Guild Wars 2

During the live stream today ANet announced they will be reviewing a lot of the AoE damage skills as they are considered too powerful.

That in itself is fine. However AoE was one of the few effective ways to deny enemies revives during Zerg vs. Zerg clashes in WvW. Without any additional changes it will be very hard to stop people from reviving people constantly, which is already a big issue in WvW combat.

Are there any additional measures being taken to limit the abundance/relative ease of reviving/resurrections especially in WvW?

Considering that PvE won’t allow resurrections in combat any more maybe that rule should be applied to WvW as well?

I hope they don’t nerf the radius, breaking siege behind walls is already a pain if you aren’t a elementalist or ranger ._.

Every single change ArenaNet introduces only caters further and further to the zerg playstyle. They don’t want guilds or smaller groups trying to take on higher numbers, they want massively culled zergs fighting blindly.

If anet handles this poorly, which is fairly likely, this change could very well be the end of competitive play in wvw. All hail the zerg.

Intigo.1653:

Every single change ArenaNet introduces only caters further and further to the zerg playstyle. They don’t want guilds or smaller groups trying to take on higher numbers, they want massively culled zergs fighting blindly.

Agreed, we were just talking about this on vent over the weekend and finally came to accept it. It is what it is though and we will continue to be out there in our smaller groups roaming, poking, sometimes running, and always getting back up off the floor.

On the face of it this proposed change is just utterly ridiculous especially for specs like staff eles that are nothing but aoe. Like the poster above me stated the effect on WvW will just be greater zerging, as it is the restriction of damage to only 5 people leads to more zerging this will just make it worst.

Anet if this is a change for sPVP please do it for sPVP only and I’d want to see iron clad justifications for making the change in PvE and WvW.

People actually have issues killing others in WvW? O.O

I have never had any issues in any situation, be it 1v2, 1v3, Group vs Group, Zerg vs Zerg.

But then again, I’m a Thief, so maybe other professions havn’t found out how to effectively kill the other players yet? I’ll give some friendly advice, instead of wasting itme to stomp someone, just burn them down. While in the downed state, they take more damage than they would if they were up, and if anyone is trying to rez them, they become free kills to you as well.

Happy hunting.

Wait, people were complaining about AoE effectiveness? AoE’s aren’t affective enough as it is. With the 5 target limit, there is hardly a counter to zergs as it is.

And really why doesn’t Anet just go ahead and rename elementalists “daggerists”?

I kinda think AOE’s are severely under powered in this game, only being allowed to hit 5 people and all. I’m still new to the game but last night in a zerg we just all bunched together while at least 2 ele’s were casting non stop AOE’s on us pretty much non of us were even taking damage. It was the lamest most pathetic thing i have seen in a PvP MMO… Outside of stealth of course lol.

I don’t know what happened to Anet. GW1 was an amazing game with countless skills and in my opinion balance fairly well. I can not say the same for guildwars 2. It’s like they took every bad idea they could think of and made a game out of it.

There is nothing wrong with the AOE I think? As its limited to 5 people…

morrolan.9608:

On the face of it this proposed change is just utterly ridiculous especially for specs like staff eles that are nothing but aoe. Like the poster above me stated the effect on WvW will just be greater zerging, as it is the restriction of damage to only 5 people leads to more zerging this will just make it worst.

Anet if this is a change for sPVP please do it for sPVP only and I’d want to see iron clad justifications for making the change in PvE and WvW.

This isn’t true, and you know it. When my group kills 35-55 players, because we’re made up primarily of Area Effect builds, all wrapped up in a single group of five, there is an issue. We usually run Elementalist, Elementalist, Necromancer, Confusion AE Mesmer, and me Thief (my primary roll is to finish people off, and make sure they’re not rezzed), while adding Cluster Bomb damage. We slaughter countless groups much larger than us, thanks to the AE damage we can put out.

I will give you one thing though, if they lower the damage, they need to increase the number of targets hit.

Keep in mind most AE abilities do far, far more damage to a single target, than most single target abilities.

AoE should stay as it is and players need to learn to use it/avoid it effectively as most of the time AoE is imperative in pulling off field combos. Using effective AoE, small groups can control and beat back large numbers using choke points and AoEs, forcing opposing raids to rethink their path, thus adding a layer of depth to the game. Decreasing AoE will only encourage people to stand around in red circles; nerfing AoE damage would diminish reactive combat gameplay.

Exarthious.5792:

morrolan.9608:

On the face of it this proposed change is just utterly ridiculous especially for specs like staff eles that are nothing but aoe. Like the poster above me stated the effect on WvW will just be greater zerging, as it is the restriction of damage to only 5 people leads to more zerging this will just make it worst.

Anet if this is a change for sPVP please do it for sPVP only and I’d want to see iron clad justifications for making the change in PvE and WvW.

This isn’t true, and you know it. When my group kills 35-55 players, because we’re made up primarily of Area Effect builds, all wrapped up in a single group of five, there is an issue. We usually run Elementalist, Elementalist, Necromancer, Confusion Mesmer, and me Thief (my primary roll is to finish people off, and make sure they’re not rezzed), while adding Cluster Bomb damage. We slaughter countless groups much larger than us, thanks to the AE damage we can put out.

I will give you one thing though, if they lower the damage, they need to increase the number of targets hit.

How is that an issue? Why shouldn’t a smaller group have the tools to kill a larger group if they outplay them?

dreztina.4820:

Why shouldn’t a smaller group have the tools to kill a larger group if they outplay them?

This.

dreztina.4820:

Exarthious.5792:

morrolan.9608:

On the face of it this proposed change is just utterly ridiculous especially for specs like staff eles that are nothing but aoe. Like the poster above me stated the effect on WvW will just be greater zerging, as it is the restriction of damage to only 5 people leads to more zerging this will just make it worst.

Anet if this is a change for sPVP please do it for sPVP only and I’d want to see iron clad justifications for making the change in PvE and WvW.

This isn’t true, and you know it. When my group kills 35-55 players, because we’re made up primarily of Area Effect builds, all wrapped up in a single group of five, there is an issue. We usually run Elementalist, Elementalist, Necromancer, Confusion Mesmer, and me Thief (my primary roll is to finish people off, and make sure they’re not rezzed), while adding Cluster Bomb damage. We slaughter countless groups much larger than us, thanks to the AE damage we can put out.

I will give you one thing though, if they lower the damage, they need to increase the number of targets hit.

How is that an issue? Why shouldn’t a smaller group have the tools to kill a larger group if they outplay them?

It has nothing to do with us outplaying them, but more to do with most Zergs being made up with upleveled players, or 80s who havn’t got into Exotic gear yet, and/or havn’t figured their builds out yet. You can tell a difference in the damage you do.

Once people are fully geared, and have thier builds figured out, they begin venturing out solo, and in smaller groups, even taking towers in a single group.

I don’t, or I should say my group does not need to be able to prey on so many, and I would rather they be given a handicap, so I can face a greater oppostion, until we steamroll smaller groups we find.

Shooting fish in a barrel is boring to me. I’d rather have to stick my hand in a bucket of pirahnas, and grab one.

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Considering the number of choke points and gates if 5 target AoE limit is removed it will turn the game into warhammer. Set 5+ ppl to Attack ground AoE the choke point and not many ppl make it alive.

From dulfy:

dulfy.1493:

• One of the issues brought up a lot in WvW./sPvP is AoE (Area of Effect). We feel like they are too strong at the moment and a lot of people in WvW are gaming the system using AoEs.
• For people that don’t know – max targets for siege weapons is 50 while max targets for AoE is 5.
• Reducing AoE effectiveness to bring them in line with the single target damage skills.
• Major update coming to all the AoE skills – make classes that are good at single target damage stand out a bit more.
• Same thing with dungeons – right now if you have a lot of AoE you can past encounters by just spamming AoE which is not what we want.

http://dulfy.net/2013/01/17/gw2-dev-livestream-jan-17-transcript/

Does anyone here know what they mean about people gaming the system?

More of Anet having no clue. lets just remove aoe and kill 80 guys single target!. The aoe is already weaker than other games. Did you not listen more people want more targets being hit by aoe than same 5 target and then aoe being nerfed.

Just promote more zerg play so the casuals can run around without any fear.

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Ya, I gotta kinda call BS on this one, too. I can see 1:3 odds, so if you had a group of like 15-20, you could take down a ball that big, if you and your team are so dang good or have mad siege up.

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Neves.2905:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Ya, I gotta kinda call BS on this one, too. I can see 1:3 odds, so if you had a group of like 15-20, you could take down a ball that big, if you and your team are so dang good or have mad siege up.

We don’t make videos, but we do fight against these guys once in awhile.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Video-7vs50

AoEs in this game are stronger than single target damage, against a single target. That is absurd brother.

But if I have to, I’ll talk the gang into making videos, so you can see the full potential of AEs in this game.

Exarthious.5792:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Neves.2905:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Ya, I gotta kinda call BS on this one, too. I can see 1:3 odds, so if you had a group of like 15-20, you could take down a ball that big, if you and your team are so dang good or have mad siege up.

We don’t make videos, but we do fight against these guys once in awhile.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Video-7vs50

AoEs in this game are stronger than single target damage, against a single target. That is absurd brother.

But if I have to, I’ll talk the gang into making videos, so you can see the full potential of AEs in this game.

That video is nothing like 7v50, much like his earlier video was nothing like 4v30. He’s a good player, but you’re still full of it.

And please, do “talk your gang” into that – until you do, stop spreading blatant misinformation.

Intigo.1653:

Exarthious.5792:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Neves.2905:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Ya, I gotta kinda call BS on this one, too. I can see 1:3 odds, so if you had a group of like 15-20, you could take down a ball that big, if you and your team are so dang good or have mad siege up.

We don’t make videos, but we do fight against these guys once in awhile.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Video-7vs50

AoEs in this game are stronger than single target damage, against a single target. That is absurd brother.

But if I have to, I’ll talk the gang into making videos, so you can see the full potential of AEs in this game.

That video is nothing like 7v50, much like his earlier video was nothing like 4v30. He’s a good player, but you’re still full of it.

And please, do “talk your gang” into that – until you do, stop spreading blatant misinformation.

How many were they fighting? There was at least 35 there, most likely 45. Even if it wasn’t 50, it still proves my point, and shows you the reason AEs need to be toned down.

Just becuase you’re not as good as groups like this, or mine doesn’t mean the issue doesn’t exist.

Most of skills are aoe skills. How you nerf that?

That video should show you why superior play should outweigh superior numbers.

Exarthious.5792:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Neves.2905:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Ya, I gotta kinda call BS on this one, too. I can see 1:3 odds, so if you had a group of like 15-20, you could take down a ball that big, if you and your team are so dang good or have mad siege up.

We don’t make videos, but we do fight against these guys once in awhile.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Video-7vs50

AoEs in this game are stronger than single target damage, against a single target. That is absurd brother.

But if I have to, I’ll talk the gang into making videos, so you can see the full potential of AEs in this game.

Everyone knows that the enemies in that video had a few screws loose in their heads, it wasn’t as much as “showing the power of AoE” as opposed to showing the power of stupidity.

The zerlings in that video were like moths to a bug zapper. No fault, but their own.

welcome in the zergswar 2

I’d say if anything it’s because of widely public videos like the ele group on CD that kill a zerg of 30+ with just 4 guys because of AEs.

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

But like all MMOs, the majority who play the classes who’re getting changed will fight tooth, and nail against the change, without offering up better alternatives, that are more reasonable.

Exarthious.5792:

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

But like all MMOs, the majority who play the classes who’re getting changed will fight tooth, and nail against the change, without offering up better alternatives, that are more reasonable.

My AoE’s do mediocore damage to max 5 targets, my single target abilities do sucky damage 1. The fix isn’t to give my AoEs sucky damage, but to give my single target abilities good damage.

Exarthious.5792:

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

Agreed here.

I think people are worried that AN are going to accommodate to quantity over skill on this one.

If they want to take the focus off AE damage in WvW and allow for melee trains/single target then they need to correct single target damage. Nerfing AoE’s in general isn’t the correct path to this “balance”. Some builds do need their AoE toned down, but again the path to “balance” for a melee train is to make that train worth while. Which would be a buff overall to survivable train builds and more pronounced a buff to CC in general.

Can one of the mods please explain why that cat was wearing a skullcap on the Twitch stream today? Is it really cold in there? Is he related to Colin Farrell? Does he have a regrettable tattoo on his head?

Emerge.9640:

The zerlings in that video were like moths to a bug zapper. No fault, but their own.

Yeah that video just shows a combination of good choke point play coupled with a low-IQ zerg who stands in the kitten.

ajm.2931:

Exarthious.5792:

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

But like all MMOs, the majority who play the classes who’re getting changed will fight tooth, and nail against the change, without offering up better alternatives, that are more reasonable.

My AoE’s do mediocore damage to max 5 targets, my single target abilities do sucky damage 1. The fix isn’t to give my AoEs sucky damage, but to give my single target abilities good damage.

The problem though is defense is so useless in this game, they just can’t up the damage to single target abilities, without really messing stuff up. So in my honest opinion, as someone who plays AE classes, among them the Elementalist, the AE Confusion Mesmer, and the Shortbow Thief, they need to lesson the damage our AEs do, and increase the number of targets hit.

I know I used the number 15, but the more I think about it, the more I believe the number of targets hit (depending on how much damage they remove) should be 20.

Smitten.3076:

If they want to take the focus off AE damage in WvW and allow for melee trains/single target then they need to correct single target damage. Nerfing AoE’s in general isn’t the correct path to this “balance”. Some builds do need their AoE toned down, but again the path to “balance” for a melee train is to make that train worth while. Which would be a buff overall to survivable train builds and more pronounced a buff to CC in general.

This is an overreaction. They would have to cut AE damage by 75% to make it useless, and allow for these make believe melee trains you speak of, and I’m pretty sure that isn’t going to happen.

Could you explain what you mean by “defense is so useless in this game” , please?

All i have to say on this is

DODGE !

Exarthious.5792:

ajm.2931:

Exarthious.5792:

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

But like all MMOs, the majority who play the classes who’re getting changed will fight tooth, and nail against the change, without offering up better alternatives, that are more reasonable.

My AoE’s do mediocore damage to max 5 targets, my single target abilities do sucky damage 1. The fix isn’t to give my AoEs sucky damage, but to give my single target abilities good damage.

The problem though is defense is so useless in this game, they just can’t up the damage to single target abilities, without really messing stuff up. So in my honest opinion, as someone who plays AE classes, among them the Elementalist, the AE Confusion Mesmer, and the Shortbow Thief, they need to lesson the damage our AEs do, and increase the number of targets hit.

I know I used the number 15, but the more I think about it, the more I believe the number of targets hit (depending on how much damage they remove) should be 20.

Smitten.3076:

If they want to take the focus off AE damage in WvW and allow for melee trains/single target then they need to correct single target damage. Nerfing AoE’s in general isn’t the correct path to this “balance”. Some builds do need their AoE toned down, but again the path to “balance” for a melee train is to make that train worth while. Which would be a buff overall to survivable train builds and more pronounced a buff to CC in general.

This is an overreaction. They would have to cut AE damage by 75% to make it useless, and allow for these make believe melee trains you speak of, and I’m pretty sure that isn’t going to happen.

I’m not sure exactly what your arguing, so I’m just going to wait patiently for you to explain.

I don’t get this one, tbh. As is, a 5-person limit on AE makes those abilities kinda weaksauce. Thus, it’s arguable that – why do we have ‘em? Sorry, lads and ladies of ANet – if anything, we need player-usable AE to have more targets. Here’s an example why:

Two Words, folks …
Zerg Balling

With that in mind, have a look at current Wv3 tactics, where some players are using the aforementioned ZB to render themselves nigh-impervious to AE attacks from anything less than siege-calibre AE. Is this what we really want? Zerg Ball vs Zerg Ball? I’d rather keep space for the concept of a small, skilled strike team being able to hold their own in a conflict.

But AOE is the only thing to hold back zergs, if you nerv it to like 5 enemies the zerg just runs thrue it and rushes over everyone.. it is the players skill to dodge roll out of red circles and you wont be in any AOE.

The reason that ppl die when a large group is AOE 1 specific area is because they rush in thinking they are god, if they were smart they would think..

Wait.. red circle ATTENTION! It might be AOE on that spot! Lets try to flank them!

Wait.. red circle ATTENTION! It might be AOE on that spot! Lets try to flank them!Now if it will be nerved a zerg will think..

Wait.. red circle ATTENTION! It might be AOE on that spot! Lets try to flank them!Now if it will be nerved a zerg will think..Guys just stand next to the wall! AOE hits only 5 ppl.. we will heal you and this way we can protect our catapults!

Wait.. red circle ATTENTION! It might be AOE on that spot! Lets try to flank them!Now if it will be nerved a zerg will think..Guys just stand next to the wall! AOE hits only 5 ppl.. we will heal you and this way we can protect our catapults!But lets give it a chance, maybe its way better then what i think lol

Wait.. red circle ATTENTION! It might be AOE on that spot! Lets try to flank them!Now if it will be nerved a zerg will think..Guys just stand next to the wall! AOE hits only 5 ppl.. we will heal you and this way we can protect our catapults!But lets give it a chance, maybe its way better then what i think lol*EDIT i dont know why the post shows my text 3x :/

Smitten.3076:

Could you explain what you mean by “defense is so useless in this game” , please?

3200 Armor isn’t much better than 2500 Armor. As a Thief, I tested this with a Guardian buddy of mine who changed servers to test it. With 2500 Armor, I killed him in 2.5 seconds, with 3200 Armor, I killed him in less than 3 seconds multiple times, so he went 100% into toughness, with toughness food, and such, putting his Armor to (if I remember correctly) to 3400, maybe 3500 Armor, and I killed him in just over 3 seconds.

Here is the kicker. I havn’t taken the time to upgrade my level 78 Exotic Beserker gear either.

The diminishing returns on Toughness, as it relates to Armor is drastic, not like the massive benefits we get from Power, and Precision, not to mention the extremely large pool of itemization you get from having a high critical hits, from food, and sigils.

Exarthious.5792:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Neves.2905:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Ya, I gotta kinda call BS on this one, too. I can see 1:3 odds, so if you had a group of like 15-20, you could take down a ball that big, if you and your team are so dang good or have mad siege up.

We don’t make videos, but we do fight against these guys once in awhile.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Video-7vs50

AoEs in this game are stronger than single target damage, against a single target. That is absurd brother.

But if I have to, I’ll talk the gang into making videos, so you can see the full potential of AEs in this game.

Those people died to AOEs because they were being idiots, not because AOE is too strong.

Potentially disastrous changes INC!

Smitten.3076:

Exarthious.5792:

ajm.2931:

Exarthious.5792:

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

But like all MMOs, the majority who play the classes who’re getting changed will fight tooth, and nail against the change, without offering up better alternatives, that are more reasonable.

My AoE’s do mediocore damage to max 5 targets, my single target abilities do sucky damage 1. The fix isn’t to give my AoEs sucky damage, but to give my single target abilities good damage.

The problem though is defense is so useless in this game, they just can’t up the damage to single target abilities, without really messing stuff up. So in my honest opinion, as someone who plays AE classes, among them the Elementalist, the AE Confusion Mesmer, and the Shortbow Thief, they need to lesson the damage our AEs do, and increase the number of targets hit.

I know I used the number 15, but the more I think about it, the more I believe the number of targets hit (depending on how much damage they remove) should be 20.

Smitten.3076:

If they want to take the focus off AE damage in WvW and allow for melee trains/single target then they need to correct single target damage. Nerfing AoE’s in general isn’t the correct path to this “balance”. Some builds do need their AoE toned down, but again the path to “balance” for a melee train is to make that train worth while. Which would be a buff overall to survivable train builds and more pronounced a buff to CC in general.

This is an overreaction. They would have to cut AE damage by 75% to make it useless, and allow for these make believe melee trains you speak of, and I’m pretty sure that isn’t going to happen.

I’m not sure exactly what your arguing, so I’m just going to wait patiently for you to explain.

I’m arguing the change is needed, and people should not overreact to the change.

ajm.2931:

Wait, people were complaining about AoE effectiveness? AoE’s aren’t affective enough as it is. With the 5 target limit, there is hardly a counter to zergs as it is.

And really why doesn’t Anet just go ahead and rename elementalists “daggerists”?

Now I want to play a game where classes are named because of the weapons they use. “Daggerist”, “Sworder”, “Axer”, “Spearist”, etc.

AOE’s should have moderate damage compared to a single target skill so the upcoming update is correct but,
AOE’s shouldn’t be limited to 5,
That’s what i think.

VLNt.9862:

AOE’s should have moderate damage compared to a single target skill so the upcoming update is correct but,
AOE’s shouldn’t be limited to 5,
That’s what i think.

Agreed.

Exarthious.5792:

Smitten.3076:

Could you explain what you mean by “defense is so useless in this game” , please?

3200 Armor isn’t much better than 2500 Armor. As a Thief, I tested this with a Guardian buddy of mine who changed servers to test it. With 2500 Armor, I killed him in 2.5 seconds, with 3200 Armor, I killed him in less than 3 seconds multiple times, so he went 100% into toughness, with toughness food, and such, putting his Armor to (if I remember correctly) to 3400, maybe 3500 Armor, and I killed him in just over 3 seconds.

Here is the kicker. I havn’t taken the time to upgrade my level 78 Exotic Beserker gear either.

The diminishing returns on Toughness, as it relates to Armor is drastic, not like the massive benefits we get from Power, and Precision, not to mention the extremely large pool of itemization you get from having a high critical hits, from food, and sigils.

I don’t disagree, I was curious which route you were going to take the statement though. DR’s , buggy mechanics or over indulgence in damaging stats.

Oozo.7856:

Exarthious.5792:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Neves.2905:

Intigo.1653:

…what…

Exarthious, you’re full of it. Please do provide proof of you killing ~55 players with your 1 group.

Ya, I gotta kinda call BS on this one, too. I can see 1:3 odds, so if you had a group of like 15-20, you could take down a ball that big, if you and your team are so dang good or have mad siege up.

We don’t make videos, but we do fight against these guys once in awhile.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Video-7vs50

AoEs in this game are stronger than single target damage, against a single target. That is absurd brother.

But if I have to, I’ll talk the gang into making videos, so you can see the full potential of AEs in this game.

Those people died to AOEs because they were being idiots, not because AOE is too strong.

Oh noes, you might not be able to blindly throw AEs and win, and might have to actually think, and put up a fight?

The horror. hah……..

When our AE group runs around it is like shooting fish in a barrel. There is no logical sense that any AE ability should ever do more damage to a single target, than a single target ability does.