Guild Wars 2

At least view the attached image if you don’t like walls of text.

I started thinking about how WvW could improved in order to deal with a major gripe I had with it, and this issue is of course;

WvW encourages you not to fight, and cap structures that have… nobody in them.

Attacking in WvW; Join a zerg, go around flipping structures all day. You get rewarded for fighting nobody, for avoiding confrontation. It creates a dilemna in that you came to WvW to fight, yet you don’t want to fight. Great for boosting your character to 80, bad when you’re geared out and want something more. Alternatively there’s the small group who think they’re too good for the zerg, go around ninja flipping structures all day again hoping that there is nobody there to repel them.

Defending in WvW; You don’t. To say it simply it’s pointless. You stand there and scout, waiting for the attackers to come along. Delay the inevitable possibly, or hope your own zerg decides to waste their time and show up from their structure flipping in some other corner of the map. Basically WvW defending boils down to flipping structures at the same speed as your opponents or hopefully faster, until one side gets bored and gives up.

I could expand on this a lot more, but the horse has been trampled into mush. Basically what I want to do is promote healthy attacking/defensive gameplay and get away from this non-combative rubbish. My current focus only concerns EBG though.

My idea;
You have a protective link starting from your home keep.

After your home keep is in your control, you can only take keeps connected to your keep, and then only keeps connected to that.

Only stonemist outer gates should be vulnerable (or maybe also a very small portion of the walls next to the gates – not quite sure). Nobody complains about there being no walls to protect inner SM, plus the outside walls are so numberous that they are only good for a discreet ninja assault, or a constant catapult barrage. Bleh.

Ninja Edit: I was thinking maybe you should need both of your nearest towers in order to be able to damage the nearest Stonemist gate/wall on your side. Not entirely sure.

To start taking structures in your enemy territory, you need to first take Stonemist and you have to take them in reverse order to your progress you took towards Stonemist.

For the typical WvW player this is problem solved in my opinion, you get epic warfare, concentrated battles so you know where you should be, meaningful feeling attack/defence, actual combat is not promoted rather than discouraged.

Now on the other hand we have the player who prefers the smaller battles, running into another small group of players, open ground fights, ganking, strategic positioning on the map. This is what we will use the supply camps for.

Dolyaks will always be killable, this will give importance to a smaller scale group hanging out in certain areas of the map where they could expect confrontation and feel like they’re helping the large warfare battle.

For supply camp capping I am not entirely decided. Would it be healthier if supply camps were dictated by the same rules in that they can’t be captured unless the nearest structure is owned by your team or they are capturable at any time? Personally I don’t want to promote flipping unprotected camps then running off elsewhere, I want them to be fought for when they’re most needed.

Camps should retain ownership by the previous holder even if both of the nearest structures are owned by a different world, but can’t be recaptured again once completely lost until you retake an appropriate structure.

Smaller groups could still be used to assault dolyaks/supply runs and the enemy reinforcement lanes.*

That’s all I got for now. I didn’t really think much about the borderlands because I didn’t play there much, but I imagine a similiar process. One gripe I had with the borderlands is that they didn’t feel like YOURS, it still felt like a 3-way battle. Your borderlands should feel like Helms Deep, it should really feel like a 2vs1 in my opinion. On the fly ideas I have – the 2 foreign worlds cannot attack each other (home player cap being twice of each foreign force), or they cannot take each others structures, possibly only that central-southern supply camp?

In the end I think the current system for WvW is pathetic though. People are resistant to any change whether it’s for better or worse, not to say my idea is sheer perfection or even viable, but I think we need to start really thinking of how to make sure WvW is good in the longterm, and currently I think it gets really stale because of the activities the current system encourages.

I thought of the overall idea in a few minutes when I was thinking of the colours that vent out of the home keeps, the giant tower thingy, and it hit me with like “Energy!”, “Star Wars force fields!”. Then I was thinking of a kind of Moba structure, where the structure siege/warfare are the lanes, with your junglers/gankers being the supply camp groups though obviously with a lot more players.

So I tried, and I’m quite happy to have my idea slaughtered because I’m pleased with it.

Side-Topic;
My other remaining gripe – normalise all WvW stats like sPvP, but allow PvE vanity to remain. It was only lately while in mists that I noticed a major detail on the map – WvW appears on the map of the sPvP lobby for no apparant reason, it literally has zero purpose as it stands. Is it possible that the original intention was sPvP characters could take part in WvW similar to PvP in GW1, but they would be closed off from PvE side of the game? Can’t help but speculate about that.

I’ll be expecting a cheque or a job offer anytime soon.

Thanks for reading, and sorry for wasting your time.

A very good effort but it seems you don’t have much experience in WWW and/or you don’t play in high tiers, I’m only saying these because you have many omissions (I give you one, you forgot the importance of upgrades) and a serial of misconceptions, forgive me if I’m wrong.
I don’t want to discuss some of the aspects that I consider errors; some of them are a personal fight that I have on my server, but let me tell you some facts:
- WWW looks simple but it isn’t, and this leads to many errors, there are many generals in GW2 that can lead a battle, but few commanders that can read the map;
- The 3 way battle server is perfect…if people play only by war objectives, but many times people play with their heart (try to understand why your server tends to put always the 1st treb in SM for the same tower, or the enemy tends to follow the same pattern);
- You really have to fight in WWW, to protect your towers and getting the upgrades, and at the same time try the opposite with your enemies (and there are two, not only one).
I’m not saying WWW it’s all strategy, because that it’s not true, there are lots of tactics to, anyway thanks for your reflection, it’s important that people do that in order to improve the game

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what annoys me is that there are groups that just go around in a circle capping bases purely for the xp and while the opposing team is clearly moving in the same pattern, they won’t just turn around and meet them. The only thing they were doing was leveling by doing that. I don’t EVER want to hear from someone who has done that that this game is repetitive and a grind.

I guess you’ve never held a tower for 4 hours under constant attack. Or driven an enemy out of your lord room, fought them toe to toe back down the stairs and finally sent them to the bottom of the lake. Or mortared down enemy trebuchets as fast as they can build them.

I get the idea of this: to make WvW a warfare with specific fronts, something like WWI trench warfare where you are constantly engaged.

But I see this as something that would make WvW really static, because it is essentially having the game assign where fights should happen. It forces zerg vs. zerg, and if your zerg is outnumbered, all this does is take away the option of striking somewhere unexpected to draw the enemy away.

I like my WvW to be dynamic, so that it’s not just tactics and firepower but strategy as well. I admit that this often results in PvD and karma-training (particularly at lower tiers), but I think it also raises the ceiling on what can be done. When it’s just a mass of players fighting over one designated objective (small groups only having the option of a limited number of camp targets is pretty static as well), there’s not much of a role for leaders, but when the game requires you to consider your weaknesses and opportunities on the map, there is so much more (potential) depth.