Guild Wars 2

StrawHat.2639:

Like many I don’t feel gliding is appropriate for WvW when improving issues that date back years are more important to us; lag being the top runner.

Am worried that in desert bl and ebg you’ll be able to glide into fortifications…

Take for example the cliff facing red keep in EBG, wouldn’t grps be able to glide pass first wall? and from SMC to Klovan maybe…long shot….

Anyways I don’t approve of this change but the armor stat swapping update change is a good plus.

(and I can see the value of gliding in desert bl with all the elevations but still…)

Gliding isnt allowed in areas that arent yours, the territory lines are going to be before the keep wall, so gliding will be disabled before the enemy even touches the keep.

I need mid-air fight rather than gliding, like Tower of Aion (which is NCsoft game) does. That was really really fun.
Of course, there should be in new proper map for mid-air competition mechanics.

I’ll skip all the “Is this a joke” and salt messages and start right if the observative stuff (In case anyone even reads this and cares about my opinion):
it’ll basically will be a fallingdmg buff for the owning team. so they can drop of towers or objectives and push in ur backs. makes defending even more cancer if theyve plenty acs or other siege already.
Think for a moment anet. do you want to advertise defending even more?
Make it impossible to decap t3 towers on alpine borderlands?
Ppl will ragequit after a few attempts and matchup’s gonna be trash for the rest of the weeks.
Dessertborder, yes, I’d like that. It’s big and stuff, but alpine and eternal battlegrounds? It didnt need gliding for almost five years.
We from our perspective (we being the bunch of ppl I play, interact and talk with since years) want fights. PPT is just boring pve, you upgrade your stuff, fight NPC Lords. We would go to silverwastes or eotm if we’d care to do that.
(Ofc that doesnt give pips and theres that motivation for new players gone)
Anyways, so theres my statement. At least buff PPK once more so ppl are motivated to leave their glideable, sieged objectives?
As for the other perspective:
There hasnt been one player yet that said: wvw doesnt have gliding, I wont test it, I just immediently dislike it. There’s no gliding in pvp either. Or in old story instances. Man I always die if I replay old stuff or jump off my home instance, Pls fix that before you introduce it to WvW.

Kitta.3657:

What in the hell?

WHAT WILL HAPPEN IF YOU ARE IN COMBAT? Disable in combat gliding. Otherwise it means anyone can run away from a fight by just gliding away and literally makes HoT Pay-to-win. Seriously. It NEEDS to be disabled to deploy gliding while in combat. Seriously. This is why gliding in WvW has always been the stupidest idea.

People should stop calling “Game Expansion” pay-to-win.
Buy it or get used to it.
Gaming companies are not charity.

They should make a floating tower you have to use Ley lines to glide upto lol.

Trajan.4953:

“I do appreciate that there are people with different skill sets. But it can’t be that there is no-one left in the company able to fix game engine issues (lag) or major flaws in the WvW game design (population imbalance).”

So how do you “Fix” the population imbalance?

I mean really? Without breaking up guilds, communities, third party VOIPs and websites, how does one actually do that?

Every single suggestion I’ve ever seen on this forum and Reddit ultimately involves some people getting the short end of the stick and having to re-locate.

Fine if you are on the winning side but not fine for those people that also play this game and may have spent the same amount of hours as you in it, or even more.

You cannot simply quantify people into a mold because people don’t work that way therefore the game will not work that way as it is people driven.

Zerg servers gonna zerg, that’s how it is, the only way is to put them all together and leave them.

How to fix? I’m not a game designer. But let’s see…

The population imbalance is consequence of:

1. players are free to transfer to whichever world they want
2. better coverage equals more rewards, better world ranking, and better play experience

“Fix”:

Create an incentive to unstack, and let players/guilds eventually transfer to emptier worlds. The incentive could be over population based penalty on getting meaningful rewards and world ranking.

Yes, players on the stacked worlds would get the smelly end of the stick. They may continue zerging butwould find it less rewarding.

MadameS.3582:

SgtOVERKILL.4701:

Running around WvW for years and since the past two years since gliding was annoucned, I do not think I’ve ever heard anyone mention the thought of gliding or mention wanting it.

Remember that it’s just a test, if people don’t end up loving it then it’ll be removed

Desert BL still exists.

I rest my case.

Korgov.7645:

Trajan.4953:

“I do appreciate that there are people with different skill sets. But it can’t be that there is no-one left in the company able to fix game engine issues (lag) or major flaws in the WvW game design (population imbalance).”

So how do you “Fix” the population imbalance?

I mean really? Without breaking up guilds, communities, third party VOIPs and websites, how does one actually do that?

Every single suggestion I’ve ever seen on this forum and Reddit ultimately involves some people getting the short end of the stick and having to re-locate.

Fine if you are on the winning side but not fine for those people that also play this game and may have spent the same amount of hours as you in it, or even more.

You cannot simply quantify people into a mold because people don’t work that way therefore the game will not work that way as it is people driven.

Zerg servers gonna zerg, that’s how it is, the only way is to put them all together and leave them.

How to fix? I’m not a game designer. But let’s see…

The population imbalance is consequence of:

1. players are free to transfer to whichever world they want
2. better coverage equals more rewards, better world ranking, and better play experience

“Fix”:

Create an incentive to unstack, and let players/guilds eventually transfer to emptier worlds. The incentive could be over population based penalty on getting meaningful rewards and world ranking.

Yes, players on the stacked worlds would get the smelly end of the stick. They may continue zerging butwould find it less rewarding.

And how does that work with serverlinks?
You are on a low polulated, linked server, do you earn more rewards than your host server?
If you transfer away to get on a low server and suddenly you are linked, will you get a refund?
How will this improve bandwagoning, if everyone transfers to the only non-full host-server options for rewards afterwards?

I personally dislike the whole gliding idea. It will be just another way for enemies to run away from attackers and the game mode is already starved of fights as it is.

But the territories thing is interesting. It opens up a way to make strategic decisions more important, for example by giving each territory bonuses/maluses (for example: damage reduction on guards/walls/gates) based on the other adiacent territories.

McKenna Berdrow.2759:

Hello, Mist Warriors!

(…)

We’ve made several map adjustments to the Eternal Battlegrounds, Desert, and Alpine Borderlands maps to better accommodate gliding. Besides map adjustments, we have also replaced Ballista’s fourth skill with an anti-air bolt skill that shoots people out of the air and immobilizes them for a short duration.

It is important to keep in mind that this is a test for gliding in WvW. If we discover with this test that gliding is not appropriate for WvW, we will disable it.

(…)

Lets shoot some ducks, i can imagine few set ot ballistas on fire keep, when people try to fly down fromdesert to the lava pit zone

this might be actualy fun, hope it works.
I still have a few questions on how alone towers territry zone will work with glidding, but ill leave those questions to the testing

this is interesting air buff on dbl means no fall damage

Rai.1084:

Korgov.7645:

Trajan.4953:

“I do appreciate that there are people with different skill sets. But it can’t be that there is no-one left in the company able to fix game engine issues (lag) or major flaws in the WvW game design (population imbalance).”

So how do you “Fix” the population imbalance?

I mean really? Without breaking up guilds, communities, third party VOIPs and websites, how does one actually do that?

Every single suggestion I’ve ever seen on this forum and Reddit ultimately involves some people getting the short end of the stick and having to re-locate.

Fine if you are on the winning side but not fine for those people that also play this game and may have spent the same amount of hours as you in it, or even more.

You cannot simply quantify people into a mold because people don’t work that way therefore the game will not work that way as it is people driven.

Zerg servers gonna zerg, that’s how it is, the only way is to put them all together and leave them.

How to fix? I’m not a game designer. But let’s see…

The population imbalance is consequence of:

1. players are free to transfer to whichever world they want
2. better coverage equals more rewards, better world ranking, and better play experience

“Fix”:

Create an incentive to unstack, and let players/guilds eventually transfer to emptier worlds. The incentive could be over population based penalty on getting meaningful rewards and world ranking.

Yes, players on the stacked worlds would get the smelly end of the stick. They may continue zerging butwould find it less rewarding.

And how does that work with serverlinks?
You are on a low polulated, linked server, do you earn more rewards than your host server?
If you transfer away to get on a low server and suddenly you are linked, will you get a refund?
How will this improve bandwagoning, if everyone transfers to the only non-full host-server options for rewards afterwards?

I would end the world linking altogether. Add a new tier whenever 3 guest worlds become populous enough to stand on their own.

The quest worlds getting better rewards than their hosts would be only a transition phase.

To avoid empty maps due new tiers, reduce playable area. 3 maps per matchup only: EB, ABL, DBL. DBL is open only from 18:00 to midnight.

To weaken north position on the BL maps, increase dolyak redelivery timers from 10 seconds to 30 seconds in northern camps.

Rai.1084:

How will this improve bandwagoning, if everyone transfers to the only non-full host-server options for rewards afterwards?

Um, I didn’t quite understand your question here.

If you mean that players would only transfer to host worlds and still get full rewards: the over population is set so that only the guest worlds will ultimately be penalty free.

Edit: Wild guess.

This will be fun.
I know a lot of “wvwers” don’t want this (looking at the comments) but there seems to be massive QQ about any change, along with QQ about stale game mode. Can’t win? lol..

I suspect this is going to fun for most. Especially with the limit of having to own the objective – potentially quite a boon for defenders of objectives.

Gliding in to from the cliff defend bay inner for example.

no more zerg self kill when commander thinks its a small jump….

As a 5-year veteran who plays WvW exclusively, I’ve waited for WvW gliding since HoT’s release. It was always pretty absurd that you couldn’t glide in Desert BL. So, thank you.

This change will definitely change map-flow and make defending easier. Please give this the proper time to kitten how things change and shift in balance, before any changes are made. For example, this should be complemented with a nerf to the absurd siege damage.

I really hope this is some kind of sick humor of ANet, if they add gliding to WvW it’ll ruin that game mode also, just like they ruined PvP

“Oh my health is low, I’ll just glide away!” | “Oh I’m being knocked off the cliff, I’ll just use stability and glide away!” what a joke

Shonex.5327:

I really hope this is some kind of sick humor of ANet, if they add gliding to WvW it’ll ruin that game mode also, just like they ruined PvP

“Oh my health is low, I’ll just glide away!” | “Oh I’m being knocked off the cliff, I’ll just use stability and glide away!” what a joke

it would be like shooting a duck in matrix…….

they are changing ballistas to have a duck hunting skills

And hope if isnt eneught they will had some effect to some range skills, longbow ranger could have some function to disable/damage the glidder.
As well DH F1 chain spear thing could(can) pull target to the ground hope it does the fall damage bug or glitch target xD

Players glidding arent invunerable and they cant fight back…

Stop whining like small kids over things you didnt even try yet.
Having changes is a good thing and it keeps the interest up.
Half of whinners here didnt even read full post.
Dont you get bored playing years of same maps and mechanics on WvW?

This is the time for a change!

There is going to be a net trap ya?

SweetPotato.7456:

There is going to be a net trap ya?

engie mortar will trap players with a net xD if get them on the air j/k

Hmm….. Anti-aircraft type weapons will be next.

The sky is falling!

Oh … wait.. people are falling out of the sky. My bad.

But yes, it feels like a pet project that has been itching at the devs for two years.

• My big question is can we access areas that were previously inaccessible, and if so can we build siege there?

A few things

• CC will break gliding. If someone is trying to escape you on a cliff for example, a CC (though it will have to be ranged) will send them to the ground.

• You can still hit people in the air.

• Gliding in EBG will be very limited due to territories. If you were Red and owned SMC + only the red side of the map, you could glide from the top of SMC to the sentry near QL, for example. That’s not very far so at least in EBG, gameplay shouldn’t change very much.

• There are lots of cliffs and open fields in Alpine and Desert borderlands. There should be lots of use for gliding and few ways to “exploit” it.

• Fall damage traits might see some interesting use.

Though I am somewhat upset with this addition, I’m no where near angry. Territories make it reasonable and no one will be immune to damage while they’re in the air. To me, it just means I get to be 110% more annoying on my longbow Ranger pelting people in the skies. I can’t wait to Point Blank Shot people trying to glide towards me and watch them hit the ground like a sack of potatoes.

So don’t freak out. People are probably imagining this to be worse than what it will.

I think the way they are doing it sounds pretty fair. It cant be used to hop over walls as the enemy airspace kicks you off the glider and it will make the desert borderland actually work and be enjoyable (at last).

If you use a “knockback” skill to push an enemy off of a height, can he deploy the glider before hitting the ground?

My understanding is that if you don’t own the structure, you can’t glide in that area. Or am I reading that wrong?

Other question: if team A owns say Lang, and team B owns their keep, can one glide into the other structure? Or do you hit the territory “wall” and drop once you reach it?

Jayne.9251:

My understanding is that if you don’t own the structure, you can’t glide in that area. Or am I reading that wrong?

Other question: if team A owns say Lang, and team B owns their keep, can one glide into the other structure? Or do you hit the territory “wall” and drop once you reach it?

Can only glide in teritories you own, so as an attacker you can not glide there, only defenders.

And to all those people saying people would just glide off instead of running; You still need some high ground to make your glider pop. Also running off still faster so stop freaking out.

Atm if a zerg meets a zerg (especially when fighting over an objective). One of the zerg usually dies, with VERY Few escapers.

If gliding adds more escape ala thief, but also to overpowered zerg professions like guardian, then this is an absolute -1. We need fights! Not runaway possibilities (thief is bad enough as it is already.)

As it’s a test, i will give this a chance. However i hope anet truly considers the possibility to retract it, or nerf it even more (like no use in combat), cause if you are already on the mind to love it, chances are slim you will remove it. Then again you brought Alpine borderland back, so there’s hope.

PS i LOOOOVE gliding in pve. It’s best feature imo ever. So this is not cause i don’t like gliding. It’s cause it might shake up wvw in the wrong way. Wvw biggest fun is zerg vs zerg. Always was, always will be. The alpine borderlands, stonemist hype that kind of playstyle, giving many fight possibilities. It is my current opinion that gliding will cause awkward situations, like ambushes from one high keep to a lower tower, runaways easier, etc.

Also gliding should have only basic speed. En not the ‘use endurance and press forward’ pve speed. That last one is definitely to good of an escape (not even chance to pew pew, if done from right cliff).

It’s coming to EotM right?

if so OMG

& also. could we get all territories there? that map would be amazing with full gliding. all it would need is npc turrets over keeps.

MadameS.3582:

DeceiverX.8361:

Hopefully they disabled the bloodstone fen gliding skills lol.

Still means smc will be brutal to defend… Need to watch out for third-floor smc drop veil bombs now as well.

Still very stupid, however. Corner someone into top floor garri while you siege it and they can just jump off a cliff to ooc glide and re-enter through various gaps. So much mesmer abuse in keeps… The list keeps on going.

The combat and balance alone is already laughably bad. The matchmaking process is poor. Now we have broken fight and territory mechanics to boot.

When has using your skills while youre gliding ever been a thing? Never lmao, if you’re fighting an enemy zerg in your keep, they cant glide away or glide back in, all of your points are incorrect, don’t knock it till you try it ok thx

1.) Bloodstone Fen gliding masteries.

2.) I was talking about defenders who already control the objective. They can flank or escape and veil bomb from a third dimension and even when backed into a corner.

3.) If gliding works like it does in PvE, then there’s no reward for using terrain to your advantage when making a siege because the glide, accessible only to the escaping defender, cannot be made by the attacking side, meaning they getva free escape despite being out-pushed and out-played. If anything, you’ll be punished for making the chase.

This is exacerbated by mesmers which can utilize gliding during the fall of a keep to re-position into harder-to-find/access locations for portal play.

4.) The mechanics are not fair for all professions or builds. Not everyone incorporates ranged cc onto their preferred style of play/build.

Please think harder about the mechanic before you dismiss my concerns of glaring problems thx.

DeceiverX.8361, i think its only the glindding funtion w/o skill, since it says players only need to buy HoT, a fresh “Hotter” has access to glide and pve masteries stay in pve.

IMO its only the function wich is great, Air keep could later be the keep that improves the glidder skills in WvW, instead of useless transmogriffers and weird buffs… this might be a god way to give some “need” to have that structure for X strategie.

Offair.2563:

Jayne.9251:

My understanding is that if you don’t own the structure, you can’t glide in that area. Or am I reading that wrong?

Other question: if team A owns say Lang, and team B owns their keep, can one glide into the other structure? Or do you hit the territory “wall” and drop once you reach it?

Can only glide in teritories you own, so as an attacker you can not glide there, only defenders.

And to all those people saying people would just glide off instead of running; You still need some high ground to make your glider pop. Also running off still faster so stop freaking out.

jerrifer cliff to EB green keep, i imagine players will fall before the wall… but i think i can see a way to exploit a mesmer inside… dont know if works but DH f1 or any other range pull skill used on enemy when he is falling from the sky : | or even pull glidding mesmer directly to the wall.

I can almost feel the annoyance of enemies gliding away. Gliding will break WvW unless you aren’t able to use it in combat. Otherwise, love love this addition.

Edit: after seeing the territories map I don’t think gliding will be that bad tbh. Defenders still have a huge advantage.

Count me hyped for this ! \o/ always wanted gliding to work in WvW especially on desert BL and now I will finally be able to glide into battle \o/

Yas! So hyped for this!

I think this sounds pretty freakin amazing. I’ll keep an open mind and try it out and am optimistic! WvW Air Force. Woot!

o.0 WTF do you smoke there?

Am I the only one who like this? I’ve always dreamed to be able to glide in WvW too!

I’m excited about this! maybe will make Deadeye usefull :P Yea I’m down for giving this a shot. Sounds like they thought it out quite well with the rules and territories.

Might freshen up things. Glad there is still being tried

There are so many annoying cliffs in ABL and DBL I don’t even. So glad gliding is coming.

Territories look cool, feels like the map will be like Risk or something, and it’s something I never knew I was missing Ability reset is also a long missing feature.

But I have a hard time figuring out my feeling about the people in /wuv/. I mean seriously:

Players: waaaaaaaaa you’re letting WvW die and you’re horrible
<Anet changes the slightest thing>
Players: waaaaaaaaa you’re killing WvW why did you change that thing
<Anet thinks about testing a larger change and is open to reverting it if it flops>
Players: waaaaaaaaa you’re forcing a litter of kittens nobody asked and you’re killing WvW

Also players: WvW is dead, Anet pls do something about it

Seriously, y’all are never happy whether anything is done or when it isn’t.

“Is this a joke hurr durr?”

No, your attitude is a joke.

This is going to be fun.

I only hope that since gliding in wvw is gained through ability points (not HoT Mastery points) is that as we max it out we can get things like the bombs/med packs from Shatterer and folks can get advanced gliding/stealth gliding through the ability points even if they don’t have it outside of WvW.

Maybe we can eventually get some leylines added in the desert BL between the shrines if we control them. That could be fun too!

So, death by lag is not the most important problem in the game, and tactic trolls don’t exist either and Anet is still fixing things that weren’t broken to begin with. Ok.

In other news? RIP gank squads trying to stop players returning to the fights.

Korgov.7645:

Out of rebalancing world populations

I don’t think you’ve thought that through properly.

Not sure what Anet can even do about rebalancing Worlds, when it is the players’ (and guilds’) choice where to move, and if to move. See also recent overtake of Vabbi (a bottom tier server) by a bunch of people, hiking it all the way up to compete with Far Shiverpeaks (a top-ish tier server), and then leaving it behind once they got bored.

As long as people can choose their server, and WvW remains server based instead of some other kind of grouping, this is not possible to control whatsoever from Anet’s side.

Thank you so much for this and I mean it

Gliding has been one of my favorite thing in the game since HoT and I’m glad that WvW will finally be able to benefit from it!

Also, I’m sure you have carefully thought the territories system and that being able to glide into objective is just needless worry!

This is the single most exciting piece of GW2 news I heard this week. Seriously, I even logged in to the official forums for the first time in 9 months just to publicly state how much I like the thought of having a full squad parachute into battle. Cannot wait to see and play this.

My 2 copper.

~MRA

This is unfortunate news. From the standpoint that the initial map makers probably (let’s be honest here, it’s certainly) didn’t have gliding in mind when it came to balancing the original maps (EBG and EoTM the most).

EBG can only really make use of SMC (adding to snowballing effect), and red keep.

Eotm is inconsistent by all the pot holes, but mostly flat.

ABL Garrison and Hills are high enough to be useful for gliding but that’s obviously by happenstance and not by design. Especially if you consider Bay can’t be glided out of to anywhere useful (you can glide from outer to inner Bay at least).

DBL is the only map that sort of considers gliding as an option, by now for obvious reasons. It at least has verticals everywhere for gliding to be somewhat useful. Although Lava keep has the same issues as Bay that I can foresee (it’s not a high objective), but will probably lack the gliding potential from outer into inner Lava keep.

It’s just like there are more important things that need to be addressed in wvw which are waiting for couple of years already without any proper solution, swept under the carpet all the time or just being neglected, but Anet works on gliding .. like .. umm ok really ?

This sounds like a lot of fun! Can’t wait to glide around in the DBL. Will make taking one of the south towers very epic. Kill lord – explosion – glide away towards south camp without looking back. sunglasses

Kitta.3657:

Hexalot.8194:

Kitta.3657:

What in the hell?

WHAT WILL HAPPEN IF YOU ARE IN COMBAT? Disable in combat gliding. Otherwise it means anyone can run away from a fight by just gliding away and literally makes HoT Pay-to-win. Seriously. It NEEDS to be disabled to deploy gliding while in combat. Seriously. This is why gliding in WvW has always been the stupidest idea.

This is such a silly statement. If your enemies decide to run away by gliding, YOU JUST GLIDE AFTER THEM !

At some point they have to land since it’s not true flight.

Your statement is even more silly because you can only glide if you own the territory ;^)

“If you enter a territory that you do not own while gliding, you will be kicked from your glider.”

AND lets not forget that being able to ‘MOVE’ a fight a large distance (via gliding in this case) means they can pretty much grab help from anyone remotely near them and/or lead you into a tower killzone.

If you could move a fight 3000-5000 units “presently” in wvsw, what would happen? They would abuse objective entrances/gaurds/pve/siege/terrain and basically take you to a spot on the map that is definitely in their favour.

The people calling things silly aren’t being ‘more silly’, they are being EXTREMELY MORE SILLY.

When will pvp get gliding? I can’t wait!