Guild Wars 2

Downed state and rallying should be removed from WvW altogether, imo. If you’re dead, you’re dead.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Dee Jay.2460:

Yes, downed-state is without doubt a terrible mechanic in PvP. Probably the single worst mechanic I’ve ever seen in an MMO.

But it’s no surprise this thread sunk to the bottom without a response. The editing and layout is terrible and presented as a wall of text. Nobody’s going to read that.

I apologize, I’ll try harder to impress those highly seated in academics next time when submitting my application.
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It’s also no surprise to me that someone like yourself would take the time to read it only to give a negative response.

To be fair, I skipped to the end as well looking for a summary. You need to be concise.

If we’re taking a vote, I would vote for auto opening the map to choose a waypoint once you are stomped/dead dead. No more dead spying, zerg rezzing, or loitering.

I will only add that independent of downed v. dead states, once a person is dead in WvW, there should be a timer on their removal from opponents towers, keeps, etc. Dead people don’t spy.

merkator.9206:

Enenion.8127:

I think rallying is fine, but stomping should be much more permanent. If you’re fighting a larger force, whether it be 2v3 or 20v30, if you can’t wipe all the enemy they can pick their guys right back up and continue as normal. Once you’re truly defeated you should have to waypoint out. This puts much more emphasis on saving someone while they are downed and can help thin out the zergs as they can be affected by attrition. By killing a few members at a time you’d eventually be able to wipe a zerg, but that’s just not possible when they can just res the 2-3 people you killed.

No offense, but that is idiotic. Next time you are in a fight where you are stomped but your side wins, think about how fun it would be to WP and take another 5 minutes to solo run back to the group of people you were fighting with.

Its not supposed to be fun. That’s why its a deterrent. Don’t die.

No hard rezing. You die you have to hit a waypoint. 1-2 players max can rally off a kill.
Those 2 changes would make wvw a million times more fun.

Josh Davis.6015:

Thanks for the post, OP. This is a fairly polarizing topic, but it is interesting nonetheless. It came up quite a bit in the 3 likes / 3 dislikes thread as well. Changing the way downstate works would have such a large sweeping change on the way the game is played – it’s sort of fun to theorycraft the ramifications!

Keep in mind, I’m just spit-balling here – none of this is in the works. I would just like to see some more conversation on the topic.

So, what if you only rallied allies when you stomped someone, rather than cleaving the body? This would be much more difficult to pull off in large-scale fights, but you would have added risk/reward for attempting. Would even-numbered fights still snowball?

It would almost always affect players in small-scale fights as well. I’ve won plenty of 1v2’s in WvW and PvP from downstate, getting that clutch rally at the right moment – but that would go away too.

What if you couldn’t hard rez downed allies? What are the positives and negatives?

Anyways, just rambling. Feel free to discuss! If you have any good threads on the topic that come to mind, feel free to link them for me.

If players are given more hit points that can make it harder to kill them in a zerg it would be far more fair.

That said, the downed state isn’t working for my characters – my 52 warrior can’t get one person to go down with the hammer in the downed state – so what is it there for if it’s not going to work?

I had a single thief on me – he was hitting me and I successfully got the hammer off and he kept hitting – the hammer did nothing, then killed me.

It’s not just the downed state – it’s what doesn’t work when downed.

I like the following.

-stomped players get kicked back to spawn(I like this in conjunction with spike only rally)
-no reviving fully downed players unless out of combat for 15-30 seconds
-limiting the rally effect of downing a player. Either make it on spikes only with a high limit(5-10) or make it any method with smaller limit(3-5).

Question, have you guys looked at the datamined stuff? One of the things included an Assaulter mastery that seems to be hinting to a finisher being used FORCING a respawn back at their starting waypoint if you have points for it.

^^^sounds cool. I like it. No I havent seen datamined stuff :P no idea where to get that.

For future knowledge, it’s always on the Guild Wars 2 Reddit. Here’s the current data mine page I’m referring to.

Josh Davis.6015:

What if you couldn’t hard rez downed allies? What are the positives and negatives?

This is what needs to change in WvW. It punishes smaller more skilled groups when the larger zerg can just have a few players IGNORE the fight and hard res completely dead players. They should not be able to rez the dead while in combat. It’s a simple change that promotes more skillful play and not “just throw more players at them until they win.”

There are absolutely no negatives to changing this in WvW.

What also needs to change is the rallying off of mobs. For instance, I down 3 players in a fight and a stupid wolf gets pulled in and dies causing all downed players to rally then proceed to kill me because they rally with half their health back and all conditions cleared. That’s terrible and has no place in PvP.

P.S. Elementalists should not be able to mist form into keep doors.

Personally I am fine with hard rez, if a group of people stop to rez mid fight they have to make the choice to sit there at eat any damage directed at them. There is risk vs reward there. The rally mechanic however, (more times than not) favors numbers and has no risk attached to it.

Rally should be more in line to help the smaller groups. An example would be if xx number of people are in xxx radius you receive a debuff/removal of the rally feature.(with the exception of keeps/towers) This would remove a large safety net from large groups. Anyone running a small tactical group vs much larger numbers knows that you rarely have time to stomp before the sheer damage kills you, you can never stand still that long. And it’s very discouraging to see half a Zerg rallying by picking off 1 of your people. ( I would

Gain buffs, send players back to base, and stuff from killing enemy players

PC’s killed are going to drop gear?

My 2 cents
1. Increase the amount of damage needed to be done in order to rally. Staff guardian / warrior with 3 tags of AA will not rally. What will the numbers be? Rough example: 20% of enemies hp to rally. Reset this amount when enemies hp reaches 100%.
2. Allow in combat ressing once a minute.
3. Give a 10 second debuff to the person who was hard ressed.