Guild Wars 2

I think thieves should have a 1 minute stealth elite skill. I mean thieves can be masters of the shadow, but why werent there elite skills reflecting playstlye choice?
Do you think thieves should have this elite skill?

Very good suggestion but i’d personally preferred if stealth lasted a week.

hell no………….

hell no………..

hell no…………..

Use superior rune of the mad king. Summons pigeons to attack the enemy after the Elite Skill cools down.

Lmao. Guess not.

I would like it actually. Provided you can’t attack and doesn’t work with backstab or anything else, unless you deactivate the skill/wait for it to end.
Something along the lines.

No, for three reasons.

The first is related to lore/fluff. I can suspend my disbelief regarding short-duration stealth effects; I imagine that that the thief is simply tossing out a small smoke cloud and then maneuvering within it for a sneak attack (or escape). Or perhaps the thief is using a quick feint and nimble footwork to get behind an opponent, thus “vanishing from sight” for a few crucial seconds. I can’t think of any conceivable explanation for a thief running (not crawling/sneaking) hundreds of meters across a brightly-lit meadow, while somehow evading the attention of sentries and archers on the nearby castle walls.

The second objection is that stealth is simply too effective at the moment. Ideally it would have more limitations or countermeasures (e.g. running into an opponent’s collision space triggers Revealed, taking direct damage from a melee attack triggers Revealed, stepping on a trap triggers Revealed, ranger pets will Reveal a stealthed thief who comes too close, etc). In the current state, a 60-second stealth effect could be used to trivialize or bypass large sections of game content (e.g. the entire “dark waters” section of the underwater fractal) without demonstrating any real skill or incurring any risk. I know that skipping/speedrunning is already part of the game culture, but the proposed change would make it even more prevalent.

Finally, most stealth skills have a cooldown that is 10-20 times longer than the duration of the stealth effect. A 10-20 minute skill cooldown would be inconsistent with the rest of the GW2 content, which suggests that the proposed 1-minute stealth is excessive.

tl;dr – hell no………….

pervertparade.7146:

No, for three reasons.

The first is related to lore/fluff. I can suspend my disbelief regarding short-duration stealth effects; I imagine that that the thief is simply tossing out a small smoke cloud and then maneuvering within it for a sneak attack (or escape). Or perhaps the thief is using a quick feint and nimble footwork to get behind an opponent, thus “vanishing from sight” for a few crucial seconds. I can’t think of any conceivable explanation for a thief running (not crawling/sneaking) hundreds of meters across a brightly-lit meadow, while somehow evading the attention of sentries and archers on the nearby castle walls.

Suspension of disbelief? It is a world of magic, in this game stealthing is magic

pervertparade.7146:

The first is related to lore/fluff. I can suspend my disbelief regarding short-duration stealth effects; I imagine that that the thief is simply tossing out a small smoke cloud and then maneuvering within it for a sneak attack (or escape). Or perhaps the thief is using a quick feint and nimble footwork to get behind an opponent, thus “vanishing from sight” for a few crucial seconds. I can’t think of any conceivable explanation for a thief running (not crawling/sneaking) hundreds of meters across a brightly-lit meadow, while somehow evading the attention of sentries and archers on the nearby castle walls.

I wanna put my two cents in here and only here. I really enjoy the game lore and there actually is a reason for the thief to have stealth abilities. You see the thief most likely evolved from the assassin profession in Guild Wars Factions. Well in Factions the assassins were a profession that worked very much like assassins and ninjas in the real world, but they had one distinct advantage, they were followers of Lyssa (goddess of beauty and illusion), and seemed to dapple in the same school of magic as the mesmers. Having the ability to change the way enemies perceive the world would give you the ability to make it so you have long lasting stealth. Now I’m not saying that this means they should put it to the game, or that it wouldn’t cause multiple issues with game mechanics/balancing. I am merely stating that from a lore perspective it is very easily possible.

Allow a constant self stealth(not useable in dungeons or short duration in dungeons) best solution. That way it’s not getting used to exploit dungeons, apart from that I can’t see why people would see the need to whine and complain about thieves getting this ability, it’s like people that constantly whine on the forums “why don’t you nerf that class, my class isn’t strong enough /cry”. It’s a game, the point of it is for it to be fun, if you don’t find a long duration stealth to be fun, don’t play a thief, but for the love of god don’t sit around on the forums whining about other classes abilities.

Xephier.1647:

Allow a constant self stealth

No.

I wanna be able to stealth like Zrii. That is one thing that really makes me mad.. The game having access to abilities that we as players can’t have(aside from Dragon specific abilities or course).. During Estate of Decay, Zrii disappears for a good 15min before reappearing, yea My rogue, who is all about stealth, cant do anything like that. That is really the killer for my Thief, no long duration stealth skill. To me a thief Is Stealth, and not being able to avoid more open world encounters is thy I gave up on my thief..

I suppose I was too spoiled by my Theif/Rogue in RIFT where I could stealth permanently as long as I didn’t do anything.

Guild Wars has always been great about preventing abilities from Being OP when they don’t want them to be.. So.. Give Rogues a Perma-steath ability on a mid duration recharge (Maybe 60 seconds) that only works in open world settings.

In Dungeons and WvW/Spvp change it so that it is a self target version of “Shadow Refuge” that only lasts say 7 seconds (about twice as long as shadow Refuge, because it is single target, your focusing on only hiding yourself, no one else)

TL:DR; Yes please, but ONLY if it doesn’t work in Dungeons and PvP

Rizalee.4593:

Give Rogues a Perma-steath ability on a mid duration recharge (Maybe 60 seconds) that only works in open world settings.

Even the open-world content has balance requirements. If you allow perma-stealth, then Thieves could easily harvest valuable resources (e.g. Omnomberries, Orichalcum, Passiflora) without being slowed by the need to fight or evade the mobs guarding those nodes. If properly traited (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fleet_Shadow), then they would permanently benefit from the fastest movement speed in the game, providing a solid advantage in exploration (e.g. map completion, scavenger hunt). They would also have an advantage in several Jumping Puzzles (such as http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wall_Breach_Blitz), since they could simply ignore enemies who are supposed to pose a challenge to players.

pervertparade.7146:

Rizalee.4593:

Give Rogues a Perma-steath ability on a mid duration recharge (Maybe 60 seconds) that only works in open world settings.

Even the open-world content has balance requirements. If you allow perma-stealth, then Thieves could easily harvest valuable resources (e.g. Omnomberries, Orichalcum, Passiflora) without being slowed by the need to fight or evade the mobs guarding those nodes. If properly traited (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fleet_Shadow), then they would permanently benefit from the fastest movement speed in the game, providing a solid advantage in exploration (e.g. map completion, scavenger hunt). They would also have an advantage in several Jumping Puzzles (such as http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wall_Breach_Blitz), since they could simply ignore enemies who are supposed to pose a challenge to players.

33% Movement Speed isn’t that fast.

pervertparade.7146:

Rizalee.4593:

Give Rogues a Perma-steath ability on a mid duration recharge (Maybe 60 seconds) that only works in open world settings.

Even the open-world content has balance requirements. If you allow perma-stealth, then Thieves could easily harvest valuable resources (e.g. Omnomberries, Orichalcum, Passiflora) without being slowed by the need to fight or evade the mobs guarding those nodes. If properly traited (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fleet_Shadow), then they would permanently benefit from the fastest movement speed in the game, providing a solid advantage in exploration (e.g. map completion, scavenger hunt). They would also have an advantage in several Jumping Puzzles (such as http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wall_Breach_Blitz), since they could simply ignore enemies who are supposed to pose a challenge to players.

I already do this though. It’s just that I’m not stealthed 100% of the time. I just use it as an aggro looser (Shadow Refuge gives more than enough time to harvest a node without being bothered by mobs).

NOOO!

1 minute of stealth?! I can’t find these kitten thieves with just 6 seconds of stealth!
Ever considered not being a thief and having an enemy thief at your back and not seeing him FOR 1 MINUTE!?

ok but thief dmg is decreased by 70% then

hell no……..

Every class should have a 30sec Stealth skill! And then give the theif a 1min elite stealth as they are the masters of stealth……. Really and then also change the game to hide and sneak instead of guild wars….. It is already hard to see peps in WvW after they come out of invs they can attack you for 1maybe 2 hits and you never see them. Remove Invs from the game is best fix… or fix rendering!! Take out stealth or give every class access to it.

pervertparade.7146:

Rizalee.4593:

Give Rogues a Perma-steath ability on a mid duration recharge (Maybe 60 seconds) that only works in open world settings.

Even the open-world content has balance requirements. If you allow perma-stealth, then Thieves could easiily harvest valuable resources (e.g. Omnomberries, Orichalcum, Passiflora) without being slowed by the need to fight or evade the mobs guarding those nodes. If properly traited (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fleet_Shadow), then they would permanently benefit from the fastest movement speed in the game, providing a solid advantage in exploration (e.g. map completion, scavenger hunt). They would also have an advantage in several Jumping Puzzles (such as http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wall_Breach_Blitz), since they could simply ignore enemies who are supposed to pose a challenge to players.

Your missing the point of the class, its called a “Thief” lol.

Did you know I already steal all gathering nodes and skill points without fighting anything that guards it? .

thieves need a long duration stealth, tbat we can just roam free, its not a battle skill so the players that pick this will have less to do in combat.

The first couple of missions as a whispers agent they used a permastealth move on me to infiktrate, I want that skill if it exists.

I bet ArenaNet is already crying because stealth should never have made it into the game and you are asking for this…

if stealth means also slow down movement you can’t run at super hero speed and be also invisible… you have to chose 1 super power at a time.
you can’t be sneaky and be fast, in no game with perma invisibility a player is encouraged to roam all the map in stealth mode because it would require a week to do it with slow movement…

i think i made my point

Letifer.4360:

I bet ArenaNet is already crying because stealth should never have made it into the game and you are asking for this…

No stealth is as intended. They said thief was supposed to pick and choose thier battles.

I’d rather it be a 5 second stealth skill with a 45 second cooldown.

But then again, Thieves don’t really have cooldowns when using weapon skills to use stealth.

What they should really have as an elite is sigil of the stealth. Passive is stealth, active is stealth and invulnerability.

Sorry sarcasm doesnt come across in posts :-p

Amadan.9451:

if stealth means also slow down movement you can’t run at super hero speed and be also invisible… you have to chose 1 super power at a time.
you can’t be sneaky and be fast, in no game with perma invisibility a player is encouraged to roam all the map in stealth mode because it would require a week to do it with slow movement…

i think i made my point

That doesn’t make sense thieves are supposed to be fast and stealthy, not stealthy and slow, or fast a noticed lol.

At this point thief is the slowest class in the game. All the other classes have movement abilities that dont really have to sacrifice anything for. Thief needs to add the running speed signet on his skill bar, that replaces a valuable skill that couldve been there. Everyone else has movement speed actions on thier weapons.

At least with the long stealth players can actually put the 50% movement speed while in stealth spec to good use.

MatyrGustav.6210:

At this point thief is the slowest class in the game.

watidonteven-

MatyrGustav.6210:

Amadan.9451:

if stealth means also slow down movement you can’t run at super hero speed and be also invisible… you have to chose 1 super power at a time.
you can’t be sneaky and be fast, in no game with perma invisibility a player is encouraged to roam all the map in stealth mode because it would require a week to do it with slow movement…

i think i made my point

That doesn’t make sense thieves are supposed to be fast and stealthy, not stealthy and slow, or fast a noticed lol.

At this point thief is the slowest class in the game. All the other classes have movement abilities that dont really have to sacrifice anything for. Thief needs to add the running speed signet on his skill bar, that replaces a valuable skill that couldve been there. Everyone else has movement speed actions on thier weapons.

At least with the long stealth players can actually put the 50% movement speed while in stealth spec to good use.

lol thief slowest class, that’s a good one.
Never mind IA and HS.

gimmethegepgun.1284:

MatyrGustav.6210:

Amadan.9451:

if stealth means also slow down movement you can’t run at super hero speed and be also invisible… you have to chose 1 super power at a time.
you can’t be sneaky and be fast, in no game with perma invisibility a player is encouraged to roam all the map in stealth mode because it would require a week to do it with slow movement…

i think i made my point

That doesn’t make sense thieves are supposed to be fast and stealthy, not stealthy and slow, or fast a noticed lol.

At this point thief is the slowest class in the game. All the other classes have movement abilities that dont really have to sacrifice anything for. Thief needs to add the running speed signet on his skill bar, that replaces a valuable skill that couldve been there. Everyone else has movement speed actions on thier weapons.

At least with the long stealth players can actually put the 50% movement speed while in stealth spec to good use.

lol thief slowest class, that’s a good one.
Never mind IA and HS.

What its true. the only way thief is fast is if I waste all my initiative with heart seeker but that doesnt really count because its not really meant for movement. They have that spec that enables them swiftness for 2 after a dodge but you waiste all you stamina. They have the signet that grants 25 movement speed, but that takes up a valuable skill spot which I could add a venom.

It just seems like thief has to sacrifice something for movement speed when other classes dont.

and thats were the 1 min stealth elite skill comes in.

MatyrGustav.6210:

Letifer.4360:

I bet ArenaNet is already crying because stealth should never have made it into the game and you are asking for this…

No stealth is as intended. They said thief was supposed to pick and choose thier battles.

You didn’t understand what I said. Thief’s are just a crappy assassin, they could use shadow step to choose their targets stealth wasn’t needed at all.

Letifer.4360:

MatyrGustav.6210:

Letifer.4360:

I bet ArenaNet is already crying because stealth should never have made it into the game and you are asking for this…

No stealth is as intended. They said thief was supposed to pick and choose thier battles.

You didn’t understand what I said. Thief’s are just a crappy assassin, they could use shadow step to choose their targets stealth wasn’t needed at all.

That can be achieved, when I first played thief I didnt use stealth at all, I used 2 pistols and I was agile. I also seen thieves with a sword & dagger that didnt use sfealth, all tney did was teleport/shadowstep everywhere, tbey were good.

The option is there.

MatyrGustav.6210:

Letifer.4360:

MatyrGustav.6210:

Letifer.4360:

I bet ArenaNet is already crying because stealth should never have made it into the game and you are asking for this…

No stealth is as intended. They said thief was supposed to pick and choose thier battles.

You didn’t understand what I said. Thief’s are just a crappy assassin, they could use shadow step to choose their targets stealth wasn’t needed at all.

That can be achieved, when I first played thief I didnt use stealth at all, I used 2 pistols and I was agile. I also seen thieves with a sword & dagger that didnt use sfealth, all tney did was teleport/shadowstep everywhere, tbey were good.

The option is there.

Not the way an Assassin did, not even close, Thief was made having stealth in mind this made it weak unless he is using stealth and stealth is one of the hardest mechanics in an MMO to balance, either is kitten or OP, and Thief can go almost perma stealth already in this game.

about speed… have you tried to run away or chase someone with a mesmer? and i cannot waste any utility slot to run so fast… and also i have to use a focus to run fast for few seconds…
1m invisibility would be the longest skill duration in the history of all guild wars… in one minute at thief speed you could run a map from one edge to the other without being slowed down by a random encounter, could you imagine 1m stealth in wvwvw you could come in and out from attacked towers spy everywhere and be the perfect gamebreaker.

that said if the thief can skip every single random fight in exploration with a wise use of 1m invisibility each profession should be able to do so… we cannot be bothered by mobs while we try to reach that POI just behind that champion

The best way i thinnk thiefs should have stealth to work in GW2 is the way hoe stealth has functionated in GW2 under the snowball minigame.

That stealth there was different from the normal stealth and it was just like PERFECT.
It had a longer duration, was not too long (maximum duration should be 10 seconds with making it pre ending, if you attack sooner, adding a trait that allows for 1 attack out of stealth letting it not end (huge recharge after this for doing this again then), major trait at 30 points shadow… and while being in stealth, thiefs had 33% movement speed increase, so that you could get within the 10 seconds your damaged kitten far enough away out of danger, what you can’t do with stealth in GW2 at the moment.)

The curretn stealth system is just a JOKE and people are only whining and complaining over it, because theres just this one thing – culling, which makes out of this way too underpowered mechanic something too overpowered, because the culling is often so strong, that you can perma stealth, meaning using any new stealth skill after the previous duration ended, before enemies can see you again

Stealth is the Thiefs Main Weapon and Main Defense together to survive in WvW and it is also their way to support in groups either in dungeons or again in generel for WvW.
Stealth is absolutely NOT hard to balance.
Zhe most easiest hard counter class for the thief would be rangers…
Just giving their pets the passive auto ability to DETECT hidden enemies as they have better senses to see and smell enemies.

Condition for letting this work: the pet must have hitten the thief first at least 1 to get in contact with the thief (to get the smell…)
What do you think what hunters do with their hunting dogs??? They train them in finding their prey by giving them something of the prey to smell on so that they will know what’s the scent of their prey and then the hunt gets starting..

But thats not the only way how stealth could get a hard balance.
Also the other classes could have some own methods for detecting stealthed thiefs (thse methods would also mean, that in counter balance thiefs should not receive damage, while beign in stealth, except from Eles AoE spells, what would be their way of detecting stealthed thiefs…

An Engineer instead would detect them for example by creating a dust tower, that creates a very light dust in the air of similar consistence like flour turning stealthed enemies visible again, if they go through that flour cloud

Warriors could have just a defensive counter attack stance, just waiting for thiefs to come and giving them a surprising counter attack.
Guardians could have symbols for ground target that makes guardisn have temporarely have an aura of clairvoyance as working similar to ranger pets AoE auto Detection

Everything just a matter of creativity to come up for counter methods…
Stealth is very easy to balance.
Stealth being too OP or too UP is just a matter of everyones personal feelings in regard of the way how everyone is individually thinking about, how stealth should functionate in a game like GW2.

Too me is the current stealth absolutely underpowered, it would need a serious buff and as consequence of this buff should receive the other classes some hard counters against stealth to detect thiefs. Problem solved in my opinion…

No to stealth reveal skills no matter how minor. It would break the profession. 1 minute stealth elite? probably too much but 20 seconds for a 2-3 second channel time (so easily spotted) could be acceptable. Maybe even make them take extra dmg while they channel it.

Rizalee.4593:

In Dungeons and WvW/Spvp change it so that it is a self target version of “Shadow Refuge” that only lasts say 7 seconds (about twice as long as shadow Refuge, because it is single target, your focusing on only hiding yourself, no one else)

TL:DR; Yes please, but ONLY if it doesn’t work in Dungeons and PvP

What part of Not in Pvp or Dungeons did you kittens miss?

No – thieves are bad enough at the moment, this would be a step in the wrong direction as of right now.

MatyrGustav.6210:

gimmethegepgun.1284:

lol thief slowest class, that’s a good one.
Never mind IA and HS.

What its true.

Thieves are renowned for being the most difficult to catch and one of the fastest moving professions in the game. (And that’s without the ‘+50% movement while stealthed’ trait, because any good WvW thief uses the fall-damage reduction trait.)

You clearly don’t understand enough to be making suggestions.

Learn more about the game dude, you’re lacking verily.

In PVE, it wouldn’t that bad if Arenanet or us found a solution for exploiting map explores with that. And of c. attacks and damages should brake it.

In PVP, its “Hell NO!”. But its heavily exploited/hacked on WWW.
Surmia EU server is full of cheaters. Thieves are in stealth for 1-2 minute, and sometimes they put stealth on 50+ zergs for as long as they don’t attack.

Stealth in multiplayer games was always a bad shot.
I suggest to make it like in Crysis Multiplayer. Trackable by footsteps, and it drains endurance or something, so the thieves will run out of it if they move.

What about a elite-signet that grants as a passive effect permastealth while out of combat?
It would be fun in open PvE and imho not to OP in Dungeons and WvW. You already can travel untouched in this areas w. SB and stealth.
Dunno about s/tPvP but hey, you can nerf it there.

Molch.2078:

What about a elite-signet that grants as a passive effect permastealth while out of combat?
It would be fun in open PvE and imho not to OP in Dungeons and WvW. You already can travel untouched in this areas w. SB and stealth.
Dunno about s/tPvP but hey, you can nerf it there.

There’d be no way to “nerf” that kinda signet in spvp without simply removing it all together. Permastealth doesn’t fit the thief playstyle in this game (although atm it is possible but not intended). A 15-20 second stealth elite skill that just stealths the thief could be good, but idk an appropriate cd for it without making it the “obvious” choice and potentially op. Stealth isn’t op, perma stealth would be however.

Molch.2078:

What about a elite-signet that grants as a passive effect permastealth while out of combat?
It would be fun in open PvE and imho not to OP in Dungeons and WvW. You already can travel untouched in this areas w. SB and stealth.
Dunno about s/tPvP but hey, you can nerf it there.

That would result in complaints about farming rich nodes and certain commune skill points.

NinjaEd.3946:

There’d be no way to “nerf” that kinda signet in spvp without simply removing it all together. Permastealth doesn’t fit the thief playstyle in this game (although atm it is possible but not intended). A 15-20 second stealth elite skill that just stealths the thief could be good, but idk an appropriate cd for it without making it the “obvious” choice and potentially op. Stealth isn’t op, perma stealth would be however.

On what grounds do you say that they did not intend a player to build in such a way that they could stay in stealth pretty much all the time? After all, clearly they put some thought into it, as the permastealth playstyle has low damage output in comparison to backstabbers or the like.

No…, reasons:

• a small group can make perma stealth, if it was AoE stealth
• 1 min, is enough to finish a lot of enemies
• makes hiding in keeps very easy, say 5 ppl have this elite skill, and it stacks duration 5 min of stealth, you kidding me… if not stacks, they can cast it when stealth duration is out, to get another 1 min, possible, if it has one week CD, if it was aoe, but I assume you mean single target
• would ruin the game, 12 sec stealth from shadow refuge is enough, and I think that’s long stealth

Where do you people get these ideas…Honestly ? Do you not feel op enough as a thief already ? Want to have a Godmode enabled aswell for 1m ? Maybe ask them to give you a rocketlauncher while your at it.

MatyrGustav.6210:

gimmethegepgun.1284:

MatyrGustav.6210:

Amadan.9451:

if stealth means also slow down movement you can’t run at super hero speed and be also invisible… you have to chose 1 super power at a time.
you can’t be sneaky and be fast, in no game with perma invisibility a player is encouraged to roam all the map in stealth mode because it would require a week to do it with slow movement…

i think i made my point

That doesn’t make sense thieves are supposed to be fast and stealthy, not stealthy and slow, or fast a noticed lol.

At this point thief is the slowest class in the game. All the other classes have movement abilities that dont really have to sacrifice anything for. Thief needs to add the running speed signet on his skill bar, that replaces a valuable skill that couldve been there. Everyone else has movement speed actions on thier weapons.

At least with the long stealth players can actually put the 50% movement speed while in stealth spec to good use.

lol thief slowest class, that’s a good one.
Never mind IA and HS.

What its true. the only way thief is fast is if I waste all my initiative with heart seeker but that doesnt really count because its not really meant for movement. They have that spec that enables them swiftness for 2 after a dodge but you waiste all you stamina. They have the signet that grants 25 movement speed, but that takes up a valuable skill spot which I could add a venom.

It just seems like thief has to sacrifice something for movement speed when other classes dont.

and thats were the 1 min stealth elite skill comes in.

So you’re saying a mesmer, warrior, ranger, or necro doesn’t need to waste a weapon slot and a skill cooldown for a focus/warhorn swiftness? A guardian with a staff?
And, since none of those actually gives permanent swiftness, you think they don’t need to use another utility, healing skill, elite (for warrior and ranger), or trait for more swiftness? Because I guarantee you I’d rather be using Kit Refinement, Power Wrench, Adrenal Implant instead of having to sacrifice one of them for Speedy Kits.
Calling Thief the slowest profession is an absolute joke, since they’re the second fastest, behind D/D Elementalists, and even more of a joke if your reasoning involves sacrificing skills, since everyone else has to do that to get their mobility as well.

Great idea;

“Stealth (duration – 1 minute) – if any action or movement is taken by you while under stealth, you are killed.”

Caedmon.6798:

Where do you people get these ideas…Honestly ? Do you not feel op enough as a thief already ? Want to have a Godmode enabled aswell for 1m ? Maybe ask them to give you a rocketlauncher while your at it.

Charrzooka?

Non-thief players whine about thief using stealth and attacking. Thief players whine about not being about to stealth longer. . .