Guild Wars 2

We knew that Habib told us there was a meeting about the tier 8 matchup and ranking problems. Well, since he stepped down we no longer know for sure that this issue is being looked into. I think we’d like a confirmation from our new WvW director (I like you more than Habib already btw) that the tier 8 ranking problem is being looked into AND will be resolved soon. We’d definitely like an ETA on when a fix will be pushed out or what ANet is planning to do.
Please don’t pull a Habib on us and force me to send more cookies! (I might just send even more if you pull through for us)

If only they allowed transfers, then the people that hate it badly enough to post ad nauseum could instead click a single button and free from their torment forever. I’ll get to work on making a thread about adding transfers to the game.

Omne.4603:

If only they allowed transfers, then the people that hate it badly enough to post ad nauseum could instead click a single button and free from their torment forever. I’ll get to work on making a thread about adding transfers to the game.

Heh, did you even take the time to read the OP? Or just feel that this was the correct place for a little trolling?

Omne.4603:

If only they allowed transfers, then the people that hate it badly enough to post ad nauseum could instead click a single button and free from their torment forever. I’ll get to work on making a thread about adding transfers to the game.

FYI, I was on Borlis pass for a month and continually posted on this issue (including sending the cookies etc)

Is anyone here aware then EU tier 9 has it much worse and dont complain. Since launch Vabbi and FoW have made 1 thread as far as i know complaining about how uneven it is and have never left that tier since falling there.

So on that note…. Dear Anet pls fix EU tier 9!

Yorric Hunt.8214:

Is anyone here aware then EU tier 9 has it much worse and dont complain. Since launch Vabbi and FoW have made 1 thread as far as i know complaining about how uneven it is and have never left that tier since falling there.

So on that note…. Dear Anet pls fix EU tier 9!

Aye, both bottom tier have some fundamental issues. The only way for a server that’s absolutely crushing the opposition to leave there is for one of the servers in the tier above them to do really badly for a long time so they can swap places.

I’ve never set foot in a server in the lowest tier, but I can completely understand why they complain. There’s not really a whole lot they can do besides posting threads and hoping some of the Anet stuff understands the issues the bottom tier is facing.

Yorric Hunt.8214:

Is anyone here aware then EU tier 9 has it much worse and dont complain. Since launch Vabbi and FoW have made 1 thread as far as i know complaining about how uneven it is and have never left that tier since falling there.

So on that note…. Dear Anet pls fix EU tier 9!

I like T9, it’s nice and comfy there.. :-)

Mainly caused because of our sheer numbers.. During the daytime the bigger (not better, but bigger) server just caps almost everything, we at FoW become active in the evening (with guilds like WvW, AKP, …).
Might I mention that yesterday evening we had almost the entire borderlands of Blacktide (the greens) capped? Since they were too busy zergballing on our borderlands of course.. :p

Main tactic when outnumbered: divide and conquer. And no reason yet to get into a higher tier, we’ll get T1 once we’re ready for it..

I don’t want to say t9 doesn’t have a problem but it has been repeatedly shown that the all other servers are significantly better than the 2 bottom servers. They get
new matchups every month or so, yet SF has been here for almost 4 months and will likely stay another.

I know its not the best option, but maybe they should consider letting the bottom 3 servers, population wise, merge into the rest? Because even if they reset the ratings, in 2 months, ET and FC are going to be the exact same rating drain they are now.

Aeonblade.8709:

I know its not the best option, but maybe they should consider letting the bottom 3 servers, population wise, merge into the rest? Because even if they reset the ratings, in 2 months, ET and FC are going to be the exact same rating drain they are now.

I know you’re well intentioned but you’re also wrong. Following the recent free transfer phase the FC and ET WvW populations jumped and will EASILY compete with, if not beat, tier 7.

DevonCarver.5370:

I’ll have more info once Habib gets in, but we are going to bump the ratings of the tier 8 teams to attempt to partially address this today. That’s not going to stop things from sliding back towards the current state, so there will be discussions about larger changes that are necessary to address this issue. But for now we are just going to juke the stats, as they say.

Very cool, nice to see a response and action taken for those stuck in t8.

DevonCarver.5370:

I’ll have more info once Habib gets in, but we are going to bump the ratings of the tier 8 teams to attempt to partially address this today. That’s not going to stop things from sliding back towards the current state, so there will be discussions about larger changes that are necessary to address this issue. But for now we are just going to juke the stats, as they say.

You should make weekly rewards worth fighting for tiers. Nothing fixes problems greater than a little bribery.

If the server populations for the T8 ones are Very High as the lists suggest, the problem is that not many people on those servers are attracted to WvW.. And you should look at options on how to make it more attractive to a bigger populace of players.

Someone suggested maybe having some sort of playoff system, But this will lead to highly unfair matchups sometimes.

So instead, make we should create divisions, where each division has say 3 tiers in it. have separate playoff in each division between the servers in the 3 tiers, and at the end of them you calculate a score for each server; then restart with a new round of playoffs.

I’m not a sports fan really, but I assume this would give better scores maybe, but really it would give servers a chance to face other servers instead of the same old ones every week.

What’s up today?
Did someone die?
Someone got possessed?
So much red in the forums!

Free hugs for devs today!

DevonCarver.5370:

naphack.9346:

What’s up today?
Did someone die?
Someone got possessed?
So much red in the forums!

Coffee?

That’s where you’ve been going wrong guys.
You should have been sending coffee, not cookies!

I like this Devon guy; he posts and talks to us a lot.

DevonCarver.5370:

naphack.9346:

What’s up today?
Did someone die?
Someone got possessed?
So much red in the forums!

Coffee?

Nahhhh, Devon is a keener. We heartily support this strategy. Quick! Someone buy Devon a personal espresso machine and paid barrista!!!

DevonCarver.5370:

I’ll have more info once Habib gets in, but we are going to bump the ratings of the tier 8 teams to attempt to partially address this today. That’s not going to stop things from sliding back towards the current state, so there will be discussions about larger changes that are necessary to address this issue. But for now we are just going to juke the stats, as they say.

If this fixes things I see cakes with your name on them in the future. No rat poison in them either. Food for thought.

DevonCarver, it’s so awesome to see you posting so much in here. Way more awesome than seeing you come in and post though, is seeing you take action. Keep it up man, this is such great news that it pulled me out of my slump due to multiple escalations at work on a Friday. Thank you!

Hi Devon,

Thanks for helping T8 out.

I do have a question for you. I’m on Gate of Madness, which is currently set to be Red Team on T7. Should we be expecting to be in T8 after reset? Or will it take a week at the higher rating before SF breaks out?

Thanks

Thanks Devon,

Just getting a reply from you makes a world of difference to our mood!

If throwing a bunch of points into T8 (and probably T9) would upset the system too much, how about throwing points at T1 thru T8 but distribute it so that the lower tiers gains a greater percentage of points than the upper tiers? Just a thought.

EDIT: Personally I’ll be glad that SF gets rewarded with a positive ranking out of all this when they are beating FC and ET by such a big margin but loosing points at the moment (as is the case with a number of green teams beating the opposition and still loosing points). If any permanent fix could be achieved then I hope that the winning team always gets a positive ranking rather than loosing ranking because Glicko said so.

You could offer the inhabitants of the bottom 3 servers free transfers to the server of their choice , then turn that Tier into 3 maps of open world pvp…no more ppts…open keeps & towers to seige up for bases, but no points invlolved in taking them…no camps…

Just open world pvp

Devon you’re getting those cookies. Thanks so much.

Yorric Hunt.8214:

Is anyone here aware then EU tier 9 has it much worse and dont complain. Since launch Vabbi and FoW have made 1 thread as far as i know complaining about how uneven it is and have never left that tier since falling there.

So on that note…. Dear Anet pls fix EU tier 9!

I understand that T9 is probably just as frustrated as we are, but they are faced with regular matchup changes and if T8 was in a similar situation I’m sure we’d (probably) be OK with that. Just keep in mind that T8 frustration comes from being totally outmanned and stripped of points by the likes Devona’s Rest and Kaineng. Especially Kaineng – when they eventually broke loose of T8 they ended up at the top of T2…
Sorrow’s Furnace (from all accounts I’ve heard and read) are fielding enough numbers to at least be top of T7. I’m pretty confident that the next server falling down from T7 to T8 and still beating the snot out of us will be the end of T8 gripes. We’d settle for the battle for the last 2 spots and that would be that, but as long as SF remains in T8 and can’t break free we will never know…

Looks like SF is going to get their marching orders soon….don’t worry everyone else in T8 we will be pulling you out too.

Would be cool if once a year they open server transfers (with the guild builds and what not) for free for a week once a year and reset all the ratings. This way there is change and you get a chance to work with other guilds.
(may post this in suggestions as well)

I am worried that if they actually fix the problem in T8 we will not have anything else to complain about so we will start bickering at each other.

Cantur Soulfyre.5409:

I am worried that if they actually fix the problem in T8 we will not have anything else to complain about so we will start bickering at each other.

LOL I know right what do I do with my life on the gw2 forums if I can’t do something that catches attention for t8???
After personally starting half a dozen threads and about 30 posts about this issue I can’t believe they’re finally trying to solve it.

Scleameth.6809:

Thanks Devon,

Just getting a reply from you makes a world of difference to our mood!

If throwing a bunch of points into T8 (and probably T9) would upset the system too much, how about throwing points at T1 thru T8 but distribute it so that the lower tiers gains a greater percentage of points than the upper tiers? Just a thought.

EDIT: Personally I’ll be glad that SF gets rewarded with a positive ranking out of all this when they are beating FC and ET by such a big margin but loosing points at the moment (as is the case with a number of green teams beating the opposition and still loosing points). If any permanent fix could be achieved then I hope that the winning team always gets a positive ranking rather than loosing ranking because Glicko said so.

there is nothing wrong with losing points even when you are winning, if the other server fares better than expected.
The problem here is, glicko should probably be adjusted.
In chess, for example, even if you are not that much better, you can easily take 100% of the games against a worse player. The outcome is predictable, so if the other guy grabs, says one out of the matches and actually wins it, while managing to get remis in 2 others out of, says, 7 played matches, it clearly shows, he’s actually quite good, so he will be rewarded with points for it.
Thing is, it’s literally impossible to win by 100% in this tiered setup. JQ (NA) against Vabbi(EU) might be pretty much the only matchup, I can imagine, where a server could truly get literally 100% of the points.
Glicko probably needs to be adjusted towards the mid. Right now, it expects landslide victories of huge margin, where they cannot possibly happen to the point actually expected by glicko. Glicko needs to be taught in some way, that getting more than 66% of the total points in a matchup already is a huge beatdown in this game.
THAT is the kind of adjustment needed, cause then, servers can actually break out of the glicko hell, if they only try hard enough.

And about EU tier 9: they constantly get the snot beaten out of them by changing servers, so they got a way to compare themselves to the higher tier.
Why would they complain?
NA tier 8 is still kind of competitive, even with SF winning by large margins, while they did not have a chance for the past months to try against other servers, where they actually belong rating wise. Of course, they will be kitten , if they just can not know what would happen, if they actually faced a t7 server for once.
For the t9 eu servers, it’s clear, no matter, which server comes down, they probably have no chance.
If t7 servers come down and really beat FC and ET, they will probably settle for it.
But as long, as they got no way to prove themselves, they won’t. Things will change, so the conclusion will come soon.

Hmmm… better open up free transfers for the top 1 server! #yolo

Elitejelly.7462:

Would be cool if once a year they open server transfers (with the guild builds and what not) for free for a week once a year and reset all the ratings. This way there is change and you get a chance to work with other guilds.
(may post this in suggestions as well)

I would like that idea, kind of like a offseason for NFL, each teams have changes in their rosters and schedules to start a new season.

DevonCarver.5370:

titanlectro.5029:

Hi Devon,

Thanks for helping T8 out.

I do have a question for you. I’m on Gate of Madness, which is currently set to be Red Team on T7. Should we be expecting to be in T8 after reset? Or will it take a week at the higher rating before SF breaks out?

Thanks

It would appear that the change we are making will impact the ratings for the next matchup. I do not know specifically who will end up where, but it is likely that SF will break out and someone else will drop. If not this week, then likely the next.

I want to have your quaggans. Seriously, much love from T8!

Well those T7 guys were posting pics of spiking a Anet employee….so the only fair thing to do is move SF and let us right this injustice for you guys.

I usually dont use bible quotes but this one from Deuteronomy would be most fitting given the current situation and what T7 is going to look like afterward.

‘All its land is brimstone and salt, a burning waste, unsown and unproductive, and no grass grows in it, like the overthrow of Sodom and Gomorrah, Admah and Zeboiim, which the LORD overthrew in His anger and in His wrath.’……Dueteronomy 29:23

DevonCarver.5370:

Remember that this is merely a band-aid solution for now. One that will hopefully return some movement between T7 and T8. For it to be permanently solved will require more work and time. But, this should make things better for now.

Just add new siege golems that once built can break down the walls between a neighbor tier.

These golems should be like a server monument. Containing 500 Omega golems, 50 Superior ballistas and like 10,000 extra supply ontop and built/upgraded like a big mobile keep.

Oh course you played Supreme Commander and have watched Tron! Pic attached.

Or its smaller alternative.
5 Omega golems stack, new 6th skill appears and they morph into a.. transformer, basically.
How to get around copyright? Just stick an Anet symbol on it.

Problem solved, just need bigger gunz.
Bird for Dev.

EDIT:
Need details on its mechanic?
Just pm me.

Instead of doing measures like this which are tailored to the lower tier only why not do this:

Lower cap on WvW maps by 25-33%. This will cause queues to come back to Tier 1-2/3 forcing people to transfer off the bandwagoned servers and server populations to balance out through tiers until it trickles down. Do this and don’t be afraid of the kittening and moaning of people who CHOSE to go to servers stacking regions. This will also solve the skill lag issue in upper tiers that doesn’t show up as often in lower tiers because of lower population.

Lower tiers won’t be affected with this because they don’t have the population but will get new recruits form upper tiers who can’t do WvW because for 1-2 hr queues during weekdays.

Please anet be the bad guy for a week & fix skill lag and balance out pops in lower tier with one step!

Luvpie.8350:

Instead of doing measures like this which are tailored to the lower tier only why not do this:

Lower cap on WvW maps by 25-33%. This will cause queues to come back to Tier 1-2/3 forcing people to transfer off the bandwagoned servers and server populations to balance out through tiers until it trickles down. Do this and don’t be afraid of the kittening and moaning of people who CHOSE to go to servers stacking regions. This will also solve the skill lag issue in upper tiers that doesn’t show up as often in lower tiers because of lower population.

Lower tiers won’t be affected with this because they don’t have the population but will get new recruits form upper tiers who can’t do WvW because for 1-2 hr queues during weekdays.

Please anet be the bad guy for a week & fix skill lag and balance out pops in lower tier with one step!

Er.
What about the PvE servers whos WvW is empty yet server pop is very high?
Those servers wouldn’t get the xfers, for instance, my server. Even though we are low tier.
That and people have server loyalty? You know. The guys who would rather suffer months of losing than to bandwagon off.

Rob.7624:

Luvpie.8350:

Instead of doing measures like this which are tailored to the lower tier only why not do this:

Lower cap on WvW maps by 25-33%. This will cause queues to come back to Tier 1-2/3 forcing people to transfer off the bandwagoned servers and server populations to balance out through tiers until it trickles down. Do this and don’t be afraid of the kittening and moaning of people who CHOSE to go to servers stacking regions. This will also solve the skill lag issue in upper tiers that doesn’t show up as often in lower tiers because of lower population.

Lower tiers won’t be affected with this because they don’t have the population but will get new recruits form upper tiers who can’t do WvW because for 1-2 hr queues during weekdays.

Please anet be the bad guy for a week & fix skill lag and balance out pops in lower tier with one step!

Er.
What about the PvE servers whos WvW is empty yet server pop is very high?
Those servers wouldn’t get the xfers, for instance, my server.
That and people have server loyalty? You know. The guys who would rather suffer months of losing than to bandwagon off.

Then you will be balanced with appropriate tiers like now in lower tiers.
Lower queue timers > loyalty for WvW guilds especially the ones stacked in higher tiers.

Announcing this correction with so little warning feels a bit like throwing GoM under the bus… how about making the ratings bump a bit more public and waiting till next week so servers have a chance to prepare.

GrandmaFunk.3052:

Announcing this correction with so little warning feels a bit like throwing GoM under the bus… how about making the ratings bump a bit more public and waiting till next week so servers have a chance to prepare.

How is this throwing GoM under the bus? I’m just curious, because even if they normalize t8, you still have a week to not come in third place again. Either show up or don’t and fall to t8, pretty clean cut.

MUST..DESTROY…GOM

GrandmaFunk.3052:

Announcing this correction with so little warning feels a bit like throwing GoM under the bus… how about making the ratings bump a bit more public and waiting till next week so servers have a chance to prepare.

At least NSP has a week to pack their bags….guessing mostly because Anet came down to see the numbers on both servers and saw exactly what I saw in my grand adventure to T7.

Maybe all the pics and talk of recent numbers paid off.

Aeonblade.8709:

GrandmaFunk.3052:

Announcing this correction with so little warning feels a bit like throwing GoM under the bus… how about making the ratings bump a bit more public and waiting till next week so servers have a chance to prepare.

How is this throwing GoM under the bus? I’m just curious, because even if they normalize t8, you still have a week to not come in third place again. Either show up or don’t and fall to t8, pretty clean cut.

From what I’ve read, GOM may be moved down to t8 as a result of the ratings bump, though it’s not a guarantee. Which would mean they potentially might not have that week to “not come in third place again”.

Right man in the right place… for example of this thread we can see how much Devon cares and I, as a WvW player, really appreciate this so much! Thanks boss!
Finally no “NA tier 8” threads on forum, god thanks

Aeonblade.8709:

How is this throwing GoM under the bus? I’m just curious, because even if they normalize t8, you still have a week to not come in third place again.

But that’s the thing, according to Devon the ratings bump might be enough to drop them down tonight.