Guild Wars 2

Simple. Too casual and easy, let’s see tactics and difficulty. Enough said.

Not to sound overly negative, but if it’s one thing GW2 has taught me, it’s that catering just to casual players is a big no-no. Why? casual players don’t require a lot to be happy.. give them something capable within a 1-2hr window and they’ll be fine. The other players who spend more time on the game suffer. It’s been a huge learning experience for me.

Mujen.2089:

Not to sound overly negative, but if it’s one thing GW2 has taught me, it’s that catering just to casual players is a big no-no. Why? casual players don’t require a lot to be happy.. give them something capable within a 1-2hr window and they’ll be fine. The other players who spend more time on the game suffer. It’s been a huge learning experience for me.

Sure but that one percent of hardcore people sure don’t matter in the equation. On average following sentiments play:

- Casual: I don’t have much time so I’ll buy some gems to get a nice weapon. I’ve got a good income and I want to spend it on the hobby I love.

- Hardcore: Buying gold through gems is cheating and people who do so make my legendary worthless. Gold buying is bad because people don’t work for their items.

So on one hand you have a casual group willing and able to spend money. On the other hand, you have a hardcore group which is usually not willing to spend real money on in-game stuff.

To most people, spending two hours on a videogame after work, chores, kids and hobbies is quite a lot. As much as I like GW2, it’s last on the prio list.

Go do the math. Which’d be the better market to cater for from a business perspective?

marnick.4305:

Mujen.2089:

Not to sound overly negative, but if it’s one thing GW2 has taught me, it’s that catering just to casual players is a big no-no. Why? casual players don’t require a lot to be happy.. give them something capable within a 1-2hr window and they’ll be fine. The other players who spend more time on the game suffer. It’s been a huge learning experience for me.

Sure but that one percent of hardcore people sure don’t matter in the equation.

As much as I like GW2, it’s last on the prio list.

Go do the math. Which’d be the better market to cater for from a business perspective?

1. If the gem store had worthwhile items more people would buy them.
2. Check the forum, most of the “casual players” wouldn’t play the game if it was subscription based. They don’t like to “pay money to play a game”
3. Last on the priority list meaning you may drop the game at a whim, because you have a minimal investment.
4. Do you know people make enough money playing video games to not need a typical job. If the game is interesting, people stream & others donate, it attracts more clientele.
5. People don’t invest a lot into things they don’t feel aren’t going anywhere. There are a lot of skeptics.

Personally: I bought the game $60 I bought gems twice $20 – I’m done. after 1 month I’m bored of the game, I’m only playing for my friend’s company, I’m not spending another cent. I wasn’t going to even buy the game, my friend convinced me. I LOVED gw1.. Saw gw2, watched streams (most of which are gone now) & decided wasn’t a good sequel to gw1.. Only came cuz my friend. #5 applies to me, i’m too skeptical to spend my money on this game.

Mujen.2089:

marnick.4305:

Mujen.2089:

Not to sound overly negative, but if it’s one thing GW2 has taught me, it’s that catering just to casual players is a big no-no. Why? casual players don’t require a lot to be happy.. give them something capable within a 1-2hr window and they’ll be fine. The other players who spend more time on the game suffer. It’s been a huge learning experience for me.

Sure but that one percent of hardcore people sure don’t matter in the equation.

As much as I like GW2, it’s last on the prio list.

Go do the math. Which’d be the better market to cater for from a business perspective?

1. If the gem store had worthwhile items more people would buy them.
2. Check the forum, most of the “casual players” wouldn’t play the game if it was subscription based. They don’t like to “pay money to play a game”
3. Last on the priority list meaning you may drop the game at a whim, because you have a minimal investment.
4. Do you know people make enough money playing video games to not need a typical job. If the game is interesting, people stream & others donate, it attracts more clientele.
5. People don’t invest a lot into things they don’t feel aren’t going anywhere. There are a lot of skeptics.

1. I agree but the in-game store in GW1 hardly had anything worthwile for years. It takes time to flesh out a business concept.
2. Casuals don’t want to pay a subscription for the 5 hours they play in any given week, but they’re more than happy to catch up with hardcore people through money. Important distinction.
3. GW2 is my primary hobby. Yet with fiancée, job, friends, sports, chores … all those are important in that they’re not optional. GW2 is my primary optional hobby. Again, you’re not seeing the distinction between optional things, which are last on the prio list because real life takes precedence at all times. At the end of the day, someone has to do the dishes, someone has to buy food. All that eats into GW2’s time.
4. That’s a very small group of professional gamers and aren’t a valid point in this discussion. Most people who stream don’t earn enough to cover their internet costs, let alone build a living out of it.
5. I will never do a full ironman, yet I bought myself an expensive racebike. People love to spend money on hobbies that go nowhere. The entire entertainment industry is built around that premise. Fun is worth something in its own right, there isn’t an expectation it should go somewhere.

Personally: I bought the game $60 I bought gems twice $20 – I’m done. after 1 month I’m bored of the game, I’m only playing for my friend’s company, I’m not spending another cent. I wasn’t going to even buy the game, my friend convinced me. I LOVED gw1.. Saw gw2, watched streams (most of which are gone now) & decided wasn’t a good sequel to gw1.. Only came cuz my friend. #5 applies to me, i’m too skeptical to spend my money on this game.

I’ve been playing for 6 months straight now because this game allows me to progress with minimal time investment. I’ve got too much other stuff on my plate to play a videogame as if it were a second job. If you stopped after 1 month, you bought the wrong game. You knew GW2 would be a casual sequal to archcasual game GW1.

I get the impression that to most hardcore players, the very concept of “fun” is an irrelevance. It’s numbers, kills, gear, money, prestige. The game is simply a second job to them.

For people like me who sit somewhere in between casual and hardcore, GW2 suits me fine.

marnick.4305:

Mujen.2089:

I wasn’t going to even buy the game, my friend convinced me. I LOVED gw1.. Saw gw2, watched streams (most of which are gone now) & decided wasn’t a good sequel to gw1.. Only came cuz my friend. #5 applies to me, i’m too skeptical to spend my money on this game.

I’ve been playing for 6 months straight now because this game allows me to progress with minimal time investment. I’ve got too much other stuff on my plate to play a videogame as if it were a second job. If you stopped after 1 month, you bought the wrong game. You knew GW2 would be a casual sequal to archcasual game GW1.

Didn’t know anything about the game really, saw it being played & the mechanics weren’t for me, so I think from my prior post, pretty much sums it up. So unless you’ve really invested a lot of money into this game, should I say you’re part of that casual group that feels spending money on a game is a waste? Would you sell an RV to a person who travels once/3yrs or a person who travels 2-3/year? Who do you think is more likely to make a better sales pitch on? Since we’re talking business. Over 6 mo you have spent.. $100? on gems… for a “video game” of little priority?

Wait, you saw it being played, didn’t like the mechanics yet bought it anyway and now you’re moaning about it? Right.

uknortherner.2670:

I get the impression that to most hardcore players, the very concept of “fun” is an irrelevance. It’s numbers, kills, gear, money, prestige. The game is simply a second job to them.

For people like me who sit somewhere in between casual and hardcore, GW2 suits me fine.

Exactly.. casual players have their own area.. so why can’t there be areas for those who play the game say 3-4hrs/day or more? Does fotm affect casual gamrs? absolutely not, but yet they complain as if they are forced to. Just seems like selfishness to me.. non casual gamers don’t complain about your map completions, jumping puzzles and whatever it is you guys do… yet casual gamers feel they should be on the same lvl as everyone else, why? If you can’t raid, you cant raid… so u can do dungeons.. it’s that simple. Just because someone drives a Mercedes Benz doesn’t mean you have to also, just means they spent more to earn it and you have a Toyota Corolla.. ur still driving. Why do casual gamers feel obligated or feel it’s even realistic to be on par with someone who plays way more?

The tempo of GW2 right now is ok for me. Anet did advertise this game as being casual friendly, so it is only right that they should try to stick to that.

I said “try” because of the apparent issue that surfaced regarding ascended gear.

Overall, the casual-ness of this game is the one major thing that makes me playing it. I would really hate to see this game become like other games in terms of “hardcore” content.

GW2 is GW2, and GW2 is a “casual game”. There is no appeal in making it the same as other “hardcore” games.

uknortherner.2670:

Wait, you saw it being played, didn’t like the mechanics yet bought it anyway and now you’re moaning about it? Right.

Well sometimes friends do things for other friends.. if you have friends you’ll understand that. Correct me if im wrong but did I create this thread? have you looked at the other areas of the forums? Do you pvp? You’re happy with the game, that’s good for you, but there’s also many others not happy. I’m gonna bet you don’t pvp.. cuz pvp is another area of the game casual players have no idea is suffering.

Baeyne.9584:

The tempo of GW2 right now is ok for me. Anet did advertise this game as being casual friendly, so it is only right that they should try to stick to that.

I said “try” because of the apparent issue that surfaced regarding ascended gear.

Overall, the casual-ness of this game is the one major thing that makes me playing it. I would really hate to see this game become like other games in terms of “hardcore” content.

GW2 is GW2, and GW2 is a “casual game”. There is no appeal in making it the same as other “hardcore” games.

Well I have no clue as to what ANet told you guys to sell you the game, but the pvp community is raging that they were promised an esport… so casual or esport… can’t have both… Casual gamers don’t make very good pvp players.. sorry just facts. Many people have said they are trying to please too wide a playerbase. Sounds like it to me..

Mujen.2089:

marnick.4305:

Mujen.2089:

I wasn’t going to even buy the game, my friend convinced me. I LOVED gw1.. Saw gw2, watched streams (most of which are gone now) & decided wasn’t a good sequel to gw1.. Only came cuz my friend. #5 applies to me, i’m too skeptical to spend my money on this game.

I’ve been playing for 6 months straight now because this game allows me to progress with minimal time investment. I’ve got too much other stuff on my plate to play a videogame as if it were a second job. If you stopped after 1 month, you bought the wrong game. You knew GW2 would be a casual sequal to archcasual game GW1.

Didn’t know anything about the game really, saw it being played & the mechanics weren’t for me, so I think from my prior post, pretty much sums it up. So unless you’ve really invested a lot of money into this game, should I say you’re part of that casual group that feels spending money on a game is a waste?

I’ve bought several gemcards myself + my fiancée gives me one from time to time. Spending money on a game isn’t waste. Spending money on subscription is a waste.

Would you sell an RV to a person who travels once/3yrs or a person who travels 2-3/year? Who do you think is more likely to make a better sales pitch on? Since we’re talking business. Over 6 mo you have spent.. $100? on gems… for a “video game” of little priority?

I don’t know what an RV is but lets turn it around. An oldtimer car you’re only allowed to drive at happenings in Belgium. That means you pay over 10k for a cool car+maintainance, only to drive it 4 times a year. Many people love doing that, many people spend a lot of money on their oldtimers. But renting an oldtimer … not really.

If i am not mistaken.

The majority of the complaint threads in the general discussions forum is concerned with how “grindy” or how “hardcore” this game is.

Compared to the amount of people who post those kind of threads to people who post that this game lacks “hardcore” content. The “need more hardcore thingy” threads are abyssmaly low.

The fact that pvp may be suffering or not has no relation to the “hardcore-ness” of this game, because casual players still pvp.

Baeyne.9584:

If i am not mistaken.

The majority of the complaint threads in the general discussions forum is concerned with how “grindy” or how “hardcore” this game is.

Compared to the amount of people who post those kind of threads to people who post that this game lacks “hardcore” content. The “need more hardcore thingy” threads are abyssmaly low.

The fact that pvp may be suffering or not has no relation to the “hardcore-ness” of this game, because casual players still pvp.

Please explain to me how “grindy” gw2 is, because I don’t see it.. You can craft to 80 or even knock out 10 lvls easy with 2g.. if you wanted to. So that takes care of leveling.

What to do at 80?
Map completion – solo no “grind”
WvW – group fun? or solo fun?
Dungeons – grp up/solo queue for tokens of your choice
Farm for gold to buy stuff – “farming” grind
Jumping Puzzles – can be done naked so, gear is not a factor.
level a craft – need materials and/or gold… harvest items yourself (which is apparently part of the attraction of the game) or farming grind.
Legendary creation/purchase – “grindy” depending on ur persective or avenue of acquiring.

Besides Legendaries/map completition/completiting all jumping puzzles.. what are the long term attractions to the game? Where is the GRIND that takes so long.. the painstaking hardcorness of gw2 to be complained about? Is it because it can’t be all done in 2 weeks playing 1hr/day?

My point exactly! The game is already casual, yet people are screaming at anet for making it too “grindy”.

Now imagine, if you put in content that is more “grindy” or “hardcore” than what is i the game now.

I admit i love progression, i love gearing my toon with the best gear. But that is already satisfied by ascended gear and testing myself in higher level fractals.

Like i said, i like the tempo of the game right now. I will can even go so far as to say that anet managed to strike a balance between “hardcore” content and “casual” content.

And if Anet manages to maintain this balance in the years to come, then i can truely say that they lived up to their manifesto.

Mujen.2089:

Besides Legendaries/map completition/completiting all jumping puzzles.. what are the long term attractions to the game? Where is the GRIND that takes so long.. the painstaking hardcorness of gw2 to be complained about? Is it because it can’t be all done in 2 weeks playing 1hr/day?

As a casual, I think the amount of content is just right. Ascended isn’t too crazy to get and gives a realistic gearing goal. I sincerely hope it’s the last step ever though. Legendary weapons are extremely long-term cosmetic goals with are also exactly what I want as a casual. There’s plenty of achievements to spend a lot of time on too.

I’ve been playing almost daily² since release. I’ve barely scratched the surface of the game.

² daily means 5 days a week, about 1 hour a day max. Weekends are almost impossibel for me to log on. Some days I go on a binge which leads to an average 3h daily in lifetime.

Knight Kravitz.5162:

Simple. Too casual and easy, let’s see tactics and difficulty. Enough said.

Wear full-squishy gear.
There’s more progression than just item rarity and whatnot.

Most people think the game, like most other MMORPG’s, is about item progression. Get the BiS and you’re done. Just like in GW1, getting BiS is a joke. The endgame gear progression should be about getting a fancy and pretty armor/weaponset that makes you feel happy. That’s the item progression.

The gear progression should, also, be looked at in a different light.

Get beefy gear that will let you live when you make a mistake.

Slowly start getting squishier gear as you learn to mitigate damage with your profession’s utility.

End up with full-squishy gear and not die.

If you want tactics and difficulty, give yourself a challenge. If you’re truly a hardcore player you would get yourself out of your element and put yourself at risk. Go into WvW and solo/roam. Keep going and take okittenerg.

If that’s not your cup of tea, try soloing a dungeon or a dungeon boss. There are a lot of solo’s that have been recorded. That’s something that’s in almost any players reach if they dedicated time and effort. I, personally, would like to do something like that but am limited by an ~15fps machine running on lowest settings when fighting big battles. It tends to spike during the crucial moments, too, but I won’t go into details because I’m also making excuses for how bad I can be, at times.

Don’t think that Legendaries and Exotics/Ascended make you a hardcore player. I’m a casual that plays the game hardcore. Sure, I’ll be an elitist and do Fractals or CoF speedruns, but I only do it if I have something that I will gain. In terms of Fractals, it was an ascended backpiece. In regards to CoF speedruns, it’s for quick cash and adding to my sword collection (with the tokens).

when the game first came out i’d have agreed with you but now that they have added ascended items and these new rank things they’ve gone way too hardcore.

is playing for 2 years to get your gear and 80 fractals not enough?

To the OP, and any that agree with OP: quit whining and find another hobby instead of wasting your life away in a pixel world…

The people that get a character, or 10, to lvl 80 and fully ascended, exotic, w/ legendary in less than a year spend waaaaay too much time in this make believe world.

Casual players and middle of the road player bases are much larger and more of an income base than hardcore players. It’s economics 101, cater to the larger crowd.

Too much casual?
-Cough-

Sorry but this entire topic feels like the very fundamental problem incarnate.

There are ENOUGH hardcore games out there for people that “LOVE” that philosophy of mind set, go and enjoy one if you hate this one so much.

Honestly this game actually ISNT casual ENOUGH, fractals are biased, explorable dungoneering is biased, wvw is extremely biased and even more so to end game pvp.

No, this isnt casual friendly so dont even “use” that excuse.

Not sure if thread is made by troll or not.

i just want to see more exciting bosses with better loots and actual possiblities to fail lol, you cant even fail a dragon event……

In PvE we need more high-end dungeons (similar to DoA, UW, FoW from GW1) or mabye a hard-mode, where you face lvl 80-100 creatures. I think they allrdy have plans about these things. Mabye we will see this in upcoming expansions/patches.

Mujen.2089:

uknortherner.2670:

I get the impression that to most hardcore players, the very concept of “fun” is an irrelevance. It’s numbers, kills, gear, money, prestige. The game is simply a second job to them.

For people like me who sit somewhere in between casual and hardcore, GW2 suits me fine.

.. non casual gamers don’t complain about your map completions, jumping puzzles and whatever it is you guys do… yet casual gamers feel they should be on the same lvl as everyone else, why? If you can’t raid, you cant raid… so u can do dungeons.. it’s that simple.

From my standpoint the problem with “hardcore” players is that they drive discontent. After spending 12 hours a day in the game they’re on the forums complaining that there’s nothing to do and the game is boring and dying and already dead and there’s nothing to do and, “OMG I”m not gonna do a kittened jump puzzle give me raids!"

The problem is that most people can’t do raids. I want the devs to spend their precious resources on things that can be enjoyed by many different types of players/people. Not something that can ONLY be enjoyed by hardcore players, because then they spend their 12 hours a day chewing through the content, master it and start kittening that there’s nothing to do and, “OMG I’m not gonna do a kittened jump puzzle, give me more raids!”

Fractals were a great addition to the game because casuals can play at low levels and hard-core can push that envelope up-up-up and everyone is happy. I would have loved to see some new fractals coming into the mix in this update. Fractals, or ever increasing dungeon difficulties are a nice mix for casual-hardcore. This is the type of content that I’d like to see continue. It doesn’t eliminate casuals completely from the mix, but it gives the hardcore both a challenge and bragging rights. But there is still a problem with how quickly it is digested.

Off topic:

The problem with Fractals is that players have zero chance at the best rewards unless they push the levels really high meaning that casual players have no chance at the best rewards whatsoever. I can see that for the ascended items and the crafting materials for infusions, they’re only needed if you’re in the higher levels anyway. But, some of the Fractal Skins are fabulous. The problem is that they come in account bound — hardcore players can’t sell them on the TP even after they get duplicates of the same skin, making their play seem unrewarding and casuals can’t get them by any method. In my opinion both sets of players would be better served if the drops were able to be sold between players.

Mujen.2089:

Well sometimes friends do things for other friends.. if you have friends you’ll understand that. Correct me if im wrong but did I create this thread? have you looked at the other areas of the forums? Do you pvp? You’re happy with the game, that’s good for you, but there’s also many others not happy. I’m gonna bet you don’t pvp.. cuz pvp is another area of the game casual players have no idea is suffering.

None of my friends expect me to buy a video game that I am not interested in to game with them.

Knight Kravitz.5162:

i just want to see more exciting bosses with better loots and actual possiblities to fail lol, you cant even fail a dragon event……

This is not the same as asking for hardcore content. I don’t think there is any player in the game that would disagree with this. I want to be able to fail too, because that makes success mean something. I want to be able have have interesting boss fights. But, I don’t expect to have to go to great lengths or spend long hours in game to have those things.

Aye.8392:

Mujen.2089:

uknortherner.2670:

I get the impression that to most hardcore players, the very concept of “fun” is an irrelevance. It’s numbers, kills, gear, money, prestige. The game is simply a second job to them.

For people like me who sit somewhere in between casual and hardcore, GW2 suits me fine.

.. non casual gamers don’t complain about your map completions, jumping puzzles and whatever it is you guys do… yet casual gamers feel they should be on the same lvl as everyone else, why? If you can’t raid, you cant raid… so u can do dungeons.. it’s that simple.

From my standpoint the problem with “hardcore” players is that they drive discontent. After spending 12 hours a day in the game they’re on the forums complaining that there’s nothing to do and the game is boring and dying and already dead and there’s nothing to do and, “OMG I”m not gonna do a kittened jump puzzle give me raids!"

The problem is that most people can’t do raids. I want the devs to spend their precious resources on things that can be enjoyed by many different types of players/people. Not something that can ONLY be enjoyed by hardcore players, because then they spend their 12 hours a day chewing through the content, master it and start kittening that there’s nothing to do and, “OMG I’m not gonna do a kittened jump puzzle, give me more raids!”

Fractals were a great addition to the game because casuals can play at low levels and hard-core can push that envelope up-up-up and everyone is happy. I would have loved to see some new fractals coming into the mix in this update. Fractals, or ever increasing dungeon difficulties are a nice mix for casual-hardcore. This is the type of content that I’d like to see continue. It doesn’t eliminate casuals completely from the mix, but it gives the hardcore both a challenge and bragging rights. But there is still a problem with how quickly it is digested.

Off topic:

The problem with Fractals is that players have zero chance at the best rewards unless they push the levels really high meaning that casual players have no chance at the best rewards whatsoever. I can see that for the ascended items and the crafting materials for infusions, they’re only needed if you’re in the higher levels anyway. But, some of the Fractal Skins are fabulous. The problem is that they come in account bound — hardcore players can’t sell them on the TP even after they get duplicates of the same skin, making their play seem unrewarding and casuals can’t get them by any method. In my opinion both sets of players would be better served if the drops were able to be sold between players.

I disagree with selling that would make fractals completely pointless:p the loot is hardly even ether at higher levels I myself am 40 fracs and I got better look 10-20 then they decided to nerf the high levels this games becoming a giant nerf instead of just making stuff harder

marnick.4305:

Mujen.2089:

Besides Legendaries/map completition/completiting all jumping puzzles.. what are the long term attractions to the game? Where is the GRIND that takes so long.. the painstaking hardcorness of gw2 to be complained about? Is it because it can’t be all done in 2 weeks playing 1hr/day?

I’ve been playing almost daily² since release. I’ve barely scratched the surface of the game.

² daily means 5 days a week, about 1 hour a day max. Weekends are almost impossibel for me to log on. Some days I go on a binge which leads to an average 3h daily in lifetime.

This right here is the problem, ive only just come to realise it and ive been playing for a year on and off.Gw2 IS too casual..

By the time i get home from work , my other activities, dinner etc and start playing its around 7:30 pm. I play around 3to4 hours nightly. Now for someone like me that plays 4 hours a night, ive run out of stuff to do, you can only farm dungeons so much till your geared on all ur toons.

Gw2 is too casual, it only took me a year to realise it ( playing on and off ).

Kitedyou.1720:

To the OP, and any that agree with OP: quit whining and find another hobby instead of wasting your life away in a pixel world…

This is one of the stupidest sayings going. " get another hobby if you dont like it "
So, tell me friend, what do you do in the evening?
Its either tv ( boring , boring , boring, i DL anything i want to watch ), read a book ( i do inbetween ) or keep ur brain remain active with computr games.

You like casualnesss , i dont. I like to challenge myself in ALL aspects of my life…

I casually play hardcore. I play GW2 however I want and spend nearly all my spare time (more time than anything else) playing it.