Guild Wars 2

Its fine for EB, as it gives the lesser populated servers a chance to play that map.

However for a defending borderland its a pain in the rear end. Why should a invading force of 10 players get such an easy foothold?. If 10 players decide to attack another servers borderland they outta work for it rather then just smile at some epic boss and let it do all the work.

It dosnt really help either that if your already on a low pop server and 10 invaders start this break out event on your borderland. You cant defend against it.

If you have to make it easier to attack another servers borderland, just remove any chance to upgrade the two towers near their entrance. Just dont need the PvE for WvW.

Let Break-out event stay in EB and for borderland defenders only. Remove it as a mean to attack another servers borderland.

Am i wrong?.

I don’t really care since everyone can do this at every borderland, so it’s still equal.
However I do think the borderland’s defenders should have an advantage on their borderlands.

I’m not a fan of the breakout events on the borderlands but I don’t mind them either.

They should only be for your own home borderland tbh.

I agree, they should be for defending server BL only and maybe EB, but only maybe.

Break out is fine, it really helps when you get spawncamped and if you have enough siege and defenders in the first tower the BO-Commander will go down rather easy

I think many people are still missing the point of the breakout event.

It was never intended that you could “own” a borderland and push the enemy out. Each team was meant to have an advantage in their borderland, but every borderland was important because each one had an orb. No one could afford to leave a borderland alone, because that meant you were forfeiting an orb.

The meta changed when the orbs where removed. Suddenly, it made more sense to just concentrate on home because you have an advantage there. Everyone became focused on locking out the enemy, and holding the home BL. You only had to worry about two zones, your BL, and EB. Generally, you would only attack someone’s BL to force them to commit more troops to defend it.

This was an unintended result of the removal of orbs. Breakout events are meant to fix this. There is always supposed to be a battle (spawn camping does not count) in every map, so they made it easier to get started.

Does this make it harder to defend your home borderland? Yes, it is supposed to. Instead of focusing on cleansing the enemy completely off your home map, go to their map and divide their forces. The meta-game was changed intentionally. The old meta-game is not supposed to work anymore. That is the point.

titanlectro hit it on the spot. You’re not supposed to “lock-down” a borderland. It is originally designed that the neutral state of it be that each server own one keep and all have a similar share of territory across all borderlands. In the new form of play, the event doesn’t disrupt your gains particularly.

If a breakout event happens, you STILL have the greater quantity of territory, and the event only gets the enemy one single outpost. Also I’ve fought and held off the breakout event, and found it wasn’t as hard as holding off a zerg-scale assault under the same circumstances. The NPC commander is tough, but balanced by the lack of intelligence.

I think it’s balanced, and with it at least I know what I’m watching for from the enemy (though I wish I could approach enemy spawn and see an event marker since I can’t really look in).

Big fan of how it currently works. I would encourage more of these. Anything that brings players together in WvW is a huge win for WvW.

(minus PvE events in WvW)

titanlectro.5029:

I think many people are still missing the point of the breakout event.

It was never intended that you could “own” a borderland and push the enemy out. Each team was meant to have an advantage in their borderland, but every borderland was important because each one had an orb. No one could afford to leave a borderland alone, because that meant you were forfeiting an orb.

The meta changed when the orbs where removed. Suddenly, it made more sense to just concentrate on home because you have an advantage there. Everyone became focused on locking out the enemy, and holding the home BL. You only had to worry about two zones, your BL, and EB. Generally, you would only attack someone’s BL to force them to commit more troops to defend it.

This was an unintended result of the removal of orbs. Breakout events are meant to fix this. There is always supposed to be a battle (spawn camping does not count) in every map, so they made it easier to get started.

Does this make it harder to defend your home borderland? Yes, it is supposed to. Instead of focusing on cleansing the enemy completely off your home map, go to their map and divide their forces. The meta-game was changed intentionally. The old meta-game is not supposed to work anymore. That is the point.

Is there any way we can get just this post stickied so people will quit bringing this topic up. Very good explanation in this post.

titanlectro.5029:

It was never intended that you could “own” a borderland and push the enemy out.

Yep. It’s not meant to be easy to hold anything below Hills/Bay on your own borderland. The parts that are supposed to be easier to hold are Hills/Bay and everything north of that on your own borderland, plus the tower and camp in your particular corner of each of the other two borderlands. You should be taking that lower tower on the other two borderlands before trying to take and hold the harder lower towers on your own borderland.

I understand the “concept” of them not wanting people to own their own Borderlands, but that is just the reality of the situation, even with breakout events its not going to be solved.

They should have anticipated these things…the reality is the same situation other MMO’s have run into when implementing large scale PvP. Even with an EILO or other rating system, because of server transfers etc, you will almost always have servers that out man other servers significantly. The real issue is how to properly and effectively “Balance” things when you are outmanned. WoW tried it with their version of the outmanned buff that makes everyone else’s stat’s better in Wintergrasp.

No one in any game has yet to find a practical solution to being able to achieve this. If you buff one side you have to be careful not to make it too overpowering and on the other it has to be effective enough to help out the outmanned teams.

I always thought it would be interesting to have a specific number of “bot” NPC’s in a zone that were attacking, bringing supply or building siege in every zone, maybe 25-50. Pick a number, then as people start to come in and players populate the zone they depsawn for every person that joins. This NPC’s wouldn’t be super effective, but it would certainly help out people trying to enter the zone.

ok…break out event.

let me see if i get what you mad about.

you mad that a server that has no towers and keeps can get 1 tower with ease.

….you do know thats kinda the point.

to give them a foothold so you can’t spawn camp them.

the breakout event is fine as it is now, lets servers get a foothold with ease. now if it was giving them a keep i could understand. but this is just a tower. easy enough to take back.

and last i checked the breakout event has a short cooldown durign which time you can build siege.

the NPC commander isnt much of a threat(unless you crying that greatsword warrior is OP, in which case its something everyone has known for a while) and you can easily defeat the event by killing the 10 human players and then focusing on the commander.

they made this event for the exact thing its doing right now. look at it not from your point of view but from the server that is using it. to them this event is giving them a chance to gain a small foothold in a map where they are outmatched.

Hyde.6189:

titanlectro.5029:

It was never intended that you could “own” a borderland and push the enemy out.

Yep. It’s not meant to be easy to hold anything below Hills/Bay on your own borderland. The parts that are supposed to be easier to hold are Hills/Bay and everything north of that on your own borderland, plus the tower and camp in your particular corner of each of the other two borderlands. You should be taking that lower tower on the other two borderlands before trying to take and hold the harder lower towers on your own borderland.

This is correct. If you check the map right after reset, Defenders own Bay, Hills, and everything north of those. Invaders own the tower outside their spawn and the supply camp nearby. I believe the south supply camp starts neutral. Similarly, each server owns their third of EB and SMC starts neutral. In an even match, the map should look like it does at reset with SMC being the battle that decides the war. It was not intentional for Defenders to secure their BL and spawn camp the Invaders.

Break out is for the weak people with no brains… Thanks Anet for supporting kitten #8230; Get the freaking NPCs out of WvW we are there to fight players. Even move the NPC in towers keeps and SM.

@MasterDeluxe

I agree with you. Breakout events are not a solution to server imbalance. However, I don’t think that Anet ever intended for breakout events to fix server imbalance. I believe that their purpose was to change the meta-game, encouraging servers to fight for all four maps instead of only two.

I think that this misconception (That breakout events are for balance) is why some people keep freaking out about “PvE” in WvW. They see the NPC as a bot designed to bring balance. I see the NPC as a strategic asset, like being able to treb Bay from the Garrison. It gives you an advantage in certain situations. They could have implemented in a different way so it wouldn’t “feel” like a bot, but the effect is exactly the same.

Edit: I was not pointing this at you Morningstar, you just happened to post what I was talking about while I was writing.

The cooldown is little help to be honest. I don’t know what it is, but we had barely enough time to repair the walls and gates to our tower, before another server came marching back, less than five minutes later, with another Breakout event.

I don’t mind Breakout but, in its current state, it’s too much of a handicap; how much have the players themselves contributed besides building the siege and manning it? I was part of a Breakout event trying to take Greenbriar; the defending server had at least 20 people holed up in the tower and we were sure we weren’t going to be able to take it… But then Commander Siegerazer storms in, walks all over their group and clears them out, letting us basically go up to the lord room and cap the tower with little to no opposition.

Breakout events should make it easier for invading servers to gain a foothold in other borderlands, but not to the extent that it’s so inclined in their favour. There is little incentive to upgrade the southern towers now and people will more likely rely on Breakout events to gain a foothold, rather than using their brains and employing tactics and strategy.

Where before people had to go out, cap supply camps and employ initiative to gain towers, everyone can now afford to rely on Breakout events and not do any work. Atm, it’s only encouraging complacency.

Usagi.4835:

The cooldown is little help to be honest. I don’t know what it is, but we had barely enough time to repair the walls and gates to our tower, before another server came marching back, less than five minutes later, with another Breakout event.

I don’t mind Breakout but, in its current state, it’s too much of a handicap; how much have the players themselves contributed besides building the siege and manning it? I was part of a Breakout event trying to take Greenbriar; the defending server had at least 20 people holed up in the tower and we were sure we weren’t going to be able to take it… But then Commander Siegerazer storms in, walks all over their group and clears them out, letting us basically go up to the lord room and cap the tower with little to no opposition.

Breakout events should make it easier for invading servers to gain a foothold in other borderlands, but not to the extent that it’s so inclined in their favour. There is little incentive to upgrade the southern towers now and people will more likely rely on Breakout events to gain a foothold, rather than using their brains and employing tactics and strategy.

Where before people had to go out, cap supply camps and employ initiative to gain towers, everyone can now afford to rely on Breakout events and not do any work. Atm, it’s only encouraging complacency.

Yeah, the only things that might need to be changed about the breakout are balance on the strength of the commander (he’s a touch on the too strong side right now I’d say) and timing.

I don’t know if it’s intentional or a bug, but the times I’ve participated in breakouts, the commander is back and ready to start a new one before the first event is even complete. If a server manages to fight off a breakout, they should have at the very least a 15-30 minute reprieve from further attacks.

I saw a situation where we already owned the tower, but still had the NPC Commander at spawn ready to go.

At the very least, that shouldn’t happen.

Ultimately, I find the BO event to be a hamfisted, slapdash attempt to address legitimate gameplay issues.

I agree with Usagi. If you can defend the first time, there should be a cooldown of 30 minutes or so before the event happens again. If they can’t get it the first time, that should give defenders a chance to make any repairs/get more siege set up etc in preperation for the second assault. Good concept overall but it needs to be tweaked.