Guild Wars 2

I’m on the JQ/Mag/FA matchup, and I couldn’t help but notice that there were over a dozen duelers piled up on the side of Stonemist. I don’t play WvW to duel, I play it for skirmishes, so I go run around the map and look for fights. I found about 6 roamers and some stray zerglings. If all of those people who were dueling chose to skirmish instead, the fights tonight would have been great. I don’t mind seeing a small handful of people dueling, but when there’s a small blob of people sitting on a hill beside Stonemist waiting for duels, I can’t help but think that’s why WvW feels so empty.

Here’s your problem: Bigger is better. If quantity is the only thing that counts everybody who hasn’t joined the blob becomes a reliability.

Question is how this is hurting the small scene. Because all your possible enemies are with the other duellers and not where you would fight them? That is a balance problem as people don’t usually run around alone anymore as they’ve got no chance against class x and y and maybe z.

Weeks ago when we rolled a t2 matchup for a week against Mag/FA, I was running around SMC one night and found a group of people from all 3 servers dueling. Instead of attacking, I just jumped downed and stood alongside those players from other servers and we watched some nice duels and respectfully did not attack each other, even yelling at other servermates not to attack the duelers. We even played around with tonics, was a fun time.

Now I dont know why SMC is the popular spot for dueling considering its usually a queued map but it is the popular spot for dueling, I try to be respectful about it, even spectate at times.

It’s popular because it’s a high trafic area, so other roamers are likely to pass and stop by if they see people dueling.

It can easily ruin the immersion especially for roamers and havoc groups. Usually they end up around S camp behind the camp but they can easily end up in high profile areas. If it really bothers you and its a largish lingering group encourage them to take it to the obsidian sanctum or you can intentionally steer a zerg to mow the duelers over?

I usually build cannon and shoot these duelers. That what i call outplaying enemy.

False dichotomy here.

Have you ever considered that those people might just be taking a break from running around? A lot of people encounter each other roaming and it’s just more convenient to meet up at a predetermined spot rather than just run around aimlessly hoping to get lucky.

Try giving this a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_

It can be useful to hone various skills which can be applied in more practical situations, aka getting better.

In a game that promotes zerging everything, I suppose people that seek some degree of self improvement in a game where the bar can be set quite low are quite the bane of its existence.

ArchonWing.9480:

False dichotomy here.

Have you ever considered that those people might just be taking a break from running around? A lot of people encounter each other roaming and it’s just more convenient to meet up at a predetermined spot rather than just run around aimlessly hoping to get lucky.

Try giving this a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_

It can be useful to hone various skills which can be applied in more practical situations, aka getting better.

In a game that promotes zerging everything, I suppose people that seek some degree of self improvement in a game where the bar can be set quite low are quite the bane of its existence.

I have seen players who are 1 vs 1 monsters, but in real fight they are totally useless. So i could say that 1 vs 1 fights will lower your skill level.

ArchonWing.9480:

False dichotomy here.

Have you ever considered that those people might just be taking a break from running around? A lot of people encounter each other roaming and it’s just more convenient to meet up at a predetermined spot rather than just run around aimlessly hoping to get lucky.

Try giving this a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_

It can be useful to hone various skills which can be applied in more practical situations, aka getting better.

In a game that promotes zerging everything, I suppose people that seek some degree of self improvement in a game where the bar can be set quite low are quite the bane of its existence.

Totally agree. I’ve found dueling to be tremendously helpful from a small-scale skills point of view, and from the perspective of adding more variety to the game mode.

I find it helps small-scale wvw rather than ruins it, and I think it would be easy for someone to ask similar question of, “do small-scale/havoc squads ruin large scale scene” with just as much justification. In that case, hypothetically, someone could be concerned that five or six havoc groups plus roamers could have made a mid-sized tagged-up group, which is obviously better (sarcasm).

Junkpile.7439:

ArchonWing.9480:

False dichotomy here.

Have you ever considered that those people might just be taking a break from running around? A lot of people encounter each other roaming and it’s just more convenient to meet up at a predetermined spot rather than just run around aimlessly hoping to get lucky.

Try giving this a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_

It can be useful to hone various skills which can be applied in more practical situations, aka getting better.

In a game that promotes zerging everything, I suppose people that seek some degree of self improvement in a game where the bar can be set quite low are quite the bane of its existence.

I have seen players who are 1 vs 1 monsters, but in real fight they are totally useless. So i could say that 1 vs 1 fights will lower your skill level.

Well, we have no idea of how useless they were before that! Improvement is relative.

Choppy.4183:

ArchonWing.9480:

False dichotomy here.

Have you ever considered that those people might just be taking a break from running around? A lot of people encounter each other roaming and it’s just more convenient to meet up at a predetermined spot rather than just run around aimlessly hoping to get lucky.

Try giving this a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_

It can be useful to hone various skills which can be applied in more practical situations, aka getting better.

In a game that promotes zerging everything, I suppose people that seek some degree of self improvement in a game where the bar can be set quite low are quite the bane of its existence.

Totally agree. I’ve found dueling to be tremendously helpful from a small-scale skills point of view, and from the perspective of adding more variety to the game mode.

I find it helps small-scale wvw rather than ruins it, and I think it would be easy for someone to ask similar question of, “do small-scale/havoc squads ruin large scale scene” with just as much justification. In that case, hypothetically, someone could be concerned that five or six havoc groups plus roamers could have made a mid-sized tagged-up group, which is obviously better (sarcasm).

Yea, the thing I would be pointing is that there’s an assumption that someone would be dueling and if they weren’t, they’d be blobbing. This is not the case, and some may just opt to log off. There’s a lot of downtime sometimes.

Dueling makes no harm to WvW, small or big scale, but duelers can not expect their figths to be respected all the time, first because you cant be always be sure a 1v1 is a duel (unless in certain places where you have some people around already watching or if both bows first) it might not and if so you have to help you server mate,

Second the WvW game mode is not designed for this, you can go to sPvP create a private room and duel all day long, or go to the obsidian place.

I always try to respect duels. but I do not think dueling so close to SMC is a good idea… there are other places with less zerg moving around like behind speldan camp or in the borderlands.

albotelho.2931:

Dueling makes no harm to WvW, small or big scale,

except the part where they are constantly putting swords on the nearby objective.

Justine.6351:

albotelho.2931:

Dueling makes no harm to WvW, small or big scale,

except the part where they are constantly putting swords on the nearby objective.

That’s Anet’s fault for changing white swords to being triggered by guards going into combat instead of damage to the structure.

Justine.6351:

albotelho.2931:

Dueling makes no harm to WvW, small or big scale,

except the part where they are constantly putting swords on the nearby objective.

Objectives only get contested if you aggro guards. People dueling by the sides of SMC normally don’t aggro guards unless they go really close to the wall to aggro the archers. But SMC is pretty much always contested anyway.

are you guys talking about the northeast, northwest or southwest of the castle? i find it rare and random when i see duelers there. at least in my server

i prefer the small scale and roaming scene. that way, i dont ever have to worry about joining a guild/zerg and wait for commands. i dont have a lot of free time for gw2 so i have a lot more fun 1v1 instead.

@Choppy
hey buddy, it’s been a while :D

I am tier 3 and myself do not duel (because I suck at it). I see some duelers from time to time, often southeast of sm, never seen many of them and on my server never in a number that would the hurt the zerg in any way. Most of the time the same numbers from all servers are dueling, so all server would be hit the same way as well anyway. For me it is no problem and actually kind of a nice thing to see people fighting and letting each other get back up for a rematch. Just go there and join in the fight.
We have far more people afk at a waypoint or merchant waiting for their next reward track to pop on queued maps for example.

Fighting near a tower or keep is a no no!

Had this the other week with the duelers keeping our T3 SM constantly contested because they were too close.

Even after asking them to move, they didnt, cos hopped onto a cannon and kept firing it. It doesnt stop SM from being contested, but it does reduce the amount of space they have to have a fair match.
Then our zerg steam rolled them for the fun of it, after that they moved.

So as they were contesting a T3 SM, they cant complain that they are just doing a 1v1, cos they are affecting the map.

Yea, I’m not sure why people would expect when they duel outisde the front door of a big objective. I mean it’s fine to do it anyways, but you can’t really blame anyone.

People that do act all surprised remind me of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdctnPIR5kA

Cecilia.5179:

I’m on the JQ/Mag/FA matchup, and I couldn’t help but notice that there were over a dozen duelers piled up on the side of Stonemist. I don’t play WvW to duel, I play it for skirmishes, so I go run around the map and look for fights. I found about 6 roamers and some stray zerglings. If all of those people who were dueling chose to skirmish instead, the fights tonight would have been great. I don’t mind seeing a small handful of people dueling, but when there’s a small blob of people sitting on a hill beside Stonemist waiting for duels, I can’t help but think that’s why WvW feels so empty.

kill them

More often than not, the people who dislike duellers are the ones who interrupted a duel and got yelled at. Don’t take it to heart if that happens. People can be jerks, there’s no reason to feel ashamed for making a mistake. Walk away and learn from it.

I don’t think duels hurt anything. WvW is effectively sandbox, you can do as like when you like with some exceptions. As long as you’re not griefing, you shouldn’t need to worry about what others think about what you enjoy doing. I do understand that when a map is Q’d and players are duelling it can be a frustrating sight but they’re as entitled to play the game as they like as anyone else. Sure, they could duel in a PvP area or on another map but the same can be said for zergs/guilds. They could just as easily organize fights on other maps or in guild halls, couldn’t they?

I’m really doing a horrible job of defending this hobby but the point I’m trying to make is that everyone should be able to play as they like within reason. Not understanding something shouldn’t mean you disagree with it. I personally don’t like to duel at all because I find it silly how my opponent can change their traits and utilities or entire build before we fight. I don’t complain or interrupt when I see them though because those players are doing what they enjoy and that’s all that matters to me, that they’re having fun.

If you want to live by the “red is dead” mentality, they can’t say you’re wrong for doing it any more than you can say they’re wrong for duelling.

I’m sorry that you feel negatively about duelling but maybe if you participate in some duels or watch a few, you might change your mind. Just remember not to take the game so seriously.

for me gvg is worse than dueling … when i see enemy capping all the map and our people gvg in a corner …. i find it terrible

Junkpile.7439:

ArchonWing.9480:

False dichotomy here.

Have you ever considered that those people might just be taking a break from running around? A lot of people encounter each other roaming and it’s just more convenient to meet up at a predetermined spot rather than just run around aimlessly hoping to get lucky.

Try giving this a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_

It can be useful to hone various skills which can be applied in more practical situations, aka getting better.

In a game that promotes zerging everything, I suppose people that seek some degree of self improvement in a game where the bar can be set quite low are quite the bane of its existence.

I have seen players who are 1 vs 1 monsters, but in real fight they are totally useless. So i could say that 1 vs 1 fights will lower your skill level.

Or you could say big zerg fights have unplayable FPS.

I’ve heard the same thing about me, I die on the first push cause my FPS drops to about 2-4…. Gimmie a duel or small scale fight at 30fps anyday.

If they are contributing to a map queue, I find it pretty disrespectful to other players.

If they’re in an area of strategic value- practically everywhere on EBG provides strategic value as a scout- and they complain about being killed, they’re in the wrong.

If someone wants to duel, they can do it south of the windmill on ABL, in OS, or not at all.

No.

The dueling I don’t find any problem with it providing it isn’t done right outside a spawn point ,castle ,keep,tower or camp.It’s difficult to tell whether it’s duel or just camping and tapping to contest way points. If your in those spots you can be most certain that you will be attacked.If your dueling with the understanding that down is a win and that a stomp is unwarranted then you can duel in areas that are far away from standard traffic.In EBG ,North West corner of Speldan ,in the canyon East of Blue World spawn or North West of Green World spawn (not really a choice spot).In Alpine use the Mill area where the warthogs are. DBL there are a few spots near each spawn location and the center .Make the map aware of a duel in those areas and I’m sure no one will bother you. You don’t want to be interrupted and many of us don’t want to bother you.Just use some common sense and let the map know what your doing.

sephiroth.4217:

Junkpile.7439:

ArchonWing.9480:

False dichotomy here.

Have you ever considered that those people might just be taking a break from running around? A lot of people encounter each other roaming and it’s just more convenient to meet up at a predetermined spot rather than just run around aimlessly hoping to get lucky.

Try giving this a read: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Play_

It can be useful to hone various skills which can be applied in more practical situations, aka getting better.

In a game that promotes zerging everything, I suppose people that seek some degree of self improvement in a game where the bar can be set quite low are quite the bane of its existence.

I have seen players who are 1 vs 1 monsters, but in real fight they are totally useless. So i could say that 1 vs 1 fights will lower your skill level.

Or you could say big zerg fights have unplayable FPS.

I’ve heard the same thing about me, I die on the first push cause my FPS drops to about 2-4…. Gimmie a duel or small scale fight at 30fps anyday.

it’s other way around for me, I am good in small fights but I totally suck in 1 vs 1, which is quite annoying cos often people ask me to duel them after a small group fight.

People payed for the game they play. They can do what ever they like,even if that means dueling while a q is on the map. Please show me in writing that this is above the game rules. Many of us find its silly for the whole intire map going to wooden empty towers when 1-4 people can do it.

How can people says “they are not sure if it’s a duel or not?” Simple if it’s 1 dude vs another it’s a 1v1, a duel, an even fight…let them get on with it. If you are going to interupt at least let them finish the duel first.

Fat Disgrace.4275:

How can people says “they are not sure if it’s a duel or not?” Simple if it’s 1 dude vs another it’s a 1v1, a duel, an even fight…let them get on with it. If you are going to interupt at least let them finish the duel first.

Because we can’t read minds. More often than not it’s a team mate that is being attacked while roaming or returning to the main group.Nobody can be sure.I’ve been whispered many times “Why didn’t you help me!” So don’t presume everyone knows what your doing .Make arrangements with your dueling partner or let the map know whats going on at your location.Consideration goes both ways.

it can’t be perfect for everyone in every situation. join the fight or ignore and if duellers don’t like being constantly interrupted, they can move elsewhere. they stay there cos people don’t attack them after all

Fat Disgrace.4275:

People payed for the game they play. They can do what ever they like,even if that means dueling while a q is on the map. Please show me in writing that this is above the game rules. Many of us find its silly for the whole intire map going to wooden empty towers when 1-4 people can do it.

How can people says “they are not sure if it’s a duel or not?” Simple if it’s 1 dude vs another it’s a 1v1, a duel, an even fight…let them get on with it. If you are going to interupt at least let them finish the duel first.

The first sentence pretty much answers the OP’s question. You’re never going to stop ppl from dueling, zerglings. Let people do their thing. It is considered a sandbox RvR…Many more things to QQ about than duelers, jeez. Get over it.

And WvW feels so empty for so many because it’s too little too late for changes in WvW for many players and whole guilds. Then players and guilds that are left have to go to higher tiers to find constant fights. Or play musical worlds to chase the bandwagons.

It seems like people think that if that dueler isn’t dueling, they’ll go help facilitate the blob or barring that, some other person in their place will help in that cause. That’s honestly wishful thinking in most cases. You’re more likely to get people that only farm nodes/reward tracks/dailies and then afk. Or you might have someone that’s actually suited towards fighting other players and picking off the enemy tail if you ask nicely enough. Or they might attract enemy attention by having zerglings trying +1 and +2 and getting wrecked and then making angry threads about it here. I mean if they get 15 people screaming “red is dead” and chasing a poor soul across the map, that’s got to be some kind of tactical advantage.

My other suspicion of the other source of complaints is that a blob guild can’t get all their guildies in because obviously they are more important than anyone else. Usually they’ll come in, think they’re God’s Gift to the map and demand everyone bow down to their tag. Sure you can duel in a non-queued map, but what about blobbing a non queued map?

Of course, there’s also the roaming classes and builds that don’t work that well in a group….

Duels and roaming are often mixed up. Roaming is fun but eventually having some 1v1 as opposed to 1v3 is a nice change of pace. Duels are also where you find more skilled players who know how to max themselves out for what they are running.

I’ve run into exceptional players dueling that I would have had a smaller chance fighting if I was just out roaming (and less likely to fight 1v1).

Also duelers code of conduct. Those who interfere will be killed and the spectators won’t help. If you think the duel shouldn’t be allowed and interfere, be prepared to face the consequences. On the other hand if you can get the stomp good for you.

saerni.2584:

Also duelers code of conduct. Those who interfere will be killed and the spectators won’t help. If you think the duel shouldn’t be allowed and interfere, be prepared to face the consequences. On the other hand if you can get the stomp good for you.

I remember one time when a bunch of us were duelling, I had a friend who came by and told me about how a couple of the people there had jumped on his corpse and siege buried him earlier. He said he wanted revenge and I told him he could try but I wouldn’t help. It would mean I’d get killed too and I didn’t want to.

He then proceeds to kill almost every dueller there and casually runs off in to the sunset. It was pretty hilarious watching him destroy like 5 people then just leaving like nothing happened.

Lol, I love that so much.

Dueling allows players to hone their small fighting skills, method to quickly sample new classes/builds and a way to test small scale build changes.

Two caveats though:

1. When there is a map q, it is open season on duelers as far as I am concerned.

2. If its red its dead applies in all situations. Course interrupting a duel will often get the interrupter dead quick.

The small scale scene ruins itself

RlyOsim.2497:

And that’s kind of the point. A person scouting, upgrading a keep or running supply is not primarily focused on killing people, duelers are.

Not really, I distinguish between scouts, roamers and duelists.
All of them are basically roamers and roamers are in to kill, whether it’s 1 vs 2 (if possible) or 2 vs 1 or x vs x. Scouts probably have a more important task at hand and don’t stop for every fight, duelists might enjoy fighting a certain enemy and they usually don’t kill if it’s a real duel.

I don’t really get where this entitlement mentality on both sides comes from.

Holy kitten, the amount of hypocrisy comming from blob farming materials in this thread is over the top, I didn’t even manage to read whole thread because I already have enough of outrage.

I’ll tell you what, I do roaming as well as I do dueling too. I enjoy both, I like new builds people come with since WvW isn’t so restricted with stats or builds and I like practice, lots of practice. And while I’d just stomp some random WvW farming material or carebear on my roaming routine around trying to look “useful” and not “disrespectful” to the other players (Does anyone actually give a kitten? I mean, most of those useful wvw players just bandwagon servers nowdays like cheap kitten) duelling could actually give me more fighting experience and result in more fun too.
There are some quite annoying things in WvWers behavior I’ve noticed since I started playing WvW. First it was pure, unrelenting hatred towards GvG players, which drove them out of WvW to an extent I can barely find one if I want to. Now it’s “those 3 dueling guys we lost a blob fight because of”. Seriously, QUIT THAT BULLkitten
Because it’s up to me how I manage my time and how I want to play the game I payed for. There are no strict rules telling us how are we supposed to play WvW, except for those unspoken ones pushed into everyone throats by the masses. Made up by somebody whos WvW perspectives could be very biased and onesided.

And lmao @ the person who said 1v1 people usually suck at teamfights. What an irony, each time I get some Big Name WvW guild player in my team in sPvP they utterly suck both at solo contesting or teamfights, enough to make me feel ashamed I am playing for the same server they do.

Vasdamas Anklast.1607:

There are some quite annoying things in WvWers behavior I’ve noticed since I started playing WvW. First it was pure, unrelenting hatred towards GvG players, which drove them out of WvW to an extent I can barely find one if I want to.

Stop your outrage, it’s the HoT “balance” that killed GvG – GvG players aren’t that fragile.

PierPiero.9142:

for me gvg is worse than dueling … when i see enemy capping all the map and our people gvg in a corner …. i find it terrible

Build some trebs to poison them. When they complain just tell this is your own made up game mode and they can always go to OS to gvg to their hearts content.

Duellers are fine, smallscale is crap in WvW because the game mode is too structured, the vast majority of people on the map are in guild raids / blobs, as a playerbase WvW is the one of the least “PvP” you will find in a PvP game mode, that GW2 is cheesy as kitten already and even worse in WvW and that balance is beyond terrible for small scale, to take one aspect engage/disengage the disparity between classes / builds is horrifically bad to the point risk vs reward is completely broken, the result – very little smallscale and what there is, is generally kitten.

Jana.6831:

Vasdamas Anklast.1607:

There are some quite annoying things in WvWers behavior I’ve noticed since I started playing WvW. First it was pure, unrelenting hatred towards GvG players, which drove them out of WvW to an extent I can barely find one if I want to.

Stop your outrage, it’s the HoT “balance” that killed GvG – GvG players aren’t that fragile.

Not unless HoT is so unbalanced it can literally warp time. The GvG scene was “dead” long before HoT released.

Dawdler.8521:

Not unless HoT is so unbalanced it can literally warp time. The GvG scene was “dead” long before HoT released.

Not on EU – most of the GvG guilds quit because of the Elites.
No idea what was going on in NA.
But do you really think a few people who complain could break up a whole sub game mode? And hey, they even got arenas with Hot – they didn’t need to be in wvw anymore.

And yes, HoT is that unbalanced.

They have a place to designed to do this, Obsidian Sanctum. Remember all of the G vs. G drama a while back and the changes to OS to make them happy? Well, this is the place they should “officially” doing this for various reasons.

On the other hand there are known places people hang out for fight club stuff. You, your group, squad, or team, have a choice to allow it to happy – drive by and ignore. Or, you can engage and attempt to kill them and ruin their fun.

Duelers as you put it do not ruin much of anything other than taking up a potential slot for non-WvW play which could cause a queue…