Guild Wars 2

For the sake of knowledge and discussion, I thought it would be a fun idea to start a thread based on builds that we like to fight and like to play, as well as hate to fight and hate to play.

If we describe things that give us difficulty, others who are more experienced can give tips on how to improve.

For example, I like to fight condition Mesmers when on my Warrior. Probably for obvious reasons but I find the fights very enjoyable because they tend to last quite a while and it can be a tug of war at times. I’ll get low then they’ll get low and it gets the heart racing.

I dislike fighting bunker Druids because they’re incredibly difficult to kill unless you have respectable access to CC’s and are very wise about timing their usage. I find it extremely unenjoyable to fight these builds as their reset potential is about as high, if not higher than a Thief’s and it feels like I’m putting way more effort in to the fight than they are.

If you have questions or gripes, write them here so we can learn some stuff from each other!

Note: This is speaking from a small scale/roaming perspective in case it wasn’t clear.

Condi Mesmers, and Warriors are by far the most overtuned faceroll classes atm and the most annoying to fight against. Second to that are bunker builds that don’t even bother fighting, they just nonchalantly walk into the nearest building even if its miles away tanking everything you throw at them(classes like bunker DH/Ele/Druid/Etc).

condi mesmers are ridiculous.

first come all the builds that chain invuln, blocks, evade, stealth, mobility.. most noticeably stealth mesmers, d/p & d/d thief, evasion thief, ghost thief, evasion ranger, certain rev builds, certain dh builds and last but not least stealth scrapper, to an extent also species of my own class – berserker warriors with double endure pain & traited shield.

then i hate every single and last condition burst build. burn guard, condi necro, condi thief.. etc.

most enjoyable fights on warrior are:
other power warriors, staff daredevil, elementalist, power engi, power ranger.

.. duelling outside spvp (cant talk about spvp) went down the drain hand in hand with all the other bad design decisions, most noticeably, but not exclusively with HoT. too much paper, rock, scissors, too much cheese as described above and balance overall is just terrible terrible terrible atm in WvW.

any build that can dish out a lot of dmg while being tanky

Tanky as hell, dodge and run spam druid, I don’t mind condi chrono or bunker tempest, but the insta reset druid is annoying af :/

Jayden Ennok.3687:

any build that can dish out a lot of dmg while being tanky

^

Condi trapper thieves because you cant “fight” them.

Dislike to fight: Condi mesmers and perma stealth condi trapper thieves (if those still exist).
The last build doesn’t give me much trouble since I have reveal but lets be honest, these 2 builds take cheesy to the next level.

I hate to fight Condi Warriors and Condi Reapers, because they hardcounter me.

I faceroll Condi Mesmers, Dragonhunters and Scrappers (because of NCSY!) and deal enough damage to force any Daredevil to retreat after 2 Seconds.

Build: Full Zerk D/Wh Power Reaper with shouts (YSIM!, Suffer!, NCSY!, CTTB!) and Rune of the Trooper.

I hate fighting (meta) scrapper the most. Too many passives, defensive skills and boons. The only thing, that makes them bearable is the fact that i don’t have to fight them, because they lack ranged pressure and chasing potential. Unfortunately many other common builds are not very fun to fight for similar reasons – passives and (defensive) boons. Most condi builds counter my own build, so those are not my favourite matchups either, but it is mostly because of my own build, not because i dislike condis in general (I definitely prefer condi engi over the typical power scrapper).

I like fighting (mostly) thieves, mesmers, to some extent warriors and (non-retri) revs, and some rare “non-meta” builds of other classes.

PvP specs. The class doesn’t matter. I get melted by PvP players who come to WvW.

The nearer a WvW build is to a PvP build, the less I can cope with it.

Playing as a Condi Necro, I find Thieves and Warriors as the worst match-ups, with equal skill it’s usually a win for them, but I still find the Thief being the bigger thorn in my shoes, because of their mobility and reset potential is just too annoying to deal with as a Necro, at least with a condi build. Burst Mesmers can also be very dangerous but thankfully they’re not as common.

Surprisingly, it’s usually a favorable match-up against every other profession with a natural tendency to counter condi builds which is what necro is godly at. Still, good Scrappers can give me a run for my money and some Druids are exceptionally difficult to beat, Dragonhunters are also becoming a threat due to the recent buffs and can put out a lot of pressure. Revs are usually a free kill unless they manage to pressure me enough and deal with my condi burst with their well timed heal and cleanse (Mallyx can somehow give them a slight edge if they have enough boons to cover their resistance but I run traited signets and traited spinal shivers so it’s usually not an issue for me).

I tend to avoid solo roaming as Necro because its mobility makes it very difficult to juke large groups running in your way or other havoc groups looking for fights, so I usually run with at least anoter guildie or two and that’s where I see Necro being a genuine threat, what they lack in sheer mobility, they make it up in fighting prowess with the right tools.

All HoT builds

Dislike Playing: Tanky wet noodle builds.
Like Playing: Greatsword, Sword/Axe; Greatsword,Rifle; Greatsword,Sword/Warhorn Warrior.

Like Fighting: Everything.

Dislike Generally: complaining about builds being both tanky and damaging when tankiness is just a way of dealing with damage like stealth, evading attacks, attacking from range, etc. Griping about warrior builds doing damage while being tanky is like complaining that elementalists can do damage from range or that thieves can do damage and stealth. It is nonsensical.

Sustain Druids are a pain. I also can’t handle mesmers very well.

I like fighting against warriors and guardians.

My fights fall into three categories

• I can’t kill them; they can’t kill me — one of us leaves (usually me — I’d rather do something other than 1:1 for 10 minutes)
• They know even less about 1v1 than I do and they die. Great, I get bags, dance the llama, and we both move on.
• They know more about 1v1 and I die. Sad, since they get the bags, dance the skritt, and we both move on.

The only time I care is if the opponent camps a particular spot — and that’s just because it annoys me personally. It’s a legit WvW tactic.

tl;dr like everyone else, I prefer winning, so it’s less about the build, more about the opponent.

Thelgar.7214:

Dislike Playing: Tanky wet noodle builds.
Like Playing: Greatsword, Sword/Axe; Greatsword,Rifle; Greatsword,Sword/Warhorn Warrior.

Like Fighting: Everything.

Dislike Generally: complaining about builds being both tanky and damaging when tankiness is just a way of dealing with damage like stealth, evading attacks, attacking from range, etc. Griping about warrior builds doing damage while being tanky is like complaining that elementalists can do damage from range or that thieves can do damage and stealth. It is nonsensical.

Is it? I’m not convinced. Perhaps all classes should have access to all forms of stealth/self-water+blast/blinks/range/clones/portal/etc, but via class-unique mechanics.

Those condi mesmers give me fits. Other than that, like Illconcieved said, its more about the player then the class and build.

I like to play what need a lot of active play to survive and doesn’t rely on spamming 1111111.

I dislike encounters with builds that can be summed like: invul, invul, invul, block, block, block, evade, evade, evade, dodge, dodge… stealth… followed by what seems like a 5 sec window to attack them when they emerge from stealth before they rinse and repeat all the BS above. It get worst when half of it is auto-triggered…

IDK how ppl stand playing that. It has to be so boring to ride a bike you can’t fall of because it’s has 8 wheels and 3 spare chutes on it… The adrenaline must be flowing for sure…

Mostly roaming:

• condi mesmer – My build (power rifle engi) only has 1 condi cleanse on a 20s cd; cannot compete at all. Furthermore, my defense is mostly mobility and using lots of active skills, so I am especially screwed by confusion and torment.

• thieves – balanced, but unfair. They can always get away 1v1, so they’re no fun. If they know what they’re doing, you cannot win because they’ll always escape to 20000 range and reset the fight if it’s going badly for them. Also, basilisk venom being unblockable is a huge pain because I rely on gear shield to block, so even if I see them coming with venoms up, I can’t do kitten about it.

• Invuln zerkers – 0 0 0 0 0 invuln invuln invuln block block block 0 0 0 0 resistance for ~15 seconds. Meanwhile, they’re faster than you, do more damage, and have like an hour of stability. You have to wait a LOOOOONG time for an opening. It’s just no fun to play against. I basically have to run away for a full minute before finally turning around to attack them and by that point some of their invuln cooldowns are up again.

Svarty.8019:

Thelgar.7214:

Dislike Playing: Tanky wet noodle builds.
Like Playing: Greatsword, Sword/Axe; Greatsword,Rifle; Greatsword,Sword/Warhorn Warrior.

Like Fighting: Everything.

Dislike Generally: complaining about builds being both tanky and damaging when tankiness is just a way of dealing with damage like stealth, evading attacks, attacking from range, etc. Griping about warrior builds doing damage while being tanky is like complaining that elementalists can do damage from range or that thieves can do damage and stealth. It is nonsensical.

Is it? I’m not convinced. Perhaps all classes should have access to all forms of stealth/self-water+blast/blinks/range/clones/portal/etc, but via class-unique mechanics.

A uni-class concept with mechanics separated from themes? Kind of like Champions pen-and-paper RPG Is really interesting. But not equivalent to wanting to limit one class in multiple class system from having damage capability because it, like the other classes has a defensive mechanism.

Dislike: double post

coro.3176:

Mostly roaming:

• condi mesmer – My build (power rifle engi) only has 1 condi cleanse on a 20s cd; cannot compete at all. Furthermore, my defense is mostly mobility and using lots of active skills, so I am especially screwed by confusion and torment.

• thieves – balanced, but unfair. They can always get away 1v1, so they’re no fun. If they know what they’re doing, you cannot win because they’ll always escape to 20000 range and reset the fight if it’s going badly for them. Also, basilisk venom being unblockable is a huge pain because I rely on gear shield to block, so even if I see them coming with venoms up, I can’t do kitten about it.

• Invuln zerkers – 0 0 0 0 0 invuln invuln invuln block block block 0 0 0 0 resistance for ~15 seconds. Meanwhile, they’re faster than you, do more damage, and have like an hour of stability. You have to wait a LOOOOONG time for an opening. It’s just no fun to play against. I basically have to run away for a full minute before finally turning around to attack them and by that point some of their invuln cooldowns are up again.

If you’re squishy and the Thief is squishy, it’s all about denying those sneak attacks and counter pressuring their heals. As soon as they Withdraw or Channeled Vigor, lay the damage in to them immediately after. When I had an Engineer, I found it was effective to respond to their stealth with my own stealth by using a Toss Elixir S followed by a Magnet as soon as they became visible again.

Also, when a Thief retreats, you should too. Don’t chase them, back off and recover. Let them decide if they want to come back to re-engage you. You know they’re there and you’ll see them coming which means they won’t have the advantage of a surprise attack.

Thieves are a lot less scary when you show them that you’re not falling for their baits and kites. If you teach them that you’re the one in control of the fight, most of them will stubbornly buzz around you like a fly until they push their luck too far. It’s the ones that know they have limits that you should be afraid of. The ones that know when they’re beat so they disengage completely until they can jump you when you’re not prepared.

Thieves. Just outright hate them, especially those who gank in front of keeps or the spawn point.

Ni In.6578:

Thieves. Just outright hate them, especially those who gank in front of keeps or the spawn point.

Since Thief WvW build is the same as Thief PvP build. It’s easy for them to make the transition between game-types.

The good tips from Spell above are a good, but I just don’t think they’ll stop anybody dying. The fact is that people can’t switch from 1v1 build to zerg v zerg build quickly enough – and the thief doesn’t have to.

It’s not that thieves are particularly overpowered. They’re not. It’s just an unfair fight.

If I screw up and take too much damage, I will die. The thief can catch up because their mobility is 3x as good as any other class. If the thief screws up and takes too much damage, they stealth or escape out of range. In order for me to win, I need to kill the thief in one burst. The thief can just keep resetting until they eventually catch me off guard.

coro.3176:

It’s not that thieves are particularly overpowered. They’re not. It’s just an unfair fight.

The thing with being a thief is that mistakes are not easy to recover from. There aren’t many second chances on that class. These days it feels high risk, low reward… trust me as there was a time when every post in this thread would begin and end with Thief.

If you think running into a thief is difficult as a non-thief… wait till you play a thief. Go in to test the metal of an opponent, jump back from the fight only to get descended upon by other thieves. Thieves are cannibalistic more so than any other class. Thieves kill each other far easier than they can kill just about any other class… and they do so at a good clip.

Condi Mesmer, Bunker *

So currently playing base power shatter mesmer not these HoT classes and quite frankly all HoT specs are a pain in the backside. The only thing I can reliably beat without having to focus too hard is reaper and power eles. Everything else is much more dangerous and a split second not focusing will lead to me downing.

Daredevils are a pita for me because they break target lock so much and shut down power mesmer so effectively. Especially the ones running bandits defense as they can negate my burst every time while shutting down clones/phantasms with stealth.

Dragonhunters, warriors, revs, scrappers and druids are pains for obvious reasons, they can out sustain and have a number of auto procs to mitigate my burst.

When I go chrono with the build I posted on the mesmer forums I can go toe to toe with a lot of these builds as I get more blocks and CC from the shield which really helps. When playing chrono I find power berserkers more fun to fight and can make condi mesmers re-evaluate their choice of EZ build. Druids are much more manageable as I have enough CC and powerblock will lock them out of their sustain.

apharma.3741:

So currently playing base power shatter mesmer not these HoT classes and quite frankly all HoT specs are a pain in the backside. The only thing I can reliably beat without having to focus too hard is reaper and power eles. Everything else is much more dangerous and a split second not focusing will lead to me downing.

Daredevils are a pita for me because they break target lock so much and shut down power mesmer so effectively. Especially the ones running bandits defense as they can negate my burst every time while shutting down clones/phantasms with stealth.

Dragonhunters, warriors, revs, scrappers and druids are pains for obvious reasons, they can out sustain and have a number of auto procs to mitigate my burst.

When I go chrono with the build I posted on the mesmer forums I can go toe to toe with a lot of these builds as I get more blocks and CC from the shield which really helps. When playing chrono I find power berserkers more fun to fight and can make condi mesmers re-evaluate their choice of EZ build. Druids are much more manageable as I have enough CC and powerblock will lock them out of their sustain.

It saddens me that this truly is the state of small scale WvW. I prefer my core specs on all my classes and it sucks that there are so many fights I know I could win had I just taken the elite spec instead.

I main a standard pew pew Ranger and although I win a good share of my fights, I’m always giving it 110% in those fights. I have to be so on the ball or I’m toast in a heart beat. Last night was a very good example of that – Usually Warriors are easy for me because I can kite them so effectively. As long as I sheath my bow when they’re blocking so I don’t get reflected, it’s no problem. But this Warrior last night got close enough to me to hit me just one time and that was enough to cost me the fight. He hit me with a Rush because I had been clumsy with my Swoop kiting and I lost 70% of my health. After that, I wasn’t able to tank anything else and he only needed to hit me one more time to win, which he did.

I enjoy the challenge of being at a bit of a disadvantage but I don’t enjoy feeling like my losses could have been avoided based on something other than skill. There are just so many fights since HoT where going Druid or Reaper would have easily saved me a death instead of being a better player.

condi mesmers are a pain and seem quite unbalaced in WvW small scale or 1:1 combat.

Since they are not fun to play with/against, I’ll call this thread the nerf list. On the nerf list is certainly Warrior, Mesmer, and Druid.

It was supposed to be a constructive thread but knowing this community, I shouldn’t have expected anything other than complaints. QQ away I guess.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

apharma.3741:

So currently playing base power shatter mesmer not these HoT classes and quite frankly all HoT specs are a pain in the backside. The only thing I can reliably beat without having to focus too hard is reaper and power eles. Everything else is much more dangerous and a split second not focusing will lead to me downing.

Daredevils are a pita for me because they break target lock so much and shut down power mesmer so effectively. Especially the ones running bandits defense as they can negate my burst every time while shutting down clones/phantasms with stealth.

Dragonhunters, warriors, revs, scrappers and druids are pains for obvious reasons, they can out sustain and have a number of auto procs to mitigate my burst.

When I go chrono with the build I posted on the mesmer forums I can go toe to toe with a lot of these builds as I get more blocks and CC from the shield which really helps. When playing chrono I find power berserkers more fun to fight and can make condi mesmers re-evaluate their choice of EZ build. Druids are much more manageable as I have enough CC and powerblock will lock them out of their sustain.

It saddens me that this truly is the state of small scale WvW. I prefer my core specs on all my classes and it sucks that there are so many fights I know I could win had I just taken the elite spec instead.

I main a standard pew pew Ranger and although I win a good share of my fights, I’m always giving it 110% in those fights. I have to be so on the ball or I’m toast in a heart beat. Last night was a very good example of that – Usually Warriors are easy for me because I can kite them so effectively. As long as I sheath my bow when they’re blocking so I don’t get reflected, it’s no problem. But this Warrior last night got close enough to me to hit me just one time and that was enough to cost me the fight. He hit me with a Rush because I had been clumsy with my Swoop kiting and I lost 70% of my health. After that, I wasn’t able to tank anything else and he only needed to hit me one more time to win, which he did.

I enjoy the challenge of being at a bit of a disadvantage but I don’t enjoy feeling like my losses could have been avoided based on something other than skill. There are just so many fights since HoT where going Druid or Reaper would have easily saved me a death instead of being a better player.

A few of us have gone back to core builds and created a guild called You Are Getting Carried By [HoT]. Going around destroying groups running the HoT specs is a bit of an uphill struggle sometimes especially when you come into a group of a few condi reapers, condi berserkers and a daredevil/DH providing spike power damage.

The most annoying outnumbered fight last night was 2-3 chronos with 3 daredevils which constantly spiked and stealthed with stealth rezzing everytime we downed one, when numbers evened up we killed them easily but certainly not an easy 2v1.

-Condi mesmers: They need some special attention
-Condi thieves: especially the ones that burst while invisible
-Warriors: This was insane. I can’t believe it completely dodged the nerf bat.
-Cheese Druids: The ones that kite and 111111 you to death with staff while their pet does stupid damage and is too bulky/dodgy to kill before the recharge finishes. They also have incredible healing.
-Reapers: I feel bad for them
-Reflect spam vs bow: Some builds naturally have way too much reflect
-1 shot builds: Fun to play as. Terrible to play against.
-Gank squads: Fun to play as. Not fun to get steamrolled by.

Warrior because it takes a month before you can even start damaging them. Then you have to try to catch up to them.

classes with stealth, most stupid mechanic in GW2

Condi Mesmers have been incredibly strong since release. They had a few months a long ways back where they weren’t completely dominant but for the longest time they have been the best or nearly so dueling and small scale fighting class.

Mesmers in small scale along with Guardians in large scale have essentially dominated GW2 WvW in their respective roles. I guess it is no surprise both are relatively easy to play.

Druids… Rangers were so horrible for so long I kinda feel this is their due.

Daredevils: there is absolutely not a single imaginable justification to have immobilize removed on dodge (not to mention the perma evades themselves) since immoblize itself is the natural counter to a class that is constantly moving. And the ability to basically instantly teleport yourself out of combat range making it entirely impossible to catch them.

Warriors: passive immunities combined with a ridiculously overpowered passive health regeneration, passive condition removal, motherkittening +1000 toughness after breaking stun (which you have tons of) combined with the toughness of having heavy armor and the base health of warriors while dealing a kitten ton of damage with berserk gear AND the ability to simply run away from almost anything in case this hasn’t been enaugh yet.

What I “like” playing against? I don’t care as long as it takes skill to master. A well played engineer or berserker mesmer requires a lot of skill so I don’t mind being crushed by them.
If necros had some stability it would actually be viable again but they are just so weak right now.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

It was supposed to be a constructive thread but knowing this community, I shouldn’t have expected anything other than complaints. QQ away I guess.

Yeah, I liked the idea of it. Sorry I complained about the complaints.

• condi mesmers: the confusion buff was insane, too much passive condi application, the mesmer only needs to do nothing.

• perma-stealth thieves. Every single class in this game needs a trait or skill that can counter that in a effective manner (aoes, reveal, hard CCs). I still cant get whay there is a mechanic that allow someone to burst you dead while staying invisible.

• perma defy-the-pain warriors: the last buff just made that class silly. It’s 10 seconds inmmunity while they deal a ton of damage and after that they will use the shield and blocks that allow them to heal a ton with the signet.

• ultra bunker druids. Druids needs more viable builds than go for the classic bunker “let the pet do my job”.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

It was supposed to be a constructive thread but knowing this community, I shouldn’t have expected anything other than complaints. QQ away I guess.

when the pvp aspect of this game is more or less balanced then you will have what you asked for. Until then is completely normal for the people to point out thw faults in the system.

I fight what I see and run from what I choose to run from.

The only WvWers that annoy me are the pond scum that abuse and then block people.

The enemy I can live with.

Thief’s regardless of build. I actually like the class but they just seem to be played by real scum bags, the kind that roam 3+ and insta gank or my favourite ones that let you solo a camp and jump in while your hp is low to finish you.
I don’t even bother engaging druids anymore as it’s just a waste of time.
Now that wvw is like 80% dragon hunters they are also becoming tedious, teleport trap burst, invuln invuln block block rinse repeat over and over.
Other than that I don’t mind anything else.

Edit revenants

Straegen.2938:

Thieves are cannibalistic more so than any other class. Thieves kill each other far easier than they can kill just about any other class… and they do so at a good clip.

Truer words were never spoken. Some of my non-thief friends just don’t understand it, but any time another thief is in a fight…

TakeCare.3182:

Straegen.2938:

Thieves are cannibalistic more so than any other class. Thieves kill each other far easier than they can kill just about any other class… and they do so at a good clip.

Truer words were never spoken. Some of my non-thief friends just don’t understand it, but any time another thief is in a fight…

Shatter mesmer is super cannibalistic too

Condi Chrono, Condi PU mes, Condi teef
I don’t mind condition classes, but these guys have no burst, it’s just all sustained high damage that after a little while you just can’t really do anything against. No skill in playing it, no joy to fight against it.

I /do/ like good thieves! Dueled a D/P teef the other night that absolutely destroyed me and it was a ton of fun. Good thieves are rare, but they are a scary thing.

I should say, I do love fighting a good non-stance/invuln Warrior. Rifle Engi vs Warrior is an awesome duel – trading cc’s and damage and blocks and dodges. It’s what the game should be about rather than condi cheese and invulns for days.

Dislike playing as and fighting against Staff Druid. I think it’s because the relative effort you have to put in to kill the Druid compared to what the Druid has to do is enormous. I just can’t bear to use staff in any of my builds anymore.

Also dislike fighting and playing as D/P thieves because it really is overtuned. So much damage just from basically auto-attacking and shadow shotting. Just nothing like the class I once enjoyed.

Like playing as and fighting against interrupt Mesmer because it’s one of the last things in the game that feels like it requires some effort from the player. When I win on an interrupt build I actually feel like it’s because of something I did rather than just because of certain traits I happen to have. Fighting against a decent interrupt Mesmer is a joy because it takes some decent knowledge (at least for GW2) to know what types of interrupts should be used and what key skills must be interrupted to succeed.

Ah see, the last few answers are what I’m talking about.

Despite the immense levels of faceroll builds and casual friendly stuff, there are still things that are a pleasure to fight, win or lose.

I can tell when someone is better than I am pretty quickly and if I happen to beat them I always /salute. If more people join, I back up so I can appreciate and study them from afar. Nothing to do with honor (because I’ve got none of it, lol) but everything to do with admiration. Since I’m partially disabled, the level of skill I can achieve can only get so high. When I see someone who I recognize as being very talented, I enjoy whispering them to compliment them and watching them toy with other players if I see them on the field.

I remember watching and making friends with this Mesmer who was full zerk and kiting around almost 10 people, slowly killing them one by one. Someone says in map “WHO THE FxCK IS THIS GUY.”

Or this Thief that seemed to have an obsession with contesting keep waypoints but was obnoxiously good at it. Had small zergs trying to kill this guy but he knew his profession inside and out. Was abusing vertical mobility to the absolute extreme and it was hilarious to watch. I had to whisper and compliment.

A Ranger who was tanking inside a supply camp for a good 30minutes. Watched him kill at least a dozen people and sometimes 3 or 4 at once. This was pre-HoT so no Druid and if I recall, he was also full melee.

And a Necromancer that always wound up dying after getting overwhelmed but he always went out with a bang. So many times I would see this guy juking and kiting 5 – 10 people around until there were just too many for him to handle. I don’t care if he always wound up getting stomped, the amount of practice this guy must have had with Necro to be able to take on that many people without Reaper is just mind boggling.

I love finding players like this because it’s just enjoyable to watch them/get beat by them.