Guild Wars 2

Yes, I do know lots of people love the new gliding in WvW but as one who has been playing WvW for a few years now this gliding has completely ruined the game for me.

By the way, I can glide, so my disbelief and disappointment has nothing to do with so-called Pay to Win. I do have a HoT account on Fissure of Woe and Free-2-Play account on Anvil Rock.

Last night in WvW was a complete shambles with people gliding all over the place and enemies just jumping of the tallest cliffs in order to escape.

At our Citadel, instead of running down the steps, some of our own players were simply gliding down to the North West Tower so giving our enemies there little time to recover – very unfair to our enemies. The distances are already relatively short in the Alpine Borderlands but gliding has made them insanely short.

Seems no where is safe now – earlier so many lonely paths between steep cliffs where you knew you were relatively safe unless a stealthed player was about, but now people can just glide down from cliffs to you. Doesn’t matter whether its an enemy coming to attack you or a friendly coming to help you, we need distance to matter in WvW.

Lag, what a terrible time last night, teleporting to our Citadel while standing right outside was taking 30 seconds or more, sometimes a minute. There wasn’t a queue so the map wasn’t full. Perhaps the lag was just a coincidence or my network route had problems.

Sorry I’ve got no positive suggestions as still in shock.

Anyhow, for me, a truly wonderful amazing game ruined. Guess I’ll read more, give it while and reflect, perhaps its not as bad as I think.

P.S.
I’ve just seen some more posts where people love the gliding – could be I’m a dinosaur.

Don’t worry, over time the more glaring problems will come to light, and then the poor devs will have to work on it even more, spending less time on stuff that matters.

The devs did say that if it turned out to do more harm than good they would basically remove it again.

I personally think it has no place in WvW.

Colly.4073:

The devs did say that if it turned out to do more harm than good they would basically remove it again.

I personally think it has no place in WvW.

WvW lacks “tools” and mechanics, glidders can provider several new tactics, but its a double edged sword if Anet starts doing some weird care on the glidders and possible future skills.

WvW is only a ktrain empty towers gameplay, every server does it, if this will make players fight more, it is a good adition.

I have to admit that last night in WvW chat I never saw anyone criticising the gliding – everyone seemed to be having fun. Seemed I was the only misery guts.

I died half a dozen times or more in the mass fights near NWT – yet it seemed a drunken shambles to me – I was sober – perhaps a drink might have helped me.

Just a culture shock for me – WvW so very different to a few days ago when I knew the distances to places, shortcuts, how long to get there, and whether I might make it in time.

It never occurred to me that a lot of PvE’rs would come – not sure how that will affect the queues but hope they have lots and lots of fun, and they come to stay.

Think I’ll give it a few days rest, see how things settle down then go in again – try to readjust – try to figure out new tactics, try to have fun

I already posted that I love it, but this won’t help repeating it. Instead of focusing of emotions – though those are also very important, we have to focus on reasoning, in order to reach a consensus or compromise. I hope the devs have a summary of the substance posted here, the “whys and wherefores”, and how those can be solved – if needs to be solved.

For example:
Problem: Gliding possible into enemy objectives, in certain circumstances.
Solution(s): Remove boons from player in gliding state, move borders to better spots – or even add neutral zones in-between (no gliding zones) where needed, add high damage & unremovable long debuff to those still entering it, and so on

There are also subjective “problems”, those that conflict with what a player was used to be a norm or at least thought it is, such as:
- there were relatively “safe” zones inside the enemy territory, now they are exposed because gliding… well, that territory belongs to the enemy, or it is close to it, tread carefully
- gliding adds another new escape option, one that cannot be followed, they shouldn’t be able to glide while in fight mode… but it’s an advantage given to those owning the area, so it’s normal to have an advantage – comparable to the objective gates, where the owned can enter only, and more fair “run away” option than stealth, leaps, teleports, and similar. It’s not a glider related problem, though that adds a new way to that “running away” feature – that isn’t forbidden, and should be solved together if ever is considered to be solved (removing escape options). At least a defender now can get away, without specifically having a gank squad to stealth it.

We don’t know what the “majority” thinks, but likely most are neutral about this. Of course there were far more important issues to be solved, but that’s again not a reason to be against a feature. I like if the enemy can respond fast, to any attack we make on their objectives, because I hate taking something without winning a fight there. Gliding reduces the time I always felt as wasted, and adds a far higher percent that is filled with action, not boring walking.

Population balance, competitiveness, WvW focused skill balance and more, are still higher priority than anything – including gliding. But we can’t stop time and undo this decision: it’s way too late. It’s done. I love it, but still disappointed that those more important things aren’t addressed. Still, if we want to be heard, we should behave like intelligent beings, so our voice can be considered as one that cares about this game mode.

Malkom.5607:

I have to admit that last night in WvW chat I never saw anyone criticising the gliding – everyone seemed to be having fun. Seemed I was the only misery guts.

I died half a dozen times or more in the mass fights near NWT – yet it seemed a drunken shambles to me – I was sober – perhaps a drink might have helped me.

Just a culture shock for me – WvW so very different to a few days ago when I knew the distances to places, shortcuts, how long to get there, and whether I might make it in time.

It never occurred to me that a lot of PvE’rs would come – not sure how that will affect the queues but hope they have lots and lots of fun, and they come to stay.

Think I’ll give it a few days rest, see how things settle down then go in again – try to readjust – try to figure out new tactics, try to have fun

Really good insights actually. I agree, I am not sure if in two weeks I will like it or not, but yeah, it’s different.

They need to tweak the exploits, to Prevent captures that shouldn’t be able to happen.

The change in tactics needed is the most interesting part to me. Routes of escape change which makes both attackers and defenders consider different tactics.

I think if they make the exploit tweaks, we will be able to evaluate it over the next couple of weeks.

They did say it can be removed so it can still be undone. In the end once the novelty wears off, it is going to amount to more things for the dev to work on instead of the important ones that truly matter.

Malkom.5607:

Just a culture shock for me – WvW so very different to a few days ago when I knew the distances to places, shortcuts, how long to get there, and whether I might make it in time.

Think I’ll give it a few days rest, see how things settle down then go in again – try to readjust – try to figure out new tactics, try to have fun

I can sympathize with this, there are many things that were more fun before in WvW. Those times won’t return, but we will remember forever the fun moments.

a few positives:

1. first off did anyone consider that there might be a lot of people who didnt play WvW because of the big difference in mechanics from pve to pvp? this will help ease that.
2. it will bring in a LOT of new tactical use, i’ve not been attacked from so many different angles for a long time, as it is so easy now to get surrounds on attacking enemies (not sure if it is good, but at least it force the mindless zerg to actually split up or turn around to deal with attackers from different angles instead of blindly running in one direction).
3. it ease the slowmotion movement in some area’s, and gives more escaped paths in some area’s. due to slowdown in combat and the general slow movement bc your always supposed to have perma swiftness (wth is the point in a buff that the game is balanced around you ALWAYS having on. should just change its effect and buff base speed tbh, or remove the kitten slow down in combat as it is a plague).
4. it might open up for more interesting things in the future (not sure how i like the idea of mounts running around in wvw, however it will decrease the feel of Slowmotion movement so think it is ok) ^^

Just fix the WvW lag. Thats the only thing I care about.

it makes taking a lot of towers harder since defenders can just glide in and man siege.

overlook>veloka has an unfair advantage in this regard.

also alpine bls spawn>net, we did this to another server yesterday and demolished them. if there was no gliding they would have taken the tower.

I’m not sure how the desert bl is taking this since I don’t play on it.

I’m fairly happy with it, my warrior now can literally get the drop on thieves. I like putting the shoe on the other foot and catching thieves by surprise.

My only issue so far with gliding is that at Hills, its territory is rather small. So the influence of the keep, especially a keep you can glide any direction out of, is minimized because it’s territory border, both north and south, is so close to the keep.

Bigsexy.8302:

Majority of veterans don’t like it,

unless you can provide a proper research quotation to prove your “majority” claim in here I’ll just assume you dislike it and plainly assume that since you [and maybe few of your friends] don;t like it “majority” has to do the same….

Imagine that…gliding makes people be more aware and fight…

Lots of people probably don’t see it yet, but gliding is causing more problems than it solves. Actually, it really doesn’t solve anything to begin with. Not having gliding wasn’t even hindering anything. After they add it, then the problems start happening.

Famine.7915:

Lots of people probably don’t see it yet, but gliding is causing more problems than it solves. Actually, it really doesn’t solve anything to begin with. Not having gliding wasn’t even hindering anything. After they add it, then the problems start happening.

You usually have good suggestions re:WvW. I also know you understand the gameplay as well.

What problems other than new exploits have you noted?

Jesus, these forums are full of qq rere’s lately.

The thing that gliding does do is add some new tactics and surprise to the going around in a ball game we’ve been playing for 5 years, just like mesmer portals. It’s something new to learn and find new ways to use against your enemy, it also promotes needing more awareness rather than the usual look around the corner to see red names.

Obviously there will be growing pains and not every nook and cranny is covered, the devs at least had the sense to create territories that only defenders can glide in, not every border is going to be perfect so we’re going to have to point out bad spots to them.

Maybe they should create barriers along the borders of every structure so no players, not even defenders, cannot fly through them at all.
“But invisible walls break meh immersion!”
“Well If you know it’s there don’t fly into it!”

My overall impression is it’s a positive change, but it certainly needs some tweaks in terms of additional no-fly zones: Citadel to either of the northern towers makes the two already arguably most defensible towers nigh impossible to flip with even the most token force of defenders on it. A small no-fly border around Citadel would fix the issue though – It’s the unbroken flight from the height of Citadel that creates the problem.

There are certainly a few border adjustments to be made, but they’re far from game-breaking imo.

I was on the fence about gliding, but I don’t think that I really like it even though it has some advantages.

It certainly screws over me and my friend’s little 2-man havoc group. It’s impossible to even attempt to stop enemies from getting in and sieging NWT, NET, SET (assuming they own Hills), so why even bother trying unless the map is dead.

I haven’t tried, but this may even be applicable to SWT gliding from the ruin as well.

Also gone are the days I can push somebody off a cliff. Now they just glide away. Boo.

Frankly, it’s not a shambles. It’s fair game for all sides. Glide on them, they glide on us.. glide away, and so on.

The only people so far that I see complaining about gliding at all are IN these forums. Absolutely everybody else that I know in WvW, (on both servers I’m on), enjoy the new skill a lot and if/when it goes to vote I’m confident that it will get a huge majority of the vote.

Magolith… that’s only true about the falling IF you are in their territory. In your own zone you can still knock the enemy off and watch them plummet and splat on the ground below

Balthazzarr.1349:

Magolith… that’s only true about the falling IF you are in their territory. In your own zone you can still knock the enemy off and watch them plummet and splat on the ground below

Yea, I know that. The nature of us havocing is that we’re typically in enemy territory though. That’s not a deal-breaker for me though.

Not being able to even try stopping people from getting in is what I hate.

Yes but it does go both ways so that makes it fair imo.

Dragon.8762:

Just fix the WvW lag. Thats the only thing I care about.

^This

It has gotten worse and worse as time and updates go by, skill lag used to only happen when 3 zergs met but now it’s even when 2 meet.

Gliding is great. It has generated a newness to otherwise stale end-game content. There are new tactics and strategies available. There are new perspectives for roamers and seige builders. Sure, its’ change…but change for the good. Consider all the people that have left the game because of boredom. I want them to come back so I can teach them all about this new fun.

So every time i jump from Red Keep to defend Ogrewatch with the zerg, i think of this scene and hear this music…)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TqtehtSB0LI

I think the gliding is an interesting innovation and I’m enjoying experimenting with it. I do think there will be a lot of teething problems that will need to be sorted out but on balance I think it will end up being a net positive.

I also suspect that the complaints we’re hearing about gliding being added would be dwarfed by the complaints we’d hear if it was taken away.

Glider range should be reduced to less than just territory boundaries and they should prevent gliding while in combat. It’s a cute thing to glide out of the DBL keep or out of garri to help leave a well-controlled and elevated zone quickly, but it favors defense way too much and really makes it impossible to safely “trespass” like under/behind enemy hills without getting jumped on by a ton of enemy players.

Really, without a complete and total redesign of the elevations of all of the maps into flat surfaces (which I don’t think is a great idea), gliding isn’t meant for WvW.

My take on it is it really has no place in WvW. However as long as people are dumb enough to glide by me and they are an enemy they will die 9 out of 10 times. So basically free bags at this point. But I do hope it gets removed. Sure people are having fun with it. And as always some abuse it. I think it will be removed soon, and we will not see it again.

Balthazzarr.1349:

Glide on them, they glide on us.. glide away, and so on.

Instead of flying that just make me think of two zergs slathered in oil going at each other.

I guess i’m one of the ‘minority’ vets that enjoy the gliding. Yes a few exploits need fixing. The one concern I have is that CC’ing people in the air hasn’t been making them drop their wings. This needs to happen as at the moment it’s a little too easy to simply glide away.

Dawdler.8521:

Balthazzarr.1349:

Glide on them, they glide on us.. glide away, and so on.

Instead of flying that just make me think of two zergs slathered in oil going at each other.

hmm…. oh ya I saw that game… but it was adults only!

Gliding is a 10/10.
It made moving through the maps so much better.
And from what I see a lot of players love it.
The game has far more serious problems,especially with the small scale combat balance which is fubar,and taking away the only good feature that came with the last patch would be stoopid.

I agree that when cc’ed when gliding, you should instantly fall, and if it’s to your death, then so be it. But you should still be able to glide while in combat, as it is an escape tactic. So get your cc ready if you see your opponent about to take a leap.

I like gliding more than I like siege disablers and shield gens. ~shrugs~ I’d rather remove those. then set a Arrow cart limit effect so we don’t have a dozens ACs raing down on people. Get out and fight!

anyone know when they are done testing and will decide whether to keep gliding in WvW or not?

Sorry OP, Gliding seems to be a huge win. You’re certainly in a minority in not liking it.

Watch as more of the landscape terrain gets changed.

You can STILL GLIDE FROM THE PANG SIDE! roflmao… whether you own it or not!

Wish I’d made the subject of this thread “Gliding a shambles?” as clearly the shambles was in my head – apologies to Devs etc.

Anyhow, I’ve learnt a huge amount from the posts here and didn’t realize the implications gliding would bring. Suddenly nearly everything is more complex. I’m quite an old guy, over 60, and for some of us oldies it takes time to figure new stuff out – at least its fun.

I even watched a couple of YouTube videos where groups were gliding in to attack their enemy. You could see all the dead who needed rezzing – so from my combat healer perspective I could either just swoop down to heal them or else keep going on foot and take another minute or so to reach them. Guess we know what commanders and sane people would do.

I’ve just been in to my HoT account and glided in Desert Borderlands – lots of fighting there but tonight will go back to my F2P account and be a foot solder so I can see how it affects me and what the new tactics are – should be interesting.

Times, they are a changing, as always.
At least many happy memories as one poster said.

Magolith.9412:

2-man havoc group.

that ain’t havoc group….
that’s roaming group :|

The pip kitten and the legendary backpack already brought in pve clowns who run from fights unless they outnumber you. Roaming is literally just chasing down people until they come across more and gank you.

This just makes it easier for people to run from fights. I am not surprised to see so many pve heroes cream their panties over it.

gliding is a new toy and yay for fun but its bringing in a ton of issues since the maps weren’t designed with it in mind.

Stand The Wall.6987:

gliding is a new toy and yay for fun but its bringing in a ton of issues since the maps weren’t designed with it in mind.

Or, in the land’s known as reality, a handful of tweaks.

Gliding is implemented exceptionally well, and is mostly of benefit to defenders. This change is a huge improvement: there are now more and better ways to get big fights faster.

Well done, Arenanet. Kindly ignore these few naysayers.

It’s a gimmicky thing that’s good in some cases, bad in others. It’s not “implemented exceptionally well” by any means, but neither is it completely broken.

E.G it’s nice if you own a number of territories and can glide straight to certain objectives, i.e. going from spawn to hills. It’s not nice if you don’t own objectives and are killed because you enter enemy territory, i.e. gliding from nc to garri on dbl if you don’t own garri.

It’s gimmicky because it seems ultra rushed and requires a bunch of case by case updates from anet to make sure it’s not exploited. It doesn’t add anything of value to wvw, but it’s not that bad either. It’s just something for anet to say they “added” to wvw, even though everyone and their dog knows that dbl was intended for gliding since HoT launch.

Once the bugs are ironed out it will be a nice addition. I’ve been enjoying it a lot.

If we keep calling for changes to be removed instead of giving them a solid chance then WvW will get stale again. We need to have the game mode continue to update as the game progresses.

Seems fine, i dont get the tears? You need to be in an area where you control the main objective to initiate gliding. I feel Anet have actually done well here.

psizone.8437:

Once the bugs are ironed out it will be a nice addition. I’ve been enjoying it a lot.

If we keep calling for changes to be removed instead of giving them a solid chance then WvW will get stale again. We need to have the game mode continue to update as the game progresses.

Definitely needs updates, but on more glaring issues.

DemonSeed.3528:

Definitely needs updates, but on more glaring issues.

Definitely, but if we get this riled up over a small, relatively simple update, what will the forums be like if anything goes wrong during an important update?

I think they’ve said a few times that devs go back and forth on projects, it could well have been a non-WvW dev that did this update so it’s not like they did this instead of something else.

They’re definitely slow on the important stuff, and they focused on things that I disagreed with when they did that voting way back. However, I genuinely don’t know how difficult fixing the important issues is or how long it will take, so getting something whilst we wait for those things to get implemented is great.