I think WvW should be “rewarding” enough that we get the things we need in order to continue playing. I play WvW because WvW is fun. PvE has done this very strange morphing into nothing but an endless “reward” farm. I mean….do these people endlessly farming the same champion event over and over and over actually stop and think about what they’re doing? Like….really? All you’re left with is “why?”
How people think it’s worth it to spend hours and hours farming out worthless artificial currency while not actually having real fun….is beyond me. Yeah, it pays well (artificially), but it’s not….fun. WvW pays better than PvE at any level of rewards, because WvW provides real challenge and fun. Even if it’s a buggy, mostly neglected, mess, it’s far superior than what ANet seems to be investing most of their resources in.
What happens when ANet realizes that their game is nothing but farming and pulls things back to even half of what they added with this farm event?
I think WvW should be “rewarding” enough that we get the things we need in order to continue playing. I play WvW because WvW is fun. PvE has done this very strange morphing into nothing but an endless “reward” farm. I mean….do these people endlessly farming the same champion event over and over and over actually stop and think about what they’re doing? Like….really? All you’re left with is “why?”
How people think it’s worth it to spend hours and hours farming out worthless artificial currency while not actually having real fun….is beyond me. Yeah, it pays well (artificially), but it’s not….fun. WvW pays better than PvE at any level of rewards, because WvW provides real challenge and fun. Even if it’s a buggy, mostly neglected, mess, it’s far superior than what ANet seems to be investing most of their resources in.
What happens when ANet realizes that their game is nothing but farming and pulls things back to even half of what they added with this farm event?
It’s actually pretty simple to rationalize their stupidity Fauntz. Everyone wants to feel like a winner, or at least have some sort of affirmation they don’t suck. Rewarding someone for doing something, even if that something is say, sleeping with Rosie O’Donnell for 5 million dollars, will encourage people to do it. Not because knocking boots with that train wreck of a human being would be enjoyed, but because you’re going to get 5 million dollars to do it.
No matter how stupid, boring, or disgusting the task is (remember Fear Factor?) if the rewards are deemed valuable enough to people they’ll do it…the dumber the person or the higher the reward the more likely the task will get done. I’ll never clean a chemical toilet at a Hair Metal concert, because I’m fairly skilled and intelligent and have way better employment options …but if they offer me 250 thousand dollars to clean that chemical toilet I suddenly realize my dignity has a price tag. My skills and intelligence suddenly become irrelevant if I’m motivated by money.
…just as a note that will blow your mind…all modern 1st world currency is artificial, groups give it a made up value, it’s literally just a bunch of paper we print dead peoples faces on, add a number, and say it’s worth a foot long sub. Game currencies operate the same way.
Circumventing profanity filters one kitten at a time.
I think WvW should be “rewarding” enough that we get the things we need in order to continue playing. I play WvW because WvW is fun. PvE has done this very strange morphing into nothing but an endless “reward” farm. I mean….do these people endlessly farming the same champion event over and over and over actually stop and think about what they’re doing? Like….really? All you’re left with is “why?”
How people think it’s worth it to spend hours and hours farming out worthless artificial currency while not actually having real fun….is beyond me. Yeah, it pays well (artificially), but it’s not….fun. WvW pays better than PvE at any level of rewards, because WvW provides real challenge and fun. Even if it’s a buggy, mostly neglected, mess, it’s far superior than what ANet seems to be investing most of their resources in.
What happens when ANet realizes that their game is nothing but farming and pulls things back to even half of what they added with this farm event?
This is a point I keep trying to make. Remember FPS games before they had XP? Remember when you played the next round of Unreal Tournament simply because the last round was fun, and the next one probably will be too? That’s what keeps me playing WvW and sPvP. Granted, I’d like to see a bit more evidence of development resources being poured into WvW, but for the time being, it’s still fun, and I’ll still play.
On the other hand though, all the farming that PvE enables does inflate the economy, and does make it harder for the non-farmer to afford some spicy mushrooms and weapon oil. In that respect, I think more if not most primary WvW players don’t want so much to be rewarded, as they want not to be left behind, financially speaking. As you stated, most just need it to be rewarding enough to sustain itself. It still kind of stings to see those who are into brainless farming rolling in gold while those engaged in something much closer to battle are rolling in comparative squalor.
The possibility of physical and mental collapse is now very real.
No sympathy for the Devil, keep that in mind.
Buy the ticket, take the ride.
I think WvW should be “rewarding” enough that we get the things we need in order to continue playing. I play WvW because WvW is fun. PvE has done this very strange morphing into nothing but an endless “reward” farm. I mean….do these people endlessly farming the same champion event over and over and over actually stop and think about what they’re doing? Like….really? All you’re left with is “why?”
How people think it’s worth it to spend hours and hours farming out worthless artificial currency while not actually having real fun….is beyond me. Yeah, it pays well (artificially), but it’s not….fun. WvW pays better than PvE at any level of rewards, because WvW provides real challenge and fun. Even if it’s a buggy, mostly neglected, mess, it’s far superior than what ANet seems to be investing most of their resources in.
What happens when ANet realizes that their game is nothing but farming and pulls things back to even half of what they added with this farm event?
This is a point I keep trying to make. Remember FPS games before they had XP? Remember when you played the next round of Unreal Tournament simply because the last round was fun, and the next one probably will be too? That’s what keeps me playing WvW and sPvP. Granted, I’d like to see a bit more evidence of development resources being poured into WvW, but for the time being, it’s still fun, and I’ll still play.
On the other hand though, all the farming that PvE enables does inflate the economy, and does make it harder for the non-farmer to afford some spicy mushrooms and weapon oil. In that respect, I think more if not most primary WvW players don’t want so much to be rewarded, as they want not to be left behind, financially speaking. As you stated, most just need it to be rewarding enough to sustain itself. It still kind of stings to see those who are into brainless farming rolling in gold while those engaged in something much closer to battle are rolling in comparative squalor.
Indeed. I’ve been making kids cry and rage quit from getting owned in online games since Quake, and I did it just to taste their tears…best reward system ever.
WvW is akin to that, but I only get two maps (sure there’s 4 but 3 are identical), it’s bug infested, there’s exploits you can run into virtually without trying, and there’s no longer fair or balanced matchups…most of which we’ve had to deal with for a year.
Bad rewards is just pouring salt in the wound.
Circumventing profanity filters one kitten at a time.
I think WvW should be “rewarding” enough that we get the things we need in order to continue playing. I play WvW because WvW is fun. PvE has done this very strange morphing into nothing but an endless “reward” farm. I mean….do these people endlessly farming the same champion event over and over and over actually stop and think about what they’re doing? Like….really? All you’re left with is “why?”
How people think it’s worth it to spend hours and hours farming out worthless artificial currency while not actually having real fun….is beyond me. Yeah, it pays well (artificially), but it’s not….fun. WvW pays better than PvE at any level of rewards, because WvW provides real challenge and fun. Even if it’s a buggy, mostly neglected, mess, it’s far superior than what ANet seems to be investing most of their resources in.
What happens when ANet realizes that their game is nothing but farming and pulls things back to even half of what they added with this farm event?
This is a point I keep trying to make. Remember FPS games before they had XP? Remember when you played the next round of Unreal Tournament simply because the last round was fun, and the next one probably will be too? That’s what keeps me playing WvW and sPvP. Granted, I’d like to see a bit more evidence of development resources being poured into WvW, but for the time being, it’s still fun, and I’ll still play.
On the other hand though, all the farming that PvE enables does inflate the economy, and does make it harder for the non-farmer to afford some spicy mushrooms and weapon oil. In that respect, I think more if not most primary WvW players don’t want so much to be rewarded, as they want not to be left behind, financially speaking. As you stated, most just need it to be rewarding enough to sustain itself. It still kind of stings to see those who are into brainless farming rolling in gold while those engaged in something much closer to battle are rolling in comparative squalor.
Indeed. I’ve been making kids cry and rage quit from getting owned in online games since Quake, and I did it just to taste their tears…best reward system ever.
WvW is akin to that, but I only get two maps (sure there’s 4 but 3 are identical), it’s bug infested, there’s exploits you can run into virtually without trying, and there’s no longer fair or balanced matchups…most of which we’ve had to deal with for a year.
Bad rewards is just pouring salt in the wound.
I think we all agree about the big difference between PvE and WvW, for the good and bad.
Money/farming/reward wise, there are only two things that would make me happier in WvW:
1- Making a decent and constant amount of gold. Enough to buy what I need to play, such as consumables (food+oil/stones), gear (the one strictly necessary, maybe if I change build, etc.) and siege/upgrades for towers, etc.. I do not need to have hundreds of gold, just a decent amount so that I do not need to go farming in PvE to get 5g/hour;
2- Some cosmetic reward which is exclusive for WvW (or whatever, even not exclusive) but some sort of variety in skins, which now I can only get by doing solid PvE…
Thing here is that killing other players doesn’t require that you do anything special, you are not being asked to quit having fun and do something boring/less attractive.
Thing here is that killing other players doesn’t require that you do anything special, you are not being asked to quit having fun and do something boring/less attractive.
Depends on what you’re defining “asked” as.
If someone is trash talking to my face they’re asking for me to trash talk back…or possibly baiting me to hit them.
If someone is offering me lavish rewards for a task that requires minimal effort they’re asking me to do that thing.
Personally I don’t care if ANet releases a Living Story line that poops precursors, I’m not going to do it because it sucks, its pathetic, and if I wanted to PvE I’d log off and play Skyrim or Left 4 Dead 2 (has a way better downed state mechanic BTW) because those are actually fun games with quality content.
ANets fascist laws of rewarding crappy content do not apply to me, because I have this odd obsession with being entertained by my entertainment products…pretty foreign concept in the MMO market.
Circumventing profanity filters one kitten at a time.
250,000 Total Kills in WvW Ultimate Dominator (almost 800 hours) gives a total of almost 50 achievement points when a living story 10 hour content give the same amount of points?
250,000 Total Kills in WvW Ultimate Dominator (almost 800 hours) gives a total of almost 50 achievement points when a living story 10 hour content give the same amount of points?
800 hours? Most dedicated wvw players have racked up a lot more than 800 hours, and a lot less than 250k kills. 250k kills should award about 1000 points all on its own. :P
Examples:
- Escort 500,000 supply caravans
- Capture 1,000,000 objectives.
- Capture Stonemist Castle 25,000 times. <- this is my favorite! hahaha! plus the reward is 25 points!
If you cap SM one time per day, you will need 68 YEARS to get this 25 points, I will die first (in real life), unless immortality is invented, before completing that.
Examples:
- Escort 500,000 supply caravans
- Capture 1,000,000 objectives.
- Capture Stonemist Castle 25,000 times. <- this is my favorite! hahaha! plus the reward is 25 points!
If you cap SM one time per day, you will need 68 YEARS to get this 25 points, I will die first (in real life), unless immortality is invented, before completing that.
well, that’s why they’re considered lifetime achievements. if your lifetime is long enough to actually get it, that’s one hell of an achievement.
As I said above, we will address these, ideally, by the end of the year. The rewards will be better and the numbers will be less crazy town. There will also be some changes coming sooner than that that will go some length to addressing the imbalance in terms of total achievement points in WvW compared to PvE.
As I said above, we will address these, ideally, by the end of the year. The rewards will be better and the numbers will be less crazy town. There will also be some changes coming sooner than that that will go some length to addressing the imbalance in terms of total achievement points in WvW compared to PvE.
I’m very happy to see this. Though it doesn’t take very much from you guys to pleasantly surprise me.
[VoTF] www.votf-online.net
7.2k+ hours played on Minesweeper
As I said above, we will address these, ideally, by the end of the year. The rewards will be better and the numbers will be less crazy town. There will also be some changes coming sooner than that that will go some length to addressing the imbalance in terms of total achievement points in WvW compared to PvE.
blah blah blah, WvW players get the short end of the stick, as usual. But thanks for responding!
Sanctum of Rall
Pain Train Choo [Choo]
Mind Smack – Mesmer
Thing here is that killing other players doesn’t require that you do anything special, you are not being asked to quit having fun and do something boring/less attractive.
Are we being asked? No. Is it all but necessary? Yes. And as Devon said just a few days ago…
Precursors do drop from the chests, but very rarely. I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole. We will continue to do what we can to improve the rewards available from WvW and there are some developments specifically relating to skill points that are coming soon to the game as a whole, but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.
(emphasis mine)
That’s basically admitting that they have to cajole us back into PvE for whatever reason. Be it making the LS look more populated than it would be otherwise or whatever. Granted, this post was about getting particular shinies. Shinies which I have no problem going without, but it still betrays that the devs feel the need to push us back into PvE for some reason. It was kind of insulting (and as a general rule, I’ll defend Devon and the devs) that he was implying that all of us in WvW land had no idea what we were missing. I’d wager most WvWers got their $60 out of PvE and are sticking around specifically for the WvW. That would be, like, playing how you want to play.
The possibility of physical and mental collapse is now very real.
No sympathy for the Devil, keep that in mind.
Buy the ticket, take the ride.
Thing here is that killing other players doesn’t require that you do anything special, you are not being asked to quit having fun and do something boring/less attractive.
Are we being asked? No. Is it all but necessary? Yes. And as Devon said just a few days ago…
Precursors do drop from the chests, but very rarely. I’d love to say you should be able to get everything ever from just playing WvW, but not only is that not going to happen, it’s not good for the game as a whole. We will continue to do what we can to improve the rewards available from WvW and there are some developments specifically relating to skill points that are coming soon to the game as a whole, but honestly if you want to get all the things in the game, you have to play all the game. Branch out, I suspect you’ll enjoy it. And WvW will still be there when you want to play it.
(emphasis mine)
That’s basically admitting that they have to cajole us back into PvE for whatever reason. Be it making the LS look more populated than it would be otherwise or whatever. Granted, this post was about getting particular shinies. Shinies which I have no problem going without, but it still betrays that the devs feel the need to push us back into PvE for some reason. It was kind of insulting (and as a general rule, I’ll defend Devon and the devs) that he was implying that all of us in WvW land had no idea what we were missing. I’d wager most WvWers got their $60 out of PvE and are sticking around specifically for the WvW. That would be, like, playing how you want to play.
Spot on perfect. I have played some 2800hrs on this game. Not alot compared to some i know, but i have done all the PVE i ever want to do. I have wasted alot of my own money trying for a precurser to get a legendary( some 500 gold brought with gems) with no luck. I have no intrest in anything PVE anymore. I play the game for WvW yet we get no real support. I can only assume that the Devs are trying there best at pushing forward in WvW but i dont really see any light in the tunnel. It’s been 1 full year since release and what have we got. I have done every single Beta weekend that i could, and nothing in WvW has changed really since, then. Dont get me wrong i love the game. But we will never be treated like the PVEer’s out there.
blah blah blah, WvW players get the short end of the stick, as usual. But thanks for responding!
This made me lol. Talk about backhanded compliments.
7 months later and we have WvW season AP, but those original WvW APs still have not been changed. I think you should apoligise to rchu.8945
Macros, you can use them as long as they arent macros.
Remember to buy the officially endorsed GW2 Steel Series Keyboard, it supports macros!
WvW, we only care if it affects the servers we play on.
As I said above, we will address these, ideally, by the end of the year. The rewards will be better and the numbers will be less crazy town. There will also be some changes coming sooner than that that will go some length to addressing the imbalance in terms of total achievement points in WvW compared to PvE.
Ah, I guess I remembered that wrong. I remembered it as “by Christmas”(unless there is another – not yet necroed thread). I guess when it’s up for WvW “by the end of the year” means “by the end of the year 20xx we’ll put a blog”. But hey, at least they know these numbers are unrealistic and are " working on it™ ".
Now I wonder when will they get kittened off enough to change the CoC as not to allow necroing of old dev posts.
I want yakslapper currently it will take me 100yrs at my current pace. 10k yaks dead in a year. Surprise that the easiest wvw ap is ultimate dominator is 250k kills which is possible but yakslapper is 1million kills :P. Still should have just started a new thread instead of bring this up again.
Ele – Tarnished Coast
“Quoth the raven nevermore”
Platinum Scout: 300% MF
I kind of feel bad for the Dev’s that made the posts. I know they wanted to do what they said, but had been ordered otherwise probably.
In any case, one day, one year there will be:
Feasible achievements in WvW
Raid UI for the Squad + Commander abilities help
Help for population balance (so many suggestions have been made no progress was done).
When scientists discover the center of the universe,
a lot of people will be disappointed they are not it.
I kind of feel bad for the Dev’s that made the posts. I know they wanted to do what they said, but had been ordered otherwise probably.
In any case, one day, one year there will be:
Feasible achievements in WvW
Raid UI for the Squad + Commander abilities help
Help for population balance (so many suggestions have been made no progress was done).
There has been progress.. I am sure I read somewhere that the WvW team finally worked out how to empty the trashcan , there back office is now re-primed and ready to dump the next load into the ether…
i just wanted to come here and say to all of you, 25k kills is a lot, and you should be proud of yourselves, even if the rewards aren’t as amazing as you hoped. I remember when i first saw this Achievement, i was very excited to begin my journey for ultimate dominator… however, i dont ever roam with zergs, and hardly any other people at that. here i am at 10k kills. proud of about half those, the other half were scrubs im sure of it.
As I said above, we will address these, ideally, by the end of the year. The rewards will be better and the numbers will be less crazy town. There will also be some changes coming sooner than that that will go some length to addressing the imbalance in terms of total achievement points in WvW compared to PvE.
Hi Devon, I will praise your honestly and courage and will respect you decisions and efforts, If you come out and say the issue won’t be worked on. On this particular issue and the 100 other ones. We understand if you say the team has other priorities and don’t expect this to change. That for me and some others is more valuable than any other fake promise. It will prove that you don;t take us for a bunch of fools….
Fixes for these are being worked on. As well as changes to the WvW achievements to make them more in line with all the other achievements in the game. And to reward a suitable amount of achievement points. However, making changes to achievements that are already live is far more complicated than it would seem and we have focused on other areas so far. This is on our list to fix by the end of the year, however.
I’ve said it before, and I will repeat it here. We are aware of the problems with the WvW achievements and will be doing more to address them in the near future.
I don’t think it is realistic to hold them to a date. I do think it is expected for Devon to keep us updated though.
We have this huge feature patch and what is in it for WvW? Account bound xp? I don’t understand how fixing a poor design decision is considered a feature.
Well I’m almost there, now at over 24500 WvW kills…
Looking very much forward to the SUPER GENEROUS 10 achievement points I am about to receive… However I would rather receive a PRECURSOR a title and some gold, considering all the time that took.
Seriously, I’m looking very much forward to the new content, but PLEASE fix the unrealistically disappointing rewards in WvW.
I know this is not the first time it’s mentioned, but as I am approaching my 25k now I had to say something about it.
A whole 10?
No wonder people who do dungeons make fun of us.
Not keeping all IT jobs here is a major reason IT is so bad HERE. 33y IT 10y IT Security
Guys, Devon said wait until the end of the year. Give them time to address this issue.
The end of the year?
So…. two+ years without any needed changes and fixes in WvW???
While we’re taking losses every single day in WvW in lagging and servers without adequate populations?
In reality, many humans will move on rather than continue to play the one part of the game that should be the most polished. My friends did – they are now paying for the privilege of not being told “next year” . (five months from now or more…)
Not keeping all IT jobs here is a major reason IT is so bad HERE. 33y IT 10y IT Security
There will also be some changes coming sooner than that that will go some length to addressing the imbalance in terms of total achievement points in WvW compared to PvE.
Like the not inconsiderable amount of AP in the EotM category and, of course, from Seasons.
Yeah, they haven’t manged to re-do the main WvW achievement category, but it’s not like nothing has happened.
Guys, Devon said wait until the end of the year. Give them time to address this issue.
The end of the year?
So…. two+ years without any needed changes and fixes in WvW???
While we’re taking losses every single day in WvW in lagging and servers without adequate populations?
In reality, many humans will move on rather than continue to play the one part of the game that should be the most polished. My friends did – they are now paying for the privilege of not being told “next year” . (five months from now or more…)
In fairness to Smooth Penguin… it is any easy fail to make as Devon never actually said the end of which year… smoke screens are smoke screens for a reason, helps to dodge dem bullets more successfully!
If you actually read his post instead of selectively quoting, he said “ideally, by the end of the year”. Which means it would have been ideal to get it done by then, but he didn’t say it would be.
So what he said was true, and still is. Things have happened in a less than ideal way, but that’s life.
Getting an honest two way dialog requires mutual respect. The amount words get twisted and misquoted it’s no wonder the devs don’t post as much as we might like. So many times I see people complaining that the devs aren’t replying, when those same people have engineered the ‘conversation’ so that the only sensible response is none at all.
I think the issue is that there is no mutual respect. Respect is earned.
We’ve been loyal GW players for years, yet if we post a single thing about any issue with the game, our posts are deleted and ignored.
Anet has lost our respect for them, it is they who need to earn it back. Instead they have taken the cowardly way out by permanently banning people from the forums. What does that say about how they take the community’s views?
The WvW Forum Poster Formerly Known As Omaris Mortuus Est
Fixes for these are being worked on. As well as changes to the WvW achievements to make them more in line with all the other achievements in the game. And to reward a suitable amount of achievement points. However, making changes to achievements that are already live is far more complicated than it would seem and we have focused on other areas so far. This is on our list to fix by the end of the year, however.
Which year?
We had a promise it was being looked at last year..
Kill count is a joke, as some people clock up several hundred or more a day just by zerging or doing gvg and playing toons that can tag everything in sight on a stacked server or one that has a lot of zerg vs zerg battles, whereas less populated servers people might struggle to get more than a couple dozen kills.
Victory, Beings Lost On Borderlands (BLOB), SFR & Gandara (inactive)
If you actually read his post instead of selectively quoting, he said “ideally, by the end of the year”. Which means it would have been ideal to get it done by then, but he didn’t say it would be.
So what he said was true, and still is. Things have happened in a less than ideal way, but that’s life.
We are already one third into a new year.
In the time frame since his post, PvEers have gotten several new semi-dungeons, a giant tower, a completely redesigned LA, more SAB, new Teq, Wurm, Marionette, Scarlet, etc.
We are not only angry at the lies, but also at the faceless higher-ups that so blatantly misallocate resources. If Devon et al got some real support from their company going, I’m sure he could so some magic on a proper time scale. It’s not primarily about the devs themselves.
Getting an honest two way dialog requires mutual respect. The amount words get twisted and misquoted it’s no wonder the devs don’t post as much as we might like. So many times I see people complaining that the devs aren’t replying, when those same people have engineered the ‘conversation’ so that the only sensible response is none at all.
So in short, grow up show some respect.
Trust isn’t free. It’s earned. There wasn’t a single update targeted at the core WvW audience since the ruins change last September — and that wasn’t very well designed.
It took more than 5 years to create GW2. Perhaps it takes just as long to fix issues. I’m not a game programmer, so I don’t understand these technical things.
