Guild Wars 2

*Introductory note: I dislike creating threads with the same topic as some old thread, but search/sort function of GW2 forum is, quite unreliable. I suspect SOMEONE must’ve had the same idea and posted it on the forums, but couldn’t find any through search function.

First I would like to introduce my world: Kaineng. We constantly battle against Eredon Terrace to not be the first (from last).

Of course, WvW being WvWvW, any other world we face against other than ET has a lot more participants. 90% of the time I have this neat “buff” saying we’re “outnumbered”

But let’s look @ the buff benefits.

“The enemies greatly outnumber your forces, be careful out there!
+33% Experience
+20% Magic find
+25% World Experience
Take no armor damage on death”

In my opinion, these “buffs” are too self-centered when the WvW should be about the team (world) and thus should give more “worldly benefits”.

1. Experience : 33% more Experience? Great! But it’s only for you and your teammates, but not to the world itself.

2: Magic Find: Same goes with the +20% Magic Find. Seriously, if you find a precursor in a WvW drop, the chances are you’re leaving WvW game immediately to craft legendary or something.

3. World Experience : This would be the only real benefit to the World-game itself would be +25% World Experience. This, in my opinion, is fine.

4. No armor damage: Now that armor repair is free, I don’t even know why this would be a “buff”.

Some suggestions:

1. Longer “Righteous Indignation.” The standard length of time of RI is three minutes. Three minutes is a long time to wait, but it’s a short time to get somewhere, and cap a point. This means, by the time you’re done capturing a point, get the RI up, and move onto your way to another capture point, the chances are the previously captured point has lost its RI hence re-capped.

The argument may be that WvW isn’t just a capping game, but also a defending game. But seriously, you are “outnumbered” good luck defending against a swarm of zergs.

The longer RI would serve to give the outnumbered team to strategically time their cap points to get the resulting World-Points.

2. Give a buff that actually DOES help when you’re facing off a larger force. This would mean not more experience. And there would be tons of way to do this.

a. Reduce cooldown time of elite skills.
I’ve read the forums that some of the elite skills have way too long CD, but the power they give are too underwhelming. I agreed, and thought to implement it somewhere.

c. Faster capture speed
Self explanatory.

d. Bonus expendable World Ability Points (that is nulled when the “outnumbered” is finished)
Doesn’t have to be ability points, but rather the buff to give one or two more “sub-ranks”
e.g. If I wanted two more subranks on the “Guard Killer” Upgrade from rank 7 to 9, I would’ve needed 45 WAPs.

e. Easier to demoralize/help mercenaries

These are some examples that DON’T directly buff our characters, but rather the World itself. Frankly, I thought the direct buffs like the movement speed buff mentioned above are quite “boring” and “dull.” If the Anet isn’t too creative, then they could just replace the buff to like “+n Power, +n Vitality, +n Toughness” whatever.

The point is that the current buffs don’t buff the World as a whole, and I think it is quite serious to the Worlds that are frequently “outnumbered” and everyone knows being outnumbered in WvW is an extremely hard challenge.

I always thought that this so called “buff” was kind of useless and it does not help you over come you being out numbered, WoW had a similar system that actually boosted your stats while I don’t think anet should do the same they really need to change this buff and give us something usefull that will help when fighting servers who out number you 100 to 1.

It’s not supposed to be a powerful buff. ANet does not want guilds bullying people off of maps so that they can keep their buff.

Whether you dislike their reasoning or not, that’s why outmanned buff is the way it is.

“The enemies greatly outnumber your forces, be careful out there!
+33% Experience
+20% Magic find
+25% World Experience
+1 hour siege timer and stop siege decay
Take no armor damage on death”

i love to play outnumbered at nights in our home border . because i am carrying about my server , i am wasting all of my time refreshing the sieges in our main keeps .

WHAT A GAME

The only real purpose the outmanned buff seems to do is serve as a deterrent to enter WvW.

While some could care either way if they’re outmanned or not, IE, sitting in their keep on mumble ready to call in the map hopping zerg, for most that enter WvW, will leave.

Actually a buff given based on how far ahead a server is ahead of the others is more of a population balancing mechanism.

Once one server is ahead of the others by 10K ppt or more Undermanned buffs kick in to help the weaker servers even the match. Its tiresome to play a match that cannot be won, and it demoralizes players to see that its impossible to catch up.

Here’s an example of how these buffs would work……

Stage 1 (5k ahead)
RI camp and tower buffs for lead nation vanishes while RI duration increases for captured camps from Undermanned servers (length of increase is up to debate).
+33% more wxp
+33% more drops
+33% more rare magic drops
All kills (players and npc’s ) made upon leading servers count as ppt.
Capturing towers and keeps on lead nation gives bonus pts upon capture (50 for camp, 300 per tower, 500 per keep. Capturing upgraded objectives grants more per level of upgrade).

Stage 2 (10k-20k)
Double the buffs above.
Increase RI duration a little(on lowest scoring server).
2x pts for killing lead nation players
Double bonus points for capture objectives on leading servers.

Stage 3 (20k+)
+5 supply carry for lowest scoring server.
5 x pts for killing lead server players.
Triple bonus points for capturing objectives on leading servers.

This would help slow down a stacked server because it would force more to defend on that server, while encouraging more participation on the undermanned ones because effort to take objectives and fight lead server actually show on the scoreboard.

This buffs are only applied when point score leads reaches those thresholds and can be given to any server.

It would help prevent blow outs and the constant k-training of the weakest server in the match up while encouraging a team up on the lead nation.

Now, these suggestions don’t affect population advantages in combat but it does mitigate blow outs while rewarding players who participate in wvw on low pop servers.

Even just placing a bounty (bonus on higher scored server’s objectives and player kills) can really help balance play between servers with mis-matched population, as weaker servers are encouraged to double team the lead nation.

Bounties can be in the form of wxp, drops, gold, and wvw scoreboard points with different amounts depending on how far ahead lead nation is in comparison to other servers. Lowest scoring server’s objectives should give only standard rewards to those who capture them.

i know last week you guy’s at Kain put up a good fight and yes I’m on ar.

Highly agree that Outnumbered needs an overhaul.
OP_ has aprox. what is needed
I do like the notion from Jaytee about added bonus based on being general underdog situation. But Mostly it needs – actual player – equalization -. There far -far greater options being more players than most mere extra stats can give.

First off- home map should gain the greater benefit.. So that being outnumbered in the home map gets a higher boost.

It also needs to be scaled a bit. say you are outnumbered 1/3 or 1/5 or 1/10- various stages so that a few stands just a bit of a chance against the many.

Supply carry (3/5/10): Extra subs can’t be moved to other map.
Longer Righteous (1 min/3/5)
Boost to nearby Lords-Vets Health: Say 10%/30%/50% if an outnumbered player is near.
Actual Player stat increase: Say 3%/5%/10% more health to players.
Wall and gate health: Could be that while outnumbered the workers repairing actively does so while being attacked- and get a health boost.- just means its defend last a bit longer. (walls and gates are flimsy enough as is) (and btw in general should have more health)
Keep Lords noting the outnumbered factor. and rally extra NPC guards to defend.
Stages could be.
Stage 1: +1 “guardian” type Vet. giving passive buffs and hard to kill.
Stage 2: Guard vet +1 Stealth hunter; a Vet Ranger that can detect stealth in Keep inner side and marks that location on map and sends pet to attack it.
Stage 3: Guard +Stealth hunter +1 poison caster that can actually stand by the lord an hits enemy with aoe damage -

At highest outnumbered stage and if no supply camp is yours,- on HOME map: spawn a NPC Havoc team at home base that charges away and takes a camp and holds that for 10 minutes with Righteous. Sort of like the breakout Champ.- just automated and based on giving players a chance of gaining sups again.

I’d like to see an automatic alliance kick in when one server is dominating the other two.

While some upgrades to out numbered aren’t a bad idea, the mechanic itself is an indicator that something is fundamentally poorly designed in the system.

This is one of the many topics that’s been discussed over and over and over and…..

Seriously though, if the WvW team wants to earn some points back with the community they will take a look at this buff and think of some ways to improve it.

The big thing is armor repair is no longer in the game, so the greatest benefit is no longer there.

I wouldn’t mind seeing more siegerazor events.

I’d say the OP and Jaytee have some great ideas on balancing out not only Outmanned, but server population issues as well.

To prevent server manipulation of triggering buff or bounty a minimum participation level (objectives captured, hrs played in matchup, players killed etc) could be instilled so only players that meet them would gain the benefits…..

Or you could base bonuses or bounties based on each individuals effort (more objectives taken/players killed, higher bonus/bounty).

These buffs only apply to individual players when differences between warscore begin to rise.

I’m only looking to reward players who play on underpopulated servers during a match up. More effort should receive more rewards and playing underdog is extremely tiresome in my opinion.

[quote=4116508;VladeKR.9851:

2: Magic Find: Same goes with the +20% Magic Find. Seriously, if you find a precursor in a WvW drop, the chances are you’re leaving WvW game immediately to craft legendary or something.
[/quote]

20% magic find is so minor it’s like a mosquito attacking an elephant, so even though its there it would be unlikely that pre’s would start falling-out of the air (nice thought though).

Considering the outnumbered buff sometimes seems completely random I’m not sure I want to make it more powerful.

Sometimes it’ll blink on and off

I’ve been in parties where some have it and some not, despite being on the same map, at the same place, at the same time.

But yeah, as a low pop server player I’d like to get some kind of compensation for the free armor repairs.

Repairs are free so armor not breaking is very useless right now. Magic find is a joke and so is the exp buff. All in all the only thing out maned buff is for is to see if its even worth zoning in. Generally if your a roamer and the OM buff is up it’s a good sign where ever you go its going to be a 1v3 or 1v5.

That all said the real solution is to simply merge the bottom 3 servers. In terms of the true bottom ET,Kain these 2 servers should simply be merged as neither has a population to make one full zerg at any given time.

Might be nice to see the “no armor damage on death” buff changed to an increase in toughness stat.

Another idea could include an increased siege weapon dmg buff whilst outnumbered, since it’s likely that a small group of people will be defending structures against a blob.

Right now, you can be quite prepared, but 4 people trying to hold garrison against a blob of 30 is usually a given outcome.

I’m not sure about the details, but the idea of removing Outnumbered and putting in “Outpointed” sounds decent to me.

Evalia.7103:

I’m not sure about the details, but the idea of removing Outnumbered and putting in “Outpointed” sounds decent to me.

Or how about—‘WARNING—-You are about to be crushed——Proceed with Caution’, and when your dead another pop up—-‘Told you so’.

Shadey Dancer.2907:

Evalia.7103:

I’m not sure about the details, but the idea of removing Outnumbered and putting in “Outpointed” sounds decent to me.

Or how about—‘WARNING—-You are about to be crushed——Proceed with Caution’, and when your dead another pop up—-‘Told you so’.

The “Told you so.” would imply thinking during programming, and a huge sense of humor.

I remember one system at work where a co-worker asked me for help and when I looked at their screen the message “Do you know what you are doing?”

I laughed and had to quickly explain (after getting a laser death stare) that I wasn’t laughing at them, I was laughing at the fact someone took the time to write that code.

Life lesson for you all out there. When someone comes to you for help, it’s best not to laugh at them.

“The standard length of time of RI is three minutes. "

It’s 5 Minutes unless there’s something I don’t know about.