Guild Wars 2

So if the stab change is here to stay why not adjust ranged CC attacks. Statics, lines, walls etc. Make the cast time slightly longer then before and make the duration of the attack lower. This will increase the need for skill on where to place the CCs and could still reward skill over spam.

So everyone play guardian again? yea that sounds “fun”.

“We were OP before and you took that from us… give it back!!”
Everyone screamed and complained about how zergs and blobs steamrolled through everything – so a change was made to level the field a bit and everyone is screaming how they cannot steamroll through everything.

tom.7468:

So everyone play guardian again? yea that sounds “fun”.

Until Revenant is here. Obviously this is a major wink-wink-nudge-nudge for “buy the expansion if you wanna keep raiding in WvW!”

One Prarie Outpost.4860:

“We were OP before and you took that from us… give it back!!”
Everyone screamed and complained about how zergs and blobs steamrolled through everything – so a change was made to level the field a bit and everyone is screaming how they cannot steamroll through everything.

I don’t think you understand…Right now when a coordinated group goes to fight a zerg so let’s say 20v40+ stab comes off almost immediately because the zerg/blob/whatever can spam CC almost constantly and the coordinated group only has a limited amount of stab. Now if Anets design is for the smaller group to have no chance even if they are better coordinated then GGWP, but if they didn’t mean for that to happen then make ranged CCs not just a mindless spammed attack.

One Prarie Outpost.4860:

“We were OP before and you took that from us… give it back!!”
Everyone screamed and complained about how zergs and blobs steamrolled through everything – so a change was made to level the field a bit and everyone is screaming how they cannot steamroll through everything.

Everyone is screaming because we were complaining about how zergs and blobs were able to streamroll everything AND THEN THE MADE IT EVEN WORSE.

Nothing “leveled” the field. Now you either blob, or you get blobbed, and if you run into another blob you stare at each other slinging AOEs and ranged attacks until one side gets bored and either builds siege, runs away, or suicidally pushes into you and dies.

Kodiak.3281:

Everyone is screaming because we were complaining about how zergs and blobs were able to streamroll everything AND THEN THE MADE IT EVEN WORSE.

Nothing “leveled” the field. Now you either blob, or you get blobbed, and if you run into another blob you stare at each other slinging AOEs and ranged attacks until one side gets bored and either builds siege, runs away, or suicidally pushes into you and dies.

EXACTLY. I find all these posts who say that stab change is the end of blobbing, totally ridiculous.
What stability change killed is Guild Raids. Like 15v15, 20v20. Now you need to be a massive blob to have enough ppl to survive ACs, or be blobbed by the other server.
And with that, the last thing left that I enjoyed in this game, that wasn’t nerfed or removed, is gone.

RIP Guild raiding and enjoyable open fights 2012-2015

Kodiak.3281:

One Prarie Outpost.4860:

“We were OP before and you took that from us… give it back!!”
Everyone screamed and complained about how zergs and blobs steamrolled through everything – so a change was made to level the field a bit and everyone is screaming how they cannot steamroll through everything.

Everyone is screaming because we were complaining about how zergs and blobs were able to streamroll everything AND THEN THE MADE IT EVEN WORSE.

Nothing “leveled” the field. Now you either blob, or you get blobbed, and if you run into another blob you stare at each other slinging AOEs and ranged attacks until one side gets bored and either builds siege, runs away, or suicidally pushes into you and dies.

Then there is no fix. If it was bad before and it’s bad now it cannot be fixed by stability or CC or boons or anything skill or trait related. They have to dissolve zerg/blob ability. But that will never happen.
An outnumbered map should have defensive buffs – including stability/CC improvements. But screaming about how you want it back doesn’t fix it, does it?

But they’re not dissolving blobs. They’re making people blob up in huge numbers. What they’re dissolving is 15v15 or 20v20 – the heart and soul of WvW.

Actually even numbered fights are doable it’s the big uneven ones that aren’t anymore.

I bet you the WvW devs just sit and laugh every time they hear that using stability is skillful and using CC is mindless…

Nike.2631:

I bet you the WvW devs just sit and laugh every time they hear that using stability is skillful and using CC is mindless…

Haha you know what’s even funnier….you said WvW devs!

Nike.2631:

I bet you the WvW devs just sit and laugh every time they hear that using stability is skillful and using CC is mindless…

there are no wvw devs.

One Prarie Outpost.4860:

“We were OP before and you took that from us… give it back!!”
Everyone screamed and complained about how zergs and blobs steamrolled through everything – so a change was made to level the field a bit and everyone is screaming how they cannot steamroll through everything.

That’s not the case,atm it’s just a boring range spamm fest,the melee trains were fun,with linebackers ranging around.Now 2 blobs stand still and Everyone range each other ..when one blob moves towrds the other,the other blob moves back,there is 0 melee going on…And if this is gonna be gw2 for now.Then meh,time to find something else,because this were 2 horribly boring days of gw2 so far.

One Prarie Outpost.4860:

Kodiak.3281:

One Prarie Outpost.4860:

“We were OP before and you took that from us… give it back!!”
Everyone screamed and complained about how zergs and blobs steamrolled through everything – so a change was made to level the field a bit and everyone is screaming how they cannot steamroll through everything.

Everyone is screaming because we were complaining about how zergs and blobs were able to streamroll everything AND THEN THE MADE IT EVEN WORSE.

Nothing “leveled” the field. Now you either blob, or you get blobbed, and if you run into another blob you stare at each other slinging AOEs and ranged attacks until one side gets bored and either builds siege, runs away, or suicidally pushes into you and dies.

Then there is no fix. If it was bad before and it’s bad now it cannot be fixed by stability or CC or boons or anything skill or trait related. They have to dissolve zerg/blob ability. But that will never happen.
An outnumbered map should have defensive buffs – including stability/CC improvements. But screaming about how you want it back doesn’t fix it, does it?

Frequently they do just the opposite. They nerfed confusion into the ground when if was a zerg killer, now they have nerfed stability. I think they expect that people will just have siege wars over towers.

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

Zetsumei.4975:

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

So out of some artificial and irrational, self limiting “dignity” that you created for yourself, you will not take the logical ad advantage? That is your problem. No need to project your irrational sense of tactics on others.

coglin.1867:

Zetsumei.4975:

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

So out of some artificial and irrational, self limiting “dignity” that you created for yourself, you will not take the logical ad advantage? That is your problem. No need to project your irrational sense of tactics on others.

Are you sure the majority of guilds will ‘adapt’ to open field siege and enjoy it, calling it skillful? Why don’t you see all guilds strategically using open field ac’s and ballistas?

Zetsumei.4975:

Are you sure the majority of guilds will ‘adapt’ to open field siege and enjoy it, calling it skillful? Why don’t you see all guilds strategically using open field ac’s and ballistas?

We did not see many ACs and ballistas since they did not improve the meta. As soon as siege weapons will improve or favor a meta they will be used.

Belenwyn.8674:

Zetsumei.4975:

Are you sure the majority of guilds will ‘adapt’ to open field siege and enjoy it, calling it skillful? Why don’t you see all guilds strategically using open field ac’s and ballistas?

We did not see many ACs and ballistas since they did not improve the meta. As soon as siege weapons will improve or favor a meta they will be used.

Youre telling me 5 flash built sup ac’s wont give an advantage?

Maybe the solution isn’t to ball up so hard against a blob, but instead to spread out. Its easy to cc in front of 1 single target, but if you split into a couple smaller groups that requires 2-3 times the cc to cover your flanks.

Or we could not try to even think of other strategies and keep up the qq-train!

coglin.1867:

Zetsumei.4975:

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

So out of some artificial and irrational, self limiting “dignity” that you created for yourself, you will not take the logical ad advantage? That is your problem. No need to project your irrational sense of tactics on others.

Well as a part of a fighting guild myself I can honestly say I will also quit WvW before resorting to such tactics. What you probably don’t understand is that most fighting guilds like to challenge themselves against greater numbers and push themselves to win through skill, coordination, and teamwork. Open field siege is very dull, and removes a lot of the elements of excitement (it’s not just about always winning). Unless you’ve actually raided in a HC raiding guild you probably won’t understand this, but it really ends up feeling like the most fun you can possibly have in gw2. After awhile that’s all you wanna do and everything else (like pve) seems more lackluster. For me WvW and these sort of fights were the true endgame and the gem of gw2. For those that didn’t get to experience those sort of adrenaline pumping fight in which you and everyone around you really pushing themselves to overcome great odds…well I’m sorry but you missed out imo.

Don’t have time right now but I would of liked to post a video of WvW raiding during it’s prime vs the current raids (and Pirate Ship meta), to get my point across.

Zetsumei.4975:

coglin.1867:

Zetsumei.4975:

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

So out of some artificial and irrational, self limiting “dignity” that you created for yourself, you will not take the logical ad advantage? That is your problem. No need to project your irrational sense of tactics on others.

Are you sure the majority of guilds will ‘adapt’ to open field siege and enjoy it, calling it skillful? Why don’t you see all guilds strategically using open field ac’s and ballistas?

You mean the same players going bananas over the stability change? The same ones who claimed “skill” allowed them to defeat much larger number, now claiming it is impossible? Since when did “skill” mean stacking stability? Since when did skill mean losing a battle because out of pride, define folks as skilled?

There is more glory use siege in open field fight than run some warrior guardian 11111 train. At least arrow cart require some skill.

There is an item were you can disable siege but you know who cares.

TooBz.3065:

Frequently they do just the opposite. They nerfed confusion into the ground when if was a zerg killer, now they have nerfed stability. I think they expect that people will just have siege wars over towers.

This is actually the entire reason they nerfed Stability.

Nerfing Stability basically guts mobility. Groups are no longer able to be mobile while fighting. This eliminates blitzkrieg style attacks where organized groups could end a fight very fast.

This in turn favors ranged blobbing. Know what ranged blobbing is perfect at? Defense. What was the #1 thing they said they want to do with this expansion with WvW? Encourage people to fight defensive battles to defend what they own. Like an entirely new map that’s full of chokepoints and Stability is nerfed so you can’t push on through them when it’s defended.

Welcome to the new boring age of WvW where everyone sits in their base and stares at each other behind Arrow Carts.

hedix.1986:

Kodiak.3281:

Everyone is screaming because we were complaining about how zergs and blobs were able to streamroll everything AND THEN THE MADE IT EVEN WORSE.

Nothing “leveled” the field. Now you either blob, or you get blobbed, and if you run into another blob you stare at each other slinging AOEs and ranged attacks until one side gets bored and either builds siege, runs away, or suicidally pushes into you and dies.

EXACTLY. I find all these posts who say that stab change is the end of blobbing, totally ridiculous.
What stability change killed is Guild Raids. Like 15v15, 20v20. Now you need to be a massive blob to have enough ppl to survive ACs, or be blobbed by the other server.
And with that, the last thing left that I enjoyed in this game, that wasn’t nerfed or removed, is gone.

RIP Guild raiding and enjoyable open fights 2012-2015

After spending some time playing after the patch, I’m sorry to have to agree with this. Organized large scale combat is why I play this game – because doing it well takes work and is crazy fun. The new ranged/kiting zerg meta is just plain boring. I really love this game, so I’ll hang around for a while and see if it improves, but….

well, lets just hope it improves.

coglin.1867:

Zetsumei.4975:

coglin.1867:

Zetsumei.4975:

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

So out of some artificial and irrational, self limiting “dignity” that you created for yourself, you will not take the logical ad advantage? That is your problem. No need to project your irrational sense of tactics on others.

Are you sure the majority of guilds will ‘adapt’ to open field siege and enjoy it, calling it skillful? Why don’t you see all guilds strategically using open field ac’s and ballistas?

You mean the same players going bananas over the stability change? The same ones who claimed “skill” allowed them to defeat much larger number, now claiming it is impossible? Since when did “skill” mean stacking stability? Since when did skill mean losing a battle because out of pride, define folks as skilled?

are you from yak’s bend?

I think people here are getting mixed up between small blobs, large blobs and guild groups. The hammer trains obviously are the the blobs, as the guild groups ran GWEN or their own specific comps.
What you may see as a “blob” is actually a 4-group or 20-man guild group using voice comms with their raid leader giving out directions. With this change we don’t really have this any more as currently a 50-60 man unorganized blob will eat this guild group alive.

Here’s the thing. Most servers have an actual TS server or something similar. Do you even know how difficult it is to get pugs into TS? I’ve been across maybe 4 or so TS servers and there are hardly any pugs in the ebg room or otherwise to get this imaginary organized blob going. Maybe like 5-10 pugs out of 60+ will log into TS. Your dream of an organized blob is unrealistic unless you had a server force players into ONE fat wvw guild and enforced a “you must be in TS!!” policy for raiding. FYI, none of this is going to happen.

So what we’re left with small man guild group being thrown into the blender and unorganized blobbing is even further encouraged.

BUT HEY! You know those tools we were promised that one time! The ones that anet would provide so people would be able to communicate, set up events, etc so we could be ORGANIZED!!!111

…

Where are they? Do they matter now with the wvw community stretched so thin with server stacking, the megaserver fiasco, and the recent abandoning of world completion for wvw?

#wvwizded

Zetsumei.4975:

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

Scrubs can’t quit. They were never truly playing the game to begin with.

coglin.1867:

Since when did “skill” mean stacking stability?

Never, because good guilds only had at most 60% uptime. You’re the one that needs to get good if you think that was carrying the guilds that rekt your blobs.

Also lol playing to win in wvw, there’s nothing competitive here. There is only fun or not fun.

coglin.1867:

Zetsumei.4975:

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

So out of some artificial and irrational, self limiting “dignity” that you created for yourself, you will not take the logical ad advantage? That is your problem. No need to project your irrational sense of tactics on others.

This “dignity” is not a self-created problem, I’d be careful about calling it irrational. It is the heart and soul of WvW fighting guilds, and people involved with GvG. If you’re not a part of the scene, do not dismiss it so easily.
Dignity and codes of conduct, are what created a WvW etiquette, what drove the community for the last 2.5 years. What made the WvW we have today. We enjoyed big organised, structured fights – that take skill (it’s foolish to think that a blob busting group of 10 or 15 requires no skill). That experience is now taken away by the meta pushing for siege and ranged combat instead of fast paced skirmishes.

Anyhow, “dignity” is what drove the WvW community for years. What caused so many guilds to pay for gems to transfer and try out fights on different servers – I’m bolding this, because $$ seems all Anet cares about atm. Give us the fights that we enjoy (i.e. not pirateship) and you’ll still get that money. Take this away, and people will quit. Simple.

Feels like this argument is between casual/roaming vs those in organized zergbusting guilds.

First group – change is great, you guys just need to L2P
Second group – change is awful, destroying our fun

I hate changes that are creating unnecessary arguments between players.

Gaab.4257:

Feels like this argument is between casual/roaming vs those in organized zergbusting guilds.

First group – change is great, you guys just need to L2P
Second group – change is awful, destroying our fun

I hate changes that are creating unnecessary arguments between players.

Yes it was fun spam skills without any fear of cc. Well if you got some soft cc it lasted 0.2 sec anyways.

hedix.1986:

coglin.1867:

Zetsumei.4975:

Belenwyn.8674:

Wait until resistance and shield generators are available. This will shift the meta another time. Just pave your way with shield domes and say bye-bye to CCs.

Open field siege? That’s the ultimate disgrace for a fights guild, guilds with any dignity will quit before resorting to this as a norm.

So out of some artificial and irrational, self limiting “dignity” that you created for yourself, you will not take the logical ad advantage? That is your problem. No need to project your irrational sense of tactics on others.

This “dignity” is not a self-created problem, I’d be careful about calling it irrational. It is the heart and soul of WvW fighting guilds, and people involved with GvG. If you’re not a part of the scene, do not dismiss it so easily.
Dignity and codes of conduct, are what created a WvW etiquette, what drove the community for the last 2.5 years. What made the WvW we have today. We enjoyed big organised, structured fights – that take skill (it’s foolish to think that a blob busting group of 10 or 15 requires no skill). That experience is now taken away by the meta pushing for siege and ranged combat instead of fast paced skirmishes.

Anyhow, “dignity” is what drove the WvW community for years. What caused so many guilds to pay for gems to transfer and try out fights on different servers – I’m bolding this, because $$ seems all Anet cares about atm. Give us the fights that we enjoy (i.e. not pirateship) and you’ll still get that money. Take this away, and people will quit. Simple.

If WvW is driven by dignity and codes of conduct the stability change is not a problem. Just adjust the codes of conduct and stay to your dignity to maintain the old battle style.