Guild Wars 2

I am from BG day 1, and I really enjoyed our community and the fact that we were a high performing T2 server that had no major alliances, but could still put up a heck of a fight even in PuGs. Now, because Titan Alliance disbanded at HoD and many came to BG a large bandwagon group followed, and I will admit I have seen a pretty big decline in the community for sure.

But here is the thing, there is literally nothing I have personally seen BG do that I have not seen the other servers do, I have reported exploiters from BG, SBI, and JQ this past week. I had a guy from JQ whisper me after he killed me in a 1v1 while trying to do the jump puzzle calling me a noob. I also had a lot of people alt+f4 after losing to me in 1v1 fights from both SBI and JQ (as I am sure many BG’ers did it as well). I had quite a few times where an SBI or JQ would jump on my corpse or /laugh emote after killing me, no big deal, but still just really unnecessary (again I am sure BG is just as guilty).

As far as tactics go, I do not want to get into a debate… But Turtle is a game mechanic tactic, not an exploit. 2v1 (IF it did happen, not saying it did or did not) is also valid tactic and not an exploit of any sort.

My whole point in this post is, why has BG been labelled by many as “that” server, thus becoming the punching bag for criticism when all other servers are equally guilty of these same offenses? And secondly, what can we do (if anything) to change your mind as a community?

It was a great match in my opinion, and incredibly challenging. My thanks goes out to all the SBI and JQ players that had a great attitude throughout. I am looking forward to a rematch!

If this becomes a back and forth flame war, instead of constructive then I ask the mods to close it ASAP.

I faced you folks in a pretty harsh match that you stomped us in. I think part of it was the attitude of the players on your server coming to this forum in the match’s thread. They were complaining of being bored, insulting to our server straight out sometimes, and showed a real lack of sportsmanship.

The usual response to this is the same as any other issue that arises. You can’t blame one server for a few bad apples. Unfortunately, since this is a community, that is exactly what can happen if it gets out of control. This is why as a server you folks need to rein these bad folks in and try to bring them into the fold of being proud of their server without being jerks. Learn to win with some grace.

Another thing you guys can do is stop asking for more people to join your server and live with what you have, like most of the servers do. Winning isn’t everything when you sacrifice your soul for it.

I hated you guys a few days after the match, but have since gotten over it. I wish you the best of luck. Honestly, and I think eventually this stuff will blow over and Beastgate will be one of the best servers out there.

there are 7 billion people in the world, you can’t expect them to all like you – it’s a game, play hard, play fair, have fun and celebrate everyones right to free speech. Just don’t take it to heart and have fun. When you have fun anyways, it fixes most of the problems. You never want to be more popular than toilet paper.

“I don’t know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody.”
Bill Cosby

I had no problems with Blackgate personally but yeah the majority of it stemmed from the trash talk, insults, and accusations of 2v1 just so we could win. I realize there will always be the vocal minority for few trolls but the do pretty bad damage. One thing that can help is when you see someone doing that qoute and post back saying that is not the feeling of the general server and explain. When you just reply and add to it then it only goes downhill.

For instance the matchup thread for this week on Guru was locked originally for this and another had to be started. the current one is 46+ pages I think and 90% of it is arguing, name calling, and insults and very little score updates. So basically you have to have the majority of your folks flat out denounce the trolls and work to counteract them. It is a sad realization and problem for all servers SBI included.

(Just my opinion) My perception for BG that I saw a few weeks ago the week they were matched up with DB: 2010 Miami Heat Welcome Party http://youtu.be/e9BqUBYaHlM

I heard from people that the “bad apples” jumped/bandwagoned to Blackgate since it was the hot server at the time. Weeks later, I’m pretty indifferent about Blackgate. And you shouldn’t care how others perceive your server either if you’re enjoying it there already.

Yeah I agree with everyone about the fact that is impossible to please everyone, or even the majority most of the time… But, generally I was just looking to see if there was any way to improve cross server relations. And also, if people see posts about how BG is obnoxious and generally rude, then new players or good communities looking for a place to settle (PvX) will be discouraged from joining. Most of us at BG do not want that. We want to get rid of the bandwagon/trolls and gain quality players.

I think you folks will be fine. You are a good server and honestly agree with the post above that some bad apples transferred there but the vast majority of BG folks are good people.

If you want to give new quality players a good impression to choose their home server, you could change the name of your server to Nicegate or Familygate…Blackgate sounds like a place where Raiders fans hang out…

that statement doesn’t help, epics =|

i was thinking about this …and started laughing – being an old school RP’r – you have the perfect opportunity to RP an evil server haha – in the old days we had guilds like ITB and KAAOS – they were fierce pvp’rs and people either hated them or feared them – our community was also tight knit ..and knew better than to take that out of character – but it was a riot and those guilds did not hesitate to show all their evil glory on the field and on the forum in RP character…. they wanted to be hated!! lol ( they did it so well in fact, they were loved )

I myself am Neutral alignment when it comes to RP – but that’s not because i want the right to be evil… it’s because I want the right to be a good character in game every so often. but in reality, I could really give a rats kitten if you like me or not when I’m in character … it should be very clear that when you see me and my blade in game …it would be wise of you to run. I WILL without hesitation laugh and dance on your corpse.

Turn that hate into revenge. Can’t forget SBI came away with the win, JQ and BG have to do something about this!

Yea BG came in thinking they would stomp us, and then there was the silly orb hacking thing that was a really bad first impression. Over time though as BG gets more used to the fights in T1 and stops crying about 2v1 and things then it’ll cool down. JQ is a good example if anything, everyone hated then for JQQing about everything that didn’t go their way, then they got themselves together and managed to hold onto #1 for awhile.

this is from when the patch came in was at LA overflow and i lol’d that i actually have screenies…

My assessment of last match:

BG showed everyone the “turtle” method and took a huge lead by using it. This pissed SBI and JQ off and they, especially SBI, started saying bs like bg is hacking and exploiting and whatever, but the reality is SBI was QQing because they didn’t know what to do. So many SBI members come on forums and successfully painted BG as the evil.
Fast forward 3 days, JQ and SBI spend the majority of their time focusing on BG. This is true – the majority of the time I played while BG was still in the lead, SBI and JQ rarely full on attacked each other. Seemed like a mutual unwritten agreement that we did not want BG to take first place.

Anyway, in response to the opening, I don’t think you guys have to do anything as a community to “remove the hate” because this already happened: you guys didn’t come in first this match up. Plus, Anet removed the orbs which was the roots of all the bickering. Clean slate this week, anything can happen. But I think what we learned from last week is forum slander can actually have an effect on how a match swings, so I hope this week we don’t have any more forum wars cause it would be nice if matches were completely determined by players on the battlefield.

The forums had 0 bearing on what happened in game, are you kidding me?

Try and be a bit more humble. Proclaiming yourself “Beastgate” definitely didn’t win you any fans.

“What can we do about it?”

You want an honest answer? Ok:

(1) Stop using turtles. You can call it a “tactic” all you want, but it exploits the game’s AOE cap. Thing is, I haven’t even seen it help much as far as actual gameplay goes, since you can’t exactly siege with a turtle, it’s more annoying than anything. The people who do it seem to just like the satisfaction of standing around being immune.

(2) Stop talking about 2v1. Seriously. It makes you look very new. JQ and SBI have been rivals forever, we’ve never had nor will ever have an alliance of any kind, because we both want to win. Server’s usually attack the other server that’s weakest, being attacked already, or has more points. It’s how 1v1v1 is played.

(3) Stop calling yourself Beastgate. Honestly it makes you guys look like you’re 12 years old. All the chest thumping and egos do not help people to like you. Just play the game. If you win, show respect to your opponents; if you lose, show respect to your opponents.

SoR just finished a matchup against TC. Tarnished Coast being the unofficial RP server probably has the most original and fun players to compete against. We saw large packs of candy men beating on towers this week in WvW. We saw naked supply camp rushes, as well as other fun quirks. Now of course we saw the occasional alt+f4 downed player and a few thieves exploiting rendering to hold supply camps but I am not about to hold an entire server responsible for the actions of the few.

Your server, however, it is not the few. The abusers of the rendering issues, the downed player quitters, the turtlers, the mesmer portal bomb abuse, it’s all the norm for ’Beastgate’. The respectable players on your server are the exception, they are the minority.

Even you, OP, condone the acts of turtling/stacking. You will never see anyone on Sanctum of Rall use that tactic because it’s poor sportsmanship. I happen to agree that it’s clever use of game mechanics and not an exploit but that doesn’t change the fact that it’s lame and if you’re going to use it, you’re lame.

By all means if you wish to continue to push the envelope and bend the rules of the game to the extreme do it. But don’t expect the rest of us to herald you as the champion server. It’s like flopping in basketball, yes it works and it will get what you want, but eventually someone is going to hit you in the face with an elbow and the rest of us are going to stand up and cheer.

You are giving too much power to a fraction of the gaming community. If you counted every negative post on the forums that goes against your server your going to have….what? a couple dozen accounts if that much?

Just have a pepsi, play the game and ignore the forum trolls. You will never stop them from posting.

They can not offend you, you can only choose to be offended. Simple as that imo.

or just go evil and laugh like Mad King thorn!! hahaha!! sorry i couldn’t help it…i’d be having so much fun with it ;x

Just to clear something up about the Beastgate nickname.

Players on BG did not give us this name. It was born out of the HoD/NSP/BG match that took place during the 24hr format. This was the big long awaited clash between Titan Alliance on HoD and Ascension Alliance on NSP (they were on NSP at the time), and BG surprised them both by being extremely competitive in the match.

Here is the first post on the gw2guru Stonemist Castle forums where the nickname Beastgate was used. It was posted by a non-BG player ….

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/58683-new-match-up-again/#entry1864809

Here’s the quote for those that don’t want to click the link …

Chamcham wrote:

Blackgate, more like BEASTGATE, Everyone was counting them out.

This was all the way back on September 1st, and the nickname just caught on and stuck.

Well its a good name for a good server. Nuff said.

Peetee.9406:

SoR just finished a matchup against TC. Tarnished Coast being the unofficial RP server probably has the most original and fun players to compete against. We saw large packs of candy men beating on towers this week in WvW. We saw naked supply camp rushes, as well as other fun quirks. Now of course we saw the occasional alt+f4 downed player and a few thieves exploiting rendering to hold supply camps but I am not about to hold an entire server responsible for the actions of the few.

Your server, however, it is not the few. The abusers of the rendering issues, the downed player quitters, the turtlers, the mesmer portal bomb abuse, it’s all the norm for ‘Beastgate’. The respectable players on your server are the exception, they are the minority.

Even you, OP, condone the acts of turtling/stacking. You will never see anyone on Sanctum of Rall use that tactic because it’s poor sportsmanship. I happen to agree that it’s clever use of game mechanics and not an exploit but that doesn’t change the fact that it’s lame and if you’re going to use it, you’re lame.

By all means if you wish to continue to push the envelope and bend the rules of the game to the extreme do it. But don’t expect the rest of us to herald you as the champion server. It’s like flopping in basketball, yes it works and it will get what you want, but eventually someone is going to hit you in the face with an elbow and the rest of us are going to stand up and cheer.

But see that is the thing, you can look on youtube or cruise forums and find hard evidence of just about every server exploiting/portal bombing, heck we got portal bombed a few times when I was on the other night. And how you can claim to know the whole BG community is beyond me, so I will just dismiss that. And I am not condoning anything from anyone, you missed my whole point… You insulted me for “condoning stacking” and all I said was that it was not an exploit, but a tactic, which you in fact agree with in your post! Sooo… Yeahhhh… Not sure why you even posted that.

Also, SoR has never had to deal with the bandwagon, you guys look like an awesome competitive server from what I have seen and heard, but if these free transfers remain and you rise to the top, you will get unwanted communities joining you making your server look bad.

Yeah I agree with elderan… the turtle bomb won’t make your server any better looking to other servers, call it an exploit, clever use of game mechanics, but at the end of the day all it is is a cheap tactic that’s taking advantage of an over-looked aspect of the game with the AOE Cap limit of 5 players in 1 clumped up area.

If I’m not mistaken, SoR did receive a boatload of transfers. They leapfrogged 2 tiers or something because of that.

flagg.6073:

Try and be a bit more humble. Proclaiming yourself “Beastgate” definitely didn’t win you any fans.

Come on admit it Steelballs Island isn’t much better lol. Although to be fair I think it was HoD that gave us that nickname

Coming from an SBI player who was very pissed off by BG:

The problem was the combination of the amount of hacking (higher than other opponents we faced) with the lack of posts by BG players coming out against hacking.

The removal of orbs should definitely help, since it will stop the most glaring and annoying hack.

Something else you need to do is to turn your silent majority of people who do not condone hacking into a posting majority. Every time there is an accusation of hacking, there should be 5 BG players posting that they hate hackers. NOT 5 BG players calling into question whether hacking happened.

Speak out against hacking often and loud, and people will trust you that you do your part on your server to prevent it.

- Xeeron

Shift Focus.9083:

Yeah I agree with elderan… the turtle bomb won’t make your server any better looking to other servers, call it an exploit, clever use of game mechanics, but at the end of the day all it is is a cheap tactic that’s taking advantage of an over-looked aspect of the game with the AOE Cap limit of 5 players in 1 clumped up area.

I guess all the players on the EU servers, who use this tactic regularly and have used it since beta, are cheap then?

You can use turtles all you want…noone on SBI/JQ hates you for it, we respect that you developed a new tactic to fight against. You were a little kitteny coming into the match, but I think over the course of the week all the servers gained respect for each other. It’s not a problem anymore. Except for one thing. Don’t kitten complain about 2v1. You might not notice it, but it happens to everyone. T1 isn’t some kiddie fight where if you’re getting attacking by someone the other server is going to help you by attacking the other server. People will do whatever they feel benefits themselves the most, be it not attacking certain towers, or both attacking the same target, and it’s something SBI has just come to accept. Complaining about 2v1 will do NOTHING except make your server look like spoiled crybabies.

Talesslaser.7813:

You can use turtles all you want…noone on SBI/JQ hates you for it, we respect that you developed a new tactic to fight against. You were a little kitteny coming into the match, but I think over the course of the week all the servers gained respect for each other. It’s not a problem anymore. Except for one thing. Don’t kitten complain about 2v1. You might not notice it, but it happens to everyone. T1 isn’t some kiddie fight where if you’re getting attacking by someone the other server is going to help you by attacking the other server. People will do whatever they feel benefits themselves the most, be it not attacking certain towers, or both attacking the same target, and it’s something SBI has just come to accept. Complaining about 2v1 will do NOTHING except make your server look like spoiled crybabies.

Again. BG didn’t develop the stacking tactic. It’s used on EU servers regularly. It just so happens that the group that started using it against you guys was the EU Alliance that transferred to BG a couple weeks ago.

Regarding 2v1, I’d humbly ask that you cut BG some slack on this one. This is the first time in T1 for the server since September 1st, and is the first competitive match the server has had in weeks. Players whining about 2v1 either don’t fully understand the flow of battle in WvW or don’t understand situations where it’s in the best interests of two servers to focus on the leader. 2v1s CAN happen, or are PERCEIVED to be happening. Either way, it’s legit and the core of BG WvWers understand this.

Liquid.9672:

Shift Focus.9083:

Yeah I agree with elderan… the turtle bomb won’t make your server any better looking to other servers, call it an exploit, clever use of game mechanics, but at the end of the day all it is is a cheap tactic that’s taking advantage of an over-looked aspect of the game with the AOE Cap limit of 5 players in 1 clumped up area.

I guess all the players on the EU servers, who use this tactic regularly and have used it since beta, are cheap then?

If you’d like to put it like that, then yes. i’ve seen plenty of times a server working hard to take down a tower, keep, etc then out of no where comes a portal bomb, completely wrecking the crap out of all the hard work within seconds, and with very little casualty on the bombing side, if any at all, because of the immunity to aoe (5 player cap limit) i’m sorry I see something wrong with an over looked game mechanic on arena net’s side being abused by a lot of people, can’t justify that tactic =)

My diplomatic solution to this is to give them a valid and tangible reason to hate, by killing as many of them as possible.

Violence really does solve everything in WvW.

What Xeeron said pretty much sums it up. Everyone in tier 1 is acutely aware of the bandwagon jumpers that flock to the new flavor of the week server. I’m not looking forward to their inevitable exodus to SBI.

You can’t control this. You aren’t to blame for the zerg of bad apples into your community. I fully realize there are great guilds and players on every server that just want a challenging fight.

However, you can control the attitude your community exudes. You can make the people who diminish your server’s integrity feel unwelcome. You can even go to the extent of self sabotage in order to get them to leave. It’s extreme, but I personally would rather lose our #1 NA ranking than win alongside exploiters. If necessary I’ll take a week off and PvE or sPvP instead.

Not everyone will share this commitment to a fair match-up. Not everyone will even be aware of poor sportsmanship when it does occur. Still, some guilds or community leaders need to step up and be a voice for fair play, and the extent to which you pursue this has an impact on the perception of your server.

I don’t claim to be privy to the attempts BG made to distance themselves from the zerg that plagued their server and soon will plague SBI. Maybe you guys worked really hard at it and it just didn’t work. Maybe we’re in for a rude awakening this week as we have to contend with the same thing HoD, JQ, and now BG have endured.

Until we get extended (30 day+) lockouts in WvW after transfer, this will be a recurring problem. Still, I don’t think it’s fair to call an entire server unscrupulous. Many times you are a victim of your own success.

I think more vocal leadership from BG guilds will erase the tarnish from your reputation. Orb removal will go a long way to reducing the animosity between servers too since the most blatent hacking (fly mode orb retrieval) just won’t be possible anymore.

You can’t control the cards you were dealt, but you can control how you play them.

cold.3946:

What Xeeron said pretty much sums it up. Everyone in tier 1 is acutely aware of the bandwagon jumpers that flock to the new flavor of the week server. I’m not looking forward to their inevitable exodus to SBI.

You can’t control this. You aren’t to blame for the zerg of bad apples into your community. I fully realize there are great guilds and players on every server that just want a challenging fight.

However, you can control the attitude your community exudes. You can make the people who diminish your server’s integrity feel unwelcome. You can even go to the extent of self sabotage in order to get them to leave. It’s extreme, but I personally would rather lose our #1 NA ranking than win alongside exploiters. If necessary I’ll take a week off and PvE or sPvP instead.

Not everyone will share this commitment to a fair match-up. Not everyone will even be aware of poor sportsmanship when it does occur. Still, some guilds or community leaders need to step up and be a voice for fair play, and the extent to which you pursue this has an impact on the perception of your server.

I don’t claim to be privy to the attempts BG made to distance themselves from the zerg that plagued their server and soon will plague SBI. Maybe you guys worked really hard at it and it just didn’t work. Maybe we’re in for a rude awakening this week as we have to contend with the same thing HoD, JQ, and now BG have endured.

Until we get extended (30 day+) lockouts in WvW after transfer, this will be a recurring problem. Still, I don’t think it’s fair to call an entire server unscrupulous. Many times you are a victim of your own success.

I think more vocal leadership from BG guilds will erase the tarnish from your reputation. Orb removal will go a long way to reducing the animosity between servers too since the most blatent hacking (fly mode orb retrieval) just won’t be possible anymore.

You can’t control the cards you were dealt, but you can control how you play them.

Thank you for a well thought out and unbiased response, this is pretty much the model for a response I was hoping for. It seems that what I have taken from this thread, is that us BG’ers should be more verbal on the forums and in our own communities about discouraging exploiting and trash talking in our own community. The Beastgate thing is whatever… All servers will get nicknames, I personally think it makes you sound like a 12 year old when you get all worked up over what a server calls themselves.

you have one person to thank for this. kefro. his posts for several weeks have done nothing but badmouth the casual wvw community, and pronounce blackgate as gods gift to wvw. as long as he is posting, blackgate will be considered the most cancerous thing to happen to t1.