Guild Wars 2

Please allow guilds with higher level auras override the claims of guilds with a lower level aura. ie. A guild with Aura III could claim an objective currently owned by a guild with only Aura I and an objective owned by a guild with Aura VIII could claim anything with Aura VII or less etc.
This would prevent “troll” claiming of objectives where someone with aura I claims your keep when it is temporarily unclaimed.

Or just make a poll on the map to force unclaim objective.

Sich.7103:

Or just make a poll on the map to force unclaim objective.

I believe that its harder to implement a voting system. Thus I find OPs idea to be much better. To only allow guilds with higher-lvl aura override an objective claim.

Troll claiming is one of the best ways to semi-permanently put a knife in the gut of opposition. Imagine that every time they come to keep, they leave with 5 (or even 10) less supplies they could have if legitimate guild had claimed the objective.

Second best way is to build a bunch of useless siege right on top of supply depot or merchant and waste the objective’s supply that way.

Third way used to be to join your side commander’s guild and guest enemy world, following their commander and providing real-time info on their movements. Anet fixed that exploit.

I agree with the OPs post. Frustrating to come to a claimed spot where no +5 is running and other decent buffs aren’t available and nothing you can do about it. There will always be trolls but this feature would allow the guilds with higher Aura to benefit their server.

Just add troll report…. And this can be good to report an entire guild…

This actually sounds like a pretty good idea, imo.

For myself, I never claimed anything until our guild had +5 (full auras) but have a few issues with reporting people for claiming without them.

Rather than talk about the systems in place or the rights of capturers to claim I will simply add my suggestion to cure the problems I forsee.

SUGGESTION

Add the troll report feature as suggested above. If it turns out the claimant did so from the Queue list when they captured it, Ban the reporter for 3 days, second offence, 3 weeks, third offence 3 months.

ADDITIONAL THOUGHTS.

The incorrect “troll report” would of course be ignored.

If necessary a warning could be placed upon the incorrect troll reporter but they obviously would not make reports without knowing who took the structure. “or why” so I see no need for a warning.

It’ll just lead to fights … Who determines who valid to claim or not.

Yep, there are troll guilds. With all the recent activity, just flip the keep. Problem solved.

Giving the power to the players to decide has, historically, been a bad idea in this game.

Highest contribution to the take gets first right of claim.
Wanting to use a particular guild’s claim as a mobile benefit dispenser has both upsides and downsides.

Ya lets report or exclude everyone that doesn’t quite measure up ,“really good idea”
Maybe you would like ANET to put timers on claims so you have to keep running back to reset all the tactivators.No thanks! Better just to put up and shut up in some instances.

This isn’t about who gets to claim the object. The original post was a request to make it so that a guild with a higher aura could claim an object. Yes there are trolls.. but trolls or not some people claim when they really don’t have many of the good buffs so to be able to override that claim with your guild claim if possible would be a good thing. That’s it… no troll reporting, not fighting, just override to benefit your server team.

The guild with most players at the capture gets to claim objective. If the most players capturing it are all “trolls” then the server is full of them. It is not supose to be a system where you can just upgrade the auras with another claim later, you have to actually be there at the time of capture with enough guildies.

This is an important item to address. Because we can’t kill spies or take them out of play, some sort of counter play needs to be in place. Apparently this is happening a lot in tier 2 =\

Naithe.4271:

This is an important item to address. Because we can’t kill spies or take them out of play, some sort of counter play needs to be in place. Apparently this is happening a lot in tier 2 =\

Yes, that’s what I thought.
HUNT captured, sieged up, sentried and walked dolyaks for first QL and then Durios last weekend. Once we’d held the tower all the way to t3 some people felt we should relinquish our claim as we don’t have +5 supply yet.

The tower of those 2 we didn’t claim of course regularly flipping all weekend and available for non “trolls” to claim.

From a server point of view, I’d go with being able to over ride with a higher aura. The server benefits. I benefit from the better aura.

You could then organise caps better so that you have the best auras on all objectives giving your server the best chance.

It’s a nice simple solution that means no input required from Anet past the programming, which suits them as trolling reports will get about as much joy as reporting speed hackers etc has done over the last three years.

Guilds that have done more pve are more important than guilds actually doing the work of holding structures.

Naithe.4271:

This is an important item to address. Because we can’t kill spies or take them out of play, some sort of counter play needs to be in place. Apparently this is happening a lot in tier 2 =\

Spies get really annoyed if you follow them around, being super friendly and helpful.

New players, however, love it and are grateful.

Eventually your spy becomes your scout — if you see him or her in a tower, you know there’s going to be inc soon.

There have been times that I have seen when the following has happened:
1) Someone for whatever reason accidentally claimed something else when their guild had Ramparts(aka Garrison) claimed. When they realised when they had done they tried to reclaim the keep only to find that someone had jumped in and claimed it who only had a partial aura.
2) A guild with a lower aura had the same number of people (or more) than other guilds when capping the objective and get first option on claiming and take it.
3) Some people due to a prior guild activity have forgotten to change which guild they are repping. They cap the objective and realise this when the list of guilds allowed to claim the objective appears. They change guilds and wait for the timers to run down only for someone else to claim it before the list runs out.

Usually the trolling is accidental – but if the claiming guild won’t unclaim it by claiming another objective it can be a pain.

Best buffs win. That is how it should have been all along.

My guild only has up to toughness on the aura, and I make it a point to only claim towers or a BL keep if there is a fight imminent and no other auras are available.

At capture, 3 guilds are offered the opportunity to claim it. Perhaps if it is dropped, the dialogue could reopen to offer the other guilds involved in the capture the opportunity to claim.

Troll claims are usually small guilds who aren’t in the top 3 of a capture event.

This thread is just another attempt to make sure small guilds leave WvW. Many already did after HoT release and now after they slowly manage to get some of the lost boosts back, you want to kick them out completely. Well, not everyone is in multi-server-thousand-member-super-guilds, people from small guilds work harder then all you big blobby lazy people and now you want to push them away just based on how many PvE players you got.

Really? Play, capture stuff, instead of sitting in PvE maps and then claiming objectives you never touched before. Nobody who hasnt been there when it was captured should NEVER be able to claim anything.

Just throwing something out there for you.

My guild is level 13, we barely have any of the WvW buffs because ANet made most things unattainable for small guilds to get. It will be awhile before I have more WvW buffs, I currently only have the exp and magic find buffs and the ability to claim towers and camps lol. But I can’t progress my guilds WvW buffs until I progress other PvE things in my guild hall so that I can get other things.

Prior to HoT, my guild had all of the WvW buffs. We desperately miss what we already earned, but have no way to get it back besides spending insane amounts of money on guild hall upgrades.

Why I claim things with only my 2 tiny buffs? Because I worked hard for those two tiny buffs lol. I only claim camps and the occasional tower – but I only claim things that I actually captured with my 3-5 man group.

Is it a troll claim? Nope, its just a claim because I took it lol.

FogLeg.9354:

This thread is just another attempt to make sure small guilds leave WvW.

You really haven’t a clue what you are talking about.
I have a small guild which I have solo upgraded to level 47 so far including all WvW upgrades and I started this thread so don’t talk rubbish about this being an anti-small guild thread.

Nidome.1365:

FogLeg.9354:

This thread is just another attempt to make sure small guilds leave WvW.

You really haven’t a clue what you are talking about.
I have a small guild which I have solo upgraded to level 47 so far including all WvW upgrades and I started this thread so don’t talk rubbish about this being an anti-small guild thread.

What exactly is your definition of small then? My guild has 19 members with only 4-5 on at any given time, all we do is WvW which really puts a big stop to us being able to level the guild. And I also don’t like to spent a boat load of money on gems to upgrade either, already been down that road to get us where we are so far.

Nidome.1365:

FogLeg.9354:

This thread is just another attempt to make sure small guilds leave WvW.

You really haven’t a clue what you are talking about.
I have a small guild which I have solo upgraded to level 47 so far including all WvW upgrades and I started this thread so don’t talk rubbish about this being an anti-small guild thread.

Ooooh! I didn’t think you could solo upgrade, so I haven’t bothered. How?!

Jayne.9251:

Ooooh! I didn’t think you could solo upgrade, so I haven’t bothered. How?!

I found 3 people to help me do the guild hall capture mission – Lost precipice in my case.
Spend a fair amount of time farming materials. The biggest pains for me were there huge quantities of sand, flax and elder wood that I needed.
I have guild missions set to PvE and usually do these during “prime time”. The “Instanced” missions I ignore.
Easy Bounty – Activate and find the bounty – during prime time there is usually at least one other guild doing the same one so you can join in for completion.
Medium Bounty – Same as easy, but there are 3 to do so you have to be quick so you’ll fail these far more often than succeed.
Hard Bounty – Don’t bother.
Easy Trek – This can be easily soloed.
Medium & Hard Bounty – Don’t bother.
Easy, Medium & Hard Races – If there are other guilds doing it then activate and give it a go. More often than not you’ll get completion.

Claiming already selects the guild with the most members present at the point of claiming to give them first dibs at putting their name on it.

Just because you have better bonuses, it doesn’t mean you have the authority to show up to an objective another guild fielded way more members to claim and take ownership of it. If you want your guild to own an objective, your guild need to show up to actually take it. If you feel your server would benefit more from your bonuses, the system is designed to encourage you to either take over unclaimed objectives, or actually do the work and go take one from the enemy.

It’s fine the way it is. The alternative would be allowing guilds with a lot of upgrades to more effectively troll their team than people just claiming stuff because it had literally no buffs or name on it.

Josh XT.6053:

What exactly is your definition of small then? My guild has 19 members with only 4-5 on at any given time, all we do is WvW which really puts a big stop to us being able to level the guild. And I also don’t like to spent a boat load of money on gems to upgrade either, already been down that road to get us where we are so far.

When I did the Lost Precipice capture mission (with the aid of 3 non-members) the guild had 7 members of which I was the only active one repping the guild (there were 2 semi active people on the roster who never repped because they had their own guild and the rest hadn’t logged in for months) – in the past two weeks 2 of the old members have started playing again and I have persuaded a couple of WvWers to join as a secondary WvW guild and occasionally help me out with the “WvW Opportunity” guild missions (plus it gives them an extra +5 supply claim option).

I usually spend 4 hours a day in WvW and the rest of the time farming materials.

From a server point of view, I’d go with NOT being able to over ride with a higher aura.
The server benefits from the promotion of the smaller guilds as all updates through from HoT have been kicks in the teeth for smaller wvw guilds.

As you promote the return of the small WvW guilds you could have teams doing stuff away from the main zerg, thus helping the server. Even if they are just doing guild wvw missions, they are living breathing bodies.

The above is opinion based as is the following;

The contempt shown to smaller wvw guilds by the systems put in place at HoT is bad enough without player driven nails in the coffin. Forcing guilds to only do pve missions is a very good way to lose wvw players.

IMHO, if a small guild claims a structure, defends it, upgrades it by running Yaks etc, then it is in the server’s best interest to support them.

TLDR: Do not allow overwriting of buffs as a given.

You can thx anet for killing small guild…
But on the map when a very small guild claim a keep and refuse to unclaim to allow bigger guild to apply bonus then you have an issue…
The guild can even uncheck the box to not allow using the guild upgrade…

On useless tower from DBL this is not an issue… But on the north tower on ABL or on the keep this is a big issue for all the server !

But on my opinion the first problem is not that the small guild want to play the game… The problem is that anet killed the small guild and if you don’t have at least 50 people in your guild spending tons on gold you can’t get back what you had before HoT !
Anet should never remove what we had before… I don’t care about that stupid guild hall, I don’t care about pve stuff inside… I just want to be able to help my server with my small family guild… Claiming stuff and applying bonus… But now this is impossible… Thx AneT…

All the guild upgrade system should be completly removed and bring back to the old way… But anet can’t do that… Too many people have loose tons of gold to build that “thing”.

“Misunderstandings and neglect occasion more mischief in the world than even malice and wickedness. At all events, the two latter are of less frequent occurrence.”

(or less kindly: Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.)

I play in T2 and routinely come across objectives with what, +20% MF (is that the weakest aura)? Much rather lay my own guilds’ claims with the +5 supply at aura 8. I suspect when I see this on really core objectives like Garrison that it’s probably a troll claim. In cases though, without confronting anyone about it, I’ve noticed that at least a couple weeks back, guilds I knew were here for the fights and zergbusting etc. laying claims but their auras were surprisingly crappy. The auras have gotten better since then, but in those cases I figured it was a claim for pride as opposed to anything else, they aren’t trolls, they maybe just hadn’t PvE’d hard enough / donation drive’d / resonanance/aetherium managed up to the stronger auras.

If it’s a guild I’ve never heard of with a claim though, then suspicion mounts. Remember that anyone can click anything unclaimed on the map and lay a claim, whether they participated in capture or not. Often things get “de-claimed” when a battle group is on the move, stripping supply out of a chain of objectives on say, a drive to a keep / garrison. It’s +5 the spawn camp, drain. Then +5 the spawn tower (thereby camp claim vanishes and it’s up for grabs), drain, and so on and so forth.

The “high claim trumps” idea floated above maybe has some merit, but that higher-claimant might be rapidly moving their claim anyhow, so then what, is the objective un-claimed after? Alternately, would it revert to the weaker claim?

I think there’s a lot of new players and returning players with all the WvW hype, these folks may not have invested in guildhall upgrades to get WvW auras, but I hope the majority are here having fun, not alts from other servers doing the troll thing. If they are new to WvW and they see the rectangle of “claim for [guildname]” let them push the button, and hope map chat isn’t necessarily full of snarky folks yelling about it. Give a little benefit of the doubt, although yes I am sure there are trolls too, I have no good idea on what you can actually do about that (how do you sort server loyalists from enemies to let, say, a majority / seniority group who hopefully aren’t trolls themselves apply a “Turncoat” debuff exactly? You don’t!)

Nidome.1365:

Jayne.9251:

Ooooh! I didn’t think you could solo upgrade, so I haven’t bothered. How?!

I found 3 people to help me do the guild hall capture mission – Lost precipice in my case.
Spend a fair amount of time farming materials. The biggest pains for me were there huge quantities of sand, flax and elder wood that I needed.
I have guild missions set to PvE and usually do these during “prime time”. The “Instanced” missions I ignore.
Easy Bounty – Activate and find the bounty – during prime time there is usually at least one other guild doing the same one so you can join in for completion.
Medium Bounty – Same as easy, but there are 3 to do so you have to be quick so you’ll fail these far more often than succeed.
Hard Bounty – Don’t bother.
Easy Trek – This can be easily soloed.
Medium & Hard Bounty – Don’t bother.
Easy, Medium & Hard Races – If there are other guilds doing it then activate and give it a go. More often than not you’ll get completion.

Just like to add that the medium trek can be done with 2 people that have 100% map completion and a guide if you don’t remember all locations. Hard can be done with 3-4 fairly easily too. Same goes for the medium and hard bounty. I know a guild that has had 3 people wait at each bounty in prime time and just tag it.

I know you’re talking about solo but it’s worth mentioning that even a couple of more people can complete nearly every guild mission and most difficulties.

Josh XT.6053:

Just throwing something out there for you.

My guild is level 13, we barely have any of the WvW buffs because ANet made most things unattainable for small guilds to get. It will be awhile before I have more WvW buffs, I currently only have the exp and magic find buffs and the ability to claim towers and camps lol. But I can’t progress my guilds WvW buffs until I progress other PvE things in my guild hall so that I can get other things.

Prior to HoT, my guild had all of the WvW buffs. We desperately miss what we already earned, but have no way to get it back besides spending insane amounts of money on guild hall upgrades.

Why I claim things with only my 2 tiny buffs? Because I worked hard for those two tiny buffs lol. I only claim camps and the occasional tower – but I only claim things that I actually captured with my 3-5 man group.

Is it a troll claim? Nope, its just a claim because I took it lol.

^this^

There’s basically no such thing as a “troll claim” any longer. Just because my small guild only has AuraIII, like XT said, we worked hard for that shet!

I think people are mistakenly thinking that claiming does something good for a guild.. it doesn’t. You don’t get favor or any other benefit. If you claim and don’t have a good number of buffs, if any, then you benefit nobody, not even your own guild. If an object isn’t claimed at all then it can be claimed at any other time by anyone so it doesn’t HAVE to be claimed at capture point. Having a setup where a guild with higher buffs can “over ride” a current low buff claim is a good thing for the whole server. It does NOT benefit the guild, so this thing about “my guild shouldn’t be knocked out of a claim” idea doesn’t make sense. Before HoT came in claiming objects and maintaining them, I think, benefited the guild.. not totally sure about that. But for sure now there is ZERO benefit for the claiming guild at all. So like I said, ya your little guild claimed it and it’s nice to see your banner up there… but if my guild comes along with a ton of upgrades and would like to claim it for the extra buffs then I really don’t see why this has become a thing to fight about.

One more item I noticed… You don’t require a claim on an object for it to upgrade. They upgrade anyway based on the number of yaks that come in. Claiming it just applies the buffs to it and allows people to add their tactics to it if they have any.

Jayne.9251:

Nidome.1365:

FogLeg.9354:

This thread is just another attempt to make sure small guilds leave WvW.

You really haven’t a clue what you are talking about.
I have a small guild which I have solo upgraded to level 47 so far including all WvW upgrades and I started this thread so don’t talk rubbish about this being an anti-small guild thread.

Ooooh! I didn’t think you could solo upgrade, so I haven’t bothered. How?!

Hey, if you got the time to grind your face off getting mats that can’t be bought or made, and the gold to buy or make the other mats.. then you can solo upgrade your hall It’s not cheap!

Balthazzarr.1349:

Jayne.9251:

Nidome.1365:

FogLeg.9354:

This thread is just another attempt to make sure small guilds leave WvW.

You really haven’t a clue what you are talking about.
I have a small guild which I have solo upgraded to level 47 so far including all WvW upgrades and I started this thread so don’t talk rubbish about this being an anti-small guild thread.

Ooooh! I didn’t think you could solo upgrade, so I haven’t bothered. How?!

Hey, if you got the time to grind your face off getting mats that can’t be bought or made, and the gold to buy or make the other mats.. then you can solo upgrade your hall It’s not cheap!

Naw I just wanted to be able to provide some useful buffs like I did in the past as a solo guild. Not sure I want to do that much pve for wvw, lol.

Balthazzarr.1349:

Hey, if you got the time to grind your face off getting mats that can’t be bought or made, and the gold to buy or make the other mats.. then you can solo upgrade your hall It’s not cheap!

The most expensive item is the 100g you have to pay for the guild hall claim. I did buy some thyme from the AH as farming it is so slow.
Other than that I parked most of my characters on the flax farming spots although I did spend an hour or two in the silverwastes each day while I needed shovels which also got me sand.
WvW sythersizers, lootbags and champ bags get you a lot of materials.
I did spend an awful lot of badges of honour – I had well over 10k of them before I started but you need a lot of badges of tribute for the WvW upgrades which ate through those very quickly.

Small guild as well, if you have some focused people you can get up there. We run about a havoc group and are at level 49 focusing on guild buffs and WvW buffs were priority. But a number of our group figured that ANet would make this vast material sinks and started stock piling before HoT release so we were ready to run.

That said this one is tough. I like the idea but its the active buffs I am concerned with too. And this could be trolled the other way to. Imagine a troll guild upgrades its guild. It then runs to each of your objectives, forces their claim over someone elses and then releases the claim. Then they circle the map and in short order nothing is claimed. Not sure which is the lesser of evils here.

The issue with the troll report is as other have mentioned, some well intentioned people might be reported when they really were trying to help since no one else was claiming it.

Balthazzarr.1349:

So like I said, ya your little guild claimed it and it’s nice to see your banner up there… but if my guild comes along with a ton of upgrades and would like to claim it for the extra buffs then I really don’t see why this has become a thing to fight about.

It is mostly about pride.

It is also quite a lot about WvW upgrades requiring PvE grind. If you do mostly WvW whole day, you will have less upgrades compared to other guild that runs PvE constantly. So, not only are we punished for playing a lot of WvW but we can not even put our guild name on the objectives because some big shot PvE guild thinks they are better at playing WvW?

I will repeat again – unless your big shot PvE guild is there to capture the objective, you have no kitten right to start claiming ANYTHING. Go back to your lovely PvE instead of starting to whine about people who actually play in WvW.

FogLeg.9354:

Balthazzarr.1349:

So like I said, ya your little guild claimed it and it’s nice to see your banner up there… but if my guild comes along with a ton of upgrades and would like to claim it for the extra buffs then I really don’t see why this has become a thing to fight about.

It is mostly about pride.

It is also quite a lot about WvW upgrades requiring PvE grind. If you do mostly WvW whole day, you will have less upgrades compared to other guild that runs PvE constantly. So, not only are we punished for playing a lot of WvW but we can not even put our guild name on the objectives because some big shot PvE guild thinks they are better at playing WvW?

I will repeat again – unless your big shot PvE guild is there to capture the objective, you have no kitten right to start claiming ANYTHING. Go back to your lovely PvE instead of starting to whine about people who actually play in WvW.

I hear ya… but as for my “big shot guild”… I got it from level 39 to 56 mostly by myself. Not that much of a big shot. I did this so I could provide lots more buffs for my friendly players. Not so I could tag a tower or keep and show that I took it with my guild. I don’t care a single bit about my “flag” flying in the objective. I only care about being able to give more buffs and tactics where possible especially in the keeps, to help protect things while sometimes waiting for help to arrive.

By the way, my little guild is always looking for more WvW players… want some buffs…? come join… if you’re on BP that is ( or FA at the moment works as well ).

I would like to add or reiterate… The claiming of the objects is NOT about “guild pride”… it’s about providing buffs to your fellow team mates. The whole point of claiming an object was created for this purpose. NOT so that some guild could boast that they took the object. Guilds with lots of buffs want to claim objects to benefit the whole group defending that object… They’re not claiming it to show off who they are… (that’s a side item since your flag is flown but NOT what it’s about for the most part).

When I come to a spot that has been claimed but doesn’t have the extra supply buff running it’s frustrating to say the least. If I’m with just a few people then the extra supplies ( 5 extra per person ) is VERY useful. If you claimed the camp/tower/keep just to show that YOU did it but don’t have these buffs running then, well, that’s all nice and actually selfish ( flames coming for sure ), and doesn’t benefit anyone.. not even you.