Guild Wars 2

“We don’t care about PPT, we play for fights.”
Is a great excuse when you’re losing.

Quite bad one too.
You and your team run around an empty map, doing absolutely nothing to contribute your server while your opponent is smarter and camps/defend towers.

that was so 2013 ….

why do you care so much what other people do? live and let live.

Nick, this game has been out for over a year now. If you or anyone else hasn’t figured out that the ppt game = coverage then you have my condolences.

I know [DN] would much rather get great fights than even go touch a tower/keep. Personally I don’t mind sitting in EOTM all day getting those fights and not even looking/thinking about taking a single tower/keep.

If you enjoy playing the ppt game; then more power to you, but for you to come to a conclusion that “wanting to play for fights” is a losing war cry; then I ask you to tell that to my inventory that’s always full of bags.

Yes. But you still get to hear this excuse all the time.
Quite frankly its annoying.

Moral winner is one who get most bags.

When the game is usually decided on reset night, the fact people still say they play for PPT are just smacking their head against a wall. Coverage is what wins the game, not skill. If there is no point in fighting for the tick because you will lose anyway then whats the point?

this is more fun than pressing 1 2 3 on siege

Nick.6972:

Yes. But you still get to hear this excuse all the time.
Quite frankly its annoying.

if it annoys you, then we’ve accomplished our mission.

At this point Anet should just make another eotm map based on the hunger games style plain forest arena with a lake in the middle and no structures. Last side standing, when you die you spawn into another instance of the map instead.

That’s all the supposed pvp’ers are asking for these days it seems, a place for them to hit 1 and collect loot bags since they can’t be bothered with structures or siege or points. Bonus loot if you figure out how to break the ceiling before the other side is dead.

The winner is the one that has the most fun.

However that works out for them.

Im happy to wrack up high ppt if its conductive of fights.
Sadly the best ppt game is the one that avoids fights. Its counter intuitivev.

DeWolfe.2174:

that was so 2013 ….

more like 2012 is when ppl still cared about ppt. But i guess theres still 10% of the population who still plays it!

lets be honest, ppt means less than nothing at this point.
1. Winning gets you nothing
2. Winning ppt has more to do with coverage than how well you play
3. Ppt is determined by blobs which is boring and no fun

At the end of the day this is a game, people want to have fun. I for one rather kill stuff than pvd or spam my 2 buttons in a giant blob. if I wanted to follow orders all the time I would have joined the army.

Nick.6972:

“We don’t care about PPT, we play for fights.”
Is a great excuse when you’re losing.

Quite bad one too.
You and your team run around an empty map, doing absolutely nothing to contribute your server while your opponent is smarter and camps/defend towers.

If you want to be honest, then stop making assumptions about how fights are obtained. Best ‘play for fights’ groups know how to crack open a tower and farm bags while contributing to ppt with the gate/walls down

PPT means this: What servers you will go against next week.

Of all the variables in WvW, the match up is the single biggest one that determines what options will be open to you for having fun in WvW over the next seven days. If you care about that, then you care about PPT.

Caring about PPT and caring about maxing PPT are not the same thing.

Lets be honest, Nick you suck. Fights all the way! Who enjoys spamming seige at undefended keeps! This is fun… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYNOB2wtiuE

dwahvel.7356:

DeWolfe.2174:

that was so 2013 ….

more like 2012 is when ppl still cared about ppt. But i guess theres still 10% of the population who still plays it!

I can’t speak for all servers but most people I know still play for ppt, or at the very least do still care about it. People feel bad when we lose, and excited when we win. They shout “Get this keep fast, before tick!”. It adds an extra lair of excitement to wvw for some of us.

Yes PPT is a pretty pointless exercise, but I like to do the best for my community whenever I can. I’m sure many people feel the same, although doing this week in and week out without much reward – also with the current Match-Up system, it’s not worth stressing or losing sleep over.
Playing for PPT is not exactly as described though, you have those who Flip stuff before the tick and those who defend and Assault Structures looking for fights.

Fighting blobs and Melee trains can be both exciting and frustrating really due to the Skill lag and the lack of diversity you face. I find that dueling or small scale stuff is a good change of pace from things if you are lucky to find that sort of stuff without interference!
It’s just a shame WvW is so dependant on the Zerg mentality and Coverage.

Nothing wrong about wanting fights and not caring about PPT. On the otherhand, bring a karma train to EoTM and claim to want fights.

That’s another story. -cough-

What if I don’t care about PPT or the fights?

If I wanted a fair, challenging fight I would go play sPvP. I would care about the PPT meta if it wasn’t so boring, scouting towers, walking yaks, PvDooring, all of that is lame but vital to winning.

No really, all I want to do in WvW is mindlessly zerg down small wandering groups than watch them cry about it on the forums. Looks like I’m winning!

Played wvw since the first month of gw2, and the term “we play for fights not ppt” is not an excuse. Many groups whether it guild or commander play for fights and fights only. I myself most of the time couldnt care less about ppt or getting towers or keeping ticks etc as long as there is fights cause i know in the end of the day no matter how kittene you try, the winner is decided by one, who has the bigger and better early morning crew, and 2 more numbers throughout the day. If you like karma trains then good for you =)

Knackers.8562:

Pno matter how kittene you try, the winner is decided by one, who has the bigger and better early morning crew, and 2 more numbers throughout the day.

This just isn’t accurate. It’s determined by who has better overall coverage. Darkhaven has, unquestionably, better off time coverage than any server in former bronze league. And yet, we’ve lost to SF twice and NSP once because both have overwhelming prime time coverage (where they run us over in EB almost nightly, taking our eb keep and everything else for a couple of hours, then just karma training it).

Matches are not necessarily decided by 1 area of coverage, but instead about how well you do in all areas of coverage. Sometimes an oceanic/sea crew will win the day for a server, sometimes an NA or EU crew will win the day for a server. Thus, I don’t think it’s appropriate to just say “relax, it doesn’t matter what happens during na time, whoever has better oceanic will win”.

PPT is a side benefit of me looking for fights.

The people who say they don’t care about PPT with a straight face are only making excuses for why they are losing. I care enough about my server to try and do my part as a whole.

I want there keeps, i want there land, i want them dead and i want to win. So i get the fights, the PPT and every thing else i want by playing my best and trying to out think and outfight the ohter side.

Nick.6972:

“We don’t care about PPT, we play for fights.”
Is a great excuse when you’re losing.

Quite bad one too.
You and your team run around an empty map, doing absolutely nothing to contribute your server while your opponent is smarter and camps/defend towers.

I agree with you but at the same time there are two types of guilds. Those who play for ppt and those who play for fights, though both types of guilds may clash those who are more experienced in fights should always win.

This doesn’t mean ppt guilds are bad because it is those guilds that win match ups. They are in charge of running supply buying upgrades and setting up/manning siege. They have the potential to do well alone but they must play defensive against a fighting guild.

A fighting guild on the other hand is dependent on the ppt guilds to win a matchup. The ppt guilds tell the fighting guild where the enemy are and the fighting guild’s job is to wipe them. The fighting guild is also best suited to harass enemy territory.

No server that is in the top 3 tiers will only play for fights they will always be a hybrid or more lenient toward points. So in that sense you are correct, however both fighting groups and point groups are needed in a successful server.

Nick.6972:

“We don’t care about PPT, we play for fights.”
Is a great excuse when you’re losing.

Quite bad one too.
You and your team run around an empty map, doing absolutely nothing to contribute your server while your opponent is smarter and camps/defend towers.

I’ve heard that from several people that used to be on SBI, and guess what, they transferred to higher tier servers when stopped winning the PPT. So yeah, people care about winning, whether they like fights or not. I’m tired of hearing this PPT doesn’t matter crap, beacause it does. No one likes to lose.

I know the way the score is calculated isn’t the best, but it is what we have. I also know that EoTM has killed many servers PPT (and you would think the “we only care about fights” people would just be there).

So, why was Pyro, Ark, etc, etc, from Mag out in full force, karma training the BLs last week against SBI and BP (when they weren’t getting good fights) and not in EoTM? Because they care about PPT too.

D best.3547:

I agree with you but at the same time there are two types of guilds. Those who play for ppt and those who play for fights, though both types of guilds may clash those who are more experienced in fights should always win.

This doesn’t mean ppt guilds are bad because it is those guilds that win match ups. They are in charge of running supply buying upgrades and setting up/manning siege. They have the potential to do well alone but they must play defensive against a fighting guild.

A fighting guild on the other hand is dependent on the ppt guilds to win a matchup. The ppt guilds tell the fighting guild where the enemy are and the fighting guild’s job is to wipe them. The fighting guild is also best suited to harass enemy territory.

No server that is in the top 3 tiers will only play for fights they will always be a hybrid or more lenient toward points. So in that sense you are correct, however both fighting groups and point groups are needed in a successful server.

Indeed, every server needs a healthy balance of both types of guilds, especially in the higher tiers where enemy zergs/blobs are roaming around taking territory. It’s good to have the zerg busting guilds around to help harass/break/demoralize the enemy zerg/blob.

I’ve seen the call for EP our top fighting guild on SoS to come defend a broken outer hills from three big guild groups at the same time, and successfully held the line, while our pug zerg went and recapped/reset some enemy territory. You can bet your kitten we appreciated it when they came out to play defense and help hold off/distract the enemy that greatly outnumbered us.

You cannot land in the higher tiers without ppt guilds/commanders, and anyone who comes on to the forums and flaunt they are only for the fights and don’t care about ppt, are showing no respect/appreciation to the other type of players on their server. The players who are trying to keep their server standings, which in turn gives better fights to those fight only guilds.

I think even servers like Maguuma have realized that tier 3 and below is not for them, so they have been playing the ppt game harder than usual the past few weeks to get back into tier 2. FA and SoR will probably wake up again once they get a trip back to tier 3 and below. I can understand the servers on the bottom half of the servers not caring about ppt much though, because they don’t have the population, they might as well only fight.

yeah , play for fight but left their old “always outnumbered” server to play in a stacked server…

play for fight my kitten ….

when you are outnumbered you can get some kitten good fights. It can be fun defending stuff while outnumbered, and you can win those battles if you have enough siege, and strategy. Gotta use the choke points wisely.

Xenesis,
Servers on the lower half also care about PPT.

Problem is with many servers. We sleep, in prime time yes we can dominate when our guilds and zergs fill up all maps, but before that, barely anyone wants to do the boring map hop and karma train, its mostly just looking for a map with the most orange crosses and fight/farm lootbags. In saying that, as a silver league server fighting gold league, we lose everything and occasionally even tick 0 in the early morning cause we sleep. Iv stayed up alot to check on wvw and thats how it goes =/

D best.3547:

I agree with you but at the same time there are two types of guilds. Those who play for ppt and those who play for fights, though both types of guilds may clash those who are more experienced in fights should always win.

This doesn’t mean ppt guilds are bad because it is those guilds that win match ups. They are in charge of running supply buying upgrades and setting up/manning siege. They have the potential to do well alone but they must play defensive against a fighting guild.

A fighting guild on the other hand is dependent on the ppt guilds to win a matchup. The ppt guilds tell the fighting guild where the enemy are and the fighting guild’s job is to wipe them. The fighting guild is also best suited to harass enemy territory.

No server that is in the top 3 tiers will only play for fights they will always be a hybrid or more lenient toward points. So in that sense you are correct, however both fighting groups and point groups are needed in a successful server.

Well said.

Synergy is a beautiful thing to see in action.

Our guild is a small swat-team. We play mostly for PPT because that is how we contribute best to our server. With outnumbered buff last night, as we were 4-manning towers and keeps, we had some of the best fights in months of playing.

We ran into other small groups. We smashed into large zergs and held on long enough (barely) for our zerg to arrive (more open field fights). We had a lot of defensive fights and even a smattering of good 1v1. We went down some. So did they. Lots of /bows

Lost track of how many times we spotted enemy zergs heading for our keeps/towers, alerting our zerg and swinging back around to take part in massive fights.

Our goal was PPT.

The fights were what we enjoyed on the way.

The two are NOT mutually exclusive.

goldenwing.8473:

Our goal was PPT.

The fights were what we enjoyed on the way.

The two are NOT mutually exclusive.

Except when they are.

The PPT game plays best by avoiding fights, and can be pursued without the latter. “Fights” are what make the game rich, and without them the game is little more than a rousing game of farmville. Without good fights, unless you’re some sort of sick number cruncher, there is no reason to play, and more reason to find other players in other games (or other servers) willing (or forced by design) to engage.

Ross Biddle.2367:

“Fights” are what make the game rich, and without them the game is little more than a rousing game of farmville. Without good fights, unless you’re some sort of sick number cruncher, there is no reason to play, and more reason to find other players in other games (or other servers) willing (or forced by design) to engage.

We agree.

I think most of us would also agree that PPT needs, ahem, tweaking.

I have never done Karma trains, and don’t agree(personally) with those that ran in the days of collusion.

I’m sure there are guilds out there that focus exclusively on PPT, hitting undefended towers/keeps, ignoring enemy players and/or out-racing them.

As said in posts above, those guilds contribute to the server. And given the way PPT is currently set up, often makes sense.

Our guild is doing what we can to strategically contribute, sometimes that includes fighting, sometimes it just means getting a quick turnover on a tower or keep before the timer. Of course we are going to optimize in the moment.

We don’t run from fights, we run towards contributing. However we can. It is possible for us to both have PPT in mind while playing and enjoying fights at the same time.

We embrace all of WvW and don’t believe that overall any playstyle excludes others at a server level.

PPT is mostly about coverage. If the losing server guilds aren’t playing for fights, they’d just be masochistic in playing PPT knowing they’ll lose.

Without tweaks regarding PPT, the dichotomy will continue to be a normal sight during WvW.

I do agree intentionally running around randomly seeking for fights is a pretty dumb motive to play WvW. Usually guilds will take towers and stuff to encourage the overwhelming server leading in PPT to come to them. Running around randomly not taking anything to get a fight sounds pretty boring and random to me.

As one wise SoR commander has said: “PPT is how we get good fights, guys.”

Nick.6972:

Yes. But you still get to hear this excuse all the time.
Quite frankly its annoying.

sry but i dont get u. what is the pint of your thread?
u wanna pat yourself on your shoulders, because u are on a server that outnumbers the others? so how does this annoy u?
is it because u wanna hear me say: yes, your server is soooooo awesome we lost because u are soooo much more skilled than us, u are the man baby!marry me!…..
seriously is that what u want?
im on an underdog server in t2 and u know what? i enjooooy the fights. i dont care about the ppt that much as there is no point if u get 2 servers that outnumber u. but i enjoy the fights. i love zergbusting and thats all we do. we look for orange swords, run there and dive in and this is fun. now if we have other commanders on that go for ppt, thats great, but it doesnt interfere with my fun.
if i focus too much on ppt, i get stressed out and double teaming and such can also discourage u, so why not just go look for fights and enjoy the game?

Heezdedjim.8902:

As one wise SoR commander has said: “PPT is how we get good fights, guys.”

Nothing more fun that taking down a wall on Hills and seeing a pile of players come pouring down the hill like ants onto a sugar pile!

/wave “Guys, it’s just 4 of us!” lol

We “out” more zergs that way.

The same way people want to bash looking for fights as excuses for losing, saying you play for PPT sounds like you just run around with bigger numbers and better coverage.

“Different opinions exist.

Different playstyles exist.

Opposing opinions exist.

Opposing playstyles exist.

Gameplay etiquette will continue to evolve."

-The Zen of online gaming

Tachii.3506:

PPT is mostly about coverage. If the losing server guilds aren’t playing for fights, they’d just be masochistic in playing PPT knowing they’ll lose.

That’s one way of putting it. Another is that it’s worth fighting for something for reasons beyond just winning.

That’s what I always saw WvW as being about.

In a tennis tournament, the first round will feature unseeded players going up against the best in the world. Why bother, when they know they have no chance to win? And so on.

Qaelyn.7612:

That’s one way of putting it. Another is that it’s worth fighting for something for reasons beyond just winning.

That’s what I always saw WvW as being about.

If you’ve got a good server culture players should be willing to ‘play for the server’. That was completely destroyed by having free transfers for so long however.

Qaelyn.7612:

Tachii.3506:

PPT is mostly about coverage. If the losing server guilds aren’t playing for fights, they’d just be masochistic in playing PPT knowing they’ll lose.

That’s one way of putting it. Another is that it’s worth fighting for something for reasons beyond just winning.

That’s what I always saw WvW as being about.

In a tennis tournament, the first round will feature unseeded players going up against the best in the world. Why bother, when they know they have no chance to win? And so on.

oh how noble. quite easy when one’s server buys other servers.

Everyone loves a good fight but EotM isn’t good for fights. Any semi organized guild can go there are roflstomp unorganized randoms running around in small groups. But is that a good fight? Is there any challenge in it? The best fights have always been the close ones fought over a major objective where it all comes down to the commander and team making the right moves at crucial times to tip the balance in their favor against a skilled and evenly matched enemy. Those are intense, close, and exciting. You don’t get that in EotM. You just get even more mindless zerging and scattered, disorganized chaos where groups collapse in the first engagement. Or just capping undefended towers. Yeah that happens in EotM too. Maybe even more than in regular WvW.

I care very much about PPT.

Flipping a camp/tower is often the only way to get fights. The opposing servers always notice the only 1 vabbian camp on the whole EB.

" “We don’t care about PPT, we play for fights.”
Is a great excuse when you’re losing.
Quite bad one too.
You and your team run around an empty map, doing absolutely nothing to contribute your server while your opponent is smarter and camps/defend towers."

OP, I think kitten just died somewhere.

/sad story

Sanduskel.1850:

oh how noble. quite easy when one’s server buys other servers.

I’m on TC. I’m not aware that we have ever “bought” anything, we have no real chance to win this week, but we’re still out there trying hard.

In fact, we’re trying hard despite facing two servers that have had a ton of transfers, and have paid for at least some as I understand it. So that’s not an excuse.

Last night a guildie and I were 2 of less than 10 players on JQ’s entire BL, but we still killed yaks and flipped camps despite getting jumped and slaughtered several times.

It’s about doing your best, not only playing when you can win. Well, at least for us it is.

The only really good – unfortunately rarely occurring – is of course: Good fights to get good points.

Heezdedjim.8902:

As one wise SoR commander has said: “PPT is how we get good fights, guys.”

This.

Mag is renowned for really wanting fights but when we don’t mind our PPT we get stuck with nothing to do but Ktrain for most of the week. So we push the PPT a lil more than we’d like to get the hell away from Tier 3.

Basharic.1654:

Heezdedjim.8902:

As one wise SoR commander has said: “PPT is how we get good fights, guys.”

This.

Mag is renowned for really wanting fights but when we don’t mind our PPT we get stuck with nothing to do but Ktrain for most of the week. So we push the PPT a lil more than we’d like to get the hell away from Tier 3.

But higher tiers aren’t related to better opponents/fights, higher tiers only mean: more (quite often worser) opponents all around the time.

Heezdedjim.8902:

As one wise SoR commander has said: “PPT is how we get good fights, guys.”

So much truth to this. You could have your entire BL on lockdown, everything yours, and keeping control of your section of Eternal. Small havoc groups on the other borderlands, and then out of nowhere, YOU GET OUTMANNED AT HOME. Suddenly your entire BL is queued by one side, either aiming for your Hills or your Bay, you end up having to send out the call for people to come back to defend, and you end up with a 2+ hour battle for that one location on the map, the entire keep with massive holes in it at end, just barely having managed to hold it…and over 10g worth of goodies from defending it.