Loot drops in WvW: what about defense?

Loot drops in WvW: what about defense?

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Posted by: Slamz.5376

Slamz.5376

One thing that concerns me from the new patch notes: drop rates are increasing for killing champions and bosses.

To which I have to ask, “What about defense?”

On defense I can get karma, xp and money like everyone else, from the event completions, but obviously I’m not killing any champions or veterans — just players; the ones attacking the thing I’m defending.

MOST people already don’t like defense. Towers (and especially supply camps) just get swapped — effectively farmed for offensive rewards — which I don’t think is healthy, long-term gameplay. Adding more rewards to offense while overlooking defense will simply encourage this behavior. I hope it’s something that’s being pondered by the devs because it’s certainly going to be on the mind of the players who already say things like “let them have it so we can take it back”.

Camelot Unchained – from the makers of DAOC
A game that’s 100% WvW
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained

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Posted by: Littlefeather.8623

Littlefeather.8623

Unfortunetly defense has always been under rated.

Crazy Leg

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Posted by: Aeolus.3615

Aeolus.3615

You didnt had to defend the shrines in GW1 jade quarry also.

1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.

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Posted by: Shlamorel.8714

Shlamorel.8714

I will continue defending keeps (I enjoy that the most in wvw) regardless of the reward imbalance between offense defense… But it does seem kinda odd how much bonus incentive is given to blitzkrieg offenses.

Personally I play for fun so it doesn’t bother me directly… But I usually log for the night if the wvw matches become uncontested carousels of undefended keeps

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Posted by: Slamz.5376

Slamz.5376

Maybe loot drops could be scaled based on YOUR TEAM’S total upgrades in the zone, up to a certain point.

No upgrades anywhere = poor loot drops.
1/3rd of all structures fully upgraded = full loot drops.
Any additional upgrades = no further bonus.

So if you own your third of Eternal and have it all fully upgraded, you get phat lewts. If you own all of Eternal but none of it is upgraded then you get minimal lewts.

(We could base it on how upgraded the thing you are attacking is but that provides a disincentive for the enemy to upgrade things. Not only does it become a target but they basically gave you free gear.)

Camelot Unchained – from the makers of DAOC
A game that’s 100% WvW
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained

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Posted by: Suralin.3947

Suralin.3947

Maybe loot drops could be scaled based on YOUR TEAM’S total upgrades in the zone, up to a certain point.

No upgrades anywhere = poor loot drops.
1/3rd of all structures fully upgraded = full loot drops.
Any additional upgrades = no further bonus.

So if you own your third of Eternal and have it all fully upgraded, you get phat lewts. If you own all of Eternal but none of it is upgraded then you get minimal lewts.

(We could base it on how upgraded the thing you are attacking is but that provides a disincentive for the enemy to upgrade things. Not only does it become a target but they basically gave you free gear.)

That’s a really really really bad idea. It encourages world transfers to the point that there wouldn’t even be even matches, anywhere.

DragonBrand – Terror Gaming [TG]
Fer Aline – Thf; Suralinta – Rgr; Alyra Va Tel – Ele; Mer Aline – War

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Posted by: Ajaxx.3157

Ajaxx.3157

Its the old story of

Offense wins the fame, Defense wins the game.

Ajaxx – Warrior – [JuG] – Desolation [eu]

http://www.twitch.tv/irajaxx

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Posted by: psirca.9452

psirca.9452

Defense does need a buff.
If more people did defense and had reasons to be places there wouldn’t be nearly as large zerg forces.
It’s not that there is inherently anything WRONG with a zerg. It’s just that it works by brute force and some of us like to get into strategy based gameplay. A zerg doesn’t care if it takes tower 1, tower 2 or tower 3, they all offer the same reward. A zerg can’t decide when to defend tower 1, tower 2, or tower 3 if they all come under attack. It needs an organizing head above it to know which is strongest, which gives advantage, and which is most able to offer defense. Zerg commanders don’t usually check on these things, they just run run run to the next enemy area. We need defensive players and commanders that can lay out the strategy to let the zerg be a zerg, a pushing force to keep our enemies occupied.

The only way to get people to defend more is to offer commensurate rewards. I estimated just the other day, that if every dolyak had 10 players escorting, for a server to own even 3 supply camps on their homeland map, that would be 60 players removed from the zerg. How often can you afford to give up even 30 players from the zerg? Not often on my server unless it is really prime time and a weekend. Thirty players have to also be convinced that escorting that dolyak for nothing but an achievement tick is worth that time they spent walking for 2 minutes. Truth is , we want the bells and whistles and need to see that “ding” of an event completion on the screen to compete with the zerg because they have it. Loot bags too aren’t common on defense because player kills don’t happen.

I think the people are doing what they are told gives reward, until defense gives reward, no one can convince them otherwise. It’s up to the game to piecemeal the rewards, players can’t.

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Posted by: Shlamorel.8714

Shlamorel.8714

Not saying I support what I’m about to suggest, but buffing rewards for defense isn’t necessarily the best/only option.

Reducing offense rewards to be more in-line with defense is another alternative. It would probably just be a very unpopular one :p I will say though that buffing something (offense rewards) and dealing with this by counter-buffing the opposite (defense) can get sticky in future updates.

I have no preference if it’s altering rewards or mechanics or map geography or player mindsets, I’d just like to see more engaging/tactical defensive keep battles if anet can help improve this somehow, I’ll be an even happier camper.

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Posted by: Besetment.9187

Besetment.9187

What game are you playing? Defense gives tonnes of loot bags. Get on those superior arrow carts and ballistas.

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Posted by: Niim.9260

Niim.9260

A good defense will net you a lot more rewards from the 3 min(?) defense ticks then the attackers will earn taking the objective. The trick is having a good defense.

I do not think people generally dislike defense, I think it is more about the fact that they are comfortable being with the zerg. The zerg can only be in one place, generally, so folks will be there and not risking PvP at a defense without 20+ people to hold hands with. If the zerg turns and goes to defend, then they will all be there having fun.

~ AoN ~

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Posted by: Shlamorel.8714

Shlamorel.8714

What game are you playing? Defense gives tonnes of loot bags. Get on those superior arrow carts and ballistas.

Oh I agree whole heatedly! But I find myself alone on defense quite often and the cannon/arrow carts I try to mam are quickly destroyed.

But yes with a few comrades using siege you can definitely rack up on the loot bags. I find defense way more fun than the spammy blitz offenses.

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Posted by: Slamz.5376

Slamz.5376

What game are you playing? Defense gives tonnes of loot bags. Get on those superior arrow carts and ballistas.

I’m talking about the patch notes. Champions and veterans will have more loot, apparently including Exotics.

This will encourage offense even more than it already is while doing nothing to encourage defense (nobody is going to guard a wall when the people over THERE are maybe getting exotic drops).

Camelot Unchained – from the makers of DAOC
A game that’s 100% WvW
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/13861848/camelot-unchained

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Posted by: Marktman.5741

Marktman.5741

Did you decide to quit reading? The next part of that line was and players in pvp. You’ll get your loot n