Guild Wars 2

For almost 13 months, we have been waiting to see a completed product of the Devs work. We keep hearing that “it takes time”, that “its being worked on”. So many of us have waited quietly and patiently to see what comes from the hard work we’re told is being done on WvW.

To many of us, we still feel like there is so much more to come for WvW. Every month, thousands of us open the patch notes solely to look at the (often non-existing) WvW notes. Ever since the Arrow Cart Catastrophe in April’s patch, I’ve silently waited in growing frustration and the hopes that something better was coming.

What will it take for you to change your mind about the Orb’s Stat Bonus?

Do competitive WvW guilds have to stop playing to show you that you need to change it?

We are not the vocal minority, and it is the competitive WvW guilds that make up the backbone of all server communities. If that is what it takes to actually get your attention, than so be it.

If you find WvW so incredibly unacceptable in its current state that you’re willing to quit en masse, then maybe GW2 just isn’t the game for you? Play the game for what it is right now, not for what you fantasize about it being in the future.

I know I said quit in the title, but that’s because I didn’t have room for “leave” or “stop playing”.

As a guild leader, you are highly invested in the game in which your guild currently plays. You aren’t afforded the luxury of hopping from game to game at any moment. This question was purely to see if it really takes the WvW Guilds to stop playing to get their attention that this orb’s stat buff mechanic needs completely changed or removed.

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

If you find WvW so incredibly unacceptable in its current state that you’re willing to quit en masse, then maybe GW2 just isn’t the game for you? Play the game for what it is right now, not for what you fantasize about it being in the future.

It was the game for them two days ago, and apparently it was the game for 99% of this forum two days ago. It was the game for a not insignificant portion of the WvW-playing playerbase two days ago, as well. If GW2 was never a game that they enjoyed, then maybe I’d agree with you, but that’s not the case.

I find it amusing that the game is suddenly shattered for so many over something as insignificant as a 0-150 point increase in stats. I simply can’t believe that people who honestly and legitimately enjoyed the game prior to the buff are unable to logically enjoy it now. It seems far more likely that they’re simply being disingenuous, for effect.

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

If you find WvW so incredibly unacceptable in its current state that you’re willing to quit en masse, then maybe GW2 just isn’t the game for you? Play the game for what it is right now, not for what you fantasize about it being in the future.

It was the game for them two days ago, and apparently it was the game for 99% of this forum two days ago. It was the game for a not insignificant portion of the WvW-playing playerbase two days ago, as well. If GW2 was never a game that they enjoyed, then maybe I’d agree with you, but that’s not the case.

Very well said.

There is always a danger in taking that “high and mighty/don’t let the door hit you on the way out” attitude after a large and unpopular change is made to how an MMO plays – if you don’t believe me Google “Star Wars Galaxies” and “NGE”

ANet can recover from this, but it is going to take some “personalities” on their side swallowing a lot of pride to fix things… and if you can’t figure out what I’m talking about – here’s a ball… go bounce it.

Stormleaf.1769:

I find it amusing that the game is suddenly shattered for so many over something as insignificant as a 0-150 point increase in stats. I simply can’t believe that people who honestly and legitimately enjoyed the game prior to the buff are unable to logically enjoy it now. It seems far more likely that they’re simply being disingenuous, for effect.

“Insignificant” is not what I would call 4 ascended trinkets’ worth of stats.

Take the inverse of Bloodlust; if the other realms could get a bonus which, upon getting it, would let them go “nope, you’re not allowed to equip any accessories”, would that shed any light on it for you then? Can you understand why they might think that completely invalidates WvW? Because that is 2/3rds of what this system does.

It’s even worse than everything else that imbalances WvW because you can’t both have those orb bonuses at the same time; if someone else is eating, you can eat too. If someone else has stacked Guard Killer, you can stack Guard Killer. If you’re outmanned and you want to roam for some fun fights? Enjoy your (even more) uphill battle.

Stormleaf.1769:

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

If you find WvW so incredibly unacceptable in its current state that you’re willing to quit en masse, then maybe GW2 just isn’t the game for you? Play the game for what it is right now, not for what you fantasize about it being in the future.

It was the game for them two days ago, and apparently it was the game for 99% of this forum two days ago. It was the game for a not insignificant portion of the WvW-playing playerbase two days ago, as well. If GW2 was never a game that they enjoyed, then maybe I’d agree with you, but that’s not the case.

I find it amusing that the game is suddenly shattered for so many over something as insignificant as a 0-150 point increase in stats. I simply can’t believe that people who honestly and legitimately enjoyed the game prior to the buff are unable to logically enjoy it now. It seems far more likely that they’re simply being disingenuous, for effect.

You’re focusing on one issue.

The Biggest issue in my opinion is the major increase in lag.

Not only the above, but the addition of more “conquest” anti pvp mechanics. For example, I know this is for TW:R2, but AngryJoe’s analysis of flag mechanics in war games is absolutely correct. It’s kittened, anti-strategic thinking, and just plain boring!

But your shrugging off of a maximum total buff of +150 to all stats (even healing power and condi damage) as insignificant just blows my mind. This is a huge game changer in small to zerg fights.

Get Defense against guards, then by chance have full max bloodlust, plus lets say a food that gives +100 vitality. Grats your vitality is buffed by 500! And you didn’t waste ANY of that on your armor or trait choices. Please tell me why that amount of buffage is “Insignificant”.

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

If you find WvW so incredibly unacceptable in its current state that you’re willing to quit en masse, then maybe GW2 just isn’t the game for you? Play the game for what it is right now, not for what you fantasize about it being in the future.

It was the game for them two days ago, and apparently it was the game for 99% of this forum two days ago. It was the game for a not insignificant portion of the WvW-playing playerbase two days ago, as well. If GW2 was never a game that they enjoyed, then maybe I’d agree with you, but that’s not the case.

Yeah. Ascended weapons were the hit in the stomach to break your breath and this bl bs is the final blow. And they still have to implement ascended armor.

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

I find it amusing that the game is suddenly shattered for so many over something as insignificant as a 0-150 point increase in stats. I simply can’t believe that people who honestly and legitimately enjoyed the game prior to the buff are unable to logically enjoy it now. It seems far more likely that they’re simply being disingenuous, for effect.

“Insignificant” is not what I would call 4 ascended trinkets’ worth of stats.

Take the inverse of Bloodlust; if the other realms could get a bonus which, upon getting it, would let them go “nope, you’re not allowed to equip any accessories”, would that shed any light on it for you then? Can you understand why they might think that completely invalidates WvW? Because that is 2/3rds of what this system does. It’s even worse than everything else that imbalances WvW because you can’t both have those orb bonuses at the same time; if someone else is eating, you can eat too. If someone else has stacked Guard Killer, you can stack Guard Killer. If you’re outmanned and you want to roam for some fun fights? Enjoy your (even more) uphill battle.

There is a significant difference between a minor, blanket increase in stats and forbidding an enemy from equipping accessories altogether. I understand the spirit of what you meant, but that is a ridiculously silly comparison to make.

The thing is… 150 stat points is, in most cases, insignificant. Assuming you have all the buffs at all times (which has been exceedingly rare so far), you’ll be maybe 5% stronger than your opponent, give or take. If you die to a thief in two backstabs without the buff, you’ll still die in two backstabs. If you kill someone in ten hits without the buff, you might kill them in nine with the buff. In the vast majority of cases, people aren’t winning or losing fights by the margin provided with bloodlust, and that is why it’s insignificant. People just want an excuse for losing.

Regardless of that… So many people in WvW don’t use food or other such bonuses, despite the fact that they can. Plenty still run around in rares or exotics, when others are using ascended. When you encountered such a person prior to this week’s patch, did it completely ruin the game for you? Did you avoid the fight? Did you think “this game sucks, I should quit”? If people never reacted with outrage to those situations, I can’t exactly take it seriously when they scream about this one, considering it’s virtually the same issue.

Stormleaf.1769:

Regardless of that… So many people in WvW don’t use food or other such bonuses, despite the fact that they can. Plenty still run around in rares or exotics, when others are using ascended.

Please continue to dig that hole…

/popcorn

Yes, people need to realize that they need to stop logging if they want anything changed.

ANet measures success in concurrency numbers, so as long as you log in they dont care. You may write masterpiece and they still wouldnt care.

The power creep in WvW is another complete issue all on its own, and this stat buff just adds to it. This stat buff killed the chances of having competitive fights. When you’re a guild in the open field, you don’t want to roll through another guild for a cheap win with an uneven advantage that the other guild had no real chance to have during the fight. I don’t want enemies to have the buffs, especially when we fight groups larger than us, but I definitely don’t want the buff on me either. It cheapens any win we’d have in the open field and destroys any semblance of competition WvW had.

Food and exotic stat potential has nothing to do with this orb buff. The difference is both sides could choose to have or not have it. For the orb buff, its either you have it, or they have it, and neither side can choose not to have it. Please stop posting here if you are going to derail this thread.

Stormleaf.1769:

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

I find it amusing that the game is suddenly shattered for so many over something as insignificant as a 0-150 point increase in stats. I simply can’t believe that people who honestly and legitimately enjoyed the game prior to the buff are unable to logically enjoy it now. It seems far more likely that they’re simply being disingenuous, for effect.

“Insignificant” is not what I would call 4 ascended trinkets’ worth of stats.

Take the inverse of Bloodlust; if the other realms could get a bonus which, upon getting it, would let them go “nope, you’re not allowed to equip any accessories”, would that shed any light on it for you then? Can you understand why they might think that completely invalidates WvW? Because that is 2/3rds of what this system does. It’s even worse than everything else that imbalances WvW because you can’t both have those orb bonuses at the same time; if someone else is eating, you can eat too. If someone else has stacked Guard Killer, you can stack Guard Killer. If you’re outmanned and you want to roam for some fun fights? Enjoy your (even more) uphill battle.

There is a significant difference between a minor, blanket increase in stats and forbidding an enemy from equipping accessories altogether. I understand the spirit of what you meant, but that is a ridiculously silly comparison to make.

The thing is… 150 stat points is, in most cases, insignificant. Assuming you have all the buffs at all times (which has been exceedingly rare so far), you’ll be maybe 5% stronger than your opponent, give or take. If you die to a thief in two backstabs without the buff, you’ll still die in two backstabs. If you kill someone in ten hits without the buff, you might kill them in nine with the buff. In the vast majority of cases, people aren’t winning or losing fights by the margin provided with bloodlust, and that is why it’s insignificant. People just want an excuse for losing.

Regardless of that… So many people in WvW don’t use food or other such bonuses, despite the fact that they can. Plenty still run around in rares or exotics, when others are using ascended. When you encountered such a person prior to this week’s patch, did it completely ruin the game for you? Did you avoid the fight? Did you think “this game sucks, I should quit”? If people never reacted with outrage to those situations, I can’t exactly take it seriously when they scream about this one, considering it’s virtually the same issue.

150 vitality alone are 1500hp. That’s 10% of some people’s whole health pool. go say a professional tpvp player 1500hp is nothing. Now you have 150 armor. And power, dmg, etc…
Okey, this is not tPvP, it might not change THAT much in unorganized zergs that play only on rolling on smaller zergs, but for small scale fights that huge. 10 vs 10 you’re already looking at 15k hp more to bite down. and they’ll have more damage as well and all that.

It´s becoming increasingly clear to me that we aren´t the target audience for wvw. And by we i mean organised wvw guilds.

First the set of tools we get to work with is very inadequate. Only tool we have for organising is the commander marker and target crosshair.
Commander tag attracts puggies from across the map to one spot, and a zerg forms, when we only wanted to play as a guild. Not only that, but the tag itself isn´t all that visible in combat and all the functionality it brings is pretty much non-existant. Extra chat channel means nothing when you already have guild channel, and supply info is useless since people often need to be in several places at once, running supply, scouting, etc.
Target crosshair is just a general pve tool, but most guilds have gotten a lot of mileage out of it in wvw too, since thank god you can target allies. How ever the target calling could be so much more had it actualy been intended for wvw use. Where´s secondary and tertiary targets? Why can´t we target a spot in the ground etc.
This lack of tools leads me to believe that wvw was not meant to be for organised groups in the first place.

Then there´s the gear issues.
At first there was practicaly no way of gaining any proper gear from wvw. Only much later did they add some of the stat combos into wvw vendors, and even now there´s a lot of them missing. Ascended gear itself goes against what most people would consider good pvp experience, but in addition it´s so much more difficult to obtain set of ascended through wvw than it´s through any other way that it´s not even funny anymore.
And then there was the ridiculous bundle items people used to be able to use in wvw.
Lack of rewards also doesn´t seem to make any sense, unless you consider wvw as an extension of pve. If it was just that, there couldn´t be any rewards that made people go away from pve lest they spread their player too thin, and ther wouldn´t be any need either as people would play pve for their rewards.
Waht this makes it look like is that wvw always was, is still and proabyl will be just an extension of pve, nothing serious, just a time killer between dragons.

The balance.
Most of balancing has been done with spvp in mind. Very few changes have been around wvw use of skills, and even less have promoted organised play. Makes sense if wvw was never meant to be anything serious.

Wxp. Progression bar to fill for pve players. And the rewards seem to be thrown together overnight. 2,5k health from points? 250 stat points in vitality, that´s your weapons, chest piece and amulet combined with vit as minor stat. Not only that, it´s all character bound. Makes sense for pve stuff, doesn´t make sense for pvp stuff.

Orb buffs, empower the pve people, gives them warm and fuzzy feelings if you will. Pvp guilds don´t want it, duelers don´t want it, roamers don´t want it…but enough of that, more than plenty of threads about this already.

Sooo….most things make it look like wvw is nothing but a time sink for pve crowd, extension of pve, nothing serious, nothing organised, an aftertought.
Seems Anet doesn´t realise what kind of raw jewel of open world pvp they have in their hands, and they just keep chipping away from it…i really hope something makes them see things from new perspective, and maybe they´ll start polishing this jewel instead.

But for now, sorry guys, seems we´re not the target audience. So…. no, it wouldn´t help even if the guilds quit.

Stormleaf.1769:

The thing is… 150 stat points is, in most cases, insignificant. Assuming you have all the buffs at all times (which has been exceedingly rare so far), you’ll be maybe 5% stronger than your opponent, give or take.

35%. Three orbs is roughly a 35% increase in strength.

Don’t throw around small numbers if you haven’t even tried to do basic math yet.

Drigan.7382:

Do competitive WvW guilds have to stop playing to show you that you need to change it?

Yes, Devon already stated they will not see a need to change unless there is a decline in population.

Ensign.2189:

Stormleaf.1769:

The thing is… 150 stat points is, in most cases, insignificant. Assuming you have all the buffs at all times (which has been exceedingly rare so far), you’ll be maybe 5% stronger than your opponent, give or take.

35%. Three orbs is roughly a 35% increase in strength.

Don’t throw around small numbers if you haven’t even tried to do basic math yet.

What? If I have 2,000 power, a 150 point increase is 7.5%. If I have 25,000 health, a 1,500 point increase is 6%. Even if you’re giving every stat the same weight (which is silly), it’s still way less than 35%. For a character with base stats (meaning 3,664 total), the 900 point bonus from the orbs would only come to a 24.5% increase.

Someone made a good post in another thread and said some of us didn’t ask for or want this helping hand no matter how insignificant you think it is they’re still stats that can’t be accounted for by who ever happens to not have the orbs during the fight.

Guilds don’t just fight at windmil, we roam and we look for each other in the lakes. My guild doesn’t fight because all we want is the victory we want the challenging fights against good guilds and bigger numbers that’s where the fun in the game is for me and I’m sure some guilds share a similar mindset. I want to know I outplayed my opponent if I lose I want to know what I did wrong the bloodlust buff makes that very hard to do.

In fights where guilds make a point of players having the best gear and food it’s hard to know if we won because we played well or if it was just the bloodlust buff. Imo it cheapens a win and makes it hard to learn from a loss.

Stormleaf.1769:

Ensign.2189:

Stormleaf.1769:

The thing is… 150 stat points is, in most cases, insignificant. Assuming you have all the buffs at all times (which has been exceedingly rare so far), you’ll be maybe 5% stronger than your opponent, give or take.

35%. Three orbs is roughly a 35% increase in strength.

Don’t throw around small numbers if you haven’t even tried to do basic math yet.

What? If I have 2,000 power, a 150 point increase is 7.5%. If I have 25,000 health, a 1,500 point increase is 6%. Even if you’re giving every stat the same weight (which is silly), it’s still way less than 35%. For a character with base stats (meaning 3,664 total), the 900 point bonus from the orbs would only come to a 24.5% increase.

Notice how he says “strength” not “stats”?

Harmonizer.4210:

Stormleaf.1769:

Regardless of that… So many people in WvW don’t use food or other such bonuses, despite the fact that they can. Plenty still run around in rares or exotics, when others are using ascended.

Please continue to dig that hole…

/popcorn

It is becoming more rare to see players in rare Armour. wvw is way more challenging than say, 3 months ago.

Anet is trying to move everyone who is serious about competitive, balanced fights into their failed sPvP. That’s the reasoning behind this whole debacle.

Well i made some calculations regarding the difference between Player1 with a 150 added stats battling Player2 with no added stats.

Considerations:
- Power, Vitality, Precision and Tougness = 916 (base stats);
- No added Crit. Damage (means 4% @ lv80);
- a 1000, 2000 and 3000 defense values were taken into consideration for the armor calculations;

Adding 150 to all attributes means (direct and non cond. damage):
- Player1 will deal more damage (Power and Precision)
- Player1 will have more health (Vitality)
- Player1 will receive less damage (Toughness)

Effective Damage is the average damage (with Crit. hits @ Crit. rate included)

My math shown me that:
.1) With 150 points to Power and Precision Player1 will deal 20,4% more Effective Damage, than it would do without any added stats.
.2) With 150 points to Toughness, Player1 will receive less 7,2% Effective Damage with 1000 defense and less 3,7% with 3000 defense.
.3) With 150 points to Vitality, Player1 will have 1500 more health pool, which means ~ 10% increase to a lv80 base health pool (916 vitality).

So, it’s a HUGE difference between having those stats and having none.

/cheers

So if they removed the stat buffs and kept the capture points so that they still allowed you to capture 3 of them to get points per kill, would that be alright for all you guys who have problems with it?

Pretty much. I’m watching some of my friends or teammate. Quitting GW2.

Dirame.8521:

So if they removed the stat buffs and kept the capture points so that they still allowed you to capture 3 of them to get points per kill, would that be alright for all you guys who have problems with it?

I think the 3 points per kill introduces some really toxic incentives into the game. For example, if you are outmanned on a map, it no longer makes sense to have a skeleton crew there to cause some havoc and force the enemy to keep their team there – because getting killed while trying for objectives now feeds the enemy team points. A 5 man havoc squad getting caught and wiped at a tower might feed the enemy team as many points as you would have gotten stealing the tower in the first place.

The points on stomp punish risky play hard; they act as a strong incentive to not try when you are outmanned and any aggressive play has a good chance of you getting caught and killed. Tactical wiping is now extremely punishing, and engaging a bigger army than the one you have is sabotaging your team.

Basically, if you don’t own bloodlust, you should really be playing super passively – and that is not at all healthy for the game.

I think the points on stomp are a much bigger deal than the stats – and the stats are pretty comically stupid.

Ensign.2189:

[…]

If I remember right, one of the devs said in his stream, that they wont change the outmanned buff to a stat boost, because they fear that people get yelled at, if they join the map and the buff disappears. Now we got a situation where upleveled players provide the enemy easy point for getting stomped – imo thats by far more questionable than a buff you get if you are outnumbered…
I don’t give a kitten about the weekly points and I hate seeing upleved characters in WvW but that shows realy nice how paradox and inconsiderated these arguments are.

I like the whole combatsystem and style of the game, but constant lagspikes and questionable decisions on the game design are getting to me in a bad way…
kitten me, It’s time Anet gets some real competition.

Skaven Zverov.2984:

Delta Blues.8507:

Skaven Zverov.2984:

kingcragus.6810:

Yes please leave. Go stroke your ego elsewhere kid.

+1. So much whining and threats from egoistical elitist kids. If you do not like it, do not play it. If you want to make your own game with YOUR rules, go ahead, make one. So, if something is not your way, you will quit, and make threats? How whiny you are?

Man up, don’t play if you do not want. MAJORITY is still playing, and MINORITY is QQ-ing because they cannot play GvG ( which is NOT intended in WvW ). And if you have at least a bit of brain, you would know that GvG arenas are coming….Same as in GW1….

Not so hard to see, but noooooooooooooooooo, elitists ego aren’t going to give them a second of logical and rational thinking. Bah, forums do not have anything more than bunch of whining, no constructive ideas, just plain WHINING. Go play SWTOR and RIFT, AION or CoD, Diablo 3 or whatever you think you deserve to play….

It’s very funny how you call elitist the people that just want things to be balanced and of easy access to everyone.

Because now we have 2 groups of people

The first one wants:
- no ascended gear, so top level equip is easy to obtain and everyone will have a shot
- no bl buffs, so that the people on the weaker side don’t have to face an even stronger enemy with stat buffs
- incentive to big fun fights and not to mindless zerg karma trains

the second group wants:
- a buff that will incentive the already stronger side
- a gear tier that takes a lot of farm and time to get and that will give a big advantage versus people with less time / will to pve
- are probably okey with the current gameplay of running in a bigger group rolling over smaller numbers

And still the first group is what you call elitist.

edit: besides, there’s been lots of constructive ideas as well as feedback on to be implemented release. They’ve been ignored big time

What about the third group, as US, which are ok with what dev’s do, because they have RIGHT TO? What about those? Judgemental you are, aren’t you? And i do not see those groups to YELL that they will quit? Of course it is elitist attitude: “If something is not how i imagined, i will quit!” Right, right????

It’s not about things being how imagined, it’s about things being as stated. If someone tells you “look, you should really buy this thing I made. It’s like this this and this and you’re gonna love it” and you buy it. But then after some times he comes by and he replaces it with some crap quite different from what you bought. Wouldn’t you want to throw it in his face?

Because that’s what’s happening here. They sold a game that was promised to be fair, balanced, that people would be equally strong, with beg sieges, fights, little farm and no homeworks and now where is all that? Out the kittening window that’s where.

Drigan.7382:

The power creep in WvW is another complete issue all on its own, and this stat buff just adds to it. This stat buff killed the chances of having competitive fights. When you’re a guild in the open field, you don’t want to roll through another guild for a cheap win with an uneven advantage that the other guild had no real chance to have during the fight. I don’t want enemies to have the buffs, especially when we fight groups larger than us, but I definitely don’t want the buff on me either. It cheapens any win we’d have in the open field and destroys any semblance of competition WvW had.

Food and exotic stat potential has nothing to do with this orb buff. The difference is both sides could choose to have or not have it. For the orb buff, its either you have it, or they have it, and neither side can choose not to have it. Please stop posting here if you are going to derail this thread.

If one side is using stacking sigils or food or oil/crystals/stones and the other is not, if one side is using ascended and the other rares, if one side si using runes/orbs and the other not then there is a disadvantage. Yes these things are different from the orb mechanic because you can choose to have them anytime but that does not mean that that choice invalidates the legitimacy of the fact that ALL WvW fights are uneven. The degree to which they can be uneven can vary, but generally handicaps and concessions are taken to deal with this uneveness. If that orb buff breaks your ability to have fun because of a stat increase on your side, " weaken" yourself. If my opponent is buffed i will welcome the added challenge.

Ensign.2189:

Dirame.8521:

So if they removed the stat buffs and kept the capture points so that they still allowed you to capture 3 of them to get points per kill, would that be alright for all you guys who have problems with it?

I think the 3 points per kill introduces some really toxic incentives into the game. For example, if you are outmanned on a map, it no longer makes sense to have a skeleton crew there to cause some havoc and force the enemy to keep their team there – because getting killed while trying for objectives now feeds the enemy team points. A 5 man havoc squad getting caught and wiped at a tower might feed the enemy team as many points as you would have gotten stealing the tower in the first place.

The points on stomp punish risky play hard; they act as a strong incentive to not try when you are outmanned and any aggressive play has a good chance of you getting caught and killed. Tactical wiping is now extremely punishing, and engaging a bigger army than the one you have is sabotaging your team.

Basically, if you don’t own bloodlust, you should really be playing super passively – and that is not at all healthy for the game.

I think the points on stomp are a much bigger deal than the stats – and the stats are pretty comically stupid.

Quoting this well thought out post.

Put it simply for a possible suggestion, getting stomped with an Outmanned buff should not award bloodlust points to the team that stomped you.

Yes.

/15 chars

Basedgod.7328:

getting stomped with an Outmanned buff should not award bloodlust points to the team that stomped you.

+1

Yes, Devs said it themselves.

Delta Blues.8507:

…

Well, this is not about what they stated…As we all know, ANet has their PR, and as every other game, they will lie. Do you remember manifesto? What lies were there and what is going on now?

And, did we threat to quit the game? Those threats are elitist egoistic crap, and you cannot turn it other way. If you do not like it, do not play it. Simple as that. So, they said it will not be grindy, but it is. I do not like grindy games, but you do not see me here having my ego through the roof and stating this bullcrap. I am still playing the game, and love more stuff than i hate, and you do not see me going:" CHANGE THAT AND THAT OR MY GUILD WILL LEAVE". <<<< again, ELITIST attitude.

I know of two guilds which have quit playing due to this patch already, i wont reveal their tag cz i respect their prvacy about who they want to know. But yes guilds are quitting!

Ensign.2189:

Dirame.8521:

So if they removed the stat buffs and kept the capture points so that they still allowed you to capture 3 of them to get points per kill, would that be alright for all you guys who have problems with it?

I think the 3 points per kill introduces some really toxic incentives into the game. For example, if you are outmanned on a map, it no longer makes sense to have a skeleton crew there to cause some havoc and force the enemy to keep their team there – because getting killed while trying for objectives now feeds the enemy team points. A 5 man havoc squad getting caught and wiped at a tower might feed the enemy team as many points as you would have gotten stealing the tower in the first place.

The points on stomp punish risky play hard; they act as a strong incentive to not try when you are outmanned and any aggressive play has a good chance of you getting caught and killed. Tactical wiping is now extremely punishing, and engaging a bigger army than the one you have is sabotaging your team.

Basically, if you don’t own bloodlust, you should really be playing super passively – and that is not at all healthy for the game.

I also feel like the stomp bonus encourages players to log out when they’re downed. I know that you still give loot and experience if you do this, but I don’t think you surrender any points.

its worrying me that on our server tonight was like no one online and the other servers same thing…we are in t2 and oceanics was dead…i mean we managed to upgrade bay o.0 ….i mean with wp…and hills almost too…..still waiting on the usual 30-45 man zergs to steamroll everything…..o.0….also a few guilds didnt log onto wvw atm…

It’s not about things being how imagined, it’s about things being as stated. If someone tells you “look, you should really buy this thing I made. It’s like this this and this and you’re gonna love it” and you buy it. But then after some times he comes by and he replaces it with some crap quite different from what you bought. Wouldn’t you want to throw it in his face?

My copy of the game, back when i bought it, had orbs which were actually a bit more powerful due to extra health they provided on top of the all-stat boost. They were also much harder to neutralise for the weaker servers, making the strongest team not only stronger but also much safer on their lead.
Bloodlust is pretty easy to neutralise, compared to orbs. Bloodlust seems resistant to hacking, like the infamous orb-flying. Finally, bloodlust is much closer to what was in the game when i bought it, and what was advertised back in the day, providing extra incentive in the format; a big chunk of the playerbase had been asking ANet to reintroduce orbs, in one way or another, for a long time, and now that they’ve finally designed a much better yet similar system, egotistical pricks threaten to leave.

Except for extra points-per-stomp, bloodlust is not new. Unless you joined the game post-orb-removal, which might somehow explain your blindness and stubborness, but please do not play the ‘i bought a different game’ card because it only makes you look silly.
For months, we’d known orbs are coming back, or at least some kind of orb-like mechanics; we’d known it was in development and coming some day. Do not act surprised and caught out of nothing, simply having forgotten what was meant to be in the game since its beginning (but was removed due to hacking, flying and balance – but mainly in the ‘safety’ side of it, as in orbs being defended in t3 keeps being virtually untouchable for the weakest) and having ignored devs saying something along those lines will come back.

lol @ devon

Stormleaf.1769:

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

If you find WvW so incredibly unacceptable in its current state that you’re willing to quit en masse, then maybe GW2 just isn’t the game for you? Play the game for what it is right now, not for what you fantasize about it being in the future.

It was the game for them two days ago, and apparently it was the game for 99% of this forum two days ago. It was the game for a not insignificant portion of the WvW-playing playerbase two days ago, as well. If GW2 was never a game that they enjoyed, then maybe I’d agree with you, but that’s not the case.

I find it amusing that the game is suddenly shattered for so many over something as insignificant as a 0-150 point increase in stats. I simply can’t believe that people who honestly and legitimately enjoyed the game prior to the buff are unable to logically enjoy it now. It seems far more likely that they’re simply being disingenuous, for effect.

I do not think it is a question of “previously enjoying”; it is more a question of “I cannot wait any longer for this game to be better”. Every patch I, as many other WvW players, do hope there will be something good which could add longevity to my game. So far, not much has given hope, I reckon.

I do believe the answer is yes, I’m not saying that to be negative, Devon actually said they would consider changing it if he saw numbers dropping ….

I find it adorable that random pve puggers or people who join WvW once in a while come in here and say “don’t let the door hit you on the way out” to the guilds that post on here….

You have to be pve pugger, since most people that come in to WvW and are new and want to be more competitive in WvW, join a guild or make a guild (even if its a small roaming guild with a few buddies), if that’s not you….you are a random person that no one really cares about lol

The fact is, guilds make up 90% of WvW. If they leave. WvW dies on all servers

Stormleaf.1769:

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

If you find WvW so incredibly unacceptable in its current state that you’re willing to quit en masse, then maybe GW2 just isn’t the game for you? Play the game for what it is right now, not for what you fantasize about it being in the future.

It was the game for them two days ago, and apparently it was the game for 99% of this forum two days ago. It was the game for a not insignificant portion of the WvW-playing playerbase two days ago, as well. If GW2 was never a game that they enjoyed, then maybe I’d agree with you, but that’s not the case.

I find it amusing that the game is suddenly shattered for so many over something as insignificant as a 0-150 point increase in stats. I simply can’t believe that people who honestly and legitimately enjoyed the game prior to the buff are unable to logically enjoy it now. It seems far more likely that they’re simply being disingenuous, for effect.

I agree with this. Obviously you have to adjust to new things, but I haven’t had any issues with general WvW play after the update. As far as the general play goes(taking keeps, defending stuff, killing people, flipping camps, roaming, ect) I don’t see a huge issue.

The primary leaders of this whining are GvG guilds/players, which I know the guild of the OP of this thread is a member of a guild that GvGs(I was in a GvG against them recently.) To solve that all Anet had to do was put a neutral zone behind south camp, but instead they decided to be pricks about it. Now you have all of the GvG community raging all over the forums and threatening to quit in mass. It would have been a simple solution that wouldn’t have hurt anything.

I find it amusing that all you people do is threaten to quit but don’t. I am taking a LONG break from this game, maybe play once a month or log on to say Hi to friends. Needless to say, I think the people who are frustrated need to just leave for awhile and take a break too. If you see that the game is still broken and neglected, keep playing like I do, once a month maybe. There is more to life than this game, I see your passion but, to a certain extend. Imagine if ANET ran the Government, seems like it now, but sooner or later there will be an uprising and things will change.

timidobserver.7925:

Stormleaf.1769:

Sarrs.4831:

Stormleaf.1769:

If you find WvW so incredibly unacceptable in its current state that you’re willing to quit en masse, then maybe GW2 just isn’t the game for you? Play the game for what it is right now, not for what you fantasize about it being in the future.

It was the game for them two days ago, and apparently it was the game for 99% of this forum two days ago. It was the game for a not insignificant portion of the WvW-playing playerbase two days ago, as well. If GW2 was never a game that they enjoyed, then maybe I’d agree with you, but that’s not the case.

I find it amusing that the game is suddenly shattered for so many over something as insignificant as a 0-150 point increase in stats. I simply can’t believe that people who honestly and legitimately enjoyed the game prior to the buff are unable to logically enjoy it now. It seems far more likely that they’re simply being disingenuous, for effect.

I agree with this. Obviously you have to adjust to new things, but I haven’t had any issues with general WvW play after the update.

The primary leaders of this whining are GvG guilds/players. To solve that all Anet had to do was put a neutral zone behind south camp, but instead they decided to be pricks about it. Now you have all of the GvG community raging all over the forums and threatening to quit in mass. It would have been a simple solution.

I’m a Guild Leader, and we primarily raid WvW. My guild has never GvG’d during the lifetime of GW2…

Your arbitrary statement tries to demean both types of players, the people who GvG and the people who go out there to just WvW, thinking most people on the forums complaining are solely a bunch of GvGers QQing is shortsighted at best.

I would dissagree with the fact that you think the primary leaders of the whining are GvG Guilds/Players, it has made an already impossible battle worse down here in the low Tiers. Take X server that fields maybe 30-50 players (thats all maps) fighting Y server that fields 40-80 and then Z server who fields 100-200+, X server is doing everything they can to hold keeps towers and not be spawn camped. There is alot of this happening in the matchup to the point where Z has enough players to take towers and keeps and hold the buff, given the lowest server and possibly the lowest 2 no chance of combatting the already severly lopsided matchup.

Im not gonna read through all the garbage on this thread against the patch, but I will point out that:

IT ONLY TAKES ONE PERSON TO BACK CAP / DECAP / CAP a point.

If you are so serious about WvW, why dont you take 1 person from your guild (who enjoys PvP) and let them do the capping…One person, your zerg spamming #1 will not miss one person.

Ensign.2189:

Dirame.8521:

So if they removed the stat buffs and kept the capture points so that they still allowed you to capture 3 of them to get points per kill, would that be alright for all you guys who have problems with it?

I think the 3 points per kill introduces some really toxic incentives into the game. For example, if you are outmanned on a map, it no longer makes sense to have a skeleton crew there to cause some havoc and force the enemy to keep their team there – because getting killed while trying for objectives now feeds the enemy team points. A 5 man havoc squad getting caught and wiped at a tower might feed the enemy team as many points as you would have gotten stealing the tower in the first place.

The points on stomp punish risky play hard; they act as a strong incentive to not try when you are outmanned and any aggressive play has a good chance of you getting caught and killed. Tactical wiping is now extremely punishing, and engaging a bigger army than the one you have is sabotaging your team.

Basically, if you don’t own bloodlust, you should really be playing super passively – and that is not at all healthy for the game.

I think the points on stomp are a much bigger deal than the stats – and the stats are pretty comically stupid.

Nail on the head… typically I would run in with a banner to rez lord if close to tick with a small team vs many… now there is no point in doing so as they will stomp you can gain more points anyway.

Littlefeather.8623:

Im not gonna read through all the garbage on this thread against the patch, but I will point out that:

IT ONLY TAKES ONE PERSON TO BACK CAP / DECAP / CAP a point.

If you are so serious about WvW, why dont you take 1 person from your guild (who enjoys PvP) and let them do the capping…One person, your zerg spamming #1 will not miss one person.

There is little pvp involved with the capping..

You have to stand on it… forever. To keep it.

Oh you have competition now? Don’t worry they’ll just avoid you and either wait for you to leave or cap one of the other points.

The new conquest areas are just another failure. They actively discourage PvP and boring activity (sitting on the point… forever).

This is just one minor reason the Bloodlust Buff is receiving so many complaints.

OMG Anet is not scared if you quit anyway Chinese market open now XD