Guild Wars 2

Okay I’ll take a deep breath here as I know I’m about to get a lot of vitriole for this but I saw a thread asking about the breach in code of conduct with 2v1ing in wvw. So honestly I don’t want to mention any specific match-ups or anything. (it’s against the forum rules anyways) I just wanted to point out how the continued existence of manipulating scores could be justified as a breach of the code of conduct and what ignoring it might mean.

The code of conduct clearly labels match manipulation as any action that manipulates the outcome of a match or ratings/rankings in a ladder. A fair argument could be made that this does both. I can show plenty of screenshots (though this would bring this topic into match up discussion which obviously I cannot do) of one zerg camping bodies while another from a different server captures the point, with no in-fighting at all. This is clearly 2v1ing. So the proof is obvious.

Is WvW PvP? Well according to Anet it is as stated on their Competitive Play page. So then that would mean WvW falls under those rules.

Is ganging up on one person with a friend a breach of conduct then? Well obviously no. You are both from the same server so it is not changing the nature of the game in anyway (certainly they could match you person for person with a flat cap) and more over it is not manipulating the score at the end of the week to rig it a certain and unnatural way. It’s playing the game as intended.

Also temporarily working together to take a keep or something would probably not breach the contract if it was simply a once-and-done action. After all this would not in any serious way affect the score at the end of the week. The real problem is just massive, around-the-clock manipulation of scores through very deliberate and obviously so cooperation.

What would ignoring this breach of contract mean? Well should anyone really be silly enough to waste time on a lawyer it would give them plausible cause to violate more aspects of the code of conduct without punishment as Anet would not have maintained the code in this incident. Certainly no one wants this.

I guess the best question is what could really be done about this? Certainly banning everyone from the servers participating in such action would be bad. There’s no arguing that. Even servers being 2v1ed don’t want to have zero competition. They want to play hard and be rewarded for it. Having all your competitors banned would be bad.

Blocking anyone caught 2v1ing in WvW from entering WvW for the remainder of the week would be a steep penalty as well though probably more reasonable than outright banning the account. So the question I pose is what could Anet actually do to rectify such a thing that would not be considered over-aggressive?

WvWvW is not PvP and the devs have stated so. Stop the whinning, 2v1 is allowed in a 3 way. If anything was being done against the rules, Anet would have stepped in already.

So a dev says this

From the earliest days of development, we knew that we wanted to include some form of large-scale PvP combat in Guild Wars 2, but how would it work? We knew right away that we wanted three teams fighting against one another on a series of huge maps in the Mists (our world vs. world battleground) and that each team would be composed of an entire server full of players. Including three forces in world vs. world acts as an excellent balancing factor, preventing one team from growing too powerful and ruining the competitive balance of the game. Two teams can gang up to counter a more dominant third team, a dynamic that simply isn’t possible with only two opposing factions.

And another dev says this

At no point did I, or would I have, said “Fair competition” WvW is not intended to be “fair”. There are servers with more people, there are servers with better organizations and that will always be the case. This competition will be about showing how your world can do over a defined period of time, against a variety of opponents. SPvP is the part of our game that aims for a completely level playing field. WvW would never be able to match that goal.

Two more devs says this

16min 30sec mark

I agree discussing 2v1 is not bad though. It’s just pointless at this point. Everything that has needed to be said about the issue has already been said over and over again. Your post brings absolutely nothing new to the debate as there was already a thread asking if the 2v1 was a breach of contract.

Shepherd.5839:

Also temporarily working together to take a keep or something would probably not breach the contract if it was simply a once-and-done action. After all this would not in any serious way affect the score at the end of the week. The real problem is just massive, around-the-clock manipulation of scores through very deliberate and obviously so cooperation.

Lets look at the so called rule:

While participating in Plaver-vs-Player (PvP) gameplay, you will not participate in any form of match manipulation. Match manipulation is defined as any action taken to fix or manipulate the outcome of a match or alter or manipulate the rankings or ratings of the ladder. This also includes disrupting other people’s game experience by not actively participating in matches in good faith, a.k.a leeching.

There can’t be an exception so in your case. Either it is or it isn’t. If temporary working to achieve a single goal (hitting a WP) is fine then doing it constantly is fine. If temporary is not ok then constantly is not ok. The rule doesn’t have exceptions so neither should your cases. It is either one way or the other you can’t have it both. Therefore, either 2v1 has existed for a very long time and it is not ok. Or it is ok and it is just the nature of WvW. As for temporary one can say the 2v1 is temporary just for S2.

Does transfers count as match manipulation? What if I and a bunch of other guilds who I’m friends with decided to mass transfer before S2 to say bronze league and stack it for an easy win. Does it count? Why is it only 2v1? Servers in a 2v1 still have to work to 2v1 something. In the same way groups of people stacking a server still has to work to win. Same thing.

On top of that the rule does say to include “disrupting other people’s game experience by not actively participating in matches” . I would say said server that is getting 2v1 is breaking this rule since they aren’t going in WvW even though they are online. I have seen said guilds in EotM and such. And there are people from said server that specifically stated they will not join WvW because of “2v1” . I would say these individuals should be punished since they are breaking rule 22 and ruining my experience in this WvW match since it is boring with no fights. And said server showed up in numbers and force the day before. On top of that how about people that only participate during W1 and they don’t participate in any other week. They still get chest rewards and S2 rewards. Isn’t that against rule 22 since they are leeching rewards?

As you can see this rule doesn’t apply to WvW because if it doesn’t apply to things like leeching or not actively participating which is against rule 22. For sPvP this applies when someone afks a match and such.

Dear OP,

It seems you skipped Rule 1.

While playing Guild Wars 2, you must respect the rights of others and their rights to play and enjoy the Game. To this end, you may not defraud, harass, threaten, embarrass or cause distress and/or unwanted attention to other players.

You and your servermates constantly crying about 2v1 is interfering with my right to play and enjoy this game. Your constant attempts to threaten, embarrass, and cause distress to those who are on servers that engage in 2v1 is clearly in violation of Rule 1 of the code of conduct.

Please take action in concert with your respect for the rules and delete your account.

Thank you.

I think it’s an incredible testament to the determination of two servers committed to double teaming a third, stronger opponent.

Every time i’ve tried to organize one of these 2v1s they’ve backfired on the 2, especially as the match gets closer to the end.

Props to you (you know who you are) for maintaining your aggressive 2v1.

It’s not easy to get a whole server onboard with an organized push similar to what has been going on, let alone 2.

SO that said, 2v1s were a part of WVW game design.

It sucks to be the meat in the sandwich, but at the end of the day, what is the harm?

you loose a wvw matchup? you get third in the tournament instead of first?

I guess i’m blessed to be on a server that doesn’t give two kittens where we fall in the tournament, we just want to have a good fight.

If Anet thought 2v1 was bad then wvw would b 1 v 1.

It’s pretty simple really. 2v1 on it’s own is fine and plays an important role. Two servers sharing the same TeamSpeak for direct coordination, keep/tower and camp exchanges to manipulate the score and farm wxp, and trading 1st place weekly to manipulate the tournament score is when it is not.

YouTube or it never happened or whatever…

Drakh.3128:

It’s pretty simple really. 2v1 on it’s own is fine and plays an important role. Two servers sharing the same TeamSpeak for direct coordination, keep/tower and camp exchanges to manipulate the score and farm wxp, and trading 1st place weekly to manipulate the tournament score is when it is not.

If they coordinate karma trains apart from each other, what is holding you back to fight one of the servers?

Wanze.8410:

Drakh.3128:

It’s pretty simple really. 2v1 on it’s own is fine and plays an important role. Two servers sharing the same TeamSpeak for direct coordination, keep/tower and camp exchanges to manipulate the score and farm wxp, and trading 1st place weekly to manipulate the tournament score is when it is not.

If they coordinate karma trains apart from each other, what is holding you back to fight one of the servers?

They are not apart and it’s not really a karma train in the sense that not everyone gets the cap, one just watches while the other takes and caps while leaving a small group inside the same objective so after the 5 minutes they can just re-kill the lord to flip it again. Fights involve a tag team; when one server gets beat up and starts loosing they disengage and let the fresh server finish off the fight for them.

Rules are rules & apply to everyone.

HARDOFREADING.7298:

Rules are rules & apply to everyone.

And its been clearly stated by Anet that 2v1 is not breaking any rules.

2v1 is not wrong.

what is wrong is boasting about it when you basically can’t beat the other team without 2v1’ing them….

ghtchill.7613:

HARDOFREADING.7298:

Rules are rules & apply to everyone.

And its been clearly stated by Anet that 2v1 is not breaking any rules.

And there is nothing wrong with a 2v1. The question: is the collusion along with the wxp and tournament manipulation acceptable?

And I ask the redundant question, is stacking a server for 24hr coverage not Manipulation?

azizul.8469:

2v1 is not wrong.

what is wrong is boasting about it when you basically can’t beat the other team without 2v1’ing them….

So no-one is doing anything wrong then.

I still don’t know why everyone keeps using the term “2v1” to describe what’s happening this Season. This isn’t a “2v1”, this is MATCH-FIXING.

This isn’t a case of 2 servers hitting the same Garrison at the same time because each of them wants to take it. This isn’t 1 server seeing an enemy getting pushed from the north, and deciding to take their unprotected camps & towers in the south. This isn’t a server refusing to join a fight because they are passively working on upgrades while the other 2 servers duke it out.

This is a case of 2 servers sending a group of representatives to weekly meetings with each other in TeamSpeak, where they decide which server will take 1st place, & which will take 2nd during the next week’s match. Each week, one of these servers AGREES to take 2nd place, allowing the other server to take 1st. That is match-fixing, plain & simple.

Even in the most severe 2v1, all 3 servers are at least attempting to win the match, even if they know they have very little chance. They are at least trying to place as highly in the match as they can. In this case, the servers involved are NOT playing to win, they are each playing towards a previously agreed upon outcome to the match.

So please, when talking about the current situation in Season 2, stop calling it a “2v1”. This is something else. This is Match-Fixing, which in ANY other game or sport in the world, would generally be called “Cheating”.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Match_fixing

As mentioned yes the fact is they are doing far more than working together to flip any one point. What is happening is very deliberate manipulation of the overall score with an intent to make this last the entire season. You can check the forum and see even discussions about bringing this further to deliberately setting things up for the detriment of a specific server.

I am not mentioning names but those of you who are ARE in fact guilty of infractions so I would caution you. I expect criticism and even welcome it, but please keep all match-ups and server names out of the discussion thank you.

My point to make was that deliberately fixing multiple weeks certainly qualifies under their description of match manipulation and also under their website’s definition of PvP, as they say that World vs World is Player vs Player. This means in a strictly legal sense they are breaching the code of conduct and my point was to explain how that technically sets a precedent to breach other elements of conduct.

The forums are optional so I am not infringing on your right to enjoy the game by posting this but nice try tho.

The main point of this post was I wanted to see an honest discussion about the match-fixing problem and how Anet could actually go about fixing it. I’ve heard people say change up the leagues because only six servers doesn’t work so well for the format but they can’t really just add more servers that would only affect the lower leagues in probability. So do they merge leagues or seek some alternative solution?

All I’ve got to say is this..

2v1 is not bad. It is bad when the 2 share the win, they alternate 1st and 2nd. It is also bad when you lose to get a better match up. Why? Because this is game fixing. See Wikipedia on Match Fixing

Is match fixing wrong? Yes. See Rules of Conduct #22

Wait it says it only applies to PvP. Does it apply also to WvW? Yes of course. See Wiki definition of World versus World

I’d also like to add that I highly doubt a clearly competent company like Arena Net would want match-fixing to occur in their game. It doesn’t really mean good things for the longevity of a game where there is no reason to be on any server but the ones that are teaming up (since the one losing cannot possibly win, whereas currently there are well known dominant servers but at least the other servers COULD match their numbers if they got more players). I mean why bother playing if you cannot possibly win? And if there is no reason to play then why bother paying?

Also for the record yes I am from Blackgate yeah it does seem obvious. But I’ve been in Blackgate since beta so yeah didn’t switch over for the win. Honestly wouldn’t care if we were losing if it wasn’t in a fight that we actually cannot possibly change whether we show up with full numbers or not at all. Doesn’t matter how many players we have.

“Matchup fixing problem that Anet needs to do something about” != “My server is losing problem and all I can think to do is cry on the forums.”

Shepherd.5839:

What is happening is very deliberate manipulation of the overall score with an intent to make this last the entire season.

When I cap a camp or stomp an enemy player, I am “very deliberately manipulating the overall score” and I have full intent to make this manipulation effort last the entire season.

You, and any other player arguing against 2-vs-1 are resorting to empty rhetorics in a futile attempt to gain support to a self-invented set of imaginary rules on how WvW is supposed to be played. In doing so, you are persistently ignoring the very clear statements made by game developers themselves, or claiming arbitrary restrictions to what they must have meant.

WvW is one-on-one-on-one for one and one reason only, to make it possible for two sides to make an alliance and beat the snot out of the third party. It is not something that is overlooked or ignored by the developers — it’s a core feature of the game format! Spontaneously forming alliances are not a sign of “dirty play” or the game breaking apart; instead, they’re a sign of the format starting to fulfill its potential.

Discussing 2v1 is not bad, but it certainly is futile, unless you are seeking advice on how to not constantly be the one getting allied against.

Its not a breach of anything my friend.

Its servers with lower population density finally started to work together and play the game the way it was intended: WvWvW. There are three W’s in there for a good reason. You’d better respect the fact that PPT players finally started thinking out of the box and use something called strategy and politics.

Yes, your server with population #1 will be placed #3 or even #4 this season. Maybe you should think about it before you start new season and before you start buying guilds, organizing server blackouts and all other fun stuff that hurts PPT feelings

Maybe stacking as many players in one spot as possible is not the only winning strategy for ppt game!
Just think about it for a minute

tmakinen.1048:

You, and any other player arguing against 2-vs-1 are resorting to empty rhetorics in a futile attempt to gain support to a self-invented set of imaginary rules on how WvW is supposed to be played. In doing so, you are persistently ignoring the very clear statements made by game developers themselves, or claiming arbitrary restrictions to what they must have meant.

It’s funny when you search for “match manipulation” on google or bing you get links to guild wars 1 or guild wars 2 forums.

CuRtoKy.8576:

Lets look at the so called rule:

While participating in Plaver-vs-Player (PvP) gameplay, you will not participate in any form of match manipulation. Match manipulation is defined as any action taken to fix or manipulate the outcome of a match or alter or manipulate the rankings or ratings of the ladder. This also includes disrupting other people’s game experience by not actively participating in matches in good faith, a.k.a leeching.

There can’t be an exception so in your case. Either it is or it isn’t. If temporary working to achieve a single goal (hitting a WP) is fine then doing it constantly is fine. If temporary is not ok then constantly is not ok. The rule doesn’t have exceptions so neither should your cases. It is either one way or the other you can’t have it both. Therefore, either 2v1 has existed for a very long time and it is not ok. Or it is ok and it is just the nature of WvW. As for temporary one can say the 2v1 is temporary just for S2.

Does transfers count as match manipulation? What if I and a bunch of other guilds who I’m friends with decided to mass transfer before S2 to say bronze league and stack it for an easy win. Does it count? Why is it only 2v1? Servers in a 2v1 still have to work to 2v1 something. In the same way groups of people stacking a server still has to work to win. Same thing.

On top of that the rule does say to include “disrupting other people’s game experience by not actively participating in matches” . I would say said server that is getting 2v1 is breaking this rule since they aren’t going in WvW even though they are online. I have seen said guilds in EotM and such. And there are people from said server that specifically stated they will not join WvW because of “2v1” . I would say these individuals should be punished since they are breaking rule 22 and ruining my experience in this WvW match since it is boring with no fights. And said server showed up in numbers and force the day before. On top of that how about people that only participate during W1 and they don’t participate in any other week. They still get chest rewards and S2 rewards. Isn’t that against rule 22 since they are leeching rewards?

As you can see this rule doesn’t apply to WvW because if it doesn’t apply to things like leeching or not actively participating which is against rule 22. For sPvP this applies when someone afks a match and such.

First off working together to take down a keep or camp etc isn’t the same as rigging the whole season. In the end you are both attempting to win, you are merely joining forces to take down one point harming both of you. This is not fixing a week by agreeing that one server will come in second and the other will come in first etc. That is match-fixing. The thing here is temporary alliances versus permanent alliances. A permanent alliance is attempting to manipulate the ratings and result of a match whereas the temporary alliance to take the keep is simply setting out to take out a keep, not rig the end result.

Second, do server transfers count as manipulation? So you know there is a population cap on the borderlands right? Of course it’s not manipulation, you are all still restricted to the overall cap of the map. And you also can’t play around the clock for a full week so you may be an awesome group of friends but you can’t win the week by yourself. You are simply getting your friends to your server so you can all work together through the existing systems to accomplish a goal.

Third it says not actively participating in matches. If you aren’t playing WvW you aren’t participating in matches at all, actively or otherwise. Actively implies that you aren’t afking in the match. If you aren’t in structured pvp are you violating the code of conduct? Do we all need to immediately jump into a match? Of course not. However match-fixing is not something you can do unintentionally. I have in fact not contradicted myself but I’m glad I got a chance to elaborate further.

Shepherd.5839:

snip

Same thing. Either you have match manipulation or you don’t. Either all 2v1 counts or not. You can’t have an exception. If you do then what is consider an exception? If said server getting 2v1 is when 2v1 is bad? One point or one server is the same. Objectively speaking it is all to achieve the same goal. Define temporary. I can say this 2v1 is temporary since it occurred during W3 till now. Even then you see the 2 servers are taking stuff from each other mid week for this week and last week. On top of that fact that this is temporary for S2. Perma 2v1 would be like if a server gets 2v1ed preSeason, during season, and after seasons for the next 4 months. Who determines that? You? The one from said server getting 2v1?

If it is manipulating rating then I would say transfers are the biggest offenders of match manipulation. Since by stacking you are manipulating said rating. Boosting it through stacking on one server. This can be through guilds allied with each other on their previous server and decide together to move somewhere to win.

You know there is no server with 24 hour 4 BL queues. Hence population will always matter. So if say 10-20 guilds (100 member each with 20-30 daily in WvW) join AR right before S2 to stack and win Bronze that isn’t match manipulation? So right now HoD is winning against FA cause they are simply better. In fact the fights are always even like 50v50 and for some reason FA just flat out suck. Just because your server uses said transfers to stack over the last year doesn’t mean you should try hard to defend said practices as not match manipulation when they can be.

And you agree working with existing system. 2v1 is one of them. It is WvWvW for a reason not WvW (1v1) . You are talking to your friends on to work together to accomplish something. Just happens your friends are on another said server. On top of that the results are based on keeping the 2v1. Even if it isn’t discussed you wouldn’t want to win say 3 times in a row cause that means you are now the focus of the 2v1. Nobody in their right minds would do that. No commander or server leader would do that.

The rule 22 only applies to sPvP not WvW. It isn’t about if I’m in sPvP. It is about the match. sPvP matches don’t start unless I join them. Whereas, WvW is constant. Right now a match is occurring. Therefore, if you invoke rule 22 on WvW it must apply now regardless since the match is in progress. For sPvP this isn’t the case. To further this logic think about it this way. I’m not in a match so I won’t get a reward. If I’m in a match (by joining it) I get a reward. Therefore, if said rule truly applied for both sPvP and WvW it has to act the same way. If I get a reward at the end of the match that means I am in a match otherwise I wouldn’t get a reward like it is in sPvP. For WvW you get a reward at the end of the week regardless if you play 5 days of WvW that week or 1 day or nothing. Even for Season rewards you will get it even if you only participated during W1. This shows that you are automatically in a match for WvW since if you weren’t it would be like sPvP where you wouldn’t get a reward. Since you are in a match automatically then rule 22 is automatically applies to everyone on every server for WvW. Therefore, if rule 22 applies as you wanted it to then said server getting 2v1 should be punished because they are intentionally ruining my fun (along with others) by not showing up and instead showing up in EotM or in other areas of the game when they mostly WvW. Or as some posted stated in some other locked threads that they intentionally do not play WvW because of 2v1.

If you use something it has to be used in all cases. You can’t have a narrow definition because the rule doesn’t allow that. It clearly spells out what the rule is and where it is applied. If you want to apply it to WvW you have to apply it fully. You can’t say well in Case A it doesn’t apply because X,Y,Z (example temp 2v1) whereas in Case B it does apply because W is happening (3 weeks worth of 2v1).

How is it match fixing it one server said hey I don’t want to win multiple times in a row because then I will be the focus of the 2v1 like the server getting 2v1 right now cause they won W1, W2. If said server getting 2v1 decides to not show up because of 2v1 then isn’t it the fault of that server because they don’t show up (proof is said server had time of high PPT the other day).

As you can see rule 22 doesn’t apply. WvW is never meant to be fair. If you want fair maybe something like this: lock all BLs at 100 people on each side. Each guild can only queue in 20 people per BL (balance between dedicated guilds vs pugs). No more than 5 guilds with 6+ members per BL.

In 3 party matches, parties forming alliances is an obvious and intended aspect of the format. Forming an alliance, or 2v1 or whatever you want to call it, is as much match manipulation as capturing camps is.

Aomine.5012:

The players are the ones who decide the assault, and they decide to take a short break so that they did not assault as much as they suppose to, that’s a breach of conduct?

Short break, I don’t think it means what you think it means.

Aomine.5012:

I heard people here blabbing about match manipulation.
So one server give up because they are no match and let the other 2 server PPT as much as possible is match manipulation? When SoS and BG destined to faceroll Mag and Db and FORCE them to 5th and 6th, is it not match manipulation?

Stop making excuses.
Just say it out load BG, you want to be TOP and faceroll everyone right?
You want other servers to be idiotic and get your deserved first reward right?
I never see so much complaint and using code of conduct excuses before when the match result of the lower server is heavily manipulated by the stronger servers, but this time BG got manipulated once and they cry so loud.

Just adding a side note, you so called match fix-up is simply just we focus on taking BG stuffs, which is just like you taking everything from Mag and DB, there’s no difference.
The players are the ones who decide the assault, and they decide to take a short break so that they did not assault as much as they suppose to, that’s a breach of conduct?

Please read the thread before responding. What we are discussing here is not taking a break from fighting one server to fight another. It’s not even two servers happening to attack the one server’s side at the sametime. It’s very intentional teamwork for the long term goal of changing the overall rankings in the season 2 ladder. Like I said in the OP I can give you screenshots of a zerg from one server capturing a tower while forces from the third server camp our bodies and just let them take it. That is because it was decided that server would only get 2nd that week so they mostly cleared us out so the other could cap.

Also I would like to remind people AGAIN that we are not allowed to discuss particular match-ups and in all probability it is an infraction to do so. AGAIN I caution you to not use particular server names/match-ups in this post.

CuRtoKy.8576:

Shepherd.5839:

snip

Same thing. Either you have match manipulation or you don’t. Either all 2v1 counts or not. You can’t have an exception. If you do then what is consider an exception? If said server getting 2v1 is when 2v1 is bad? One point or one server is the same. Objectively speaking it is all to achieve the same goal.

If it is manipulating rating then I would say transfers are the biggest offenders of match manipulation. This can be through guilds allied with each other on their previous server and decide together to move somewhere to win.

And you agree working with existing system. 2v1 is one of them. It is WvWvW for a reason not WvW (1v1) . You are talking to your friends on to work together to accomplish something. Just happens your friends are on another said server. On top of that the results are based on keeping the 2v1. Even if it isn’t discussed you wouldn’t want to win say 3 times in a row cause that means you are now the focus of the 2v1. Nobody in their right minds would do that. No commander or server leader would do that.

The rule 22 only applies to sPvP not WvW. It isn’t about if I’m in sPvP. It is about the match. sPvP matches don’t start unless I join them. Whereas, WvW is constant. Right now a match is occurring. Therefore, if you invoke rule 22 on WvW it must apply now regardless since the match is in progress.

As you can see rule 22 doesn’t apply. WvW is never meant to be fair. If you want fair maybe something like this: lock all BLs at 100 people on each side.

Okay I guess you did not understand my original answer to you. Match-fixing is working with another party to deliberately set up results to your personal choosing. So If every week is a match for WvW then to be deliberately manipulating the match would be making efforts to determine not through skill or gameplay but pre-planning, in coordination with another server, exactly who would be in what position at the end of the week. Saying, hey lets all take out that keep over there and then we can start murdering each other again is not determining the end results of the week or match, it is merely coming together to determine the outcome of a single point at a single period of time. There is a difference though I AM sure you will still say otherwise.

Second I DID say working within the system. That is correct. Using external communication such as teamspeak to coordinate the actions of two servers in a borderlands is not working within the system it is in fact working without. Contrary to popular belief the program Teamspeak is NOT an ArenaNet program. What a surprise, I know right?

Once again server transfers isn’t manipulating. You are deciding you want to move to a new server for whatever reasons but you have no guarantees (and you yourself cannot guarantee) that it will mean you win. You won’t find out till it’s over. And no matter how many you transfer over you still can only get that certain amount in and having more than that just means how long your queues are.

So you aren’t breaking the code of conduct with sPvP because you didn’t choose to enter an sPvP match? I thought that was what I said with WvW but I guess I’ll explain it again. There is clearly a button to enter the mists. I can choose to click it… or just not go there. Therefore I have a deliberate choice to either enter WvW or not. So yeah, not breaking code by not coming in. Also it is VERY funny that the counter to the argument of match-manipulation in WvW is “you guys not coming to the borderlands is breaking code 1 by ruining my gameplay.” I hardly think rule 1 is going to apply to WvW in that way BUT since you insist, the other servers purposely fixing match results is ruining my gameplay so they are all in violation of the code of conduct. Does that sound better? I doubt it.

Also to that last bit they let an even number of people in from all three servers, no server has a higher pop cap than the others, so not sure what you meant there. Sounds like aside from guild-specific blocking (which doesn’t make sense, guilds trying to win with their guild members from the same server is exactly what wvw is. You do know we are discussing two servers rigging the weekly matchups together right?) your suggestion already exists, i.e. even pop caps.

#Tears

Take your loss like a man, you’re only reinforcing the behavior.

2v1 is a perfectly viable tactic in an imbalanced game mode. One server stack more WvW guilds? One server boast and chest thump incessantly? Want to knock them off their high horse? 2v1! An all out 2v1 sucks for all involved, so you know you made lots of people mad to be on the receiving end of such an attack.

As for me, if its red its dead. I may focus one server over another but I will not adhere to any complete 2v1.

I hope this tactic permiates through the tiers so the imbalanced match ups become a little close. Of course I do not mean all out 2v1, but the two servers with less coverage/population focusing the larger server but still playing for first.

I think this would offer a much more interesting battlefield if people were willing to take advantage of it.

Shepherd.5839:

I deleted my original post because I know the forum is on your side.
I’ll be extra careful for now on, to act just like you, using pretty words to cover the true meaning of the complaints of one particular server that can’t be said.

Sadly I never see people like you jump out and arguing about the secret rules of GW2 before one particular server got in a bad position. Season 2 sure is entertaining.

Honestly this entire posts should be infracted already, not just some posts.

God my day was boring, thank you for the entertainment.

I would like to be invited to these TS meetings between these two servers because they’re certainly news to me. 0_0

The 2v1 in a certain match is not about fair fights in WvW. It’s not even about unfair fights in WvW.

Fundamentally, it’s about not having to fight in WvW.

It’s strategically smart and within the rules.

I think 2v1 is an intended part of the game, there are tons of counter measures in place for it, especially during a tournament like this where one of the 2v1 servers will keep getting dropped out of the matchup.

Win trading to make sure that doesn’t happen is certainly against the defined rule. It gets even worse when it is possible to trade wins to first and second place with no legit wins.

If anet finds this was the case they should take action.

Listen enough with the 2v1 QQ you guys just followed the old meta of buying every guild you could and stacked all time zones unfortunately for you the other servers found a new meta to combat that. Your current try at forum QQ meta isn’t working to break it so try harder.

BAITness.1083:

I think 2v1 is an intended part of the game, there are tons of counter measures in place for it, especially during a tournament like this where one of the 2v1 servers will keep getting dropped out of the matchup.

Win trading to make sure that doesn’t happen is certainly against the defined rule. It gets even worse when it is possible to trade wins to first and second place with no legit wins.

If anet finds this was the case they should take action.

I don’t think any action will be taken. It is not possible that they do not know about this. They would most likely change the system in the future to reduce this type of exchanging win. This is the first time i see game tournament to allow exchanging win.

Guys respect Anet decision on this. It is no use trying to bring up this topic again. If you don’t like it maybe it is time to do something you enjoy doing.

blur.7905:

Guys respect Anet decision on this. It is no use trying to bring up this topic again. If you don’t like it maybe it is time to do something you enjoy doing.

ANET condoned match fixing and objective trading? I must have missed that post, care to link it for me?

At least anet should give BG players some special reward. Full ascended gear set for example. Everybody knows that BG is best server and moral winner.

Drakh.3128:

blur.7905:

Guys respect Anet decision on this. It is no use trying to bring up this topic again. If you don’t like it maybe it is time to do something you enjoy doing.

ANET condoned match fixing and objective trading? I must have missed that post, care to link it for me?

What i mean is that Anet should know about this by now and they chose to do nothing. From the Guild War 2 utube they also say they like the new system and seem to know the alliance.

Tell ya what BG, if you send me 2,000g from your warchest I will lead a group off a cliff once daily until season 2 is over.

Lemming Parade?

Simple facts of the matter, it’s match fixing and match manipulation, to the detriment of another whole server of players and apart from all of that, it’s tantamount to nothing short of intentional griefing of another whole server’s community.
Most of it also based purely out of childish hatred, lies and constant abusive trolling by the servers that have been participating in the the match fixing/manipulation.

I honestly feel sorry for a lot of the better half of the community on those 2 servers involved in the match fixing/manipulation as they have seen their community destroyed and tainted badly by the exploitative manipulation of matches, again, based on childish hatred.
Not even based on the ability of one server to win over another, it’s purely based on trying to demoralise another servers’ militia community and that has been made clear many times publicly by many of the guilds and community leadership from the two servers involved in the match fixing/manipulation.

The choice that Anet has taken to totally ignore the matter goes some way to explaining why no gamer of any worth will take their attempts at professional esports seriously, ever. Never mind the mess of grouping 6 servers in a Swiss style tournament, 3 of them utterly out of their depth and nothing, absolutely nothing put in place to deter or hinder the ability to manipulate and fix matches.

The fact also that a lot of commanders on both servers involved in the match manipulation weren’t even made aware (and still now some aren’t aware) that their community/guild leaderships on both servers exchanged full lists of commanders’ account names between them is also quite shocking, not to mention also a potential security risk as apparently more than account names were shared.

ballymun.3986:

Simple facts of the matter, it’s match fixing and match manipulation, to the detriment of another whole server of players and apart from all of that, it’s tantamount to nothing short of intentional griefing of another whole server’s community.
Most of it also based purely out of childish hatred, lies and constant abusive trolling by the servers that have been participating in the the match fixing/manipulation.

I honestly feel sorry for a lot of the better half of the community on those 2 servers involved in the match fixing/manipulation as they have seen their community destroyed and tainted badly by the exploitative manipulation of matches, again, based on childish hatred.
Not even based on the ability of one server to win over another, it’s purely based on trying to demoralise another servers’ militia community and that has been made clear many times publicly by many of the guilds and community leadership from the two servers involved in the match fixing/manipulation.

The choice that Anet has taken to totally ignore the matter goes some way to explaining why no gamer of any worth will take their attempts at professional esports seriously, ever. Never mind the mess of grouping 6 servers in a Swiss style tournament, 3 of them utterly out of their depth and nothing, absolutely nothing put in place to deter or hinder the ability to manipulate and fix matches.

tldr – QQ!!!

It’s fairly obvious that this thread isn’t about 2v1 in the abstract. Blackgate is upset that they are losing for what they perceive to be no good reason. And it is true that they are. The problem is that they were never winning for any good reason, either. Winning due to coverage/population and losing due to continuous 2v1 are the same. These are systemic factors that have nothing to do with how well any side played from a strategic or tactical point of view.

As I posted in the previous thread, I really do hope that this experience will finally teach T1 that the score is competitively meaningless. It is not indicative of how well you, your guild, or your server played.

BAITness.1083:

I think 2v1 is an intended part of the game, there are tons of counter measures in place for it, especially during a tournament like this where one of the 2v1 servers will keep getting dropped out of the matchup.

Win trading to make sure that doesn’t happen is certainly against the defined rule. It gets even worse when it is possible to trade wins to first and second place with no legit wins.

If anet finds this was the case they should take action.

Take action so that one particular whiny server can ensure their TOP status right?

Seriously if that particular server is as good as they made it be, they should have defeated the other 2 already, despite it’s 2v1. When you fight the 3 underdogs of T1, that surely is no problem to that particular server right? This time you can’t do it on 2 stronger ones, so that particular server whines as loud as they can.

(I am not allowed to discuss server names, go fill the name in yourself with your brain)