kill Power, innate tankiness, and supporting ability such as frenzy and balanced stance make them gods of tpvp. They just aren’t played that way…other than by ONE person

I play a ranger and i’ve honestly never found warriors that difficult,they’re much easier to predict that most of the other classes

Powerr.3649:

Warriors are one of the most versatile and strongest classes in the game. The #1 player in the world is a warrior, he just hasn’t put in his information.

Kill Power, innate tankiness, and supporting ability such as frenzy and balanced stance make them gods of tpvp. They just aren’t played that way…other than by ONE person

Just because one person can make the most out of Warrior, doesn’t mean they aren’t getting buffed based on statistics. I bet right now even if Warriors get buffed they would still be an “underpowered” class.

Off-topic, I bet I know how that Warrior you’re talking about plays though. Its definitely not bulls charge on top of balanced stance and frenzy, that’s for sure.

There are some wariors that can beat my ele, mainly the ones that are built that way. DPS warriors are easy to take down. DPS thieves are easy to beat on a bunker type ele. A glass cannon s/d ele vs glass cannon warrior or glass cannon thief is just stupid. Was running some new builds last night, couldn’t kill a pure bs thief due to lake of damage on my ele. Had some troubles against pure damage wars as well. Switch back to me more tanky dd build on my ele everything is fine again.

I don’t think warriors are op. I don’t think thieves are op, they just like killing things instantly. What I do think is that other glass cannon classes need to be buffed. That would be hard for eles, as tanking eles would get a damage buff as well. But using all attunement skills except water against a glass cannon thief, and him not even being phased, turning invis and killing me with 3 skill is just annoying.

Sebyos.4089:

Warriors not OP. Mind Wrack Mesmers and D/D Thieves are still the OP builds/classes and Warrior is far from these two. Dodge mechanic simply doesn’t work against these two last builds while dodge works perfectly fine against the best Warrior builds.

Explain how you think this is the case. Explain how dodge works fine against warriors but not against thieves and mesmers. I’ve not had any trouble dodging anything except a from stealth attack on either of these professions. In the case of a thief, they’ll get an opening, then you dodge and remove their ability to finish you. Unless you are a glass cannon, you should have a decent survival rate. In the case of a mesmer, especially a shatter (mind wrack) mesmer, the shatter is pretty well telegraphed. If you see all the illusions run at you, roll through them. If they are directly in your face, it is the same as any other very quick attack. Difficult to dodge. Luckily for you, the only illusions that sit in melee range are sword clones.

Mesmer, Thief, Guardian, Ele, Eng all stronger then the warrior imo.

Powerr.3649:

The #1 player in the world is a warrior, he just hasn’t put in his information.

Proof? Elo, matchmaking rating, streams and movies, tournament wins etc please.

Xom.9264:

Mesmer, Thief, Guardian, Ele, Eng all stronger then the warrior imo.

Also this

Powerr.3649:

Kill Power, innate tankiness, and supporting ability such as frenzy and balanced stance make them gods of tpvp. They just aren’t played that way…other than by ONE person

Yea, Frenzy and Balanced Stance are really rare utilities among Warriors…95% of GS Warriors have them on their bar.

Balanced Stance offers no group utility for your information, unless all of a sudden a self stability buff qualifies as group support. If that was the case, each and everything would qualify in the same way.

Usually wars are like BS or HS thieves….scaring new players without experience and making everyone else, who counters them easily, laugh…. Burst thieves and almost every war, from kill shot to HB (90% of them) are ridiculously easy to avoid and kill…if you know how they work they’re going to die. I personally think that probably there are more balanced and usuful specs for wars (Like thieves with S/D for example, that i used to run and still running after patch, still really good with some traits and gear changes) but noone seems to give a crap about being useful

Braxxus.2904:

Powerr.3649:

The #1 player in the world is a warrior, he just hasn’t put in his information.

Proof? Elo, matchmaking rating, streams and movies, tournament wins etc please.

Xom.9264:

Mesmer, Thief, Guardian, Ele, Eng all stronger then the warrior imo.

Also this

Actually the very first r50 was an engineer…

Archaon.6245:

I personally think that probably there are more balanced and usuful specs for wars

This is true, hell even more useful ways to play one exists.

Archaon.6245:

Actually the very first r50 was an engineer…

I meant I was agreeing with the guy I quoted that engi’s are superior to warriors in all honesty. Engi’s are very versatile, with a myriad of available options to them at any given moment along with some serious synergy in their build traits they can play with.

Really the only problem with engineers are bugs, not design flaws.

^
Obviously because Engi is still a no-brainer class. At least vs. team comps without Necros cause Necros shut them down anyways.

Schwahrheit.4203:

^
Obviously because Engi is still a no-brainer class.

You make absolutely no sense.
Engi has a far higher skill-cap than warriors do, many more situational abilities at their disposal for on the fly decision making than warriors do. Because of basic class design warrior takes far less thought to operate successfully than engi’s or ele’s. Warriors are checkers, eles/engi’s are closer to chess.

Do you think getting carried by constant boons 24/7 and spamming 1-2-3-4-5 while being able to chain CC isn’t no-brainer? Far higher skill-cap my kitten Seriously, its no different from a Mesmer where people hide their lack of skill. That’s okay though, Necros are important in team comps now and Guardian bunkers better while Thief definitely roams better. Engi’s get shut the hell down and is out-classed. Easily. Just as bad as you think on Warrior’s case because at least Warrior has options vs. conditions corrupt boon and burst damage in general.

Ain’t going to do jack if you have no boons to carry you after you use your “I messed up” button.

Like seriously dude the only classes that you deem “balanced” are “broken” in reality. But you do have a point, why should they balance around the Warrior class when the class takes too much work to be effective.

Warriors are not OP. The only players getting stomped by them are the ones that have a dual monitor set-up and are watching.. well you get where I’m going. I play guardian and destroy them all the time even with their 100b frenzy keyboard smash combo.

Schwahrheit.4203:

Do you think getting carried by constant boons 24/7 and spamming 1-2-3-4-5 while being able to chain CC isn’t no-brainer? Far higher skill-cap my kitten Seriously, its no different from a Mesmer where people hide their lack of skill. That’s okay though, Necros are important in team comps now and Guardian bunkers better while Thief definitely roams better. Engi’s get shut the hell down and is out-classed. Easily. Just as bad as you think on Warrior’s case because at least Warrior has options vs. conditions corrupt boon and burst damage in general.

Ain’t going to do jack if you have no boons to carry you after you use your “I messed up” button.

Like seriously dude the only classes that you deem “balanced” are “broken” in reality. But you do have a point, why should they balance around the Warrior class when the class takes too much work to be effective.

You’re like Fox News man. It’s crazy.
Does your warrior somehow miraculously have 20 abilities to cycle through? Where do I download this patch. Warrior design is functionally like hitting a triangle while playing a d/d ele (which you’ve deemed easy mode and skill less before) is like playing the piano. Engi’s aren’t that far behind depending on spec and kit loadout.

I really wish you would stream man, your ideas on the warrior seem to come from some different game when warrior classes actually had depth and some of the highest ability counts and options available to the classes within them, along with dynamic mechanics (stance dancing, auras, manifestations, combination attack chains).

You know, things which give a higher skill-ceiling.

Braxxus.2904:

Schwahrheit.4203:

^
Obviously because Engi is still a no-brainer class.

You make absolutely no sense.
Engi has a far higher skill-cap than warriors do, many more situational abilities at their disposal for on the fly decision making than warriors do. Because of basic class design warrior takes far less thought to operate successfully than engi’s or ele’s. Warriors are checkers, eles/engi’s are closer to chess.

Oh COME ON! Let’s not start the “higher skill-cap” crap again, it’s always this stupid myth when some people in some MMO somehow decide that some class has higher skill-cap than others. What’s so high about engi’s skill cap? Bang into battle, blind the foe, let him miss, knock him back, daze him, switch to flamethrower, knock him back again, let him come close, blind him, switch to bombs, immobilize him, pop out big ol’ bomb, knock him back again, spam some more bombs, switch back to pistol, blind him again………….. 1 2 3 4 5, 3 5 4 , 1 2 3 4 5. CC spam, spam all the CC you have and you win. Please… No class in GW2 requires a genius to play, thus debating about it is false. Actually, playing a warrior I have to be more careful when I use my abilities so I don’t get dodged too much, since all warrior abilities are so easy to dodge, also because they’re kittening slow as hell. Just because someone has more abilities at his disposal doesn’t mean the skill cap is higher, it might be quite the opposite. Especially when he can access those abilities and switch between them without any cool down, like we can with engi.

samo.1054:

Oh COME ON! Let’s not start the “higher skill-cap” crap again, it’s always this stupid myth when some people in some MMO somehow decide that some class has higher skill-cap than others.

It’s not a “somehow” decide it’s a direct comparison of how many situational variables and options one has at it’s disposal at any given point in time to respond to stimuli vs another to achieve the same result.

It’s banging on a triangle (warrior) vs playing piano (d/d ele).

They might both take a modicum of skill to do, but one has a higher skill cap than the other with more possible choices to make at any moment.

Ya know if warriors were op’d I wouldnt complain to much because they SHOULD be a strong class. Thieves are a joke an anyone playing one most of the time should be ashamed.

I dont mind dying to warriors when on my Ele, Mesmer, Guardian or Engineer. At least theres not 40% of the server population playing them like they are thieves. Buff warriors!

I dont like the thief class or anyone that plays one. I hope I made that clear hehe.

Braxxus.2904:

samo.1054:

Oh COME ON! Let’s not start the “higher skill-cap” crap again, it’s always this stupid myth when some people in some MMO somehow decide that some class has higher skill-cap than others.

It’s not a “somehow” decide it’s a direct comparison of how many situational variables and options one has at it’s disposal at any given point in time to respond to stimuli vs another to achieve the same result.

It’s banging on a triangle (warrior) vs playing piano (d/d ele).

They might both take a modicum of skill to do, but one has a higher skill cap than the other with more possible choices to make at any moment.

As I said in the previous post (for which i have a feeling you stopped readnig at the point where your quote of it ends), more choices does NOT necessarily mean it takes more skill to use.

Especially not, when every choice you make actually has a positive outcome, and there’s no really wrong choices you can make. I used the most common Engi build used right now as an example – Having all those kits at your disposal doesn’t make it harder to use, it makes it easier. Just cycle through knock backs and blinds and other CCs until your target explodes from your pure awesomeness… And yeah I’ve played that Engi quite a lot and I don’t see any other trick to it, besides using those CC skills at just the right time so you don’t spam them too much, but enough to keep yourself and your team the upper hand… That being the case there is nothing I see that takes more skill than playing a warrior.

Probably engi is the best all purpose class along with ele, and it’s not bad at all, the only engi’s problem is that it’s still full of bugs. Everyone who plays a warrior wants to just kill things around so he goes glass cannon… Let me tell you that glass cannons work only on really bad players (And i’m talking about burst thieves too), ppl with just a little experience can avoid bursts…so no, wars aren’t op and thieves aren’t too….those specs are op only vs noobs but it’s not a class\skillbar related problem…there’s almost noone running a real balanced and useful war and that’s the real issue, that leads to really few wars in tPvP…a balanced spec would be even more rewarding than just facerolling nabs and aswell would give wars a spot in pvp teams…yeah you won’t just pop frenzy and hb to make points but, maybe, you are going to do something good for your team instead going around like a crazy rambo stomping noobs and being stomped by everyone r20+

Glass-cannon builds works when ppl are out of vigor/cd’s. They can be that for several reasons. But that is basically the problem with glass-cannon haste-builds combined with stuns: In pugs they are prone to be effective, whereas they become a lot less effective as soon as there is backup or counters ready (off cd).

@samo: If I understand you correctly, you are saying, that “at times, less is more” or something along that line? I can sort of agree with that. The basic problem I have with engi is that it feels clunky; the many options is not holding me back, rather the opposite. For warriors it is quite the opposite, and the skills I need in order to survive are quite different. Coming from necro/ele/guardian warrior takes a very different mindset. I personally feel they are anything but OP … but that may just be me.

Just because you can cycle through an engi’s abilities and kill someone 1v1 does not mean that you are playing an engi to its full potential. Engi’s have tons of utility and decisions to be made during a team fight. If you are just cycling through abilities, you might not have that smoke field when you need to stealth rez a teammate, or you might not have that poison available to drop on a downed enemy to keep his teammates from rezzing him. Just the shear amount of options and tools engi’s have for different situations are why they are considered to have a higher skill cap than warriors. Most warriors literally just wait for a target to use their stunbreaker, and then they blow all of their cd’s on that target. Warriors need some utility.