Guild Wars 2

After thinking on this topic for a while I think I have found a way to reduce Zergs from WvW.

Instead of having a commander viewable on the map at all times have it be hidden at first. In order to view where a commander is at you will need to be in the commanders squad. Limit those said squads to 15-20 people or so. To join a commanders squad you will need to speak to a NPC that gives the list of commanders running on the map and their current location.

Currently people just run to the nearest commander and follow brainlessly. This would also ensure that people join the commanders squad. Solving the rate limit on map chat problem.

Upon reading this, I think following options would allow better coordination and make less zerging:

- Make a cap on the number of players who can join a squad. 20 seems reasonable
- Add extra squad interfaces, and tools:

• The commander has an option to see the people in his squad in a new “Squad” interface"
• The Squad interface shows the number of supplies of each of the people in squad, shows the guild tag and the profession of the player, aswell as the name.
• Squad members can also open this squad interface to see the other guys in it. Commanders have the additional option to see other squads than theirs on the map.
• People in squad now have yellow names instead of green ones (such as gold names for guilds).

- Commanders can decide to hide their command tag from everyone who is not a member of their guild. This allows for covert guild operations.

Reducing zergs:
- Less blobs, because squads only amount to 20 people.
- Less people running to the command tag (cause it can be hidden)

But then wouldn’t the commanders just form parties and run around the map with their squads mixed up, forming zergs again?

This is genius!
I like that idea alot.

No I don’t think so. Most commanders ‘command’ (obviously :p) and don’t want other commanders messing with their business. They can work together of course, attacking from 2 different spots etc, but I think less PUGs would tag along with them, cause they wouldn’t be marked on the map if they didn’t want that and they could only host 20 players.

It’s also important to know that each of the squad would have a different commander in the case of joined squads, so they would predominantly join their commander and won’t be able to catch up with the other one. Most people of the squad would probably talk in squad too, so the squad would be organized better, but the zerg would loose coherence.

Yes commanders may run together from time to time. At times they may need too. But it also allows for more strategic play with two squads in the same map attacking different areas. Allowing for more coordination less zerg zombie runs. But they should not be able to form parties. The idea is to slim the “fat” not remove the heart.

The key here is that the commander tag needs to be not so viewable on the map so that random people that join WvW do not swarm to it like bees to honey.

The trick is how to make it so that random people that join know to talk to the NPC or know that the way commanders work has changed.

anzenketh.3759:

The trick is how to make it so that random people that join know to talk to the NPC or know that the way commanders work has changed.

Through a new interface as I suggested? They could see the commanders on the map in a list maybe and click join and wait for the commander to accept. If commander doesn’t want to get pugs trying to join him, he can just hide his squad from people not in it.

the way to eliminate zergs would be to require multiple groups to be in multiple areas to conquer objectives.

For instance. in order to bring down a gate, you must first capture and hold the “gate shield” which happens to be on the other side of the keep. Occupying this area would allow the gate to be damaged.

That wasn’t really hard…but then again, i’m a genius, and the devs are only normal.

^LOL I like the idea, but it would require what, some 3 people to stay at the gate, or would it mean that if the 3 people fell, the zerg got trapped inside somehow and killed?

In the latter case, it would mean that they had to split a blob of 60 in 30-30, but if the enemy doesn’t have enough forces, how are they supposed to trouble the people at the gate, or would it be NPC’s rampaging on them?

^ The idea was how to split up zergs. There would inevitably be need for balance testing.

However…in the case of this example, 3 people at the gate wouldn’t really do much, and would easily be crushed by any amount of defense at the gate. Therefore, if 57 others were defending the ‘shield’ area; yes, the gate would stay vulnerable, but they would never deal damage to i.

30 – 30 makes more sense. However, I would assume it would be beneficial to flux that number about as the defending team organizes and mounts attacks on either area.

Again, the main objective is to break up the power of a zerg. This idea essentially splits a zerg in half, like you said. You could require even more objectives to cut it down further.

The problem though, is that this would give defending teams a HUGE advantage. I haven’t played in a while though, so I don’t know if that kind of advantage is necessary. It could be balanced though.

frOst.2198:

For instance. in order to bring down a gate, you must first capture and hold the “gate shield” which happens to be on the other side of the keep. Occupying this area would allow the gate to be damaged.

I would tune down the self love a bit and consider this:
1: Defenders would have to pay zero attention to the gate, focusing 100% on the area that enables damage.
2: Attackers might just completely ignore the way you want them to act, and blob the said area, then leaving two zombies there while moving on to the gate.

And as for commanders not being visible on the map:
“/m(/t) where are the commanders?” – followed up by a map location ping.

Zergs and Blobs are as much part of this game as the players in it. That said I’m not a big fan of them, and tend to roam with a smaller group.

iFocus.3781:

frOst.2198:

For instance. in order to bring down a gate, you must first capture and hold the “gate shield” which happens to be on the other side of the keep. Occupying this area would allow the gate to be damaged.

I would tune down the self love a bit and consider this:
1: Defenders would have to pay zero attention to the gate, focusing 100% on the area that enables damage.
2: Attackers might just completely ignore the way you want them to act, and blob the said area, then leaving two zombies there while moving on to the gate.

And as for commanders not being visible on the map:
“/m(/t) where are the commanders?” – followed up by a map location ping.

Zergs and Blobs are as much part of this game as the players in it. That said I’m not a big fan of them, and tend to roam with a smaller group.

beat you to it. sorry. (I just mentioned this above).

I mentioned too that it could be solved. I didn’t explain how, but here goes one idea off the top of my head:

The shield can actually be destroyed if enough damage goes through it. However, it can be repaired, not by supply, but through players ‘lifeforce’

Either by clicking on the gate, or some other object, the defending player will ‘repair’ the shield, and they will receive a debuff which bars them from doing it again for ‘x’ minutes.

The variable ‘x’ is a balancing factor based on the shields HP, the amount that is healed, and how many players the devs want to be defending at any given time.

iFocus.3781:

And as for commanders not being visible on the map:
“/m(/t) where are the commanders?” – followed up by a map location ping.

Zergs and Blobs are as much part of this game as the players in it. That said I’m not a big fan of them, and tend to roam with a smaller group.

As for the map chat asking where the commanders are at. It is true that some may still follow and Zergs/Blobs will still exist. However they will not be created as easily as well as they will be reduced in numbers.

Frost with there being multiple commanders on the map they will most of the time likely try to take multiple objectives. Thus splitting up the zerg. Most objectives can be easily taken with 15-20 people.

Notice the title never said how to eliminate zergs in WvW. I know that is not possible.

anzenketh.3759:

iFocus.3781:

And as for commanders not being visible on the map:
“/m(/t) where are the commanders?” – followed up by a map location ping.

Zergs and Blobs are as much part of this game as the players in it. That said I’m not a big fan of them, and tend to roam with a smaller group.

As for the map chat asking where the commanders are at. It is true that some may still follow and Zergs/Blobs will still exist. However they will not be created as easily as well as they will be reduced in numbers.

Frost with there being multiple commanders on the map they will most of the time likely try to take multiple objectives. Thus splitting up the zerg. Most objectives can be easily taken with 15-20 people.

Notice the title never said how to eliminate zergs in WvW. I know that is not possible.

notice that despite the word I chose to preface my suggestion, it was indeed a way to reduce zergs, not eliminate them.

most of the zergs are just guilds and dont need a commander. they just put a target marker on the leader

The reality of it all is that WvW is simply horribly designed. It needs to be scrapped and remade from the ground up; offering proper incentives, abandoning the ridiculous idea of splitting the zone into 3 separate identical zones, spacing out keeps, eliminating the dolyak supply caravans and replacing them with player DE’s (i.e. go chop down wood in the PVP heavy forest).

It’s so depressing looking at this game. The game designers should quit now and be replaced by people with talent. <- harsh, but true. They don’t know what they’re doing….unless its some hidden agenda such as, “don’t worry about the game and try and squeeze as much money as we can from our fanbase.”

I agree, the players have suggested so many incredible ideas, with a big potential, and still they just keep ignoring these suggestions and pleas and think they’re going to fix it with adding some mechanic or other that doesn’t change wvw and has near to no importance (as I’ve stated earlier).

To reduce zergs in PvP you have to incentivize solo/small group play via gameplay mechanics and WvW maps overhaul.
Changing UI will not help at all.
P.S. And also developers have to have desire to change the game to reduce zergs.And apparently they do not.

frOst.2198:

the way to eliminate zergs would be to require multiple groups to be in multiple areas to conquer objectives.

For instance. in order to bring down a gate, you must first capture and hold the “gate shield” which happens to be on the other side of the keep. Occupying this area would allow the gate to be damaged.

That wasn’t really hard…but then again, i’m a genius, and the devs are only normal.

Like in Planetside 2.Yep, this could be the way out of current situation, if developers were willing to improve WvW.

Well last update certainly buffed zergs: events give extra wxp, soldiers in towers and keeps give wxp, using siege gives wxp (e.g. arrowcarts and rams). This all encourages players to zerg towers. They don’t have to bother to defend places either, cause they can just take them back for extra wxp after… The only objective for WvW seems to be bag farming and wxp farming now. Thanks Anet, another great update.