Guild Wars 2

Do you even start to use brain power when you change stuff in WvW? I am sorry, but the changes mentioned in SOTG just promote the zerg playstyle even more. Let me break down how a zerg goes on today

- 40+ people
- Mainly classes with a good #1 attack cause this is the definition of skill based combat
- They run in straight lines and press #1
- Buffs etc not so important as long as people press #1

Now, lets say a organized group of 20 meet them. Instead of running they start buffing. Applying boons and utilities to try to turn odds to their favour and have a chance against this random blob.

Commander Greg, commander of the pugs see them and types in /say “Reds ahead move in that general direction and press #1” or maybe more like /say “follow press 1 go”

A organized group could take this on and turn it into a fight benefiting from the kittentards spamming their skills. The organized group would strip their boons, maintaining theirs, add confusion to the autotrolls, use healing fields and blast finishers. Stack on retaliation and start to even out the odds. This is in the organized groups eyes, what we call a good fight. We could make a difference. (the best fights ofc versus other org groups)

Now you just slam the organized groups down by changing confusion and retaliation. Confusion was not a problem for people with a average IQ level. Retaliation was “exploited” and could use a change, so I will wait out and see what you do with it first.

But then you go ahead and give zerg class number 1, the warrior a 3% damage boost per boon on the enemy. The class that cleave kitten all infront of him with his #1 skill. Thats on average a 15% boost against a organized group if the group have basic knowledge of the game. Sustained through a fight due to all the boon share that goes on by supportive classes. Oh and lets not forget their new -33% on movement condis. Add it with runes and food and good luck, locking down the warriors with now a whooping -98% movement condi duration.

Just please for once try to implement the “skill based” gameplay you talk so much about into WvW also.

kitten!

Confusing was OP, no doubt there and glad they changing it.

Retaliation, my only question is: Why?? Nobody cried about it and it only returns 300-400dmg which ain’t much. Don’t think I am going to use it anymore on my warrior if it gets nerfed. I’d rather go for 25% hammer damage + boon hate is a whoppin 40% more damage. 8k hammerstuns inc.

When I started playing this game i tought WvW would be awesome with all the combos possible between all professions, but no, people just hug and start running forward while pressing 1. The game has a great PvP potential that unfortunately players and devs don’t see.

inb4 moderators hit this kitten.

But seriously, Confusion was not overpowered. People just need to not have “1” on auto-attack and, oh I dunno, pay attention to the little icons that pop up on your character.

Also, why are they removing blocking treb shots? It actually took coordination to do that as well….weeeeee

Rookni.2469:

ArenaNet. Stay for a while and listen

I read that in Deckard Cain’s voice and not by choice.

I hate him so much.

They are removing anything that actually took coordination and adding stuff (like boonhate to skill 1 spammer class) to make people use less brain for WvW and with this try to force people out of WvW and into sPvP and we all know why.

esports esports esports!

Yorek Vrasen.7034:

inb4 moderators hit this kitten.

But seriously, Confusion was not overpowered. People just need to not have “1” on auto-attack and, oh I dunno, pay attention to the little icons that pop up on your character.

Also, why are they removing blocking treb shots? It actually took coordination to do that as well….weeeeee

Decent mesmer group, locate commander, place 25stack of confusion, commander uses 1 skill, boom he is dead. Nope, not overpowered at all.

MiLkZz.4789:

Confusing was OP, no doubt there and glad they changing it.

Retaliation, my only question is: Why?? Nobody cried about it and it only returns 300-400dmg which ain’t much. Don’t think I am going to use it anymore on my warrior if it gets nerfed. I’d rather go for 25% hammer damage + boon hate is a whoppin 40% more damage. 8k hammerstuns inc.

A guardian with high retal uptime will wreck a warrior thinking about 100bs. Most people die to retal and don’t notice since it could be the bleeds you have on you are the poison killing you or the burning frying you.

Retal is good against quick hitting attackers like warrior, thief, ranger many other classes are not really bothered by it.

Also I can’t believe the OP is upset about the boon hate thing for warriors since warriors are one of the fastest classes to go down you gotta be kidding me right the change is placed to specfically help deal with guardians and eles. The by product is if you have alot of boons on you then you will be hurting too but its not like the warrior wouldnt do alot of damage to you anyway.

Also from what I gather this trait is grandmaster in discipline which means they will have to sacrifice somewhere either in power or arms if they are burst with atleast 20 points in defense. Warrior will still do alot of damage no doubt but they already do when specced its not like they are running around wrecking everyone. Most people agree warrior definitely needs some help against bunker classes.

Boon hate isn’t huge because you stacked some might, and some swiftness and some protection. Protection is still -33% damage if you have access to it.

Yeah this game just took a nose dive and the patch hasnt even been in effect. I am looking at other games already.

MiLkZz.4789:

Confusing was OP, no doubt there and glad they changing it.

Retaliation, my only question is: Why?? Nobody cried about it and it only returns 300-400dmg which ain’t much. Don’t think I am going to use it anymore on my warrior if it gets nerfed. I’d rather go for 25% hammer damage + boon hate is a whoppin 40% more damage. 8k hammerstuns inc.

Engineers actually have some multiple-hit AoE skills that can pretty easily receive over ten thousand retaliation damage if someone randomly blasts a light field before the skill lands. Longbow rangers also take quite a bit of retal damage when they use their AoE against, you know, a group of people clumped together. No one was “crying” about it, but the fact that you could nearly 1-hit yourself on it has consistently come up on the forums.

Check op’s youtube he plays elementalist makes sense now disregard

Other guy who says game has taken nosedive plays glamour spec mesmer looks at other games.

TonyDiMeglio.5461:

Yeah this game just took a nose dive and the patch hasnt even been in effect. I am looking at other games already.

Except this is one of the better patches for class balance and mechanics balance if all of these things actually go through…

I run glamour sometimes and even if it is a 50% decrease in confusion damage its still going to be strong its so easy to get more than 5 stacks on someome. Ive seen people kill themselves on 2 stacks of confusion before just spamming. The spammers wont stop you can still stack 100% duration on it and they will still die just not as fast.

Listen kittens. Its not the boon hate in particular I have a problem with. Its the benefits a zerg or blob gets from it. And a warrior being one of the first to go down? Please.

Oh and my highest WvW ranked is a guardian

oZii.2864:

MiLkZz.4789:

Confusing was OP, no doubt there and glad they changing it.

Retaliation, my only question is: Why?? Nobody cried about it and it only returns 300-400dmg which ain’t much. Don’t think I am going to use it anymore on my warrior if it gets nerfed. I’d rather go for 25% hammer damage + boon hate is a whoppin 40% more damage. 8k hammerstuns inc.

A guardian with high retal uptime will wreck a warrior thinking about 100bs. Most people die to retal and don’t notice since it could be the bleeds you have on you are the poison killing you or the burning frying you.

Retal is good against quick hitting attackers like warrior, thief, ranger many other classes are not really bothered by it.

Also I can’t believe the OP is upset about the boon hate thing for warriors since warriors are one of the fastest classes to go down you gotta be kidding me right the change is placed to specfically help deal with guardians and eles. The by product is if you have alot of boons on you then you will be hurting too but its not like the warrior wouldnt do alot of damage to you anyway.

Also from what I gather this trait is grandmaster in discipline which means they will have to sacrifice somewhere either in power or arms if they are burst with atleast 20 points in defense. Warrior will still do alot of damage no doubt but they already do when specced its not like they are running around wrecking everyone. Most people agree warrior definitely needs some help against bunker classes.

Boon hate isn’t huge because you stacked some might, and some swiftness and some protection. Protection is still -33% damage if you have access to it.

Correction, bad specced warriors are the first ones to go down. The good ones seem to stay alive for ever and a 3k hit on them just seems to scratch em :/.

And yea retaliation was a great counter against rangers and thiefs. And for warriors 100b, 8 hits * 300dmg= 2.4k damage, full channeled 100b = 7-15k dmg. With the big health pool of a warrior that shouldn’t be a problem if you consider the trade off.

MiLkZz.4789:

And yea retaliation was a great counter against rangers and thiefs.

It wasn’t just a counter against thieves, it was a shut down. Thieves (in PvP) could do almost nothing against retal upkeep mesmers and guardians aside from the 40s~ cooldown strip on steal or running what has been, for a while, subpar s/x. And neither of those could keep up with the re-app rate that the aforementioned classes had for retaliation.

Warrior is one of the first to go down unless they are running a rifle or a bow. If they arent and they jump in first then they do damage and run back waiting for long cooldown.

You could make the claim that any buff to any class benefits the blob. If your blob or group wants to stand inside of 100 blades and axe auto attack then that is their fault. Its not like they cant dodge I mean what are they doing now face tanking warriors?

Vena.8436:

MiLkZz.4789:

And yea retaliation was a great counter against rangers and thiefs.

It wasn’t just a counter against thieves, it was a shut down. Thieves (in PvP) could do almost nothing against retal upkeep mesmers and guardians aside from the 40s~ cooldown strip on steal or running what has been, for a while, subpar s/x.

You mean you were scared of the 350dmg you got returned for every 4-8k you dealt?
Nei, this patch is a double buff for thiefs, eventho they still deal 7k dmg (in 1 hit) against 3.4k armor. Which is rediculous.

I have no issues with warriors or any other class or utility or whatever in a something close to even playing field. The issues I have is ArenaNets thinking when they remove benefits from the organized group and adding them to the huge number groups. It just seems backwards to promote a zergy playstyle when their engine cant handle it.

My issues are in WvW and WvW alone.

And warriors specced for it with a hammer and sword+horn do not die first if they have any clue of how to play their class

oZii.2864:

Check op’s youtube he plays elementalist makes sense now disregard

Other guy who says game has taken nosedive plays glamour spec mesmer looks at other games.

Thanks for that, makes sense now.

MiLkZz.4789:

You mean you were scared of the 350dmg you got returned for every 4-8k you dealt?
Nei, this patch is a double buff for thiefs, eventho they still deal 7k dmg (in 1 hit) against 3.4k armor. Which is rediculous.

I’m speaking in tPvP, and such numbers would require gc-spec which would, against any competent team, amount to accomplishing nothing because bunkers would shrug you off and you’d (with what would be laughable health) die to retal and their mediocre damage… while being murdered by players who aren’t stupid enough to not cantrip/dodge your mug/stun/backstab/etc.

No one runs 4-8k gc specs in tPvP. Mug is overpowered as balls, though.

Also not sure why you deduced that I play thief in PvP, I play an engineer and guardian in tPvP.

MiLkZz.4789:

oZii.2864:

MiLkZz.4789:

Confusing was OP, no doubt there and glad they changing it.

Retaliation, my only question is: Why?? Nobody cried about it and it only returns 300-400dmg which ain’t much. Don’t think I am going to use it anymore on my warrior if it gets nerfed. I’d rather go for 25% hammer damage + boon hate is a whoppin 40% more damage. 8k hammerstuns inc.

A guardian with high retal uptime will wreck a warrior thinking about 100bs. Most people die to retal and don’t notice since it could be the bleeds you have on you are the poison killing you or the burning frying you.

Retal is good against quick hitting attackers like warrior, thief, ranger many other classes are not really bothered by it.

Also I can’t believe the OP is upset about the boon hate thing for warriors since warriors are one of the fastest classes to go down you gotta be kidding me right the change is placed to specfically help deal with guardians and eles. The by product is if you have alot of boons on you then you will be hurting too but its not like the warrior wouldnt do alot of damage to you anyway.

Also from what I gather this trait is grandmaster in discipline which means they will have to sacrifice somewhere either in power or arms if they are burst with atleast 20 points in defense. Warrior will still do alot of damage no doubt but they already do when specced its not like they are running around wrecking everyone. Most people agree warrior definitely needs some help against bunker classes.

Boon hate isn’t huge because you stacked some might, and some swiftness and some protection. Protection is still -33% damage if you have access to it.

Correction, bad specced warriors are the first ones to go down. The good ones seem to stay alive for ever and a 3k hit on them just seems to scratch em :/.

And yea retaliation was a great counter against rangers and thiefs. And for warriors 100b, 8 hits * 300dmg= 2.4k damage, full channeled 100b = 7-15k dmg. With the big health pool of a warrior that shouldn’t be a problem if you consider the trade off.

With a heal with 300 healing power and requiring full adrenaline you get 8,790. 7-15k dmg isn’t much at all. If you the warrior went 20-30 points into tactics.

That 7-15k is additional damage on top of whatever your already taking.

Rookni.2469:

I have no issues with warriors or any other class or utility or whatever in a something close to even playing field. The issues I have is ArenaNets thinking when they remove benefits from the organized group and adding them to the huge number groups. It just seems backwards to promote a zergy playstyle when their engine cant handle it.

My issues are in WvW and WvW alone.

And warriors specced for it with a hammer and sword+horn do not die first if they have any clue of how to play their class

Warriors shoe horned into Hammer/ Sword+horn? Sword is terrible in a damage set it’s purpose on a damage build is mobility and only that.

The boon hate thing is just going to add maybe more builds to warriors. Now your tanky warrior can at least pump out good damage to help win the fight instead of being outsustained that is still a maybe even with these changes.

Its not going to change the warriors playstyle much just maybe how they are traited. The attacks style will still look the same you can still dodge him but not as much with the new defense trait. I can’t see how you have the slightest problem with this unless its cause you play a guardian and a elementalist you feel like warriors might now be better front liners than your guardian and ele which currently are better front liners than warriors which totally makes sense for ele’s to be better front line fighters than warriors o.O.

oZii.2864:

Rookni.2469:

I have no issues with warriors or any other class or utility or whatever in a something close to even playing field. The issues I have is ArenaNets thinking when they remove benefits from the organized group and adding them to the huge number groups. It just seems backwards to promote a zergy playstyle when their engine cant handle it.

My issues are in WvW and WvW alone.

And warriors specced for it with a hammer and sword+horn do not die first if they have any clue of how to play their class

Warriors shoe horned into Hammer/ Sword+horn? Sword is terrible in a damage set it’s purpose on a damage build is mobility and only that.

The boon hate thing is just going to add maybe more builds to warriors. Now your tanky warrior can at least pump out good damage to help win the fight instead of being outsustained that is still a maybe even with these changes.

Its not going to change the warriors playstyle much just maybe how they are traited. The attacks style will still look the same you can still dodge him but not as much with the new defense trait. I can’t see how you have the slightest problem with this unless its cause you play a guardian and a elementalist you feel like warriors might now be better front liners than your guardian and ele which currently are better front liners than warriors which totally makes sense for ele’s to be better front line fighters than warriors o.O.

I mentioned that spec only to show that warriors can have some of the absolute best survivability in a fight while maintaining good damage due to cleaving attacks. The utility the warhorn brings to a organized group is also very valuable mid fights. But still. This is not a discussion of how warriors can be specced. I am just worried about how these changes benefits the zergs MORE (not only warrior, but also ele nerfs, confusion changes etc) than the smaller groups. 1 vs 1 warrior needed this love. Thieves ability to steal boons, not so much though But not gonna touch that subject cause I enjoy my thief now and then.

oZii.2864:

Warriors shoe horned into Hammer/ Sword+horn? Sword is terrible in a damage set it’s purpose on a damage build is mobility and only that.

The boon hate thing is just going to add maybe more builds to warriors. Now your tanky warrior can at least pump out good damage to help win the fight instead of being outsustained that is still a maybe even with these changes.

Its not going to change the warriors playstyle much just maybe how they are traited. The attacks style will still look the same you can still dodge him but not as much with the new defense trait. I can’t see how you have the slightest problem with this unless its cause you play a guardian and a elementalist you feel like warriors might now be better front liners than your guardian and ele which currently are better front liners than warriors which totally makes sense for ele’s to be better front line fighters than warriors o.O.

As far as I can remember, warriors are always the fist ones in, immediatly followed by guardians and they leave as last ones together with the guardians, holding hands and collecting bags.

And yea, warriors run sword-warhorn for the mobility and hammer for the damage. Which is pretty high even in pvt build imo.

Vena.8436:

TonyDiMeglio.5461:

Yeah this game just took a nose dive and the patch hasnt even been in effect. I am looking at other games already.

Except this is one of the better patches for class balance and mechanics balance if all of these things actually go through…

Are you kittening kidding me? Eles BARELY get touched, thieves, and Warriors get buffed, and my build gets HALF OF ITS DAMAGE TAKEN AWAY.

you are an idiot.

Decked.8274:

When I started playing this game i tought WvW would be awesome with all the combos possible between all professions, but no, people just hug and start running forward while pressing 1. The game has a great PvP potential that unfortunately players and devs don’t see.

Dont play with unskilled pugs, join some guild.

I think Anet dont care about balancing WvW. I dont need stupid rewards. Just boost useless profetions (eng/rang), boost comletely useless utilities (mantra, singet, conjure, spirit, etc. ), weapons (ele’s focus, warrior’s maces, ranger’s axes, all guardian’s 1h weps, etc.) , elites (ele’s , eng’s, )

MiLkZz.4789:

Confusing was OP, no doubt there and glad they changing it.

Retaliation, my only question is: Why?? Nobody cried about it and it only returns 300-400dmg which ain’t much. Don’t think I am going to use it anymore on my warrior if it gets nerfed. I’d rather go for 25% hammer damage + boon hate is a whoppin 40% more damage. 8k hammerstuns inc.

Confusion is only op if you are a bad player who’s doesn’t cleanses and mashes buttons. I have never had a problem dealing with confusion, if someone dumps a stack of confusion on me I either cleanse or just don’t do anything. The confusion nerf is Not needed, it’s unwarranted and just another example of Anet dumbing down the game to cater for bad, lazy players.

MiLkZz.4789:

Yorek Vrasen.7034:

inb4 moderators hit this kitten.

But seriously, Confusion was not overpowered. People just need to not have “1” on auto-attack and, oh I dunno, pay attention to the little icons that pop up on your character.

Also, why are they removing blocking treb shots? It actually took coordination to do that as well….weeeeee

Decent mesmer group, locate commander, place 25stack of confusion, commander uses 1 skill, boom he is dead. Nope, not overpowered at all.

If there’s a commander idiotic enough to use any skill with 25 stacks of confusion, he deserves to die a humiliating death.

Just saying.