Guild Wars 2

Alternate title: Why The Outmanned Buff Makes Me Feel Like ArenaNet Is Spitting In My Face.

It’s no secret that when outmanned, the disadvantaged server(s) get(s) a buff. This buff provides 20% magic find, 33% extra karma and 33% extra exp! In theory, not too shabby. Pretty good, even. Except…

If your server is outmanned, there is a 99.9% chance that you are being spawn-camped, that every enemy structure is fortified and well guarded, and that you won’t be able to make it two steps out of your base without a zerg of enemies on your tail.

This makes the buff completely useless, as it does not help you survive or make up for being outmanned, it just makes it so that in the unlikely event that you capture something, it is slightly more rewarding. Not that you are going to manage to capture anything while outmanned.

This is why everytime I see the outmanned buff, I feel like ArenaNet is laughing at me, and that buff is their way to say that WvWvW is not meant to be enjoyed by everyone, but rather gives priority to the servers who can man people 24/7.

That buff needs work. There are a thousand different things it could do to help, like increasing stats. I don’t understand why it doesn’t.

Yep. WvW is currently a joke and is the only real reason I wanted to play Guild Wars 2 in the first place…

What the -F- guys.

Ditto. GW2 held my interest until I saw how bad WvWvW got. Then I just… played less and less.

They should just switch the outmanned buff with the orb buff x_x

Add another buff separate from outmanned, ‘Underdog’: Active on entire server if their capture point total is < 100 across all 4 maps.
1) reduce supply cost of siege;
2)increase HP;
3) increase dmg from player and player-controlled environment objects
Let the buff be stack-based where you have 20 stacks if your server owns nothing at all, and 1 stack if you’re at 95 capture points (or whatever value is deemed appropriate).

This would make it increasingly more difficult for a server to have 100% map control. After 80% domination, the opponents would get buffed increasingly enough to be able to push back the dominant server.

Well the whole underdog idea works with my suggestion of switching orb with outmanned.

there are 3 orbs right now right? Just make it 1, and it adds karma/gold etc

then there can be 3 levels of outmanned:

1. Outmanned = 1 orb
2. Underdog = 2 orbs
3. [insert name here] = 3 orbs

I don’t think 3 orbs would be nearly strong enough. I was thinking along the lines of 20 orbs of power (+100% hp, +1000 stats, maybe even more) for a server with no capture points at all.

Outside of the top tier match, a sizable portion of the 2nd/3rd place servers are giving up and waiting for next matchup. It’s no fun for anyone when one server owns all the map and spawn camps all the entrances for opposing servers. Massively buffing the current losers would encourage them to play more (everyone likes to be OP) and actually give a fight to the dominating server. So the next time you log in and see server ‘X’ has everything , you think, “Nice, time to go own them for a bit and take back some of our land” instead of “Hmm, hopeless cause—on to something else”

The current outmanned buff is totally ridiculous and borderline disrespectful. I have no idea who thought of it but I demand a 3 paragraph explanation on how it is beneficial in any way, shape or form to the losing team. In fact, all it does is tells me to leave because I already know we’re losing and I’m only wasting my time because we won’t get anything meaningful done.

+exp – so I can be more experience in the art of being a victim
+magic find – so I can find my teeth easier after they just got kicked out
+karma – what comes around goes around, doing the enemy team a favor so at least THEY can get something out of this. Eventually I’ll get something. Right guys….right? Yeah, no. Not this week.

Thanks Anet

Addendum: I might add, the orbs of power is a nice touch. It sure is nice seeing the enemy with the orbs of power giving them a 15% statistical advantage. Meanwhile, over here in not having fun land, we have magic find. Don’t mind me, JUST FARMING THE DIRT WITH MY MOUTH. Oh look, I found a copper.

I do agree. Outmanned is broken. Everytime I see it, I think back to the wondrous day when I was actually a raid boss in Wintergrasp. At least Blizzard made it fun to be outmanned. I could jump down and actually kill stuff before I died. Now, I just look at the arrow carts lining the exits of our spawn point, sigh and leave (Current Score: 450k, 92k, 71k <— (my server)). As much fun as it is to be trompled to death and eat a repair cost for my suffering, the “enticement” provided by outmanned is beyond stupid.

On a slightly tangential topic: why can’t players get some kill credit when they lure spawn campers into range of the brutal one shotting guards. That way players would actually get some rewards? Right now, there is a lovely see of enemies just beyond the spawn exit point (the spawn is being bombed by trebs, balistas, and arrow carts) and if you do manage to do a little damage to one and lure them in, you can’t get kill credit because the guards finish the job.

Maybe make the 3rd level of outmanned give immunity to siege weapon damage?

Too OP?

I like Outmanned, earned me a lot of Karma last Sunday and Monday night.

nachtnebel.9168:

I like Outmanned, earned me a lot of Karma last Sunday and Monday night.

Meanwhile, on Sea of Sorrows. Getting portal camped with arrow carts.

Another idea when outmanned: Deploy a cattlepult at your spawn that will shoot you to a random location in the zone (that is not directly on top of a capture point). This will make organizing a little difficult but cattlepults are fun and it stops spawn camping.

Cosine.7841:

Another idea when outmanned: Deploy a cattlepult at your spawn that will shoot you to a random location in the zone (that is not directly on top of a capture point). This will make organizing a little difficult but cattlepults are fun and it stops spawn camping.

there are 3 exits out of spawn, just so you know

(But it would be nice to flyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy~~)

I seriously wonder sometimes if someone really did just mix up the out manned and orb off…and they just don’t want to admit. Like one day I will log in and they will be flipped with no patch notes.

I would LOVE to read a three paragraph explanation for why an out manned losing team should get exp and karma buffs. I would love to see what kind of “logic” reaches that conclusion.

mangocheesecake.1487:

Cosine.7841:

Another idea when outmanned: Deploy a cattlepult at your spawn that will shoot you to a random location in the zone (that is not directly on top of a capture point). This will make organizing a little difficult but cattlepults are fun and it stops spawn camping.

there are 3 exits out of spawn, just so you know

(But it would be nice to flyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy~~)

Exactly. I always see people going straight and fighting a mob of enemies right outside spawn. meanwhile I go a DIFFERENT exit and take a camp.

mangocheesecake.1487:

Cosine.7841:

Another idea when outmanned: Deploy a cattlepult at your spawn that will shoot you to a random location in the zone (that is not directly on top of a capture point). This will make organizing a little difficult but cattlepults are fun and it stops spawn camping.

there are 3 exits out of spawn, just so you know

(But it would be nice to flyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy~~)

shhhh, don’t let the secret out

I wonder what’s going to happen when these spawn camped servers have all three of their exits blocked by treb fire and arrow carts.

Still no idea when that buff even kicks in, and I still think its 4 to 1 or a worse ratio than that.

Its not 3 to one, because I have counted that ratio many times when two zerg groups are taking over a map and only 20 of us defenders are around.

Its much higher, 5 to 1 is my minimum guess. Which makes it the dumbest buff in the game. A special kind of stupid design mechanic, imho.

You can’t defend with it, you can rarely capture anything significant with it, the xp/karma that you do get pales in comparison to the zerg groups who lay on the other side of that buff and cause the other teams to have it.

If you do put a team together to get supply points or such, you still can’t capture anything significant other than run around as guerilla gang who get ganked and provides xp and karma rewards for the overpowering team and enormous repair costs for the underdogs.

I don’t even bother WvW when that buff is up, I simply leave WvW like most players.

The boosts are nice but I feel like those things are partially what the orbs should be about. Give some gathering and EXP boosts to orbs and there’s a lot of incentive for a server to hold them because that would effect everyone on the server. A stat boost is acceptable with this as well but it cannot be too large.

Outmanned should probably not affect anything in terms of gains. To the victors go the spoils, after all. What it should do is help maintain a competitive parity for the team on the ropes. Again, noting excessive but something that helps them be a bit competitive. Minor stat bonuses. Perhaps increased badge drops to help with procuring siege, within reason. That sort of thing.

Sky.9347:

I wonder what’s going to happen when these spawn camped servers have all three of their exits blocked by treb fire and arrow carts.

They all go to one map for everything and that one map can’t be blockaded; their own borderlands. All three exits on every map aren’t blockaded on my server. However, there are roaming (bored) squads near every exit in all the maps that can be blockaded.

If you look on the maps where servers are getting dominated, you can see the precious few points they get are from their own borderlands. It’s impossible to blockade and provides a place to group for the few players still doing WvW. That’s the place to go for actual fights. Anywhere else is a ghostland with bored rovers sitting near the exits.

None of this changes the fact that outmanned is a terrible mechanic.