Guild Wars 2

I’m new to Guild Wars and I was curious on a few things. I’ve been doing WvW and I noticed that there are no notifications of when something is under attack or has been taken. What was the reasoning for this? I’m also used to having raid frames and all that stuff so I was wondering what was the reason for no raid UI?

Well… WvW isn’t a raid. You have general freedom on where to go, what to take. The map gives information on where something is under possible attack, other players give information on whether something being contested is actually an attack.

Intention is that a player looks at the map, and sees these things going on. And if people don’t see, then the attackers played it smart. If everyone got notification, it would kinda discourage smaller groups trying to sneak a cap, because everyone on the map would instantly get notified.

And of course there are sites that tie into the API and update to give that information if a person really wants it.

Lunacy Solacio.6514:

Well… WvW isn’t a raid. You have general freedom on where to go, what to take.

The thing is that when my guild is doing WvW, it just seems odd they have no support for a guild wanting to run a raid and run together. Just seems odd that the stance would be “we don’t use raid frames in the UI because we want to give you the freedom..” That doesn’t really make a whole lot of sense.

Lunacy Solacio.6514:

The map gives information on where something is under possible attack, other players give information on whether something being contested is actually an attack.

Intention is that a player looks at the map, and sees these things going on. And if people don’t see, then the attackers played it smart. If everyone got notification, it would kinda discourage smaller groups trying to sneak a cap, because everyone on the map would instantly get notified.

And of course there are sites that tie into the API and update to give that information if a person really wants it.

But you also have people telling misinformation from what I have noticed. They frequently will say there is only 1 guy when there is an entire zerg capping something. Or when your trade routes go down you get nothing. I just think it is kind of silly that they don’t give you any kind of information at all for a game that is focused around PvP and has a huge focus for world pvp.

That is the risk when people play together.

As for a guild ‘raiding’ together, you have an option to have one run a tag. Of course that attracts random people, and if you don’t want that, have to run tagless. Assuming on teamspeak or something? Just requires a bit of coordination and it works well. Occasionally might have to stop and pick up your people, but that would happen with or without a UI.
You also end up with far less cluttering your screen… Which I didn’t mention before was a lot of the purpose as well. When there is a lot of stuff on the screen, it tends to get people in trouble and blocks view/targeting.

Lunacy Solacio.6514:

That is the risk when people play together.

As for a guild ‘raiding’ together, you have an option to have one run a tag. Of course that attracts random people, and if you don’t want that, have to run tagless. Assuming on teamspeak or something? Just requires a bit of coordination and it works well. Occasionally might have to stop and pick up your people, but that would happen with or without a UI.
You also end up with far less cluttering your screen… Which I didn’t mention before was a lot of the purpose as well. When there is a lot of stuff on the screen, it tends to get people in trouble and blocks view/targeting.

You are avoiding my question and I wonder why you are bothering to post here to my question. I’m asking what is the reasoning for not implementing a raid frame UI and you seem to just be giving your own personal opinions as to why you dislike them and wouldn’t use them.

Natir.7364:

I’m new to Guild Wars and I was curious on a few things. I’ve been doing WvW and I noticed that there are no notifications of when something is under attack or has been taken. What was the reasoning for this?

This game has those things.

Well you must keep your eyes on the map all the time. If you have a waypoint in your keeps and you can’t waypoint to it, its either under attack or someone is tapping it so they can attack another objective nearby making it take longer for you to stop them.

Also white swords do pop up on things that are under attack but it takes good communication and scouts to find out what is really there. I mostly roam so if I see swords on our stuff or a camp flips, that is the direction I go to. Good call outs are the number of players that took something and where they are heading next..

As for a raid UI, In my other guild players used to say they wished you could have more than five players in a group. I still use the Icons for my party group but there is a way to turn on simple which makes it take up less of the screen.. With the amount of buffs from banners, food, guard stacks etc etc. We sometimes laugh at each others buffs since the buff line is huge LOL

Not every one plays at the highest resolution so in a way if they did have a raid UI it would clutter their screens more.. I even get annoying at the UI on the top right of the screen at times, since sometimes I lose my mouse cursor on the screen, only to find out its up there in the way of me clicking that part of the map to use some skill. I basically have to adjust my camera angle to hit that part of the map since if you mouse over that UI your skills that use ground targeting will not go off..

Map awareness, most groups have 1 or 2 players dedicated to keeping an eye on the map for the little indicators. Also, moving closer to an objective will bring up it’s progress, so you can see how long its been under siege for. It adds a layer of strategy and organization to the game mode. Having small groups tag objectives and keeping your opponents guessing or spread out or not attacking so you don’t proc the orange swords so when defenders do come, they’re in for a surprise.

Raid UI are a clutter, in GW2, many groups in the higher tiers raid with 40+ members easy, that’s 8+ parties. That’s a lot to keep track of. Players are responsible for themselves, and calling out when they need assistance. This is focuses more community interaction and promotes map awareness, which can translate to higher player skill.

Good map awareness is a skill/trait that you should strive to obtain to be a better player in GW2. Whether in WvW, PvP or (some instances) PvE.

Because of the absence of these features for so long I think the WvW community now looks at the difficulty of managing these as one of the things that separates the skillful from the newer player in WvW and not something lacking in the game. For instance a skillful group has to have scouts reporting into a commander and someone keeping eyes on the map to see when swords appear rather then a notification on screen. Also a commander has limited knowledge of his zerg’s health during a push. Its up to experience to tell him when to call for a water field rather then looking at all the health bars in a raid ui. I think at this point these things have become part of the “charm” of the game to many.

Personally I think a raid ui would be too much. There are only a few skills that require targeting an ally so that feature of a raid ui isn’t needed. It would really just be about watching health bars and I’m not sure how useful it would be with how much they can bounce around and not knowing if people have their heal or other panic buttons left yet. However I do get annoyed constantly going to the map to look for swords when I could if I wanted have a second account sitting in spawn with the map always up side by side with the account I’m playing on. So why shouldn’t I be able to get that information in one place on one account without constantly going to the map.

Tofu.1978:

Because of the absence of these features for so long I think the WvW community now looks at the difficulty of managing these as one of the things that separates the skillful from the newer player in WvW and not something lacking in the game.

I don’t think having a few people only look at the map as something that is skillful but as a boring thing someone is required to do. Why do people need to even be dedicated to looking at the map? Because the devs have neglected that aspect and you guys seem to be complacent with having a few people just stare at a map for several hours. That sounds like kitten work to me, not something “skillful” players do. Please, can someone indulge me with how “skillful” it is to look at a map and relay information?

I gave reasons as to why they didn’t have it, but ok, I won’t say more besides it really isn’t needed at all. (although those posts above say it all as well, but gl.)

Natir.7364:

Tofu.1978:

Because of the absence of these features for so long I think the WvW community now looks at the difficulty of managing these as one of the things that separates the skillful from the newer player in WvW and not something lacking in the game.

I don’t think having a few people only look at the map as something that is skillful but as a boring thing someone is required to do. Why do people need to even be dedicated to looking at the map? Because the devs have neglected that aspect and you guys seem to be complacent with having a few people just stare at a map for several hours. That sounds like kitten work to me, not something “skillful” players do. Please, can someone indulge me with how “skillful” it is to look at a map and relay information?

It’s not skillful. Just like in real life, some pretty kitteny stuff becomes normal or even respectable if it sticks around long enough. These kinds of “boring” activities are part of “winning” in WvWvW. I’m afraid this is just the beginning of your annoyance my friend lol.

There is no raid UI because there is no traditional class trinity and actual raid content. In PvE and often in WvWvW, large fights devolve into balling up on a commander tag and rolling over anything with a red nameplate then collecting loot – the mechanics encourage this low effort approach. GW2’s combat is designed with small, MOBA style fights in mind (sPvP) and the grouping options reflect that, even though people have been asking for a better commander HUD and more functionality for some time now.

Natir.7364:

Tofu.1978:

Because of the absence of these features for so long I think the WvW community now looks at the difficulty of managing these as one of the things that separates the skillful from the newer player in WvW and not something lacking in the game.

I don’t think having a few people only look at the map as something that is skillful but as a boring thing someone is required to do. Why do people need to even be dedicated to looking at the map? Because the devs have neglected that aspect and you guys seem to be complacent with having a few people just stare at a map for several hours. That sounds like kitten work to me, not something “skillful” players do. Please, can someone indulge me with how “skillful” it is to look at a map and relay information?

Nobody stated that you have to stare at the map for hours.. Why do so many people twist words around on these forums.. I stated you have to keep an eye on the maps all the time and by that I didn’t mean have your map open staring at it. Meaning that every now and then push the M button and zoom your map out. You can also still be in auto run when you do this so you don’t have to be standing still. Look at the maps and if you see a camp flipped in another BL well its either a roamer or a group. It takes no more than 5 -10 secs to scout the entire map if that. If you see no swords on your stuff then no need to go scout those objectives.

Also sentries and yaks show on maps as well.. If a sentry is moving well someone is attacking it. If a yak all the sudden disappears well something killed it. Like I said you need good communication first of all. One person shouldn’t be the only person that checks the map every few minutes. I also check the map to see what enemy objectives have swords on them as well. If my side of map is fine I go and scout to see what is happening over there..

Its like the people that complain that scouting is boring yet their definition of scouting is sitting in a tower waiting for someone to come attack it when you should be scouting the movement of you enemies. How do you do that? By looking at the map and finding them before they hit an objective. Sentries, yaks, camps and mercenary camps are all good to capture and use them to help you scout.. If you flipped ogres or see ogres get flipped well its obvious someone is up there and they will most likely hit your camp next.

I’d state that you guys are having a problem because its a learn to play issue but people hate when others tell them they are playing the game wrong. So I won’t say that

GW2 is a different type of game. On servers that care to keep their towers/keeps, they’ll keep scouts around to call inc. Scouts are necessary for many reasons, some of which include the ability to disable siege, call out the guilds attacking, where they’re attacking, how many rams are down, how many are there, etc.. This way you can properly respond. Would be silly to move a whole zerg of 40-50 players if you show up only to see a havoc group that could’ve been handled by 1 scout. Or show up with 1 group only to get rolled by a blob looking to take your garrison.

Bottom line is if you want to keep an upgraded keep, you best make sure you have scouts.

As for raid UI, the days of cluttered screens are over. I think people prefer to have their screen more clean this way, and GW2 shows you can do it just fine by stepping away from holy trinity. You don’t need raid UI, you just need to communicate better on comms. Call out water, cleanses, blasts, etc.. Make sure your people know to re-rally for these things. All classes have personal heals and damage avoidance, many have good escapes, so you’re expected to be self sufficient and proficient with your classes.

There’s more communication in GW2 than in most MMO’s when it comes to WvW. If you’re used to instanced BG’s, then you’re likely used to go in, not having to speak 1 word, and go out, and get rewarded whether you win or lose. That’s not how GW2 WvW is played. Well at least in upper tiers where WvW activities are higher, people follow commanders and are expected to be on voice comms. If you care to win and do well, you would communicate well and call out your cc’s, water fields, wells, leaps, etc..

Anyways, GW2 is just a different type of game. Once you get used to it, you’ll see why it’s a pretty good WvW game, and very fun to play. It just needs a bit more attention from Anet.

I believe WvWvW is not for you if looking at the map every now and then is too much to handle.

1) Dont expect much from Anet, they have done very very very little to fix or update WvW. 3 year and finally we are getting a replacement map for WvW.

2) As FrouFrou said, if you dont like it, then it sounds like it isnt for you. WvW is about playing as a team, though thanks to Anet’s views and lack or balance, it’s all about playing as a massive zerg and outnumbering your enemies, especially when they are asleep.

Some players like playing in a zerg, others like fighting in their smaller group against the zerg, some like to protect their towers, others dont give a kitten cos they want fights and will only defend if they will get a good fight out of it.

So the biggest part of WvW is communication, if you are not on your server TS, then you are the one cutting yourself off, map and team chat are less than half of what is going on on the map.

Yes you do not get any rewards for scouting a tower, blame anet’s laziness and neglect for that, but it is still a vital part of WvW. If you dont want to hear what your scouts are telling you then again that is your problem.