Guild Wars 2

I heard rumors we may be getting one… is this true??!

MrFluffy.9307:

I heard rumors we may be getting one… is this true??!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/CDI-Guilds-Guild-Halls/page/17#post4469798

here you are.

Yea the Raid CDI is still in progress so it’ll be a few weeks. So get your ideas ready. Crown Pavilion, ahem, wink wink.

Why bother? It’s not as if any of the other CDI’s led to anything much (if at all), so one more for people to flap in the wind doesn’t really interest me.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Baldrick — there are a lot of things on the dev backlog, not least of which are responses to player input, questions, suggestions, and concerns expressed through the CDIs. I don’t want anyone to believe the CDIs are just words. They are far more meaningful and helpful to the team that you may see right away. We’ve seen changes through CDI input; we’ll see more in the future.

If you don’t want to anyone believe the CDI are just words prove it. Because by facts and previous CDI… well, no need to explain, right?

Gaile, i know you re doing a lot for community..
But when you say future, it s really frustrating, it could be month, years, century …

They’ve always been reluctant to talk about GvG. I have the feeling they’re going to delay this one as long as possible as they have always avoided any discussions on the topic.

I registered to this forum 3 days after I got this game to ask where the GvG game mode was. I literally bought this game for GvG because it was in GW1.

If they haven’t even started to work on it by now I don’t think there is any hope…

Thanks for taking the time to reply to me personally, always appreciated even if we have completely different viewpoints.

Yeah yes, of course something came from the last group of wvw CDI’s ..colour of tags for commanders, which you were going to charge huge amounts for, then backpeddled furiously after the adverse reaction.

It’s not that we don’t believe you, it’s just that wvw has seen so little change and the current crop of ideas arising from the rose tinted view of wvw devs got by playing in seasons in guilds are just plain bad.

Hence the feeling that’s it’s all hot air and wvw has been left to rot..many of us came from gw1 expecting to see , well, guild wars like gvg implemented, pvp only skills, regular skill adjustments, interaction on maps, revolving and evolving wvw maps, new maps, etc …that’s how it feels from over here.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Have you guys genuinely never seen something come out of a CDI? Have you truly never seen changes that were outlined, discussed, and honed in the forge of the CDI system?

On the contrary I’ve seen nothing but wonderful changes that came from the CDI’s. If I remember correctly EoTM, orb changes, matchup variety, and I think even seasons were all things players had been asking for since the game came out, but ultimately resulted from CDI, no? CDI’s do work so that’s why I’m curious to see if there will be a CDI for GvG!

Also thanks for the link Hvaran!

guys new traps are product of CDI! people are suggesting anti-blob trap but they gave us siege disabler so that everyone are required to blob up. problem solved

Gaile Gray.6029:

Xillllix — we don’t talk about what we’re working on, but by the same token, not talking doesn’t mean that something is and will be completely untouched, right? How many times has something rolled out that has really surprised players, and in a good way? “I didn’t even know they were thinking about that” comes up quite often. Or “I saw some talk about this a while back, but didn’t expect to see it in the game.” I am not saying everything is under development, but just wanting to point to the fact that lots can happen behind the scenes because that is worth noting and is backed by the historical evidence of past updates.

Sorry I wasn’t talking about the CDI but about the interviews Anet gave in the past that always deliberately avoided the question of GvG. I do am looking forward to see what competitive stuff you guys have been working on behind the scenes, of course.

You have to realize that I participated a bit in the last CDI on EotM where basically we were discussing how to implement the best EotM features into EB (make SM battle more captivating using all 3 levels of the castle), the Borderlands and ways to encourage defending in EotM.
Nothing out of what people proposed there ever came along.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Have you guys genuinely never seen something come out of a CDI? Have you truly never seen changes that were outlined, discussed, and honed in the forge of the CDI system?

Hi Gaile, you do realise you are posting the World Vs World forums, right?

This isnt PvE, Living Story or John’s economy thread

This is WvW!

Gaile Gray.6029:

Have you guys genuinely never seen something come out of a CDI? Have you truly never seen changes that were outlined, discussed, and honed in the forge of the CDI system?

Remember, this is the WvW section so when people say nothing has come out of the CDI, they are talking about the WvW CDI’s. Nothing meaningful has come out of those.

We had a CDI about the commander system and Devon summarized everything the players wanted out of it and all we got was different commander tag colours… which somehow took almost a year to implement….

We had a CDI about world population and obviously nothing came out of that because if it did, John Corpening wouldn’t have had to make a thread recently about the exact same thing…….

I just hope the developers are doing something meaningful behind the scenes that the players don’t know about yet. Only time will tell.

When I replied to you via my “PM”, asking where the FCT for the WvW forums had gone; I did not mean you personally coming here to add a few posts.

It’s great that you’ve come here Gaile, but is anything gonna come out of it? Or will we scare you away like we scared to the rest?
As said by Deli, John was here for a few days, said the usual “I like your ideas I’ll pass them on”, then we’ve never heard from him either, no updates no hellos no nothing……..

Well cant wait to say hi to the next new mod who’s tricked into posting in the WvW forums in 6 months time!

This game is called “GUILD” Wars 2. Of course the developer’s doesn’t want the players to do GvGs, are you out of your mind?

It’s been 2 years + and still no Guild Halls, so, is this actually a sequel to “Guild Wars” or is it the prequel where the devs didn’t know what Guild Halls was? I thought when you had something successful in a game, you kept it and improved it? Hmmm, no, let’s just remove it, let’s remove the capes too because “the charr models doesn’t fit it”, wow, really? …

We haven’t seen meaningful change in WvW from the CDIs. All the changes are happening in the other game modes while we watch WvW die a slow death

IN short WvW comunity has no trust or any faith left. I can’t say why because saying such things here is like saying Voldemort in Harry Poter movies.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Have you guys genuinely never seen something come out of a CDI? Have you truly never seen changes that were outlined, discussed, and honed in the forge of the CDI system?

Xillllix — we don’t talk about what we’re working on, but by the same token, not talking doesn’t mean that something is and will be completely untouched, right? How many times has something rolled out that has really surprised players, and in a good way? “I didn’t even know they were thinking about that” comes up quite often. Or “I saw some talk about this a while back, but didn’t expect to see it in the game.” I am not saying everything is under development, but just wanting to point to the fact that lots can happen behind the scenes because that is worth noting and is backed by the historical evidence of past updates.

First of all, I want to say that I love the game and I appreciate all the work you put into communicating with us. So even if I may sound like a kitten, trust me when I say it’s not in my intention to do so.
You have to understand that with some past CDI, a lot of players have been left with a sour taste in their mouth and with some content being ignored completely, just reduces the faith in it. For me it has felt that whenever we have a CDI about something, just the tiny smaller suggestions are even considered and the rest are just ignored.

For example the Fractals CDI comes to mind, there were some great ideas in that. But basically what came out of it was, nerf Dredge fractal and now fractals has been swooped under the carpet as dust. Even though you may be working on it secretly in the background with a super update to fractals. You have to understand our perspective from what we currently know and can see. I think maybe having a blog where you could communicate smaller things or hint on stuff you’re working on so we’re not left out of the blue could potentially be a good idea.

You have no idea how many times I play different content in the game and I get kittened off cause the potential the game has is enormous and it feels like it’s going all to waste cause different things get prioritized or not worked on at all. This game is one of my top, if not my favorite MMO game of all times, so when sometimes stuff with great potential just get swooped under the carpet, it annoys me.

PS: I love the new living story patch, you all did amazing work on that and I literally smiled in anticipation of what you may have stored for us in the future.

Reverence.6915:

We haven’t seen meaningful change in WvW from the CDIs. All the changes are happening in the other game modes while we watch WvW die a slow death

Actually I would say that the CDIs for WvW are the ones that have (at this time) show most actual change ingame.

lordkrall.7241:

Reverence.6915:

We haven’t seen meaningful change in WvW from the CDIs. All the changes are happening in the other game modes while we watch WvW die a slow death

Actually I would say that the CDIs for WvW are the ones that have (at this time) show most actual change ingame.

He said meaningful change.

The commander changes ARE meaningful and they are a direct result of the CDIs.

lordkrall.7241:

The commander changes ARE meaningful and they are a direct result of the CDIs.

I suggest you go back and skim through the Commander CDI. Hundreds of valid suggestions were brought forward that would’ve made commanding drastically easier, including macro commands and better commander tools (something more than /squadinfo or /supplyinfo). Instead of those really good suggestions, we got commander colour tags, a watered down version of what was suggested, which was guild commander tags using the guild emblem as the icon and such… It’s a kick in the gut basically, for long term WvW players.

I’m a fan of ANet’s game, but the lack of dev support for WvW is making me look elsewhere for my go-to MMO.

I am fully aware of that. But claiming nothing came from them is quite clearly blatantly false, since there are changes made based on those discussions.

People also have to keep in mind that things takes time and might simply not work out the way the forum community wants them to work.

Reverence.6915:

lordkrall.7241:

The commander changes ARE meaningful and they are a direct result of the CDIs.

I suggest you go back and skim through the Commander CDI. Hundreds of valid suggestions were brought forward that would’ve made commanding drastically easier, including macro commands and better commander tools (something more than /squadinfo or /supplyinfo). Instead of those really good suggestions, we got commander colour tags, a watered down version of what was suggested, which was guild commander tags using the guild emblem as the icon and such… It’s a kick in the gut basically, for long term WvW players.

I’m a fan of ANet’s game, but the lack of dev support for WvW is making me look elsewhere for my go-to MMO.

They are still there for reference and no Dev in any game will ever throw away good ideas. Some changes interfere with other items and mechanics and aspects that are already in place. Some increase server load beyond what anyone would consider acceptable. Some ideas may have been accepted and are being prepared as we speak but haven’t been implemented yet because they will be easier to implement at a later date with changes that were already being planned.

These are just possibilities. None of these may be true but for some tasks there are nearly countless variables to consider when planning changes to even the smallest of details.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Have you guys genuinely never seen something come out of a CDI? Have you truly never seen changes that were outlined, discussed, and honed in the forge of the CDI system?

How many times has something rolled out that has really surprised players, and in a good way? “I didn’t even know they were thinking about that” comes up quite often. Or “I saw some talk about this a while back, but didn’t expect to see it in the game.”

Yeah because those updates we have received during 2014 were tremendously huge, weren’t they? If WVW Players should truly be happy with:

- Golem Masteries
- 3 whopping new commander icons
- Siege Disabler
- RIP Quintin Lake

Im not exactly sure where you are going with here, Gaile. Sure, surprise updates are great and all but don’t tell me we should be grateful for these updates in one-years time.

Issues, concerns and requests that have been pointed out since day 1 of the game have been ignored therefore your statement is completely false. Perhaps you are aiming for PVE here but things you summed up definitely did not apply to WVW.

Frankly, I’m not expecting anything from ArenaNet especially after the massively failed Adopt-A-Dev program. It is a shame to see your priorities go to vain.

lordkrall.7241:

I am fully aware of that. But claiming nothing came from them is quite clearly blatantly false, since there are changes made based on those discussions.

People also have to keep in mind that things takes time and might simply not work out the way the forum community wants them to work.

Again, nothing meaningful came out of the CDIs for WvW. WvW updates that do get rolled out increasingly promotes zerging and allowing whichever server that has more people online at the time to roll through everything, with the sole exception of siege disablers, that merely delays the inevitable due to the supply cost of using them.

WvW is still the “niche” game mode, when it could’ve been the main game mode that so many people bought this game for, especially DAoC vets (which I’m admittedly am not). It just severely lacks any kind of dev support or dev attention and is extremely obvious when you see how few red posts are in the WvW forums compared to any other forum. They even removed the one thing that actually gelled the WvW community together – the matchup forums, because they aren’t willing to put in a little extra effort to get moderators for the forum, even though it was the most active category of their entire forum, with thousands of posts a day at its peak.

1. New WvW community manager: “List your concerns, we will discuss them.”
2. Discussion in which the community manager quickly disappears when it’s clear he/she is completely out of touch with how the game mode is being played. But hey, maybe there’s hope with this new manager, right?
3. Waiting.
4. Waiting.
5. Waiting.
6. Go to 1.

This has happened at least 3 times. I think at this point, it’s very fair to say that these discussions/CDI are a complete waste of time.

I think the difference between the old CDIs and the new ones is that the new ones are strictly moderated. Chris is amazingly active while our old CDIs were humongous and there was no one guiding us through it, some odd red posts here and there (Was it Devon? I don’t even remember who was in charge of the wubwub CDIs!) so the topics didn’t turn out too great. Same happened with the Ranger CDI but at least we got lots of our ideas through and implemented even tho the person who was in charge of that topic didn’t really help us at all. Chris seems to be determined to stick around and hopefully he will be there for us, but he mentioned he won’t be there if we flood the topic with negativity and the usual depressing nothing-will-come-out-of-this-why-even-bother-posts.

lordkrall.7241:

The commander changes ARE meaningful and they are a direct result of the CDIs.

I fail to see how a yellow commander tag is going to reinvigorate wvw. And since the change happened over a month ago and wvw is still in the same state it was before we know that it accomplished nothing meaningful.

Grotesque.6480:

Frankly, I’m not expecting anything from ArenaNet especially after the massively failed Adopt-A-Dev program.

Didn’t your guild get a dev? Why do you consider it as failed?

Deli.1302:

Grotesque.6480:

Frankly, I’m not expecting anything from ArenaNet especially after the massively failed Adopt-A-Dev program.

Didn’t your guild get a dev? Why do you consider it as failed?

Well, in our experience we believe the Adopt-A-Dev program quite succeeded with Jessica. We were able to have great discussions regarding what we would like to see, how to re-invent WVW and how we personally feel WVW and the Guild Experience would become more exciting and thrilling.

The notes she made had been forwared to the Dev Team, which is a great step however, the majority of the Devs were stacked on areas where they could not receive a proper view of WVW and how things could be done better for WVW in general. In my eyes, that is a waste of time and thus the program failed. We and Im pretty sure [dF] were able to provide great insights, but we are a minority.

Furthermore, discussions that should have been happening after the program, did not happen. You’d think, after the program a bunch of topics would be kick-started to have a talk about. Obviously, none of us here expect anything to be implemented within a month but a talk and more transparancy that should be happening now, simply isn’t. Instead, ArenaNet is continueing to fail with talks about the current CDIs that are not helping WVW in any way. Raids are great for those who’d like em, but why focus on PVE CDI’s after such an important and innovative step as Adopt-A-Dev? Wouldn’t it make more sense to continue to maintain focus on WVW and go from there, as the experiences from WVW are still fresh in the Devs memories?

Guess we’d never know, however, as I got some time I will write a couple of proper suggestion topics now, to see if we get any responses. Afterall, I got asked to write down some of the suggestions we made on the forums in proper context. Perhaps we get a response, perhaps it will be locked away for good again.

lordkrall.7241:

The commander changes ARE meaningful and they are a direct result of the CDIs.

Dont worry lordkrall, Anet will recognise your white-knighting Soon™

Personally I think not talking about GvG is one of the better things that can happen to WvW.

With the introduction of GvG WvW will be completely dead. I still enjoy WvW and I do so because I do not have to leave my mostly PvE-centric guild and can still enjoy some larger-scale PvP. I do not want to lose that.

I don’t think anything came out of the EotM CDI as virtually no features were brought into WvW from EotM. The Commander CDI brought colored commander tags. The Population Imbalance brought nothing. The other two were requests for CDI topics which don’t really count.

I am probably missing something but lets face it the CDI system while a nice idea has fizzled with a complete lack of follow through.

People might believe these CDIs are beneficial to the community and that you take our input seriously, by bringing the changes that make sense into action, not ideas like removing White swords which we have not suggested.

I think the problems started with the ranger cdi.
We all know there was thousands of good posts, ideas but nothing happened for a year. Now rangers got one skill boost and some polish. Nothing happened with the core problem (pets)

In response to the original question, Chris said early on in the guild CDI that GvG would be a phase. Presumably it’s still coming.

Halvorn.9831:

Personally I think not talking about GvG is one of the better things that can happen to WvW.

With the introduction of GvG WvW will be completely dead. I still enjoy WvW and I do so because I do not have to leave my mostly PvE-centric guild and can still enjoy some larger-scale PvP. I do not want to lose that.

There are still plenty of people who would play WvW, heck I’m sure even GvG guilds would still play wvw to raid, they don’t GvG 100% of the time. However you do raise a good point. Playing for the tick does indeed seem to be a dying mentality, still popular in some areas though, but definitely declining.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Have you guys genuinely never seen something come out of a CDI? Have you truly never seen changes that were outlined, discussed, and honed in the forge of the CDI system?
.

In WvW or PvP? Correct, comments have been ignored.
In PvE? Yes the CDI have been valuable.

Halvorn.9831:

Personally I think not talking about GvG is one of the better things that can happen to WvW.

With the introduction of GvG WvW will be completely dead. I still enjoy WvW and I do so because I do not have to leave my mostly PvE-centric guild and can still enjoy some larger-scale PvP. I do not want to lose that.

You are assuming that if anet makes gvg that it will be like the current gvg that’s being done in wvw. It almost certainly will not be the same. The wvw gvg is really just a death match and no where near as complex and in depth as a real gvg format should be. If anet ever makes a gvg format, I’d expect it to be as complex or nearly as complex as gw1 gvg.

warriorjrd.8695:

Halvorn.9831:

Personally I think not talking about GvG is one of the better things that can happen to WvW.

With the introduction of GvG WvW will be completely dead. I still enjoy WvW and I do so because I do not have to leave my mostly PvE-centric guild and can still enjoy some larger-scale PvP. I do not want to lose that.

There are still plenty of people who would play WvW, heck I’m sure even GvG guilds would still play wvw to raid, they don’t GvG 100% of the time. However you do raise a good point. Playing for the tick does indeed seem to be a dying mentality, still popular in some areas though, but definitely declining.

that was a good point, but even now alot of guilds don’t give a kitten about tick (at least in tier 1 for 100%) and going for fights because they enjoy fights much more and there is no challenge into it and they can’t do much in their 3-4h raids on overall ppt by flipping some staff.

I agree that was a good point, but on other side there are alot ofguilds that do not GvG and just raid (mostly PvX) or GvG rarely.

Rading is still will be fun as fighting for/inside objectives can be pretty fun activity.

Deli.1302:

Halvorn.9831:

Personally I think not talking about GvG is one of the better things that can happen to WvW.

With the introduction of GvG WvW will be completely dead. I still enjoy WvW and I do so because I do not have to leave my mostly PvE-centric guild and can still enjoy some larger-scale PvP. I do not want to lose that.

You are assuming that if anet makes gvg that it will be like the current gvg that’s being done in wvw. It almost certainly will not be the same. The wvw gvg is really just a death match and no where near as complex and in depth as a real gvg format should be. If anet ever makes a gvg format, I’d expect it to be as complex or nearly as complex as gw1 gvg.

I am playing on a T3 server. We have 2-4 active guilds on our maps during evening at most plus a single public zerg that typically is no larger than 15-20 players. And I enjoy that.

Now if guilds are busy doing GvG instead of helping out in the WvW maps, this will kill WvW more or less.

I am sure GvG would not have such an impact on busy T1 servers, but down here – where WvW still can be fun at times – it will.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Have you guys genuinely never seen something come out of a CDI? Have you truly never seen changes that were outlined, discussed, and honed in the forge of the CDI system?

In WvW? Yes. The only thing that I’ve seen kind of come from a WvW CDI was the new commander tags, but lets set that straight. ArenaNet even FAILED at that, your original implementation was a blatant cash grab because it would keep people either farming gold or buying gems for gold. It wasn’t until there was massive outcry from all portions of the playerbase that suddenly things could be changed. The question then becomes did the devs actually read and understand the reasoning behind the different colored tags or see that it was an easy change and that money could be made off it. Clearly since their implementation was actually counter-productive to what CDI posts were trying to accomplish it points to them not knowing the reasoning behind it. Next lets talk about timelines. It took 1 year to get colored commander tags. We are talking about a literally 5 minutes of an artists time, or anyone that knows how to use photoshop or paint, and maybe an hour or 2 of a programmers time. Another week or two for testing just to be sure it’s working. We saw how quickly things got changed once there was a huge negative press storm brewing, it took 1 year to get that poor implementation and in about a week to get it changed. What does that say to you? To me it says that WvW was not a major concern and they gave the WvW some scraps that devs could bang out in between major LS projects.

So yes, the WvW CDI’s have been absolutely useless to date. They have produced nothing meaningful and until we see some results it’s going to be bitterness, resentment, anger, and downright skepticism. I would LOVE to be proven wrong and have ArenaNet release a patch that revitalizes WvW, however given the 2 year track record we will get something inconsequential and another meaningless season tournament that will destroy a few more server communities. The major concerns will remain untouched, pristine in launch packaging.

Colored commander tags were suggested even long before the commander CDI, so…

Halvorn.9831:

I am sure GvG would not have such an impact on busy T1 servers, but down here – where WvW still can be fun at times – it will.

You overestimate the population on T1 servers. T1 has more coverage overall, but not necessarily more players during NA prime. I think it’ll take away a good chunk of players away from WvW on a regular basis regardless of what rank your server is

Guys u playing first week or what?

The wvw and ppt it’s not prime-time, kitten .

U don’t make MAX points at prime time, never.

Most of the points made offtime with good organized map-jumping. During prime-time is just active capture/defend/stomp time for some 3-4 hours. That’s all about it and GvG guilds NEVER effect WvW (and it’s ppt based, u can like it or not but it is like that) in a big way during their raids.

We have had a match recently, where a server 5 positions further up the ladder was part of the match.

We had problems even getting out of our spawn, no matter what time of day (we tend to have a rather active night team). Now if thats what the difference is between position 14 and 19, I am sure it is the same between 8 and 14 and between 1 and 8. I don’t think I overestimate T1 population. Between top and bottom there is such a huuuuuuuuuge population difference it is not even funny anymore.

And on a side-note @Hvaran: I don’t even care anymore for the score. That’s not what I play this unbalanced stuff for. However I do love situations where you try to defend a keep with an outnumbered public group against a growing number of attackers, then just before you are going to lose that one guild group arrives and you can turn the tide of the battle. I have played GW1 but could never get into GvG, didn’t like it at all. WvW however still can be filled with those epic moments for me. I don’t want to lose that.

urieldhynne.2743:

Gaile Gray.6029:

Baldrick — there are a lot of things on the dev backlog, not least of which are responses to player input, questions, suggestions, and concerns expressed through the CDIs. I don’t want anyone to believe the CDIs are just words. They are far more meaningful and helpful to the team that you may see right away. We’ve seen changes through CDI input; we’ll see more in the future.

If you don’t want to anyone believe the CDI are just words prove it. Because by facts and previous CDI… well, no need to explain, right?

Bringing back the old feel og GvG might be hard for gw2 becouse classes and gameplay are totally diferent, it might take lot of time to find a good design for it ;\.

my 2 cents.

Just give us the Obsidian Sanctum as a pvp map. Call it a training ground, Nothing to cap, no PvE. And let the guilds who own the arena invite who they want. Nothing needs to be added for GvG. Adding this will just make it easier to get GvG with other servers/Guilds and avoid the zerg of trolls that troll every NA GvG ive seen.

maybe anet are scared that adding GvG will kill WvW. maybe guildwars 3 wont have guilds and will be called – ‘Wars 3’ (‘quote’ Nuke)

but yea, GvG doesn’t have to be hard or extra fancy mode.. we basiccly have it already it just needs tweeked!