Guild Wars 2

My understanding was that the server transfer fees where intended to help maintain some population balance. I don’t believe that anyone thinks that is working.

Given that WvW is considered completely broken as a result of the population imbalance and that most of us expect the “server” model to disappear, it makes little sense to keep us locked on a particular server.

I have been considering looking at other wvw communities to search for guilds. I expect whatever change is made to WvW to fix the population problem will be guild centric and as such I want to find a guild that is a good fit for me. However I am limited to the server that I am on and unless I want to pay $50-$100 in transfer fees while looking I am stuck where I am.

The population balance is broken. It doesn’t matter know if players stack servers because they do it regardless of the fees. And given the uncertainty of the game mode and the lack of information, some of may want to explore our options … and not pay through the nose to do it.

It would fix some of the worlds pop problems but most likely every one would go to the high end T1 and maybe T2 with only a few going to T3 and nothing below that. It may not even fix the time zone pop problem just cause more Q at prime times and a ghost town at others.

I think the current prices are a pretty pointless constraint. I’d very much like to visit other servers for a few weeks to a month at a time, but no way I’m paying 35$ for a return trip like that (→high →very high).

What I’d really like to see is the guesting feature instated for WvW.

Allow people to guest to a server outside of their own matchup. They’ll be able to play on both servers interchangeably. On the weekly reset, the guesting privileges are removed at which point they can choose a new (or the same) server for the next week.

Either that or a monthly/bimonthly free transfer.

I’m not suggesting that it would fix anything. I am suggesting that the fee hasn’t really help the problem.

And since we expect a solution to the population imbalance as that is getting focused on in the changes, in the interim it would be nice to be able to explore the rest of the WvW community without paying for the transfers.

vana.5467:

I think the current prices are a pretty pointless constraint. I’d very much like to visit other servers for a few weeks to a month at a time, but no way I’m paying 35$ for a return trip like that (->high ->very high).

What I’d really like to see is the guesting feature instated for WvW.

Allow people to guest to a server outside of their own matchup. They’ll be able to play on both servers interchangeably. On the weekly reset, the guesting privileges are removed at which point they can choose a new (or the same) server for the next week.

Either that or a monthly/bimonthly free transfer.

Too many free or 9.99 alt accounts exist for player on server a to guest an alt on server b or c in the same matchup for nefarious reasons (though some of that already exists anyway)

I want to avoid setting up f2p accounts just to look around. I think that is a bigger problem than just ending the transfer fees.

No – the server fees are there to block people from all being on the top 3 servers only. No server transfer fees are what caused the destacking of the lower tier servers in the first place. All it would do is recreate the same issue.

TorquedSoul.8097:

My understanding was that the server transfer fees where intended to help maintain some population balance. I don’t believe that anyone thinks that is working.

Given that WvW is considered completely broken as a result of the population imbalance and that most of us expect the “server” model to disappear, it makes little sense to keep us locked on a particular server.

I have been considering looking at other wvw communities to search for guilds. I expect whatever change is made to WvW to fix the population problem will be guild centric and as such I want to find a guild that is a good fit for me. However I am limited to the server that I am on and unless I want to pay $50-$100 in transfer fees while looking I am stuck where I am.

The population balance is broken. It doesn’t matter know if players stack servers because they do it regardless of the fees. And given the uncertainty of the game mode and the lack of information, some of may want to explore our options … and not pay through the nose to do it.

No the server fees were there to PREVENT SERVER STACKING. We had no server transfer fees for 6 months of the game and everyone moved to the top tier servers and left the other tier servers

Dusty Moon.4382:

TorquedSoul.8097:

My understanding was that the server transfer fees where intended to help maintain some population balance. I don’t believe that anyone thinks that is working.

Given that WvW is considered completely broken as a result of the population imbalance and that most of us expect the “server” model to disappear, it makes little sense to keep us locked on a particular server.

I have been considering looking at other wvw communities to search for guilds. I expect whatever change is made to WvW to fix the population problem will be guild centric and as such I want to find a guild that is a good fit for me. However I am limited to the server that I am on and unless I want to pay $50-$100 in transfer fees while looking I am stuck where I am.

The population balance is broken. It doesn’t matter now if players stack servers because they do it regardless of the fees. And given the uncertainty of the game mode and the lack of information, some of may want to explore our options … and not pay through the nose to do it.

No the server fees were there to PREVENT SERVER STACKING. We had no server transfer fees for 6 months of the game and everyone moved to the top tier servers and left the other tier servers

Not sure who you are responding to.

Dusty Moon.4382:

No – the server fees are there to block people from all being on the top 3 servers only. No server transfer fees are what caused the destacking of the lower tier servers in the first place. All it would do is recreate the same issue.

And yet you need to pay to transfer to ANY server regardless of tier. Not as much, but there is still a fee.

The issue still exists. There is no salvaging things as they are. The fees are pointless now. Until the changes they should just give the freedom to poke around the different communities.

They should still limit populations, they just shouldnt limit mobility.

IMHO transfers themselves are an issue, if not THE issue. I rolled a server on 3-day head-start. Guess what, I’ve NEVER been off that server (even once upon a time when they WERE free)!

Furthermore, if I’m not mistaken and they haven’t changed anything. A server’s population is not determined by how many people actually “rolled” it, it’s determined by how many are actively ONLINE at any given moment. Servers SHOULD be capped at a certain point of how many people chose that as a server, not how many are online at that particular moment!

So, here’s a solution. Set a hard server ‘cap’ (for all servers), and have that determined by how many chose that server, not whether they’re on or off-line! Then, taking things a step further, stop offering transfers all together (free or otherwise). Then that will make “picking a server” that much more important, because you had better pick one you’re going to want to stick with, because you’re never going to be allowed to transfer away from it! if you were THAT hard up about playing on a new/different server, you’d HAVE to buy another/new account!

May make some people very frustrated, but it’s better than the system as it stands! Either way, unless transfers themselves are eliminated and no longer offered, you’re always going to have those “fair weather” players who will xfer to a new server just because they always want to “win” >.<

Even if they didn’t discontinue transfers, they should at least implement a HARD CAP per server, that’s not based on how many are online. Which, as far as I can tell, is exactly how it’s set up right now (and has been). That right there WOULD (or at least in theory should) fix “population balance” issues, because they could set it at a nice low number so that we’re all FORCED to disperse!

Also, now that literally the ONLY reason for a “server” choice to even exist is WVW, they could just make it so that if you don’t WVW you are “serverless”, or if for technical reasons they do still need people to be in a ‘server’ they could make a “PVE” server (with no cap) so that people that don’t WVW are either “serverless” or on an uncapped “PVE” server, so us WVW’ers are FORCED to disperse among the WVW servers…!

At least that’s what I would do if I was “in charge”…
1) set a HARD limit to server capacity (based on how many people chose that server, not how many are “online”).
2) make PVE/PVP (non WvWers) either “serverless” or on a “non capped” “PVE server”.
3) cease offering transfers – NO more transfers!

Of course to account for people who go “inactive” you’d have to have a system implemented so that an inactive account doesn’t count toward the overall population. I’d say something along the lines of either 30/60/90 days of inactivity and they cease counting toward the server population (allowing for someone who is active to then join). If such account attempts to resume activity they can only re-join IF/when the server isn’t currently at capacity! Maybe at that time permit them to chose a new server that isn’t at capacity.

I feel like I’m taking crazy pills.

The Fees have not stopped server stacking.

The game is currently broken and there is not a FIX for population imbalance within the current WvW Server centric framework.

Been some time since only people who enter wvw count against the cap and set capacity status.

What is unknown is how quickly the status reacts to mass transfer on or off a server – seems to be @ 3 weeks.

No transfers is just silly – every game I ever played had some form of transfer available. This coming from a guy who also is on the same server as originally rolled at head start and never moved…..

Liston.9708:

Been some time since only people who enter wvw count against the cap and set capacity status.

What is unknown is how quickly the status reacts to mass transfer on or off a server – seems to be @ 3 weeks.

No transfers is just silly – every game I ever played had some form of transfer available. This coming from a guy who also is on the same server as originally rolled at head start and never moved…..

Oh, don’t get me wrong; I’d be doing that just to be a d***! It’s gets old seeing all the fair weather players bounce around just so they could be “winners”. Yea, they’re “winners” alright >.> They’re certainly a “special kind of special”!

Though my “system” (or “idea”) could certainly be implemented without the elimination of transfers all-together. Just make it so that servers have a HARD capacity in the first place. Then people would still be able to xfer, just not if the HARD cap has been reached… To still be a d*** to those fair weather “specials” – I would increase the cost though. I’d make it cost as much as buying a new account to transfer to any “Tier” >.> Then they only benefit of doing so is so that they don’t lose their toons/stuffs…

Server transfer fees are there to make anet some income.

At first everyone was affected, but then to fix the problem of empty PvE zone maps they combined them into megaservers. That meant the fees effectively didn’t affect a huge slice of the community.

They now affect WvW and cross atlantic movements, but not all. Delete your toons and you can transfer free of charge. So WvW spy accounts can move free but normal accounts have to pay.

Effectively it’s become a tax on WvW players, and probability is anet is not getting as much from it at the moment.

They could easily make transfers down from higher servers free at least. Really transfer fees aren’t effective at keeping the numbers spread out, I created an account on Yaks when it was mid table in US, now it’s top. It filled up very quickly as it moved up. If people want to move they will, server fees aren’t much of a deterrent.

Basing rewards on the numbers of players on opposing servers and adjusting for capability might help. It would mean that a numerically weaker server would get better rewards from an event in WvW than a strong one doing the same event against them. It would have to be a marked difference in reward and change dynamically.

It would also affect night capping Karma trains, who would find their earnings quickly dry up.

I suppose removing the transfer fees would also make it easier for the trolls and spies to move around.

msalakka.4653:

I suppose removing the transfer fees would also make it easier for the trolls and spies to move around.

With the current state of WvW, is that even an issue anymore? Maybe in some teirs where there is PPT competition.

With the free accounts, if they’re serious about spying, they will level to 60 and spy that way anyways.

I can see the problem of: "Free Transfer destroyed WvW in the first place." and also the "Free Transfer every 2-3 months to let us try to even it out." part. Caught in the middle.

Server transfer fees are part of the problem keeping players from balancing out the matches. If a match up is stale, too many Queues on your server, if you could easily transfer between the servers to balance that out it would make that easier for those players that are not financially able to do so.

Currently many WvW Players already have accounts on many servers and those players already have the advantage over the players who do not and have a different game experience. I do not think it is possible for a player to only play on one server to fully experience what WvW has to offer because they only know what they have been exposed to, and from one server that is very limited.

I think allowing for a free WvW server transfer every 3 months or so would help prevent stale match ups and keep things more balanced since players leave game or take breaks and this greatly changes the balance in the tiers long before Glicko can catch up.

If they removed transfer fees, I wouldn’t see much reason for those of us stuck in low-tier ghettos to stick around, except for loyalty. It’s just hard to stay loyal when your server gets relentlessly beat down every week without fail due to population and coverage deficits. 6-1 and worse odds in every fight tend to get old after awhile, no matter how much you like to “fight for the underdog.”

ANet could solve the problem by merging servers or creating alliances, but those solutions won’t make them much money, so we continue to see the slow trickle of players from losing servers transferring to winning servers at the cost of an outrageous transfer fee.

msalakka.4653:

I suppose removing the transfer fees would also make it easier for the trolls and spies to move around.

Spy accounts used to move by deleting their single character and switching server free.

Now someone could have free accounts on all of the servers simply by leveling a single character to 60 on each. This is one reason I thought they were a bit too generous giving permanent access to free accounts.

Trolls can be gotten rid of simply by anet temporarily or permanently banning their account depending on how bad they are.

lil devils x.6071:

If a match up is stale, too many Queues on your server, if you could easily transfer between the servers to balance that out

This is just disingenuous lip service. In the three years of this game, the only guilds who ever cared about transferring for balance were GvG guilds and that scene is beyond dead. The VAST MAJORITY have transferred to the latest bandwagon server.

Many GvG guilds have left GW2 or are considering going.

Unfortunately WvW was never really suitable for them, just the best option they had in GW2. Their game play conflicts with PPT and neither of the areas provided by Anet are large enough for GvG. Then you have the issue of getting the guilds together. The guild hall arena is barely large enough for 5v5.

sparc.3649:

Liston.9708:

Been some time since only people who enter wvw count against the cap and set capacity status.

What is unknown is how quickly the status reacts to mass transfer on or off a server – seems to be @ 3 weeks.

No transfers is just silly – every game I ever played had some form of transfer available. This coming from a guy who also is on the same server as originally rolled at head start and never moved…..

Oh, don’t get me wrong; I’d be doing that just to be a d***! It’s gets old seeing all the fair weather players bounce around just so they could be “winners”. Yea, they’re “winners” alright >.> They’re certainly a “special kind of special”!

I seriously doubt bandwagonners are the problem. The fact that you feel their jumping around lacks character is pretty much irrelevant. There isn’t as strong a motivation to be a part of a server as their is to be a part of a guild. Which is why WvW should become more guild centric. They are the community builders … not some fixed game element like a server.

Chaba.5410:

lil devils x.6071:

If a match up is stale, too many Queues on your server, if you could easily transfer between the servers to balance that out

This is just disingenuous lip service. In the three years of this game, the only guilds who ever cared about transferring for balance were GvG guilds and that scene is beyond dead. The VAST MAJORITY have transferred to the latest bandwagon server.

This. Free transfers wrecked the population “balance” in the first place by stacking a handful of servers… That said limiting free xfers to once a month or every 90 days, may not be so bad at this point….

Liston.9708:

This. Free transfers wrecked the population “balance” in the first place by stacking a handful of servers… That said limiting free xfers to once a month or every 90 days, may not be so bad at this point….

Transfer limit is once every 7 days right now. I think 30 – 90 is high, maybe 14 days.

During WvW season 2 the penalty was 2 weeks of EoTM only. That was better IMO because it really penalizes match tampering. Maybe a little too harsh for normal play now.

displayname.8315:

Liston.9708:

This. Free transfers wrecked the population “balance” in the first place by stacking a handful of servers… That said limiting free xfers to once a month or every 90 days, may not be so bad at this point….

Transfer limit is once every 7 days right now. I think 30 – 90 is high, maybe 14 days.

During WvW season 2 the penalty was 2 weeks of EoTM only. That was better IMO because it really penalizes match tampering. Maybe a little too harsh for normal play now.

The issue though is what happens when you are stuck on a server that is stacked and want to balance out the match and get more play time? I have games that didn’t penalize you for switching servers and it was far more balanced than this mess. Believe it or not , there are quite a few that want to play as the underdog or they get bored and go play something else instead.

Separating PvE servers from WvW server, creating less WvW servers and giving a free transfer on your wvw server every 3 months would keep it much less stale than it is currently.

lil devils x.6071:

Separating PvE servers from WvW server, creating less WvW servers and giving a free transfer on your wvw server every 3 months would keep it much less stale than it is currently.

In the current system, less and more dynamic servers, free transfers and more population transparency really is the key to allowing the community to regulate itself. we really cant do anything with the amount of servers we got today. You could halve them and probably still not reach all full servers.

But that would mean admitting the population is lower than what management percieves.

IE aint ever gonna happen. An empty server is still a server when you look at the server count only.

lil devils x.6071:

Believe it or not , there are quite a few that want to play as the underdog or they get bored and go play something else instead.

As I wrote, the VAST MAJORITY in this game do not care to play as the underdog. It can be unrewarding, stressful, and not fun. I stopped having faith that players want to be the underdog since Season 2.

Chaba.5410:

lil devils x.6071:

Believe it or not , there are quite a few that want to play as the underdog or they get bored and go play something else instead.

As I wrote, the VAST MAJORITY in this game do not care to play as the underdog. It can be unrewarding, stressful, and not fun. I stopped having faith that players want to be the underdog since Season 2.

Yes, there are many that just want to be on the winning server, not be the reason it won, however, if they implement the changes I suggested or the equivalent, massive population imbalance would not be a serious issue. You can only get to run up the score under an hour after the population drops since the maps would disappear and they would be stuck in queue and unable to play if one or two servers are stacked in the match and not the 3rd. How many maps are available to play on would be determined by total population on all 3 servers in the match. If one servers population drops in the match, the other 2 are in queue and have to wait for there to be more population on the 3rd server to play. They would be transferring to be able to play, not stack since stacking would be dead.

I’m amazed that the server activity still says “medium” for some of these servers. It should be “dead” if anything. Kaineng recently had a few guilds leave and I’m looking to leave as well but no chance in hell I’m giving anet real cash, I’m selling my mats and going the gold to gem trade transfer up. Haven’t purchased gems in over a year and don’t plan to till they shape up.

Dusty Moon.4382:

No the server fees were there to PREVENT SERVER STACKING. We had no server transfer fees for 6 months of the game and everyone moved to the top tier servers and left the other tier servers

Just for some clarification, the only reason why we had free transfers was because megaservers didn’t exist and we didn’t have guesting back then, so transfering was the only way to play in another server’s PvE map. Once they implemented guesting we got server transfer fees.

ANet doesn’t carry much about servers stacking or not. Server transfer fees are only there for revenue.

lmperdigao.2567:

ANet doesn’t carry much about servers stacking or not. Server transfer fees are only there for revenue.

Given the state of the game, it might be wise for Anet to allow players some latitude with how they interact with the game mode since at the moment the mode is a bit broken.

Players struck on servers which are a bit fit for them or abandoned on servers when everyone else leaves might think that $20 transfer fee might best be spent on a new game.

TorquedSoul.8097:

lmperdigao.2567:

ANet doesn’t carry much about servers stacking or not. Server transfer fees are only there for revenue.

Given the state of the game, it might be wise for Anet to allow players some latitude with how they interact with the game mode since at the moment the mode is a bit broken.

Players struck on servers which are a bit fit for them or abandoned on servers when everyone else leaves might think that $20 transfer fee might best be spent on a new game.

Logged in for this. Exactly what I’m doing. Might think about coming back if I see actual changes that are asked for and not more fluff.

lmperdigao.2567:

Just for some clarification, the only reason why we had free transfers was because megaservers didn’t exist and we didn’t have guesting back then, so transfering was the only way to play in another server’s PvE map. Once they implemented guesting we got server transfer fees.

They did free transfers for the 2nd tornament and it had nothing to do with guesting or megaservers. It was an attempt to balance pop’s for WvW. There were no limits set so way too many stacked without knowing it.

It could be done a way that’s not chaotic. Also the server pops got locked in once the tournament started so there was no way to rebalance.