Guild Wars 2

Can’t be bothered to log in and test whether making the cooldown 4 seconds and 0.5 second between hits helped at all.

So now to wipe the back line you need to time your 5 CoR players to hit in 0.5 second (hell, make it a 1 second) intervals, so only have to cope with massive damage every 0.5 seconds.

OK. That sounds OK now…NOT.

I have not seen the ridiculous 10k plus hits from CoR since the patch but I have only fought a dozen or so hammer Revs. Hammer Bolt still hits like a truck though.

Straegen.2938:

I have not seen the ridiculous 10k plus hits from CoR since the patch but I have only fought a dozen or so hammer Revs..

It’s more likely because of this:

Best bug ever.

Frenk.5917:

Straegen.2938:

I have not seen the ridiculous 10k plus hits from CoR since the patch but I have only fought a dozen or so hammer Revs..

It’s more likely because of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMNo6pl0-3Q

Best bug ever.

Bug? The 0.5 cooldown on the receiving end of multiple CoRs was intended. It was either that, or nerf the damage hard.

Now at least you won’t receive anywhere near as many complaints about being one shot in WvW. A good compromise, in my opinion.

And thusly did the short Reign of the Rev see it’s conclusion.

and the peasants rejoiced

Haha good thing I just got Herald on my Rev after the patch. Still seems overpowered if you ask me lol. Dabbled in WvW last night and CoR was hitting (like a train) nearly every time.

Yeah, Hammer Bolt is really strong. You can wreck clumps of players with that ability alone; manual aiming of course, not targeted.

Aside from the obvious boon sharing, I’m also liking the dwarf elite and Staff 5 in particular when pushing with melee. It is nice how you can tank up a bit as Herald with minimal damage drop off.

LetoII.3782:

And thusly did the short Reign of the Rev see it’s conclusion.

and the peasants rejoiced

The condi version is still strong in sPvP and the Hammer variant in WvW is still a solid choice.

LetoII.3782:

And thusly did the short Reign of the Rev see it’s conclusion.

and the peasants rejoiced

Unlikely. The damage itself is the problem. As long as that remains the same, CoR will continue to dominate the gamemode.

There’s a point of diminishing returns for Rev now. No matter how many do a CoR, only one will hit. Prenerf the more the better, now they’re stepping on each others toes.

That’s huge

LetoII.3782:

There’s a point of diminishing returns for Rev now. No matter how many do a CoR, only one will hit. Prenerf the more the better, now they’re stepping on each others toes.

That’s huge

I agree. I am still not completely sure the change is intended. But if it is, it makes running large group of Revenants pointless. You would still take 1-2, even if all the do is provide group boosts and hit enemy with CoR. Bringing more – no point anymore.

LetoII.3782:

There’s a point of diminishing returns for Rev now. No matter how many do a CoR, only one will hit. Prenerf the more the better, now they’re stepping on each others toes.

That’s huge

Definitely. I just don’t think it’s enough. Don’t get me wrong, I think the benefit this offers to frontline sustain is great, but you’re overestimating the impact it will have.

Well coordinated CoR spikes may not one-shot guardians anymore, but that doesn’t change the fact that the overall pressure put out by revenant substantially surpasses any alternatives.

Also, it still kittens all over anyone who’s playing even remotely glassy.

LetoII.3782:

There’s a point of diminishing returns for Rev now. No matter how many do a CoR, only one will hit. Prenerf the more the better, now they’re stepping on each others toes.

That’s huge

Eh what? All damage from different players stack. Incoming damage suffer zero limitations, unlike the 5 man AoE cap of outgoing damage (this is why we can bomb). No amount of icd change that. 20 revevants hitting 2 on 1 player will do 20 times the damage of 1 revenant hitting 2 on 1 player.

Dawdler.8521:

LetoII.3782:

There’s a point of diminishing returns for Rev now. No matter how many do a CoR, only one will hit. Prenerf the more the better, now they’re stepping on each others toes.

That’s huge

Eh what? All damage from different players stack. Incoming damage suffer zero limitations, unlike the 5 man AoE cap of outgoing damage (this is why we can bomb). No amount of icd change that. 20 revevants hitting 2 on 1 player will do 20 times the damage of 1 revenant hitting 2 on 1 player.

Watch the video linked earlier in the thread.

I still get hit like a truck sometimes from CoR but seems it happens less now. I still get 1 shot from gun flame though

Yeah, the individual skill still hits like a truck.

Edit, it’s really a combination of CoR with it’s low cool-down plus the Cruel Repercusion trait. Block one CoR and you are kittened on the next one.

Everyone who thinks the current state of CoR is okay, is delusional (this change also affects beserker longbow F1).

As is, all the damage from every class currently summs up, except for these 2 attacks. That is a gross nerf since it involves a completely new mechanic which so far was nefver part of the game design.

Sure, maybe arenanet are intending to roll this change out to other attacks and this is just a testballoon, then this would be fine. But ask yourself, how would you feel if suddenly your most powerful ranged skills were mutually exlusive with other wvw players?

+1 Cyninja, hopefully we’ll get some clarification soon, we’ve got a thread in the revenant forum also discussing this point.

If you take to the letter what was written in the release notes, then this is working as intended. However, I’m not so sure this is a new game mechanic we would enjoy.

Cyninja.2954:

Everyone who thinks the current state of CoR is okay, is delusional (this change also affects beserker longbow F1).
As is, all the damage from every class currently summs up, except for these 2 attacks. That is a gross nerf since it involves a completely new mechanic which so far was nefver part of the game design.
Sure, maybe arenanet are intending to roll this change out to other attacks and this is just a testballoon, then this would be fine. But ask yourself, how would you feel if suddenly your most powerful ranged skills were mutually exlusive with other wvw players?

Static field works the same way. It’s not a new mechanic.

vana.5467:

Cyninja.2954:

Everyone who thinks the current state of CoR is okay, is delusional (this change also affects beserker longbow F1).
As is, all the damage from every class currently summs up, except for these 2 attacks. That is a gross nerf since it involves a completely new mechanic which so far was nefver part of the game design.
Sure, maybe arenanet are intending to roll this change out to other attacks and this is just a testballoon, then this would be fine. But ask yourself, how would you feel if suddenly your most powerful ranged skills were mutually exlusive with other wvw players?

Static field works the same way. It’s not a new mechanic.

Good point. My bad. Let’s compare more 40 second aoe field skills with the most seldom combo field (lightning) to a ranged non combomechnic attack skill. Remeber how combo fields allow for interaction from players? Yeah even if the damage component of static field is caped, the combo field still has tremendous use.

Great, so they had that mechnic already in place for combo fields because people stand in them. Doesn’t excuse implementing this on a ranged attack skill which essentially now is useless with more than 2 revenants in no matter how big a zerg.

Then again, going by your earlier comments, you are not out for balance but simply for braindead lazy fixes.

I play mesmer, ele and guardian mainly in wvw and I don’t have any 1 button can down most glass builds on those toons. DH is close with the #2 bow skill but its not as bad as rev #2 skill. Have yet to be 1 shot from a DH but been 1 shot by revs and berserkers quite a bit. So until anet gives every profession a 1 shot button they should reduce the damage on the few skills that are currently doing massive damage. Stop messing with traits and cooldowns when the problem is the damage.. Could put a 20 sec cooldown on CoR and it would still 1 shot some players..

Cyninja.2954:

Good point. My bad. Let’s compare more 40 second aoe field skills with the most seldom combo field (lightning) to a ranged non combomechnic attack skill. Remeber how combo fields allow for interaction from players? Yeah even if the damage component of static field is caped, the combo field still has tremendous use.

Great, so they had that mechnic already in place for combo fields because people stand in them. Doesn’t excuse implementing this on a ranged attack skill which essentially now is useless with more than 2 revenants in no matter how big a zerg.

Then again, going by your earlier comments, you are not out for balance but simply for braindead lazy fixes.

You’re the only one comparing the two.
The fact that the tech was already in the game strongly suggests that it was taken directly from static field and that the functionality is fully intentional (as opposed to a new piece of code which might have unforeseen bugs).
That was my point, which you probably would have realized if you didn’t get so emotional about the issue.

Cyninja.2954:

Then again, going by your earlier comments, you are not out for balance but simply for braindead lazy fixes.

Oh my.. what gave me away?

Cyninja.2954:

Everyone who thinks the current state of CoR is okay, is delusional (this change also affects beserker longbow F1).

As is, all the damage from every class currently summs up, except for these 2 attacks. That is a gross nerf since it involves a completely new mechanic which so far was nefver part of the game design.

Sure, maybe arenanet are intending to roll this change out to other attacks and this is just a testballoon, then this would be fine. But ask yourself, how would you feel if suddenly your most powerful ranged skills were mutually exlusive with other wvw players?

which is worse… hitting something twice for 10k and 12k, or having a global immunity to the damage from that skill after being hit by it?

it’s not ok as it is, because it pits teammates against each other and will potentially cause arguments between people who are supposed to be cooperating… but even that flaw is less egregious than a double crit hit.

insanemaniac.2456:

Cyninja.2954:

Everyone who thinks the current state of CoR is okay, is delusional (this change also affects beserker longbow F1).

As is, all the damage from every class currently summs up, except for these 2 attacks. That is a gross nerf since it involves a completely new mechanic which so far was nefver part of the game design.

Sure, maybe arenanet are intending to roll this change out to other attacks and this is just a testballoon, then this would be fine. But ask yourself, how would you feel if suddenly your most powerful ranged skills were mutually exlusive with other wvw players?

which is worse… hitting something twice for 10k and 12k, or having a global immunity to the damage from that skill after being hit by it?

it’s not ok as it is, because it pits teammates against each other and will potentially cause arguments between people who are supposed to be cooperating… but even that flaw is less egregious than a double crit hit.

A half second of immunity isn’t much but it does help a tiny bit against multiple 2 spamming revs… it actually effects pve more than it does the wvw’ers. So revs are going to start arguing with each other because 1 can spam 2 faster than the other? Maybe learn to use other skills besides 2.. hehe

vana.5467:

You’re the only one comparing the two.
The fact that the tech was already in the game strongly suggests that it was taken directly from static field and that the functionality is fully intentional (as opposed to a new piece of code which might have unforeseen bugs).
That was my point, which you probably would have realized if you didn’t get so emotional about the issue.

You do know why that 0.5 was added to static field though right? Here’s a hint, it hasn’t anything to do with the damage (hint, stun, hint).

It was a lazy fix for that, and it’s an even lazier fix now.

insanemaniac.2456:

which is worse… hitting something twice for 10k and 12k, or having a global immunity to the damage from that skill after being hit by it?

it’s not ok as it is, because it pits teammates against each other and will potentially cause arguments between people who are supposed to be cooperating… but even that flaw is less egregious than a double crit hit.

I agree, the skill needed fixing. Not some seriously questionable work around. Check my posting history. I was advocating for CoR changes ever since the first week of the HoT launch so I’m not suddenly discovering the fact that CoR needs addressing. I’m just appalled by how arenanet went about doing it.

briggah.7910:

A half second of immunity isn’t much but it does help a tiny bit against multiple 2 spamming revs… it actually effects pve more than it does the wvw’ers. So revs are going to start arguing with each other because 1 can spam 2 faster than the other? Maybe learn to use other skills besides 2.. hehe

Half a second of immunity is enough to soak the damage of 3, 4, 5 or even 30 revenants attacking a target out of position. If you don’t see a problem with straight up immunities in a wvw enviroment you have no idea and/or no experience with realm versus realm games.

No one (at least not me) is saying CoR doesn’t need a rework. The current rework is an inefficient lazy fix which should scare any decent wvw player no matter if playing a revenant or not. It shows that arenanet are unwilling to address skill issues and instead revert to very questionable “quickfixes”. If that does not scare you about future balance changes to any class I’m not sure what will.

Cyninja.2954:

vana.5467:

You’re the only one comparing the two.
The fact that the tech was already in the game strongly suggests that it was taken directly from static field and that the functionality is fully intentional (as opposed to a new piece of code which might have unforeseen bugs).
That was my point, which you probably would have realized if you didn’t get so emotional about the issue.

You do know why that 0.5 was added to static field though right? Here’s a hint, it hasn’t anything to do with the damage (hint, stun, hint).

It was a lazy fix for that, and it’s an even lazier fix now.

insanemaniac.2456:

which is worse… hitting something twice for 10k and 12k, or having a global immunity to the damage from that skill after being hit by it?

it’s not ok as it is, because it pits teammates against each other and will potentially cause arguments between people who are supposed to be cooperating… but even that flaw is less egregious than a double crit hit.

I agree, the skill needed fixing. Not some seriously questionable work around. Check my posting history. I was advocating for CoR changes ever since the first week of the HoT launch so I’m not suddenly discovering the fact that CoR needs addressing. I’m just appalled by how arenanet went about doing it.

briggah.7910:

A half second of immunity isn’t much but it does help a tiny bit against multiple 2 spamming revs… it actually effects pve more than it does the wvw’ers. So revs are going to start arguing with each other because 1 can spam 2 faster than the other? Maybe learn to use other skills besides 2.. hehe

Half a second of immunity is enough to soak the damage of 3, 4, 5 or even 30 revenants attacking a target out of position. If you don’t see a problem with straight up immunities in a wvw enviroment you have no idea and/or no experience with realm versus realm games.

No one (at least not me) is saying CoR doesn’t need a rework. The current rework is an inefficient lazy fix which should scare any decent wvw player no matter if playing a revenant or not. It shows that arenanet are unwilling to address skill issues and instead revert to very questionable “quickfixes”. If that does not scare you about future balance changes to any class I’m not sure what will.

No need to go on a rant about my gaming experience or say I have no idea what I’m talking about. I clearly said many times the problem is the damage. If 30 revs all want to spam one friggin button on a target instead of using other skills then they will face the half of second immunity.. Ahh well you sound angry now so I’m leaving this discussion.. Since you hate immunity why not try and get skills that make you invulnerable nerfed next… anyway I’m done quoting you cause you sound angry and when I get angry I say things I do not want to say and I do not want to get another ban because some 2 spammer can no longer spam 2 and win..

Cyninja.2954:

The current rework is an inefficient lazy fix which should scare any decent wvw player no matter if playing a revenant or not. It shows that arenanet are unwilling to address skill issues and instead revert to very questionable “quickfixes”. If that does not scare you about future balance changes to any class I’m not sure what will.

Lazy fix or not, it is what we got until they say otherwise.

Unwilling to address issues isn’t the problem, it is about priorities and WvW isn’t one of them. Three formats of play to balance around, now raids, add in a new class, no test server and you can see the train wreck in front of you a mile a way.

Boreal.9826:

Frenk.5917:

Straegen.2938:

I have not seen the ridiculous 10k plus hits from CoR since the patch but I have only fought a dozen or so hammer Revs..

It’s more likely because of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMNo6pl0-3Q

Best bug ever.

Bug? The 0.5 cooldown on the receiving end of multiple CoRs was intended. It was either that, or nerf the damage hard.

Now at least you won’t receive anywhere near as many complaints about being one shot in WvW. A good compromise, in my opinion.

Then Anet should do this for all AOE skills that can hit multiple people in WvW.

Boreal.9826:

It was either that, or nerf the damage hard.

Right. That alternative is what should have happened, and I’m saying that as someone who doesn’t play Revenant.

For large scale combat, this internal cooldown option effectively acts as a too-frequent RNG chance for the skill to be wasted. That is taking away player agency, and the source of that felt pain will be your allied players standing next to you.

The excuses and solutions for that consequence are appropriate for how sPvP plays out. It is, however, completely inexcusable and against the spirit of how RvR should play.

In RvR, the discouragement for amassing a zerg should come from what the opponent can do to you, not what your allies can prevent you from doing. That was the reasoning for a lot of the choices ArenaNet made in designing (or not designing in) various mechanics of WvW in general, and that is what should apply to how the class and skill mechanics work in WvW.

That’s also why WvW deserves a separate ruleset for mechanics and balance; just like sPvP, perhaps even more aggressively different.

Boreal.9826:

Now at least you won’t receive anywhere near as many complaints about being one shot in WvW. A good compromise, in my opinion.

If the game design revolves around shutting complainers up, then there are many bad compromises being made for all involved parties.

Besides, this did nothing to stop “one shot”, and there are a lot of other imbalance issues leading to that. Some new ones were just patched in, even.