Guild Wars 2

Its been a couple a month since anet chose to remove orbs from our beloved WvWvW i don’t know about you guys but the orbs gave a sense of importance to certain keeps making it better to play.

I know, i know the removed it because of hackers teleporting orb from one place to another. But c’mon enough time has gone by. Shouldn’t we have a solution to this matter by now?

Before flamming that i’m complaining, i just think PVP got a little bit less fun, no rewards, no massive objectives. Febuary has an update for us but can a anet explain to us why they didn’t take care of this?

The orbs were a fun part of it… it’s just that there were enough people that chose to cheat, hack and abuse the system that it was ruined for the rest of us. Hopefully ANet gets a chance to put some nice polish on it and reintroduce it in the future.

Orbs (hacking not-withstanding) were awesome. I loved the whole “XXX has the orb, we have to stop them at any cost” feeling it brought to WvW. Running the orb/guarding the runner was exciting b/c you knew a world of pain was coming your way and stopping them was an adrenaline rush.

Although removing the orb was the safe solution… a ban hammer should have struck the hackers and more polishing was intended… 2 months is way more than i expected

The stat bonuses the orbs provided were unbalanced. This was exacerbated by the stat bonuses stacking, and the fact that any team capable of capturing all three orbs already had numerical superiority (hacking notwithstanding). A numerically superior force with +15% to all stats is no fun to fight against, and for players like me anyway, no fun to be part of either.

When they figure out how to add them back in without leaving them open to hacks (those hacks are still there, it’s just harder and less rewarding to use them now as soloing a keep lord & guards is time consuming and dangerous) and without the imbalanced stat adds, but still make them strategically important somehow, then I’ll welcome their return. Until then, I’m fine with them being gone.

Thrashbarg.9820:

The stat bonuses the orbs provided were unbalanced. This was exacerbated by the stat bonuses stacking, and the fact that any team capable of capturing all three orbs already had numerical superiority (hacking notwithstanding). A numerically superior force with +15% to all stats is no fun to fight against, and for players like me anyway, no fun to be part of either.

When they figure out how to add them back in without leaving them open to hacks (those hacks are still there, it’s just harder and less rewarding to use them now as soloing a keep lord & guards is time consuming and dangerous) and without the imbalanced stat adds, but still make them strategically important somehow, then I’ll welcome their return. Until then, I’m fine with them being gone.

Lets be honest, if a server has the capability to take control os the 3 orbs, that doesnt make it an unbalanced mechanic, it shows that the other 2 server lacked the strategy and capability of defending their high value target. Simple as that. It like a chess game, if you don’t protect your king, you lose

They added something, but not worth the trouble with all the hacking.

They also need to be brought back without stat buffs. Let them grant points just like a tower or something. Or other non combat benefits, like more karma or whatever.

maybe, the orbs should make the keep produce supply for itself, but only when NOT under attack, so that way its a strategical advantage, BUT not giving stats to make the numerical team OP and have the numbers.

Striker.4853:

Thrashbarg.9820:

The stat bonuses the orbs provided were unbalanced. This was exacerbated by the stat bonuses stacking, and the fact that any team capable of capturing all three orbs already had numerical superiority (hacking notwithstanding). A numerically superior force with +15% to all stats is no fun to fight against, and for players like me anyway, no fun to be part of either.

When they figure out how to add them back in without leaving them open to hacks (those hacks are still there, it’s just harder and less rewarding to use them now as soloing a keep lord & guards is time consuming and dangerous) and without the imbalanced stat adds, but still make them strategically important somehow, then I’ll welcome their return. Until then, I’m fine with them being gone.

Lets be honest, if a server has the capability to take control os the 3 orbs, that doesnt make it an unbalanced mechanic, it shows that the other 2 server lacked the strategy and capability of defending their high value target. Simple as that. It like a chess game, if you don’t protect your king, you lose

True in theory, but not in practice. I’ve been on both side of the coin, having all 3 orbs, and none, and it didn’t come down to skill/coordination as often as off-hours population imbalances.

The day the orbs were removed was a good example. In that match, my server was basically spawn camped by a server with a much stronger overnight presence and a fairly equal NA prime. The day the orbs were removed, we went from less than +100ppt to owning over half the maps in a couple hours. It’s possible that we just got really coordinated and skilled all of a sudden. Mathematically, 15% doesn’t seem like a lot, but it’s greater than the gear attk/def bump from rare to exotic, and that’s without the orbs additional bump to HP.

Even if it’s is purely a lack of strategy, there is no reason to give a clearly superior force more advantage. That only makes the game more fun for the segment of players on the winning side who prefer winning to having a fair fight. I don’t like winning when I know I had an unfair advantage (and when I had 3 orbs on my server, it felt like I could faceroll people). I also don’t like being beaten in a lopsided game (in several fights when the other side had all 3 orbs, opponents would live with 5-20%hp left when it was clear they were fairly equally skilled and the fight really could have gone either way).

Yes they made WvW more fun, anet should have simply changed the buff from the orbs. They took the easy way out.

Striker.4853:

Thrashbarg.9820:

The stat bonuses the orbs provided were unbalanced. This was exacerbated by the stat bonuses stacking, and the fact that any team capable of capturing all three orbs already had numerical superiority (hacking notwithstanding). A numerically superior force with +15% to all stats is no fun to fight against, and for players like me anyway, no fun to be part of either.

When they figure out how to add them back in without leaving them open to hacks (those hacks are still there, it’s just harder and less rewarding to use them now as soloing a keep lord & guards is time consuming and dangerous) and without the imbalanced stat adds, but still make them strategically important somehow, then I’ll welcome their return. Until then, I’m fine with them being gone.

Lets be honest, if a server has the capability to take control os the 3 orbs, that doesnt make it an unbalanced mechanic, it shows that the other 2 server lacked the strategy and capability of defending their high value target. Simple as that. It like a chess game, if you don’t protect your king, you lose

Sure it does.

You’re giving the already stronger team bonuses to make them even stronger. Its a snowball effect.

Now don’t get me wrong, I think they should bring them back in some form. Maybe let them grant some shiny bonus or something. That might draw more people into WvW.

They were not fun because first they were hacked to death, second if you were down the orb buff just buried you.

I still don’t agree it being op’ed if the server takes all 3 legitamately, even if your server has it blank spots you can still get it again.

However, if the buff was to much…. make it less… 5% down to 3%. Give the WvWvW some flare…

A common suggestion back then was to switch the outmanned buff with the orb bonus. That may have been preferable over removing the orbs completely. I don’t think the orbs would be as sought after though.

The orbs need to return somehow without making the match unbalanced. The BL maps were designed around them. In EB, you want the castle. In BL, you want the orb. Without the orbs, the BL maps aren’t as interesting.

The orbs stopped servers from doing what they do now (Everyone pile on 1-2 maps if you don’t have enough to que all 4 maps and zerg the map to death.) I cringe inside when I look at the maps and Blue BL is 90% blue, Green BL is 90% Green, Red BL is 90% Red and EB is the only one with 3 way fights happening.

I think if the Orbs were brought back it might break things up and bring back 3 way fights to all BLs.

Possible Orb buffs:
-25% reduced equipment repair cost.
-10% reduction in upgrade costs.
-10% reduction in cost of siege.
-Increased karma/xp/magic find/whatever wvw xp is
-1% increase to ppt

I would totally fight like crazy over that.

Anat.1765:

They were not fun because first they were hacked to death, second if you were down the orb buff just buried you.

This, and sadly, you’ll never avoid the former problem even if you solve the latter one.

AmIAnnoyingNow.2903:

Possible Orb buffs:
-25% reduced equipment repair cost.
-10% reduction in upgrade costs.
-10% reduction in cost of siege.

Equipment repair costs, upgrade coin costs and siege coin/badge costs should all be removed anyway. Equipment repair costs are unnecessary in WvW, whereas upgrades and siege would still be subject to supply, making supply more important.

The worst of it all ANET buried the story we don’t even know what the current status of the issue. Maybe being hacked is embarassing or something of the matter.

Could we get a Dev to shed some light?

i think instead of adding fancy features like this, they need to reward the WvW players.
After several hours of strategic killing, taking towers, keeps, camps n whatnot.
A WvW player makes almost no gold.

Will Orbs fix the above? Not really.

What is better is that instead allow the Badges of honor to be traded in for gold or something like this.

I they were to reintroduce the orbs I think reintroducing them without the stats bonus and valuing them at around+15ppt each would give people enough incentive to go after them. And it would avoid the stat stacking bonus that empowered the already winning team.

Rez.2578:

The orbs stopped servers from doing what they do now (Everyone pile on 1-2 maps if you don’t have enough to que all 4 maps and zerg the map to death.) I cringe inside when I look at the maps and Blue BL is 90% blue, Green BL is 90% Green, Red BL is 90% Red and EB is the only one with 3 way fights happening.

I think if the Orbs were brought back it might break things up and bring back 3 way fights to all BLs.

exactly.

Removing orbs removed a portion of the dynamic from WvW that added a lot of fun.

Since then the borderlands are much more stale. We really needed more meaningful things to do, not less.

Striker.4853:

Lets be honest, if a server has the capability to take control os the 3 orbs, that doesnt make it an unbalanced mechanic, it shows that the other 2 server lacked the strategy and capability of defending their high value target. Simple as that. It like a chess game, if you don’t protect your king, you lose

Chess is much more “fair” than WvW.

1 king
1 queen
2 rooks
2 bishops
2 knights
8 pawns

Both sides have these pieces and each piece is of the same value. WvW is not chess. WvW is a coverage/population/morale/skill game with thousands of people. Chess can be played with two people, or even one person just fine.

No. No, WvW is not Chess.

Orbs were broke because they let the dominant server be… more dominant, plus they couldn’t stop people from hacking the orbs.

Shaojack.3871:

Orbs were broke because they let the dominant server be… more dominant, plus they couldn’t stop people from hacking the orbs.

There are more solutions to the problem you outline than:

- leave them as-is
- remove them from the game

fivekiller.1432:

Shaojack.3871:

Orbs were broke because they let the dominant server be… more dominant, plus they couldn’t stop people from hacking the orbs.

There are more solutions to the problem you outline than:

- leave them as-is
- remove them from the game

I didn’t mention a solution to the problem =D
I see why they were removed, they said they were going to rework them and bring them back, however that’s been a long while now.

Yes I too miss the orb , it added another layer of strategy to WvW that I hope to see return.

Orbs were fine, they just had to swap the orb buff with the outmanned buff.

but the outmanned buff is so pointless imo…. it gives no motivation…. orb at least did

In daoc the relics aka “orbs” were the main driving force of rvr aka “wvw”. Without there being any kind of longer term thing the entire objective of wvw has turned into OMG STONEMIST. For most people the other BLs are only there as a waiting room for EB.

It was nice to have something else besides keeps to fight about but Orbs had two very glaring issues that didn’t make them good solutions.

1. Obvious exploitations.

2. Snowballing effect aka. making the winning team even stronger.

Both issues could have been fixed…and may well be at some point, but removing Orbs was definitely the best temporary fix.

It did make it fun, unfortunatley its implementation did not take into account server side hacking. I hope Arenanet will reintroduce the orb but with some slight modifications.

Instead of making the orb a moveable object, make it stationary and have everyone fight over it.

Cerise.9045:

Orbs were fine, they just had to swap the orb buff with the outmanned buff.

This was what I originally thought when they removed the orbs and said they would bring them back some decade in the future…. I think the 15ppt per orb or -1% gold costs on all things per orb . 3% less gold isn’t a huge thing but it would certainly be a welcome break from the already demoralized wvw I can’t make money here crowd.
Orbs were a good rush and great challenge to hold and keep out of enemy hands.

I came here after the orbs were taken away but as a suggestion, instead of them giving a significant player stat boost how about giving a stat boost to bases? So if you own the orbs all your bases become a little bit easier to defend and harder for the enemies to take. So maybe like increased armor/health for walls and gates. I could see that being fun because it would require more strategy on the attackers side to take a base.

Like the idea of having them add loot drop, extra coin, and badges…that could kill 2 birds with one stone and make many people happier

The orbs weren’t fun but the objectives of taking them were. The problem with Orbs is that it made the team that is dominating having a huge advantage making it near impossible for certain servers to fight. I’d like to see something that the servers feel the need to go for the orbs but not give some unfair advantage.

One idea is to make it so you cannot take the orb unless you kill the keep lord.

I say bring the orbs back, no buff at all. OR maybe a few simple buffs, like 10% speed buff for dolys within that zone the orb is controlled. Or supply camp guild claimings that do not lose the righteous buff. Small little buffs that just make your life a pain without giving the holder of the orbs to much juice pvp wise. Gives us all a reason to scratch our kittens. I miss it. This negates any off-time capping issues by not making the buffs have a serious bite to them

Orbs wouldn’t be such a problem if Night-time crew couldn’t just roll in and take all 3 orbs and all keeps when everyone is asleep, there has to be some kind of NPC bolstering during non-primetime that makes it where its 100x harder to take a keep at a certain time.

Make orb buffs ONLY benefit people in EB.

problem solved.

Lets be honest, if a server has the capability to take control os the 3 orbs, that doesnt make it an unbalanced mechanic, it shows that the other 2 server lacked the strategy and capability of defending their high value target. Simple as that. It like a chess game, if you don’t protect your king, you lose

Yeah, but you don’t actually expect one of your OWN PAWNS to take your king, because it was really working for the other side, but decided to transfer to yours for EXACTLY THAT PURPOSE.

My only complaint now is WHY ARE THE ALTARS STILL THERE? They serve no purpose anymore.

there has to be some kind of NPC bolstering during non-primetime that makes it where its 100x harder to take a keep at a certain time.

And when a server has a “night” crew, they would still have an edge. Their numbers might give them a chance to take something from you despite the buff, and your lack of numbers will combine WITH the buff to make it impossible to take it back.

Plus, who decides when “prime time” is? How long it lasts?

I loved the ORB part, hope it will come back..

But this time without stat bonusses, and maybe a good idea for Anet?

Make the keep that has the orb a beautifull golden keep or something so we can show off with it! but not extra stats, or double the quaggan patrols or something

Personally the orbs only makes matches unbalanced if you aren’t in a tier that you can handle, but if you’re in the correct tier, it should be fun to have. lets hope anet brings back the orbs with hacks and glitches fixed.

yes, made it more fun…was another objective which was important

The Siegerazer practically gives a team the orb bonuses and then some.
The orb allowing people to out-gear (stats) the entire other teams is truly OP this far into game with all the ascended stuff, and the huge zergs/blobs.

Bringing back the orbs would be fun. Bringing them back with the old benefits would be bad.

A WILD IDEA HAS APPEARED:

You could add an orb to a keep that has the full 1700 (supply worth of) max upgrades, and have the buff isolated to that keep. This would eliminate having to track down all the people who claimed a keep that aren’t keeping buffs up. If the orb buff is up, the keep claim’s buffs drop off. That claim can then be used elsewhere on the map. This would make defending and spending money a lot more satisfying, don’t you think?

Orbs as SM counterpart, PPT advantage atleast.

Orbs should be reintroduced into the game but swap the benefits around with the outmanned buff.

I don’t know what genius decided to give people who are outmanned on a map the chance to farm better loot and those who are obviously stronger than the enemy/numbers or otherwise the ability to get even stronger so the orbs couldn’t be taken back.

They got it completely back to front.

My Dead Characters.9517:

maybe, the orbs should make the keep produce supply for itself, but only when NOT under attack, so that way its a strategical advantage, BUT not giving stats to make the numerical team OP and have the numbers.

That would make them pointless, its far too easy right now to keep a keep contested nearly 24/7. A thief/rager plinking the door every 3 minutes and you would compleatly negate any point of holding the orb. Even worse for the team that has bay as if they put the orb there garison can treb the walls continuiously with very little room for retaliation.

I do kinda like your idea of haveing the orb generate resorces for the keep but tieing it to the under attack status just wont do. Other nice alternitives would swap outmaned with the old buff. Frankly a team thats outmaned probably could use a stat boost to help them out while outnumbered. It wouldnt be enough to save them vs overwhelming numbers but would give them a slight edge on even encounters. Meanwhile 10% EXP karma and magic find per orb, particularly if it translated into the open world would be significant enough to be worth fighting for without invokeing a snowball effect.

I agree that the orbs gave us something interesting to fight over.. and need to be added back.

Hacking is pretty easy to prevent with the Orbs – the whole problem is letting players carry the actual orb. To fix it, just switch the Orb to be NPC carried. A player picks up an ‘orb’ item at the pedestal, and a Dolyak carrying the real orb spawns and follows. If the player gets out of range of the Dolyak, the orb item disappears and spawns back at the pedestal (and the Dolyak either disappears or slowly walks back ‘home’).

The bigger problem with the orbs was the bonuses. You make the winning team (who’s usually winning due to already-better coverage, especially in off-hours) stronger, and losing teams weaker – creating a snowball effect. The simple solution to that is to either have no bonuses other than PPT associated with the orbs, or have the bonuses PvE related (gold/magic find/karma).