Guild Wars 2

The server that wins for that week gets gems as a reward.
Gives a final reward and for Anet, it may actually encourage people to visit and use the gem store more often.

This is a touchy topic. I was going to suggest instead of gems, the winning server could receive a few silver (maybe 10-20?) or one of each T6 material, but then this system would give currency and materials to players that don’t even participate in WvW. Furthermore, it increases the chances of more players stacking the winning servers in order to reap the benefits of the rewards. I think the only way to reward the winning server is to reward them with some type of item/currency that is obtainable or useable in WvW only. Maybe add some armor pieces that give benefits for a WvW setting? For example, one of the stats could be “Can carry +1 extra supply” or “Increases run speed by 5%”. It’s just an example, I don’t want to do the math on how this may improve or endanger the WvW scene considering there is already skill points that revolve around this idea.

No.

Less money 4 Anet + more server jumpers…

Any idea revolving around where you place (first, second, third) at the end of the week. The problem with WvW is that in many matchups, it’s decided who is first and second in the 24 hours. After that, few people have incentive to come out for the rest of the week. Even if there was a reward for first, the top server would only show up if threatened. And even then, a third place server will in most cases only play for second or not care.

You want a reward system that encourages players from the second and third place server to play throughout the week and to target the first place server. Maybe improving the world XP chest rewards and making the first place server’s players and forts worth extra world XP.

Lyonell.1753:

No.

Less money 4 Anet + more server jumpers…

This ^^

reward the winning server with a handicap next round.

The very last thing WvW needs is more people moving to the upper-tier, stacked servers.

You shouldn’t be rewarding worlds upon victory, only the actual participators…

kelman.9451:

The server that wins for that week gets gems as a reward.
Gives a final reward and for Anet, it may actually encourage people to visit and use the gem store more often.

Terrible idea. So you want people awarded gems for stacking servers, which would just cause even further stacking.

If anything they should award gems to people who transfer off a stacked server or award losing servers gems on blowout matches for only the individuals that actually participated WVW that week.

No…. but on the other hand, nooooooooooooooooo…

The glory (not the pvp kind) is all you should need from winning.

Besides, you forget that all 3 servers get rewards already. The more points they earn, the better the server wide benefits are, such as:

• Scavenger (bonus gold per kill)
• Gatherer (chance for additional gathering node uses)
• Wisdom (bonus xp per kill)

I’m on Crystal Desert (rank 11) verses Sea of Sorrows (rank 7) and Tarnished Coast (rank 5). It’s been 48 hours since this match up started and the scores are:

• Tarnished Coast 99,000
• Sea of Sorrows 43,000
• Crystal Desert 32,000

TC is kicking our arses, well. If CD’s current bonuses at 32k are Scav +3%, Gath +4%, and Wisdom +2%… TC has slighty better in ALL of them and by Wednesday even better.

But that’s their reward for being winners of the current matchup. They may not get a winning chest full of gold or gems at the end, but they are getting more materials, more gold, and more experience (for faster skill point gains) than SoS and CD throughout the course of the week.

I don’t think some kind of reward for “winning” is a terrible idea. However, I would argue that RANK GAIN/LOSS is more of a true indicator of who wins or loses. If you are going against a much higher ranked server but put up a great fight and do much better then was predicted I think you are the winner even though the scoreboard might say differently. What that reward is I don’t know. Perhaps, they just need to increase the outmanned buff to offer better rewards/buffs when you have it?

^
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/A-fair-way-to-reward-winning/first#post2161524

Made that post a few weeks ago. Dumped on ideas how to make sure its fair and that it rewards players that participate in wvw, even casually. Feel free to contribute to that thread. I don’t want to repost a lot of what I said in that thread here.

Remember that the reward cant be too great that people join it to ‘farm wvw’ instead of play ‘wvw’. And the reward needs to be attainable regardless of who you get matched up against.

Give the players of the 3rd place server in each matchup 50g. Then watch the entire meta of the game flip on it’s head.

… also, I’m not seriously suggesting that.

~ Kovu

The game is already terrible because of server stacking and this would just promote more of the same.

Riselight.3695:

You shouldn’t be rewarding worlds upon victory, only the actual participators…

Agreed. They just need to increase the rewards for capping/killing players up to what people make in PvE.

We STILL get rewards based on the level of the players we’ve killed… regardless of our own level… if it was a 5v20 etc. As a PvE player… kill any mob of any level and you get rewards of your own level.

Go farm CoF mindlessly and make tons of gold plus tokens for exotics (or multiple guaranteed rares to salvage). Go zerg a world event boss, get a gauranteed rare plus multiple chances at more rares/exotics.

But ONE rare per WvW level is just too much to ask for apparently… what… the… kitten.

WvW is where the fun is. PvE is where the gold is. This is what needs fixing.

This sounds like a really bad idea. Win in a WvWvW is determined by who has the best coverage. If a server has less players or their maps are empty most of the day and full only on peak hours, they are never gonna win and get the gems, despite no matter how well they play.

Your suggestion would lead to massive migration to winning servers and even more imbalanced match ups.

However I agree that the WvWvW rewards should be better. After opening about 50 WXP chests I have gotten just 5 rare items, which is probably an average rate (10% ?). Compared to any kind of pve the WvWvW rewards are just a bad joke. You can get much more rares easier and faster doing world events. I think every WXP chest past level 5 should drop a guaranteed rare and have small likelihood for even better item:
- 10% chance for an exotic item
- 1% chance for an ascended item
- 0.05% chance for a precursor

I would be more in favor of a gem reward for the outmanned server that keeps playing all week without giving up. It’s easy to play when you are steamrolling to victory.

DevonCarver.5370:

We would like to have a system that rewards servers at the end of a matchup based on their performance and are working out all we’ll need to do to make that happen. Ideally it will give extra rewards for winning while still rewarding everyone for participating. All that being said, it’s hard to know what form the final version will take. Hopefully we’ll have something to get everyone excited to fight for victory.

You cant get your match up system to work right, yet you want to add a reward for winning servers?

Holy crap, you guys have gone bat poo crazy man. Just absolutely nuts. You cant add a reward to this crappy system.

DevonCarver.5370:

We would like to have a system that rewards servers at the end of a matchup based on their performance.

Reread that. I read performance as a rating based system not ‘most points’. Basically if you can improve your servers rating, you get an award.

Adding an award can help get peoples mind off of overall points and get people to start thinking about their server rating (which is the important thing week to week).

I envision it working out like I described in the thread I linked above. The level of reward is based on your weekly wvw contribution, the type of reward winning or consolation is based on if your server gained rating or not.

The new system is already balancing the rating system out and becoming far more accurate than it ever has been. Providing an incentive for people to play for rating would be a good thing for the game.

DevonCarver.5370:

We would like to have a system that rewards servers at the end of a matchup based on their performance and are working out all we’ll need to do to make that happen. Ideally it will give extra rewards for winning while still rewarding everyone for participating. All that being said, it’s hard to know what form the final version will take. Hopefully we’ll have something to get everyone excited to fight for victory.

Rewards should be limited to WvW, like a discount at the WvW vendors (except crafting). PvE players already get a bunch of free buffs for the hours we put into WvW, they don’t need anything else.

A change is definitely needed in the reward system because the current stat bonus rewards are so inconsequential. Certainly not something Joe Schmo player would notice if they even had them (adding a persistent visible buff like we had in beta would be a good start).

I definitely agree Rating +/- needs to be stressed as the Win/Loss scenario given the new matchup system, but there needs to be a reason for servers to reach certain Score levels as well, especially once the match has been decided.

And finally any reward system should reward both the entire server & give some reward on top of it based on WvW participation. My thinking is something like this:

Server Rewards
1) Most Rating Gain = server access to a cloned PvE version of EB
2) Rating Gain = server access to a cloned PvE version of the home borderland
3) Highest Score = additional stat sets (MF being an obvious choice)

Score in general would dictate the stat bonus you get the next week rather than having to be rebuilt every week, so higher score = better stats you have for the next week. If they need to be adjusted because of this change, fine. But they should be something people notice & care about even if they dont WvW.

The cloned PvE maps would be just like normal PvE zones with events & maybe even a boss level meta event with a focus on using WvW mechanics like coordinating & sieging. I’m thinking breakout on crack & map wide.

Individual Rewards
Set criteria for a Gold/Silver/Bronze levels based on WvW participation.
Rewards are 3/2/1 reward chests which would contain 1 Rare+, 25 Badges, 1 Blueprint, 1000 WXP, & 50s.
As long as you reach Bronze participation you also get a bonus chest for each server “win” met, i.e. Most Rating Gain and/or Highest Score.

The key would be deciding what level of participation is needed for each and balancing it in a smart way.

No way. The only reward there should be is for the weaker servers ganging up on the strong server and kicking their kitten.

I think what Devon means to say is “transfer to SoR now!”

Everyone who thinks that Devon is a plant from the ESO development team, please raise your hand.

DevonCarver.5370:

We would like to have a system that rewards servers at the end of a matchup based on their performance and are working out all we’ll need to do to make that happen. Ideally it will give extra rewards for winning while still rewarding everyone for participating. All that being said, it’s hard to know what form the final version will take. Hopefully we’ll have something to get everyone excited to fight for victory.

No. You can’t do this because servers don’t play on equal footing. This isn’t TPvP where every team has 5 players, this is a game format where you’re outnumbered severely or outnumbering severely. If you reward players for having more population, people are going to all transfer to the top population servers because they are more likely to win more often. That’s exactly the opposite of what you want. You want players to spread to lower tier servers and balance the populations as much as possible.

Rising Dusk.2408:

That’s exactly the opposite of what you want. You want players to spread to lower tier servers and balance the populations as much as possible.

It really doesn’t seem so.

The server total population is not same as WvWvW population. E.g. Seafarer’s Rest (SFR) is medium sized server, but has huge WvWvW population. Currently the gem transfer cost is based on the server’s total population, not its WvWvw population or rating/rank.

Having the outmanned “buff” visible to the enemy teams causes the other 2 servers gang together against the weakest one.

Basically akittens current state the WvWvW system is built so that the weaker and lower WvWvW population server gets the shaft and there is very little motivation for most players to come to such server.

Thus the already healthy and popular servers get more and more population and the weakest ones are in more or less permanent downward spiral e.g. Blacktide, Fissure of Woe and Vabbi in EU.

Now giving extra rewards to the winner would just make things even worse. The last blow for the losing servers. And don’t tell me that thanks to this random system everybody sometimes wins and loses. Desolation hasn’t won a single time in year 2013. And we won’t win this week either as were are sandwiched between two servers with much higher coverage and number of players.

What this game desperately needs are some means for the outmanned side to cope against superior numbers. And different scoring system so that coverage doesn’t automatically determine the winner. THis might not be so big problem in top tiers of NA, but here in EU very few servers have night time or morning crews. Thus night capping decides the winner.

DevonCarver.5370:

Deniara Devious.3948:

Having the outmanned “buff” visible to the enemy teams causes the other 2 servers gang together against the weakest one.

This will no longer be the case in the next build. We’ve changed outmanned so that only friendlies can see it.

Great! Mega thanks!

I cannot wait for this new patch! When it is up?

Chris.3290:

I think what Devon means to say is “transfer to SoR now!”

Everyone who thinks that Devon is a plant from the ESO development team, please raise your hand.

Except that SoR loses rating in almost every match-up, and you would be rewarded on rating changes not points earned. With the chaotic deviation there is no way to guarantee that a server will gain or lose rating because they could be matched up in such a lopsided fight that it would be strictly impossible for them to actually gain rating if the other team so much as shows up in force on one map and holds their stuff on that map. Not to mention that, if rating decides victory (as it should), teaming up will have a whole dynamic to it.

ESO development team needs to develop their game to actually be good and playable before planting people elsewhere.

DevonCarver.5370:

Deniara Devious.3948:

Having the outmanned “buff” visible to the enemy teams causes the other 2 servers gang together against the weakest one.

This will no longer be the case in the next build. We’ve changed outmanned so that only friendlies can see it.

That was a great idea whoever thought of it! Can’t wait to see how it effects gameplay now. Definitely gona be a reduction in people saying they’re being double teamed.

DevonCarver.5370:

We would like to have a system that rewards servers at the end of a matchup based on their performance and are working out all we’ll need to do to make that happen. Ideally it will give extra rewards for winning while still rewarding everyone for participating. All that being said, it’s hard to know what form the final version will take. Hopefully we’ll have something to get everyone excited to fight for victory.

So based on performance mans if in an imbalanced matchup a server is still performing good enough even though he is losing(but still enough points to win rating) they will be rewarded? Otherwise it would make no sense cause there are always stronger servers just because they have more players and if you match them against the weaker servers victory will be decided from the beginning and rewards will only cause to stop players playing on the weaker servers cause they think it is not fair just to play WvW to help the stronger server farm then and then in the end get a reward.

There should be no rewards for servers.

Rewards should be for players based on how they perform(like it already is at the moment with giving rewards for capturing stuff). Maybe think about increasing the rewards for defending(defending and holding stuff gives more points to help the server winning but for players it is at the moment better to just lose stuff and retake it because of more events and WXP).

The points each objective gives should increase with the time you defend and hold it… until a cap is reached.

Like: Tower x points after it is captured.
After 1 hour 2x points.
After 6 hours 3x points. (it multiplies by +1 more each tier but takes much longer time to reach the next… until a cap).

Also give more rewards for killing people while defending that stuff if you can hold and defend it longer(for people killed in the radius of the event).

I talked about this in German forums but someone said “this will give too much rewards because defenders already get every 3 minutes an event”… but it just needs to be balanced. You can balance everything while trying to give more incentive to defend.

DevonCarver.5370:

We would like to have a system that rewards servers at the end of a matchup based on their performance and are working out all we’ll need to do to make that happen. Ideally it will give extra rewards for winning while still rewarding everyone for participating. All that being said, it’s hard to know what form the final version will take. Hopefully we’ll have something to get everyone excited to fight for victory.

I think that the problem here is that everyone gets reward of some kind. That doesn’t motivate enough players to try cause they still get rewarded even when they lose. That you still kind of win even if you lose system doesn’t work imo. The rewards should go to the winning server only so that it would make players really trying to win, but if you fear that players would quit WvW because there is no reward to others than the winning server(unlikely because WvW = mainly endgame content), make that reward system properly and make it like endgame rewards should be.

WvW with TPvP is basically the only challenging endgame content in gw2 atm and i am pretty sure that you know it.

I suggest that you should give that basic reward of karma, exp, money and 1-2 rare per account to all servers and the winning server could get +1-2 exotics (precursor chance) +gems per account. Reward which contains karma, money, exp, 1-2 rare, 1-2 exotic and gems should be enough to motivate players to win and keep playing WvW without the “win or lose to win” system.

The rewarding system could work like weekly achievements (where the final achievement triggers based on winning or losing and after that you get a reward chest) with some requirements so that those players who haven’t played WvW can’t get the reward for free.

However this reward system can’t happen before skill lag is solved as it should have been long time ago. Skill lag breaks the game and I am not happy at all that you can’t help that skill lag issue at all(seriously you need a much bigger WvW servers).

Please DO NOT reward “winning” servers disproportionately until populations are more balanced.

It will only further incentivize “stacking” and bandwagoning, it’s an extremely bad idea.

Furthermore, this is likely only going to breed further resentment from the smaller population servers, as coverage is not something they can control.

If you remove control from the players – they quit.

They are going to hide the “outmanned buff” finally some good news from Mr. Carver.

Rawr.5930:

Please DO NOT reward “winning” servers disproportionately until populations are more balanced.

It will only further incentivize “stacking” and bandwagoning, it’s an extremely bad idea.

Furthermore, this is likely only going to breed further resentment from the smaller population servers, as coverage is not something they can control.

If you remove control from the players – they quit.

Actually this might balance servers more when people from “hard” fights transfers to “easier”.

If your play style is to play in low server and you can’t win in WvW it’s you own choice to play the game that way.

Chris.3290:

They are going to hide the “outmanned buff” finally some good news from Mr. Carver.

How can you possible say that. Devon has been giving us good news since his arrival. And this is one more for the list, you could give him some more credit.

Are you actually going to change the mechanics of outmanned itself or just that it can’t be seen by other servers? If it’s the latter then outmanned buff is still going to be a fail.

While I don’t necessarily agree with the OP’s post, aren’t you all forgetting that transferring servers costs gems? Why would anyone pay gems to get less gems back? (Unless winning gives >800, which I doubt). With the new server randomization it is very hard to consistently win too.

But yes, the outmanned buff change is a good one

Edit: Okay, everyone will go to Jade Quarry.

Just reward laurels since they now have value in WvW.

With ascended armor and weapons hopefully not too far off in the future, laurel awarded ascended armor could compete with PvE awarded ascended armor and weapons.

Winning server gets 10 for anyone who gained a WvW rank above level 10.
2nd gets 6 for anyone who gained a WvW rank above level 10.
3rd gets 4 for anyone who gained a WvW rank above level 10.

Then we could add some more interested things to the Laurel system too. Things like more guild styled items so being in a guild actually offered some level of pride at the very least (since we all know guilds and even parties in this game are 100% useless). If player/guild housing ever gets introduced we could buy guild merrits with laurels so the guild could buy stuff to upgrade. etc etc.

I disagree with the winner getting a prize. Sorry if you’re on SoR or JQ but Blackgate recently has been #1 and i don’t see much change on the horizon. So i would just get laurels/silver/karma or whatever the prize may be, constantly? I just dont think it would work, as much as i would love it too.

DevonCarver.5370:

We would like to have a system that rewards servers at the end of a matchup based on their performance and are working out all we’ll need to do to make that happen. Ideally it will give extra rewards for winning while still rewarding everyone for participating. All that being said, it’s hard to know what form the final version will take. Hopefully we’ll have something to get everyone excited to fight for victory.

some ideas on…

- general WvW rewards
-> lower costs to upgrade keeps
-> faster dolyaks
-> higher droprate

- player WvW rewards
-> Top10 ranked players will be rewarded at the end of the matchup; ranks could be:
most kills, most escortet dolyaks, most defended/conquerd keeps, most supply repaired, most damage done with siege weapons, most damage dealed to other players accumulated
Rankings should be shown somewhere in the WvW overview.
Rewards can be, gold, blueprints, exotics, unique (cosmetic) gear that you will be able to wear in the following week bevor it gets passed on to the next top finishers.

Should be done with an extra overview and rewards for guilds; guild with most kills, longest time held keep/camp…

- PvE rewards
-> access to a new area or dungeon (with better droprate)

A servers performance should be measured (regarding my suggestions above)
a) on the fly, for example the better you do the less a keepupgrade costs, faster a dolyak runs, and
b) needs to have a hard cap, that no server in a bad matchup is locked out from a PvE bonus dungeon

bad idea OP… this will only lead to people transferring to already stacked servers….

Best way to ‘reward’ those who actually do work in WvW:
Upgrades no longer cost gold.

Direct gold increase for those currently shouldering the defensive burden, which is also currently one of the least rewarding ways of playing GW2 in general.

The “reward” should be:
5% decrease in cost gold > gem. (so we have moar gold sinking)
5% decrease in TP tax (when selling).
10% increase in gem > gold (buy gem pls )

Well you have the two bottom population servers ET and Ferg that already know without a doubt they will lose every week due to having such a small population. Add rewards to winning server and you will have even more bandwagon jumping.

You want to add rewards? Make it so numbers must be even in all zones or within 20%. ET only has 10 on a map then only 12 from the other servers can join the map, then you will see who the better server and players really are…. of course queues would break the game for the zerg servers.

The core problem in GW2 is the huge edge numbers advantage give due to multiple rallies off one kill, mass speed rezing in down state. Confussion and retal nerf AoE caps…. its like Anet is making it harder by design to beat mindless zergs with smaller numbers.

azizul.8469:

bad idea OP… this will only lead to people transferring to already stacked servers….

This has been mentioned several times in this thread but I don’t think that will be too big of a problem. Transfers are limited to once every 7 days. Since you don’t get the WvW bonus until the following match I would expect the same for any winning rewards. That would mean anyone who attempts to jump from server to server for every match will never get the reward. Everyone could attempt to jump to the #1 ranked server but eventually that is going to end up full and the new matchmaking system is going to make it difficult to determine what the next matchups will be.

The reward would also have to be something like 1800 gems or 50gold for it to be barely worth it. I doubt ANet is so crazy as to give everyone on a server 50 gold. Even if it is just for WvW participants(we’ll ignore the problem of how to determine who is a participant for now but ANet is pretty lenient about participation levels) they are going to require some huge gold sinks to offset all the gold(John will probably strangle Habib and Devon before that happens anyway).

Please don’t start this until the match up problems are fixed as such a system will only make stronger servers stronger, and weaker servers weaker.

I can only speak for the EU servers, but here you would get a free win if you match up to Vabi and FoW right now. Such a system would only make Vabi and FoW ever weaker, because they have no change at winning. As a FoW guild leader, i have already seen many players leave the server just to get their map completion….. This because despite the announcement that the new match up system would also increase color rotation, this has not happened for us, FoW is still blue and Vabbi red. This makes it really hard to get all the points in the map for world completion, one of the major problems being the green corner keep in the eternal battle grounds. It has a waypoint in no time, and is to close to the spawn, making even a surprise attack almost impossible, as you will have a full zerg in your back before you can take it.

It is really painful to see your members and friends leave the server because they are unable to reach a certain goal on their current server. And this is just my guild members i know of and about half of them come back later to rejoin the guild again but based on our total WvW scores and the amount of players i see in there, i think that there are way more players switching servers and never look back. This makes Vabbi and FoW weaker and weaker. I don’t even like to think about what a system like “reward the winning server in WvW” would do then.

Instead of such a reward system, try to balance the WvW population out first.

some ideas:
1 Change the matchup, so no 2 weak servers get matched to one strong server.
with 2 weak servers, the strong server has nothing to do, but attack the weak ones. If we would have a matchup with 2 strong servers and 1 weak server, the strong ones can keep each other busy, so the weaker one gets a change to join in the fighting.
Ofcourse, this could turn nasty as well, but we tried 2 weaker (Vabbi + FoW) vs 1 stronger (green one in Vabbi + FoW match) for months now and the outcome is always the same, strong one wins with BIG numbers.
One of the problems we would solve with 2 strong servers is that structures are more likely to be taken over from time to time, resetting all the upgrades. With only one strong server, it holds most structures for a long time and upgrades them all, giving the weak servers an even harder time to take anything. Toss in a weekly or max 2 weekly color change for all servers and we would solve a lot of the map completion problems as well.

2 Reward players for playing in weaker servers. With this, players in that server will at least stay in their server, and some might even hop over. Be aware that this has to be done carefully. If the reward is too good, lots of players will want it and hop over, totally flooding the weak server, destroying their WvW community and also giving more unbalance in WvW again. It should be enough to keep players to keep the players in that server and new players to join in, but to little to make it worth the effort of transferring there.

how about granting gems to losing servers, for participating… see how that goes….

DevonCarver.5370:

We would like to have a system that rewards servers at the end of a matchup based on their performance and are working out all we’ll need to do to make that happen. Ideally it will give extra rewards for winning while still rewarding everyone for participating. All that being said, it’s hard to know what form the final version will take. Hopefully we’ll have something to get everyone excited to fight for victory.

A simple and elegant reward would be giving +10-20% MF and/or gold for a whole week to each person having the winning server as home, no matter where they are (on the server, in wvw, guesting, etc.)