Guild Wars 2

TL/DR: Live, built-in voice chat would support better team-play, coordination, and community quality in WvW, PvP, and Dungeons/Fractals for people who are “moderates” and for whom TeamSpeak represents a major hurdle to cooperation.

I spoke with the WvW/PvP/Balance community lead from ANet this past Saturday at the GW2 party during PAX. I expressed some of this request there, but wanted to follow up with more detail.

GW2 is an exceptionally cooperative game, and lack of built-in voice chat creates barriers to successful enjoyment of a lot of content. The value of built-in voice chat for “instanced” environments such as dungeons, where there is a large learning curve for speed runs and people tend to be from different guilds, etc., should be self-evident. I think it would be a HUGE improvement to be able to coordinate with voice when running dungeons, especially now that we have a group finder. Given that I hope this is self-evident, I will focus on WvW.

I am a “moderate” WvW player. I love the format. Love my Necro and Engi, and I find that good battles are even great when part of the zerg WHEN ABLE TO LISTEN TO COMMANDER COMMS.

That’s just it. Unless you get TS, login to the right server, get verified, etc., you are sunk. You cannot listen to your commander and are left to chase after PIN. Groups of classes with specific jobs, such as Well Necros, cannot coordinate. It is kind of a mess, really. I’m not saying that mindless zerging can’t be fun, just that it isn’t nearly as rewarding as well-executed WvW.

I propose a WvW voice function that enables anyone in a live server map to participate. Here is how it would work.

A chat function, similar to how the built-in voice chat function worked on LOTRO, would be built into WvW. In that way, anyone would automatically join the channel for listening purposes, but would have to manually enable the speaking function.

Ideally, then, commanders could sort their armies into raid groups (which should be supported along with the tag changes).

Combating Abuse: yes, trolls will be trolls. A “Mute” function would be important so people could mute them.

Benefits:

WvW is great and unique. It has fantastic potential, but full enjoyment feels somewhat inaccessible to a lot of players who aren’t able to participate and build battlefield relationships without an annoying process of logging into TS. I KNOW that some people will say that “anyone who cares will login” or that people just should login anyway, but they clearly don’t. Audit the zerg numbers vs. the TS numbers and you can see that. Plus I have to get re-verified after every TS reset.

I hope that y’all will consider this request. I have lots more ideas on implementation, but this post is long enough! I think it would be great to roll out in WvW, PvP, and Dungeons/Fractals and could help GW2 get even better.

Thanks!

Derrick the Red, Jade Quarry
Pelaera (PvE Main, Guardian)
Pel Jubylee (WvW Main, Necro)

i suggested it few times and still nothing , just look at their development time .
-they wont develop it
-they will and release it after 3 years (2017 yh voice communication in multiplayer game yhhh)

I would much rather stick to using TS3. If there was only a single voice channel per WvW map than trying to run multiple groups would be a pain. It’s not uncommon to see two different groups running hammer/anvil on the same map.

On another note, there’s enough lag when two full map blobs are fighting to add VoIP traffic to the same network.

squad should be different voice channel or they can just stay in guild channel

Crius.5487:

I would much rather stick to using TS3. If there was only a single voice channel per WvW map than trying to run multiple groups would be a pain. It’s not uncommon to see two different groups running hammer/anvil on the same map.

Just like GW2 messaging a decent system would have commander, guild and party chat options.

Crius.5487:

On another note, there’s enough lag when two full map blobs are fighting to add VoIP traffic to the same network.

Lag is generally a component of performance not bandwidth. Besides these types of systems can be run from a different hosting environment.

Crius.5487:

I would much rather stick to using TS3. If there was only a single voice channel per WvW map than trying to run multiple groups would be a pain. It’s not uncommon to see two different groups running hammer/anvil on the same map.

On another note, there’s enough lag when two full map blobs are fighting to add VoIP traffic to the same network.

I do understand, but some responses. First, there would ideally be more than a single voice channel for squads. Second, you could still use TS if you wanted, but the zerg commander could command better with the built-in voice. Third, I am not sure it would make any difference to lag, depending on how it is built-in. You are using TS on your network anyway.

Thanks!

The servers already have a hard time with the traffic as it is

Just to clarify, I’m not referring to low frame rates as lag. If you are having frame rate issues that is a client side performance issue. I am referring to the massive skill lag everyone experiences when full map blobs are fighting each other. This skill lag is from high volumes of traffic on the server and it is not an issue with the client. Adding VoIP traffic on top of what is already a bogged down network would only make things worse.

Just to clarify one last time, I am referring to ANet’s network, not my own.

why everybodys assume that the voip servers needs to run on the same servers that the “worlds” run?

Map-wide voice chat integrated into the game would be terrible. Private voip servers offer much more in the way of features and control than any in-game system ever would.

Blix.8021:

Map-wide voice chat integrated into the game would be terrible. Private voip servers offer much more in the way of features and control than any in-game system ever would.

You are making the assumption that a game like GW2 would roll their own. ANet certainly has the resources to license the technology from a company such as TeamSpeak itself.

yanniell.1236:

why everybodys assume that the voip servers needs to run on the same servers that the “worlds” run?

Exactly.

For a long time players had to use a third party site for finding groups and now Anet is calling their vanity edition commander tags “big changes”. Let’s be realistic, it ain’t happening.

God no! Having people chatting about things they find extremely important which mostly is about peeing corners and telling how great they are and how noobish everyone else is, and my god i can just imagine all the raging kids in dungeons or the like as if anyone had the slightest interest in hearing what raging people have to say.
No just No! Is not even a slightly hesitation from my side. If i want to do dungeons and chat, i do it with my friends and join proper ts channel for it and have fun.
Public channel with total strangers, just no!

Woah woah woah! Hold your horses OP!

If things like coloured commander tags, golem mastery, anti-siege grenades and all the other junk that we’ll be getting on the 9th is considered by the devs to be mmajor “features”; then what you are talking about is more like a kittening expansion! It might as well be considered a whole new game!

This “feature” pack is lamer than April’s!

Some of these replies are a bit silly.

1) I don’t want to have voice chat in dungeons because I don’t want to talk to other people. Ok…yeah…probably you rage as well when new groups fail. Part of the problem is that people don’t talk and it can be hard for newer folks. Oh yeah, you can also turn off voice chat.

2) “Anet can’t handle it.” They probably can. The server stuff is all an engineering problem, and those can be solved.

I am honestly a little surprised to hear these negative responses, but then I remember how people also whine about everything ANet does.

One other note: all this stuff about “private servers being better” misses the point. THOSE SERVERS ARE PRIVATE. Most people in this game do not play 8 hours/day. I play a lot, and my average is 2.5 or so/day and there are lots of folks for whom a bit of assistance through voice chat would be welcome.

Anyway, just thoughts…

no built-in voice comm pls. the servers are already lagging as hell. use 3rd party voice comm for that.

Crius.5487:

I am referring to the massive skill lag everyone experiences when full map blobs are fighting each other. This skill lag is from high volumes of traffic on the server and it is not an issue with the client.

Skill lag – a persistent small delay in skill activation in large fights is caused by computational load on the servers, not networking load.

Network lag has different symptoms – rubber banding and impassible portals are the most common, and a total lack of response to any action is also common.

Get real – no new wvw maps, dungeons, weapon types, skills. or even basic fixes, but they have time and $$ for this? Isn’t going to happen….

azizul.8469:

no built-in voice comm pls. the servers are already lagging as hell. use 3rd party voice comm for that.

Voice comm built in would not have to increase server lag at all…there are lots of replies to this…

Even if Anet were to license technology from TS3 etc. the problem is community voice comms would still have the advantage of being player-moderated instead of Anet moderated. (It’s nice to be able to control who can listen as well as speak.) My concern is it’d be harder to bring new players into a private server TS if voice comms were already built in.

Baron Oakley.1539:

Even if Anet were to license technology from TS3 etc. the problem is community voice comms would still have the advantage of being player-moderated instead of Anet moderated. (It’s nice to be able to control who can listen as well as speak.)

Big advantage of baked in comms include the ability to essentially eliminate cross server spying and significantly better accessibility by players. They could also setup squad/guild channel moderation allowing primaries (commander) to have priority speaking automatically. Add in the ability to boot players from a squad by the commander and we have an easy to moderate system.

I do know the downside which to me is moderating foul/abusive language in open channels but many other games already have methods of handling this.

Straegen.2938:

Baron Oakley.1539:

Even if Anet were to license technology from TS3 etc. the problem is community voice comms would still have the advantage of being player-moderated instead of Anet moderated. (It’s nice to be able to control who can listen as well as speak.)

Big advantage of baked in comms include the ability to essentially eliminate cross server spying and significantly better accessibility by players. They could also setup squad/guild channel moderation allowing primaries (commander) to have priority speaking automatically. Add in the ability to boot players from a squad by the commander and we have an easy to moderate system.

I do know the downside which to me is moderating foul/abusive language in open channels but many other games already have methods of handling this.

I think you are right about spying and moderating. Again, details that can be worked out, but the advantages are there.

WvW and Spvp are pretty much in “open beta” so i wouldnt expect this. And the amount of trolling that happens in this game is pretty high so this would be abused so much.

I would rather anet focus their attention elsewhere instead of something that can be solved from a 3rd party system.

Derrick the Red.1348:

azizul.8469:

no built-in voice comm pls. the servers are already lagging as hell. use 3rd party voice comm for that.

Voice comm built in would not have to increase server lag at all…there are lots of replies to this…

the voice comm would still eats up the company’s internet bandwidth (or whatever terms you call it), which could have been used for improving the gaming experience.

again, use 3rd party for that…

zerg fights :

if all know their role in zerg fights then there is not any need for any com , but most of the times in zerg fights coming players for farming and everyone knows these players press only the 1 key . commanders can not make them press their skills or to not spread out from the fight , except to loose their voices demanding every single time specific skills.

personal when i am playing my engineer or my ele in zerg fights i know when and where the zerg need the waterfield ( i have always the commander in my target ) and i blast it alone , because i know that there is always the risk someone else place other field on top before the blasting from others.

it is a working method and i help a lot my zergs and we win most of the times ,even outnumbered

guild fights :

they have their com service . nothing to see here

havoc parties :

same as above , inside a party almost the ctrl+T is more than enough for a party leader

roamers :

they open the skype or the streaming service and they socialize as much they want

for me , there is not a single reason for a com service from anet . people in server ts most of the times want to socialize and not to use it for the fights . even when i just staying to our server ts to hear what attacked the warnings in ts can not heared because someone else is speaking this time and he is telling us the story of his life and the scouter must say it again and again until someone understand of give him attention .the same time someone else linked multiple times the tower that attacked and all in map knows what is attacked including the wvw guilds that don’t using our server ts ( they have their com service )

Built in voip could be the part of a good step forward. Upgraded commanding and squad features. And if it runs on an other server it wont make any lag. Turning on/off could be a simple menu button or even a hotkey. Mute/unmute players on a tab where you can select players with active voip (like in TS)

Interesting to see this come up.

I’ve mentioned Vivox a couple times here. All clients using it point to Vivox’s cloud, not the game’s, for the various comms. And is usually able to turn off with one click.

Does not even need integration: C3 is a free voice client system that is part of the Vivox cloud. Just need a halfhearted nod from ArenaNet or NCSoft (the latter I still see as TBA on Vivox’s customer list).

We are talking around in circles. ANet can buy a 3rd party license which uses 3rd party resources. Someone mentioned Vivox which is a great example.

AAA modern online games should have it baked in especially since the entire “server” concept should die. Tracking in that outdated poor design decision was clearly a mistake they are working to fix which means 3rd party voice comms will be pretty ineffective outside of guilds. Just look at EotM…. 3rd party voice comm is effectively useless there.

I’ll always throw my support into built in voice chat. If Anet wants to make life much easier for newbies, this is one of the ways to do it. Yes, there are some logistical issues to consider (guild chat having appropriate management tools for officers, as an in-game example) but I don’t believe they are reasons to discard the idea completely until I hear it from ANet. I would prefer not to have to fumble out of game with three different third party voip clients just to communicate on all the channels necessary to effectively voice chat in dungeons, guild and WvW in this game (Mumble, TS3 and Ventrilo). A new and casual player is not going to realize how necessary having all three of those downloaded and ready to go are.

It’s much harder to convince a PUG to download and hop into your channel and then relay information about the boss fight (and hope they listen) than them hearing your explanation immediately in-game (and hope they listen). And wouldn’t this lessen the spying issue a little if you were automagically sorted into your red/green/blue team voice chat room, or your registered server’s chat? If you could mute people, or have an option to set everyone to auto mute beyond friendslist, guildies and commanders, that also seems like a good option. The immediacy of built-in party voice chat was a big part of what I loved from Tabula Rasa (rip) and what helped make it so easy to be both a new player seeking guidance and an experienced player looking to help.