Guild Wars 2

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

Jong.5937:

I guess we will have to disagree on this one. I am more worried about the zergs that face-rub keeps, not giving a **** about siege.

Yes, it can be a pain trying to break into a well sieged keep but, as I said, a good offensive group should not be dying under it. It should just slow you down. People on siege die just as much to AOE from below. And, actually, trying to think your way into a bunkered keep is one of the more interesting challenges in the game.

YB had their entire Map queue on siege in keeps and towers vs anything that came at it.

exaggerate much? entire map queue sitting on siege LOL. so all you had to do was split up and hit multiple objectives of theirs to bring them out but you didn’t because you are JQ.. the biggest k-train server in NA

Nope, not exaggerated at all.. Had people on YB telling me they were. ( surely you remember there were players with accounts on YB and JQ at the time). and ya this was why BOTH JQ and BG just started fighting each other and ignoring YB for a while lol. The so called JQ “K train commanders” were on YB at the time..

When we were on JQ vs YB, we were busy fighting in the field with BG at the time, not K -raining TYVM lol

well you sure do not use your numbers right or the other servers have good scouts.. if every tower you go to has a map queue in it on siege i don’t even know what to say.. its not even possible. servers change over times and you keep bringing up the same thing over and over again.. last week JQ jumped out of their t3 keep soon as inner went down.. didn’t even put up a fight.. guess from now one someone talks about JQ i’ll bring this up for years

[KILL] Moved off of JQ prior to BETA and wasn’t there last week( except our players who got locked out of full server due to mergers and are coming when we open).

[KILL] went inactive on JQ months ago outside of fun fights with BG for the most part. I am talking about what made BG and JQ not care about playing the game last year..
This was not a one time thing, you can thank DK for his reputation. It isn’t like YB isn;t known for this by all of NA population regardless of what tier they were on. They earned the ‘KING siege humper’s crown" long ago… TC was only second to YB haha.

Think you came to YB AFTER they had earned that crown, they have had that crown for over 2 years BTW with their whole " fight guilds are not welcome here" nonsense they used to have on their forums as they died as fast s they could just to go back and PvD something way back when they were in T4.

so you no longer have to face them YET bring them up on a daily basis.

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

Jong.5937:

I guess we will have to disagree on this one. I am more worried about the zergs that face-rub keeps, not giving a **** about siege.

Yes, it can be a pain trying to break into a well sieged keep but, as I said, a good offensive group should not be dying under it. It should just slow you down. People on siege die just as much to AOE from below. And, actually, trying to think your way into a bunkered keep is one of the more interesting challenges in the game.

YB had their entire Map queue on siege in keeps and towers vs anything that came at it.

exaggerate much? entire map queue sitting on siege LOL. so all you had to do was split up and hit multiple objectives of theirs to bring them out but you didn’t because you are JQ.. the biggest k-train server in NA

Nope, not exaggerated at all.. Had people on YB telling me they were. ( surely you remember there were players with accounts on YB and JQ at the time). and ya this was why BOTH JQ and BG just started fighting each other and ignoring YB for a while lol. The so called JQ “K train commanders” were on YB at the time..

When we were on JQ vs YB, we were busy fighting in the field with BG at the time, not K -raining TYVM lol

well you sure do not use your numbers right or the other servers have good scouts.. if every tower you go to has a map queue in it on siege i don’t even know what to say.. its not even possible. servers change over times and you keep bringing up the same thing over and over again.. last week JQ jumped out of their t3 keep soon as inner went down.. didn’t even put up a fight.. guess from now one someone talks about JQ i’ll bring this up for years

[KILL] Moved off of JQ prior to BETA and wasn’t there last week( except our players who got locked out of full server due to mergers and are coming when we open).

[KILL] went inactive on JQ months ago outside of fun fights with BG for the most part. I am talking about what made BG and JQ not care about playing the game last year..
This was not a one time thing, you can thank DK for his reputation. It isn’t like YB isn;t known for this by all of NA population regardless of what tier they were on. They earned the ‘KING siege humper’s crown" long ago… TC was only second to YB haha.

Think you came to YB AFTER they had earned that crown, they have had that crown for over 2 years BTW with their whole " fight guilds are not welcome here" nonsense they used to have on their forums as they died as fast s they could just to go back and PvD something way back when they were in T4.

so you no longer have to face them YET bring them up on a daily basis.

I bring up the play style brought to focus by YB since they chose to play the one way that everyone else refused to play because it ruins the game for everyone. You see, YB just used the worst possible game mechanics to win, showcasing WHY most people stopped caring about the score. They are the shining example of WHY having these things in the game is bad.

If Anet solves the problem, won’t have to have them look at YB to see what is wrong with WvW.

( BTW My guild left JQ months ago and may or may not fight YB at different times.. However.. I fight where I want when I want. I see what happens as I am everywhere.

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

Jong.5937:

I guess we will have to disagree on this one. I am more worried about the zergs that face-rub keeps, not giving a **** about siege.

Yes, it can be a pain trying to break into a well sieged keep but, as I said, a good offensive group should not be dying under it. It should just slow you down. People on siege die just as much to AOE from below. And, actually, trying to think your way into a bunkered keep is one of the more interesting challenges in the game.

YB had their entire Map queue on siege in keeps and towers vs anything that came at it.

exaggerate much? entire map queue sitting on siege LOL. so all you had to do was split up and hit multiple objectives of theirs to bring them out but you didn’t because you are JQ.. the biggest k-train server in NA

Nope, not exaggerated at all.. Had people on YB telling me they were. ( surely you remember there were players with accounts on YB and JQ at the time). and ya this was why BOTH JQ and BG just started fighting each other and ignoring YB for a while lol. The so called JQ “K train commanders” were on YB at the time..

When we were on JQ vs YB, we were busy fighting in the field with BG at the time, not K -raining TYVM lol

well you sure do not use your numbers right or the other servers have good scouts.. if every tower you go to has a map queue in it on siege i don’t even know what to say.. its not even possible. servers change over times and you keep bringing up the same thing over and over again.. last week JQ jumped out of their t3 keep soon as inner went down.. didn’t even put up a fight.. guess from now one someone talks about JQ i’ll bring this up for years

[KILL] Moved off of JQ prior to BETA and wasn’t there last week( except our players who got locked out of full server due to mergers and are coming when we open).

[KILL] went inactive on JQ months ago outside of fun fights with BG for the most part. I am talking about what made BG and JQ not care about playing the game last year..
This was not a one time thing, you can thank DK for his reputation. It isn’t like YB isn;t known for this by all of NA population regardless of what tier they were on. They earned the ‘KING siege humper’s crown" long ago… TC was only second to YB haha.

Think you came to YB AFTER they had earned that crown, they have had that crown for over 2 years BTW with their whole " fight guilds are not welcome here" nonsense they used to have on their forums as they died as fast s they could just to go back and PvD something way back when they were in T4.

so you no longer have to face them YET bring them up on a daily basis.

I bring up the play style brought to focus by YB since they chose to play the one way that everyone else refused to play because it ruins the game for everyone. You see, YB just used to worst possible game mechanics to win, showcasing WHY most people stopped caring about the score. They are the shining example of WHY having these things in the game is bad.

If Anet solves the problem, won;t have to have them look at YB to see what is wrong with WvW. LOL

( BTW My guild left JQ months ago and may or may not fight YB at different times.. However.. I fight where I want when I want. I see what happens as I am everywhere.

Is there really no better place for you two to debate this? Sadly, I think this entire post has been derailed by the same 5 or 10 people replying off topic since page 6. ._.

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

Jong.5937:

I guess we will have to disagree on this one. I am more worried about the zergs that face-rub keeps, not giving a **** about siege.

Yes, it can be a pain trying to break into a well sieged keep but, as I said, a good offensive group should not be dying under it. It should just slow you down. People on siege die just as much to AOE from below. And, actually, trying to think your way into a bunkered keep is one of the more interesting challenges in the game.

YB had their entire Map queue on siege in keeps and towers vs anything that came at it.

exaggerate much? entire map queue sitting on siege LOL. so all you had to do was split up and hit multiple objectives of theirs to bring them out but you didn’t because you are JQ.. the biggest k-train server in NA

Nope, not exaggerated at all.. Had people on YB telling me they were. ( surely you remember there were players with accounts on YB and JQ at the time). and ya this was why BOTH JQ and BG just started fighting each other and ignoring YB for a while lol. The so called JQ “K train commanders” were on YB at the time..

When we were on JQ vs YB, we were busy fighting in the field with BG at the time, not K -raining TYVM lol

well you sure do not use your numbers right or the other servers have good scouts.. if every tower you go to has a map queue in it on siege i don’t even know what to say.. its not even possible. servers change over times and you keep bringing up the same thing over and over again.. last week JQ jumped out of their t3 keep soon as inner went down.. didn’t even put up a fight.. guess from now one someone talks about JQ i’ll bring this up for years

[KILL] Moved off of JQ prior to BETA and wasn’t there last week( except our players who got locked out of full server due to mergers and are coming when we open).

[KILL] went inactive on JQ months ago outside of fun fights with BG for the most part. I am talking about what made BG and JQ not care about playing the game last year..
This was not a one time thing, you can thank DK for his reputation. It isn’t like YB isn;t known for this by all of NA population regardless of what tier they were on. They earned the ‘KING siege humper’s crown" long ago… TC was only second to YB haha.

Think you came to YB AFTER they had earned that crown, they have had that crown for over 2 years BTW with their whole " fight guilds are not welcome here" nonsense they used to have on their forums as they died as fast s they could just to go back and PvD something way back when they were in T4.

so you no longer have to face them YET bring them up on a daily basis.

I bring up the play style brought to focus by YB since they chose to play the one way that everyone else refused to play because it ruins the game for everyone. You see, YB just used to worst possible game mechanics to win, showcasing WHY most people stopped caring about the score. They are the shining example of WHY having these things in the game is bad.

If Anet solves the problem, won;t have to have them look at YB to see what is wrong with WvW. LOL

( BTW My guild left JQ months ago and may or may not fight YB at different times.. However.. I fight where I want when I want. I see what happens as I am everywhere.

lol

everyone else refuses to play that way?? every server does it LOL some just do it better.

funny how you think 1 server is what is wrong with wvw. all you want to do is take easy objectives like 90% of the people left in this game mode.

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

briggah.7910:

lil devils x.6071:

Jong.5937:

I guess we will have to disagree on this one. I am more worried about the zergs that face-rub keeps, not giving a **** about siege.

Yes, it can be a pain trying to break into a well sieged keep but, as I said, a good offensive group should not be dying under it. It should just slow you down. People on siege die just as much to AOE from below. And, actually, trying to think your way into a bunkered keep is one of the more interesting challenges in the game.

YB had their entire Map queue on siege in keeps and towers vs anything that came at it.

exaggerate much? entire map queue sitting on siege LOL. so all you had to do was split up and hit multiple objectives of theirs to bring them out but you didn’t because you are JQ.. the biggest k-train server in NA

Nope, not exaggerated at all.. Had people on YB telling me they were. ( surely you remember there were players with accounts on YB and JQ at the time). and ya this was why BOTH JQ and BG just started fighting each other and ignoring YB for a while lol. The so called JQ “K train commanders” were on YB at the time..

When we were on JQ vs YB, we were busy fighting in the field with BG at the time, not K -raining TYVM lol

well you sure do not use your numbers right or the other servers have good scouts.. if every tower you go to has a map queue in it on siege i don’t even know what to say.. its not even possible. servers change over times and you keep bringing up the same thing over and over again.. last week JQ jumped out of their t3 keep soon as inner went down.. didn’t even put up a fight.. guess from now one someone talks about JQ i’ll bring this up for years

[KILL] Moved off of JQ prior to BETA and wasn’t there last week( except our players who got locked out of full server due to mergers and are coming when we open).

[KILL] went inactive on JQ months ago outside of fun fights with BG for the most part. I am talking about what made BG and JQ not care about playing the game last year..
This was not a one time thing, you can thank DK for his reputation. It isn’t like YB isn;t known for this by all of NA population regardless of what tier they were on. They earned the ‘KING siege humper’s crown" long ago… TC was only second to YB haha.

Think you came to YB AFTER they had earned that crown, they have had that crown for over 2 years BTW with their whole " fight guilds are not welcome here" nonsense they used to have on their forums as they died as fast s they could just to go back and PvD something way back when they were in T4.

so you no longer have to face them YET bring them up on a daily basis.

I bring up the play style brought to focus by YB since they chose to play the one way that everyone else refused to play because it ruins the game for everyone. You see, YB just used to worst possible game mechanics to win, showcasing WHY most people stopped caring about the score. They are the shining example of WHY having these things in the game is bad.

If Anet solves the problem, won;t have to have them look at YB to see what is wrong with WvW. LOL

( BTW My guild left JQ months ago and may or may not fight YB at different times.. However.. I fight where I want when I want. I see what happens as I am everywhere.

lol

everyone else refuses to play that way?? every server does it LOL some just do it better.

funny how you think 1 server is what is wrong with wvw. all you want to do is take easy objectives like 90% of the people left in this game mode.

No, not every server does it, MOST choose not to. If you think I want PvD rewarded at ALL in the game, you haven’t read any of my posts. That is comical even.. anyone reading these forums knows that is a pretty ridiculous statement to make. HAHA! I am the one asking for them to remove passive scoring and siege damage PPK and LOOT on players.. I want them to reward fighting other players over objectives so there is no point in PvD anymore at all..

What I want is all walls and doors down on our keep all 3 servers in the match queued up and everyone is up in there fighting it out for 6 hours without any siege and base the score on that.. not easy objectives.

That way if you win, you felt like you earned it, if you lose, it was an awesome fight!
THAT is why I play wvw and YB would just give up if they lost their siege instead of brawl it out giving the lamest fights of all time…

There are probably at least 50 links or so in the first 10 pages of threads on this forum with me stating PvD should not be rewarded, so I am not sure how you can accuse me of wanting to PvD. LMAO

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

BAITness.1083:

I can’t express how awful ideas like a forced primetime and a 3x scoring day are.

There is no such thing as a “forced primetime and daytime” multiplier. Stop making things up and read what it actually says instead.

The activity multiplier would scale on population and activity. If all three servers can gather 800+ players at 03:00 in the night then congrats, you just got high activity and thus a high multiplier. The time is irrelevant. Daytime is irrelevant. Primetime is irrelevant. Whether daytime or primetime naturally has more players on and thus higher activity is a whole other matter. Nightcappers always argue that boho it’s not their fault they play at night. Well its not primetime players fault you have low activity and population by the very definition of what nightcapping is either.

You are mistaken, Tyler B. clarified the " activity" level being based on prime time about half way through the first page of posts on this Thread:

Prime Time would be universal per datacenter. For example, all worlds in NA would have the same 6 hour period (of highest activity) as their Prime Time hours. All EU woulds would have a different 6 hour range for their Prime Time.

It is not the actual activity level of your server, it is the activity level as designated in the 6 hour time zones as being “active”.

You can have high activity on all servers in the match and have that devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time. THIS is what people are voting for in the poll.. and ANET is going to tell you you asked for..

All that quote from Tyler means is that all servers in NA will have the same 6-hour period designated as Prime Time. And during that time the multiplier will be 3.

It’s not correct to say that “you can have high activity on all servers in the match and have it devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time”. If all three servers have high activity during a time other than Prime Time then the multiplier will still be 3 during that skirmish.

In fact Tyler didn’t define “activity level” or what is meant by “high” or if it requires all 3 servers to have a high activity level to get the multiplier of 3. Probably because Anet hasn’t decided yet.

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

BAITness.1083:

I can’t express how awful ideas like a forced primetime and a 3x scoring day are.

There is no such thing as a “forced primetime and daytime” multiplier. Stop making things up and read what it actually says instead.

The activity multiplier would scale on population and activity. If all three servers can gather 800+ players at 03:00 in the night then congrats, you just got high activity and thus a high multiplier. The time is irrelevant. Daytime is irrelevant. Primetime is irrelevant. Whether daytime or primetime naturally has more players on and thus higher activity is a whole other matter. Nightcappers always argue that boho it’s not their fault they play at night. Well its not primetime players fault you have low activity and population by the very definition of what nightcapping is either.

You are mistaken, Tyler B. clarified the " activity" level being based on prime time about half way through the first page of posts on this Thread:

Prime Time would be universal per datacenter. For example, all worlds in NA would have the same 6 hour period (of highest activity) as their Prime Time hours. All EU woulds would have a different 6 hour range for their Prime Time.

It is not the actual activity level of your server, it is the activity level as designated in the 6 hour time zones as being “active”.

You can have high activity on all servers in the match and have that devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time. THIS is what people are voting for in the poll.. and ANET is going to tell you you asked for..

All that quote from Tyler means is that all servers in NA will have the same 6-hour period designated as Prime Time. And during that time the multiplier will be 3.

It’s not correct to say that “you can have high activity on all servers in the match and have it devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time”. If all three servers have high activity during a time other than Prime Time then the multiplier will still be 3 during that skirmish.

In fact Tyler didn’t define “activity level” or what is meant by “high” or if it requires all 3 servers to have a high activity level to get the multiplier of 3. Probably because Anet hasn’t decided yet.

Ye, it IS correct to say that if you read the poll option that is winning, IS the one that will do exactly that. Did you vote in the poll stickied above? The winning poll selection above is what determines that to be the case.

In addition: that is not something that should have ever been considered, little lone part of a poll presented to the players.

lil devils x.6071:

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

BAITness.1083:

I can’t express how awful ideas like a forced primetime and a 3x scoring day are.

There is no such thing as a “forced primetime and daytime” multiplier. Stop making things up and read what it actually says instead.

The activity multiplier would scale on population and activity. If all three servers can gather 800+ players at 03:00 in the night then congrats, you just got high activity and thus a high multiplier. The time is irrelevant. Daytime is irrelevant. Primetime is irrelevant. Whether daytime or primetime naturally has more players on and thus higher activity is a whole other matter. Nightcappers always argue that boho it’s not their fault they play at night. Well its not primetime players fault you have low activity and population by the very definition of what nightcapping is either.

You are mistaken, Tyler B. clarified the " activity" level being based on prime time about half way through the first page of posts on this Thread:

Prime Time would be universal per datacenter. For example, all worlds in NA would have the same 6 hour period (of highest activity) as their Prime Time hours. All EU woulds would have a different 6 hour range for their Prime Time.

It is not the actual activity level of your server, it is the activity level as designated in the 6 hour time zones as being “active”.

You can have high activity on all servers in the match and have that devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time. THIS is what people are voting for in the poll.. and ANET is going to tell you you asked for..

All that quote from Tyler means is that all servers in NA will have the same 6-hour period designated as Prime Time. And during that time the multiplier will be 3.

It’s not correct to say that “you can have high activity on all servers in the match and have it devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time”. If all three servers have high activity during a time other than Prime Time then the multiplier will still be 3 during that skirmish.

In fact Tyler didn’t define “activity level” or what is meant by “high” or if it requires all 3 servers to have a high activity level to get the multiplier of 3. Probably because Anet hasn’t decided yet.

Ye, it IS correct to say that if you read the poll option that is winning, IS the one that will do exactly that. Did you vote in the poll stickied above? The winning poll selection above is what determines that to be the case.

In addition: that is not something that should have ever been considered, little lone part of a poll presented to the players.

Are you saying you think that if all three servers have high activity level in the skirmish that begins at 9pm Taiwan time then the multiplier will not be 3?

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

BAITness.1083:

I can’t express how awful ideas like a forced primetime and a 3x scoring day are.

There is no such thing as a “forced primetime and daytime” multiplier. Stop making things up and read what it actually says instead.

The activity multiplier would scale on population and activity. If all three servers can gather 800+ players at 03:00 in the night then congrats, you just got high activity and thus a high multiplier. The time is irrelevant. Daytime is irrelevant. Primetime is irrelevant. Whether daytime or primetime naturally has more players on and thus higher activity is a whole other matter. Nightcappers always argue that boho it’s not their fault they play at night. Well its not primetime players fault you have low activity and population by the very definition of what nightcapping is either.

You are mistaken, Tyler B. clarified the " activity" level being based on prime time about half way through the first page of posts on this Thread:

Prime Time would be universal per datacenter. For example, all worlds in NA would have the same 6 hour period (of highest activity) as their Prime Time hours. All EU woulds would have a different 6 hour range for their Prime Time.

It is not the actual activity level of your server, it is the activity level as designated in the 6 hour time zones as being “active”.

You can have high activity on all servers in the match and have that devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time. THIS is what people are voting for in the poll.. and ANET is going to tell you you asked for..

All that quote from Tyler means is that all servers in NA will have the same 6-hour period designated as Prime Time. And during that time the multiplier will be 3.

It’s not correct to say that “you can have high activity on all servers in the match and have it devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time”. If all three servers have high activity during a time other than Prime Time then the multiplier will still be 3 during that skirmish.

In fact Tyler didn’t define “activity level” or what is meant by “high” or if it requires all 3 servers to have a high activity level to get the multiplier of 3. Probably because Anet hasn’t decided yet.

Ye, it IS correct to say that if you read the poll option that is winning, IS the one that will do exactly that. Did you vote in the poll stickied above? The winning poll selection above is what determines that to be the case.

In addition: that is not something that should have ever been considered, little lone part of a poll presented to the players.

Are you saying you think that if all three servers have high activity level in the skirmish that begins at 9pm Taiwan time then the multiplier will not be 3?

Not unless that falls into the designated 6 hour period for those servers. Na servers will all be set the same, which if that server is on a NA server, NO, it will not be EU servers will have a different designated 6 hour period, so not sure if that will be included with that or not, as that runs during SEA time, OCX may be left of BOTH EU and NA time zones 6 hour periods.

In addition, what happens when the servers in the match are 1 server has NA prime only, One server has OCX only and one server has EU only? No one has anyone to fight and only one score counts as full.

It should not be a case of if a server only has OCX is matched up with servers that only have NA prime that the players that play OCX would have to take off work or not rest in order to play the NA prime zone just to have their score matter..

Currently, the NA prime servers have just as much opportunity to score as the OCX only servers, they just often choose not to. if the OCX only server fights the NA only server, the OCX server is still currently disadvantaged under the current system, under the proposed system they will never have a chance to even get that far.

lil devils x.6071:

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

BAITness.1083:

I can’t express how awful ideas like a forced primetime and a 3x scoring day are.

There is no such thing as a “forced primetime and daytime” multiplier. Stop making things up and read what it actually says instead.

The activity multiplier would scale on population and activity. If all three servers can gather 800+ players at 03:00 in the night then congrats, you just got high activity and thus a high multiplier. The time is irrelevant. Daytime is irrelevant. Primetime is irrelevant. Whether daytime or primetime naturally has more players on and thus higher activity is a whole other matter. Nightcappers always argue that boho it’s not their fault they play at night. Well its not primetime players fault you have low activity and population by the very definition of what nightcapping is either.

You are mistaken, Tyler B. clarified the " activity" level being based on prime time about half way through the first page of posts on this Thread:

Prime Time would be universal per datacenter. For example, all worlds in NA would have the same 6 hour period (of highest activity) as their Prime Time hours. All EU woulds would have a different 6 hour range for their Prime Time.

It is not the actual activity level of your server, it is the activity level as designated in the 6 hour time zones as being “active”.

You can have high activity on all servers in the match and have that devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time. THIS is what people are voting for in the poll.. and ANET is going to tell you you asked for..

All that quote from Tyler means is that all servers in NA will have the same 6-hour period designated as Prime Time. And during that time the multiplier will be 3.

It’s not correct to say that “you can have high activity on all servers in the match and have it devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time”. If all three servers have high activity during a time other than Prime Time then the multiplier will still be 3 during that skirmish.

In fact Tyler didn’t define “activity level” or what is meant by “high” or if it requires all 3 servers to have a high activity level to get the multiplier of 3. Probably because Anet hasn’t decided yet.

Ye, it IS correct to say that if you read the poll option that is winning, IS the one that will do exactly that. Did you vote in the poll stickied above? The winning poll selection above is what determines that to be the case.

In addition: that is not something that should have ever been considered, little lone part of a poll presented to the players.

Are you saying you think that if all three servers have high activity level in the skirmish that begins at 9pm Taiwan time then the multiplier will not be 3?

Not unless that falls into the designated 6 hour period for those servers. Na servers will all be set the same, which if that server is on a NA server, NO, it will not be EU servers will have a different designated 6 hour period, so not sure if that will be included with that or not, as that runs during SEA time, OCX may be left of BOTH EU and NA time zones 6 hour periods.

In addition, what happens when the servers in the match are 1 server has NA prime only, One server has OCX only and one server has EU only? No one has anyone to fight and only one score counts as full.

It should not be a case of if a server only has OCX is matched up with servers that only have NA prime that the players that play OCX would have to take off work or not rest in order to play the NA prime zone just to have their score matter..

Currently, the NA prime servers have just as much opportunity to score as the OCX only servers, they just often choose not to. if the OCX only server fights the NA only server, the OCX server is still currently disadvantaged under the current system, under the proposed system they will never have a chance to even get that far.

Your first paragraph is incorrect. You’re not reading it right. If a skirmish falls outside the designated 6 hour Prime Time then it has the possibility of having a multiplier of 1, 2, or 3 depending on the activity level. So if there is high activity level during Sea then that skirmish will score the same as a prime time skirmish.

Edit. I do think it the multiplier should be based on population balance not on activity level. If its 20 v 20 v 20 the multiplier should be 3 the same as if its 200 v 200 v 200.

Adjusting how Points are earned based on variables may not have the intended effect, or will punish players in discrimination…imho.

i.e. – Attempting to adjust score due to Low Peak population levels

Score Earning should be the same anywhere & anytime.

Complex solutions often come with ripple effects that take time to measured & often end up being un-controllable…

If you can properly discover & diagnose their root cause.

Applying these complex solutions can also easily be abused & swayed by a highly vocal prevailing majority that will leave once they’re bored or not amused by the solution.

Trying to follow this complex debate is tiring & mind boggling.

There is a far more simple & elegant solution…imho.

Yours truly,
Diku

Possible Full Solution – Google Search – Reboot Base Map Mechanic

• Give players a real opportunity to make a comeback
  Matches are often decided in the first few days, making playing in the final days feel pointless

• In conjunction with population rebalancing, updating Scoring allows us to decide a winner of a match more fairly, and thus reward players more fairly

These points directly contradict each other. A catch up mechanic is the very opposite of deciding a winner of a match fairly. No server should ever get free points for whatever reason.

Your focus should be on population balancing to prevent 100,000 point leads, not on taking away a server’s points once they’ve been made.

Asator.3065:

• Give players a real opportunity to make a comeback
  Matches are often decided in the first few days, making playing in the final days feel pointless

• In conjunction with population rebalancing, updating Scoring allows us to decide a winner of a match more fairly, and thus reward players more fairly

These points directly contradict each other. A catch up mechanic is the very opposite of deciding a winner of a match fairly. No server should ever get free points for whatever reason.

Your focus should be on population balancing to prevent 100,000 point leads, not on taking away a server’s points once they’ve been made.

the match being decided early does not imply the match is decided fairly.
the match being decided fairly does not imply the match is decided early.

neither bullet point contradicts the other. comeback mechanics are unfair by design, but as long as they dont allow rubberbanding to the extent that for example mario kart wii did, it keeps things interesting for the losing team(s). in a match long enough and big enough for morale to matter, keeping interest levels high is extremely important. when players dont feel like they have a chance, theyll simply go do something that feels more worth the effort.

insanemaniac.2456:

Asator.3065:

• Give players a real opportunity to make a comeback
  Matches are often decided in the first few days, making playing in the final days feel pointless

• In conjunction with population rebalancing, updating Scoring allows us to decide a winner of a match more fairly, and thus reward players more fairly

These points directly contradict each other. A catch up mechanic is the very opposite of deciding a winner of a match fairly. No server should ever get free points for whatever reason.

Your focus should be on population balancing to prevent 100,000 point leads, not on taking away a server’s points once they’ve been made.

the match being decided early does not imply the match is decided fairly.
the match being decided fairly does not imply the match is decided early.

neither bullet point contradicts the other. comeback mechanics are unfair by design, but as long as they dont allow rubberbanding to the extent that for example mario kart wii did, it keeps things interesting for the losing team(s). in a match long enough and big enough for morale to matter, keeping interest levels high is extremely important. when players dont feel like they have a chance, theyll simply go do something that feels more worth the effort.

Though the idea of a comeback is not unfair, the suggested implementation certainly is. Their current idea is making the last day of a matchup have multiplied points. The suggested number I saw was 3, as in the last day of a matchup will be worth as many points as the three prior days combined.

Though I am glad to see them putting so much effort into WvW, I think that this is not a good idea.

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Johje Holan.4607:

lil devils x.6071:

Dawdler.8521:

BAITness.1083:

I can’t express how awful ideas like a forced primetime and a 3x scoring day are.

There is no such thing as a “forced primetime and daytime” multiplier. Stop making things up and read what it actually says instead.

The activity multiplier would scale on population and activity. If all three servers can gather 800+ players at 03:00 in the night then congrats, you just got high activity and thus a high multiplier. The time is irrelevant. Daytime is irrelevant. Primetime is irrelevant. Whether daytime or primetime naturally has more players on and thus higher activity is a whole other matter. Nightcappers always argue that boho it’s not their fault they play at night. Well its not primetime players fault you have low activity and population by the very definition of what nightcapping is either.

You are mistaken, Tyler B. clarified the " activity" level being based on prime time about half way through the first page of posts on this Thread:

Prime Time would be universal per datacenter. For example, all worlds in NA would have the same 6 hour period (of highest activity) as their Prime Time hours. All EU woulds would have a different 6 hour range for their Prime Time.

It is not the actual activity level of your server, it is the activity level as designated in the 6 hour time zones as being “active”.

You can have high activity on all servers in the match and have that devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time. THIS is what people are voting for in the poll.. and ANET is going to tell you you asked for..

All that quote from Tyler means is that all servers in NA will have the same 6-hour period designated as Prime Time. And during that time the multiplier will be 3.

It’s not correct to say that “you can have high activity on all servers in the match and have it devalued due to it not being in the 6 hour allotted time”. If all three servers have high activity during a time other than Prime Time then the multiplier will still be 3 during that skirmish.

In fact Tyler didn’t define “activity level” or what is meant by “high” or if it requires all 3 servers to have a high activity level to get the multiplier of 3. Probably because Anet hasn’t decided yet.

Ye, it IS correct to say that if you read the poll option that is winning, IS the one that will do exactly that. Did you vote in the poll stickied above? The winning poll selection above is what determines that to be the case.

In addition: that is not something that should have ever been considered, little lone part of a poll presented to the players.

Are you saying you think that if all three servers have high activity level in the skirmish that begins at 9pm Taiwan time then the multiplier will not be 3?

Not unless that falls into the designated 6 hour period for those servers. Na servers will all be set the same, which if that server is on a NA server, NO, it will not be EU servers will have a different designated 6 hour period, so not sure if that will be included with that or not, as that runs during SEA time, OCX may be left of BOTH EU and NA time zones 6 hour periods.

In addition, what happens when the servers in the match are 1 server has NA prime only, One server has OCX only and one server has EU only? No one has anyone to fight and only one score counts as full.

It should not be a case of if a server only has OCX is matched up with servers that only have NA prime that the players that play OCX would have to take off work or not rest in order to play the NA prime zone just to have their score matter..

Currently, the NA prime servers have just as much opportunity to score as the OCX only servers, they just often choose not to. if the OCX only server fights the NA only server, the OCX server is still currently disadvantaged under the current system, under the proposed system they will never have a chance to even get that far.

Your first paragraph is incorrect. You’re not reading it right. If a skirmish falls outside the designated 6 hour Prime Time then it has the possibility of having a multiplier of 1, 2, or 3 depending on the activity level. So if there is high activity level during Sea then that skirmish will score the same as a prime time skirmish.

Edit. I do think it the multiplier should be based on population balance not on activity level. If its 20 v 20 v 20 the multiplier should be 3 the same as if its 200 v 200 v 200.

They specifically stated that they have to have the multiplier tied to time of day to keep players from logging out to affect the score not just based on the actual population of the map..

It really is not a good system being proposed and more options should have been discussed before presenting it to players to vote on.

lil devils x.6071:

They specifically stated that they have to have the multiplier tied to time of day to keep players from logging out to affect the score not just based on the actual population of the map..

Yes they said that but how is that honestly supposed to work? Let’s say an NA heavy server faces an OCX heavy server. The NA heavy server has enough OCX that the activity level during OCX is kept high, at the 3x multiplier. The NA server always gets beat in OCX anyway for whatever reason. The multiplier though helps the OCX heavy server keep the score close. All the NA server has to do to win is lower the multiplier during OCX by logging out during OCX. The OCX heavy server cannot do the same during NA timezone because that timezone is going to be “blessed”.

Does that make it clearer how I say the time-based multiplier for action level seems more like a way to break potential tie conditions between two servers that end up balanced in score but not population? But it ends up rewarding the NA timezone which will result in NA players stacking NA Prime harder.

Chaba.5410:

lil devils x.6071:

They specifically stated that they have to have the multiplier tied to time of day to keep players from logging out to affect the score not just based on the actual population of the map..

Yes they said that but how is that honestly supposed to work? Let’s say an NA heavy server faces an OCX heavy server. The NA heavy server has enough OCX that the activity level during OCX is kept high, at the 3x multiplier. The NA server always gets beat in OCX anyway for whatever reason. The multiplier though helps the OCX heavy server keep the score close. All the NA server has to do to win is lower the multiplier during OCX by logging out during OCX. The OCX heavy server cannot do the same during NA timezone because that timezone is going to be “blessed”.
Does that make it clearer how I say the time-based multiplier for action level seems more like a way to break potential tie conditions between two servers that end up balanced in score but not population? But it ends up rewarding the NA timezone which will result in NA players stacking NA Prime harder.

I agree, it is a bad system and should not have ever made it this far tbh to even be discussing it yet…

It would not even need to be discussed at all if they focused on what is actually causing the runaway score issues ( passive scoring) instead. I see this proposal as a bad attempt to prop up a system that rewards lazy/ bad game play rather than later, after this just makes things worse , have to go back and take all this out making it even more complicated to resolve a fairly simple and straightforward issue.

They should just address the issue of passive scoring in the first place instead of waste resources and time continuing to not actually solve the problem that makes players not care about the score to begin with.

PPT is a dumb system, they should just have JQ/DB/BG in 1 tier with all the OCX/SEA/NA and lock everybody else out 18 hours a day with their pure NA coverage. You guys can have your own PPT wars involving NA only.

It is so boring when your opponents only has like a 10 man backcap group for 6 hours of the day even if the scores are close or whatever.

If people are so hung up on PPT there you go you can now win in your glorious PPT wars while we OCX/SEA players actually have people to play with/against.

my 2 cents.

laffingseals.5934:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lcYzOkcssE

my 2 cents.

An occasional video is nice and all, but it really it is getting to the point that this is just advertising your youtube channel.

For those who are at work or do not want to leave site, you be better to just let them know what you have to say here.

lil devils x.6071:

laffingseals.5934:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lcYzOkcssE

my 2 cents.

An occasional video is nice and all, but it really it is getting to the point that this is just advertising your youtube channel.

For those who are at work or do not want to leave site, you be better to just let them know what you have to say here.

+1 ……………

Gee, would ya look at that…I’d say a good 90-95% of those suggestions came from players…from losing servers…who identified the problems…provided the solutions….3 years ago…and were ignored…so money could be made.

Better late than never.

so your point in nightcapping is reduced the intended points if players from NA are sleeping? Wow. That idea is amazing.

IF YOU ARE AT WAR, DONT SLEEP!

THATS A SLAP TO OUR FACE – SEA PLAYERS!

Be SENSITIVE, not everyone here is from NA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If they have been listening to this thread at all they won’t go ahead with the time based scoring modifier! To be fair, even originally, they recognised its contentiousness and said they would only do if they had to. I think there are straight forward ways of measuring and rewarding actual activity, at whatever time, without resorting to such crude and detrimental systems.

Tyler Bearce.3427:

Potential (controversial) additional change:

• While the above change takes steps to bring the value of off-hours coverage in-line, there’s a good chance it’ll still be overvalued. If that’s the case (and we’ll eventually poll on this), then we have plans for an additional system.
• This is the Action Level – Victory Point Multiplier system
  • This system would multiply the Victory Points awarded by Skirmishes based on map populations and time of day.
  • During prime time hours, the multiplier would always be at it’s maximum of 3.
  • During off hours, the multiplier might stay at 3 or drop to 2 or 1, depending on on activity level.
  • It’s important to include map populations as a factor, to make the system more fair for off hours players and its important to include time-of-day as a factor to prevent a winning team from trying to keep the score muliplier low by exiting WvW

The more I read on this one, the more obvious it becomes that we have absolutely no idea how it works. Would it be possible to get some more info on how this is intended to work ?

Especially how do you plan to calculate the active population ? Is it just more than say 200 players online at the same time over all 3 servers ? Is it when 2-3 sides are roughly equal in numbers ? Is this a single map or all 4 map thing ?

How quickly will it change/react to changes in population ? If all servers have 100 players online, and one side is losing and deciding to log out say 90 players, how quickly would the system react this this ? (Regarding gaming the system).

As said before, remove the “set” x3 multiplier in prime-time, and you’ll likely lose 90% of the complaints in this thread, even if this entire suggested rule is optional and all that.

fishball.7204:

they should just have JQ/DB/BG in 1 tier with all the OCX/SEA/NA

Only, there are pockets of OCX and SEA players who are not on those servers and already made the choice not to stack into T1 in the first place.

joneirikb.7506:

The more I read on this one, the more obvious it becomes that we have absolutely no idea how it works. Would it be possible to get some more info on how this is intended to work ?

Especially how do you plan to calculate the active population ? Is it just more than say 200 players online at the same time over all 3 servers ? Is it when 2-3 sides are roughly equal in numbers ? Is this a single map or all 4 map thing ?

How quickly will it change/react to changes in population ? If all servers have 100 players online, and one side is losing and deciding to log out say 90 players, how quickly would the system react this this ? (Regarding gaming the system).

As said before, remove the “set” x3 multiplier in prime-time, and you’ll likely lose 90% of the complaints in this thread, even if this entire suggested rule is optional and all that.

Previously I wrote that the map population-based action level seemed to calculate population disparity and why. As in, when teams are closer to equal size, the activity level/multiplier is high. The thought occurred to me last night that it must also include a threshold, a minimum number of players. Population disparity alone would create some odd scores.

Why would population disparity not quite work? Take for example two low tier servers. Assume that during OCX, they both have only 10 players running around all four maps. Since they are both teams of roughly equal size, they’d end up with high activity level and score high even though they may hardly ever run into each other, which would be absurd; just as absurd as a threshold alone would be (i.e., 100 players running around chasing 10 is not high action).

Since the intent of action level seems to be to mute the effect of population imbalance (where one team cannot exit WvW to force the multiplier to be low), it’s gotta be that population-based action level would be determined by a combination of team sizes and size difference. For example, action level would not be considered high unless all sides had at least 60 players in WvW. It would stay low if one side had 60 players and another had only 10.

Lastly, Tyler wrote on Reddit that they’d make it much more difficult to manipulate than the outmanned buff. I thought I read somewhere else that action level could not be changed in the middle of a skirmish.

Reducing the point tick is great, as well as making player kills worth more points.

Still no fan of this whole night capping thing which really is not a problem. I can agree to reduce the point slightly but not make it 3 times less….

Can’t really put a judgment on the whole skirmish thing, seems like something I’d have to try out. I voted for QoL on the poll because I don’t see any problem with scoring besides the point tick issue and the lack points given for player kills, so I see no need for this skirmish thing.

Chaba.5410:

fishball.7204:

they should just have JQ/DB/BG in 1 tier with all the OCX/SEA/NA

Only, there are pockets of OCX and SEA players who are not on those servers and already made the choice not to stack into T1 in the first place.

I’ve heard the rumors of these fabled OCX/SEA guilds in low tiers but honestly haven’t seen at all outside of LAG on IoJ. Unfortunately the low tiers were always dead in OCX and I highly doubt there’s some magical population that decided not to move up tiers.

Gonna be blunt too, what these ‘pockets’ of OCX/SEA are doing is not WvW. They are literally ‘nightcapping’ since they run into nothing on the maps most of the time. If anything they should be merged upwards so that they don’t get free caps with no resistance.

fishball.7204:

Chaba.5410:

fishball.7204:

they should just have JQ/DB/BG in 1 tier with all the OCX/SEA/NA

Only, there are pockets of OCX and SEA players who are not on those servers and already made the choice not to stack into T1 in the first place.

I’ve heard the rumors of these fabled OCX/SEA guilds in low tiers but honestly haven’t seen at all outside of LAG on IoJ. Unfortunately the low tiers were always dead in OCX and I highly doubt there’s some magical population that decided not to move up tiers.

Gonna be blunt too, what these ‘pockets’ of OCX/SEA are doing is not WvW. They are literally ‘nightcapping’ since they run into nothing on the maps most of the time. If anything they should be merged upwards so that they don’t get free caps with no resistance.

I wrote players, not guilds. There’s a big difference, to be blunt. Guilds provide organization (in addition to militia commanders). Players provide raw material for that organization. You named DB, which has had almost no OCX for most of the life of this game and you didn’t name SoS. What activity you see on DB is the result of guilds. What you see on SoS is the result of players. Take away DB’s OCX guilds and it is nothing in that timezone. Take away SoS’s OCX guilds and they still have players in that timezone with nascent guilds re-organizing them. Now you could argue that they are running into nothing on the maps (even though MOS shows otherwise), but then you’re starting to cross-over into “they should play how I say” territory. Sure, their existence is one of the sources of “night-capping” complaints, but then again how they wanted to play was their choice, just as it was of DB’s SEA guilds like NNK who have stuck forever on that server through almost all the tiers.

Let me throw this question out there. Are people in favor of scoring differently through a matchup ok with winning because of a technicality? It will happen that a server controls the matchup 2/3 of the time yet still loses due the scoring system if a system that grades differently during a day is put in place.

Would you be ok with that in any other competative competition?

Furthermore do you think changing the scoring system will truly make your playtime differently, because I doubt that.

fishball.7204:

Chaba.5410:

fishball.7204:

they should just have JQ/DB/BG in 1 tier with all the OCX/SEA/NA

Only, there are pockets of OCX and SEA players who are not on those servers and already made the choice not to stack into T1 in the first place.

I’ve heard the rumors of these fabled OCX/SEA guilds in low tiers but honestly haven’t seen at all outside of LAG on IoJ. Unfortunately the low tiers were always dead in OCX and I highly doubt there’s some magical population that decided not to move up tiers.

Gonna be blunt too, what these ‘pockets’ of OCX/SEA are doing is not WvW. They are literally ‘nightcapping’ since they run into nothing on the maps most of the time. If anything they should be merged upwards so that they don’t get free caps with no resistance.

I apologize for my guild night capping (even though we had known records of fighting against DB blobs). I would love to accept your offer to move upwards if you can cover the transfer cost of my entire guild, just my guild alone would be around 230k golds. I am sure it cost more than millions of golds once you include other guilds and random pugs. I will thank you on the behalf of the lower tiers servers for resolving the night capping (even though it was caused by the T1 bandwagoners) and behalf of all night capping guilds for finding a place where they can finally strive to become skill guilds.

Well played bait, 8/8

Please. TIME isn’t a WvW guild lmao. Good joke mate, you guys are more irrelevant than KOME and don’t pretend your entire guild steps in WvW when 90% of your guild are Pve players.

DB and SoS are both very pug heavy, same with JQ. That’s the great thing. I kinda forgot about SoS despite being from there before but my point still stands, night coverage servers like DB/SoS/JQ/BG belong together because as you say, there’s always activity for pugs and the like during our timezones so no pvdoor.

As for the scoring @Conner, the game mode is 24/7. When I was losing back on SoS due to not having EU/NA I didn’t cry about nightcapping and unfairness. When we lost to JQ due to lack of SEA i didn’t take to the forums to cry about PPT and how things were bad because of ANet blah blah. I just tried, I played and tried to defend and when I couldn’t I did what I could to have fun through fights or whatever. Everyone’s way too hung up on PPT when they forget that PPT is just a byproduct of population, if your server has no population during that timezone no PPT change is gonna make them suddenly show up. In fact, any PPT change would ENCOURAGE them not to show up (eg. activity levels). This sucks.

nightcapping term gave me nightmares last night literally. wvwvw is open 24/7 since day 1 and you want to like pause it if NA players are sleeping? its like you want my guild out of this game. our guild is in wvwvw 99% of the time and you plan to reduced our impact in game?

It wasnt our fault if you are sleeping at war.

fishball.7204:

Please. TIME isn’t a WvW guild lmao. Good joke mate, you guys are more irrelevant than KOME and don’t pretend your entire guild steps in WvW when 90% of your guild are Pve players.

DB and SoS are both very pug heavy, same with JQ. That’s the great thing. I kinda forgot about SoS despite being from there before but my point still stands, night coverage servers like DB/SoS/JQ/BG belong together because as you say, there’s always activity for pugs and the like during our timezones so no pvdoor.

As for the scoring @Conner, the game mode is 24/7. When I was losing back on SoS due to not having EU/NA I didn’t cry about nightcapping and unfairness. When we lost to JQ due to lack of SEA i didn’t take to the forums to cry about PPT and how things were bad because of ANet blah blah. I just tried, I played and tried to defend and when I couldn’t I did what I could to have fun through fights or whatever. Everyone’s way too hung up on PPT when they forget that PPT is just a byproduct of population, if your server has no population during that timezone no PPT change is gonna make them suddenly show up. In fact, any PPT change would ENCOURAGE them not to show up (eg. activity levels). This sucks.

O stahp it, yew. There’s a part of a man that’s cruel to touch

fishball.7204:

DB and SoS are both very pug heavy, same with JQ. That’s the great thing. I kinda forgot about SoS despite being from there before but my point still stands, night coverage servers like DB/SoS/JQ/BG belong together because as you say, there’s always activity for pugs and the like during our timezones so no pvdoor.

DB doesn’t have OCX pugs. They have SEA pugs. SoS doesn’t have SEA pugs, they have OCX pugs. Timezones are hard, I know. OCX and SEA are different timezones. You talk about a certain level of action, but these timezones come one after the other. SoS’s SEA timezone struggled, for example.

I actually play both OCX and SEA Chaba and I’ve fought DB and been on SoS. DB has OCX pugs, not as many as SoS but they have some. SoS has SEA pugs (like those Garuda guys), CCTV etc but not as many as DB.

It’s nice you can read those PPT charts and think you know everything though Chaba.

Why am I not surprised though, having an American tell me about what happens in OCX and SEA yep yep.

fishball.7204:

I actually play both OCX and SEA Chaba and I’ve fought DB and been on SoS. DB has OCX pugs, not as many as SoS but they have some. SoS has SEA pugs (like those Garuda guys), CCTV etc but not as many as DB.

It’s nice you can read those PPT charts and think you know everything though Chaba.

Great! Then you know your personal experience cannot be extended to every OCX or SEA player. Saying a server has “some” pugs isn’t the same as being heavy with pugs in a particular timezone to the point that those pugs can continue on when a guild leaves. And were you not the one denying that there are pockets of OCX and SEA players in lower tiers? Where did these “some” OCX pugs on DB come from?

fishball.7204:

Why am I not surprised though, having an American tell me about what happens in OCX and SEA yep yep.

Maybe you should speak with SkyShroud. I’m sure he wants to hear more from you about how there’s no OCX or SEA in the lower tiers. Clearly these fabled pockets of players that didn’t want to move to T1 need to be transferred as soon as possible.

Boy, did this discussion get off track from scoring…

Bottom line: there are players who don’t want to move nor should they have to. They aren’t too heavily invested in any WvW guild to need to. They represent a server’s potential participants in WvW just as #hibergate players do. There isn’t any true population balancing that the current match/server system can support to realistically deal with these potential players (again look at Hibergate) which is why changing to an asymmetric scoring system is on the table in the first place.

DB really isn’t a lower tier… I literally mentioned them in my list of servers with OCX/SEA pugs what are you even on about?

fishball.7204:

DB really isn’t a lower tier…

What a short memory you have. They went Full status and couldn’t get any OCX guilds in even though that was what they needed at the time because “some” pugs is not enough; Grimaldi posted on this forum about it then they all transferred off and DB fell to what, T5? Did NNK transfer off? Where did some T2 OCX guilds? Not T1. SoS is what tier right now? T1 material yea or nay?

Just because some guilds and players move around in an attempt to balance populations, not everyone does. Players aren’t going balance population that way. Anet can’t solve that completely due to the fairweather/hibergate effect. When we say stuff like “if only” x population would transfer to y server for the past three years… when do we stop repeating that and start taking asymmetric scoring seriously?

DB needed much more than OCX guilds to be stable in T2. Hence the whole joke about Fallen talking about #DBmoststableT2.

DB never dropped to T5, they hovered between 3 and 4 but that’s besides the point since their ‘offhours’ held their own regardless.

Anyway my point is, any scoring changes do not do anything to suddenly introduce coverage in specific timezones. All it does is discourage people to play due to activity levels and make for a boring matchup. Being an OCX player and having YB/Maguuma as opponents is boring because they have like 15 people on a good night once a week. The PPT might be close since they have stronger EU/NA but it’s not fun for the OCX players.

I am simply annoyed at people hung up on the PPT issue which does nothing to fix population disparity to make WvW fun again.

fishball.7204:

DB never dropped to T5, they hovered between 3 and 4 but that’s besides the point since their ‘offhours’ held their own regardless.

PvDoored, some might say. If only they transferred to T1, YB could have used some SEA at the time, no?

If they were on TC at the time it’d be perfect with BG/JQ/TC having sizable SEA coverage and fighting each other in their own tier but the world isn’t perfect and WvW definitely isn’t.

Regardless any PPT solution proposed doesn’t fix the issue, instead of pvdooring at T3 or 4, their PPT is worth a bit less so they’re pvdooring T5 or T6?

fishball.7204:

Anyway my point is, any scoring changes do not do anything to suddenly introduce coverage in specific timezones. All it does is discourage people to play due to activity levels and make for a boring matchup.

That’s fair, but a scoring system doesn’t do anything for coverage. That’s why you’re getting boring matches right now even with the current scoring system. Changing the scoring system isn’t a panacea for population balance. It is only meant to remove one of the reasons population gets unbalanced in the first place; players leaving because they are always outnumbered. Examples: IoJ getting pushed up into a tier their NA wasn’t competitive in until their NA leaves or Mag being pushed into a tier their SEA isn’t competitive in, etc. Even with such great OCX coverage, SoS kept losing NA and had a great difficulty trying to attract NA. JQ is going through the same issue right now. NA-heavy servers have the opposite difficulty, trying to attract OCX and SEA for the very same reasons. No one wants to be the first in. It’s very risky.

Well I also see your point but I’d argue the PPT changes would create more population unbalances than reduce them.

For example let’s take your example of Maguuma, a heavy NA server. They might score substantially well in NA to be on even ground even against BG/TC in those 6 hours and be PPT competitive. But their 15 or so Australians who play will NOT have fun at all. They’ll just be blobbed down and spawn camped by superior numbers despite the scores being close. They’ll see it’s futile and just either go PvP or logoff instead.

Whereas right now, when a server PvDoors hard enough to move up they eventually hit a wall and get people to fight/oppose them. Sure if you look at it IoJ isn’t competitive in NA but a lot more servers are not competitive in OCX and that’s just as bad really.

There are no simple solutions and PPT changes are simply band aid fixes to something that needs surgery basically.

Fix the stacking issue that has been around since launch. Winning is ONLY about stacking a server, skill is pointless. Penalize players that stack to win. WvW sucked at launch because of stacking and NOTHING has changed.

Everything else just doesn’t matter until the stacking issue is fixed.

fishball.7204:

For example let’s take your example of Maguuma, a heavy NA server. They might score substantially well in NA to be on even ground even against BG/TC in those 6 hours and be PPT competitive. But their 15 or so Australians who play will NOT have fun at all. They’ll just be blobbed down and spawn camped by superior numbers despite the scores being close. They’ll see it’s futile and just either go PvP or logoff instead.

That’s why the time-based action level doesn’t make sense. Only the population-based one. At worse, favoring a primetime with action level is going to make players stack that timezone even more, which isn’t what I think a lot of us want.

Grim West.3194:

Fix the stacking issue that has been around since launch. Winning is ONLY about stacking a server, skill is pointless. Penalize players that stack to win. WvW sucked at launch because of stacking and NOTHING has changed.

Everything else just doesn’t matter until the stacking issue is fixed.

Spot on this server linkage system clearly won’t solve anything unless they do more.