Guild Wars 2

The ratings you (Anet) gained during the one day matches to start your week matches have now been destroyed due to guilds transferring everywhere theres servers in tiers they shouldn’t be in anymore etc.

3 day matches is long enough to get to the point where you have a good idea who is going to win (almost certain) but before the point where they should be leaving to not play wvw anymore.

It would also be long or short enough to put servers in the tiers they should be in after transfer outbreaks.

I should reply to :
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Bring-back-one-day-matches/first#post431647

But this really needed it’s own thread for the points made.

Supporting this.

This would be a great idea. 3 days keeps it fun the entire time and u wont feel bad for investing money on upgrades and stuff.

3 days would be bad for those who can only play on weekends. And then people will start saying that their “main force” is on only during weekends/weekdays etc etc, unnecessary drama.. ):

Good idea. This would make it a lot more fun for everyone.

Samfisher.7942:

3 days would be bad for those who can only play on weekends. And then people will start saying that their “main force” is on only during weekends/weekdays etc etc, unnecessary drama.. ):

3 days doesn’t mean it’s going to be cut off during weekends. I don’t understand how this could be bad at all for weekends, if anything it would give them more of a feeling of achievement due to the fact what they did during their time as being a weekend player has a smaller window of time to show results.

Really it’s better for everyone full time players and weekend players, along with better balancing the servers after transfer wars.

I don’t think dragonbrand would have lost as many guilds had it been a three day match.

I think 3 days is a tad too short, especially for the matchups that are fairly close. I’d say 4 days is best. Not too long and not too short.

3 days is nearly 3 matches a week rather than two (well 4 days is one day more than two matches, but three days is only two days more than 3 matches). This will put people where they should be at much faster on the ladder regardless of transfers.

The 3-4 day mark is also around the time when servers start going perma outmanned.

Terrible idea. You can fix the transfer issue by making it take longer to transfer or forcing a longer time in between transfers (or both) on top of not allowing people to transfer to already over populated servers . All short matches do is give the victory to the first server to get momentum.

The whole point of having 2 week long matches is to see who can make through the long haul. If your server starts to quit after being beaten after a couple of days your server simply deserves to lose.

ANET just needs to have harder limits on transfers.

I think separating that match into a number of rounds each week may be a good idea. That way it resets and servers don’t just give up .

Two week matches will annihilate WvW. The losers will be too frustrated at being zerged every time they poke their head out of spawn to show up, and the winners will be too bored of spawn camping to go out either. We’re already seeing this in 7-day matches, in some cases for 6 days… two week matches just means 10+ days of nobody bothering to play WvW.

I also think that 4 days would be better but it has a BIG downside which pretty much kills the idea.

A week has 7 days so the day the matches start will shift week by week. The problem with 4 days is that there is only one reset per calendar week and when that reset lands on a weekend it will cause havoc. Three day matches, on the other hand, means two resets per calendar week. This would make the impact of a weekend reset negligible in comparison.

You know what would probably work out perfectly, though? 60 hour matches. The reason this would work is because it does not benefit the “night crew” or the “day crew” because the start/finish time will always switch, meaning that the server with the best “night” coverage won’t win all the time. It would also make things even better for weekend players.

Personally I thought the one day matches were good, a little too quick 3 days would probably be a lot more ideal than 1 or 7 day, this does a lot more than one thing though.

Not sure how it’s been for you guys but when I’ve been on a server with 100% map control even the winning server starts to quit/log off because there is nothing to do.

I do not support this, I see sense and reasoning to it but i suspect there are hidden agendas here.

I speak from what i have seen on Desolation, Transfers do hurt the server but whining and getting Anet to fix your problem is the easy way out.

Maybe sack it up and fix it yourselves which Desolation has done and now people are transferring back.

Not to mention if you are butt hurt about the one week matches, You are certainly going to hate the two week rotations that will be heading our way soon.

Just my two cents.

Hidden agendas here?

No hidden agendas when you get into a match and are fighting an ex tier two that should now be tier 4 or 5 from server transfers that would be balanced much quicker in a 3 day rotation. Along with many other things this does including preventing some of those server transfers like possibly dragonbrand. Read the first post before you accuse of hidden agendas.

Answer this question : What was the one day rotations really for?

Now, a 3 day rotation is similar to a one day rotation but gives you enough time to really know who is going to win that matchup no matter how long it goes on for.

Two week matchups will be a disaster, and don’t say I didn’t warn you from the start, even someone else above posted why.

I think three and a half day matches would be better.

• First game starts 6am Saturday Morning and Finishes 6pm Tuesday Night.
• Second game starts 6pm Tuesday Night and finishes 6am Saturday morning.

I like 1 week matches, and once (or if) things balance out, would like 2 week matches as well. I don’t see much of a point in discussing this until free server transfers end though.

micron.5369:

I like 1 week matches, and once (or if) things balance out, would like 2 week matches as well. I don’t see much of a point in discussing this until free server transfers end though.

Ending free transferring won’t magically solve balancing or magically balance things out, there is a post about this, and I’ve been saying for months free transfers aren’t the problem.

I support this idea. It’ll make people more hungry for WvWvW. 4 day’s will let everyone in the server get a taste of WvWvW. And if the queues are too long for a 4 day session, it’ll encourage others to switch servers. 24 hours transfer should be changed to 7 days, and eventually become more strict (paying a price). They should hurry up and enable your guild upgrades to be able to move to so people feel more encouraged.

2 week rotations are ideal assuming the player base isn’t ADD and/or butt hurt over losing for a couple days. It gives the right amount of time for turn arounds when server population is balanced. Before changing how long matches last, ANET should first fix some of the other issues with WvW. Then they can think about changing the length of the match. One week right now would be fine if you weren’t allowed to transfer to a server you are currently fighting against, or if server transfers took twice as long as wvw matches.

“One week right now would be fine if you weren’t allowed to transfer to a server you are currently fighting against, or if server transfers took twice as long as wvw matches.”

Well, apparently this is not what ruined the ladder in its entirety.

R E F L H E X.8413:

“One week right now would be fine if you weren’t allowed to transfer to a server you are currently fighting against, or if server transfers took twice as long as wvw matches.”

Well, apparently this is not what ruined the ladder in its entirety.

There’s several issues that need to be addressed that a 3 day match up won’t fix. Lets fix those first before altering how long the matches work

Xpiher.5209:

R E F L H E X.8413:

“One week right now would be fine if you weren’t allowed to transfer to a server you are currently fighting against, or if server transfers took twice as long as wvw matches.”

Well, apparently this is not what ruined the ladder in its entirety.

There’s several issues that need to be addressed that a 3 day match up won’t fix.

There’s also several more that it will severely help, in the case of pros and cons, there’s probably double (more than that) the pro’s here, if there is even a single con.

I’m all for suggestions and all but until transfers are fixed it doesnt matter how long the match is
In addition there are servers who will perform alot better in a 3 day weekday match. The weekend is what starts the match and sets the tone. One would say that the most people per server are available friday night through Sat. So the fact that you set your footing in the first 24 hours makes the wvw great

R E F L H E X.8413:

Xpiher.5209:

R E F L H E X.8413:

“One week right now would be fine if you weren’t allowed to transfer to a server you are currently fighting against, or if server transfers took twice as long as wvw matches.”

Well, apparently this is not what ruined the ladder in its entirety.

There’s several issues that need to be addressed that a 3 day match up won’t fix.

There’s also several more that it will severely help, in the case of pros and cons, there’s probably double (more than that) the pro’s here, if there is even a single con.

You haven’t shown that. 3 day matches only alleviate the “oh we are losing I quit” phenomenon, but if that happens your server simply deserves to lose. As others have stated, 3 days is too short because it’ll ignore the weekends half the time.

Makes more sense to reset on Mondays and Fridays.

Xpiher.5209:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Xpiher.5209:

R E F L H E X.8413:

“One week right now would be fine if you weren’t allowed to transfer to a server you are currently fighting against, or if server transfers took twice as long as wvw matches.”

Well, apparently this is not what ruined the ladder in its entirety.

There’s several issues that need to be addressed that a 3 day match up won’t fix.

There’s also several more that it will severely help, in the case of pros and cons, there’s probably double (more than that) the pro’s here, if there is even a single con.

You haven’t shown that. 3 day matches only alleviate the “oh we are losing I quit” phenomenon, but if that happens your server simply deserves to lose. As others have stated, 3 days is too short because it’ll ignore the weekends half the time.

(Monday Tuesday Wednesday) (thursday Friday Saturday) (Sunday Monday Tuesday)

The weekend is still there and sometimes it will be all weekend. If a server just loggs out that leaves the winning team to do absolutely nothing making all 3 servers doing absolutely nothing in wvw.

CD won last week, but guess what the majority of members quit that match near the ending because there was nothing to do after killing the grub and champion. I’ve been in many matches like this also.

The thing about one day matches was everyone wanted to play all the time, and 3 day would be just like that everyone would want to play all the time. Just because people know it’s time to call it game when they get ganged doesn’t mean they deserve to lose either, it means they don’t feel like beating a dead horse and want their opponents to sit there and not have anything to do so they can’t enjoy themselves either.

Now, Imagine 10 days of wvw having absolutely nothing for you to do in it, sounds great doesn’t it?

How about the fact that we now have servers that should be three tiers lower competing in t2?

Or the fact that people don’t want to play at certain points servers go outmanned and it makes the rest not want to play either?

What you are saying doesn’t even make sense really because if someone only plays on weekends what they did will have a bigger impact on a shorter match and they will see their results sooner.

• I didn’t say 2 weeks was perfect, just that 3 days was too short
• Population unbalance leads to one server able to build orbs and thus get even more powerful
• Server population/time zone distribution isn’t fixed by a 3 day match. This is what causes servers competing in higher or lower tiers than they should
• 3 day matches doesn’t fix the bandwagon issue
• Perma out manned isn’t solved by a 3 day match length, if how well the first day goes largely determines the out come of a match. And like I said, if your server quits due to losing after a day or two it deserves to lose.
• Points being awarded the same throughout a match’s length when some times are less populated by every server than others is not fixed by a 3day match up. This part of the reason why how well you do during the first 2 days determines the out come of a match. If you can take over the entire map without a fight you will have a large point lead instead of what should be a small one.

Those, IMO, are more important issues to solve and cannot be solved by ANET changing how long a match last. Even the suggestion of 60hr matches doesn’t solve that issue.

What does any of that have to do with this thread that progresses the game, those are unrelated to the topic at hand?

The bandwagon issue destroyed the ranking and yes this will even out the rankings 3x as fast nearly making it not effect the ladder as much as it is currently doing, the servers that got abandoned will be back in a comfortable tier within a week, rather than a month.

It’s like going in my drop thread and saying changing drops are a bad idea due to nightcapping. It is completely off topic and shouldn’t even be mentioned.

R E F L H E X.8413:

What does any of that have to do with this thread that progresses the game, those are unrelated to the topic at hand?

The bandwagon issue destroyed the ranking and yes this will even out the rankings 3x as fast nearly making it not effect the ladder as much as it have.

Faster matches doesn’t progress the game. Its a band-aid fix to a larger problem. All it does is increase ranking volatility if those issues aren’t addressed before hand.

I’m not saying your idea is bad presay, I’m just saying it shouldn’t be done until those other issues are addressed. If ANET does it first, its less likely they’ll actually fix the broken mechanics of WvW.

I consider keeping people interested in playing and keeping the ladder more up to date progressing the game. Also :

the servers that got abandoned will be back in a comfortable tier within a week, rather than a month.
It’s like going in my drop thread and saying changing drops are a bad idea due to nightcapping. It is completely off topic and shouldn’t even be mentioned. Actually it just doesn’t even make any sense at all really.

The other things you are saying should be addressed you should make a thread for, they are not even related to this topic, as this topic is talking about improving other things, even some of those will see improvements but are unrelated.

signs

Week long matches suck. The battle is pretty much decided within the first 3-4 days, and after that, people stop playing so one server dominates, or people transfer over.

i think 3 days matches + league style cycling will be more interesting…

currently, only the no1 team moves up, and the 3rd moves down, this system is kinda boring especially for the servers on the “top 2 tiers”, u’re always playing the same people. This also happens to every other server that are borderline on 2 tiers, winning big on weeks then getting stomped the next and repeat.

i think it would be cool if every server gets placed against every other server throughout a long “season” sort of thing, like football leagues, and then maybe reward the top servers at the end of the “season” and even have a “champions’ league” after the main season ends with slightly longer battles, placing the top servers from US and EU against each other for even bigger rewards

Haker.5067:

signs

Week long matches suck. The battle is pretty much decided within the first 3-4 days, and after that, people stop playing so one server dominates, or people transfer over.

Its decided with in the first couple of days because of broken mechanics not necessarily match length

Here’s the only thing that matters :

Haker.5067:

The battle is pretty much decided within the first 3-4 days, and after that, people stop playing so one server dominates, or people transfer over.

What he said was the truth, it doesn’t matter what or why it was decided maybe one server had more night coverage, it doesn’t matter how it was decided the point being the match is decided more than likely in this time frame and the other servers will either quit or worse TRANSFER.

24hour match ups for 4days
All servers against each other (or as close to as possible) in a round-robin point style.

Followed by a 3day weekend final – placing servers against one another according to points accumulated throughout earlier part of the week..

Bragging rights to the weekend winners. And a fresh opportunity to all servers at the beginning of each week.

That’s what I’d like to see.

R E F L H E X.8413:

Here’s the only thing that matters :

Haker.5067:

The battle is pretty much decided within the first 3-4 days, and after that, people stop playing so one server dominates, or people transfer over.

What he said was the truth, it doesn’t matter what or why it was decided maybe one server had more night coverage, it doesn’t matter how it was decided the point being the match is decided more than likely in this time frame and the other servers will either quit or worse TRANSFER.

But it does matter. Those mechanics remain broken with a 3 day match up, which means the band-aid fix (this fix) is an easy way out to cover up the other issues. Its the easy way out. Without those fixes, ladder ranking remains volatile

But hey, if you are ok with a band-aid fixes thats all well in good.

Xpiher.5209:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Here’s the only thing that matters :

Haker.5067:

The battle is pretty much decided within the first 3-4 days, and after that, people stop playing so one server dominates, or people transfer over.

What he said was the truth, it doesn’t matter what or why it was decided maybe one server had more night coverage, it doesn’t matter how it was decided the point being the match is decided more than likely in this time frame and the other servers will either quit or worse TRANSFER.

But it does matter. Those mechanics remain broken with a 3 day match up, which means the band-aid fix (this fix) is an easy way out to cover up the other issues. Its the easy way out. Without those fixes, ladder ranking remains volatile

I see no broken mechanics in wvw, I see points being taken and rewarding you for what you have taken. That is not broken.

Ofcourse this isn’t going to fix hacking, this sin’t even “trying” to be a hotfix for hacking orbs, are you not reading this thread? Many people agree with this and you are trying to argue against something that is obviously good for the game no matter which way you look at it.

Like I said you are bringing up something completely unrelated, you might as well talk about the mesmer portal or something else that is completely unrelated because you are not really contributing to the thread by saying it’s not good becuase it doesn’t fix x, it’s not trying to fix x, what it is doing though is a ton of other good things for the game.

This is a great idea for a very temporary fix. If nothing else Anet should implement this while working on the deeper underlying issues.

R E F L H E X.8413:

Xpiher.5209:

R E F L H E X.8413:

Here’s the only thing that matters :

Haker.5067:

The battle is pretty much decided within the first 3-4 days, and after that, people stop playing so one server dominates, or people transfer over.

What he said was the truth, it doesn’t matter what or why it was decided maybe one server had more night coverage, it doesn’t matter how it was decided the point being the match is decided more than likely in this time frame and the other servers will either quit or worse TRANSFER.

But it does matter. Those mechanics remain broken with a 3 day match up, which means the band-aid fix (this fix) is an easy way out to cover up the other issues. Its the easy way out. Without those fixes, ladder ranking remains volatile

I see no broken mechanics in wvw, I see points being taken and rewarding you for what you have taken. That is not broken.

• Outmanned vs Orb bonuses are broken
• Points being awarded evenly throughout the entire length of the match is broken (it rewards equally when you aren’t actively fighting anyone which is stupid).
• Transfers cause population fluctuation and issues of guilds transferring to lower ranked servers in order to get easy match ups

Those 3 points make it so there the tieres remain volatile with 3 day matches. Fixing these 3 issues perhaps could also fix the issue of people giving up by giving more even matches. If not then 3 day matches should be looked at.

Not sure how it works in NA, but in Europa most matches are fun and quite equal at weekends and WvW gets more and more abandoned during the week, since the match is decided mostly in the night from monday to tuesday.

End yes, the problem would not be solved by 3-day-matches.

And yeah, Exspecially Score and Orbs are broken. Since a primetime-player is almost unimportant for the score, because there are so much of them, normally all battlefields are full, meaning that only about 0,3 Points are around for every Player. If you would keep this “Points per Player”-Base everything would be fine, but normally at night there often aren’t even half as much people online, so people are easy to reach 1 Points per Player, which makes this time more important, than primetime, which should not be.

Alright let me tell you like this, culling is a huge issue that should be addressed. But this 3 day matchup has nothing to do with culling and the problems that culling causes is not even related to the problems that this is addressing. The same thing goes for many of the things you are bringing up.

Now, Transfers are going to happen a lot less with 3 day matches, I personally got to witness the destruction of dragonbrand while we were beating them.

At this point I really do not understand why you are even in this thread other than to troll, because being off topic like this then coming up with more excuses that don’t even make sense to the topic it really seems like you are trolling here.

Terrible idea. I think 1 week is the best format. 2 weeks would be terrible though.

REFLHEX, its not off topic and its not trolling. Your purposed fix is a band-aid fix for all those other issues I’ve brought up. In my experience, game developers are less likely to address core issues if a band-aid fix gets enough momentum

But theres no point in us arguing anymore. We’ve exhausted our points.

This is not trying to bandaid fix anything.

This is trying to keep people playing and encourage them to not transfer so they can actually do something in world vs world.

This is to make it so when the winning server has the full map they don’t have to stand there and have nothing to do for the rest of the week.

This is not trying to fix anything this is trying to keep world vs world playable for both the winners and the losers.

It is also trying to keep the ladder where it should be at other than throwing an abandoned server in matchups they should not be in for a full month making wvw not playable to them for that LONG.

There is a huge difference.

R E F L H E X.8413:

This is not trying to bandaid fix anything.

This is trying to keep people playing and encourage them to not transfer so they can actually do something in world vs world.

This is to make it so when the winning server has the full map they don’t have to stand there and have nothing to do for the rest of the week.

This is not trying to fix anything this is trying to keep world vs world playable for both the winners and the losers.

There is a huge difference.

You aren’t getting what I’m saying. This “fix” masks those other issues, thus its a band-aid fix for those issues even if you don’t intend it to be. I get what you are saying; however, I think your issue is less likely to be an issue when those other things are fixed. With server population in constant flux (regardless of the reason), with out manned and orb bonuses being broken, when points are awarded evenly even without competition, a come back is less likely to happen and thats why a match is decided within the first two days. Don’t you want to see comeback be possible?

Its basically putting the cart before the horse.

I get what you are saying and this isn’t trying to fix anything. This is keeping world vs world playable, you just aren’t seeing the difference between keeping the game playable and trying to fix something.

This is not a fix, this is a different way of doing things that keeps the game playable for everyone 24/7.

R E F L H E X.8413:

I get what you are saying and this isn’t trying to fix anything. This is keeping world vs world playable, you just aren’t seeing the difference between keeping the game playable and trying to fix something.

I see the difference that’s why I said its a bad idea. If you fix those issues, then your play-ability 24/7 is fixed as well.

Ok so you talk about transferring. Let me show you why your theory is backwards and I am only going to explain wvw’s current situation in full one time, and then I will bump the thread with this post instead of replying to you because this is good for the game and you cannot argue against it even though you are trying to.

3 Servers :
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/13318/gw123.jpg

6 Servers :
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/13409/gw006.jpg

9 Servers :
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/13675/gw033small.jpg

12 servers :
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/13599/gw001.jpg

15 servers :
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v38/Revanche/gw002_zpsbebb9581.jpg

And possibly more that I am not going to dig for screenshot already decided this week, more than likely one or two days ago.

This is 15 servers that will no longer have an enjoyable wvw match for the rest of the week. The losing teams will most likely not play and not want to be spawn camped. The winning servers will have to resort to pve farming in wvw or doing the jump puzzle and inevitably quitting for the rest of the week.

Now, unfortunately for a server like ET, these guys have a high rating but got abandoned, these guys won’t be able to wvw or have anything remotely competitive for about a month – month and a half UNLESS they get a ton of players on that server fast.

Now lets move on to the next point : If this were a 3 day matchup which these game have all been obviously decided in two days or so. The rest of the week wouldn’t be boring for an entire 9 servers, also all of them would be put back into a competitive environment within a week/week and a half.

Lets say for example a high ranked server transfer to a low ranked server so they can have easy mode lockouts, with three days they will be put back in a ranking they should be at in a competitive environment.

The server that got abandoned would quickly be put back into a competitive environment. Every single server would automatically be thrown into competitive environments so much quicker.

It is then, and only then when every server is having competitive matchups that you can then move on to lock free transfers, if you lock them right now, which they don’t even need to be locked to begin with since they are not the problem, you will lock so much imbalance for months that it will never really balance out.

I support a 3 day match length. As it has been said, most matches are decided within the first few days, leaving the rest of the week as overkill. It just makes people frustrated and many just quit trying at all. Heck, I would even like the matches cut down to 24 hours. I think it would keep things fresh and more dynamic.

What you are ignoring, Xpiher, is timing.

More people play, for longer periods of time, on the weekends.

This is why, before server transfers and anything else, the outcome of a 7-day match is often decided in the first two-three days. 6pm Friday night through to midnight Sunday are the peak hours for gaming.

The rest of the “mechanics” that you have complained about are a direct result of matches starting on a Friday night.

With 60 hour matches it would look like this:

Friday night -> Monday morning.
Monday morning ->Wednesday night
Wednesday night -> Saturday morning
Saturday morning -> Monday night
Monday night -> Thursday morning
Thursday morning -> Saturday night
Saturday night -> Tuesday morning
Tuesday morning -> Thursday night
Thursday night -> Sunday morning
Sunday morning -> Tuesday night

That’s 10 rounds in about 3 weeks instead of nearly three months. No two matches in a row can be dominated by “night-capping” or the population surge of the weekends. Weekday players will always be able to make a difference to the match.

A faster competition makes for an exciting competition. Volativity in the server rankings is a good thing. The problem at the moment is that the competition is decided by server transfers and not the actual match-up. And the main reason people transfer is because they are sick of one-sided battles that leave them with nothing to do for the best part of a week. Overwhelming vitory is boring for both the victors and the vanquished, but when the match is going to reset tomorrow there is far less of an impact on morale than if it’s going to reset next weekend or two weeks from now. This will reduce server hoppers.

While we’re at it… A lot of people don’t seem to understand what will happen when they complain that free server transfers have to stop YESTERDAY. Will it stop the population fluctuations? Absolutely. Will it stop things like what happened to Dragonbrand this week? Absolutely. But do you know what else absolutely will happen? The top three servers will continue to have hours long queues 24/7 and the bottom three servers will continue to be ghost-towns. PERMANENTLY. Moving an entire guild to another server is one thing when it’s free, it’s something entirely different when every member of that guild has to pay actual money to make the shift. In fact, guilds aside, some people may simply stop playing altogether, preferring to play another game rather than having to actually pay to go to a server where they are able to participate in WvW. I have played on Dragonbrand since Headstart and have no intention of leaving. I have seen the impact of the server transfers and not just this week*. But I also support WvW lock-outs rather than ending free transfers.

*Our fight with Crystal Desert and Blackgate, a couple of weeks ago, was extremely close for the first four and a half days, until some Europeans transferred to BG and steam-rolled the maps. It was so close, in fact, that it is an excellent argument for shorter matches because the difference between first and third was only a couple of thousand for the first three days and anyone could have won.