Guild Wars 2

I have been playing WvW very seriously for a couple of years now and I REALLY like to use golems. On the old maps with Travelers runes an Omega golem could keep up well enough to be playable. On the new maps it has been very questionable whether or not they are worthwhile due to the extra spacing.

Today, I was tagged up and leading a small group. We built an Omega and I hopped in only to find out that I was very slow in my traveler runes. Took the two nearby towers – with multiple Mesmer ports to help me move. Then I abandoned the golem as too slow and went on to take two keeps (with the help of [MAKI]) and another tower without it. After the caps, I tagged down and went back to experiment with the golem. I confirmed that the speed of the golem was the same with or without the traveler runes. I also confirmed that damage still scales with power so not all effects from my gear has been removed. Just the increased speed.

Unless I have a dedicated team of mesmers I don’t that I can justify building golems at this point. Perhaps in EBG but certainly not in the borderlands. There is no way to know if Anet intended this or not. (I just re-read the most recent patch notes and couldn’t find it mentioned). What I do know is that I don’t like it and hope that they change it back.

Prior to HoT I mostly played WvW. Since HoT I have been mostly farming materials for the guild hall and only occasionally playing WvW. I have not enjoyed the new maps but have worked hard to learn them and hope that they will grow on me. My focus for the last month (and the next month) is to get +5 for the guild. At this point I am not sure how much of a WvW there will to go back to at that point.

Thanks for reading.

Able Sentry
Ferguson’s Crossing
[FOE] Guild Leader

ANet please fix this. It worked before HoT & was a strategic choice many Commanders used in making Golems viable.

Isbot,
Thank you for posting this…

I’ve been working for the last 6 months on creating a Full set of Celestial & Travelers is flushed down the toilet.

As a PUG Commander I was betting on using golems to spark tower assaults with the previous ability to use the Traveler’s Rune.

It’s really depressing to play WvW & to try and do something to motivate other players to join in…while these oversights break my spirit.

I posted about this in the wrong forum section (twice accidentally), pointed this fact out and thought a mod would move the post, which they didn’t.
Anyway, I found this change to make speed-runes not affect golems to be a slap in my face for several reasons.

Firstly, there are many problems and bugs which people complain about since HoT, many of those issues seem rather urgent and important to me. Not only are speedy Golems a pre-HoT thing, but I can’t really recall an outrage about imba speed-runes and Golems on the forums ever. Once more Anets priorities are quite far from what is important to players.

Secondly, I wouldn’t even care if this change had happened on Alpine Borderlands. But on Desert Border I have to bloody flag on to get 3 people on me to build a ram (because 9 out of 10 of my mates refuse to play on that map) AND I have to build golems because else Ill whack t3 gates all day long. On top of that I am condemned to limp across this huge wasteland with true golem speed, which borders to torture.

Thirdly, when there’s one to three players on the map taking t3 stuff even with ram(s) plus golem(s) the seemingly randomly respawning mobs wear the golems down quite a bit during the hours and hours and hours of exciting pvd. Right now I can go through ten Alphas per day.

Fourthly, not golem related but I have to say this too: Whoever came up with those mobs and bosses in the new maps should be grrrr scolded very harshly. Not only do they mess up my golems, but also every single one of them is simply annoying. Block-block-block, interrupt-interrupt-interrupt, blink-blink-blink, push-push-push and so forth. I mean with a zerg you won’t even notice it but when youre 1-3 ppl it only gets tedious. It’s like swimming through liquid cheeese against a extremely strong current while being very, very sleepy.

Now people keep asking me, thuggy why oh why do you do this anyway? Well, simply because there is nothing else to do! I could be bored in pve, in spawn or wrecking golems, the latter just got blessed by Anets attention and thus comes very kitten close to the stand-in-spawn- wvw excitement. Thank you so very, very much guys.

I actually like this change, but it does sound painful.

What if it remained but golems had their base speed increased and possibly were unable to take mesmer portals? They need to be slow, after all, but perhaps it doesn’t have to be excruciating.

Oh thank you for your compassion Sviel. Excruciating is the correct term. And I agree as someone who used to defend stuff etc, golems shouldn’t be too mobile. What ticks me off is simply that this change comes right now, right on this huge map, full of cliffs and curves, where there is nothing else to do than pvd, and not enough people around to even do that unless maybe on prime-time.

Imagine spending 1 gold coin to buy the golem.

Having to build golem with 1 – 3 players.

Run it from camp to tower….but in the time you do it. You get attacked by 1 – 2 roaming players….there are 2 enemy sides btw.

Rinse & Repeat…

How many of your 1 – 3 man team will help you again?

Don’t forget…you earn nothing for trying.

Dear Diku, enemy players are my smallest worry because they mostly do not exist. If one turns up to def we will most likely fail if he is capable of using siege and I’m fine with that.

Wait…I think I’m supposed to have an escort of 30-80 players….forgot.

My bad…your guild must be that big to ride WvW.

Yea if one is not zerging on prime-time its just excruciating. There’s nothing to do for small groups especially in the earlier hours and even this nothing has become more excruciating thanks at least in part to super slow golems.

@thug

Yes, I agree. If 1 defender shows up & knows how to use siege. We deserve to fail.

That’s how good mechanics work.

I’m just venting because for the past 6 months…this is what I was looking forward to using as a PUG Commander to rally the minimal troops on map.

I feel that ANet is making WvW only for the Minor & Major League baseball teams.

The Little League baseball teams…like the PUG based militia I command are kept outside the ball park.

We are shunned and everything we fairly earned in Guild Upgrades that strategically helped us…literally were stripped away & put behind a massive Guild Requirements.

So I hope you understand why I’m…pretty disgusted actually…that the Traveler’s Runes that once worked before HoT is now nerfed.

sigh

ANet is killing my spirit to be a PUG Commander…I’m sure this feeling is shared by others…not sure if it’s a lot…but it’s really crushing.

Ok…getting off my soap box.

Game on folks…as best as we can.

To be honest, I think the gold cost on siege should be much lower. It should be realistic compared to the amount of income a WvW player has.

No more travelers with golems? Sad but I’m not the least bit surprised. The fill in the blank (?) in charge want you to use the shiny new Charr motorcycle things… that is if anybody can AFFORD to unlock it and then AFFORD to have a scribe in the guild make them?

#kittenlogic
#kittenpriorities

You can’t force people to try new stuff; You can make them suffer for not wanting to, apparently.

Do u hear that?? its the sound of Anet not giving a kitten….

I’m glad golems are slow for everyone. Omega golems are the most over-powered siege machines and with higher walls hopefully they can no longer snipe carts on the walls.

I can almost take an SFR seriously when they talk about nerfing golems, while keeping in mind the nightly 12-omega trains to our garrison…

As if omegas are slooow without traveler runes…

Catalin.5341:

I’m glad golems are slow for everyone. Omega golems are the most over-powered siege machines and with higher walls hopefully they can no longer snipe carts on the walls.

And yet, I havent seen a single Omega golem for a month. Or a regular golem for that matter.

Why? Because all a zerg or small party need to do is dump catas on a wall, nobody will have time to find them in the hidden canyons anyway.

I can almost take an SFR seriously when they talk about nerfing golems, while keeping in mind the nightly 12-omega trains to our garrison…

I’m a rare breed on my server. There’s a ton of farming and gvg mentality.
Honestly I don’t care for the PPT, I don’t even look at the points and I don’t care if our server wins or not. I’m only interested in the siege warfare. An achievement for me is to take a T3 fully sieged and fully defended objective.

In the old days I would get a rush from being that one player that prevented a 50 blob to cap an objective. But SFR climbed the ladder and when we started playing with vizuna (THE MASTER RACE OF SIEGE) then my efforts felt pointless. And when the catapult skill 5 bubble was implemented I switched from defense to offense.

And yet, I havent seen a single Omega golem for a month. Or a regular golem for that matter.

It goes hand in hand with the people not playing problem. This means there’s no need to spend good money on golems when you can PvD you’re way around and on the extreme ocasions proxy catas work wonders too.

You guys realize that’s the original point of golems right.. ‘re-usable’ very strong siege but slow and vulnerable to open field attack. All I see is a bunch of complaining karma trainers.

Zetsumei.4975:

You guys realize that’s the original point of golems right.. ‘re-usable’ very strong siege but slow and vulnerable to open field attack. All I see is a bunch of complaining karma trainers.

^this, but have u also to take into account that for this 3 years WvW was most of that… blob and be blobed, so speed golems was needed for ninja cap, now that ANet is changing wvw to some that needs a bit more effort and organization, yes in that most comply because they need more time spamming pvd skills.

Tempests, Scrappers, Mesmers have traits and utilities that grant AOE super speed. It’s not the consistent 25% movement speed you’re used to, but it’s something! Bring lots of these classes and you might have a higher super speed uptime.

T H E R E W I L L N O T B E FUN !

People don’t get the point.

I’m talking about the time when there is no zerg, no blob and no karma train.

I’m talking about the time when you log on and stand in spawn and there is NOBODY. At the moment that is a large proportion of the day.

The decision I’m facing at that time is: Do I go to pve, do I keep standing in spawn or do I do something on this godforsaken map.

At least speed-runes and golems saved me time running sups. Running sups across this huge, empty map, again and again.

At least speed-runes made the whole nonsensical process a bit more fast and less excruciating.

There is nobody who cares about defending, there is nobody at all. And if there is a golem-rush and zergs and blobs etc during kitten -time they have bloody mesmers anyway.

I complain about this sudden, totally unimportant change right now when there is a billion other important things they could fix.

It is like they force you to have an operation on your genitals but then they give you no anesthesia so you can enjoy the process fully conscious and then they also start punching in your genitals to make the experience more enjoyable.

The speed should be fixed so that it is applied properly to the golem. I agree this is something that should not have been taken away. With the sheer size of the new map alone it was a golem necessity.

You can still solo super speed with Eye of the Storm. Pop it before entering the golem. The default is 5s, but maybe be able to extend the boon duration/concentration with some gear and food that’s probably not optimal for roaming, but hey if you’re the only one on map there should be no probs.

Awwww come on…you’re gonna say that Travelers & Golems promotes KTrainers arguement?

Here’s what I believe are more characteristic of KTrains:

1) Can easily Portal a Large Number of Golems far more Faster & Efficiently with multiple Mesmers coordinating.

2) Can easily defend a Golem against (1-3) roamers being out in an open field.

3) Can easily build any type of siege at gate or wall with the amount of supplies in zerg.

4) Capping an objective quickly not as important if single defender calls for support and 2 show up to help.

Small Havok (1-3 people) groups need Travelers more than KTrains in my opinion:

1) Travel fast with their 1-2 golems.

2) Can NOT really defend their golem against (1-3) roamers being out in an open field.

3) Can NOT build any type of siege without having to do multiple supply runs.

4) Capping an objective quickly is CRITIICAL if single defender calls for support and 2 show up to help.

Have you ever played as a scout/havoc team, or do you follow your Commander most of the time?

Sorry…just want ANet to fix this. Little League guilds are dying since HoT launched.

It’s rough enough being a PUG Commander…this nerf really hurts when trying to motivate the few troops on your map to fight.

That’s amazing that your map still has nightly 12-omega trains to your Garrison…I mean Rampart. I haven’t seen any consistent golem activity since HoT launched a month ago.

However, I seriously doubt all 12 Omega Golem drivers are using Traveler runes as their primary source to move quickly. Chances are…maybe 1/2 the drivers use Travelers. Might be different in Tier 1-6…where it’s a requirement for Golem drivers.

You believe what you will…Travelers & Golems typically benefit the Small Havoc groups that need to Ninja Objectives in my opinion.

Peace,
Diku

cgMatt.5162:

Tempests, Scrappers, Mesmers have traits and utilities that grant AOE super speed. It’s not the consistent 25% movement speed you’re used to, but it’s something! Bring lots of these classes and you might have a higher super speed uptime.

Golems are unaffected by speed buffs, hence the use of Travelers runes.

Firts guild catas destroyed, now this?

Apparently Anet won’t be happy until the BLs are completely empty, roamers and havoc groups are completely eradicated, and every single person is in a single EB zerg.

I think they just patched a bug. Maybe they realy want to do something with wvw

Good change. Omegas are nothing for a 3 man party in my opinion.

Some of the patch notes for HoT failed to mention major changes:

Objective bosses now have health scaling based on the number of allied and enemy players in the area.
They didn’t tell us that we could no longer see the health of the lord, so unless you have a scout positioned in the lord room, you have no way of knowing if the lord is getting attacked by a thief that hid inside, a guy who glitched inside, or an enemy zerg that came in the north side while you were defending the south. Even PvP tells you, “Your Lord Is Under Attack!” Our lords are now less important than PvP lords =(

Fixed an exploit that allowed siege golems to wield bundle items.
They didn’t tell us about any changes to Traveller Runes or Speed Runes.

Fixed a bug that allowed waypoints to be available for a few seconds between repel events.
They didn’t tell us that they changed white sword rules dramatically. Previously a gate, wall, or lord would have to be hit (thus leaving the waypoint uncontested if no one went and hit a gate). Now, white swords can be triggered by someone running by, an NPC running by, a piece of enemy siege nearby, and bugged enemy guards spawning inside your stuff.

Keeps will now mark enemy players within their perimeter for the first 5 minutes after being flipped.
Right now, the team that does the marking is rarely the team that took the keep (bugged.)

Loosmaster.8263:

cgMatt.5162:

Tempests, Scrappers, Mesmers have traits and utilities that grant AOE super speed. It’s not the consistent 25% movement speed you’re used to, but it’s something! Bring lots of these classes and you might have a higher super speed uptime.

Golems are unaffected by speed buffs, hence the use of Travelers runes.

Please try it! Apply super speed to a golem and see that it works. If this was not the intent then it is a bug and should be reported as such.

I’m on mobile at the moment so maybe will do it later. Also if there was just a patch and it stops working before the time of my post, it’s possible a dev already saw it and hotfixed it.

cgMatt.5162:

Loosmaster.8263:

cgMatt.5162:

Tempests, Scrappers, Mesmers have traits and utilities that grant AOE super speed. It’s not the consistent 25% movement speed you’re used to, but it’s something! Bring lots of these classes and you might have a higher super speed uptime.

Golems are unaffected by speed buffs, hence the use of Travelers runes.

Please try it! Apply super speed to a golem and see that it works. If this was not the intent then it is a bug and should be reported as such.

I’m on mobile at the moment so maybe will do it later. Also if there was just a patch and it stops working before the time of my post, it’s possible a dev already saw it and hotfixed it.

On mobile also. Unless they changed it fairly recently, all the aoe speed buffs I could apply, i.e. Warhorn, I would see “Immune” pop up. I’m in T8 and haven’t seen a golem built in 3 months, lol.

You can still use the speed booster on golems (15% or whatever it gives for 1 hour). I Found that to be nice. Getting the boosters is kind of the problem though. So unless we can buy speed boosters or something with our wvw badges/other rewards…. Why don’t we go crazy and create a leveling system for golems? Each tower/keep/wall/enemy/gate/kill or anything that grants WvW experience that you land WHILE attacking in a golem…levels your golemn! The level reward could be fairly straightforward, being a simple speed buff that increases in small intervals from 5% to maybe a maximum of 25%. I think that’s fair. The golemn becomes more and more damaged over time afterall. Becomes less of a pvp threat but is rewarded for successive victories with ‘momentum’.

ANet would you please re-consider allowing Traveler Runes to work with golems like they did on the Old Alpine map?

cgMatt.5162:

Loosmaster.8263:

cgMatt.5162:

Tempests, Scrappers, Mesmers have traits and utilities that grant AOE super speed. It’s not the consistent 25% movement speed you’re used to, but it’s something! Bring lots of these classes and you might have a higher super speed uptime.

Golems are unaffected by speed buffs, hence the use of Travelers runes.

Please try it! Apply super speed to a golem and see that it works. If this was not the intent then it is a bug and should be reported as such.

I’m on mobile at the moment so maybe will do it later. Also if there was just a patch and it stops working before the time of my post, it’s possible a dev already saw it and hotfixed it.

Ive done this for some time and to be honest i would like if this remained a thing, instead of a boring slap on your everyday speed runes. This actually puts a value in super speed (scrapper otherwise got a bloated amount of super speed). Keep a scrapper or similar class with your golems to drive them way faster. This also means that the progress of a golem train can be slowed by focusing down the people outside of golems boosting them with super speed. Its a neat teamwork synergy. If anyone wonder a super speed scrapper gives a bunch of golems close to 100% super speed uptime which cause them to move at speeds identical to players with swiftness out of combat. And if you don’t feel like including scrappers in your train you probably have enough glint revenant’s already to give them a fairly high up time of it . Yes believe it or not but they got other skills than COR and passive boonstacking.

As for if it is intended or not, they are not immune to super speed due to the mastery granting them super speed after breaking a gate.

Our home border keeps getting k-trained on a regular basis and it is very rare that they bring golems, omegas OR discount. They simply do not need them. Just the other day it took the enemy blob less than 6 minutes to go from touching the outer gate to killing the lord. (Lol, t3 means so much…) There weren’t any golems.

Golems are useful for small groups, duos and trios of would-be defenders who have the ungrateful task of flipping their own border back. They are useful because of the increased supply cost of siege and the random, frequent interval at which the guard mobs respawn. You can’t run back and forth between the keep and the camp – you need mobile siege.

There is no excuse for this change. Not under the current climate anyway.

@msalakka.4653, people got mad because need more effort and organization to get with golems to their distiny, and k-train in new bl takes longer, nothing more….

Aeolus.3615:

@msalakka.4653, people got mad because need more effort and organization to get with golems to their distiny, and k-train in new bl takes longer, nothing more….

So small groups can’t be organized? In your mind being organized means running with the blob?

Jim Hunter.6821:

Aeolus.3615:

@msalakka.4653, people got mad because need more effort and organization to get with golems to their distiny, and k-train in new bl takes longer, nothing more….

So small groups can’t be organized? In your mind being organized means running with the blob?

did i say that??…. read it again please,

btw if i recall chrono get time reduced in portal CD, that even helps porting up the golems to destiny, still wondering why people want traveler runes….

Aeolus.3615:

Jim Hunter.6821:

Aeolus.3615:

@msalakka.4653, people got mad because need more effort and organization to get with golems to their distiny, and k-train in new bl takes longer, nothing more….

So small groups can’t be organized? In your mind being organized means running with the blob?

did i say that??…. read it again please,

btw if i recall chrono get time reduced in portal CD, that even helps porting up the golems to destiny, still wondering why people want traveler runes….

Because some small 2-5 man groups don’t want to run all mesmer parties….

Every character I have has a set of armor in their inventory with speed runes because I spent my game time harassing enemy bl’s by solo/small group roaming. Golems weren’t my go to strategy but I liked having them as an option, especially if I was flipping back my own bl in the early morning.

Now you basically need to zerg to use them. You can’t move them around quickly without a zerg. You can’t take direct paths to get anywhere because of the kitten map design. You need a group to constantly kill guards since T3 gates take so long for small groups.

This is just another example of how anet has ruined WvW for roamers and are pushing people to blob.

Diku.2546:

Awwww come on…you’re gonna say that Travelers & Golems promotes KTrainers arguement?

Here’s what I believe are more characteristic of KTrains:

1) Can easily Portal a Large Number of Golems far more Faster & Efficiently with multiple Mesmers coordinating.

2) Can easily defend a Golem against (1-3) roamers being out in an open field.

3) Can easily build any type of siege at gate or wall with the amount of supplies in zerg.

4) Capping an objective quickly not as important if single defender calls for support and 2 show up to help.

Small Havok (1-3 people) groups need Travelers more than KTrains in my opinion:

1) Travel fast with their 1-2 golems.

2) Can NOT really defend their golem against (1-3) roamers being out in an open field.

3) Can NOT build any type of siege without having to do multiple supply runs.

4) Capping an objective quickly is CRITIICAL if single defender calls for support and 2 show up to help.

---

Have you ever played as a scout/havoc team, or do you follow your Commander most of the time?

Sorry…just want ANet to fix this. Little League guilds are dying since HoT launched.

It’s rough enough being a PUG Commander…this nerf really hurts when trying to motivate the few troops on your map to fight.

That’s amazing that your map still has nightly 12-omega trains to your Garrison…I mean Rampart. I haven’t seen any consistent golem activity since HoT launched a month ago.

However, I seriously doubt all 12 Omega Golem drivers are using Traveler runes as their primary source to move quickly. Chances are…maybe 1/2 the drivers use Travelers. Might be different in Tier 1-6…where it’s a requirement for Golem drivers.

You believe what you will…Travelers & Golems typically benefit the Small Havoc groups that need to Ninja Objectives in my opinion.

Peace,
Diku

Had to re-read my post. Yup…still there & still the same reasons why people want traveler runes…well at least for me…can’t speak for everybody.

If somebody in ANet has a bug list…please…please put this on it.

Your truly,
Diku

You guys accusing the OP of doing this as a karma train are way off base. The OP plays on my server, his strategy is to laboriously flip camps and create golems, and then his team of 3-5 people uses 2-3 golems to cap structures. He’s very good at what he does and it is very far from blob karma training.

The (undocumented, of course) change is another nail in the coffin of small groups. As Diku said, the blobs going to move their golems with mesmers, its the smaller groups this change hurts.

@Xernth

Thanks for the vocal support…I think we won the ktrain vs small group argument handily about the use of Traveler Runes with Golems.

Just providing detail behind why people want traveler runes.

I used to be very good at havocking with 2-3 players, but many of the changes recently have seriously hurt small groups & the “Little League Guilds” that I love to champion.

Your friend is probably better at havocking than I am…so I hope he is fairing better at the recent changes than I am.

I just hope ANet at least restores Traveler Runes for Golems to how it was being used before HoT released.

Diku

p.s.
Previously Earned Guild Upgrades would be nice to have back too.

Little League Guilds are being locked out of the ball park. Only Minor or Major League in scope baseball teams are allowed to access any of the strategic WvW equipment imho.

ANet…throw this old dog a bone please.

Traveler’s rune stopped working in a few other areas of the game as well. Any transformation (polymorph, tonic, power suit, golem, assault roller, scorpion, etc.) will not have movement speed buff affecting since it’s probably coded that no passive boons shall be permitted while inside a transformation.

In the mean time pilot them with thieves using short bow #5. Shoot, enter, exit. Shoot, enter, exit. I assume that’s also working as intended until Anet announces otherwise — I mean, they surely would have fixed it sometime over the past 3+ years if it wasn’t, right? /cough CONTESTEDKEEPWPTIMERS /cough

Tempest “Eye of the Storm” will apply Superspeed to golems.

Bowl of Orrian Truffle and Meat Stew, +40% to your Endurance refill rate. This really helps speed up your golems. I’ve been using it for a while and before the change, I was faster than people with Trav runes. Now that the runes don’t work, I highly recommend making a stack of bowls for your golems.

@Sinbold

Thank you for this bit of information.

This provides a little comfort…knowing that other WvW players care…even though it seems like we’re often neglected in the greater scheme of things by ANet.