Guild Wars 2

Guardians have somehow managed to escape a nerf-ageddon that has hit nearly every class at some point over the years. This despite it being one of if not the most heavily used classes since the launch of the game. Simply put the Guardian has always been a top class in some form.

Now they dominate nearly every aspect of WvW both in terms of numbers and fighting types (zerg, skirmish, roaming, etc). Any time a class reaches this level of dominance it needs a bat to the knee, a nerf party, a kitten slap. Time to tone down the trapper, reign in the bunker and for the love of the game nuke that DH invisible fence!

I only have an issue with lb 5 (ie culling is broken).

I could argue that dh burn roamers are OP but tbh I am pretty evenly matched against them on my condi hybrid scrapper assuming they are equally skilled, so it would be unfair. Meeting zerg specced guards is like kicking around a baby turtle while laughing maniacally.

Straegen.2938:

… for the love of the game nuke that DH invisible fence!

^This

Hunter’s Ward... AKA -Longbow 5... AKA- Invisible fence – NEEDS To Be FIXED!!!

IT’s BUGGED!

My experience with it has been that at least, and this is no exaggeration, 50% of the time it’ll land on the victim, and Hunter’s Ward is Totally Invisible! No glowy chains, no red circle – NOTHING! IMO this makes it quite a serious bug that’s exacerbated for an already OP CC skill which lasts 6 friggin’ SECONDS. You know?!?

Anet,

Quite frankly, this is the kind of bugged situation that Should NOT have to wait for quarterly updates to remedy.

Krypto.2069:

time it’ll land on the victim, and Hunter’s Ward is Totally Invisible! No glowy chains, no red circle – NOTHING! IMO this makes it quite a serious bug that’s exacerbated for an already OP CC skill which lasts 6 friggin’ SECONDS. You know?!?

Just as bad in my opinion is the only way to escape it is by teleport. Stab, dodge, etc do nothing. No circles show up under a players feet to indicate they should dodge to avoid it either.

They created a new type of CC and gave it only to one elite class with virtually no mechanism for some classes to escape it. Of course it was also delivered on one of the strongest elites.

That’s the biggest annoyance. Not only being invisible but barely anything you can do to get out.

I’m usually not one to jump in on nerf threads but I have to agree, that invisible fence is literally and figuratively broken.

Willing to trade LB#5 for a 33% hp bump and an optional speed boost on guards.

If the leaked notes are true, it looks like CCs may be addressed in WvW with a big stab boost too.

As it stands right now (IMO) I feel DH is just about right. There is no single class other than reaper where its not a 50-50 chance of winning or losing against. Reaper however wrecks me every single time.

I run solo alot in wvw on my DH and I’m here to tell you that my condi mesmer is usually the one I switch to when I get tired of dying on my DH. She has great survivability.

I’ve stalemated against one ranger on my DH. We just couldn’t kill one another (good fight). Ranger is also my other favorite class and the binding roots elite ranger skill has tore my DH up in several pvp matches and in WvW.

But I also know why many are upset with it because I got stuck in “multiple” DH traps a few days ago and it was like being a ping pong ball tossed back and forth till it killed her. Yes that sucked.

DH traps are very easy to avoid and many players are able to negate every single one I drop in a fight. In PvP its more difficult to avoid them because they fit nicely on the capture point.

The other day in WvW I had one attack pulled on me that I just couldn’t get out of. Forgive me for not knowing what it was because I don’t have every class just yet or all of the new hybrid classes, but it was like a mini dust storm (slow moving) and every time I got up after it knocked me down it hit me again with another knockdown. I did have more than one player happily bag farming me at the time, but that attack was the worse I’ve dealt with thus far.

In my opinion if they start chipping away at DH there will be no more 50-50 for it and it will become as subpar as guardian was. I would fix the trap where only one could activate on a single player at a time however because it is not escapable even for a heavy class when more than two are dropped on a player.

Kamara.4187:

As it stands right now (IMO) I feel DH is just about right. There is no single class other than reaper where its not a 50-50 chance of winning or losing against. Reaper however wrecks me every single time.

Reapers should not be wrecking you on the trapper build so long as you don’t drop every trap in one spot and stand in the traps. Most of the time WoR followed quickly by Whirling Wrath will do the trick to burst them down. If they dodge or break the immobilize, go back to kiting and wait to line up True Shot. If it is heavy condi timing CoP can be a trick but otherwise the DH has the advantage as going in close triggers traps (best staggered) and ranging them is a suckers bet.

Straegen.2938:

Kamara.4187:

As it stands right now (IMO) I feel DH is just about right. There is no single class other than reaper where its not a 50-50 chance of winning or losing against. Reaper however wrecks me every single time.

Reapers should not be wrecking you on the trapper build so long as you don’t drop every trap in one spot and stand in the traps. Most of the time WoR followed quickly by Whirling Wrath will do the trick to burst them down. If they dodge or break the immobilize, go back to kiting and wait to line up True Shot. If it is heavy condi timing CoP can be a trick but otherwise the DH has the advantage as going in close triggers traps (best staggered) and ranging them is a suckers bet.

I’m playing the meta trap medi build on my DH, and I’m being honest here. Reapers wreck my world lol.
I am not the best pvper but I’m not the worse either. I average 50-50-ish for my rank which is not that high because I’ve only been doing pvp in GW2 after taking a break from WvW when I got frustrated over the golem rush.

I don’t want to play an OP class, I want to learn and play my class very well. That’s what I always loved about GW1. It wasn’t about the gear, it was how you played your build.

Yes even in Gw1 there was a flavor of the month, but that wasn’t my thing back then to jump classes. I made a warrior in prophesies and took her all the way to the last expansion. I did make a few other toons but none of them had the miles that I put on that warrior.

GW2 has been different for me. Here I’ve made several avatars, and I like all of them but I mainly play the Ranger, mesmer, and DH. I also have a warrior, thief/daredevil (new), Rev (also new), and a up coming necro, and engi.

Every one of them have been a blast to play, but there is also a factor of what works best for a player and their play style. I’m very aware that I may not have found the best fit for me yet out of the classes. So this is not about defending my favorite. I’m just trying to give an honest opinion.

BTW ty for the tip. I will try to practice that and see if it turns my luck around a little

Please nerf the baby gates. Not only does the visibility issue need to be fixed, but six seconds is entirely too much.

Kamara.4187:

Yes even in Gw1 there was a flavor of the month, but that wasn’t my thing back then to jump classes. I made a warrior in prophesies and took her all the way to the last expansion. I did make a few other toons but none of them had the miles that I put on that warrior.

The Guardian is not only a flavor of the month but has been a go-to class since release. The class used to be primarily zerg fighters and had modest performance in smaller scale fights. This was a solid balance. Great in some areas, weak in others. Now Guardians/DH are pretty much dominant in all facets of fighting. They effectively have no weak points outside of a handful of specific builds. They do everything too well.

All classes need to have shortfalls otherwise everyone gravitates to one class and the meta becomes stale. This is what is happening with Guardians and DH. So many players run them now it is nearly impossible to get into a fight and not have a significant portion of the fighters playing one class often one build.

DH cant beat any elite spec than DD.

Mesmers first

I find Hunters ward to be the most annoying, the duration and effects can be frustrating but its made worse with the lack of visuals. You get hit/caught in it, without even realizing it until you start constantly falling and unable to move.

Straegen.2938:

Kamara.4187:

Yes even in Gw1 there was a flavor of the month, but that wasn’t my thing back then to jump classes. I made a warrior in prophesies and took her all the way to the last expansion. I did make a few other toons but none of them had the miles that I put on that warrior.

The Guardian is not only a flavor of the month but has been a go-to class since release. The class used to be primarily zerg fighters and had modest performance in smaller scale fights. This was a solid balance. Great in some areas, weak in others. Now Guardians/DH are pretty much dominant in all facets of fighting. They effectively have no weak points outside of a handful of specific builds. They do everything too well.

All classes need to have shortfalls otherwise everyone gravitates to one class and the meta becomes stale. This is what is happening with Guardians and DH. So many players run them now it is nearly impossible to get into a fight and not have a significant portion of the fighters playing one class often one build.

I disagree. Guardian before DH was pretty easy to own by most classes in a 1v1. Burn guard did improve them and I would go so far as to say it was a bit op, but DH is about 50-50 in a 1v1 against most classes right now. They are not op and I die daily to many in a 1v1, but at least now I also win a few.

So what if it has been viable since the start of the game? Only means anet has done something right with the balance of it.

I don’t see DH as OP but the Hunters Ward being visible would be a nice fix. Other than that, don’t see any problems.

What? Why pick on Guardians? What about eles? Are they actually not excellent at anything? Reapers aren’t far behind.

Also, Guardians haven’t escaped all nerfs. Virtues range was cut to 600. Dodge heals are utter trash thanks to the stat/trait split. Might of the protector has a cooldown now. Guardians are also the only class that must wear traveler runes if they don’t want to fall asleep roaming.

Hunter’s Ward IS stupid, but fixing stability would go a long way. The other thing that needs toning down is spear of justice as it is unstoppable with zero tell. Reflects shut down about 1/2 of what a DH can do in bigger fights, though.

Despite being a major problem in WvW, Dragonhunter will likely never see any important changes until it can find a meta role in sPvP. Stuff like the duration of LB5 and the lack of counterplay for Hunter’s Verdict are real issues to be addressed, but Anet would have to reconsider how they balance the game in order for this to be finally sorted.

ArchonWing.9480:

Guardians are also the only class that must wear traveler runes if they don’t want to fall asleep roaming.

Tell that to my non chronomancer power shatter mesmer =(

ArchonWing.9480:

Hunter’s Ward IS stupid, but fixing stability would go a long way. The other thing that needs toning down is spear of justice as it is unstoppable with zero tell. Reflects shut down about 1/2 of what a DH can do in bigger fights, though.

I’d argue a 6s CC is way too much and toning the time down would be better. Agreed on SoJ and I think WoR is just way too good. I’d like to see the base virtue resolve and WoR have the same CD but somewhere between the two values as 50s for virtue of resolve always felt a tad high.

apharma.3741:

ArchonWing.9480:

Guardians are also the only class that must wear traveler runes if they don’t want to fall asleep roaming.

Tell that to my non chronomancer power shatter mesmer =(

ArchonWing.9480:

Hunter’s Ward IS stupid, but fixing stability would go a long way. The other thing that needs toning down is spear of justice as it is unstoppable with zero tell. Reflects shut down about 1/2 of what a DH can do in bigger fights, though.

I’d argue a 6s CC is way too much and toning the time down would be better. Agreed on SoJ and I think WoR is just way too good. I’d like to see the base virtue resolve and WoR have the same CD but somewhere between the two values as 50s for virtue of resolve always felt a tad high.

Well, at least mesmers have a very good choice. But it’s somewhat true that I’d never go back to base mesmer as a result. Unfortunately they have decided to use elite specs to “balance” things which means base classes aren’t even part of the equation.

Hunter’s Ward also wouldn’t be as bad if you could actually SEE the kitten ed thing. And it should not knock you back like a ring of warding. And yea the two resolve values could be a bit more balanced. Base resolve is pretty sad if not traited.

WoR isn’t too bad given comparable reflects I would say actually, But SoJ is definitely overtuned. What is HoT’s obsession with unblockable?

Simonoly.4352:

Despite being a major problem in WvW, Dragonhunter will likely never see any important changes until it can find a meta role in sPvP. Stuff like the duration of LB5 and the lack of counterplay for Hunter’s Verdict are real issues to be addressed, but Anet would have to reconsider how they balance the game in order for this to be finally sorted.

Probably impossible to resolve if you ask me. DH is not seen in high pvp, from what I’ve been told, and while “good” in pve, they’re not considered anything that special. Split balance would save a lot of elite specs, really.

ArchonWing.9480:

What? Why pick on Guardians? What about eles? Are they actually not excellent at anything? Reapers aren’t far behind.

Also, Guardians haven’t escaped all nerfs. Virtues range was cut to 600. Dodge heals are utter trash thanks to the stat/trait split. Might of the protector has a cooldown now. Guardians are also the only class that must wear traveler runes if they don’t want to fall asleep roaming.

Hunter’s Ward IS stupid, but fixing stability would go a long way. The other thing that needs toning down is spear of justice as it is unstoppable with zero tell. Reflects shut down about 1/2 of what a DH can do in bigger fights, though.

Do pls play an ele…I will kill you with my eyes covered while lying on my bed, stretching my arm while holding a stick to reach the keyboard..or even better I will let my cat play and he will kill you…

Made a guardian, haven’t got DH yet and killed people with ease…no major effort playing med guard…ofc I’m not asking for nerfs ( why should I?) but do pls play a kittening ele , I’ll use another profession..I will kill you blindfolded as I’ve said)

Go on..make an ele and find me a single viable roaming build that doesn’t end up being a healbot with zero dmg

It’s not just Hunter’s Ward, gravity well has the same amount of stability stripping and can be chained as well

@Supreme Okay… I’ll just take your word on it then. I didn’t realized eles had gone downhill in roaming.

@ Infusion. Well, Gravity Well has a 900 range, and if you manage to stunbreak out before the last beat you can get out largely unscathed. Not saying it’s okay either, but I think it’s not as badly designed.

Straegen.2938:

Guardians have somehow managed to escape a nerf-ageddon that has hit nearly every class at some point over the years. This despite it being one of if not the most heavily used classes since the launch of the game. Simply put the Guardian has always been a top class in some form.

Won’t talk about the DragonHunter because I do believe you’re somewhat right on that. But, the reason for that the Guardian has never been nerfed is simply because it’s always been the most balanced class in game.

Sure there have been instances where some builds have been kind of OP but there has always been a hard counter to it.

Simply put, if you’ve been wrecked by a Guardian in the past it’s because you didn’t have the right counter to his gamestyle or you’re just bad. Sorry to say.

There have been other classes that have been used as much as Guardian in WvW, and this is because they fill a very specific and important roll. Take the Elementalist, it’s very much needed for it’s water and firefields. Then you have the Mesmer with it’s veil, portal, nullfield. Warriors have banners, condi cleanse, blasts etc. Necromancers have their wells, and are also used in focus parties along with the thief, which also can give stealth to the parties.

It’s not a matter of the Guardian being OP or anything, it’s quite the contrary. The DragonHunter on the other hand is a different matter. But then again, all the Elite Specilizations are on steroids. Reapers, Chronomancers, TEMPEST, they all are very much better than their older counterparts. Doesn’t have anything to do with the Guardian though.

Sorry for rant. Much Love <3

They just need to make DH LB 5 more visible and I’m sure most people would be happy.

L Step.8659:

They just need to make DH LB 5 more visible and I’m sure most people would be happy.

That and lower the duration of the chains, 6 seconds is to long

ArchonWing.9480:

@Supreme Okay… I’ll just take your word on it then. I didn’t realized eles had gone downhill in roaming.

@ Infusion. Well, Gravity Well has a 900 range, and if you manage to stunbreak out before the last beat you can get out largely unscathed. Not saying it’s okay either, but I think it’s not as badly designed.

And Gravity Well is an Elite not a weapon skill.

Not sure where you get this… me roaming my DH really doesn’t work well. I really need other classes working as a havoc group for him to be effective. Warrior, Scrapper, Necro, Mesmer… reasonably spec’d and a little lucky have no problems taking me down solo.

Ranger, now sped’ with Druid is a lot more survivable (with Glyphs), and still can have good DPS with longbow. That’s my goto class for PvP and the only one where I have a positive win/loss ratio.

So, I’d love to know how it is people can make their DH’s so disturbingly tough; I haven’t managed it.

Guardians/DH, time for a bat to the knee

Nooo! We’re already so slow without Travelers ! >_<

Agreed with the rest, hunters ward must die etc.

I always laugh when I look at the skills available to a DH:

A heavy armor class with great sustain, powerful ranged abilities, tremendous CC, a target pull…

Then I look at my warrior and log off.

grifflyman.8102:

Then I look at my warrior

Well, that’s where the problem is.

Although I find it very annoying that these elites were touted as another way to play, yet they’re so dominant and apparently balance is being conducted around these elites (base classes aren’t really tinkered with) that it does in fact, make them mandatory.

joneirikb.7506:

Guardians/DH, time for a bat to the knee

Nooo! We’re already so slow without Travelers ! >_<

Agreed with the rest, hunters ward must die etc.

Wtb speed for guardians

Nah hunters ward doesnt need to die lol, just needs some tweaking. Make the visuals actual work properly, and lower the control duration in half. That should bring it in line, 6 second control effect is ridiculous.

lujate.5432:

ArchonWing.9480:

@Supreme Okay… I’ll just take your word on it then. I didn’t realized eles had gone downhill in roaming.

@ Infusion. Well, Gravity Well has a 900 range, and if you manage to stunbreak out before the last beat you can get out largely unscathed. Not saying it’s okay either, but I think it’s not as badly designed.

And Gravity Well is an Elite not a weapon skill.

That’s an odd argument since the other skills available as an elite for Chrono do not have such a profound effect in fights of 15+ people:

Time Warp
Mass Invisibility
Signet of Humility / Moa

What Gravity Well loses in range it makes up for in the short cast time and the ability to chain 2 of them

Also, a dark field is not always ideal.

What’s odd about pointing out that Gravity Well is an elite skill?