Guild Wars 2

Anyone noticing a big drop in WvW population in his server ?

Borlis Pass had no guilds transferring off for the past months, and 2 months ago the server used to queue all maps at reset for 2 hours, now we cant queue more than 1 map
Maguuma used to queue all maps @ reset as i remember, no NA guilds transferred off for awhile, now we can only queue 2 maps

WvW ded ?

Pretty sure this week is due to the Lion’s Arch event. But I have noticed a very steady decline in WvW population since last November.

Since WvW queues are no longer a deterrent the servers have started cannibalizing each other.

The good servers feed off the medicore ones leaving behind a bare skeleton of what was. There’s no incentive to stick to crappy servers outside of some form of loyalty. The points-per-tick system makes coverage the all-decisive measure of success.

WvW population is also down this week simply because farming Lion’s Arch is so kitten lucrative.

WvW population will also take another dip when Elder Scrolls Online launches in 6 weeks time. But that’s nothing you can stop.

So yeah, it’s going to be a rough WvW for the coming weeks and I don’t see much change ahead.

Steady decline + other things to do + less interest ahead of season 2. I guarantee you’ll see participation increase again when the tourney starts.

It’s because of the current Living Story good sir. It’s pretty much a raid instance, and you know how much us WvWers flock to a good raid.

Also…KALKZ, Y U NO REK MA BL!?

EotM means you can now play WvW-style without queues or inbalanced matchups.

Now lets mix in the fact that the placing of the server in the upcomming league gets you more reward and it wouldnt surprise me if even more people moved to the high-pop servers for the easy max reward, and the lower pop servers dont even bother playing an uphill battle and just go to EotM.

Leaves very little people left in WvW.

EotM, Lion’s Arch and the fact that it’s between seasons (er, Tournament) means less folks in WvW.

There’s been a very noticeable drop in the PvE zones as well. Was running a couple of low level alts through QD this week and noticed the champ train was about a third to a quarter of what is normally runs (and this was at various hours, including right before and after daily reset.)

On the other hand, I have about 2 dozen alts parked in Gendarran (for farming) and every one of them lands in an overflow due to the replacement LA hub there. Noticed that the hub is bustling.

I would expect to see WvW “light up again” once Tournament starts, although I could be wrong. Be interesting to see what effect EotM has (if any) then. Or whether all the issues with population and rewards justs undermines it. Hope not.

I agree with all the above-mentioned reasons.

But there is maybe another thing that made some people stop playing WvW:
It is supposed to be a 1vs1vs1 competition but many have realised that it, most of the time, turns into a 2vs1 “fight”.
The servers that ally with each other call that “strategy” but it’s in fact a way to be at least twice as much as the third server. Thus they make sure they’ll finish 1st and 2nd weeks after weeks.
But at the same time, players from the third server can’t compete with “equal weapons” and stop wasting their time in this fake 1vs1vs1 competition.

Dee Jay.2460:

Since WvW queues are no longer a deterrent the servers have started cannibalizing each other.

The good servers feed off the medicore ones leaving behind a bare skeleton of what was. There’s no incentive to stick to crappy servers outside of some form of loyalty. The points-per-tick system makes coverage the all-decisive measure of success.

WvW population is also down this week simply because farming Lion’s Arch is so kitten lucrative.

WvW population will also take another dip when Elder Scrolls Online launches in 6 weeks time. But that’s nothing you can stop.

So yeah, it’s going to be a rough WvW for the coming weeks and I don’t see much change ahead.

Agree

I question the ability of Anet developers to actually think ahead before making a change. More and more people transfering to the larger servers because of it. Anet were blind if they didn’t see this coming. Combine with new content and WvW is a joke.

It’s almost as if they have conceded the WvW concept to EOS and daoc unleased, because they sure do everything in their power to ignore it.

Anet obviously doesn’t care about WvW. Either that or they can’t afford to care. Which I find hard to believe with all the time and love they continue to pour into the living story. Which means they might care, but just not enough to actually do anything.

Either way, same end result for the rest of us.

Forzani.2584:

Dee Jay.2460:

Since WvW queues are no longer a deterrent the servers have started cannibalizing each other.

The good servers feed off the medicore ones leaving behind a bare skeleton of what was. There’s no incentive to stick to crappy servers outside of some form of loyalty. The points-per-tick system makes coverage the all-decisive measure of success.

WvW population is also down this week simply because farming Lion’s Arch is so kitten lucrative.

WvW population will also take another dip when Elder Scrolls Online launches in 6 weeks time. But that’s nothing you can stop.

So yeah, it’s going to be a rough WvW for the coming weeks and I don’t see much change ahead.

Agree

I question the ability of Anet developers to actually think ahead before making a change. More and more people transfering to the larger servers because of it. Anet were blind if they didn’t see this coming. Combine with new content and WvW is a joke.

It’s almost as if they have conceded the WvW concept to EOS and daoc unleased, because they sure do everything in their power to ignore it.

Well transfers earn them a lot of money. So I doubt it’s a problem for them. In fact I’d wager transfers are the only way they earn much money from WvWers.

And the feature update they announced is directed straight at TESO and designed to minimize the player fluctuation during that time. It’s pretty common practice among MMOs today.

Release a massive update around the same time your competitor launches to retain your players with interesting stuff until their curiosity dies down. ANet wasn’t born yesterday and have planned ahead accordingly.

You can beat your kitten the “feature update” will come pretty close to 4.04.2014, the date TESO launches.

TESO is coming. WIll be nice to not have to deal with such bad balance issues.

TESO seems great now, however all we are seeing is beta servers, i have high doubts that things will be so smoth and perfect once you get a few hundred thousands logging in during the first few weeks. In the meantime, GW2 will be at a steady state with fresh content. So, i wouldnt worry about TESO stealing too many players. Some may try it out, but to me, TESO seems to be less aimed towards casual play, which is what GW2 really excels at.

Sanduskel.1850:

TESO is coming. WIll be nice to not have to deal with such bad balance issues.

just have to deal with the horrible controls.

Also DAoC wasnt all that different. Only real reward was DF. Also same problem with zergs as well. Although with no AoE cap it was easy for a few stunners/AoE mez and PBAoE classes to take out an entire zerg.

Dee Jay.2460:

Forzani.2584:

I question the ability of Anet developers to actually think ahead before making a change. More and more people transfering to the larger servers because of it. Anet were blind if they didn’t see this coming. Combine with new content and WvW is a joke.

It’s almost as if they have conceded the WvW concept to EOS and daoc unleased, because they sure do everything in their power to ignore it.

Well transfers earn them a lot of money. So I doubt it’s a problem for them. In fact I’d wager transfers are the only way they earn much money from WvWers.

Thats short term thinking though. In the long run allowing unfettered transfers for leagues hurts the game. If anet need the cash now rather than looking at the long term health of the game then I’d say the game is not in great shape financially.

As for the ability to think ahead I’d more than question the ability of the devs I’d outright say they have no ability to foresee the long term consequences of anything in the game from balance, to increasing AC damage, through to ascended silk requirements.

I blame it on the removal of the wvw matchup discussion forum.
Everyones loves drama, and the lack of it made people lose interest.
Trash talking is a part of competition and sports.

I agree with the above post. Final nail.

DuranArgith.1354:

I blame it on the removal of the wvw matchup discussion forum.
Everyones loves drama, and the lack of it made people lose interest.
Trash talking is a part of competition and sports.

Mentioning that some dev will close this saying “do not discuss match ups” e.e

1- Removal of Matchup forum decreased most people’s interest
2- Matchups are too long, all the good you may do in one day has little impact over the weekly score
3- Lack of a true GvG system (with guild ranks and halls) means less and less people are interested in GW2 overall
4- WvW relies on reward because it is lacking a sense of accomplishment like GvG in GW1 had
5- Pve is too easy, lack of new zones (with new music, skills and challenges) and hard zones makes the overall community bored
6- EOTM showed us how WvW could be so much better, but at the same time has no impact on score, which in turn left most of the community confused about what Anet is trying to do with WvW
7- New skills that aren’t worth using, lack of promised content (like new traps), static maps, bugs (like getting stuck after Blink or Lightning Flash) amongst other problems also do not help

In my opinion only GvG and PvE expansions with many super-hard zones can save GW2 in the long run. Anet has amazing game mechanics (best I’ve seen for a mmo) but seems not to capitalize on them.

1. no rewards. made around 125g this week doing LA and only had a single 1.25g exotic drop. It just throws money at you. On the other hand you dont make anywhere near that in WvW

2. most matches are over by the first of the week. why even bother when you are either up by 75k or down by 75k on Monday.

Dee Jay.2460:

Forzani.2584:

Dee Jay.2460:

Since WvW queues are no longer a deterrent the servers have started cannibalizing each other.

The good servers feed off the medicore ones leaving behind a bare skeleton of what was. There’s no incentive to stick to crappy servers outside of some form of loyalty. The points-per-tick system makes coverage the all-decisive measure of success.

WvW population is also down this week simply because farming Lion’s Arch is so kitten lucrative.

WvW population will also take another dip when Elder Scrolls Online launches in 6 weeks time. But that’s nothing you can stop.

So yeah, it’s going to be a rough WvW for the coming weeks and I don’t see much change ahead.

Agree

I question the ability of Anet developers to actually think ahead before making a change. More and more people transfering to the larger servers because of it. Anet were blind if they didn’t see this coming. Combine with new content and WvW is a joke.

It’s almost as if they have conceded the WvW concept to EOS and daoc unleased, because they sure do everything in their power to ignore it.

Well transfers earn them a lot of money. So I doubt it’s a problem for them. In fact I’d wager transfers are the only way they earn much money from WvWers.

And the feature update they announced is directed straight at TESO and designed to minimize the player fluctuation during that time. It’s pretty common practice among MMOs today.

Release a massive update around the same time your competitor launches to retain your players with interesting stuff until their curiosity dies down. ANet wasn’t born yesterday and have planned ahead accordingly.

You can beat your kitten the “feature update” will come pretty close to 4.04.2014, the date TESO launches.

We will agree to disagree on that statement. Yes, transfers make them money, but it is not self sustaining.

I think they earn the most money from WvW. Especially the people that only do WvW and are trying to be competitive. Personally I would never spend money for PvE…because if I was good at it, like many are, you just have to do the dungeons/crafting etc that people prefer to do.

Not as bad this week; certainly slumped big time last week. Remember this happening when clock work chaos living story was in play.

Put rewards on the level of Escape from LA in WvW, and just see where the GW2 populations go.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Put rewards on the level of Escape from LA in WvW, and just see where the GW2 populations go.

guaranteed exotics from Embroidered Belt Pouches

It’s because WvW is as dynamic and changing as the brick wall behind my monitor.

morrolan.9608:

Dee Jay.2460:

Forzani.2584:

I question the ability of Anet developers to actually think ahead before making a change. More and more people transfering to the larger servers because of it. Anet were blind if they didn’t see this coming. Combine with new content and WvW is a joke.

It’s almost as if they have conceded the WvW concept to EOS and daoc unleased, because they sure do everything in their power to ignore it.

Well transfers earn them a lot of money. So I doubt it’s a problem for them. In fact I’d wager transfers are the only way they earn much money from WvWers.

Thats short term thinking though. In the long run allowing unfettered transfers for leagues hurts the game. If anet need the cash now rather than looking at the long term health of the game then I’d say the game is not in great shape financially.

As for the ability to think ahead I’d more than question the ability of the devs I’d outright say they have no ability to foresee the long term consequences of anything in the game from balance, to increasing AC damage, through to ascended silk requirements.

Maybe that’s the point. Grab cash now + fewer in WvW =‘s more in PvP =’s esport dreams come true!

Rather sooner than later there is not enough WvW-population for 51 server.
Currently probably 6 NA and maybe 9 EU would be already enough.
And with the 2nd league we will probably see such a concentration process.

I think it’s time for a reorganisation. The “only 3 sides” of EotM have shown that it’s a good thing from match balance point of view, and the adaptive overflow maps are good from a coverage point of view, however in it’s current form it destroys two other important things:
– identification
– interest for matchoutcome.

But how about merging all worlds into 3 NA (2-3 english, 0-1 spanish) and 3 EU (1 german, 1 french, 1 english/others) server (overflow maps easily provide the capacity for PvE, maybe several permant and addressable copies per server, and even inside PvE, manpower intensive things like teq/mario/worm become better doable 24/7 this way) .

This would give each server enough manpower to play several different WvW-matches with with good coverage on different playtimes and durations:
– the 24/7 match as it is now
– a weekend match (Fr 18:00 till So 23:00)
– for EU a primetime match, i.e. every day 18:00-24:00 (7 times 6h), not shure what the adequate equivalent for NA would be (one for NA prime AND one for oceanic prime?)
– EotM 3h matches
– always obsidian

So on weekend prime there would be 3 different WvW-matches each server is involved in. Weekend outside prime and prime under the week there would be 2 matches and there is always the 24/7 as it is now. ANd there is always a 3h EotM as now and of course obsidian.

Matches can have different number of maps per match (e.g. the primetime match could consist of the 3 borderlands 2 times EB and EotM (all count for scoring).

This way matches can be MUCH better adapted to coverage of avalaible players (as now in EotM) AND you still retain competition and identification with a world.

Wait for the Spring Tournament. WvW needs to be a competition with a end reward that is actually worth playing for. Playing in this current Match-up system with not much of a reward is what is keeping much of the GW2 player-base from WvW and the fact there is now the EoTM.

EoTM is an instance where you can fight a variation of WvWers besides what you get in your Server’s weekly Match-Ups, but it’s still very much WvW besides the loss of identity you get. You still have Large Blobs running on the Main EoTM and the overflows – the differences are that there are 3h Matches with no PPT to worry about.

Right now it’s mostly Guilds and Players playing for the fights and loot, even then it isn’t as lucrative and the fights you get are a mixed bag with blobbing and Skill lag.
Even the Competitive Scene isn’t headed in a direction that will keep those players interested in that kind of thing in the long run IMO.

And yeah, WvW down to it’s core hasn’t changed much really : You have the PPT system that hasn’t changed and you have the same mechanics that ensures that Players blob up.

In the meantime I should get round to farming LA, cause I’m running low on Gold.

There is a huge droppdown in WvW populations, especially in the EU.
Last two month’s there has almost been 1-2 guilds a week retiring from this game and moving on to others.

Except for the implosion of SoR , BG still can still field 50 to 70 man blobs on atleast 3 maps at any given time.

Fuzzion.2504:

Except for the implosion of SoR , BG still can still field 50 to 70 man blobs on atleast 3 maps at any given time.

40-60 of those being uplevel rangers

GO, OUR RANGER ARMY #BEASTGATE

Baels.3469:

It’s because WvW is as dynamic and changing as the brick wall behind my monitor.

Only to you PPT blob’ers in T1.

Amins.3710:

Baels.3469:

It’s because WvW is as dynamic and changing as the brick wall behind my monitor.

Only to you PPT blob’ers in T1.

Funny how a ehmry bay says this when they basically all went to SoS who loves ppt.

You think the drop is bad now, just wait till ESO

someone will pop in the post and say “well ESO is bad” and my response is “It doesn’t matter what you think”

GW2 will eventually get some of the population back it loses from ESO.. but the game has superior Mass Scale PvP compared to GW2, its going to take a chunk out of this game.

The living story (LA)(Eotm) is affecting WvW EB and borderlands. Also im sure most guild and maybe pugs are preparing sor season 2.

Most servers are farming pve so they can buy guilds for season 2.

CrimsonNeonite.1048:

Wait for the Spring Tournament. If you think its bad now, its only going to get worse.

Fixed it for you.

ESO early access is smack in the days season 2 start. How many DAoC fans do we have in WvW? How many people in WvW like massive fights? How many enjoy siege warfare and keep battles? Yep, that’s the kind of guys GW2 are going to loose for at least a month. IE much of the WvW population. What’s left is just PvE pugs dropping into WvW for fun. The guilds that remain are going to roflstomp all opposition, making PvE pugs leave as well. Which mean the guilds wont have much of a challenge and find it unfun. Other 20-30 man raid guilds will probably loose a good chunk of their WvW players and be left in shambles, unable to muster even a dozen people, again finding it unfun.

Doomsaying at its best :p

hmm ESO… then Wildstar….mmm

ex-DAoC player here, in an ex-DAoC guild. Ex-world wide FPS ladder player.

Our guild was in ESO beta and as “bad” as GW2 WvW is, with population issues, PPT problems, etcetera, we will not be going to ESO. Just because Matt Firor is involved does not automatically make the game a DAoC replacement. It isn’t. (Of course there will be some attrition.)

We also are skeptical regarding DAoC Unchained, with Mark Jacobs at the helm, and that is the game we’ve seen extensive previews/interviews via Mark’s Founders campaign. (Don’t get me wrong, I hope that works out, and works out for Mark.)

It is apparently an MMO-culture “almighty prophetic belief” that every new game that comes out suddenly becomes a “threat” to the already existing MMO games.

We’ve seen this same reaction happen since the 90’s.

Never seems to really completely work out that way.

As I’ve been saying for over a decade at least, the only game killer is the game’s own developer.

Seems a massive drop on Desolation, outmanned nearly all day, everyday, easier to get exp in EOTM.

Fuzzion.2504:

Except for the implosion of SoR , BG still can still field 50 to 70 man blobs on atleast 3 maps at any given time.

I don’t think there is a single thread remotely related to WvW population in which you haven’t whined about BG, kudos to that kind of dedication.

goldenwing.8473:

ex-DAoC player here, in an ex-DAoC guild. Ex-world wide FPS ladder player.

Our guild was in ESO beta and as “bad” as GW2 WvW is, with population issues, PPT problems, etcetera, we will not be going to ESO. Just because Matt Firor is involved does not automatically make the game a DAoC replacement. It isn’t. (Of course there will be some attrition.)

We also are skeptical regarding DAoC Unchained, with Mark Jacobs at the helm, and that is the game we’ve seen extensive previews/interviews via Mark’s Founders campaign. (Don’t get me wrong, I hope that works out, and works out for Mark.)

It is apparently an MMO-culture “almighty prophetic belief” that every new game that comes out suddenly becomes a “threat” to the already existing MMO games.

We’ve seen this same reaction happen since the 90’s.

Never seems to really completely work out that way.

As I’ve been saying for over a decade at least, the only game killer is the game’s own developer.

If you weren’t on Blackgate I’d agree with your whole post.
ESO is a regression graphicswise, ugly and choppy compared to GW2. Gameplay I’ll leave be, beta is a terrible time to discuss that. .. But I’m not overawed.

Wildstar, like GW2 is an NCsoft game. Seems unlikely the two aren’t going to share a customer base in some shape or form.

Camelot Unchained is a Mark Jacobs project.. Remember Warhammer? It’s shut down.

GW2 is really, really polished and well attended. After a year it’s hard to recall all the irritants in other MMO’s that are not present here. After some time away I’m sure people will come to appreciate it again. I’m certainly looking forward to an expansion, I’m willing to bet one will come along about the time we’re getting sick of Wildstar or Camelot Unchained.

Well remember. These forums have given a lot of suggestions about how to improve WvW. ANET has publicly stated that the forum users do not represent the views of the majority of WvW players and ignored our comments.

gg anet

I haven’t logged into GW2 since I started playing ESO. Aside from having three opposing sides there really is no comparison between the two games. ESO’s PvP is everything that GW2’s isn’t.

Poxheart.2845:

I haven’t logged into GW2 since I started playing ESO. Aside from having three opposing sides there really is no comparison between the two games. ESO’s PvP is everything that GW2’s isn’t.

Too bad the actual combat in that game isn’t that good. It’s not worth a subscription.

RyuDraginer please make these statements after game is live. From what I have seens there are some improvements in this area. Its still beta.

To topic, yeah seems like there is some drop down in wvw population. And there will be bigger drop down when ESO will be released. But then some people will come back to GW2 as ESO will not have new shiny look in few months.

I say this after every beta I’ve been in since the beginning. The game is fun, but it feels like it should be B2P, not P2P.

goldenwing.8473:

ex-DAoC player here, in an ex-DAoC guild. Ex-world wide FPS ladder player.

Our guild was in ESO beta and as “bad” as GW2 WvW is, with population issues, PPT problems, etcetera, we will not be going to ESO. Just because Matt Firor is involved does not automatically make the game a DAoC replacement. It isn’t. (Of course there will be some attrition.)

We also are skeptical regarding DAoC Unchained, with Mark Jacobs at the helm, and that is the game we’ve seen extensive previews/interviews via Mark’s Founders campaign. (Don’t get me wrong, I hope that works out, and works out for Mark.)

It is apparently an MMO-culture “almighty prophetic belief” that every new game that comes out suddenly becomes a “threat” to the already existing MMO games.

We’ve seen this same reaction happen since the 90’s.

Never seems to really completely work out that way.

As I’ve been saying for over a decade at least, the only game killer is the game’s own developer.

Both graphics and gameplay are better in ESOs version of WvW. I was in beta test.
And ESO is much better optimized than GW2. It also supports DX11.

the risk that new games pose to existing ones isn’t that they might be better, it’s simply that they might divert attention.

a player who takes a break from GW2 for any reason, is a player who is a high risk to never return. it doesn’t matter if ESO is terrible, if people stop playing to try it out, there is a good chance they won’t come back.

this is especially a problem for GW2, which is incredibly casual-friendly. there’s not much of a grind, and if you take a break for a while you won’t find yourself hopelessly outgeared when you return. as a result, there’s no urgency to come back. so you can comfortably put off your return to GW2 for another week, week after week, knowing that it won’t make much difference.

at this point, the vast majority of the players in my wvw guild are no longer playing this game. many of them quit because GW2 wasn’t the game they hoped it would be, but many of them simply took a break for outside reasons. of those, almost none of them will return because they have no good reason to bother, and those few that do will come back, see how few people we have and say “meh, this game is dead”.

-ken

We miss our monkey on borliss pass. He is either not around as much or not as entertaining.

Moar Monkey Please!

Seriously though, BP had two bad matchups recently that sent our Casuals into Edge of the mists.

The fact that some of our more famous commanders are not tagging up also hurts, because then the map has no commanders and people don’t know where to go, and they just leave.