Guild Wars 2

People who lose to spamming heartseekers, deserve to die. Your timing on dodging is off so stop crying about it. There is no difference in a thief that spam heartseeker and the one crying about it. WHY? Both in my opinion are nubs, because they never took their time to play and learn their class properly. If you know how to play your class… heartseeker thieves are the easiest to beat in my book. Also for those who play it casually and just having fun… Obvious you guys aren’t the one crying about thieves spamming heartseeker. sarcasm.

First off you know thieves run on initiative, which mean, after spamming their heartseekers, their initiative eventually run out… they’ll become vulnerable and that is when you attack. Used any skills you can do daze, stun, knockdown and etc. But make sure you kill them before they hide in shadow and escape and always save your heals when 35-45% of health go down if he/she got through with heartseeker. In a one vs one situation, there is no way you could lose.

Most build is 30/30/0/0/10… So most likely their traits focus on dual weapons to do more damage, but no survivability traits at all. Which mean no regain initiative unless they used signet or roll for initiative which is useless for them if they trying to kill you since it create distance and it allow you to run away.

While in a big open field battle in WvWvW. Is there anything to warn you about? Because obvious there is no place for a heartseeker thief. =D

Now for backstab thieves. Most thieves rely on only one teleport skill, which is steal. So if you fight a backstab thief head on… just dodge to evade. I advise you to dodge backward because it create a distance. their steal can be up to 900-1200 range. So just dodge properly and you can turn the table. HOW? Because some thieves have the tendency of pop everything up for that one to three shot kills. Which can leave them vulnerable.

Pop in Basilisk (40-45 CD), Haste (60 CD), cloak and dagger (6 initiative), Steal, and backstab

So if you evade this… basilisk become useless and it’s on cool down… haste is on cool down… For them to cloak and daggers going to take 2-3 seconds… since they miss it… Boo yah, right in front of you is a thief that fail to backstab.

After a fail attempt for backstab and they go off your screen… most likely because of shadow return or Infiltrator signet. Which mean they’re on a different scale with backstab. But the method still work the same but on a bigger range.

If a thief got you from behind with backstab…

it is like… an ele ride the lightning and updraft then change to fire for burst damage that look like one shot kill too.

or a warrior that bull charge, knock you down, haste and hundred blade.

why I used an ele and a warrior? Because if they attack from behind with a knockdown… Feel like forever to get up and by the time you’re up… you’re down…

Hopefully this is somewhat a helpful hint to let you guys know… it’s not that hard to kill a thief that spec in one area. =D

its gonna be so sad to see this thread deleted but boy do i agree with you 100%

this needs to be stickied in all forums and included in the EULA when people install the game. the thief QQ has to stop, it’s just getting sad

it does show who are the casual players in the forums are though. . .

in any case, i’d like to see the anet devs stand up to this spamming/flooding going on in the forums(multiple sub forums). it’s bad enough that when i want to read the thief forums for useful information, i have to sort through the QQ. but i shouldn’t need to sort through it in WvW, other class forums, general, etc.

they’re spamming and flooding them because they feel that if they’re loud enough the devs will listen to them. the moderators and the devs need to punish them for ruining the forum experience for so many

its not that simple,thieves are invis 99% of the time,+ the rendering issue when they are able to attack you while being invis,nor can they be targetted in this time,they backstab you hs hs hs ,50% lost,invis,then your hitting 1 and aoe the kitten out of my surroundings,he pops up in the distant,goes invis again,for you know it your hit again,its rinse and repeat and many classes cannot do a thing about it,something you would understand if you play other classes.And im getting tired of people trying to defend thieves while there is obviosuly something wrong with them,and the devs also know this,and hundreds of people also know this,people that play thieves,als know and confirm this.

At this point Im more tired of these whine posts than people complaining about thieves.

You are probably bad a thief, and I agree a poorly played thief is not an issue. The problem lies in when a good player gets on a thief, it becomes stupid. Combining smart usage of blinds, and attacking during the culling period leaving stealth, allows a smart thief to be unkillable. Not to mention the ability to have over 20k health removed from a quickness proc, mug/bs/hs spam rotation on a 3k armor character.

P.S. I have 3 fully geared 80s, one of which is a thief.

Actually a bad thief can still do pretty well. The rewards you get for the amount of effort put in is more than any other class. Which is where most of the complaining comes from I think.

Im talking about backstab and heartseekers. For perma stealth thieves… You just need to know which stealth move they are using…

Hide in Shadow… once you see that animation try to stun/daze and etc. So he can’t go into cloak.

Or once he set a shadow refugee… used any skills that force him out of refugee before the animation is gone like stomp move from ele, warriors, engineer and etc.

If you force him/her to used cloak and dagger… most likely he/she is force to extend their stealth with another skills… or they are going for the kills. Try your best to dodge and keep up the AOE skills.

If they used cluster bomb to cloak them as a combo… make sure you take a hit from that cluster bomb to force him/her out.

My way of keeping a permastealth attack off me is through AOE on me… and distance.

Thiefs are OP no tears at all when I posted this.

If all peeps change their class to thief that will send a message to Anet that their game is broken. Just imagine all classes inside WvW are thieves, we will just laugh how laughable Anet games are.

cheezekiller.2841:

If all peeps change their class to thief that will send a message to Anet that their game is broken. Just imagine all classes inside WvW are thieves, we will just laugh how laughable Anet games are.

Thief Wars – Attack of the Thieves… coming soon…

Most of the people complaining about thieves don’t do so because of the damage output, but for the fact you can never see them…

Here’s how a warrior with 2,400 armour and 23K health fares in WvW vs a Backstab Thief in one simple picture.

At no point did either a thief or a red name tag render on my screen and as far as I knew I was moving through an empty field under swiftness spamming savage leap / whirlwind / rush. I was downed before my client even registered combat! Full health -> downed-> stealth stomped and I saw and heard nothing at any point. This is Tier1 WvW so no surprise some of these guys have this down to a very fine art.

I mean c’mon. If my client registers something I can react to before I die, maybe I can counter it (warriors have lots of options). I had zero chance.

You know whzat the difference is between a player who plays too bad to defend himself and a thief who plays bad?

The thief can kill others, while the bad other player will always die himself!

That’s the reason why people complain.
Thieves can be countered yes, but they have it way too easy to kill others in WvW.

You call players bad if they can’t defend against a thief.
But you forget that it’s the thief that has the advantage, being bad or good, he still has the advantage…

Culling is part of that advantage.
If they can’t fix culling, than they have to adjust stealth till it’s fixed.
Harsh, but that’s the only fair thing to do.

Thief can re-stealth is fair?
ok, sure it’s fair.
But if he can re-stealth, than why does he need that burst?
Re-stealth to re-damage… that’s the point of re-stealthing.
Either one stealth and burst, or restealth and more steady damage bit by bit.

TLDR version of this post: Thieves can’t be OP since I die so much when playing mine.

Haste and culling are the main balance problems ATM. Even when the thief model loads their name often doesn’t, so they can’t be marked and often times can’t be tab-targetted.

Not really on anyone’s side here, I play a thief most of the time in WvW. Backstab glass thieves are extremely easy to counter on some classes, other classes it is definitely more of a challenge. Heck thieves are one of the easiest targets for me in game as a thief (I play a more balanced build)! It is like countering something like cookie-cutter HB+Haste+Bullscharge warriors. That being said, the true issue is with culling like others have stated. I do not intentionally abuse culling, but sometimes I notice I am half way through a haste burst and my target hasn’t even rolled yet. It feels almost like cheating.

For permastealth… I believe one of the build a friend of mine run was 10/10/30/5/15?

So for 30 toughness his build was to regain initiative faster in stealth, heal in stealth, and he used dagger with pistol.

First he set up a shadow refugee, then when it is down… He used blinding powder and heartseeker to stack steal in blinding powder. He constantly do this to stack stealth.

In pvp all I did was run in circle like crazy to force him to attack me to come out of stealth instead of using AOE skills… His build can’t kill so I didn’t have to worry much about it. When I had an opportunity on my warrior… I’ll try to immobilize him.

So this build can’t kill but create confusion on other players.

Then there is a build on 20/20/30 which or 10/30/30 with more power, but with AC gears… I can’t see how someone can die to backstab -__-.

But I get what you mean, a thief that permastealth just ruin the game for hardcore/social people.

I’m not sure how others play permastealth… but it seem like if people understand how permastealth work… Best way to counter is to force their heartseeker to hit you which force them out of stealth or wait for shadow refugee to be used… to start the counter attack.

I guess for me to understand permastealth more… I’ll run it and give it a try. My guildies told me to run permastealth, but I love open battle with my thief.

So basically to be permastealth, you need to space to perform it? In my aspect it is better to run dagger and pistol unless you’re spec to kill?

Cirian.8917:

Here’s how a warrior with 2,400 armour and 23K health fares in WvW vs a Backstab Thief in one simple picture.

At no point did either a thief or a red name tag render on my screen and as far as I knew I was moving through an empty field under swiftness spamming savage leap / whirlwind / rush. I was downed before my client even registered combat! Full health -> downed-> stealth stomped and I saw and heard nothing at any point. This is Tier1 WvW so no surprise some of these guys have this down to a very fine art.

I mean c’mon. If my client registers something I can react to before I die, maybe I can counter it (warriors have lots of options). I had zero chance.

I think you got killed by a backstab thieves with teleportation skills -____-

In my opinion, I can’t see how a permastealth able to kill you fast enough for the game not to registered it… Permastealth you need 30 toughness to regain initiative fast enough to keep yourself in stealth.

Also I play on Ehmry Bays before my guild is dead… I just moved up to Tier 2. The culling is bad on EB already and on tier 2… I was running around… before my game registered I was in combat -____-. I could of drop without seeing the enemies and question what just happen.

For me atm, the thing that is not registering to me is… If they are permastealth build? What power backing up thier backstab to kill you in one shot? I feel like you guys got backstab by a glass cannon and not a permastealth build.

Players that don’t have the level, gear or knowledge needed to fight in WvW will make cry threads until the end of time. Every Thief spec can be countered. The most complained about is the Glass Cannon spec which is so awful in WvW because of it’s cool-down cowboy play-style.

Every thread is perma stealth this and culling that. These are just crutches for bad players to lean on. They need something to point to and say that is the reason they die. So much so that they actually loose money to repair bills and call WvW a gold sink.

My warrior, who is not yet level 80, is sort of able to escape thieves that spam heartseeker. I just use main hand sword 2 followed by bulls charge and start booking in to the nearest safe area. Problem is unless that thief is an idiot he will be able to keep up with me, and I rarely survive. Once I have exotic equipment I might be able to escape, but the reason I can even try to escape is I’m constantly watching my surroundings. Stealth lets the thief set up the battlefield, but with it’s relatively low duration anyone who is paying attention to the area around them has a chance to spot the thief ahead of time. Even if you can’t fight a thief that is the key to not getting ganked.

Thiefs are OP, I understand why Thiefs come here and post but it does not change the fact.

Eshei.6803:

Cirian.8917:

Here’s how a warrior with 2,400 armour and 23K health fares in WvW vs a Backstab Thief in one simple picture.

At no point did either a thief or a red name tag render on my screen and as far as I knew I was moving through an empty field under swiftness spamming savage leap / whirlwind / rush. I was downed before my client even registered combat! Full health -> downed-> stealth stomped and I saw and heard nothing at any point. This is Tier1 WvW so no surprise some of these guys have this down to a very fine art.

I mean c’mon. If my client registers something I can react to before I die, maybe I can counter it (warriors have lots of options). I had zero chance.

I think you got killed by a backstab thieves with teleportation skills -____-

In my opinion, I can’t see how a permastealth able to kill you fast enough for the game not to registered it… Permastealth you need 30 toughness to regain initiative fast enough to keep yourself in stealth.

This isn’t entirely true, and I’m not going to explain exactly how, but using combo fields, I can stay stealthed for a very, very long time.

I will agree thiefs need a rework. BUT in solo combat. I am downed 2/10 times if I stay and fight. Once you learn how thiefs work, as the OP and others have said. You can neutralize them really easily.

In fact, I killed a lvl 80 backstab thief with my lvl 14 Elementalist, by dodge rolling as SOON as I realized he was going to attack, then spamming meteor shower, lava font, and the baby meteor shower signet.

The problem with thiefs is that they can just run away once they realize they suck denying you the proud victory you deserve. That’s excessively annoying. I have an immob power on my guardian and as soon as I pop it they disappear and I dont see them again, until I see their tag going over a hill away from me.

I’m just tired of having to deal with them. They’re just not fun to fight against.

I have to agree that people need to stop the tears about being killed by a thief , alot of the people crying dont stack toughness or health yet they want to live from a back attack thief? I dont think so!!! Man up and stack some defense or die cuz dps warriors hurt way more than thieves.

A lot of bad thieves in here. I die maybe 1 in 100 kills, now that everyone is geared. I barely just broke 100 deaths, with over 7000 kills on my Thief.

If you’re dying a lot, you need to practice more, a lot more.

The easiest thing to do is not look at the threads. Don’t bother to respond to them because it’s pointless to ask for them to verify their claims beyond screenies of the damage they suffer and most of them are complete hyperbole anyways. There will always be bad players who complain and in every MMO that has it, stealth is the #1 thing complained about in PvP in my experience. People can’t handle it and will never be able to handle it, if thieves are nerfed into next year and are only able to defeat folks who are upleveled and AFK, you’ll still see a thread pop up once a week about how someone got owned in 1 second and it’s just not fair.

It’s thier right to voice their opinion as long as ANET will tolerate them so the only real options are to ignore them or fight fire with fire and post screenshots of every time another class kills you quickly and make a complaining thread about that. Personally, the only problem I have with the complainers is that some of them are on a literal crusade and are kittenting up threads that are not related to thieves at all with their whining.

All I am reading is “I am trying to defend my overpowered class from getting nerfed so everyone else should l2p. I am scared so i will lash out at everyone else and call them nubs”

Get over it. Thevies are one of the most overpowered classes i have ever seen in the many mmos i have played.

Eshei.6803:

People who lose to spamming heartseekers, deserve to die. Your timing on dodging is off so stop crying about it. There is no difference in a thief that spam heartseeker and the one crying about it. WHY? Both in my opinion are nubs, because they never took their time to play and learn their class properly. If you know how to play your class… heartseeker thieves are the easiest to beat in my book. Also for those who play it casually and just having fun… Obvious you guys aren’t the one crying about thieves spamming heartseeker. sarcasm.

First off you know thieves run on initiative, which mean, after spamming their heartseekers, their initiative eventually run out… they’ll become vulnerable and that is when you attack. Used any skills you can do daze, stun, knockdown and etc. But make sure you kill them before they hide in shadow and escape and always save your heals when 35-45% of health go down if he/she got through with heartseeker. In a one vs one situation, there is no way you could lose.

Most build is 30/30/0/0/10… So most likely their traits focus on dual weapons to do more damage, but no survivability traits at all. Which mean no regain initiative unless they used signet or roll for initiative which is useless for them if they trying to kill you since it create distance and it allow you to run away.

While in a big open field battle in WvWvW. Is there anything to warn you about? Because obvious there is no place for a heartseeker thief. =D

Now for backstab thieves. Most thieves rely on only one teleport skill, which is steal. So if you fight a backstab thief head on… just dodge to evade. I advise you to dodge backward because it create a distance. their steal can be up to 900-1200 range. So just dodge properly and you can turn the table. HOW? Because some thieves have the tendency of pop everything up for that one to three shot kills. Which can leave them vulnerable.

Pop in Basilisk (40-45 CD), Haste (60 CD), cloak and dagger (6 initiative), Steal, and backstab

So if you evade this… basilisk become useless and it’s on cool down… haste is on cool down… For them to cloak and daggers going to take 2-3 seconds… since they miss it… Boo yah, right in front of you is a thief that fail to backstab.

After a fail attempt for backstab and they go off your screen… most likely because of shadow return or Infiltrator signet. Which mean they’re on a different scale with backstab. But the method still work the same but on a bigger range.

If a thief got you from behind with backstab…

it is like… an ele ride the lightning and updraft then change to fire for burst damage that look like one shot kill too.

or a warrior that bull charge, knock you down, haste and hundred blade.

why I used an ele and a warrior? Because if they attack from behind with a knockdown… Feel like forever to get up and by the time you’re up… you’re down…

Hopefully this is somewhat a helpful hint to let you guys know… it’s not that hard to kill a thief that spec in one area. =D

I agree with the OP. Except one thing about roll for intiative, if you are chasing someone and to build initiave you do a bout face and then roll. This way you head in the same direction the person is running.

Most of the complainers are just noobs that quit every game they play when they fail to use any defensive tactics. So often than not I dont see people use any defensive skills They just want to build their character for all offense and then when they die in 3 hits they go vent in the forums. This was the same with AION. People complain that sorcs can just one shot everybody, but then when they try different gearing for magic resist they notice that alot of those attacks can be evaded.

The main issue is culling and not being able to see the thief that is the issue. People think the thief can hit you and stay stealth, which is not true. Its culling that makes you think that.

Binafus.8153:

Thiefs are OP, I understand why Thiefs come here and post but it does not change the fact.

Thief are balanced at the higher level of skill cap along all professions. If you have constant trouble with them it just means you are a fairly low skill player. Tough to hear I know. The good news is, you can always get better!

Here are a couple tips.

1) Use your mouse to turn. I know the keyboard has been amazing to turn with since Doom but the mouse really is better

2) Bind your abilities to keys. Clicks has been awesome since Microsoft stole the mouse from Apple but sometimes going backwards is actually better. Weird I know. This going against #1 I know but just trust me.

3) Use the dodge ability. In this game you get a free ability that give you immunity to everything. It’s really weird. I recommend binding it to a key so you can do it faster, just in case you do use this but use the double tap method.

This is just the beginning. Spread your wings and fly!

Hammerhorn.1347:

I have to agree that people need to stop the tears about being killed by a thief , alot of the people crying dont stack toughness or health yet they want to live from a back attack thief? I dont think so!!! Man up and stack some defense or die cuz dps warriors hurt way more than thieves.

I’m hitting Bunker Guardians for 5k mugs, 4k-5k Cloak and Dagger, and 4k-5k Backstabs who have over 3500 armor. They’ve got the highest toughness they can get, and give up virtually all of thier damage. Guardians have as few hit points as the Thief.

What more do you want them to do?

Nothing worse than bad players defending a class when they know absolutely nothing about the game.

They’re going to have to fix things, and I want to be there to help them fix stuff so they do not break my class, which has happened in every other MMO to date, when people like the scrubs in here defending the broken mechanics are doing.

If we do not get on board with HOW to fix it appropriately, the developers are going to destroy our class, because they don’t know what all is wrong. Quit being a bad player, and part of the problem, but be part of the solution.

Beachead.4127:

All I am reading is “I am trying to defend my overpowered class from getting nerfed so everyone else should l2p. I am scared so i will lash out at everyone else and call them nubs”

Get over it. Thevies are one of the most overpowered classes i have ever seen in the many mmos i have played.

So that mean, All I’m reading from you is “I want thieves to be nerf because I can’t dodge roll and play my class efficient enough against a thief… So thieves should be nerf. Problem solve!”

Beside I can beat thieves on my glass cannon or toughness build on my warrior. When I play my thief… I don’t run dual daggers. =D

Thieves are easy mode in this game, but I am not so sure they are OP. they just have a very low skill cap to be effective

jkctmc.8754:

Hammerhorn.1347:

I have to agree that people need to stop the tears about being killed by a thief , alot of the people crying dont stack toughness or health yet they want to live from a back attack thief? I dont think so!!! Man up and stack some defense or die cuz dps warriors hurt way more than thieves.

I’m hitting Bunker Guardians for 5k mugs, 4k-5k Cloak and Dagger, and 4k-5k Backstabs who have over 3500 armor. They’ve got the highest toughness they can get, and give up virtually all of thier damage. Guardians have as few hit points as the Thief.

Yea because a bunker guardian that just soaks all those hits is a pro. They don’t have any defensive cool-downs they could blow! They also still have ~5K health left to pop stuff if they are bad.

Stiv.1820:

Binafus.8153:

Thiefs are OP, I understand why Thiefs come here and post but it does not change the fact.

Thief are balanced at the higher level of skill cap along all professions. If you have constant trouble with them it just means you are a fairly low skill player. Tough to hear I know. The good news is, you can always get better!

Here are a couple tips.

1) Use your mouse to turn. I know the keyboard has been amazing to turn with since Doom but the mouse really is better

2) Bind your abilities to keys. Clicks has been awesome since Microsoft stole the mouse from Apple but sometimes going backwards is actually better. Weird I know. This going against #1 I know but just trust me.

3) Use the dodge ability. In this game you get a free ability that give you immunity to everything. It’s really weird. I recommend binding it to a key so you can do it faster, just in case you do use this but use the double tap method.

This is just the beginning. Spread your wings and fly!

Stiv your name seems familiar. Did you use to play SWTOR?

To stay on topic I agree with you 100%. People not using their defensive skills.

Stiv.1820:

jkctmc.8754:

Hammerhorn.1347:

I have to agree that people need to stop the tears about being killed by a thief , alot of the people crying dont stack toughness or health yet they want to live from a back attack thief? I dont think so!!! Man up and stack some defense or die cuz dps warriors hurt way more than thieves.

I’m hitting Bunker Guardians for 5k mugs, 4k-5k Cloak and Dagger, and 4k-5k Backstabs who have over 3500 armor. They’ve got the highest toughness they can get, and give up virtually all of thier damage. Guardians have as few hit points as the Thief.

Yea because a bunker guardian that just soaks all those hits is a pro. They don’t have any defensive cool-downs they could blow! They also still have ~5K health left to pop stuff if they are bad.

You have reading issues, or you’re just a horrible Thief. I can sustain my damage, and stealth for a long time, something like 28 seconds. The only class I can not kill is a good bunker Elementalist.

A bunker Guardian only has roughly 13k or 14k hit points, if they’ve managed to get some Vitality while maxing Toughness. I can chew through that regardless of their armor, so anyone who thinks armor matters much in this game is a bad player. It doesn’t, and it doesn’t scale as well as power & precision. Not to mention the best defensive builds are those who utilized Precision, and the procs you can get with it.

Get good at the game before you defend our class brother, or you’re going to create a situation where the developers destroy the class because we’re not helping them with the real problems with the game.

Stiv.1820:

Binafus.8153:

Thiefs are OP, I understand why Thiefs come here and post but it does not change the fact.

Thief are balanced at the higher level of skill cap along all professions. If you have constant trouble with them it just means you are a fairly low skill player. Tough to hear I know. The good news is, you can always get better!

Here are a couple tips.

1) Use your mouse to turn. I know the keyboard has been amazing to turn with since Doom but the mouse really is better

2) Bind your abilities to keys. Clicks has been awesome since Microsoft stole the mouse from Apple but sometimes going backwards is actually better. Weird I know. This going against #1 I know but just trust me.

3) Use the dodge ability. In this game you get a free ability that give you immunity to everything. It’s really weird. I recommend binding it to a key so you can do it faster, just in case you do use this but use the double tap method.

This is just the beginning. Spread your wings and fly!

You aren’t helping your argument by being demeaning to people. Just sayin

jkctmc.8754:

They’re going to have to fix things, and I want to be there to help them fix stuff so they do not break my class, which has happened in every other MMO to date, when people like the scrubs in here defending the broken mechanics are doing.

If we do not get on board with HOW to fix it appropriately, the developers are going to destroy our class, because they don’t know what all is wrong. Quit being a bad player, and part of the problem, but be part of the solution.

This is the best quote ever about thiefs, and should be the end all. They have issues that need fixing. BUT they dont need to make thiefs laughable in a knee jerk reaction to complainers that dont even try. EVERY time I step in wvw, I seek out a solo thief and fight him to learn how, and learn what I can do better. Trial and Error. Now when I see a thief coming, I dont throw my hands up and scream then tab out to the forums.

The only thing I have to say about thieves really is this: the only problem I have with them is when they don’t render for me.

Jeda.5209:

Stiv.1820:

Binafus.8153:

Thiefs are OP, I understand why Thiefs come here and post but it does not change the fact.

Thief are balanced at the higher level of skill cap along all professions. If you have constant trouble with them it just means you are a fairly low skill player. Tough to hear I know. The good news is, you can always get better!

Here are a couple tips.

1) Use your mouse to turn. I know the keyboard has been amazing to turn with since Doom but the mouse really is better

2) Bind your abilities to keys. Clicks has been awesome since Microsoft stole the mouse from Apple but sometimes going backwards is actually better. Weird I know. This going against #1 I know but just trust me.

3) Use the dodge ability. In this game you get a free ability that give you immunity to everything. It’s really weird. I recommend binding it to a key so you can do it faster, just in case you do use this but use the double tap method.

This is just the beginning. Spread your wings and fly!

Stiv your name seems familiar. Did you use to play SWTOR?

To stay on topic I agree with you 100%. People not using their defensive skills.

Daoc, Aion mostly. I played SWTOR as a Sith Assassin for a bit. Basically hit level cap finished the story and quit. Wan’t digging the PvP much. Same goes for Rift.

Cover Girl.2580:

The problem with thiefs is that they can just run away once they realize they suck denying you the proud victory you deserve. That’s excessively annoying

you say that like its unfair or imbalanced though. that’s how they designed the class. the class is NOT designed to face tank you.

if you can’t get over the fact that thieves can and will run away when needed, then you need to play a different game. or prepare for rebalancing. they’d probably let us 1 shot you if they took away our mobility or stealth.

covenn.7165:

Stiv.1820:

Binafus.8153:

Thiefs are OP, I understand why Thiefs come here and post but it does not change the fact.

Thief are balanced at the higher level of skill cap along all professions. If you have constant trouble with them it just means you are a fairly low skill player. Tough to hear I know. The good news is, you can always get better!

Here are a couple tips.

1) Use your mouse to turn. I know the keyboard has been amazing to turn with since Doom but the mouse really is better

2) Bind your abilities to keys. Clicks has been awesome since Microsoft stole the mouse from Apple but sometimes going backwards is actually better. Weird I know. This going against #1 I know but just trust me.

3) Use the dodge ability. In this game you get a free ability that give you immunity to everything. It’s really weird. I recommend binding it to a key so you can do it faster, just in case you do use this but use the double tap method.

This is just the beginning. Spread your wings and fly!

You aren’t helping your argument by being demeaning to people. Just sayin

When your argument is weak, you pretty much have to fall back to bluster and insults.

FourTwenty.4268:

Cover Girl.2580:

The problem with thiefs is that they can just run away once they realize they suck denying you the proud victory you deserve. That’s excessively annoying

you say that like its unfair or imbalanced though. that’s how they designed the class. the class is NOT designed to face tank you.

if you can’t get over the fact that thieves can and will run away when needed, then you need to play a different game. or prepare for rebalancing. they’d probably let us 1 shot you if they took away our mobility or stealth.

Speaking from the experience of being an old school stealther. That is very care bear. As a purist, you should be forced to pay for bad decisions. It is also part of the reason your class gets so much flak. Unfortunately it generally leads to nerfs.

jkctmc.8754:

Stiv.1820:

jkctmc.8754:

Hammerhorn.1347:

I have to agree that people need to stop the tears about being killed by a thief , alot of the people crying dont stack toughness or health yet they want to live from a back attack thief? I dont think so!!! Man up and stack some defense or die cuz dps warriors hurt way more than thieves.

I’m hitting Bunker Guardians for 5k mugs, 4k-5k Cloak and Dagger, and 4k-5k Backstabs who have over 3500 armor. They’ve got the highest toughness they can get, and give up virtually all of thier damage. Guardians have as few hit points as the Thief.

Yea because a bunker guardian that just soaks all those hits is a pro. They don’t have any defensive cool-downs they could blow! They also still have ~5K health left to pop stuff if they are bad.

You have reading issues, or you’re just a horrible Thief. I can sustain my damage, and stealth for a long time, something like 28 seconds. The only class I can not kill is a good bunker Elementalist.

A bunker Guardian only has roughly 13k or 14k hit points, if they’ve managed to get some Vitality while maxing Toughness. I can chew through that regardless of their armor, so anyone who thinks armor matters much in this game is a bad player. It doesn’t, and it doesn’t scale as well as power & precision. Not to mention the best defensive builds are those who utilized Precision, and the procs you can get with it.

Get good at the game before you defend our class brother, or you’re going to create a situation where the developers destroy the class because we’re not helping them with the real problems with the game.

Oh look, someone who thinks highly of themselves because they kill randos in WvW.

Ever hear of P/V/T gear?

How does armor do nothing with those numbers you are posting? 5k mugs, 4k-5k Cloak and Dagger, and 4k-5k is about 40% less damage. Do you not understand that damage is dependent on your target’s armor vs your power? If they didn’t have toughness that would be more like 7k 7k 12k.

I know my class and specs very well. You obviously haven’t fought a decent guardian. Bunker guardians are actually terrible outside of sPvP. Zerker guardians using defensive cool-downs are the real honey badger of this game.

jkctmc.8754:

Eshei.6803:

Cirian.8917:

Here’s how a warrior with 2,400 armour and 23K health fares in WvW vs a Backstab Thief in one simple picture.

At no point did either a thief or a red name tag render on my screen and as far as I knew I was moving through an empty field under swiftness spamming savage leap / whirlwind / rush. I was downed before my client even registered combat! Full health -> downed-> stealth stomped and I saw and heard nothing at any point. This is Tier1 WvW so no surprise some of these guys have this down to a very fine art.

I mean c’mon. If my client registers something I can react to before I die, maybe I can counter it (warriors have lots of options). I had zero chance.

I think you got killed by a backstab thieves with teleportation skills -____-

In my opinion, I can’t see how a permastealth able to kill you fast enough for the game not to registered it… Permastealth you need 30 toughness to regain initiative fast enough to keep yourself in stealth.

This isn’t entirely true, and I’m not going to explain exactly how, but using combo fields, I can stay stealthed for a very, very long time.

But with a combo field you’re constantly spending initiative right? So how you going to reach quick enough to a warrior on quickness running the other direction, using his weapon skills to move faster… when you need toughness traits to get 33% movement speed, regain initiative faster, and remove condition while in stealth?

Even if its possible to do permastealth with no toughness… how is it possible to permastealth using combo fields to go into stealth using heartseeker?

Is it even possible to regain initiative fast enough to keep field combo and heartseaker up?

FourTwenty.4268:

Cover Girl.2580:

The problem with thiefs is that they can just run away once they realize they suck denying you the proud victory you deserve. That’s excessively annoying

you say that like its unfair or imbalanced though. that’s how they designed the class. the class is NOT designed to face tank you.

if you can’t get over the fact that thieves can and will run away when needed, then you need to play a different game. or prepare for rebalancing. they’d probably let us 1 shot you if they took away our mobility or stealth.

I don’t think I’m crying any imbalance. I simply said they were annoying. maybe you should rethink your arguments instead of just raging and lashing out with your standard " you need to play a different game" line you borrowed. I see from your other posts you are a thief, so I gather you’re super defensive that once thiefs get reworked. you wont be skilled enough to kill anyone, and since you are used to the broken thief, you wont know how to play other classes, and will ragequit. you should probably start learning how other classes work now for the inevitable
changes to thiefs.

Oozo.7856:

covenn.7165:

Stiv.1820:

Binafus.8153:

Thiefs are OP, I understand why Thiefs come here and post but it does not change the fact.

Thief are balanced at the higher level of skill cap along all professions. If you have constant trouble with them it just means you are a fairly low skill player. Tough to hear I know. The good news is, you can always get better!

Here are a couple tips.

1) Use your mouse to turn. I know the keyboard has been amazing to turn with since Doom but the mouse really is better

2) Bind your abilities to keys. Clicks has been awesome since Microsoft stole the mouse from Apple but sometimes going backwards is actually better. Weird I know. This going against #1 I know but just trust me.

3) Use the dodge ability. In this game you get a free ability that give you immunity to everything. It’s really weird. I recommend binding it to a key so you can do it faster, just in case you do use this but use the double tap method.

This is just the beginning. Spread your wings and fly!

You aren’t helping your argument by being demeaning to people. Just sayin

When your argument is weak, you pretty much have to fall back to bluster and insults.

Actually if you look through all my posting history, I used to be constructive. It’s become apparent to me in the past couple weeks that trying to help people understand mechanics is like dropping bricks on my head. It’s gotten to the point where I am just going to post information as useless as all the whiners.

Stiv.1820:

Oozo.7856:

covenn.7165:

Stiv.1820:

Binafus.8153:

Thiefs are OP, I understand why Thiefs come here and post but it does not change the fact.

Thief are balanced at the higher level of skill cap along all professions. If you have constant trouble with them it just means you are a fairly low skill player. Tough to hear I know. The good news is, you can always get better!

Here are a couple tips.

1) Use your mouse to turn. I know the keyboard has been amazing to turn with since Doom but the mouse really is better

2) Bind your abilities to keys. Clicks has been awesome since Microsoft stole the mouse from Apple but sometimes going backwards is actually better. Weird I know. This going against #1 I know but just trust me.

3) Use the dodge ability. In this game you get a free ability that give you immunity to everything. It’s really weird. I recommend binding it to a key so you can do it faster, just in case you do use this but use the double tap method.

This is just the beginning. Spread your wings and fly!

You aren’t helping your argument by being demeaning to people. Just sayin

When your argument is weak, you pretty much have to fall back to bluster and insults.

Actually if you look through all my posting history, I used to be constructive. It’s become apparent to me in the past couple weeks that trying to help people understand mechanics is like dropping bricks on my head. It’s gotten to the point where I am just going to post information as useless as all the whiners.

Most people know how to dodge, key bind, and mouse move. This isn’t WOW. :p

Cover Girl.2580:

I don’t think I’m crying any imbalance. I simply said they were annoying. maybe you should rethink your arguments instead of just raging and lashing out with your standard " you need to play a different game" line you borrowed. I see from your other posts you are a thief, so I gather you’re super defensive that once thiefs get reworked. you wont be skilled enough to kill anyone, and since you are used to the broken thief, you wont know how to play other classes, and will ragequit. you should probably start learning how other classes work now for the inevitable
changes to thiefs.

I actually dont play a thief(yet) but I have played stealthers in other MMOs. I’ve seen this all before. I’ll wait until the massive nerf hammer hits(cause every dev does it) and then ill work on playing a stealther.

So since your assumption of which class I play is false, would you like to talk more about your assumptions on my playstyle and how ‘bad’ i am. . .or are you just mad that we keep stomping you in WvWvW?

Should read through more of my posts though, reading comprehension might be hard for you, but keep trying and you’ll see what classes I play.

If a thief got you from behind with backstab…

it is like… an ele ride the lightning and updraft then change to fire for burst damage that look like one shot kill too.

Yeah, exactly the same… except, that the huge ball of lightning, that takes 3 seconds to reach you is clearly visible, compared to an invisible enemy that appears instantly out of nowhere.

If RTL would instantly teleport you behind your target, then we could talk.

Eshei.6803:

jkctmc.8754:

Eshei.6803:

Cirian.8917:

Here’s how a warrior with 2,400 armour and 23K health fares in WvW vs a Backstab Thief in one simple picture.

At no point did either a thief or a red name tag render on my screen and as far as I knew I was moving through an empty field under swiftness spamming savage leap / whirlwind / rush. I was downed before my client even registered combat! Full health -> downed-> stealth stomped and I saw and heard nothing at any point. This is Tier1 WvW so no surprise some of these guys have this down to a very fine art.

I mean c’mon. If my client registers something I can react to before I die, maybe I can counter it (warriors have lots of options). I had zero chance.

I think you got killed by a backstab thieves with teleportation skills -____-

In my opinion, I can’t see how a permastealth able to kill you fast enough for the game not to registered it… Permastealth you need 30 toughness to regain initiative fast enough to keep yourself in stealth.

This isn’t entirely true, and I’m not going to explain exactly how, but using combo fields, I can stay stealthed for a very, very long time.

But with a combo field you’re constantly spending initiative right? So how you going to reach quick enough to a warrior on quickness running the other direction, using his weapon skills to move faster… when you need toughness traits to get 33% movement speed, regain initiative faster, and remove condition while in stealth?

Even if its possible to do permastealth with no toughness… how is it possible to permastealth using combo fields to go into stealth using heartseeker?

Is it even possible to regain initiative fast enough to keep field combo and heartseaker up?

It’s a spec that isn’t all that great at real fights. Great for random WvW though. You don’t need all of these but it’s very easy with 20 Shadow and 20 Acro. You take 2 init on stealth, faster init regen in stealth and 2 init per 10 sec. With D/P when you heartseeker out/thru the blind field you get 2 inti back so it costs just 1. Teh field stays up long enough to heartseeker through it 3 times giving a total of 12 seconds of stealth. You can do this forever and keep non flashing stealth up.

The “flaw” or possible bug is that heartseeker thru a blind field gives back 2 inti even when already stealthed. Who knows if that’s intended but it’s key to this build.

You can take the signet to add another 1 init/10 to make sure you always have full init even when in stelath. This build is not near as effective as going full 30 crit or power with d/p and not having perma stealth unless all you want to do is kill weak targets in WvW.