Guild Wars 2

Way to go ANET! Without the guard stacks, there the rest of the stat lines are pretty lame for roamers.

So as a roamer, you never ram or cata a tower? You never have the need for +5 supply? You never need the ability to build/repair stuff faster or simply to survive better in enemy siege fire?

Even for roamers, there are several trait lines except Guard Killer and such, that still benefit you. And I am a roamer, so I dare say that I know from experience. Besides Guard Killer and Defense Against Guards will still benefit roamers with 5% dmg bonus and resistance. Maybe they will also buff those bonuses a bit up (or rescale it, so you end up with +/- 10%) to make them more significant.

Turk.5460:

I don’t understand why people are upset about this. Most people won’t see a difference. They’ll only be losing a slight advantage they had over newer players. Oh no, guys! You’re going to be on par with an enemy instead of having a slight advantage! Time to whine about it like its some sort of huge nerf!

Applied fortitude adds what 2500 health, a bit more than a slight advantage for low health classes.

Coldtart.4785:

Grinding for advantage is the epitome of pve, or did you not see all the other rage posts about ascended gear and food still existing in this topic?

By that logic levelling is grinding.

Coyote.7031:

As a nublet with only 70 something ranks, good. I hate the idea of wasting over 300 points to get something useful. I’d much rather spend my points else where. I put my points in supply, repair, and build mastery over guard stacks. I’d rather be useful to a group than just live an extra hit. But that’s me.

And you don’t think being able to live an extra hit is not as useful to a group if not MORE SO, than being just another a seige build bot ?

morrolan.9608:

Turk.5460:

I don’t understand why people are upset about this. Most people won’t see a difference. They’ll only be losing a slight advantage they had over newer players. Oh no, guys! You’re going to be on par with an enemy instead of having a slight advantage! Time to whine about it like its some sort of huge nerf!

Applied fortitude adds what 2500 health, a bit more than a slight advantage for low health classes.

Even better! There’s absolutely no reason to defend such a distinct passive advantage. Especially when the people defending it are the same ones who have heavy opinions on skill-based combat…

Turk.5460:

This right here is the mentality that needs to go. Do you think a RR1-3 stood a chance against a RR10? Was that fair in any way? No, in a game where the players boast about being so skill-based, those same players will defend to the death every tiny advantage they can get over other players. Any way to passively make the odds skewed in their favor… -rolls eyes-

A RR3 stood a better chance against a RR10 than say my engineer without a food buff vs that condi necro with +40% condi duration. This aside, the fact is neither game is/was balanced around 1v1 and WvW(RvR) is never a balanced environment without the intervention of players to make it so.

The devs went about these guard killer/defense against guard abilities totally the wrong way, it should have been a sliding scale of HP’s, so 10 ranks each rank gaining you some HPs with the lower ranks garnering the most. Something like

rank1 +1000hps – 1% bonus
rank2 +500hps – 2% bonus
rank3 +250hps – 3% bonus
rank4 +150hps – 4% bonus
rank5 + 150 – 5% bonus
rank6 + 150 – affect enemy lords/supervisors
rank7 +100 – 7% bonus
rank8 + 100 – gain 50% endo after killing guard/lord/supervisor
rank9 + 50 – 10% bonus
rank10 + 50 – guard killer chest, chance at unique items/ascended items

This way even if you are only rank 3 you are still getting 1750 HPs from this ability and rank 5 is attainable for just 15 points. It still provides something for those at the high end to purchase. But they are seeing diminished returns compared to those just venturing into WvW.

Also as stated i could handle losing this if there was some kind of char progression in WvW, skins, titles, loot rewards overhauled, the achievement system fixed(although its been years so ive given up this happening about a year ago). Not everyone and everything about WvW is siege happy or has to revolve around siege, some people like scouting, some like roaming, some like small man/group action, some like open field fights and some are GvG oriented. Sure keep those siege related abilities for those that like them, im all for diversity.

I have about 8.5k badges, nothing to do with them, and about 4.6million karma, nothing to do with it, im drowning in dragonite/bloodstone/whatever the kitten the other kitten is that makes stars, nothing to do with it. I like how they added Mawdrey …….. for PvE’ers. A nice nod to the little shop of horrors tho.

Better loot rewards or skins and whatnot would be worlds better than stat rewards.

Turk.5460:

morrolan.9608:

Turk.5460:

I don’t understand why people are upset about this. Most people won’t see a difference. They’ll only be losing a slight advantage they had over newer players. Oh no, guys! You’re going to be on par with an enemy instead of having a slight advantage! Time to whine about it like its some sort of huge nerf!

Applied fortitude adds what 2500 health, a bit more than a slight advantage for low health classes.

Even better! There’s absolutely no reason to defend such a distinct passive advantage. Especially when the people defending it are the same ones who have heavy opinions on skill-based combat…

All players have the opportunity to get it. But even besides that it is clearly just making up for the base health of eles and guardians being too low for the WvW environment.

Paavotar.3971:

Diku.2546:

To the other long time WvW players who don’t think it’s useful…nobody is forcing you to use your precious WvW skill points to get it. Get the skills that you like.

I don’t think anyone have said its not useful. A lot of people said it’s mandatory skill and that’s why it’s such an awkward trait. And the fact that you had to kill guards to get it made it even more awkward, because how hard it was for defenders to get stacks and how easy it was for attackers to get them.

I’m mostly a roamer, group and solo, and am really glad we are getting rid of this trait as it was rather stupid from the start.

I have to disagree with your opinion.

I personally solo camp cap & rely on this trait.

The advantage might be small in your opinion, but as a solo camp capper…it sometimes can be the difference between success or failure.

Not all WvW worlds have 2 man teams or karma trains to help them re-cap Fully Upgraded camps in defense of their Border Land map.

This trait is a blessing for solo camp cappers that are trying to defend their Home World by re-capping camps…

Why would that be a stupid thing for defenders?

Diku

Diku.2546:

Paavotar.3971:

Diku.2546:

To the other long time WvW players who don’t think it’s useful…nobody is forcing you to use your precious WvW skill points to get it. Get the skills that you like.

I don’t think anyone have said its not useful. A lot of people said it’s mandatory skill and that’s why it’s such an awkward trait. And the fact that you had to kill guards to get it made it even more awkward, because how hard it was for defenders to get stacks and how easy it was for attackers to get them.

I’m mostly a roamer, group and solo, and am really glad we are getting rid of this trait as it was rather stupid from the start.

---

I have to disagree with your opinion.

I personally solo camp cap & rely on this trait.

The advantage might be small in your opinion, but as a solo camp capper…it sometimes can be the difference between success or failure.

Not all WvW worlds have 2 man teams or karma trains to help them re-cap Fully Upgraded camps in defense of their Border Land map.

This trait is a blessing for solo camp cappers that are trying to defend their Home World by re-capping camps…

Why would that be a stupid thing for defenders?

Diku

But with the changes you will be dealing more damage to the guards because they are going to rise the damage from 5% to 10%. That’s way better than extra 100 power.

They also increase the defense from 5% to 10%. Not as good as the 250 vitality, but that was rather absurd amount of vitality to be honest.

I’m glad they’re being removed. I hope food is next.

MightyMicah.7451:

I’m glad they’re being removed. I hope food is next.

I hope they don’t remove food from WvW. They are mostly balanced and give a nice extra flavour for the builds. Theres a lot of diversity in them and can give an edge on some parts of your build. Only problem with them at the moment is the +/- 40% condiduration foods that should be reduced to 15-20%, they are just way too dominant and powerful right now.

Food should have really never existed in WvW. food should have been from the begin of this game on already just a PvE only mechanics, just exactly how food worked in GW1.
If Anet would make Food finally PvE only too, then we could see alot more useful and better universal usable food, than we currently have, without that ANet would have to worry about screwing up WvW with it, what the condition duration foods alone do already!!

The trait buffs should stay as part of WvW Character Progression, ANet should just lower the required amounts of rank points to get them for your characters accountwide from 230 to 150.
150 ranks are NOTHING, if anyone says somethign different, that person muts not be clear in his/her head anymore.
With all the WXP Buffs that you can get plus using laurels and badges of honour to quickly buy you also ranks, you get to 150 in no time, if you play and run around in EotM running for some hours in circles in a Karma Train Zerg and claiming towers and keeps non stop, overwhelming smaller zergs and getting tons of kills with alot of Wxp from that way also too and every now and then killign all aethers in the middle which are quickly overwelmend also by a k-train.
Then theres also the wxp bonuses you get from dailies which add also daily easily a bonus of like 1000+ Wxp. Basically every 5 days 1 free rank up. Over a year thats 72 free rank ups just to say maximum if you do the dailies every day.
For active players a nice little side bonus.

If its just the mechanic, how Anet falsely described it to work in the Germen patchnotes, everythign would be perfectly fine.
Anet would have simplified the way how you get these effects, so that newer players can get them easier and become quicker on par with veterans, everyone would have not to worry anymore about putting the first 230 points just into the npc traits, cause you would simply unlock those buff effects generalyl after getting rank 50 and rank 150, regardless of where you have spent your points into.

You could say for example just put the first 50 ranks all into ram mastery first and at rank 50 you would get Applied Strength, even if you have no single point in the npc trait that raises attack power agaisnt guard npcs…
Same with appllied fortitude.. you get it automatically at rank 150, even if you would have until this point no single point put into the trait line that increases your defense agaisnt guard npcs.

Thats how it should work and it woudl solve this way all problems!
Especially if ANet owuld finalls remove foods and potions from WvW and with the change of the borderland maps get the shrines changes, so that theres no stat bonus from shrines also anymore.
Then would be WvW alot more balanced as far balance goes for this game mode.

Orpheal.8263:

Then would be WvW alot more balanced as far balance goes for this game mode.

If you get it automatically, why not get it when you join WvW no matter the rank? That’s even more balanced! You could even have it in PvE. And PvP!

Hell, you could just increase the base stats of alla characters for perfect balance.

Or just not have it at all.

Same thing.

MightyMicah.7451:

I’m glad they’re being removed. I hope food is next.

Yes! Let’s make it into a larger version of cookie cutter spvp builds! Remove ascended armor and legendaries from wvw.

Better yet, make it so when you enter wvw you can only play one pre built class with ZERO build variation allowed!

@nightblood:
No, I don’t believe they will add additional stats to gear. The gear will simply become more powerful (the gear attributes get stronger). So a 00266 Zerker Ele (who actually become a ‘00666’ Zerker Ele) would have significantly less HP and Healing Power than she has now. Toughness would be a bit more even. But she would also have significantly more Power, Crit Chance and Crit Damage than now.

So why not give up some of the extra offensive stats gained for some defensive gear? There, “problem” (it wasn’t a problem to begin with, just a new meta) solved. No need to streamline all gear with more attributes.

The only obstacle I see is that ppl might have to reinvest in new gear. Hopefully ANet will offer something for WvW players in this regard, especially getting expensive runes out of your WvW gear would be appreciated by the community, I believe.

Dawdler, keep your senseless and unfitting sarcasm please for yourself. It helps no one.
If you cant stay constructive and objective without making snarky comments, then just better be quiet.

This kind of comments show just, how unable some people are to just simply constructively think about it, how WvW could functionate without Buff Food/Potions, without feeling the need to directly attack someone for making the suggestion to remove these mechanics. Its so unmature…seriously!

If Build Variation, like in Baldricks comment is the only excuse for it, for why Anet should keep Food and Potions in WvW, then this is in my honest opinion a very cheap arguement.
There exists also Build Varity without Buff Food/Potions.
All what these two things add to WvW is only Power Creep and nothing else.
Power Creep, that makes certain Builds which clearly are balanced in this game around PvP absolutely overpowered for WvW in all situations and creates a situation, where everyone practically gets FORCED to use these items, if they want to have effectively a chance of winning, basing on it, that both sides are of equal player skill levels.
The side without these buffs would definetely lose!

WvW should still be all about Player Skills and tactical gameplay together and not turning this game basically into “Buff Wars 2”.
However, there needs to be also character progression in WvW as a kind of motivator to keep on playing WvW and also to see a difference between a total noob, which just started playing a few days ago WvW and a long time playing WvW veteran.
Thats why I’m personally totally fine with into WvW integrated Buffs, that everyone could unlock automaticalyl over time, without having to worry about, where you spent your Rank Points into.

So if ANet would rework Buff Food and Potions into a more WvW integrated solution, then I would perfectly accept that, because then it wouldn’t be a forced up situation for me, where I get forced to waste gold/materials just to have a chance in WvW against a full buffed enemy at equal player skills – no I would get it automatically just by playing long enough WvW to earn those effects as part of my character progression in WvW via gaining enough rank points, regardless where I spent them for various WvW masteries that aren’t all about Stats, but more about Siege Weapon expertises and other war relative effects that help me to do something in WvW more effectively good or improve my various roles in WvW, if there would be finally class specific WvW traits for example.

Thats why the Applied Boons shoudk stay, they are part of WvW’s own unique character progression and all what is needed now to make them a bit fairer is to make out of them a more integrated solution which players simply automatically unlock over time once they played long enough WvW to receive them as reward for their veteran status that they gain over time.

I think Buff Food/Potions could be easily reworked for WvW into WvW Masteries (that everyone would have then, even if you don’t buy HoT)
Once earned after collecting enough Rank Points, players would then be able to speak with a new NPC at the Spawn Are, the War Chef and by talking to the Tricks NPC, which also sells traps, there you get also then your Potion Effects.

For paying them a small amount of Badges of Honour you get from these npcs then every (except those condition duration in/decreasers) food/potion effect that you want, that lasts then as long you stay in WvW the whole day.
This way would have everyone much easier access to those effects, without having to waste gold/materials on these things, just paying badges of honmor and badges would finalyl get more useful and have another good sink.
That would be my personal compromise, if these buff effects from potions/food should stay, then at least as a wvw integrated solution thats better accessable for everyone, which is a part of WvW character progression and that without the condition duration in/decreasers which totally screw up WvW, or at least cwith drastically reduced % numbers down from 40% to max 20%

Orpheal.8263:

However, there needs to be also character progression in WvW as a kind of motivator to keep on playing WvW and also to see a difference between a total noob, which just started playing a few days ago WvW and a long time playing WvW veteran.

But there are tons of other WvW skills in the mastery system. Is fortitude/strength so critical that it define the masteries?

You argue alot on why we dont want to have unbalanced stuff like that in WvW, yet fortitude/strength is pushed to the side and ignored.

If its that critical… I would say its just as bad as the food situation (which btw I agree with, 40% has always been over the top as a boon).

I don’t push the fortitude/strength buffs aside , nor do I ignore them.
I recognize them very well as that, what they are and for what they are meant for, when Anet introduced them.
As a kind of Character Progression for WvW.
Buff Food/Potions instead were never meant as that and didn’t got introduced into the game at a later point for that reason.
They were both from begin on there, where the fortitude/strength buffs were not.
ANet had a purpose for them and that purpose worked very well for a long time now.
Now they simply want to remove that Character Progression and thats the point with that many people aren’t ok with, as they (me included) don#t see any further reason why to keep on playing WvW, if ANet simply removes later all Character progression for which players played hard to earn it in the first place.

This step is basicalyl exactly, like as if Anet would announce from today to tomorrow, that they will remove Ascended Gear from the game completely with HoT.
Wouldn’t make you that not angry?? Especialyl when you invested alot of time and effort to earn that progression for your character(s)???
I think – yes, you would be. Same as angry as tons of players where, when Anet introduced Ascended Gear and from one moment to another, your exotic progression was just second best in the game and basically wasted time that you probable could have use better, if Anet wouldn#t have rushed the release of the game due to NCSoft to get it out 2012 and instead would have release the game a year later with ascended equipment from the begin on beign in the game. Then it wouldn’t have given that huge player exodus fiasco of the past, because people would have known from begin on, that ascended is max and wouldn’t have wasted much time on working to get sub optimal equipment.
But thats an other topic. Wanted to use it only as a reference for this case.

This change that Naet simply plans there showsto me personally, that Anet simply doesn’t have learned anything at all from the past, that destroying player progression is absolutely NO wise decision. And yet they do it ever and ever again more or less…

Buff Food/Potions on the other hand have nothing to do at all with Player Progression in WvW.. they are nothing but helpful forced upon utilities which you need to use in order to have a chance in WvW to win, while the fortitude/strength buffs are WvW integrated mechanics, which simply everyone can get over tiem automaticalyl, without that you need to waste money/materials for it to get an partwise overpowered temporary effect for 30-45 minutes, what makes buff potions/food basically “pay2win”, just that you don’t pay with real money, but instead with gold/materials which is for players, that aren’t rich and don’t have the materials, or the crafting requirements to make these items a heavy limit.
The birthday blaster helped a bit at closing this problem, but you need to have first a 2 year old character to get it, so also very limited… and its effects is also very weak, weaker than normal buff food, cause ANet nerfed its effect down >.<
The birthday cakes were perfect when Anet introduced that item, imo there was no need to nerf it, cause it exists also normal all stat food in the game.

Thats why i think its a good comprpmise, that when these buff effects should stay, then they should work all as WvW integrated character progression unlock mechanics and the old food/potion effects should become accessable for everyone just via badges of honor.
If ANet really wants WvW to be Buff Wars 2, then the buffs should be all accessible for everyone in a same kind of way, without letting it be a money/material/crafting limited pay2win mechanic.
The best way to do that is via Bages of Honor, this currency is currently anyway absolutely underwhelming and barely of any use…

So why not add a War Chef to WvW and let the Tricks NPC also give away potion effects, while you can get from the War Chef all kinds of food effects for Bagdes of Honor.
That would be a Win/Win for everyone and it would be definetely also a condition, under which I could accept the removal of fortitude/strength, when therefore food/potions become alot more accessible for everyone.

PS: lets say gettign food and potion should cost as much Bages like you receive from making your Dailies, so that you could buy practially from those badges from your dailies each day 1 food and 1 potion. (or 2 food/2 potion instead whatever you prefer)

Good they get removed. I hope food will get adjusted too in the near future, or at least the condi food.

yeah, and while w’re at it, why not give every Player who enters wvw for the first time a stack of every siegeweapon and a legendary.

Oh and for all Players with silver rank or above a debuff of 50% on every stat, and no loot. Even better, they have to pay 10g to even enter the Queue to a borderland.

It’s always nice to see how a-net rewards the loyal Players !!!

the krytan assassin.9235:

Now after 1 yr they suddenly say okey lets remove it, but this changes the meta alot. for example applied fortitude is mandatory for ele to survive in his current build state, this means that they will have to gear more tanky now. necro’s however don’t suffer the same problem because they got a 33k hp healthpool.

Whilst I largely agree with the premise of your post, I had to post just to ask that you don’t spread misinformation; necros do have a higher base health pool than eles (which is offset by paltry access to stability, vigor and on-demand boons in general, invulnerability, blinks etc.) but they too, in the current system, would have to spec for more vitality/toughness. 33k HP is not base. You would have to forgo damage for that.

Hexalot.8194:

Coyote.7031:

As a nublet with only 70 something ranks, good. I hate the idea of wasting over 300 points to get something useful. I’d much rather spend my points else where. I put my points in supply, repair, and build mastery over guard stacks. I’d rather be useful to a group than just live an extra hit. But that’s me.

And you don’t think being able to live an extra hit is not as useful to a group if not MORE SO, than being just another a seige build bot ?

I’d rather they roll that extra stats into buff just for playing WvW. Also I don’t know about you, but I find avoidance seems the best survival technique. If I zerg all target me at once, there’s no way I’d survive that attack, so 250 stats is moot. I can see it being a big help to small fights like havoc or roamer, but then it’s just an advantage to the higher ranked player and another reason for it’s removal.

Why do people even want the Applied buffs? Since everyone except newbies have them, removing them does nothing, since it applies to everyone, except newbies. They only make it easier for people to kill newbies. Why would you want to make it easier to kill newbies? Why would you need more of an advantage against newbies?

morrolan.9608:

Turk.5460:

morrolan.9608:

Turk.5460:

I don’t understand why people are upset about this. Most people won’t see a difference. They’ll only be losing a slight advantage they had over newer players. Oh no, guys! You’re going to be on par with an enemy instead of having a slight advantage! Time to whine about it like its some sort of huge nerf!

Applied fortitude adds what 2500 health, a bit more than a slight advantage for low health classes.

Even better! There’s absolutely no reason to defend such a distinct passive advantage. Especially when the people defending it are the same ones who have heavy opinions on skill-based combat…

All players have the opportunity to get it. But even besides that it is clearly just making up for the base health of eles and guardians being too low for the WvW environment.

The single most popular profession since launch, when there wasnt even any Applied Fortitude? Hardly…

I was against the buffs, it felt bad that experienced players also get a numerical advantage over new players. You have an advantage in having spend more time to get better. If you spend that time mindlessly zerging, to bad.

However i do understand the counter argument. PvE gets you advantages in WvW, ascended gear, expensive foodbuffs, runes that are unobtainable in WvW and even some special stat combinations that are only available from PvE.
So then why is that okay, but a numerical advantage from playing WvW is not?

And we already got an answer from a dev on removing Ascended gear in WvW. “We dont want to invalidate peoples time spend”. Yet that is what they are doing here with time spend in WvW.

So i feel a similar treatment should be given to Ascended gear and Legendaries by cutting their stats down as well.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Why do people even want the Applied buffs? Since everyone except newbies have them, removing them does nothing, since it applies to everyone, except newbies. They only make it easier for people to kill newbies. Why would you want to make it easier to kill newbies? Why would you need more of an advantage against newbies?

I suspect they wanna hide behind poor arguments to hide their own lack of skill and/or build crafting.

Since those buffs were around, it basically lowered the diversity of used builds, not increased it. Before ppl had to make conscious decisions about if they wanted to take the risk or not to go full zerker. With the buffs, especially applied fortitude, the risk is considerably smaller and the need for a decision here decreased considerably.

If ppl demand rewarding the loyal player, they should focus on things that actually make sense and not on such a useless buff, which basically removed diversity both in builds and usage of WvW points (cuz all went first for guard stack buffs).

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Why do people even want the Applied buffs? Since everyone except newbies have them, removing them does nothing, since it applies to everyone, except newbies. They only make it easier for people to kill newbies. Why would you want to make it easier to kill newbies? Why would you need more of an advantage against newbies?

Because stats have a direct impact on my characters progression, not the siege im deploying, not the keep im claiming, not the camp im ferrying supply from, not my group, not my server, not the kittening commander. Me.

I dont get the argument it makes WvW imbalanced, heres a news flash WvW isnt balanced, 99% of the time you are outnumbering someone else or being outnumbered. Only through the intervention of players(setting up a 15v15, a 1v1, a 5v5) do you usually get any sort of parity.

You get char progression through PvE, mats to craft your ascended armour/weapons, money for the high end food. What do you get for WvW? An ascended drop once every 6 months that has some kittened mixture of stats thats useful to no build anywhere.

I dont PvE really(well just started pharming for the 1st time ever) so i have 1 char with ascended gear out of the four 80’s i have. I have played longer than a guy i know that has 7 legendaries, home instance with every node imaginable, ascended gear on 4 or 5 toons and about 2000 gold just casually laying about(im running around a lot of the time with 2 gold).

When he rolls out to WvW his characters have a stat advantage over me, because of, character progression. But unlike the people here who want to shoot down the bonus a WvW player can get for defending keeps until a bleary eyed 4am, ferrying supply, manning siege, killing players. I feel hes earned it, hes ground mobs, played the TP, ground dungeons, farmed kakas, farmed Orr. Probably done event chains until his eyes bled. But hell in a handbag if the WvW players who have been investing time in that game mode want something.

That said i thought they went about the stat increases the wrong way, you should of been able to jump into these boosts straight away so a person just venturing out into WvW can get in on them and they taper off as you go up the ranks. But there is still a carrot for those that have spent a lot of time in WvW at the end of the 10 ranks. So using my progression above say a newbie who has just got to WvW has 3 ranks he has a bonus of 1750hps. The veteren that has been playing for months and has 10 ranks has 2500 hps.

READ THIS ANET,

Your in-game “support ticket staff” advised me to post my message on the forum.

WOW nice update Anet, WvW is literally the only mode I play. I don’t care if I had to spend my points in those lines, they make WVW fun. They literally make or break a successful builds and now your completely ruining your own game. MANNN I literally SPENT HOURS AND HOURS putting time and money into this game and now you just TAKE AWAY what I worked towards for such a long time. Its nice to see that Anet likes taking things away from us that we have spent so many hours working towards. Thanks a lot guys. I didn’t mind the trait changes too much needless to say how many hours have been spent perfecting builds. I sunk so much money into this sinkhole all these new changes ESPECIALLY the guard buff’s that are needed for SUCCESSFUL power builds like most 80-90% of warrior’s and possibly thieve’s are just ruining everything. Anet is NERFING my warrior so much that ive probably spent about 2000 Hours on trying to constantly adjust to all these “stupid” adjustments over the years. Your making WvW un-playable and putting PVE aspects into it now? You just nerf and nerf and nerf until there’s nothing left.

Thanks for literally taking the possibly 100-150 hours it took to get those stacks from WvW and just ripping it out of my hands without even considering the amount of time that was put into that. Whats next are you going to take my legendary skins from me too?? Why not just cut the stats down on this skin I literally paid over 200$ dollars for since i’m not a PVE scrub, that might satisfy you?

Yeahhhhh did you ever consider that major PVE players already get a MAJOR advantage since they have so much gold pressing 1,1,1,1,1,,1,1,,1,2,1,2,1,21,,1,1 all day that they come into WvW with full ascended and full legendary etcc… SOOOO why unbalance me? It took so longggg to get full ascended as a WVW player. Man do you even play your own game to see the difference in gold ratio. When I see the developer tags in game from allll the hours ive played I just see you guys Idling around like your just waiting fo some gold seller to BAN…do you even read the comments on here????

HERES AN IDEA!! You can start putting de-buffs on bronze, silver, gold, mithrill and diamond ranks (if anyone is even there). Make it mainstream, all new players can get+5000vitality. if your bronze you have 25%debuff on all stats, if your silver you have to literally pay to get into a borderland and have a 50% debuff, if your gold you can only log into the game once per week and if your mithril or diamond why don’t you just bann them because their clearly zerg all your new players around, and making a bunch of babies that cant play, and that come complain on these forums of something they know nothing about, when they die outside the zerg.

I have NEVER posted something on any forum EVER but with the amount of time and money spent on this game ….What the heck Anet ?

Pi**ed off WvW player that is probably dropping this game along with a few good Havc WvW groups. I’m finished poring hundreds of dollars into this game.

Thanks Anet,

TyPin.9860:

So as a roamer, you never ram or cata a tower? You never have the need for +5 supply? You never need the ability to build/repair stuff faster or simply to survive better in enemy siege fire?

Even for roamers, there are several trait lines except Guard Killer and such, that still benefit you. And I am a roamer, so I dare say that I know from experience. Besides Guard Killer and Defense Against Guards will still benefit roamers with 5% dmg bonus and resistance. Maybe they will also buff those bonuses a bit up (or rescale it, so you end up with +/- 10%) to make them more significant.

We don’t care about the whatever +5 supply? what om going to spend 300lvls on something I can activate in guild for free. Yes roamers, meaning people that can successfully kill most people they encounter, Or solo capping. There ain’t nothing better then those buffs when taking camps and towers by yourself. Not to mention it actually makes or breaks most builds that people have spent time and money on. Its not unbalanced PVE scrubs come in WVW with full ascended and legendary’s cause they’ve been pressing 1,1,2,1,2,1,,1,1,1,1,2,1,1, the past 2 years and WVW players take MONTHS just to get a few gold to afford the food and maintenance oil, up-cost. Took so long to get a legendary and ascended gear as a WvW player, I had to buy most of the legendary.

Sorry i’m so mad at this new update i’m about to just quit the game soon,

Chorazin.4107:

Turk.5460:

This right here is the mentality that needs to go. Do you think a RR1-3 stood a chance against a RR10? Was that fair in any way? No, in a game where the players boast about being so skill-based, those same players will defend to the death every tiny advantage they can get over other players. Any way to passively make the odds skewed in their favor… -rolls eyes-

A RR3 stood a better chance against a RR10 than say my engineer without a food buff vs that condi necro with +40% condi duration. This aside, the fact is neither game is/was balanced around 1v1 and WvW(RvR) is never a balanced environment without the intervention of players to make it so.

The devs went about these guard killer/defense against guard abilities totally the wrong way, it should have been a sliding scale of HP’s, so 10 ranks each rank gaining you some HPs with the lower ranks garnering the most. Something like

rank1 +1000hps – 1% bonus
rank2 +500hps – 2% bonus
rank3 +250hps – 3% bonus
rank4 +150hps – 4% bonus
rank5 + 150 – 5% bonus
rank6 + 150 – affect enemy lords/supervisors
rank7 +100 – 7% bonus
rank8 + 100 – gain 50% endo after killing guard/lord/supervisor
rank9 + 50 – 10% bonus
rank10 + 50 – guard killer chest, chance at unique items/ascended items

This way even if you are only rank 3 you are still getting 1750 HPs from this ability and rank 5 is attainable for just 15 points. It still provides something for those at the high end to purchase. But they are seeing diminished returns compared to those just venturing into WvW.

Also as stated i could handle losing this if there was some kind of char progression in WvW, skins, titles, loot rewards overhauled, the achievement system fixed(although its been years so ive given up this happening about a year ago). Not everyone and everything about WvW is siege happy or has to revolve around siege, some people like scouting, some like roaming, some like small man/group action, some like open field fights and some are GvG oriented. Sure keep those siege related abilities for those that like them, im all for diversity.

I have about 8.5k badges, nothing to do with them, and about 4.6million karma, nothing to do with it, im drowning in dragonite/bloodstone/whatever the kitten the other kitten is that makes stars, nothing to do with it. I like how they added Mawdrey …….. for PvE’ers. A nice nod to the little shop of horrors tho.

zinkz.7045:

Gaab.4257:

Not exactly sure yet why this should be ‘improvement’, I feel it’s again catering the beginners and taking away sense of progress and achievement.

What is this ‘achievement’ you speak of, you really regard playing a video game for X number of hours as an ‘achievement’?

Achievement == achieving something tangible and noticeable by playing a certain game mode (and I’m talking rather experience than time, as achievement points are not that strictly related to the amount of time you spend in WvW).

Similar to game levels. Do you think those are useless as well, as those are also earned after playing a video games for a certain amount of time? Do you think traits and skills earned by playing are also useless? I don’t really understand your argument.

DevJD.5483:

I sunk so much money into this sinkhole all these new changes ESPECIALLY the guard buff’s that are needed for SUCCESSFUL power builds like most 80-90% of warrior’s and possibly thieve’s are just ruining everything. Anet is NERFING my warrior so much that ive probably spent about 2000 Hours on trying to constantly adjust to all these “stupid” adjustments over the years. Your making WvW un-playable and putting PVE aspects into it now? You just nerf and nerf and nerf until there’s nothing left.

You are implying that there where no power builds in WvW until they added fortitude/strength buff? O.o

Okay, many bring up, that the PvE farmers all have an advantage due to ascended armor. This is technically true, but I doubt it really comes into effect. RNG in dmg has more effect than the actual ascended advantage.

The normal WvW player, the ones who also would have access to guard stacks, mostly have ascended trinkets and weapons. They only lack in ascended armor. What is the stat difference between this mix of ascended-exotic and pure ascended?

1st attribute: 14
2nd attribute: 11
3rd attribute: 11
Armor: 47

Summing all together amounts to not even 100 points in difference. You are really upset that hours and hours of PvE farming give such a tiny advantage? This is ridiculous. For ages the WvW veterans said this difference is negligible. Now that you lose guard stacks you cry about not even 100 points stat difference? Get some perspective dudes.

Also some WvW player said they “had to buy” legendary? Why waste your money on smth mostly cosmetic, if you are truly worried about that stat difference. If you have money to buy legendaries, you have money to buy stuff for ascended armor.

@DevJD:
You might be roamer if you win your duels and cap some camps. But this is something that really isn’t that impressive. If you can’t contribute to your server than you might as well not be there. Yes your guild can make +5 supply. But you can also invest in +5 and then you have +10. It isn’t a concept too hard to grasp. But you said it yourself. You seem more worried about your personal performance in insignificant duels. If you really do not have use for any other WvW buff, then I am not sure what you actually do in WvW…

EDIT:
Oh, you’re a warrior. Lol. All right. The warrior is one of the profession, that really is in need of those buffs (sarcasm). Wow… really? This is pathetic.

TyPin.9860:

Okay, many bring up, that the PvE farmers all have an advantage due to ascended armor. This is technically true, but I doubt it really comes into effect. RNG in dmg has more effect than the actual ascended advantage.

The normal WvW player, the ones who also would have access to guard stacks, mostly have ascended trinkets and weapons. They only lack in ascended armor. What is the stat difference between this mix of ascended-exotic and pure ascended?

Arguable about the weapons, i have ascended weapons and armour on 1 toon out of my 4, yes trinkets on all toons thanks to Laurels but not the backpiece.

TyPin.9860:

Summing all together amounts to not even 100 points in difference. You are really upset that hours and hours of PvE farming give such a tiny advantage? This is ridiculous. For ages the WvW veterans said this difference is negligible. Now that you lose guard stacks you cry about not even 100 points stat difference? Get some perspective dudes.

If you read my post i advocate that the guy who farmed all those hours deserves it, that is character progression and that the initial implementation of the stat boost was wrong, it should of been accessible to everyone with those first venturing into WvW accruing the most gains per rank compared to someone rank 8 or 9.

As for the stats themselves for me who has ascended trinkets but not the back on most toons 101 points worth of stats, certainly advantageous, this is also passive and cannot be removed unlike guard stacks.

Lets turn the question around, to better level the playing field the devs removed ascended weapons and armour from WvW, is this a good thing? It’s making WvW more “balanced” for everyone, clearly that must be a good thing no?

People are saying it will hurt their build. I’m wondering what builds will this change hurt? Will it actually break any builds? I can’t imagine it would.

No guard stacks , charater bonuses are pretty Normalised putting you on a same stat level as Low ranked players.

clearly your skill as a player will be more than enough to deal with the normalisation of overall stat boosts.

im glad its gone , with certain runes it leave to quite large % boosts and im not going to point out which rune (but im sure some people know which rune im talking about)

It was a bad build it was dependant on the buffs, you are supposed to have them only as a bonus for your build and be ready to lose them most of the times.

Might was nerfed, stability was changed, now there will be less condition power, power and vitality. Next should be the +40 condition duration food nerf and perplex runes removed completely and I would be happy

So:

Removed the Orb
Removed Buffs
Removed Quaggan event for stand in circle Ruin event
Nefed stand in circle Ruin buff
Removed Players Upgrades to keeps and camps

Seems we’re getting there, there is not much left going for this boring BL map.
You only need to remove the kitten map! …Oh wait, you are going to remove the map.

Victory at last! Map defeated.

Can Ranks finally be linked to additional rewards (account bonuses to magic find/gold find/karma/etc.)? Can there be specific requirements to wear unique armor/weapons that has rank Silver, Gold, Platinum rank, etc.?

There needs to be a reward system to play WvW again and again (and again).

Not to state specific other games with WvW modes, but having ranks that provided additional bonuses did not break WvW equivalents in those games. Think ‘additional’ stun break ability, passive movement speed bonus, additional defending stat bonus, etc. which are far more egregious differences. While I agree that these are unfair to newer players, ranks is a progression system and available to all (i.e. the carrot on the stick).

TL;DR What’s the new carrot? If you kill reward progression via ranks, you need to replace it or you ultimately work your way to killing WvW altogether.

TyPin.9860:

@DevJD:
You might be roamer if you win your duels and cap some camps. But this is something that really isn’t that impressive. If you can’t contribute to your server than you might as well not be there. Yes your guild can make +5 supply. But you can also invest in +5 and then you have +10. It isn’t a concept too hard to grasp. But you said it yourself. You seem more worried about your personal performance in insignificant duels. If you really do not have use for any other WvW buff, then I am not sure what you actually do in WvW…

EDIT:
Oh, you’re a warrior. Lol. All right. The warrior is one of the profession, that really is in need of those buffs (sarcasm). Wow… really? This is pathetic.

WvW was never supposed to be balanced, so I do not see how these guard stacks or food are any problem at all.

To reply to this I really liked your idea about how the developers should have done it more progressively. I only play warr and guard in wvw out of prefference. I do very well in wvw BUT my article is not about my personal performance in wvw. The big picture I am trying to paint here is that #1 when they introduced the buffs in the first place everyone complained. #2 after they did it was for character progression and people sunk time into investing in those lines and not the others. #3 They are literally taking away a character progression model THEY introduced. So imagine it took you 100hours to get those stacks because you really wanted them. Anet is taking your time and just throwing it away as if nothing happened. Its like…let’s say someone Figuratively makes 1$ per hour playing guildwars and they are working on a legendary skin or whatever the case may be. Anet erases what you worked for without even caring and takes your money away . I don’t care about the buff as much as I care about the levels. Yes I will get my points back granted but this is not just a debuff or an adjustment …to me a wvw player its like you deleted a legendary out of my inventory … If you are having issues against warrior in wvw try running full condi mesmer with OP confusion. It ticks off like 7k HP every time I even basic attack…lol

Malediktus.9250:

WvW was never supposed to be balanced, so I do not see how these guard stacks or food are any problem at all.

So should they allow consumables like Experimental Rifle to work in World vs. World now? (This item used to work in World vs. World by the way…) Or maybe they should allow Teleport to Friend and Revive Orbs to work in World vs. World too. Because after all, World vs. World was never supposed to be balanced!

You can sing that tune until your face is blue, but the truth is balance does matter to a degree. There is a line drawn whether or not you’re willing to admit it. You’re just upset that these buffs just happened to fall on the other side of this line now.

They also made balance changes with World vs. World in mind. Maybe you didn’t play at launch, but Portal used to not have a target limit. The game mode this change targeted was World vs. World.

Nokaru.7831:

So should they allow consumables like Experimental Rifle to work in World vs. World now? (This item used to work in World vs. World by the way…) Or maybe they should allow Teleport to Friend and Revive Orbs to work in World vs. World too. Because after all, World vs. World was never supposed to be balanced!

There were some things like spike fruit(lulz) that were clearly broken and needed to be removed(despite the hilarity factor).

Chorazin.4107:

Nokaru.7831:

So should they allow consumables like Experimental Rifle to work in World vs. World now? (This item used to work in World vs. World by the way…) Or maybe they should allow Teleport to Friend and Revive Orbs to work in World vs. World too. Because after all, World vs. World was never supposed to be balanced!

There were some things like spike fruit(lulz) that were clearly broken and needed to be removed(despite the hilarity factor).

dont forget the peg leg disaster. o.0

with not being balanced i agree. so yeah a player that has played wvw for a long time should maybe have access to certain buffs. thats something a new player can look up to and achieve with the same amount of effort. abusing and exploit a certain pve item that offers little to no counter play can hardly be compared to applied fortitude ang stacks.

selan.8354:

Chorazin.4107:

Nokaru.7831:

So should they allow consumables like Experimental Rifle to work in World vs. World now? (This item used to work in World vs. World by the way…) Or maybe they should allow Teleport to Friend and Revive Orbs to work in World vs. World too. Because after all, World vs. World was never supposed to be balanced!

There were some things like spike fruit(lulz) that were clearly broken and needed to be removed(despite the hilarity factor).

dont forget the peg leg disaster. o.0

with not being balanced i agree. so yeah a player that has played wvw for a long time should maybe have access to certain buffs. thats something a new player can look up to and achieve with the same amount of effort. abusing and exploit a certain pve item that offers little to no counter play can hardly be compared to applied fortitude ang stacks.

But simply saying that WvW is not supposed to be balanced doesn’t mean that it is good to introduce even more imbalance. Which is what the guard stacks do. And other things that Anet introduced after launch as well – BL buff and masteries in general and superior siege.

Johje Holan.4607:

selan.8354:

Chorazin.4107:

Nokaru.7831:

So should they allow consumables like Experimental Rifle to work in World vs. World now? (This item used to work in World vs. World by the way…) Or maybe they should allow Teleport to Friend and Revive Orbs to work in World vs. World too. Because after all, World vs. World was never supposed to be balanced!

There were some things like spike fruit(lulz) that were clearly broken and needed to be removed(despite the hilarity factor).

dont forget the peg leg disaster. o.0

with not being balanced i agree. so yeah a player that has played wvw for a long time should maybe have access to certain buffs. thats something a new player can look up to and achieve with the same amount of effort. abusing and exploit a certain pve item that offers little to no counter play can hardly be compared to applied fortitude ang stacks.

But simply saying that WvW is not supposed to be balanced doesn’t mean that it is good to introduce even more imbalance. Which is what the guard stacks do. And other things that Anet introduced after launch as well – BL buff and masteries in general and superior siege.

not that massive of an imbalance. if i gforget to eat food, then i see a big difference! and even if my guild gets wiped we have no stacks and manage to zerbust a full guardstacked zerg…. its really not suuuuch a big difference, but it did make players feel like they have worked for something. i remember when the ranks were brand new. and we all grinded our way up there.

selan.8354:

i remember when the ranks were brand new. and we all grinded our way up there.

Hahaha that was hardly because it was “rewarding” to have it… Everyone and their grandma knew that the applied fortitude/strength was needed to compete in WvW due to the insanely high bonuses. That’s why people rushed it.

not really. it was a goal to have it. i actually mastered my cata first and supply cap and siege mastery. and my guild ran without those 2 buffs for a very very long time even though others had it. stop making it look like that a guy with full stacks 1 shots u because u dont have full stacks! u got 1 shot because zerker!