Guild Wars 2

Now that the tournament is finished for a while , we are left here at FOW with dedicated but deflated wvw’s we are so outnumbered so many people have stopped playing.

The solution – you tell me we are in bronze and where devastated by the outnumbered classes we are a low population server who have been hit that much from beginning to end .
we are now almost non existent in wvw which is a real shame because for me it is my daily look forward to day … but this is fading rapidly !
Any suggestions on getting people back on to wvw ?

I got idea, transfer to another server.

Again, the low ranking servers have players but they have two problems.

1. Most of their players play in prime time, and
2. People bandwagon and stop playing if they die a bunch of times or their server is way behind

Merging full-in-prime time servers with full in prime time servers is not a solution.

Here is a solution:

Split the day into blocks, run a separate ranking for each block of time. That way a broad competitive scene can develop for prime time.

I think that maybe the Bronze League situation is different in NA and EU. In our bottom match-up, our 23rd and 20th level servers have been fighting hard for first place and even the though the third place server (24th) has been trailing quite a bit in in points, they’ve gotten waypointed keeps and have managed some nice captures from the other two servers. While each server has quiet periods with only a few people on, it’s not dead down here in NA and we have more people playing on ET than we’ve had in a while.

I didn’t realise when I first came back. But EOTM has completely sucked a huge amount of players out of WvW. The rewards across the board are better. There is short term matches. There is regular karma trains to attract casuals. There are casuals that attract organized guilds to come farm. From the numbers I am personally seeing, if you count “EOTM” as a part of “WvW” than I honestly thing WvW actually has more players then ever. The problem is EOTM is just supposed to be a side show for when WvW map caps are reached…

Well indeed eotm has done a lot of damage to main stream wvw – when it was indeed meant to be a stopping point when it was waiting to get onto your wvw servers but then the megaserver ended that issue.

But the eotm continued as it was originally built for and has had no changes to it.
So higher rewards and change of maps was so positive that people use it for a main game type – and for levelling up there alts.

Understandable may i add .

But perhaps now it needs looked at – perhaps a new approach is needed for the eotm to be used as a second type of wvw game that can be combined to the current wvw points system.
Perhaps a system where by if you are on a low server then the other 1-2 teams break down there numbers and transfer the over match to eotm so that it would be a lever playing field on actual wvw.

Maybe you have a even better idea! throw down your thoughts!
thanks..

nekretaal.6485:

Again, the low ranking servers have players but they have two problems.

1. Most of their players play in prime time, and
2. People bandwagon and stop playing if they die a bunch of times or their server is way behind

Merging full-in-prime time servers with full in prime time servers is not a solution.

---

Here is a solution:

Split the day into blocks, run a separate ranking for each block of time. That way a broad competitive scene can develop for prime time.

They could put weight on the ppt system, the more players online, the more ppt would be added.

Currently my server is winning due to heavy nightcapping, I don’t think a handful of players should be able to hold 100% of all four maps and add a huge chunk to our score.

nirvana.8245:

I didn’t realise when I first came back. But EOTM has completely sucked a huge amount of players out of WvW. The rewards across the board are better. There is short term matches. There is regular karma trains to attract casuals. There are casuals that attract organized guilds to come farm. From the numbers I am personally seeing, if you count “EOTM” as a part of “WvW” than I honestly thing WvW actually has more players then ever. The problem is EOTM is just supposed to be a side show for when WvW map caps are reached…

It’s not just rewards, although they are main motivation for many players. When our server is heavily outnumbered and enemy zerg of 40-50 chases me, a single person around the map, then eotm doesn’t look that bad (fun wise). Regular WvW has many sides that are not fun at all – who wants to spend hours sitting in a tower to scout or refresh siege. Since eotm is short term, people just don’t worry about these things.

How to save world v world on low server’s?

Removing the full status from uppers servers.

I agree with EOTM being a huge problem.

It should only be avaible when all maps are queued.

You mean:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Solution-to-fix-the-population-imbalance/page/25#post4492414
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Adapt-A-Dev-A-Wasted-Last-Chance/page/2#post4492402
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Scoring-Discussion/page/7#post4492179
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv/Fair-WvW/first#post4490852

Please read before you make new threads.
And read the news:
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/ready-up-23-updates-on-balance-skyhammer-the-world-tournament-series-and-the-wvw-fall-tournament/

urieldhynne.2743:

How to save world v world on low server’s?

Removing the uppers stacked servers.

FTFY

Jeknar.6184:

FTFY

Do we really want a refugee guild from a T1 server that can queue a map all by themselves transferring to our server? I’m happy with those who want T1 play having their T1 play. What I’d like to see are changes that make the lower tiers more competitive, not necessarily heavily populated.

Yeah because it’ll totally “solve” anything to make things more “competitive” between the 5/6 people on each side that are the whole population 18h a day right ? RIGHT ?

That’s what low tier servers lack, “competitive” gameplay, not people to at the very least have enough people to somewhat have more than 20 people/map 60+% of the day (and they are FARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR from that in EU at least).

Find a way to make low ranked server transfers cheaper. Supposedly, they already did so in a former patch, combined with population count. Obviously it didn’t turn things around dramatically as insane prices for losing servers are still insane prices.

The eotm sucking up population from wvw? Even i prefer eotm if it’s just exp and farming i want. The rewards in the map are just too good compared to other maps. champions here, champions there. That means exp here, exp there, loot here, loot there. Plus the attribute that people in eotm most often DO NOT WANT TO DEFEND. This promotes capping and capping and capping and capping and capping and capping and wooops, green is at our keep? who cares! capping and capping and capping. more exp this way. There’s no reward on defending. It’s not the homeborders where an upgraded garri at stake actually has IMPORTANCE. so why defend? just cap. again, more rewards, and none to break the trend.

Filovirus.6258:

Yeah because it’ll totally “solve” anything to make things more “competitive” between the 5/6 people on each side that are the whole population 18h a day right ? RIGHT ?

Maybe EU has that problem and could shed a few servers (it has more than NA), but things don’t look that bad in NA to me, even at the bottom.

godofcows.2451:

Find a way to make low ranked server transfers cheaper.

There is a person who posted on Reddit who wants to transfer to Eredon Terrace with his wife (to join some other players from his server that have already transferred and are having fun) and the main thing holding him back with that it will cost him around $45 to transfer them both. Why is it so expensive to transfer to the 23rd ranked server?

Merge Servers please, so we can all move on with our lives…

Jeknar.6184:

urieldhynne.2743:

How to save world v world on low server’s?

Removing the uppers stacked servers.

FTFY

I wrote “Removing the full status from uppers servers” because is what Arenanet did few days ago.

IMO that was a terribad idea. At least 10 people I know transferred to BG.

There was a increase in the price of gems, because LOT of people was buying. And I don’t think so for spend it is low tiers transfers.

Berk.8561:

Do we really want a refugee guild from a T1 server that can queue a map all by themselves transferring to our server? I’m happy with those who want T1 play having their T1 play. What I’d like to see are changes that make the lower tiers more competitive, not necessarily heavily populated.

There is no such guild anywhere in GW2…

Jeknar.6184:

There is no such guild anywhere in GW2…

In the past, there were guilds that claimed they could do it. Have they all moved on or decayed or was that never really true?

Berk.8561:

In the past, there were guilds that claimed they could do it. Have they all moved on or decayed or was that never really true?

I played on BG during the golden days of GW2, and I personally never seen one.

If EotM is more attractive than WvW then it should be thought why this is so.

Rewards are probably one thing, but the possibility to play without voice com (not having to hear a commander is a very nice thing for 90% of the WvW-commanders), irrelevance of the bad scoring, filled instead of empty maps (as I play mostly in the morning, I had to notice that I have more fights in EotM than in WvW even in T2), escape from imbalanced matches, no need to waste money on upgrading, no need to waste time on scouting, … are probably others.

So don’t ask to shutdown EotM, ask how WvW could become more attractive, e.g. by replacing the borderland-maps in WvW with the EotM map. (As soon as people start defending towers and keeps the karma train wrecks immediately.) stop forcing people into voice com, stop shouting at the Zerg if something doesn’t work, stop being rude to up levels, …

@Dayra, you’re asking to Hardcores and Tryhards to be nice to Casuals… That never, ever, gonna happen…

This is the way i see it. If I want to make gold or an ascended set in a timely fashion then i need to leave wvw. If i don’t want to make gold or craft anything for any characters then i like to be in wvw.

Dayra.7405:

So don’t ask to shutdown EotM, ask how WvW could become more attractive, e.g. by replacing the borderland-maps in WvW with the EotM map.

Please NO.

I am not the only person who utterly hates the EotM map. The colors are unbalanced. The map is full of gimmicks, distracting visual effects and has too long travel time and way too many champion NPCs (farming them = main reason why people play EotM). EotM is a nightmare for roamers, perfect for fear necros, especially against opponents who don’t have stability. It other words it is a pve karma train and a trolling map, similar design to Skyhammer, which is also widely hated in spvp/tpvp.

The best solution is to merge some low population servers. Offer players on those servers free transfers to medium population servers.

Many players are afraid that the top servers are nothing but a big blob. This is NOT true. Nobody forces you to join the blob. I play on EU rank 2 server. Here is a true story from a busy reset evening (I cannot reveal which match up). Me + 1 another Desolation player went far behind enemy lines, sniped all the enemy players, dolyaks, camp, sneak captured their tower. It turned out to be defended, but still with just 2 players, we get rid of the opposition and captured the tower. I was not playing a thief, mesmer, warrior nor a condi bunker, but a balanced build. Outside the reset evening + prime time many maps often have just few players. The players on other servers might have a different experience.

PS. WvWvW can be profitable. I made enough gold to fully equip one character with ascended gear (weapons, armor, runes, sigils etc) in about 2 months of WvWvW, about 1-4 hours WvWvW per day. During those 2 months I spent just 1.5 h in EotM and hated every second of it, despite those many champion bags. Now I am in good track getting my 3rd character full ascended, almost solely from WvWvW.

Here are quick tips to get rich in WvWvW: flip a lot of stuff (camps, towers). Tag every tower, keep, StoneMist by killing at least 3-4 guards of it solo. Then you are guaranteed to get gold reward, once it flips. Join those EU gold league blob fights where enemies die like flies and AoE spam as much as you can, better yet, build tons of sup ACs and have full mastery on it and man one. You will get gazillion loot bags in a snap. Play on those maps where you are outnumbered (the buff helps). With these tips you should get around 2-3 g/h and sometimes 15 g/h if you get lucky and get an exotic item with an expensive rune. I know it is less than pve dungeon farm, but still just max 400 h or so to get 1000 g = 1 ascended set.

Jeknar.6184:

@Dayra, you’re asking to Hardcores and Tryhards to be nice to Casuals… That never, ever, gonna happen…

Then the hardcores end being a bit lonely in WvW, whereas the Casuals enjoy EotM. Fine for me. I just do not understand, why the hardcore where asking above to get casuals back. Or are they just mising someone to shout at?

Jeknar.6184:

Berk.8561:

In the past, there were guilds that claimed they could do it. Have they all moved on or decayed or was that never really true?

I played on BG during the golden days of GW2, and I personally never seen one.

Several guilds were capable of it. On BG, it was KnT and ND, AoI on reset. TC had CERN. JQ had SF, SG, WvW, old school FoO and ATM. None of them can do that now and some of them are no longer around.

urieldhynne.2743:

Jeknar.6184:

urieldhynne.2743:

How to save world v world on low server’s?

Removing the uppers stacked servers.

FTFY

I wrote “Removing the full status from uppers servers” because is what Arenanet did few days ago.

IMO that was a terribad idea. At least 10 people I know transferred to BG.

There was a increase in the price of gems, because LOT of people was buying. And I don’t think so for spend it is low tiers transfers.

The increase in gem pricing has nothing to do with transfers (it’s too little in numbers to have any impact on the game really, unless Anet is lying and there is only like 10/20k people left playing total in this game….).

The gem price increase is the same as it has been for the past year or so, it spikes every time they release something in the Gem Store (specially skins, outfits, finishers, and a few other things) or there is promos.

The last gigantic spike was just before and during the last set of 10 days of promos, with gems going up to 18g for 100 from memory.

Then it went back to 11.50/12.50 average pretty fast.

It follows a cycle : Anet release something, price spike a lot, then go down slowly till it goes back to “normal”, Anet release something, rince and repeat.

There is a few variations from that mostly linked to seasonal events and such, and their awaited/expected promos and outfits and such.

Some people are already stacking up gems for Halloween, which explains the spike in price too.

Reverence.6915:

Jeknar.6184:

Berk.8561:

In the past, there were guilds that claimed they could do it. Have they all moved on or decayed or was that never really true?

I played on BG during the golden days of GW2, and I personally never seen one.

Several guilds were capable of it. On BG, it was KnT and ND, AoI on reset. TC had CERN. JQ had SF, SG, WvW, old school FoO and ATM. None of them can do that now and some of them are no longer around.

Pretty sure IRON from SOR in their prime (pre season 1) pulled it off a couple of times.

Otokomae.9356:

Merge Servers please, so we can all move on with our lives…

Pretty much. Like it seems pretty obvious thats what needs to happen. No matter what happens, someone isn’t going to be happy. Merging lower tier servers will effect the least amount of players.

nirvana.8245:

Otokomae.9356:

Merge Servers please, so we can all move on with our lives…

Pretty much. Like it seems pretty obvious thats what needs to happen. No matter what happens, someone isn’t going to be happy. Merging lower tier servers will effect the least amount of players.

Implement a fix that will impact a minority of players drastically and most not at all? An impermanent solution without a fix to the causes in the first place? Then what the kitten is being fixed, and why are you arguing for it?

omegazone.9254:

Now that the tournament is finished for a while , we are left here at FOW with dedicated but deflated wvw’s we are so outnumbered so many people have stopped playing.

The solution – you tell me we are in bronze and where devastated by the outnumbered classes we are a low population server who have been hit that much from beginning to end .
we are now almost non existent in wvw which is a real shame because for me it is my daily look forward to day … but this is fading rapidly !
Any suggestions on getting people back on to wvw ?

Certainly – don’t play for PPT.

If you have any sort of community left (as opposed to just random people that play WvW and don’t really speak to each other) then try to have events so that people can come out in a group (which matters if you’re out-populated) and have them run around together for a few hours. Have theme nights (all minion masters is a popular one) or set an objective (green garrison or bust!). You’ll get your WvW fix, develop stronger ties to each other, enjoy your time spent WvWing, and won’t burn out while your server settles into whatever Glicko backwater it’s heading to.

When my server dropped down to the bottom NA tier, we were in a similar situation. We’ve gone up six ranks in the past few months – things change. Eredon Terrace (also on NA) has remained strong (in spirit) throughout their time in the Glicko ghetto and, thanks to some hot transfer action, now seem to have steady coverage in places they were light before and are on the rise.

It passes. You’ll be okay.

NonToxic.9185:

nirvana.8245:

Otokomae.9356:

Merge Servers please, so we can all move on with our lives…

Pretty much. Like it seems pretty obvious thats what needs to happen. No matter what happens, someone isn’t going to be happy. Merging lower tier servers will effect the least amount of players.

Implement a fix that will impact a minority of players drastically and most not at all? An impermanent solution without a fix to the causes in the first place? Then what the kitten is being fixed, and why are you arguing for it?

What did you even say there?

Should probably lock the borderlands and contain everyone in EB. Just throwin that out there. I dont really think it’s a good idea, cause i <3 borderlands, but unless the tales of emptiness are highly exaggerated, i think borderlands would spread a low server’s resources too thin for them to be effective anywhere..

Correct me if i’m wrong.

Hamster.4861:

Should probably lock the borderlands and contain everyone in EB. Just throwin that out there. I dont really think it’s a good idea, cause i <3 borderlands, but unless the tales of emptiness are highly exaggerated, i think borderlands would spread a low server’s resources too thin for them to be effective anywhere..

Correct me if i’m wrong.

Most servers have enough people to cover 2 maps. The problem is: Each server stay on its own borderland and on EBG… So you have 3 maps without action (because there are no enemies) and EBG.

Jeknar.6184:

Hamster.4861:

Should probably lock the borderlands and contain everyone in EB. Just throwin that out there. I dont really think it’s a good idea, cause i <3 borderlands, but unless the tales of emptiness are highly exaggerated, i think borderlands would spread a low server’s resources too thin for them to be effective anywhere..

Correct me if i’m wrong.

Most servers have enough people to cover 2 maps. The problem is: Each server stay on its own borderland and on EBG… So you have 3 maps without action (because there are no enemies) and EBG.

that’s exactly what i’m saying about being spread too thin! only recently has my server gotten to a point where we are able to field guilds on enemy borderlands, while having a full staffed defensive squad on our own borderlands. We’re edging our way up to T3 now, and we just got to the point where we have decently rounded coverage. I’m pretty familiar with the struggle though, having fought to bring my server up in ranking through education and promotion.

like i said, restraining everyone to EBG isnt a very good idea. I’d feel pretty cheated if it happened to me. But if it meant that there was EPIC BATTLE on the 1 map, then it would possibly be a worthwhile tradeoff

Hamster.4861:

like i said, restraining everyone to EBG isnt a very good idea. I’d feel pretty cheated if it happened to me. But if it meant that there was EPIC BATTLE on the 1 map, then it would possibly be a worthwhile tradeoff

The problem is: If there is people to cover 2 maps, and you restrain everyone to one, you will have queues… I wouldn’t trade my queue free server for a epic battle which I most likely would stay out of…

The concept of merging servers from lower tier that ALL have players on at the same timezone is flawed. ( ie all NA prime )

If you wish to equalise servers, T1/T2 have to be the servers deleted so that a decent spread of off hour players are in the move.

My preference would be deletion of all servers and redo the entire structure.

elkirin.8534:

The concept of merging servers from lower tier that ALL have players on at the same timezone is flawed. ( ie all NA prime )

If you wish to equalise servers, T1/T2 have to be the servers deleted so that a decent spread of off hour players are in the move.

My preference would be deletion of all servers and redo the entire structure.

Breaking up the T1 servers could possibly help spread the player base over off hours for some of the other tiers but T2 may not have enough to make a difference.

The difference between T1 and T2 is insane. Like Stephen Hawking teaching toddlers how to twerk, insane.

Why do everybody think those guilds and players from T1 will spread on other servers? Those players are on T1 because they wanted to stack up.
In less than month there will be another “t1” stacked servers.

Hule.8794:

Why do everybody think those guilds and players from T1 will spread on other servers? Those players are on T1 because they wanted to stack up.
In less than month there will be another “t1” stacked servers.

Truth! Maybe, just maybe this is where alliances could play a part. Maybe if you are part of an alliance you can step down to lower tiers from time to time to bolster numbers. This could be similar to server guesting but for like an hour or so.
It would have to be per guild and limited to one guild per server from the same server of the same tier. <- I’m not sure if that sentence makes any sense. o.0

Delete bottom 8ish servers, free transfers for those affected. It’s a win, win.

Do we know the average player count for all the servers? I mean as far as WvW population. If that info is public then this could be solved easily, methinks.

Another great idea to get players into wvw would be to release a Cantha themed wvw map similar to Bukdek Byway and the other surrounding zones from GW1 but on a much grander scale. Catwalks, rooftops, balconys, sewers, dark alleyways, etc… Also, no siege allowed, PPK only (maybe some boobytraps). However, this map, unlike EotM would actually count towards server scoring. I would never leave this map.

accept the fact that WvW is dying/dead

Rimmy.9217:

When my server dropped down to the bottom NA tier, we were in a similar situation. We’ve gone up six ranks in the past few months – things change. Eredon Terrace (also on NA) has remained strong (in spirit) throughout their time in the Glicko ghetto and, thanks to some hot transfer action, now seem to have steady coverage in places they were light before and are on the rise.

We’ve gone up, hit a wall, lost some people, went back down, got some more people, and now going back up again. I’m good with it all. And I have fun winning or losing most of the time because there is always something even one person can do (solo camps, upgrade and defend what you’ve got, pick off lone enemies, etc.). Make it about doing the best with what you’ve got rather than winning. That said, I do think some sort of score handicapping or incentive to show up when losing is inevitable could improve participation.

Flyphish.6398:

Delete bottom 8ish servers, free transfers for those affected. It’s a win, win.

Delete top 6-9 servers, free transfer for those affected. It’s a win,win.

Hule.8794:

Why do everybody think those guilds and players from T1 will spread on other servers? Those players are on T1 because they wanted to stack up.
In less than month there will be another “t1” stacked servers.

If course it only makes sense AFTER a realistic (based on counting who plays WvW) WvW-team capacity restriction below T1 capacityy is in place, I.e. they do not fit all together into one team anymore.

If such a restriction does not exist or the intended capacity is above t1 size splitting T1 servers doesn’t make sense.

If most server are only able to fill 2 maps and less outside prime, maybe it would be good to restrict WvW matches to 2 maps (EB and something new/rebalanced EotM/ merged borderlands) in prime and 1 in off time (not even EU t1 can fill 1 map completely during night or early morning)

Jeknar.6184:

Flyphish.6398:

Delete bottom 8ish servers, free transfers for those affected. It’s a win, win.

Delete top 6-9 servers, free transfer for those affected. It’s a win,win.

I see a lot of posts from low tier servers saying they don’t want to deal with large battles in higher tiers. From my experience visiting several servers over EU and NA, it’s only when you get to tier 4 that you get even medium sized battles frequently. That means that merging the bottom few servers will only bolster WvW participation as more people in WvW only makes more people want to participate. Those who want to roam alone are in the minority by a large percent.

The real problem with low tier servers though, is the “fair weather” problem. Many servers (ET included prior to transfers – my experience on ET for a week a few months back showed me a large population of 50+ on EBG every night but no one working together) have a LOT of players that simply don’t show up if the matchup isn’t in their favour. This makes unbalanced matchups even more lopsided and simply snowballs from there.

Jeknar.6184:

Flyphish.6398:

Delete bottom 8ish servers, free transfers for those affected. It’s a win, win.

Delete top 6-9 servers, free transfer for those affected. It’s a win,win.

Vastly more people WvW on the top 3 tiers, why disrupt more people when you can roll the dead server players into the more active tiers. Minimal disruption and we get fewer threads about how dead it is down in T8.

In the meantime, help yourselves. Transfer to a server with action during your normal playtime…it’s an obvious solution. Then you will be in game playing and not trying to imagine ways to “revive” a server, which in the end is pointless because the limited population will always be a barrier.

If you like low population, stay…it’s really simple.