Guild Wars 2

Primetime every day, 10 + ACs decorating the walls and houses in bay and hills. Shameful behavior of completely hiding gates. 2000 damage * 50 players. 5 super ACs = 10000 damage per second, you might as well be equipping your force with rifles machine guns.

Within 2 seconds bodies will be littered on the floor, and I can imagine Devon going “Wow! That was an exciting fight. ‘Grin.’”

Day in, day out, “some” guilds/players will hide behind them. And if we try to clear them with trebs, they just portal bomb them. This was 6 months ago, 3 months ago, and apparently players still uses ACs every single day and drag it out in a battle of 5 hours attrition.

I got sick of it 6 months ago, 3 months ago, and I’m still sick of thess ACs. I’m wondering if anyone still likes Devon’s statement.

I am sick of all siege pretty much, but yeah ACs and even trebs. (All siege does) But especially these two IMO discourage actual fighting, and encourage turtling up and running when things are not looking good.

Overpowered ACs and supply-draining-door-defending trebs have completely shut down the game.

It’s become unplayable.

Find other ways to cap something if theyre heavily sieged with AC.Also,stop dancing in Ac range,it hurts.

So sad that PvD’ers every one in a while experience a little bit of resistance…

It’s surprising this was made AFTER the AC LoS was nerfed. If you are getting killed by AC’s, you can always build omegas to take them out and have them range dps the gate OR you can always catapult or treb down a wall out of AC range. You can even have multiple different classes that have the ability to AoE an Akittenil it goes down.

Radian.2478:

So sad that PvD’ers every one in a while experience a little bit of resistance…

In my opinion, it should be time consuming and quite difficult to take a defended tower. That’s why people build fortifications. I think this would all be much less of a problem if PvDoor against paper towers yielded almost no rewards while taking hours to fight your way into a well-defended T3 keep had rewards commensurate with the amount of time and effort it took to take the site.

I personally love siege warfare. I love standing on top of the walls and sending meteor showers on the hapless attackers, or going into mist form to get back into the keep after I get pulled from the wall. While attacking I love being able to help my zerg by utilizing water fields to keep them up and clearing the walls of enemies with various AoE spells.
Any AC trouble counter it with catas or trebs, not that hard.

Radian.2478:

So sad that PvD’ers every one in a while experience a little bit of resistance…

It’s surprising this was made AFTER the AC LoS was nerfed. If you are getting killed by AC’s, you can always build omegas to take them out and have them range dps the gate OR you can always catapult or treb down a wall out of AC range. You can even have multiple different classes that have the ability to AoE an Akittenil it goes down.

Unless you think once in a while resistance = turtling in keep Every Single Week If Not Every Day.

I like AC’s… especially poorly placed ones…
How to capitalize on AC’s (does not apply to eles manning them due to haxor mistform getaway).

1 – roll trap ranger
2 – stand next to wall below AC, use spike trap, then flame trap and poison trap
3 – If they try to “unmount AC” and run, use entangle.
4 – ??
5 – LOOTBAGS

Rinse and repeat whenever someone gets on that AC.

LoneWolfie.1852:

Day in, day out, “some” guilds/players will hide behind them. And if we try to clear them with trebs, they just portal bomb them. This was 6 months ago, 3 months ago, and apparently players still uses ACs every single day and drag it out in a battle of 5 hours attrition.

Just going to say something about this particular part.

If they have enough numbers in the tower to portal bomb and kill everything you have set up to take the tower then either you didn’t defend them or you were outnumbered.

If you were outnumbered then chances are you wouldn’t have taken the tower to begin with.

You could always simply just treb the wall and all the siege down. It’s not really that hard.

Actium.8765:

LoneWolfie.1852:

Day in, day out, “some” guilds/players will hide behind them. And if we try to clear them with trebs, they just portal bomb them. This was 6 months ago, 3 months ago, and apparently players still uses ACs every single day and drag it out in a battle of 5 hours attrition.

Just going to say something about this particular part.

If they have enough numbers in the tower to portal bomb and kill everything you have set up to take the tower then either you didn’t defend them or you were outnumbered.

If you were outnumbered then chances are you wouldn’t have taken the tower to begin with.

You could always simply just treb the wall and all the siege down. It’s not really that hard.

This all over.

Also, I would perceive your 50 man group to be a bit of a problem as far as the game is concerned. I applaud the defenders you’re QQing about, they clearly have out-strategized your zerg.

That is outrageous. People that actually defend a keep and are weird enough to use ACs to help them defend? What’s this game coming to.

Arrow Carts are probably the only tool that allows you to overcome superior numbers.

Without Arrow Carts you might as well log out when the zerg comes knocking.

It’s rare enough to see people defending as is, it would be shameful to reduce their chances even further.

Dee Jay.2460:

Arrow Carts are probably the only tool that allows you to overcome superior numbers.

Without Arrow Carts you might as well log out when the zerg comes knocking.

It’s rare enough to see people defending as is, it would be shameful to reduce their chances even further.

Essentially 1 sup. AC is > or = at least 5 players.
If you are in a low pop server (for wvw) like me then ACs will literally save your life numerous times. They are the most vital piece of siege for undermanned servers due to cheap cost and high effectiveness.

Nah, needs garlic.

You get more dragonite if you don’t defend your keep and still siege monkeys sit in walls and throw kitten.

Junkpile.7439:

You get more dragonite if you don’t defend your keep and still siege monkeys sit in walls and throw kitten.

You may not get mats, but you defend points which end up benefiting your server.

A quick treb can clear ACs at every gate (except water gate garrison).

There are spots for everything.

Who ever designed these towers and approved the funds to have them built should have their head chopped off. Its like they were made to be taken…. Off with their head!

AC tend to be used well as counters to other weapons that are alone walls or behind doors. Other then that AC are a pure def tool and often do not get maned.
So i am not tired of them at all i am tried of ppl using them badly and to nearly no point.

AC works as a counter to rams and short range siege. One truth of the matter is that almost all AC placements can be countered by Elementalists with Meteor Shower traited for Blasting Staff. Coordinate a pack of 3-5 eles to target sieges on walls before the rams drop.

Beyond that it comes up to be a siege war to take a tower.

How to: Treb wars!
A well defended tower will place a trebuchet on the supply depot where it can counter trebuchets used offensively. A counter treb cannot take down a truly determined offense and the offense will win.

You need more trebs than the enemy has in the tower or to cover them with line of sight or range. Trebs against a tower with a treb in it should be placed farther apart than the treb’s aoe range (1200 units or more to be safe). The counter treb cannot target your trebs before you can take it down. Once the counter treb is down there is nothing the tower can do to defeat the offense other than send a gank force out to take the trebs.

You can make do with 1 treb assuming you ambush the defenders in the tower with it. Make sure the treb’s user is fairly skilled with trebuchets.

I don’t understand what the problem with AC’s are anymore, unless they havn’t fixed the issue with them shooting directly through walls/gates.

Any AC’s sitting on top of walls are sitting ducks for Ele’s and Rangers, to the point you may as well not even bother building them.

Trebs and Ballistas are also great tools to rid a tower/keep of AC’s.

Also, the LoS nerf to AC’s also makes AC’s up top have to be closer in if they are going to hit the rams. That just means they’re easier than ever to AoE. They could already be AoE’d down when placed up top in most places harder to reach, now any profession ought to be able to AoE AC’s up top easy. AC’s in east keep south outer and garrison outer watergate are a little tougher to take down but those aren’t even mandatory attack points. Any AC placed behind a gate on the ground cannot be AoE’d but 600 range rams will be well out of AC range there.

Siege spam is so boring.

I love AC’s. No I am not tired of them. Yes I am effective at using them for defense and able to eliminate them if on offense.

Don’t blame players, blame Anet. Superior AC is the only reliable response for 1g omega golem rush. Just like treb behind gates is the only thing what can repel 5 superior rams.

They broke siege balance with bringing it to Trading Post and giving additional buffs, while ignoring objectives (gates, walls). Have fun blobbing.

imo all siege that isn’t a ram or a golem should be removed from the game. That would also mean that coverage would need to be compensated for, because ACs are the great equalizer in defending a structure.

Plus omegas are my spirit animal.

so if your server is out zerged during oceanic times how else do you stop 25-30 people from changing the color on your borderlands? seems like ACs are the only answer to “Outnumbered”

Also were people in the middle ages screaming for siege to be nerfed?

They should remove siege and gates and every side would have only one keep (no towers at all) in every map. That would make things more fun.

Stand The Wall.6987:

Siege spam is so boring.

Almost as boring as blobs of 50 players PvDooring by pressing the 1 key.

Arrow carts are the force equalizer for outnumbered servers. If a player has an issue with them, they in all likelihood have just announced to the world they are a zerger who doesn’t know any strategy or tactics beyond auto-attacking a gate to getz the phat lutz inside.

There is not a single spot anywhere in the game that an AC can be built to cover a gate for which a counter doesn’t exist. If someone lacks the patience or the will to do what it takes to counter it, that’s the player’s problem, not the game’s problem.

If that kind of strategic play and counter-play is not to your liking, then you’re in luck. The Edge of the Mists map is a PvDooring zerger’s dream come true.

Sick of ACs? Then play TESO which doesn’t have ACs in its RvRvR pvp.

Halo.8976:

Don’t blame players, blame Anet. Superior AC is the only reliable response for 1g omega golem rush. Just like treb behind gates is the only thing what can repel 5 superior rams.

They broke siege balance with bringing it to Trading Post and giving additional buffs, while ignoring objectives (gates, walls). Have fun blobbing.

1.7 G omega rush * 10. Breaks gate down, destroys ACs, lose half of attack force, and when allies come back gate is back at 50%. Enemies waypoint in every 3 minutes. This is your daily routine.

Waypointed garrison, hide behind ACs for hours, constant 3 mins waypoint and once the doors break down they repair it immediately to prevent allies from getting in, with new ACs on the roof. In history, I don’t recall a gate to be repairable within seconds. This is part of the reason why things are so silly and kittened. This isn’t off peak hours but prime time, and the zerg size is roughly the same.

If you really think golem rushes “work” you must be silly. You can throw 20 super golems and still fail because the enemy can just waypoint in over and over with warriors throwing warbanners on lord.

Please, this is your daily routine.

Mine was losing 4 fully upgraded keeps to 40+ man zergs when we had only 15 people to defend. Maybe you should try to play on not a blob server.

Halo.8976:

Please, this is your daily routine.

Mine was losing 4 fully upgraded keeps to 40+ man zergs when we had only 15 people to defend. Maybe you should try to play on not a blob server.

That is another problem altogether. Your problem is caused by the discrepancy of numbers. Maybe you should try not to complain when you’re playing in a small server that can’t pull out numbers.

Who said it was a problem? Farming kittened auto-attacking blobs was pretty fun. I got full ac mastery on my condi necro just for that.

LoneWolfie.1852:

Halo.8976:

Please, this is your daily routine.

Mine was losing 4 fully upgraded keeps to 40+ man zergs when we had only 15 people to defend. Maybe you should try to play on not a blob server.

That is another problem altogether. Your problem is caused by the discrepancy of numbers. Maybe you should try not to complain when you’re playing in a small server that can’t pull out numbers.

The AC is the only way for an out-manned server to even hope to defend it’s towers and keeps from a zerg which only relies on numbers to get the job done. We get rid of that, or if we nerf it, this game will then favor larger servers even more that it already does.

morrolan.9608:

Sick of ACs? Then play TESO which doesn’t have ACs in its RvRvR pvp.

Best joke ever sick of AC go to a game where all sieges is free to put down and takes no time to put it down where you can have oil pots every where at every chock where every one has a treb ram etc…. TESO is the WORST places to rvrvr if you hate sieges. There may be no AC but most if not all sieges act like AC as in its a point and click with aoe and no charging or skill to land the hits.

ScaryHydra.3165:

LoneWolfie.1852:

Halo.8976:

Please, this is your daily routine.

Mine was losing 4 fully upgraded keeps to 40+ man zergs when we had only 15 people to defend. Maybe you should try to play on not a blob server.

That is another problem altogether. Your problem is caused by the discrepancy of numbers. Maybe you should try not to complain when you’re playing in a small server that can’t pull out numbers.

The AC is the only way for an out-manned server to even hope to defend it’s towers and keeps from a zerg which only relies on numbers to get the job done. We get rid of that, or if we nerf it, this game will then favor larger servers even more that it already does.

So your solution is no solution at all? Because you don’t have enough players, you place ACs every day with 1 hour long treb wars?

Sorry, rather than solving the problem, you’re actually exacerbating the issue of having insufficient population. Why? Because nobody wants to play boring waiting games for doors to go down. PVD isn’t fun, but that’s the problem of smaller servers, you claim that your non-prime time has zergs PVDing. And if ACs doesn’t go down or stop super rams within 5 seconds of 5 arrow carts raining?

Omega rush. Woah, you see the problem there? And then you complain, Omygah, omega rush imba!

……..Sigh.

On bigger servers, coverage is relatively balanced and the PvD problem is solved. If anet manages to combine servers, population problem is solved.

Gate Of Kaineng.
Darkhaven’s rest.

Etc.

Jski.6180:

morrolan.9608:

Sick of ACs? Then play TESO which doesn’t have ACs in its RvRvR pvp.

Best joke ever sick of AC go to a game where all sieges is free to put down and takes no time to put it down where you can have oil pots every where at every chock where every one has a treb ram etc….

You can carry siege but it takes damage and it costs to buy and its only useful against other siege not in an actual battle between players so the situation is not as you describe.

I’m sure it would make a lot of people happy if we buffed the damage on rams, took away every other piece of siege and denied upgrades to any towers, ontop of that if you own the tower a siegerazer defensive bubble would cover the area in a 3000 range wide essentially blocking off anyone wanting to defend and would have to wait to opposing zerg received that champion loot bag and karma.

Better yet, Towers and keeps have no gates at all…!!!

morrolan.9608:

Jski.6180:

morrolan.9608:

Sick of ACs? Then play TESO which doesn’t have ACs in its RvRvR pvp.

Best joke ever sick of AC go to a game where all sieges is free to put down and takes no time to put it down where you can have oil pots every where at every chock where every one has a treb ram etc….

You can carry siege but it takes damage and it costs to buy and its only useful against other siege not in an actual battle between players so the situation is not as you describe.

The thing is its still cost nothing in the filed that the problem at first its going to be easy to counter siege in eso because no one will be able to buy / fix it but in time when ppl start building things up and farming your going to see a major shift in have and have not. “If you do not have the ability to keep up with the cost of your siege you will be kicked from our rvrvr guild” i think will become a stander point of view. When it comes down to real rvrvr combat that is = size and some type of leadership on both sides the amount of sieges they can put down will win them fights but the lack of a limitation such as supple your going to see this type of fight happen over and over even on the small level. ESO will be about sieges and doing pve to buy more siege in the long run.

Jski.6180:

The thing is its still cost nothing in the filed that the problem at first its going to be easy to counter siege in eso because no one will be able to buy / fix it but in time when ppl start building things up and farming your going to see a major shift in have and have not. “If you do not have the ability to keep up with the cost of your siege you will be kicked from our rvrvr guild” i think will become a stander point of view. When it comes down to real rvrvr combat that is = size and some type of leadership on both sides the amount of sieges they can put down will win them fights but the lack of a limitation such as supple your going to see this type of fight happen over and over even on the small level. ESO will be about sieges and doing pve to buy more siege in the long run.

The situation you describe is more of a problem in GW2. Because as has been said, in ESO siege is essentially useless once battle is joined.

morrolan.9608:

Jski.6180:

The thing is its still cost nothing in the filed that the problem at first its going to be easy to counter siege in eso because no one will be able to buy / fix it but in time when ppl start building things up and farming your going to see a major shift in have and have not. “If you do not have the ability to keep up with the cost of your siege you will be kicked from our rvrvr guild” i think will become a stander point of view. When it comes down to real rvrvr combat that is = size and some type of leadership on both sides the amount of sieges they can put down will win them fights but the lack of a limitation such as supple your going to see this type of fight happen over and over even on the small level. ESO will be about sieges and doing pve to buy more siege in the long run.

The situation you describe is more of a problem in GW2. Because as has been said, in ESO siege is essentially useless once battle is joined.

So what keep this from happening in GW2 is supple it makes it so you NEED to have a set number of ppl from a set number of supplies from wvw over all. An AC cost 30 supple you need at least 2 ppl to build one (if they have supple mastery or they hit a +5 camp) most of the time its 3 ppl to make one AC for the stronger ac is 40 supplies this needs at least 2 ppl too (if they have +5 from mastery and +5 from camp but likely they do not) most likely it will take anywhere from 3 to 4 ppl to build this. Now once you spend that supple you do not get it back you must give up this supple that could of been used to fix something or build something else this is a give and take of def a tower / keep or even open filed fighting. In ESO the only true limiting factor is sieges cap but what this leads to is what is know as sieges creeping where you just push a bit over and over with sieges and siege alone to the point of making it where they need to rush you with your siege or for them to simply give up. You can do this to a point in GW2 but at a point you will run out of supplies and another plane of attk can be used to make the other side waist there supplies on-top of having means of destroying supple a person has adding another level of play because you stop them from being able to make such things in the first places.

There is nothing to say ESO only going to keep the sieges that it has and as ppl complainer about zerg in ESO you will see a counter to them in sieges more then like and you will get things like AC to counter them but there is no real counter to any sieges in ESO other then most siege. With out a supple system siege is going to be the name of the game in ESO.

LoneWolfie.1852:

Primetime every day, 10 + ACs decorating the walls and houses in bay and hills. Shameful behavior of completely hiding gates. 2000 damage * 50 players. 5 super ACs = 10000 damage per second, you might as well be equipping your force with rifles machine guns.

Within 2 seconds bodies will be littered on the floor, and I can imagine Devon going “Wow! That was an exciting fight. ‘Grin.’”

Day in, day out, “some” guilds/players will hide behind them. And if we try to clear them with trebs, they just portal bomb them. This was 6 months ago, 3 months ago, and apparently players still uses ACs every single day and drag it out in a battle of 5 hours attrition.

I got sick of it 6 months ago, 3 months ago, and I’m still sick of thess ACs. I’m wondering if anyone still likes Devon’s statement.

WvWvW = castle/keeps/towers = sieges battle
its a conqueror figth and not champ farming
if they use ACs, u just use treb or golem (guard them for prevent portal bomb)
WvWvW its a strategic part of PvP without sieges its just pvp
and if u want make only pvp just go in sPvP map
if u take 10000 dmg from sAC, u need to upgrade ur wvwvw traits

Sieges should be used and destroyed by anybody. And friendly fire on them! No mor gate defending catas and trebs!

Well, given that with zoom-hack and other abilities, a higher position doesn’t really give you any advantages in-game and golem-rushes can reduce a T3 tower to pulp within minutes, ACs are often the only reliable counter available.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not a big fan of them, but they have their purpose. The last few months, the match-ups for my server have been horrible and we’re constantly outnumbered. ACs are often one of the few things standing between a handful defenders on our side and a 40+ blob of enemies.

Where I have issues is when servers that clearly outnumber you, then hide behind ACs when you do manage to muster a force to push them a bit.

Tired of AC’s? hell no, counter siege it! meteor shower it! pull people off acs!

So many ways to get rid of them or to avoid them

^^ or just use Omega rockets. I’m just tired of people using it for the wrong purposes.
It’s definitely not easy to defend with lesser numbers even with so many AC’s that you don’t even have enough players to man and even then once the gate breaches the first thing the Assaulting server usually does is clear the siege on the walls.

Kraag Deadsoul.2789:

Stand The Wall.6987:

Siege spam is so boring.

Almost as boring as blobs of 50 players PvDooring by pressing the 1 key.

Arrow carts are the force equalizer for outnumbered servers. If a player has an issue with them, they in all likelihood have just announced to the world they are a zerger who doesn’t know any strategy or tactics beyond auto-attacking a gate to getz the phat lutz inside.

There is not a single spot anywhere in the game that an AC can be built to cover a gate for which a counter doesn’t exist. If someone lacks the patience or the will to do what it takes to counter it, that’s the player’s problem, not the game’s problem.

If that kind of strategic play and counter-play is not to your liking, then you’re in luck. The Edge of the Mists map is a PvDooring zerger’s dream come true.

Almost as boring as a couple of siege monkeys auto-attacking by pressing the 1 key.

Organized guilds are the force equalizer for outnumbered servers. If a player has an issue with them, they in all likelihood have just announced to the world they are a siege monkey who doesnt know any strategy or tactics beyond auto-attacking a gate to getz the phat lutz outside.

There is not a single karma train in the game that cannot be taken down. If someone lacks the patience of joining a guild, that’s the player’s problem, not the game’s.

If that kind of strategic play and counter-play is not to your liking, then you’re in luck. Regular WvW is a siege monkeys dream come true.

I’m not sick of AC. Not 6 months ago, not 3 months ago and not today.