Guild Wars 2

Having seen the new Stronghold trailer and read the early indications its a new 5v5 game-mode, I’d like to strongly ask Anet as to why the current GvG scene has been ignored for the 3rd year running?

Since the early days of RG, Votf, CoN etc… we’ve developed a strong and popular fighting format based around 15v15 or 20v20. That is what GvG means in a GW2 context. Yes GW1 gvg was fun, but every guild (that can actually fight :P) in GW2 has been playing a new exciting format for 2.5 years (and had to ‘unofficially’ support itself).

Does ANET not realise many server communities hang by a thread as it is, with relations between PPT and GvG guilds pretty much killing the experience. You had the opportunity to bring something to the table that’d reconcile some of those differences… but no you wiffed… GG

Anyone who says the new OS is enough hasn’t had to wait a whole evening for their turn to fight.

The biggest thing I don’t understand is you did the whole ‘Adopt a Dev’ initative. Grouch even went to dF (and had a great time). Where did the feedback that WvW is a diverse game-mode but doesn’t have the features to satisfy the player-base in the long-term go? Instead we got siege disablers? (srsly though -.-).

It wouldn’t even be that hard… a medium sized map with a slightly re-designed version of the ready-check you give players in spvp to indicate a fight-resolved gg call, have that trigger a simple score-board and leave it as first to 5 rounds. Not really that hard surely?

Either way, you could at the very least acknowledge there’s clearly an under-represented part of your competitive community. Honestly, you should do something…you’ve got an A+ fighting-system going to waste.

Player-created content doesn’t get special consideration by company whose game they’ve eked out a niche in – world stunned.

Where’s the special content for the culture of jumping puzzle ambushers? What about the harvesting farmers who brave enemy borderlands in search of carrots while under fire?

WHEN WILL THEY BE HEARD?!

Rimmy.9217:

Player-created content doesn’t get special consideration by company whose game they’ve eked out a niche in – world stunned.

Where’s the special content for the culture of jumping puzzle ambushers? What about the harvesting farmers who brave enemy borderlands in search of carrots while under fire?

WHEN WILL THEY BE HEARD?!

Those players make up either a very small portion of the player base & or a very annoying portion.

Larger scale coordinated PvP AKA GvG however has had a ton of people asking for it to become a real thing, not just something player sponsored.

Again…

HoT is NOT OUT YET.

WAIT and THEN QQ. Kitten… Since when is it custom to complain about something with almost no information on it>>>>>>?????

Ragnar the Rock.3174:

Rimmy.9217:

Player-created content doesn’t get special consideration by company whose game they’ve eked out a niche in – world stunned.

Where’s the special content for the culture of jumping puzzle ambushers? What about the harvesting farmers who brave enemy borderlands in search of carrots while under fire?

WHEN WILL THEY BE HEARD?!

Those players make up either a very small portion of the player base & or a very annoying portion.

Larger scale coordinated PvP AKA GvG however has had a ton of people asking for it to become a real thing, not just something player sponsored.

So, the biggest player base in GW2 is PvE, can we agree on that? A statistically tiny slice of the player base is WvW, and a slice is also both.

Of that tiny slice there’s a subset, not even on all servers, who occasionally get together to play PvP with more people than the official PvP maps hold.

Since they’ve managed it for this long, I can’t see how there’d be any real priority to do anything about it, especially as it’s an unsupported game mode and there’s plenty of supported ones that need attention.

In my opinion Anet doesn’t want to improve the GvG experience in WvW for 1 main reason, it would drive away some of the few people that still play PvP.

By the information we have you’ll be able to run Stronghold up to 10v10 in custom arenas. What is the problem here?

Do you think it should be you who decides what the competitive player count should be?

I hope with the word of GvG you don’t actually mean just 25vs25 or something similar till one of the groups get wiped.
GvG in guild wars has always been something different from that http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guild_versus_Guild.
I don’t think Anet will ever support the GvG you are probably referring to.

sander.5830:

I hope with the word of GvG you don’t actually mean just 25vs25 or something similar till one of the groups get wiped.
GvG in guild wars has always been something different from that http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guild_versus_Guild.
I don’t think Anet will ever support the GvG you are probably referring to.

Yeah there are some serious differences in who and what the GvG community is.

Novuake.2691:

Again…

HoT is NOT OUT YET.

WAIT and THEN QQ. Kitten… Since when is it custom to complain about something with almost no information on it>>>>>>?????

^
Latest trend, “I don’t know what I’m getting but I saw the corner of the box and I don’t like the color!”

And lets be honest here, the GvG crowd is 1% of the WvW community, and that’s being generous. The WvW community is 5% of the game’s total. They’re a tiny, excessively noisy sub-culture in Anet’s game which DOES have 2 quite similar pvp experiences they already sanction…

They’ve already gotten Obsidian Sanctum. I mean kitten ..

The BvB that people have started calling GvG is not actual GvG.

GvG is the mode that was available in GW1. Something that they are giving us a more advanced version of with HoT.

LetoII.3782:

^
Latest trend, “I don’t know what I’m getting but I saw the corner of the box and I don’t like the color!”

And lets be honest here, the GvG crowd is 1% of the WvW community, and that’s being generous. The WvW community is 5% of the game’s total. They’re a tiny, excessively noisy sub-culture in Anet’s game which DOES have 2 quite similar pvp experiences they already sanction…

They’ve already gotten Obsidian Sanctum. I mean kitten ..

This “trend” need to stop. I am sure its kitten ed demoralizing for ANET staff to have their hard earned work bloody shot down before its even available.

Hell its even making me a little demoralized for the state of humanity and this games community…

lordkrall.7241:

The BvB that people have started calling GvG is not actual GvG.

GvG is the mode that was available in GW1. Something that they are giving us a more advanced version of with HoT.

I wouldn’t be so quick to call it an advanced version.

Deli.1302:

I wouldn’t be so quick to call it an advanced version.

It have the whole standard thing (the match ends when the enemy lord is killed) and adds stuff on top of that.

Isn’t that the very definition of an advanced version?

Novuake.2691:

LetoII.3782:

^
Latest trend, “I don’t know what I’m getting but I saw the corner of the box and I don’t like the color!”

And lets be honest here, the GvG crowd is 1% of the WvW community, and that’s being generous. The WvW community is 5% of the game’s total. They’re a tiny, excessively noisy sub-culture in Anet’s game which DOES have 2 quite similar pvp experiences they already sanction…

They’ve already gotten Obsidian Sanctum. I mean kitten ..

This “trend” need to stop. I am sure its kitten ed demoralizing for ANET staff to have their hard earned work bloody shot down before its even available.

Hell its even making me a little demoralized for the state of humanity and this games community…

You should know better than to judge either by reading official forums

Tom Gore.4035:

You should know better than to judge either by reading official forums

Hahah very valid point! Starting to get to me…

I’d be happy with just a leaderboard with the guilds on it. I’m fine with OS, the windmill and the middle island at south camp.

The leaderboard will make it seem more official

lordkrall.7241:

Deli.1302:

I wouldn’t be so quick to call it an advanced version.

It have the whole standard thing (the match ends when the enemy lord is killed) and adds stuff on top of that.

Isn’t that the very definition of an advanced version?

If we can learn something from GW2 PvP history is that everything compared to GW1 is a downgrade, I bet GvG will be the same.

lightson.2310:

I’d be happy with just a leaderboard with the guilds on it. I’m fine with OS, the windmill and the middle island at south camp.

The leaderboard will make it seem more official

You do know that the leaderboard is coming, right? It’s obviously going to be only for the Stronghold, of course, because measuring any WvW “GvG” would be impossible.

lordkrall.7241:

The BvB that people have started calling GvG is not actual GvG.

GvG is the mode that was available in GW1. Something that they are giving us a more advanced version of with HoT.

And stupidest argument of the year award goes to…..

Are we going to say that sPvP isn’t a real game-mode, because Battlefield were using the name “Conquest” first?

Are we going to say that jumping puzzles aren’t a real thing, because Mario totally did that years ago?

Ragnar.4257:

lordkrall.7241:

The BvB that people have started calling GvG is not actual GvG.

GvG is the mode that was available in GW1. Something that they are giving us a more advanced version of with HoT.

And stupidest argument of the year award goes to…..

Are we going to say that sPvP isn’t a real game-mode, because Battlefield were using the name “Conquest” first?

Are we going to say that jumping puzzles aren’t a real thing, because Mario totally did that years ago?

Just because you made a 25 vs 25 TDM for guilds doesn’t mean you’re entitled to the GvG format.

In PvP you’re also playing TDM and Conquest, so both forms can be GvG.

However, as I’m a GW1 player I support the GW1 format of GvG.
Kill enemy guilds lord, game won.

Byron.1902:

I’d like to strongly ask Anet as to why the current GvG scene has been ignored for the 3rd year running?

It hasn’t been ignored for the third year running, they built the arena in obsidian sanctum for “GvG”, it hasn’t been any more ignored than many other communities such as the RP community.

Byron.1902:

Since the early days of RG, Votf, CoN etc… we’ve developed a strong and popular fighting format based around 15v15 or 20v20.

It isn’t popular, WvW is a minority of the playerbase, and of that segment only a minority engage in GvG, nor would I describe it as strong the rate at which GvG guilds disintegrate, re-form, etc, is well interesting.

You also miss out the problems of “GvG” which make Anet supporting it as a gamemode an issue, such as the class balance which is absolutely terrible and doesn’t change because essentially the game breaks in large groups which makes certain classes OP and others too weak, engies & rangers basically do not exist in it, thieves & mesmers have been permanently underepresentated, the other four classes have been permanently overrepresentated, why should they waste time on a game mode that certain classes basically can’t play?

zinkz.7045:

Byron.1902:

I’d like to strongly ask Anet as to why the current GvG scene has been ignored for the 3rd year running?

It hasn’t been ignored for the third year running, they built the arena in obsidian sanctum for “GvG”, it hasn’t been any more ignored than many other communities such as the RP community.

Byron.1902:

Since the early days of RG, Votf, CoN etc… we’ve developed a strong and popular fighting format based around 15v15 or 20v20.

It isn’t popular, WvW is a minority of the playerbase, and of that segment only a minority engage in GvG, nor would I describe it as strong the rate at which GvG guilds disintegrate, re-form, etc, is well interesting.

You also miss out the problems of “GvG” which make Anet supporting it as a gamemode an issue, such as the class balance which is absolutely terrible and doesn’t change because essentially the game breaks in large groups which makes certain classes OP and others too weak, engies & rangers basically do not exist in it, thieves & mesmers have been permanently underepresentated, the other four classes have been permanently overrepresentated, why should they waste time on a game mode that certain classes basically can’t play?

Engi is the only class that isn’t seen in GvG’s, the rest are. lol

I love it when 20 people gang up on one, then the one tries to defend, and is utterly beaten to a pulp.

Stop qualifying the organised Blob vs Blob “CC spam in Soldier’s gear” GvG. It’s a disgrace for any GW1 player. Okay, some people can find that fun. Okay, it requires some form or organisation. Fine.

But man if you call sPvP a “failure”, there are no words to describe what an actual Blob vs Blob mode would be. The 3 videos Blu (was it him ?) tried to do to cover BvB matches are there as proof for how lame it will be.

Also people seem to vastly overestimate the community behind GvG, and understimate the number of players playing PvP now.

Guardian of Angels.9867:

Just because you made a 25 vs 25 TDM for guilds doesn’t mean you’re entitled to the GvG format.

In PvP you’re also playing TDM and Conquest, so both forms can be GvG.

However, as I’m a GW1 player I support the GW1 format of GvG.
Kill enemy guilds lord, game won.

NOT a GW1 player, but hell yes, the lord mechanic would add so much more gameplay possibilities.

Vermillion.4061:

Engi is the only class that isn’t seen in GvG’s, the rest are. lol

I’ve watched a few GvG’s lately, I’ve seen zero rangers (I’m on EU), I’ve seen one video of AGG (US guild) using a ranger, but it was as a bit of fun, against not very good guilds where the ranger was barely pressured (and still died), when I see TA, LaG, etc using rangers as standard in proper GvGs then rangers can be considered as actually being used, until then they are still out in the cold, like they have been for the last 2.5 years.

And if even by some miracle ranger does become standard it will be like thief/mes so will just marginally improve the class balance that will still be terrible with 5 or so guards for a single ranger, and GWEN classes making up 75% of the group whilst the other 4 are barely represented or non-existent.

GvG is purley made up thing by ppl who could not handle “hardcore” PvE. So there for ANet won’t support punch of rebel scum wanting to play there Glorious Empire….emmm there game the way it was not meant to be played.

All guild activetys and guild related stuff is superficial mambojambo whit no real game system.

Guardian of Angels.9867:

Ragnar.4257:

lordkrall.7241:

The BvB that people have started calling GvG is not actual GvG.

GvG is the mode that was available in GW1. Something that they are giving us a more advanced version of with HoT.

And stupidest argument of the year award goes to…..

Are we going to say that sPvP isn’t a real game-mode, because Battlefield were using the name “Conquest” first?

Are we going to say that jumping puzzles aren’t a real thing, because Mario totally did that years ago?

Just because you made a 25 vs 25 TDM for guilds doesn’t mean you’re entitled to the GvG format.

In PvP you’re also playing TDM and Conquest, so both forms can be GvG.

However, as I’m a GW1 player I support the GW1 format of GvG.
Kill enemy guilds lord, game won.

And you’re still getting hung up on the name.

It. Is. Just. A. Name.

Call it whatever you want, there are still a lot of people out there who enjoy it and wish it received some sort of support.

You could call 2 guilds competing to collect the most iron-ore GvG if you wanted. It. Is. Just. A. Name. You could call 2 guilds role-playing dolyak races GvG if you wanted. It. Is. Just. A. Name.

Just.

A.

Name.

The fact that GW1 had a game-mode called GvG doesn’t in any way invalidate what players in GW2 enjoy spending their time doing.

Ragnar.4257:

Guardian of Angels.9867:

Ragnar.4257:

lordkrall.7241:

The BvB that people have started calling GvG is not actual GvG.

GvG is the mode that was available in GW1. Something that they are giving us a more advanced version of with HoT.

And stupidest argument of the year award goes to…..

Are we going to say that sPvP isn’t a real game-mode, because Battlefield were using the name “Conquest” first?

Are we going to say that jumping puzzles aren’t a real thing, because Mario totally did that years ago?

Just because you made a 25 vs 25 TDM for guilds doesn’t mean you’re entitled to the GvG format.

In PvP you’re also playing TDM and Conquest, so both forms can be GvG.

However, as I’m a GW1 player I support the GW1 format of GvG.
Kill enemy guilds lord, game won.

And you’re still getting hung up on the name.

It. Is. Just. A. Name.

Call it whatever you want, there are still a lot of people out there who enjoy it and wish it received some sort of support.

You could call 2 guilds competing to collect the most iron-ore GvG if you wanted. It. Is. Just. A. Name. You could call 2 guilds role-playing dolyak races GvG if you wanted. It. Is. Just. A. Name.

Just.

A.

Name.

The fact that GW1 had a game-mode called GvG doesn’t in any way invalidate what players in GW2 enjoy spending their time doing.

So what’s your opinion?
So far you’re only countering players who claim GvG isn’t a 25 vs 25 TDM.

Guardian of Angels.9867:

So what’s your opinion?
So far you’re only countering players who claim GvG isn’t a 25 vs 25 TDM.

What I think he ment was “we don’t care how it’s called as long as it’s fun and engage the comunity in a form of competition that cannot be found elsewhere”

It’s a Guild vs Guild. You don’t like it ? it offends you ? your problem, you can go back defending your shiny circle from a decapper and forget about all this.

Guardian of Angels.9867:

Ragnar.4257:

Guardian of Angels.9867:

Ragnar.4257:

lordkrall.7241:

The BvB that people have started calling GvG is not actual GvG.

GvG is the mode that was available in GW1. Something that they are giving us a more advanced version of with HoT.

And stupidest argument of the year award goes to…..

Are we going to say that sPvP isn’t a real game-mode, because Battlefield were using the name “Conquest” first?

Are we going to say that jumping puzzles aren’t a real thing, because Mario totally did that years ago?

Just because you made a 25 vs 25 TDM for guilds doesn’t mean you’re entitled to the GvG format.

In PvP you’re also playing TDM and Conquest, so both forms can be GvG.

However, as I’m a GW1 player I support the GW1 format of GvG.
Kill enemy guilds lord, game won.

And you’re still getting hung up on the name.

It. Is. Just. A. Name.

Call it whatever you want, there are still a lot of people out there who enjoy it and wish it received some sort of support.

You could call 2 guilds competing to collect the most iron-ore GvG if you wanted. It. Is. Just. A. Name. You could call 2 guilds role-playing dolyak races GvG if you wanted. It. Is. Just. A. Name.

Just.

A.

Name.

The fact that GW1 had a game-mode called GvG doesn’t in any way invalidate what players in GW2 enjoy spending their time doing.

So what’s your opinion?
So far you’re only countering players who claim GvG isn’t a 25 vs 25 TDM.

Well, since you asked, I would very much like it if an official game-mode or leaderboard of some sort was introduced supporting what players in GW2 WvW have been calling GvG.

However, I wasn’t going to give that opinion until you asked, because it’s just farting into the wind on these forums. ANet aren’t going to support it because of “really interesting, very excite, definitely look at, not at this time, can’t say anything”. That’s been made clear repeatedly, so quit stressing.

I just post here because I have an uncontrollable reflex to call out bullkitten when I see it.

Ragnar.4257:

Guardian of Angels.9867:

Ragnar.4257:

Guardian of Angels.9867:

Ragnar.4257:

lordkrall.7241:

The BvB that people have started calling GvG is not actual GvG.

GvG is the mode that was available in GW1. Something that they are giving us a more advanced version of with HoT.

And stupidest argument of the year award goes to…..

Are we going to say that sPvP isn’t a real game-mode, because Battlefield were using the name “Conquest” first?

Are we going to say that jumping puzzles aren’t a real thing, because Mario totally did that years ago?

Just because you made a 25 vs 25 TDM for guilds doesn’t mean you’re entitled to the GvG format.

In PvP you’re also playing TDM and Conquest, so both forms can be GvG.

However, as I’m a GW1 player I support the GW1 format of GvG.
Kill enemy guilds lord, game won.

And you’re still getting hung up on the name.

It. Is. Just. A. Name.

Call it whatever you want, there are still a lot of people out there who enjoy it and wish it received some sort of support.

You could call 2 guilds competing to collect the most iron-ore GvG if you wanted. It. Is. Just. A. Name. You could call 2 guilds role-playing dolyak races GvG if you wanted. It. Is. Just. A. Name.

Just.

A.

Name.

The fact that GW1 had a game-mode called GvG doesn’t in any way invalidate what players in GW2 enjoy spending their time doing.

So what’s your opinion?
So far you’re only countering players who claim GvG isn’t a 25 vs 25 TDM.

Well since, you asked, I would very much like it if an official game-mode was introduced supporting what players in GW2 WvW have been calling GvG.

However, I wasn’t going to give that opinion until you asked, because it’s just farting into the wind on these forums. ANet aren’t going to support it because of “really interesting, very excite, definitely look at, not at this time, can’t say anything”. That’s been made clear repeatedly, so quit stressing.

I just post here because I have an uncontrollable reflex to call out bullkitten when I see it.

Thanks for your opinion, though when you’re calling out bullkittens keep an eye out that you don’t sound like some immature forum troll.

Thanks for clearing it up

That’s what ya get for queuing maps and doing nothing while stuff flips cause you’re busy in a “scrim”. I could care less about your GvG’s you have an obsidian sanctum arena for that, when ya bring it to home bl it becomes ever so boring for the defenders, who when they accidentally run into a fight get shouted at in /m, or who get told no when they ask for help holding a way-point. As a casual observer who enjoys watching these subjects devolve, I can only begin to guess that maybe anet possibly shares a view of indifference towards ya.

Oh btw, i love trebbing your fights, oh so very much.

VaaCrow.3076:

That’s what ya get for queuing maps and doing nothing while stuff flips cause you’re busy in a “scrim”. I could care less about your GvG’s you have an obsidian sanctum arena for that, when ya bring it to home bl it becomes ever so boring for the defenders, who when they accidentally run into a fight get shouted at in /m, or who get told no when they ask for help holding a way-point. As a casual observer who enjoys watching these subjects devolve, I can only begin to guess that maybe anet possibly shares a view of indifference towards ya.

Oh btw, i love trebbing your fights, oh so very much.

Then surely you would be in favour of giving guilds some official support so they aren’t on your precious maps?

Don’t say OS; 1 small space is not sufficient for 3 entire server’s worth of guilds.

LetoII.3782:

Novuake.2691:

Again…

HoT is NOT OUT YET.

WAIT and THEN QQ. Kitten… Since when is it custom to complain about something with almost no information on it>>>>>>?????

^
Latest trend, “I don’t know what I’m getting but I saw the corner of the box and I don’t like the color!”

And lets be honest here, the GvG crowd is 1% of the WvW community, and that’s being generous. The WvW community is 5% of the game’s total. They’re a tiny, excessively noisy sub-culture in Anet’s game which DOES have 2 quite similar pvp experiences they already sanction…

They’ve already gotten Obsidian Sanctum. I mean kitten ..

Practically every zergbusting (/fights) guild out there in wvw gvg’s.. or are you trying to tell me there are still people out there who think ppt means something

I asked about why he described guild teams and the new PvP game type and why he didn’t say the words ‘GvG’? He replied with multiple points. He said the GvG community is actually two groups that do not understand each other very well. One is the GW1 GvG and the other is the modern WvW style GvG. The modern WvW style GvG is something that could be a gametype of its own (sounded like he thinks it should but…). However, ANet doesn’t currently have enough resources for the three gametypes it currently has. The PvE, PvP, and WvW teams just don’t have as much resources as they really want to make them into the ideal version that they are dreaming of (in the time they want it in). They do not want to pull people off the 3 core features to create a 4th which would cause neglect for all 4 core features. As to whether or not the new PvP game type is going to be like the classic 8v8 GvG… they are not decided. They have play tested everything from 5v5 to 10v10. Nothing is set in stone yet for how the standardized setup will be, and likely will not be decided until enough beta testers comment on it. (HoT beta testing coming, no word on invites)

From http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/2tsiox/pax_afterparty_lessons_learned/

Ragnar.4257:

Are we going to say that jumping puzzles aren’t a real thing, because Mario totally did that years ago?

Yes, because Mario got better than portobello when he found a mushroom.

Rimmy.9217:

Player-created content doesn’t get special consideration by company whose game they’ve eked out a niche in – world stunned.

Where’s the special content for the culture of jumping puzzle ambushers? What about the harvesting farmers who brave enemy borderlands in search of carrots while under fire?

WHEN WILL THEY BE HEARD?!

It should be understood though that many other games have had Guild wars in the past and Guild vs Guild, and that is not a small scale battle, so many actually purchased this game thinking it would be like what most games consider to be guild wars. When most people think of Guild Wars and Guild Vs Guild, They think of the massive battles of the other games that existed prior to Anet naming their game “Guild Wars”. In other games with this mode of gameplay, you had battles with hundreds of players, you have battles with 40 vs 40, it was not 5 vs 5, most players who have been playing mmorpgs for quite some time, do not even consider 5 vs 5 a skirmish, little lone to be called a " guild vs guild".

Many actually purchased this game expecting it to have guild wars in it as what they consider to be guild wars in many other games and felt duped by the name and the hype. I am not aware of anyone who actually just purchased " Guild wars" for jumping puzzles, however, that is what you play Mario for. Guild Wars is sadly one of the games on the MMORPG market that doesn’t actually have “guild wars” in it ( as what was considered to be guild wars prior to Anet using that name). That is part of the problem. Personally, I would be happy if they removed all the jumping puzzles from the game and focused resources on actual “guild wars” instead of using a name that has nothing to do with the game itself.

Zetsumei.4975:

LetoII.3782:

Novuake.2691:

Again…

HoT is NOT OUT YET.

WAIT and THEN QQ. Kitten… Since when is it custom to complain about something with almost no information on it>>>>>>?????

^
Latest trend, “I don’t know what I’m getting but I saw the corner of the box and I don’t like the color!”

And lets be honest here, the GvG crowd is 1% of the WvW community, and that’s being generous. The WvW community is 5% of the game’s total. They’re a tiny, excessively noisy sub-culture in Anet’s game which DOES have 2 quite similar pvp experiences they already sanction…

They’ve already gotten Obsidian Sanctum. I mean kitten ..

Practically every zergbusting (/fights) guild out there in wvw gvg’s.. or are you trying to tell me there are still people out there who think ppt means something

Yes, but I think they all live on Tier 1. You have endless grueling fights where the winner gets the ppt, how it was actually meant to be played. I prefer the brawl to be over ppt, winner taking the spoils, at least there is a real battle for keeps and towers, even camps at times, unlike other tiers that just Ktrain instead. I think they would have to give best player loot ( chests ) in defending keeps and towers to resolve that issue on the lower servers.

It frigging hard find 20 players who you can stand and it’s even more harder find 20 players who you can stand and who are willing use lame specs and lame tactics.