Guild Wars 2

So i guess its another week of people belittling Anvil Rock and patting themselves on the back for beating them?

I mean even NSP is posting here. Shouldn’t you be spending more time trying not to lose your match? I guess when you hit the wall and realized that fighting servers with more population than you isn’t the same kicking a server half your population around you needed to go and feel superior to someone?

Rashka.7304:

Two weeks ago DH was PvEing through the maps at night against SR and SoR. They made it second after SR with only 2k difference.

Last week same matchup and DH thought all they need to do is improving their daytime performance to win that round. While SR gave up on the DH nightzerg SoR pushed back. Hard.

Result was not only that DH gave up after facing reasonable resistance, on top of it certain individuals spread false rumors about guild transfers and hacking. And here, not 24h after they were beaten down one tier the same folks are padding themselves on their shoulders again. Some of DH really need to learn some diginity.

Firstly lols go to your own matchup…Second the amount of players SoR had in the am 7-12 pst was night and day from two weeks ago to last week. SoR had many more players for you guys during that time. Were there less dh players? Absolutely. Fielding what we did in the previous match though your “regular” force still somehow miraculously outnumbered us though. With no transfers at all just ppl staying up extra hrs on end during the weekdays riiiiiight

Also many times the map will look one way on the weekend and change during the week.

Rashka.7304:

Two weeks ago DH was PvEing through the maps at night against SR and SoR. They made it second after SR with only 2k difference.

Last week same matchup and DH thought all they need to do is improving their daytime performance to win that round. While SR gave up on the DH nightzerg SoR pushed back. Hard.

Result was not only that DH gave up after facing reasonable resistance, on top of it certain individuals spread false rumors about guild transfers and hacking. And here, not 24h after they were beaten down one tier the same folks are padding themselves on their shoulders again. Some of DH really need to learn some diginity.

I cannot agree with Rashka more. I’m from Darkhaven and last week was really quite sad. Everyone on DH blamed the hackers and their effect on morale, but all I really saw was SoR shutting down our night game. Hell, I was even on one of the “nightcap” runs where we’d usually flip the whole map on EB in an hour, and we couldn’t even get our own keep back. We’d go from tower to tower flipping it and SoR would be right behind us just retaking it, essentially negating anything that our “uber organized nightcapping team” achieved.

I’ve said it in private and I’ve said it in public on DH and I’ve been shunned hardcore for it. Our zerg tactics with a ton of people on a gate might seem like organization to you all, but it really isn’t. It’s organized to the point of people getting karma all in a ball, but as soon as servers wise up to it (aka SoR), we got shut down. We can only zerg at night in crap brackets and we’ll never move up as a server to higher brackets if that’s the only thing we can do.

Sure, maybe some SoR people hacked. But the fact that people would rather kitten about it on forums/vent all the while SoR was taking towers from us legitimately and then us blaming it on the hackers just shows how out of touch we really are.

As to the new match up:

Everyone on DH is praising how organized we are. That’s a huge load of kitten. We had numbers over both Anvil and Ferguson’s and everyone knows it. Our own borderlands got swamped by Anvil and Ferg by losing all three keeps within an hour (while we had a queue in it) while we were being held even in EB and barely making headway in Anvil borderlands. Only when people from Ferguson’s and Anvil started dropping off and our queues remained did we make headway. We easily took EB (yayyy organization?) with numbers and we finally took back our garrison on DH while…surprise surprise, no one was defending orb up north.

The fact that it took over an hour to take a supply camp. A SUPPLY CAMP with a 3:1 numbers advantage while having the elevation advantage (Longview -> Faithleap) against Anvil just shows to go how little organization we had. At the time we had 3 commanders running around, while our other supply camps were still being taken and the only people communicating via /map or /team were pugs.

I’ve seen way too much backpadding on DH’s side (forums and ingame) about us slamming Ferg and Anvil. Congratulations. We should be. No offense, but we’re 200 points higher than both of them in the overall ratings, we have a much larger population and a lot more players do WvW on DH. DH isn’t going to learn anything from this matchup because we’re wiping the floor because of our population. We’re going to placed in the bracket above us and maybe do well, maybe not. Either way, we’re not going to make any progression with no one wanting to man up and realize our tactics aren’t tactics, they’re just throwing people at the objective.

There are a few commanders on DH that I do enjoy watching, however they’re so few and far between (and hardly play enough) that people don’t actually appreciate anything they’re saying. I’ve yet to see commanders use squad commands besides the supply check, I’ve yet to see multiple commanders working in conjunction with each other (besides standing next to each other at a gate) to ensure our supply camps in our territory are being defended.

Might of been a rant, but I feel it needed to be said. The general tone of this thread is just so depressing as it is.

Kodiack.2783:

Here is a little history lesson for you pros in Darkhaven.
Week 1 we were stuck with Yaks’ Bend, currently ranked 13th.
Week 2-3 we were stuck with NSP, currently ranked 15th.
So excuse us in Anvil Rock if we aren’t impressed with your virtual domination of the map. What your fighting now are the die hards that wont’ quit and jump ship to a winning server.
Here’s another tip. You’re bragging about beating up on the lower 25% of the entire server list. Nobody is impressed.
-K

It’s funny you bring this up because Darkhaven also fought with Yaks bend that week and the last two weeks we fought SoR which is currently ranked 14. So we’re right here with you.

Oh and what you’re fighting now are also the die hards that didn’t give up on DH and jump servers even after we got spanked by Yaks and SoR.

But I will admit that Arius jumped the gun with saying DH won this week. The match up just started and a lot can happen in a week.

Btw, why does it seem that these threads always turn into flame wars? Why can’t we all just enjoy the game and congratulate each other on some good matches? I played a few hours today in Anvil Rock Borderland and it was a lot of fun fighting Anvil Rock.

DH has no organization on a large scale. I always try to give advice in chat, but no one ever listens. I call for Defense after we take a couple camps and towers, but no one listens. I tell people to upgrade guards, walls, etc., but no one listens. I tell people stop taking supply from keeps, because we need it to upgrade, but no one listens. I give up on Darkhaven WvW, because we need large organized guilds to be effective.

Zulubeast.8519:

Rashka.7304:

Two weeks ago DH was PvEing through the maps at night against SR and SoR. They made it second after SR with only 2k difference.

Last week same matchup and DH thought all they need to do is improving their daytime performance to win that round. While SR gave up on the DH nightzerg SoR pushed back. Hard.

Result was not only that DH gave up after facing reasonable resistance, on top of it certain individuals spread false rumors about guild transfers and hacking. And here, not 24h after they were beaten down one tier the same folks are padding themselves on their shoulders again. Some of DH really need to learn some diginity.

I cannot agree with Rashka more. I’m from Darkhaven and last week was really quite sad. Everyone on DH blamed the hackers and their effect on morale, but all I really saw was SoR shutting down our night game. Hell, I was even on one of the “nightcap” runs where we’d usually flip the whole map on EB in an hour, and we couldn’t even get our own keep back. We’d go from tower to tower flipping it and SoR would be right behind us just retaking it, essentially negating anything that our “uber organized nightcapping team” achieved.

I’ve said it in private and I’ve said it in public on DH and I’ve been shunned hardcore for it. Our zerg tactics with a ton of people on a gate might seem like organization to you all, but it really isn’t. It’s organized to the point of people getting karma all in a ball, but as soon as servers wise up to it (aka SoR), we got shut down. We can only zerg at night in crap brackets and we’ll never move up as a server to higher brackets if that’s the only thing we can do.

Sure, maybe some SoR people hacked. But the fact that people would rather kitten about it on forums/vent all the while SoR was taking towers from us legitimately and then us blaming it on the hackers just shows how out of touch we really are.

As to the new match up:

Everyone on DH is praising how organized we are. That’s a huge load of kitten. We had numbers over both Anvil and Ferguson’s and everyone knows it. Our own borderlands got swamped by Anvil and Ferg by losing all three keeps within an hour (while we had a queue in it) while we were being held even in EB and barely making headway in Anvil borderlands. Only when people from Ferguson’s and Anvil started dropping off and our queues remained did we make headway. We easily took EB (yayyy organization?) with numbers and we finally took back our garrison on DH while…surprise surprise, no one was defending orb up north.

The fact that it took over an hour to take a supply camp. A SUPPLY CAMP with a 3:1 numbers advantage while having the elevation advantage (Longview -> Faithleap) against Anvil just shows to go how little organization we had. At the time we had 3 commanders running around, while our other supply camps were still being taken and the only people communicating via /map or /team were pugs.

I’ve seen way too much backpadding on DH’s side (forums and ingame) about us slamming Ferg and Anvil. Congratulations. We should be. No offense, but we’re 200 points higher than both of them in the overall ratings, we have a much larger population and a lot more players do WvW on DH. DH isn’t going to learn anything from this matchup because we’re wiping the floor because of our population. We’re going to placed in the bracket above us and maybe do well, maybe not. Either way, we’re not going to make any progression with no one wanting to man up and realize our tactics aren’t tactics, they’re just throwing people at the objective.

There are a few commanders on DH that I do enjoy watching, however they’re so few and far between (and hardly play enough) that people don’t actually appreciate anything they’re saying. I’ve yet to see commanders use squad commands besides the supply check, I’ve yet to see multiple commanders working in conjunction with each other (besides standing next to each other at a gate) to ensure our supply camps in our territory are being defended.

Might of been a rant, but I feel it needed to be said. The general tone of this thread is just so depressing as it is.

I tip my hat to you Zulu. Every once in awhile, someone from a population dominate server understands why things are the way they are. It seems to be easy for some people to give “advice” on how to win when their server is simply stomping due to mainly larger population numbers. For some reason it seems harder for others to understand the underlying issues.

Wars, campaigns,battles, skirmishes,..etc are won by a handful of leaders, strategy, and manpower (i.e. soldiers). My server, Anvil Rock, has the leaders and strategy, we just don’t have the manpower.

Yes. Zulubeast is absolutely right. That’s how Darkhaven is right now.

Not trying to start a war here and this will be my last post on the subject matter, but
again @Macovan since the reply button isn’t there at the moment.

I read through the posts you’ve posted that had to do with WvW and NSP vs AR and one of the threads got shut down, secondly you’ve never offered anything constructive and have only been throwing comments in peoples faces, in the WvW chat.

So I ask again, please stay in your world now as we don’t need the added comments from your server. If you have any further issues feel free to PM me.

Everyone on DH knows we outnumber these servers, the reason I know I was saying don’t give up to the other servers isn’t to condescend but I would rather a close match and lose than to dominate that’s just not fun >.> but no… DH is terrible with being organized most of the day I will admit a couple large guilds get organized when they are on RE is one of them (though not the only of course) and I was in Eternal before they were there in force and after and the change was HUGE, RE isn’t made of elite players who go 1 v5 and win all the time or anything, but we communicate and organize. DH could be so much higher if we were more organized and that is why this match up is (no offense to anvil rock or fergy) a bust… We would have to be stupid to lose simply because of the number advantage. Yes last night in Eternal we won at equal numbers (or at least close to equal) but before we got organized there we were down to 2 towers and a supply camp and our keep because we just werent coordinating.

Any DH player that doesn’t admit our numbers isn’t a huge bonus is stupid. plain and simply stupid. However now to the DH players, some are saying this week won’t help us improve I say kitten that. We can improve tremendously by working especially on the morning to afternoon organization, because really, it’s terrible… Our night cap crew is not super organized however it is much more organized than our day crew, no one can argue that.

Anvil rock please do not blame us for the number advantage though… we do not try to make this the reason we have a ridiculous advantage but realistically no one is going to get off wvw to make it more fair… I am sorry that is the case but can’t be helped

Let us make this a productive week on all servers, idk what anvil and fergy need (maybe guild vent groups and large guild alliances or maybe they just dont have the manpower to work with im not on the server not sure) and DH let us work on working TOGETHER we can move up way past where we are if we do this. Good fight to us all!

The fact that DH is winnning is a freaking miracle.
Then again I seen DH winning on the weekend and loose hard on the weekdays.

I am on Darkhaven and have been from day one. Dont get me wrong, I love this server. What upsets me is that we did not have these numbers last week when we were losing. We have many on our server that need to man up and get into the fight even during during those times when we are not fairing well. Good job Furgersons Crossing hanging on to your Borderland. You guys have heart.

All I can say is that Anvil Rock is not a PvP server. At least whats left of it. I strickly pvp’ed in beta and spend most of my time either in WvW or sPVP. 1v1 I can kill any profession, but in Anvil Rock WvW is just a joke. Even if you are successfully are killing another player, the zerg is right behind them and you’ll die.

So yeah, I’m another Anvil Rock player complaining about the reality of their server. And yeah, that’s why I’m even on the forums. I"m done. Time to find a real PvP server.

Only reason I picked this server was because Team Paradigm was suppose to have their North American Team on this server. Bad choice.!

At least the only dirction Anvil Rock can go from hear is up.

Please don’t misunderstand our complaints. We aren’t complaining that you bring or have more players in wvw. It’s our fourth week at this we are used to it, we’re just tired of hearing from you guys how its skill / organization and not plain numbers.

Now at least a few of you are admitting it now, and that’s a step forward on your end.

Lets have fun this week, lets WvW our hearts out but but don’t come here and lecture to us about how if we only organized better we would win. We fully accept the fact that we don’t have the numbers to properly use sound tactics, which is why we play the we we do.

-K

I’m glad to see these teams can have an honest match, best of luck to all.

Kodiack.2783:

Please don’t misunderstand our complaints. We aren’t complaining that you bring or have more players in wvw. It’s our fourth week at this we are used to it, we’re just tired of hearing from you guys how its skill / organization and not plain numbers.

Now at least a few of you are admitting it now, and that’s a step forward on your end.

Lets have fun this week, lets WvW our hearts out but but don’t come here and lecture to us about how if we only organized better we would win. We fully accept the fact that we don’t have the numbers to properly use sound tactics, which is why we play the we we do.

-K

As an NSP WvWer who went against your server last week, I can honestly say Anvil Rock was a greater challenge than the others we faced before you and you gave us a run for our money here and there. Keep your chin up and do your best.

Soon the free server xfers will be done and we can get into a better WvW flow.

Also we all may be on the botton 6 servers, but our queue times are the lowest around.
The mid to upper level servers have large queue times.
I’d rather be able to join WvW when I want to then have to wait hours to get in.

Harpazo. Thanks, but saying Anvil Rock gave a challenge here and there is just being nice to the pitiful.
Its more like giving a trophy to all the kids who play soccer because they participated.

Why would you want no wait times just to get steam rolled. That makes no scence. Yes, Anvil has no wait times, but thats because no one wants to be there and get nothing done.

The definition of insanitiy is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results. That’s what the no que time will give you.

Yerlte, I stood solo last week against NS in our supply camp north of Anvil Rock begging for support last week. All that happened was people saying its easy to get back. So for 3 hours, we would continuously lose and retake our 1 supply camp that meant anything to fortify our towers.

The embarrassment is that I wasted over 1 gold tyring to fortify that camp solo.

- Gearhead – Engineer

Goldmember.4368:

Harpazo. Thanks, but saying Anvil Rock gave a challenge here and there is just being nice to the pitiful.
Its more like giving a trophy to all the kids who play soccer because they participated.

No need to be cynical.

Pangie.3217:

Kodiack.2783:

Here is a little history lesson for you pros in Darkhaven.
Week 1 we were stuck with Yaks’ Bend, currently ranked 13th.
Week 2-3 we were stuck with NSP, currently ranked 15th.
So excuse us in Anvil Rock if we aren’t impressed with your virtual domination of the map. What your fighting now are the die hards that wont’ quit and jump ship to a winning server.
Here’s another tip. You’re bragging about beating up on the lower 25% of the entire server list. Nobody is impressed.
-K

It’s funny you bring this up because Darkhaven also fought with Yaks bend that week and the last two weeks we fought SoR which is currently ranked 14. So we’re right here with you.

Oh and what you’re fighting now are also the die hards that didn’t give up on DH and jump servers even after we got spanked by Yaks and SoR.

But I will admit that Arius jumped the gun with saying DH won this week. The match up just started and a lot can happen in a week.

Btw, why does it seem that these threads always turn into flame wars? Why can’t we all just enjoy the game and congratulate each other on some good matches? I played a few hours today in Anvil Rock Borderland and it was a lot of fun fighting Anvil Rock.

When did I say we’ve already won? I said we have strong night time organization, but I don’t recall ever having said we’ve won. I really wish people would read my posts before commenting on them.

@Zulubeast

Your post was well thought out, but I believe it was wrong on multiple points.

“Hell, I was even on one of the “nightcap” runs where we’d usually flip the whole map on EB in an hour, and we couldn’t even get our own keep back. We’d go from tower to tower flipping it and SoR would be right behind us just retaking it, essentially negating anything that our “uber organized nightcapping team” achieved.”

This is due to multiple reasons, that SoR people will even admit:

1. They used Mesmers (legally or illegally) to gain entrance to our towers/keeps. Seriously, go ask them, they admitted to doing it legally, though some of us believe it was sometimes illegal (and one person posted video evidence I’m too lazy to dig up).

2. SoR had a numerical advantage, all but three zones at any given time would give us the outmanned buff — especially during the night time.

3. Did you run with the night zerg regularly? If you did, you would know that it has pretty huge amounts of organization. A lot goes into scouting, supplying, and a few other underappreciated things that are done. Unfortunately, most people are just taking part in the seemingly mindless zerg, and do not know what is happening (I don’t know if you’re one of them or not).

Where is this “backpadding” you’re seeing? I’ve seen perhaps two people brag or boast about Dh being ahead. I don’t know Zulu, I’m going to be honest here (with all due respect), it seems to me you’re attacking straw-men (as are others, such as the one who I quoted). Darkhaven has bragged very little in this thread or around the forums, though I have seen one or two posts.

Rashka.7304:

Two weeks ago DH was PvEing through the maps at night against SR and SoR. They made it second after SR with only 2k difference.

Last week same matchup and DH thought all they need to do is improving their daytime performance to win that round. While SR gave up on the DH nightzerg SoR pushed back. Hard.

Result was not only that DH gave up after facing reasonable resistance, on top of it certain individuals spread false rumors about guild transfers and hacking. And here, not 24h after they were beaten down one tier the same folks are padding themselves on their shoulders again. Some of DH really need to learn some diginity.

Yes, except for we were still usually ahead in the 2-6am region, where most of our nightzerging takes place. So we didn’t “give up”. Unfortunately, when outnumbered, as other people in this thread have so willingly pointed out, there’s not much you can do. It was a common misunderstanding that we outnumbered the other servers during the night — in fact, I’d be willing to say SoR outnumbered us all along. Rather, we were willing and able to gather all of our night time participants into one zerg, and thus were successful. Unfortunately for us, SoR got their act together and was able to use the numerical advantage it does have to defeat us, by having more people we simply could not cover all bases at all times.

But, you are right in that Dh got hugely demoralized. If we couldn’t dominate the night, we simply had no chance of winning, because SoR was simply more organized and had larger numbers.

and tonight was all about green.

Zulubeast.8519:

-snip-

Fellow Darkhaveners who truly care for our server to improve and progress, read Zulubeast’s post, and then read it again.

I’ve been reluctant to say anything, and besides Zulu has put it more succinctly than I ever could.

I can tell you from the points he makes that this is coming from a person who wants us to truly succeed for the right reasons, in the right way.

And I’m coming from the experience of being part of our night “zerg.” No, we were not the organized. We were a step above PUG with numbers. I wouldn’t say it was brainless and I’m not saying it didn’t require organization, but it did not and does not require the kind of true organization, strategic planning, and initiative from ALL players that we really need to become better. That’s a simple fact.

It was blitzkrieg, shock and awe, overwhelming force vested in numbers. I’m not going to discredit our fearless half naked norn or the other commanders, because it did get results and it has its uses. But we cannot rely on it.

That said, even if you think everything I’m saying and Zulu said is bull kitten, can we quit with the gloating and back-patting here? Personally I don’t think we have anything good to feel about this match, but I’m not going to spoil your fun. Just please don’t bring that onto the forums. We literally gain nothing from it except a false pretense that’s going to get smashed in our next match when we go up a tier unless we start making some changes. And it’s not right to those on our opposing servers who are still putting up a fight.

Just quit it already. Grow up.

im from Sorrows Furnace. Last weeks match up wasnt SoR doing better, They had a pop surge, pretty massive one that tripled their pop. Thus leading to my server and DH gettin squashed. MY suggestion to all sides is, Dont own all bls 100%, those kinds of point scores will raise your ranking yes, But then youll be paired witha server with 50x the time pop size and youll find yourselves squashed again. Now im not saying let someone win, Just dont land your self int he 250k-300k digits, thats a sure jump to land ya somewhere ya cant defend against. As to why im saying this, Fort Aspenwood did this, Guess what, their droping ranks fast now cuz of it.

Cael.2641:

Zulubeast.8519:

-snip-

Fellow Darkhaveners who truly care for our server to improve and progress, read Zulubeast’s post, and then read it again.

I’ve been reluctant to say anything, and besides Zulu has put it more succinctly than I ever could.

I can tell you from the points he makes that this is coming from a person who wants us to truly succeed for the right reasons, in the right way.

And I’m coming from the experience of being part of our night “zerg.” No, we were not the organized. We were a step above PUG with numbers. I wouldn’t say it was brainless and I’m not saying it didn’t require organization, but it did not and does not require the kind of true organization, strategic planning, and initiative from ALL players that we really need to become better. That’s a simple fact.

It was blitzkrieg, shock and awe, overwhelming force vested in numbers. I’m not going to discredit our fearless half naked norn or the other commanders, because it did get results and it has its uses. But we cannot rely on it.

That said, even if you think everything I’m saying and Zulu said is bull kitten, can we quit with the gloating and back-patting here? Personally I don’t think we have anything good to feel about this match, but I’m not going to spoil your fun. Just please don’t bring that onto the forums. We literally gain nothing from it except a false pretense that’s going to get smashed in our next match when we go up a tier unless we start making some changes. And it’s not right to those on our opposing servers who are still putting up a fight.

Just quit it already. Grow up.

To the last paragraph I totally agree. Gloating about winning a match clearly in our favor is not a great idea.

However, I’m going to have to persist in saying that a lot of organization goes on during night time that many people are not aware of. Are we the most organized thing ever? No. Are we unstoppable? No. But man, the night time zerg is more organized than most day time forces — and it’s mostly a bunch of random people! Compare it to any gathering of random people, and it will outclass almost if not all of them. I don’t think it’s as good as simply one large guild getting together, for obvious reasons, but it’s still really, really good.

Also, pulling off a successful Blitzkrieg takes a lot of organization. Managing where to attack, when, keeping supplied, and trying to hold possessions with one zerg is not as easy as it sounds — a lot goes on in the background that most are not aware of.

I’ve been there, Arius. I’ve actually refused to call our night crew a zerg for the longest time because I did see that it required a level of organization that we never had before. Anyone who says we solely go off numbers or “zerging” is wrong, but they are also not far from the truth.

Unless things changed the times I wasn’t there, I didn’t see much in the way of fortifying/upgrading towers, or in splitting up the zerg when we really didn’t need to have everyone on point attacking the same objectives. Very few if any people running supply, watching for back-caps and staying to hold positions. Very little in the way of support siege being placed, manned, and maintained besides whatever we needed to take down doors/walls, whereas I vividly recall seeing a surplus of that from SoR towards the end of last week besides the fact that their numbers surged.

That said, I haven’t been as vocal because I also know we’ve been stuck between a bit of a rock and a hard place, in a way. Our night crew could dominate the night, but we knew we would lose holdings in the day because that’s where SF and SoR had their numbers mainly. That said, I often wondered if, night after night, we might have been better off trying to fortify at all.

Regardless, our day game needs to be organized. Unfortunately, I play nights and early mornings almost exclusively due to my work schedule. I do what I can when I’m on but I’m also not in a big guild and not a commander.

I think the thing I’m most disappointed about is that this week will teach us nothing if we don’t make an effort to teach ourselves. Fact is, if we don’t make changes now and really work to improve, we’re going to go up in rank and repeat last week, and then probably lose more and numbers to morale. It’ll be a vicious cycle.

I don’t care for us to be a winning, dominant, high tier server, but I feel like we have a ton of potential to be really competitive that may never get utilized because we’ve reached the point in the tiers where numbers alone, even numbers directed with a singular purpose, won’t do it.

Cael.2641:

I’ve been there, Arius. I’ve actually refused to call our night crew a zerg for the longest time because I did see that it required a level of organization that we never had before. Anyone who says we solely go off numbers or “zerging” is wrong, but they are also not far from the truth.

Unless things changed the times I wasn’t there, I didn’t see much in the way of fortifying/upgrading towers, or in splitting up the zerg when we really didn’t need to have everyone on point attacking the same objectives. Very few if any people running supply, watching for back-caps and staying to hold positions. Very little in the way of support siege being placed, manned, and maintained besides whatever we needed to take down doors/walls, whereas I vividly recall seeing a surplus of that from SoR towards the end of last week besides the fact that their numbers surged.

You’re mostly correct. We don’t do much in the way of fortifying, nor with things such as support siege, or defense in general. However, we’ve always been very careful to keep ourselves supplied as much as we could. In addition to that, what many do not know about the night time zerg, is the fact that the DHA is coordinating the entire time (I believe in specific it is HOT and HVN). There is much that goes on behind the scenes that people are not aware of and then there’s the very smooth running and efficient pug-type zerg going on in addition to that.

Though, to be fair, supportive siege equipment is usually not even particularly helpful because it slows us down due to the requirement of supplies. The zerg only runs as long as it has supplies :P.

“That said, I haven’t been as vocal because I also know we’ve been stuck between a bit of a rock and a hard place, in a way. Our night crew could dominate the night, but we knew we would lose holdings in the day because that’s where SF and SoR had their numbers mainly. That said, I often wondered if, night after night, we might have been better off trying to fortify at all.”

You are perhaps correct, I’m not entirely sure which would be more efficient. On the one hand, doing it blitzkrieg style allowed us to gain an even larger advantage during the night… on the other it left us out in the cold when the sun rose.

“Regardless, our day game needs to be organized. Unfortunately, I play nights and early mornings almost exclusively due to my work schedule. I do what I can when I’m on but I’m also not in a big guild and not a commander.”

Yes, it most certainly does. I play at varying times myself, and Darkhaven could use a lot of improvement on all fronts (especially our day game).

“I think the thing I’m most disappointed about is that this week will teach us nothing if we don’t make an effort to teach ourselves. Fact is, if we don’t make changes now and really work to improve, we’re going to go up in rank and repeat last week, and then probably lose more and numbers to morale. It’ll be a vicious cycle.”

I agree, I just hope people don’t let it go to their heads. This is not exactly fair for either of our opponents, they’re both fighting as hard as they can, but they simply don’t have the numbers.

“I don’t care for us to be a winning, dominant, high tier server, but I feel like we have a ton of potential to be really competitive that may never get utilized because we’ve reached the point in the tiers where numbers alone, even numbers directed with a singular purpose, won’t do it.”

I agree, Darkhaven has a lot of potential. I’m hopeful we’ll see an improvement in our daytime akin to the improvement that came in our night time crew all the sudden, and I’m hopeful the night time crew will improve to do blitzkrieg and yet also give us some defensive capabilities when morning comes.

But yeah, I’m very much in agreement with you on most of your points, and very appreciated that you’ve been so civil while making them. I suppose I’m just tired of people saying Darkhaven has no organization and can only win through numbers (which you did not do, just a more general statement).

All I can say is: If you see a shirtless norn…. run. Run fast, run far. The zerg is behind him and it’s pumped.

Also, fergie always try to come out of the spawn from the front, where we got ALL our siege just waiting for you guys, just a FYI. Get your pugs organized.

Arius.7031:

Pangie.3217:

Kodiack.2783:

Here is a little history lesson for you pros in Darkhaven.
Week 1 we were stuck with Yaks’ Bend, currently ranked 13th.
Week 2-3 we were stuck with NSP, currently ranked 15th.
So excuse us in Anvil Rock if we aren’t impressed with your virtual domination of the map. What your fighting now are the die hards that wont’ quit and jump ship to a winning server.
Here’s another tip. You’re bragging about beating up on the lower 25% of the entire server list. Nobody is impressed.
-K

It’s funny you bring this up because Darkhaven also fought with Yaks bend that week and the last two weeks we fought SoR which is currently ranked 14. So we’re right here with you.

Oh and what you’re fighting now are also the die hards that didn’t give up on DH and jump servers even after we got spanked by Yaks and SoR.

But I will admit that Arius jumped the gun with saying DH won this week. The match up just started and a lot can happen in a week.

Btw, why does it seem that these threads always turn into flame wars? Why can’t we all just enjoy the game and congratulate each other on some good matches? I played a few hours today in Anvil Rock Borderland and it was a lot of fun fighting Anvil Rock.

When did I say we’ve already won? I said we have strong night time organization, but I don’t recall ever having said we’ve won. I really wish people would read my posts before commenting on them.

In your very first post you said this:

Arius.7031:

Hey guys, figured I’d try to get a thread about this match going. Good luck to all parties involved, but Darkhaven is going to win.

So fine you didn’t say we won but you did say we were going to and that’s kind of a fine line.

Pangie, I don’t think you understand how that is meant to be taken. I’m not boasting or saying it’s all but guaranteed, I’m saying that in the spirit of competion, it’s something that is done all the time in sports. I was actually hoping for someone to respond with a similar line, that’s how it usually goes. I didn’t even really mean it, I had no clue if we would win or not.

It’s nothing more than a competitive spirit. I hope you get what I’m trying to say, but I never meant to suggest we were actually going to win.

Arius.7031:

Pangie, I don’t think you understand how that is meant to be taken. I’m not boasting or saying it’s all but guaranteed, I’m saying that in the spirit of competion, it’s something that is done all the time in sports. I was actually hoping for someone to respond with a similar line, that’s how it usually goes. I didn’t even really mean it, I had no clue if we would win or not.

It’s nothing more than a competitive spirit. I hope you get what I’m trying to say, but I never meant to suggest we were actually going to win.

Right, I’ll take your word for it. However if you notice in the post that i was originally quoting it seemed like that person was taking this thread to be us boasting about winning. So I was just replying to that.

Kodiack.2783:

Here’s another tip. You’re bragging about beating up on the lower 25% of the entire server list. Nobody is impressed.

So while you might have started this thread to be sportsman like, just in case you didn’t notice, it didn’t exactly turn out that way.

I don’t think he was responding to me, rather it was to other people. You’ll notice I went out of my way not to brag or count the chickens before they hatched (I made that mistake last match, as some may remember), and he remained very adversarial. So I don’t think it’s really my or really anyone else’s statements that set him off, he just had a chip on his shoulder.

My comment was made in the spirit of a sort of friendly competition, I was trying to get people to demonstrate their server pride but hopefully avoid the trash talking.

Edit: Although, I do stand by my statement (Kodiack was looking for a fight even before that), he may have been responding to iii. Not sure.

Here is an idea…why don’t we go play the game instead of complaining about it on the forums?

The tone of the OP was one of good sportsmanship and you people have just brought it down with your constant complaining…

To the OP, yes indeed good luck to everyone, we have a whole week to make a good fight!

Dark Haven’s got to have one of the most douch bag (purposely spelled it wrong) players I’ve ever played with. Constant /taunting but the ones that do it are the most noobiest and are the ones constantly dieing. nuff said. Stop acting like you’re the SHlT when the other two server is out manned and you’re still dieing 5x more often then us. I’m pretty sure Dark Haven’s got a awesome community but, there’s been too many occasions where i see a lot sore winners.

Arius.7031:

snipped for word length allowances

I’ve been almost all (on vent with the alliance and not) night capping runs DH did in the two week long fights with SoR and SF. I’ve seen how it works and I’ve seen its many flaws. Not once did I see supply camps being taken ahead of time, only the whole zerg would take them. I have heard so many commanders bragging about their scouts, and when the time comes to choose a next target and we choose one to waste an hour on, you can see the inconsistencies clearly. However, I digress.

There’s a few things that characterized the two week long fights between SF/SoR/DH.

1. DH had had a crazy fast night capping crew. This worked during the first week because it was a new thing to the two servers we were facing. We absolutely destroyed at night because no one knew it was coming. Two things happened the next week, SF saw that the night capping was coming and decided to rant about it on forums and SoR decided to deal with it. Guess who won that second week?

2. SoR was the focus on much debate/aggression over hacking the second week. I guarantee you all of this supposed “hacking” happened the first week, but DH didn’t care at all because we were already beating SoR and focusing on SF. In fact, I saw more mesmer tactics pulled by SoR on the first week than the second week and they still lost. The logic that somehow their mesmers were now in fact using third party scripts and exploits is completely ludicrous and completely ignored the fact that SoR fixed their problem of getting night capped.

3. When we night capped, we were winning. When we couldn’t night cap, HOLY CRAP they hacked! That excuse is the lamest thing I’ve seen on these forums yet. We blame our lack of organization and ability to adapt instead on isolated incidents that really didn’t cost us that many points in the long run. If we were really that organized, why didn’t we just wipe the floor with the hackers and get the orb back? Clearly, something else is going on.

To the whole backpadding, this whole thread and the very statement of “but we all know Darkhaven is going to win anyways” gave the tone of self-gratifying bull kitten. Guess who is having the closest weekly match yet? Hint hint, it’s the team that we blamed for hacking and hasn’t been called out once for hacking this week. Guess who is stuck in a lower bracket because we blamed our problems on someone else instead of fixing them? I dare not even give us a hint for that one.

I see next week happening two ways:

1. We’ll of course move up a bracket (if the bracket above us stays stagnant we might jump up two). If we move up one bracket, we’ll have the success of the night zerg again because these tiers of servers can’t muster up a force to defend against it (aka why SoR is now about this tier and we dropped down one) however our day game will again be outplayed and out matched because those servers somewhat understand that blaming your problems doesn’t work so hot for them.

2. If we move up two brackets, we will get demolished. Absolutely wrecked. And I guarantee you that one time some kid sees a mesmer fly hacking, ONE HUNDRED PERCENT of the reason why we lost is because of that incident. I guarantee DH will blame everything about our loss on that lone mesmer that barely impacted the sanctity of WvW.

I’ve been playing mass PvP games for a long time, these types of “blame the other guys for our problems!” arguments will just make us bitter and sitting down in the lower brackets where we already are.

Another rant, but again, it had to be said.

Zulubeast.8519:

Rashka.7304:

Two weeks ago DH was PvEing through the maps at night against SR and SoR. They made it second after SR with only 2k difference.

Last week same matchup and DH thought all they need to do is improving their daytime performance to win that round. While SR gave up on the DH nightzerg SoR pushed back. Hard.

Result was not only that DH gave up after facing reasonable resistance, on top of it certain individuals spread false rumors about guild transfers and hacking. And here, not 24h after they were beaten down one tier the same folks are padding themselves on their shoulders again. Some of DH really need to learn some diginity.

I cannot agree with Rashka more. I’m from Darkhaven and last week was really quite sad. Everyone on DH blamed the hackers and their effect on morale, but all I really saw was SoR shutting down our night game. Hell, I was even on one of the “nightcap” runs where we’d usually flip the whole map on EB in an hour, and we couldn’t even get our own keep back. We’d go from tower to tower flipping it and SoR would be right behind us just retaking it, essentially negating anything that our “uber organized nightcapping team” achieved.

I’ve said it in private and I’ve said it in public on DH and I’ve been shunned hardcore for it. Our zerg tactics with a ton of people on a gate might seem like organization to you all, but it really isn’t. It’s organized to the point of people getting karma all in a ball, but as soon as servers wise up to it (aka SoR), we got shut down. We can only zerg at night in crap brackets and we’ll never move up as a server to higher brackets if that’s the only thing we can do.

Sure, maybe some SoR people hacked. But the fact that people would rather kitten about it on forums/vent all the while SoR was taking towers from us legitimately and then us blaming it on the hackers just shows how out of touch we really are.

As to the new match up:

Everyone on DH is praising how organized we are. That’s a huge load of kitten. We had numbers over both Anvil and Ferguson’s and everyone knows it. Our own borderlands got swamped by Anvil and Ferg by losing all three keeps within an hour (while we had a queue in it) while we were being held even in EB and barely making headway in Anvil borderlands. Only when people from Ferguson’s and Anvil started dropping off and our queues remained did we make headway. We easily took EB (yayyy organization?) with numbers and we finally took back our garrison on DH while…surprise surprise, no one was defending orb up north.

The fact that it took over an hour to take a supply camp. A SUPPLY CAMP with a 3:1 numbers advantage while having the elevation advantage (Longview -> Faithleap) against Anvil just shows to go how little organization we had. At the time we had 3 commanders running around, while our other supply camps were still being taken and the only people communicating via /map or /team were pugs.

I’ve seen way too much backpadding on DH’s side (forums and ingame) about us slamming Ferg and Anvil. Congratulations. We should be. No offense, but we’re 200 points higher than both of them in the overall ratings, we have a much larger population and a lot more players do WvW on DH. DH isn’t going to learn anything from this matchup because we’re wiping the floor because of our population. We’re going to placed in the bracket above us and maybe do well, maybe not. Either way, we’re not going to make any progression with no one wanting to man up and realize our tactics aren’t tactics, they’re just throwing people at the objective.

There are a few commanders on DH that I do enjoy watching, however they’re so few and far between (and hardly play enough) that people don’t actually appreciate anything they’re saying. I’ve yet to see commanders use squad commands besides the supply check, I’ve yet to see multiple commanders working in conjunction with each other (besides standing next to each other at a gate) to ensure our supply camps in our territory are being defended.

Might of been a rant, but I feel it needed to be said. The general tone of this thread is just so depressing as it is.

This guy wins post of the week.
Seriously, freaking wonderful.
<3 A random Ferg member.

fatboy.5016:

im from Sorrows Furnace. Last weeks match up wasnt SoR doing better, They had a pop surge, pretty massive one that tripled their pop. Thus leading to my server and DH gettin squashed. MY suggestion to all sides is, Dont own all bls 100%, those kinds of point scores will raise your ranking yes, But then youll be paired witha server with 50x the time pop size and youll find yourselves squashed again. Now im not saying let someone win, Just dont land your self int he 250k-300k digits, thats a sure jump to land ya somewhere ya cant defend against. As to why im saying this, Fort Aspenwood did this, Guess what, their droping ranks fast now cuz of it.

SoR didn’t have a population surge. During the weekdays the only time BLs had queues was when an event was organized and even EB had no queue most of the time(As a ‘prime time’ casual player that was the first time I had ever seen no queue on EB). 2 weeks ago I was never able to get in EB and last week there was no queue. Overall our WvW population was DOWN. This is hardly a sign of an influx of players.

Bottomline is the reason DH and SF were outmanned so much is that YOUR servers stopped doing wvw. How many posts were there about people who ‘worked on their armor’ or something last week instead of WvWing or how many people said they jumped into a BL and saw 10 people standing in the entrance with no one doing anything and decided to immediately leave?

i have to agree to zulubeast

dh is not organized, we dont have a nightcrew, its just some random zerg that happens to be oceanic, and

oh man these guys have no shame

i mean, i was trying to get a vista in anvils northern camp last night and these guys put up a good fight… holding their only camp for the entire server….

then dark haven nubs decided to do this, what you dont see is about 10 more siege weapons behind the trebs =D

shame on you dark haven! shame on you bullying less populated but better organized servers!

Zulubeast.8519:

snipped for word length allowances

I’ll quote the first sentence of your paragraph to show which paragraph I’m responding to.

I’ve been almost all (on vent with the alliance and not) night capping runs DH did in the two week long fights with SoR and SF

Of course it has many flaws, I never said it was the bomb, just that it was deceptively organized (which it is). Again, yes, mistakes are sometimes made. However, if you were truly there for the night time zergs (I rarely saw you) then you should know full well 95% (random but should be accurate) of the time we choose the perfect target.

1. You’re right, and this is partially attributed to them outnumbering us. I do agree, they did outplay us, but I think their numerical advantage simply gave them an edge we could not really overcome (or didn’t do a good enough job at trying to at least). I mean, think about it, in the zone with the zerg there would always be a similar sized if not larger SoR zerg running around, and then in the other 3 zones we’d have the outmanned buff. What could we do? Our zerg still outperformed any zerg they would get going, but we just couldn’t keep up on 4 maps.

2. Agreed to an extent. I will however have to state that many, many well respected members of the Dh community witnessed SoR players (especially SiN members) flying away on many occasions.

3. Yeah, I never said that it was only because they were hacking. Now, I do think that hacking contributed to a certain extent, but they quite clearly outplayed us regardless of the hacking. Yes it’s true, Dh was disorganized and SoR was quite organized. But the fact is that their numbers did contribute a lot to their victory. If our numbers were even at nighttime, I guarantee you that we would have dominated the entire night. We were still more organized than they were during the night.

Dude! I guess I need to make my intentions more clear, but that was nothing other than jest in the name of friendly competition. It’s like “good luck, BUT YOU’RE GOING DOWN”. It’s not meant to be taken seriously. And it isn’t really trash-talk.

1. Blaming our problems on others is not why we fail during the day. It is, simply put, the fact that we aren’t very organized during the day.

2. Okay.

I guess, just to sum it up, quite clearly you do not understand my position at all. I agree. Blame games do nothing, but that doesn’t mean that there is no truth to the accusations. It’s true, Dh does lack organization. The constant blame games didn’t help the situation. But, SoR, quite clearly, outnumbered us at virtually all times (day and night). More than that, there were quite a few instances of them hacking. When people notice this they don’t want to play. It makes them feel like their work is useless, because it will be easily undone.

You know, at this point, and after seeing the three trebs at the spawn, and the super awesome guys manning them, I hope DH goes up SEVERAL ranks and receive as warm a welcome from higher tier servers . Three trebs off a spawn, an arrow cart, three balistas in the supply, a second arrow cart. Shameless way to kill unsuspecting people. By the way, where are those trebs now? Go spend a few more gold and buy some new ones, we accidentally broke all that garbage.

Classy lol.

I say let them camp a bunch of empty spawn points and play pve for the week.

Then they can move back up the ranks and get stomped again.

Zulubeast,

I’ve always admired your posts and respected your logic. It is certainly sound in many areas. As much as I might be tempted to challenge you on one point, that is not the reason for my post because as usual, you make some keen observations.

You do rant a lot about how weak we are, all the mistakes we make both in WvW performance and how we react to it. You elaborate in great detail all of the things that are wrong with our server and how great others are. You also keep bringing up the point that good servers DO something about their weaknesses. That’s all fine and good.

But I don’t hear any suggestions from you. That is why I am posting this reply to you. We have a fairly well-publicized server alliance website up and running now where suggestions for improvement are more than welcome. It’s also the place to air grievances with what we’re doing/how we’re performing.

So I ask this of you, please. The next time you feel inclined to go on (what I recognize as a very objective) bashing of our own server, highlighting all of its faults, would you please do us the courtesy of making one or two recommendations on what to DO towards improvement?

Like I said, I respect your opinions a great deal and think you’re hitting the nail on the head with a few points, but come on. I can only hear how much we suck from someone for so long until I start yearning for answers that address what we SHOULD do when we do move up a bracket. This is where our server discussion needs to be focused, not just pounding on negativity all the time without addressing the question…what do we need to do to prepare for the next level of warfare?

I tend to look at the positive side. I think we are almost ready for it. Not quite, but very very close and perhaps we’ll be ready before the next reset if we plan and prepare accordingly.

On that note, in the next hour or two I will post two new threads on our server alliance webpage. One making two suggestions that might help address our well-known weakness and the other is to express my clearly expressed dissatisfaction (on numerous occasions within our server) with siege camping spawn points. I refuse to play WvW for the remainder of the week in protest of it, as long as it keeps happening.

I encourage you and all of Darkhaven to participate in those discussions. If you need the web address, I can mail it to you in-game or pst you.

I’ve been playing PVP and RVR for a really long time. What I see on Darkhaven is the classic example of people who only come out to play when the team is winning. I don’t know if it is better on other servers but seeing a queue to get into borderlands this week when we had a skeleton crew last week is sickening. As for our night crew, brag when you can do it against a group like SoR or Yak’s Bend. During our match with Yak’s Bend, we would get on and battle during prime time only to find everything gone in the morning. When SoR started fighting back against the night crew, we got rolfstomped.

Calling people “nubs” because they can’t mount an offensive is just plain stupid. A “nub” is someone who is new or inexperienced at the game, not someone who is trying to fight through overwhelming odds. At least they’re still out in the field fighting. Let me see the half-naked norn fight an even numbered group and live to tell about it, then you can talk.

Rule #1 in battle – respect your opponent.

Last night I hopped into wvw after the update into ferg’s borderlands. (I couldn’t get in before because there was a queue and maybe it’s the time I chose to play but it was the first time I’ve seen a queue in a while.) They had taken some stuff so I ran with a big mob of people taking it back and our last stop was the supply camp up north. When we took it someone dropped a flame ram on their red door. -.- So I just grabbed the vista and left.

I don’t like spawn camping. I hate when it’s done to us and I hate that we’re doing it to others. I don’t get the point. I’d rather lose and go down in a flame of battle than win by spawn camping.

Btw, I’d like that link Worban. Thanks.

The only time I actually participated on this matchup was on the first night of it. After seeing how we can dominate, I just started in doing my map completion. The WvWvW queues in all maps were pretty much people trying to do the map completion and jump puzzles. Next week will be back to normal ones we are matched up with the higher tiers as PvE people will start to go back to PvE. I guess its just time to stack up on siege items for next week’s matchup.

Got 1 week to do that jump puzzles so hopefully all the PvP guilds will take this opportunity to stock up on siege items.

On second thought, keep up the good work DH, I made 140k karma, 6 gold, a lot xp (I made 80 3 more times today), and got a friend in game a new great sword(thanks undermanned buff). I’m sure all of your players are doing just as well as our little 2-4 man crews are. Keep trebbing the spawn walls for hours walls, we’ll keep flipping your camps.

Were camping the spawn?? -.- so glad i haven’t stepped foot in wvw since this week. I absolutly hate spawn camping. But hey, atleast Dovgan found a good side to all the shannigans. glad your havin fun with it sorry that people on my server are alil…uh… “mean” (can’t say what i want to say)

All in all I hope you guys get a better matchup next week.. DH has the numbers this week and honestly…its no fun. I’d rather be the outnumbered server.

Also to all of those people that are NOT in any of these 3 servers and still posting here please stop belittling Anvil and Fergy. Every week during the matchup there will ALWAYS be “flame chat” between oppossing sides. It’s just natural. So when the week is done just move on and start flamin the other contesting servers you are currently facing.

Besides all of that i’d like to say one thing…. I love you guys. ;D lol