Guild Wars 2

Hi all

Why is edge of the mists so unbalanced.. ?!?.. I mean I do understand why all the green servers being green and so on…

but eotm seems to be always in favor of greens.. I get that SFR always win (mostly).. so greens always have a massive population…

I mean cmon.. at least rotate these servers on eotm… dont always make them green..

Anet are usually good at balancing skills, bosses and characters.. they do skill balances each update even when I didnt know there was an unbalance… but edge of the mists seems to be a runaway train when it comes to balance

why dont they just random the servers each week.. even if SFR is green each week.. dont make them green each week on edge.. in fact.. make new colours.. just random it up a little..

I mean I’m green some weeks too.. and if SFR are green.. then its just steam roll over the map all week.. and that’s fine.. I usually make a new char when I’m green.. I’ll level too 80 by weeks end..

is there a reason why its so unbalanced?.. is it meant to be this way??

I mean it is easily fixed.. just don’t relate eotm too wvw.. change it up a little.. make the colours spawn random… and level the playing field..

I only say this cause of some low tier servers that are always mostly red.. they must find edge of the mists daunting.. by constant steam rolled by greens…

easy fix.. make new colours.. (yellow, purple, brown).. mix up the edge match ups each week.. not depending on their WvW result..

Anet focus on balance a lot.. its strange they completely ignore this super unbalance.. and its going on for awhile now..

the map itself doesnt help.. reds easiest too take.. greens the toughest too take.. I mean it almost seems engineered this way.. if so.. why??

fix it.. and make it fun for all servers.. not just for servers that are green..

S.

currently on Gandara…

As a low level player there is no point of joining EOTS for leveling purposes. We get stepped on every single time. I managed about 1 level (20 → 21) in 2 days; I could only stomach a couple of hours of ‘fun’.

As a lv 80 player, why would I join EOTS? Part of the ‘zerg’ feels the same as a lv 1 player, every time we encounter the enemy we are bags, and as solo I could make no difference. So I joined WvW and capped a few things. At least I felt that I did a minuscule contribution.

It is an overflow map. If you want a balanced match, join your server’s fight instead of farming an overflow map.

rogerwilko.6895:

As a low level player there is no point of joining EOTS for leveling purposes. We get stepped on every single time. I managed about 1 level (20 -> 21) in 2 days; I could only stomach a couple of hours of ‘fun’.

Maybe, just maybe, the reason you are getting stepped on is because everyone on your side is underleveled and undergeared in a pvp environment? Then it’s working as intended. When people stop treating EotM as their leveling ground, or karma/champ train, EotM will transform into an actually good map for pvp battles.

that may be, but I don’t believe in such generalizations
what’s certain is that we had that buff that sais we are very few

Phoenixlin.8624:

It is an overflow map.

what does this mean?

Eotm is an temporary map were you can “fight” while waiting in the Q to an official boarderland. The points you gain doesn’t count for your server.
So pve people decided to turn Eotm into a karmafest. That’s the main reason why I never go there. 90% are upscaled pug’s. The land of the rallybots.

Hoaxintelligence.4628:

So pve people decided to turn Eotm into a karmafest. That’s the main reason why I never go there. 90% are upscaled pug’s. The land of the rallybots.

There was this one time a group of regular WvWers gathered in EotM. We started moving around, not taking things just trying to find the enemy upleveled zerg and destroy it. It was great fun, those guys were getting killed faster than ambient creatures! Oh, we were “outnumbered” too… but I guess all the numbers in the world can’t help the farmers if they are just bad

As a side note we did something similar yesterday on the my Borderland, it was being taken by another server (big blob) so a group of guildies appeared and defended a couple objectives, it was SO funny winning against triple numbers, they were all morning karma/champ farmers so we killed them quickly and eventually they left the Borderland and never came back!

Don’t blame the farmers in WvW… get a proper team and farm them, sometimes they drop nice loot!

I like to fight WvW guilds. Not randoms. I don’t go WvW for the lootbags.
If I want lootbags I follow the commander, wich I don’t like cause I roam solo yolo, or Im raid with the guild. But I understand why its funny as hell to kill an upscale group like they were insects xD

its not an overflow map.. you will join the an instance.. when that instance fills up.. then a new instance will be made and all new players will join that instance and so on.. there is no set server overflows.. since its all servers

rogerwilko.6895:

currently on Gandara…

As a low level player there is no point of joining EOTS for leveling purposes. We get stepped on every single time. I managed about 1 level (20 -> 21) in 2 days; I could only stomach a couple of hours of ‘fun’.

As a lv 80 player, why would I join EOTS? Part of the ‘zerg’ feels the same as a lv 1 player, every time we encounter the enemy we are bags, and as solo I could make no difference. So I joined WvW and capped a few things. At least I felt that I did a minuscule contribution.

I put this down to bad commander.. a good commander would read the map and can pretty much figure out where the Green’s are.. and are able to avoid them.. and thats how unbalanced it is.. if your red.. forget about any sort of zerg fights.. its a case of dodge the zerg.. and karma train.. but u need a good commander to read the map and plan accordingly..

Saifon.9857:

its not an overflow map.. you will join the an instance.. when that instance fills up.. then a new instance will be made and all new players will join that instance and so on.. there is no set server overflows.. since its all servers

The original design was for it to be like an overflow map. However, they didn’t want it to be inaccessible to people on low activity WvW servers so they didn’t make it to where you had to be in a queue for WvW to be put on the map.

It’s not really designed to have equal numbers on each side or be evenly matched.

Neither is WvW itself. If you want balanced fights against other players you have to go to pure PvP.

so its designed to be unbalanced.. but why?.. I mean not really fair for the servers that are constantly red to have a completely different game experience than the green or blue teams.. I thought guild wars was all about balance and fair play.. but I just don’t understand why?.. surely its an easy solution.. just randomize the colors or something..

Why balance EOTM if anything they do is try to avoid the karma trains?

I don’t see green as always being the dominant side. I’ve seen weeks where Frostreach mowed down opposition nonstop with map blobs, and weeks when Badlands clearly outnumbers the other colors.

I think a lot of it has to do with what T1 server is which color, but that doesn’t always show you which one is going to be the most populated. Plus, which T1 server wins changes a lot each week except for during tournaments, so we rotate colors a lot. Badlands is the most often underpopulated, but it’s not always.

In several of the tiers, afaik, one server dominates others, so they’ll usually be green – and servers that win easily in lower tiers are the more populated ones, so green is most often the most numerous, but there’s really no way to change this potential imbalance without making colors completely random (which a lot of people have asked for anyway for mapping purposes), but I see plenty of instances where red or blue wipe green repeatedly. And during OCX/SEA, whichever color JQ is usually dominates, from what I’ve seen.

EotM doesn’t necessarily favor green. It’s more along the lines of who is on green that week. I’ve heard from various people that JQ has a strong presence there. You’ll likely notice a difference in weeks that they’re another color. There are also multiple maps and I’ve seen green actually losing many times.

EotM as stated previously is/was intended to be an overflow map for WvW. It was designed as a place to go when the regular WvW maps, G,R,B borderlands and EB were queued. So yes it was not designed to be balanced or equal in any way shape or form. Most of the time it does favor green as those servers that are Green for their match are favored to be the winner of the match based on Glicko rating, therefore they tend to have a higher population. Anet recognized early on that this map was not being used as intended, instead becoming a leveling area/ktrain/champ train. In fact there are several guilds that run for only EotM. Working as intended? Nope, but the map is there now and often you see more activity from some servers there than you do on their actual borderlands and EB.

The overall game population decline makes this map completely unnecessary in regards to WvW, with only T1/T2 able to actually queue a map these days. In T4 we may see a queue for EB on reset and even that isn’t long enough to justify keeping EotM as an overflow.

It’s unbalanced because enemy rage quit after first wipe. Usually first wipe happen when enemy afk PvD some tower and we run over them before they even notice what happening. Weird thing is that we never get caught with pants down like that.

I do not even see a need that EotM assignment respects server-membership.
For the 4h of the match a person always gets the same color, but otherwise it should be next join goes to weakest team.

EotM should be removed from the game entirelly or massively revamped. 99.9% of it’s playerbase are mindless upscaled characters, following a commander zerging PvE “bosses” while avoiding the other 2 teams with any means nessessary.

As a low lvl character, I don’t like farming the same stuff over and over to gain lvl’s. I’d rather grab a friend and do PvE stuff where we could have a bit of fun.

As a lvl 80 char, the only reason I see in going EotM, is because I’m bored of the other 2 WvW map designs. Having said that, as a solo roamer, 90% of the enemies you wil find will be upscaled chars running away, 8% lvl 80 chars running away, and the rest 2% will be players like you who roaming in EotM because they are terribly bored.

Règi here. I play on SFR and have been playing there for a long time. During that time SFR has always had a strong presence in the EotM. I used to lead regularly ( starting 1 pm or 11 pm ), but recently decided to stop doing so, because there is no point in leading anymore, if you’re on SFR’s color, that is.

Mostly when I tag and /supplyinfo on the second sentry, because most of us reached the tag by then, I have 80-89 players on me. Usually I would start of with a gank on Frostreach, since I know most enemy commanders ( or they know me ), I usually asked for a number count, most of the times they would’ve around 50-60 ppl on tag, of course with 80-89 players, and some SFR lvl 80 pugs who come to farm kills, it is an easy wipe. After that I would move around the map to find Badlands somewhere and kill them. Usually I would find they couldn’t even make orange swords.

So for me EotM is 90v50-60v20-30. This would be the unbalanced part of EotM where OP is talking about. Of course, like others mentioned, when SFR would not be green, there would be a huge change in population, but that’s besides the point, because in my opinion what happened here has something to do with several mechanics of the game, of which I will only name two.

The first and foremost mechanic is the commander. I strongly believe EotM has been dominated, because of one single dedicated commander. Someone who developed and ran efficient paths and has really good map-awareness, making him/her able to predict enemies easily and killing them as a result. The part of this mechanic that failed is that there isn’t/wasn’t really a counterpart to this commander. At least not someone who could beat him/her at a daily basis, this maybe because nobody played as frequent as him/her. In effect to this a lot of people would frequently follow this commander and people that weren’t on SFR’ side would do something else that week. Why there is no real counter-part is debatable, might be because of strong SFR lvl 80 guardian presence that would render any other commander incapable of repelling, or because no other commander took the time and the effort to learn the countless mechanics of this map and get some force to follow him like a support group, so to say.

The other mechanic is the server population imbalance. Like most know SFR has a lot of bandwagonners and they just keep adding, apparently everyone is tired of getting stomped and decide to join the winning party, I guess nobody likes a challenge anymore (or they do, I heard some SFR pug commanders moved to FSP so that they could’ve interesting fights again).

I read now that people want Anet to fix this issue, while it’s actually an issue that could be resolved by the community, but it would require effort, time and will. In my opinion FR and BL should start getting organised, there should be a, or several, commander(s) that try and organise their side with a support group regularly. If people can’t be bothered to do so then this game-mode will be reserved for the mindless k-train people argue it to be.

To respond to some arguments people made:

- I do not think EotM is still a map that serves purely as an overflow, since WvW is so queue-less nowadays it’s purpose has changed, it was once intended to be an overflow, but the community changed it to something else.

- I agree with Junkpile on the notion that a lot of players just ragequit after they wipe at start. It’s mostly their commanders fault, but they should know there is most likely an aggressive enemy force coming most of the time out of experiences they had before and question their commander’s decision, but this mostly ties back on commander’s just not being competent.

- NA has made EotM an entirely different thing (from what I have heard groups get their own overflow and such) and thus the issue OP is talking about is more an EU-related thing, it does prove however that the community indeed has the capability to fix this issue on its own.

Final note, I will most likely make some edits after some good sleep x)

Yes all go to EoTM now SFR is splitting up and not killing WvW anymore all go EoTM you will get massive skills and end of the weak you all be good as Red Guard.
Killing in EoTM is easyer then doing PvE in lvl 80 areas.

BTW EoTM is not WvW wrong section move to general next time.

Theorem:
SFR ( ViZ was until Anet nerfed them because casuals could not beat him.) is GW2’s endboss. You have to beat him to finish the game.

Axiom:
1) SFR killed wvw
2) SFR killed eotm

Lemma:
1) The BIG BAD GUY, who is hard to defeat is the endboss.
2) SFR is a BIG BAD GUY, because A1 and A2.
3) SFR is hard to defeat.

Conclusion: SFR is the endboss.
Q.E.D.

I agree. It is unbelievably unbalanced. A way i was thinking to correct it, is to handle it like the PVP games.

It is just a waiting room, right? At least, that was intended purpose. It is however a map a lot of people enjoy simply leveling on etc. And to be frank, its a fun distraction as well.

However, it is not fun if you get ganked the whole time.

So, if possible, let every person who log on, fall into a que, and get distributed red-green-blue etc, like in PvP. Someone leaves blue, blue gets the next guy that logs on. That way, you do not have a complete over dominance of one side. Additionally, you split servers into the three sides evenly.

The map goes back to be a waiting room, and it hopefully resole a lot of the balance issues.

The only time you’ll probably see competent blue or red commanders is if they are dominating their tier’s matchup. If they are not, they can’t be running EotM when their home is being wrecked.

This is why Green is always winning in EotM because they are winning in WvW and bored to tears…

This is totally unbalanced. I agree green ALWAYS wins. Or at least 80% of the time. I ve played there for the past weeks and i always get runned over as i m not green and always roll over ennemies when i m green.
Plz balance the mist Anet.

You cant balance it because its not WvW. There is nothing to balance. Its just PvE with upscaled pug zergs rolling around. You want to see some fun? Put a 30 man WvW guild in EoTM and hilarity ensue. They will roll over everything. Keep bosses that take a while to kill and can take out 10+ pug zergers? Dead in 10 seconds. 60+ man zone blobs? 30 of them are in downed state in the first 5 seconds of battle.

I suggest just accepting your weekly fate of being the underdog. Anet cant balance this.

Dawdler.8521:

You cant balance it because its not WvW. There is nothing to balance. Its just PvE with upscaled pug zergs rolling around. You want to see some fun? Put a 30 man WvW guild in EoTM and hilarity ensue. They will roll over everything. Keep bosses that take a while to kill and can take out 10+ pug zergers? Dead in 10 seconds. 60+ man zone blobs? 30 of them are in downed state in the first 5 seconds of battle.

I suggest just accepting your weekly fate of being the underdog. Anet cant balance this.

Manpower can of course be balanced. It’s absolutely avoidable that 1-2 side have permanent outmanned buff.

I’m on deso so I am almost never green, it’s always blue or red for me. I’m ok with it for the most part since I see it as a competition between red and blue, which is good and fun since both blue and red are usually fair game to each other. Just avoid green like ebola, which is not too hard TBH.

It is weeks like this where SFR is red where EotM becomes so unbalanced to the point where it is not fun.

People are saying EotM is for fighting ? Ok life complete I have officially seen it all now.

Another EotM thread? ~.~

It’s pretty easy to troll zergs; especially if you have a party with 2 necros and 1 thief. The bigger the enemy zerg is the better.

Walls to fear off various cliffs, invis cannon slaughter as they try to cap something, 1 last timely cata shot to a bridge that will destroy it and send the blob crashing down, or an old fashioned spawn camp to stomp the constant stream of stragglers who have been killed across the map by your teammates.

EotM is a fun drinking game. So many lols had.

Saifon.9857:

Hi all

Why is edge of the mists so unbalanced.. ?!?.. I mean I do understand why all the green servers being green and so on…

but eotm seems to be always in favor of greens.. I get that SFR always win (mostly).. so greens always have a massive population…

I mean cmon.. at least rotate these servers on eotm… dont always make them green..

Anet are usually good at balancing skills, bosses and characters.. they do skill balances each update even when I didnt know there was an unbalance… but edge of the mists seems to be a runaway train when it comes to balance

why dont they just random the servers each week.. even if SFR is green each week.. dont make them green each week on edge.. in fact.. make new colours.. just random it up a little..

I mean I’m green some weeks too.. and if SFR are green.. then its just steam roll over the map all week.. and that’s fine.. I usually make a new char when I’m green.. I’ll level too 80 by weeks end..

is there a reason why its so unbalanced?.. is it meant to be this way??

I mean it is easily fixed.. just don’t relate eotm too wvw.. change it up a little.. make the colours spawn random… and level the playing field..

I only say this cause of some low tier servers that are always mostly red.. they must find edge of the mists daunting.. by constant steam rolled by greens…

easy fix.. make new colours.. (yellow, purple, brown).. mix up the edge match ups each week.. not depending on their WvW result..

Anet focus on balance a lot.. its strange they completely ignore this super unbalance.. and its going on for awhile now..

the map itself doesnt help.. reds easiest too take.. greens the toughest too take.. I mean it almost seems engineered this way.. if so.. why??

fix it.. and make it fun for all servers.. not just for servers that are green..

S.

Understatment.

Maybe EoTM needs to be where Jade Quarry fights with the lowest servers.

Maybe EoTM needs to have all the larger servers fighting with the lower servers – balance can be had.

It just doesn’t seem that there are very many who are working to balance one thing before moving on an complicating the game with more… More bugs, more problems and still not many really fixed.

Saifon.9857:

so its designed to be unbalanced.. but why?.. I mean not really fair for the servers that are constantly red to have a completely different game experience than the green or blue teams.. I thought guild wars was all about balance and fair play.. but I just don’t understand why?.. surely its an easy solution.. just randomize the colors or something..

It’s designed to be unbalanced because it doesn’t count for anything. The only thing you get for “winning” is some supply dropped into the borderlands of the color that wins, which can’t be +5’d. There’s little point making EotM competitive, when the reward is essentially nothing.

On top of that, because there can be multiple EotM instances running at once, if your side is always losing EotM, you just have terrible luck on which instances you are getting into. In many of those that I have joined, green has been spawncamped for the entirety of a round. And then the same will happen on blue and red next instance.

atheria.2837:

Saifon.9857:

Hi all

Why is edge of the mists so unbalanced.. ?!?.. I mean I do understand why all the green servers being green and so on…

but eotm seems to be always in favor of greens.. I get that SFR always win (mostly).. so greens always have a massive population…

I mean cmon.. at least rotate these servers on eotm… dont always make them green..

Anet are usually good at balancing skills, bosses and characters.. they do skill balances each update even when I didnt know there was an unbalance… but edge of the mists seems to be a runaway train when it comes to balance

why dont they just random the servers each week.. even if SFR is green each week.. dont make them green each week on edge.. in fact.. make new colours.. just random it up a little..

I mean I’m green some weeks too.. and if SFR are green.. then its just steam roll over the map all week.. and that’s fine.. I usually make a new char when I’m green.. I’ll level too 80 by weeks end..

is there a reason why its so unbalanced?.. is it meant to be this way??

I mean it is easily fixed.. just don’t relate eotm too wvw.. change it up a little.. make the colours spawn random… and level the playing field..

I only say this cause of some low tier servers that are always mostly red.. they must find edge of the mists daunting.. by constant steam rolled by greens…

easy fix.. make new colours.. (yellow, purple, brown).. mix up the edge match ups each week.. not depending on their WvW result..

Anet focus on balance a lot.. its strange they completely ignore this super unbalance.. and its going on for awhile now..

the map itself doesnt help.. reds easiest too take.. greens the toughest too take.. I mean it almost seems engineered this way.. if so.. why??

fix it.. and make it fun for all servers.. not just for servers that are green..

S.

Understatment.

Maybe EoTM needs to be where Jade Quarry fights with the lowest servers.

Maybe EoTM needs to have all the larger servers fighting with the lower servers – balance can be had.

It just doesn’t seem that there are very many who are working to balance one thing before moving on an complicating the game with more… More bugs, more problems and still not many really fixed.

Jade Quarry does fight with the lowest servers in EotM. If they are green, then the lowest server that is also green is fighting with JQ. And the second-lowest green. And the third. And so on.

I’ve been playing again the last few days, thought I would give it another try, nothing has changed, OG groups and BL are huge and swarm us, we have no chance we rarely have enough people to do anything Outnumbered buff like the whole day.

Thanks for bumping this. The subject line made me laugh. :-)

LOL at the subject line x2

Because it was designed as a “waiting room” back when WvW regularly had long ques.

It wasn’t designed to be fair or competitive. It was designed to give people a way to get WxP while they were in que for real WvW, and to try out experimental ideas without disrupting ranked WvW.

Then they just forgot why they built it and dropped the disruptive elements directly in the WvW with HoT anyway.

Because Anet excels at designing systems and then abandoning them to go design more systems, so they can abandon them just as quickly.