So every one play bunker but the condi dmg players who am i kidding they are already bunker. What a boring game that would be and is becoming. Your counter is asking for players to put every thing into counter condi where ppl only need to do a much smaller amount to deal with power dmg. There is something wrong with that.
Condi dmg will not be fixed untill they treat it like power dmg or they start to treat power dmg like condi dmg anything less then that is a waist of time and suggestions.
Because condi clears are tied to toughness/vitality/healing power.
/s
Well ya condi clears are def tool so they would be tide to def combos the problem is you need to run every thing to counter them you cant just run one thing to kind of get by. Its too all or nothing where the ones using the condis them self can go both high bunker and high dmg at the same time with condis. It is the only thing in the game that can do that and it makes all other builds pointless beyond you must run the same condi dmg build or the super counter build. That a real problem in a game that is made to be played any way you want. It would be a problem in any game even the super meta build gear score games.
Runes of hobrik is the best example of showing what is wrong. Before condi was there but it was not the end all be all so hobrik runes where super expensive because you could run that power build with some counter condi -20% duration was enofe most of the time and that was more to counter soft cc. But once they added in stacking hobrik drooped like a stone (i understand that -40% duration food got nerf too but the condi duration food got hit all though they added in gear that give condi duration ontop of that with out adding in gear that was -% over all part of the problem) now its at 10s on good day or such when it use to be in the 10G ranges. Its a crazy telling of ppl behaviors to condi -% duration and where the game is.
So every one play bunker but the condi dmg players who am i kidding they are already bunker. What a boring game that would be and is becoming. Your counter is asking for players to put every thing into counter condi where ppl only need to do a much smaller amount to deal with power dmg. There is something wrong with that.
Condi dmg will not be fixed untill they treat it like power dmg or they start to treat power dmg like condi dmg anything less then that is a waist of time and suggestions.
Because condi clears are tied to toughness/vitality/healing power.
/sWell ya condi clears are def tool so they would be tide to def combos the problem is you need to run every thing to counter them you cant just run one thing to kind of get by. Its too all or nothing where the ones using the condis them self can go both high bunker and high dmg at the same time with condis. It is the only thing in the game that can do that and it makes all other builds pointless beyond you must run the same condi dmg build or the super counter build. That a real problem in a game that is made to be played any way you want. It would be a problem in any game even the super meta build gear score games.
Runes of hobrik is the best example of showing what is wrong. Before condi was there but it was not the end all be all so hobrik runes where super expensive because you could run that power build with some counter condi -20% duration was enofe most of the time and that was more to counter soft cc. But once they added in stacking hobrik drooped like a stone (i understand that -40% duration food got nerf too but the condi duration food got hit all though they added in gear that give condi duration ontop of that with out adding in gear that was -% over all part of the problem) now its at 10s on good day or such when it use to be in the 10G ranges. Its a crazy telling of ppl behaviors to condi -% duration and where the game is.
That was incredibly hard to read. I’ve seen other posts by you, so I’m reasonably sure you are attempting to troll again. Unfortunately ( for you) you’re just highlighting your true nature.
The gist seemed to be:
you think condi clears should be improved by a gear stat. Or I’m misunderstanding and you are attempting to assert that they ARE tied to a defensive stat..
And that you are totally ignorant to the fact that “condi builds” still deal direct damage, however that is sacrificed when running bunker gear with condi dmg.
If you truly believe that a build (any build at all) can dish out the same damage output with trailblazers, and it can with vipers then you are going to be disappointed.
There is at least one other false assertion in there, but that horse has been dead so long, there is no longer a corpse to beat.
There is room for discussion regarding condi damage attempting to compete with power, instead of ferocity as a stat, and also changes to resistance, and duration/damage. However that is a different topic for a different thread.
So unless you actually have any constructive advice on “how to handle conditions” I suggest you try another thread.
/forum bug.
.
So every one play bunker but the condi dmg players who am i kidding they are already bunker. What a boring game that would be and is becoming. Your counter is asking for players to put every thing into counter condi where ppl only need to do a much smaller amount to deal with power dmg. There is something wrong with that.
Condi dmg will not be fixed untill they treat it like power dmg or they start to treat power dmg like condi dmg anything less then that is a waist of time and suggestions.
Because condi clears are tied to toughness/vitality/healing power.
/sWell ya condi clears are def tool so they would be tide to def combos the problem is you need to run every thing to counter them you cant just run one thing to kind of get by. Its too all or nothing where the ones using the condis them self can go both high bunker and high dmg at the same time with condis. It is the only thing in the game that can do that and it makes all other builds pointless beyond you must run the same condi dmg build or the super counter build. That a real problem in a game that is made to be played any way you want. It would be a problem in any game even the super meta build gear score games.
Runes of hobrik is the best example of showing what is wrong. Before condi was there but it was not the end all be all so hobrik runes where super expensive because you could run that power build with some counter condi -20% duration was enofe most of the time and that was more to counter soft cc. But once they added in stacking hobrik drooped like a stone (i understand that -40% duration food got nerf too but the condi duration food got hit all though they added in gear that give condi duration ontop of that with out adding in gear that was -% over all part of the problem) now its at 10s on good day or such when it use to be in the 10G ranges. Its a crazy telling of ppl behaviors to condi -% duration and where the game is.
That was incredibly hard to read. I’ve seen other posts by you, so I’m reasonably sure you are attempting to troll again. Unfortunately ( for you) you’re just highlighting your true nature.
The gist seemed to be:
you think condi clears should be improved by a gear stat. Or I’m misunderstanding and you are attempting to assert that they ARE tied to a defensive stat..
And that you are totally ignorant to the fact that “condi builds” still deal direct damage, however that is sacrificed when running bunker gear with condi dmg.
If you truly believe that a build (any build at all) can dish out the same damage output with trailblazers, and it can with vipers then you are going to be disappointed.There is at least one other false assertion in there, but that horse has been dead so long, there is no longer a corpse to beat.
There is room for discussion regarding condi damage attempting to compete with power, instead of ferocity as a stat, and also changes to resistance, and duration/damage. However that is a different topic for a different thread.
So unless you actually have any constructive advice on “how to handle conditions” I suggest you try another thread.
That the thing about condi dmg it dose not need to give up def to run effective dmg as though condi. That and condi effects have there own build in counter to the counters your talking about that is simply having a cover condi effect. Most removal do not let you chose what your clearing. So to clear that high hitting condi effect you must clear all condis over all costing a few skills where the condi player is only burning 1 to 2. It just dose not work out.
Ppl who use vipers tend to run other means of def be that stealth build in taking 0 dmg. The power dmg is ok on things like vipers but with out a crit dmg over all its not that effective for the pure condi builds. Trailblazers as giving condi dmg condi duration vit and def is very powerful for over all play and has no counter gear set up.
I am not sure why you think full trailblazers is not good for condi dmg.
So every one play bunker but the condi dmg players who am i kidding they are already bunker. What a boring game that would be and is becoming. Your counter is asking for players to put every thing into counter condi where ppl only need to do a much smaller amount to deal with power dmg. There is something wrong with that.
Condi dmg will not be fixed untill they treat it like power dmg or they start to treat power dmg like condi dmg anything less then that is a waist of time and suggestions.
Because condi clears are tied to toughness/vitality/healing power.
/sWell ya condi clears are def tool so they would be tide to def combos the problem is you need to run every thing to counter them you cant just run one thing to kind of get by. Its too all or nothing where the ones using the condis them self can go both high bunker and high dmg at the same time with condis. It is the only thing in the game that can do that and it makes all other builds pointless beyond you must run the same condi dmg build or the super counter build. That a real problem in a game that is made to be played any way you want. It would be a problem in any game even the super meta build gear score games.
Runes of hobrik is the best example of showing what is wrong. Before condi was there but it was not the end all be all so hobrik runes where super expensive because you could run that power build with some counter condi -20% duration was enofe most of the time and that was more to counter soft cc. But once they added in stacking hobrik drooped like a stone (i understand that -40% duration food got nerf too but the condi duration food got hit all though they added in gear that give condi duration ontop of that with out adding in gear that was -% over all part of the problem) now its at 10s on good day or such when it use to be in the 10G ranges. Its a crazy telling of ppl behaviors to condi -% duration and where the game is.
That was incredibly hard to read. I’ve seen other posts by you, so I’m reasonably sure you are attempting to troll again. Unfortunately ( for you) you’re just highlighting your true nature.
The gist seemed to be:
you think condi clears should be improved by a gear stat. Or I’m misunderstanding and you are attempting to assert that they ARE tied to a defensive stat..
And that you are totally ignorant to the fact that “condi builds” still deal direct damage, however that is sacrificed when running bunker gear with condi dmg.
If you truly believe that a build (any build at all) can dish out the same damage output with trailblazers, than it can with vipers then you are going to be disappointed.There is at least one other false assertion in there, but that horse has been dead so long, there is no longer a corpse to beat.
There is room for discussion regarding condi damage attempting to compete with power, instead of ferocity as a stat, and also changes to resistance, and duration/damage. However that is a different topic for a different thread.
So unless you actually have any constructive advice on “how to handle conditions” I suggest you try another thread.
That the thing about condi dmg it dose not need to give up def to run effective dmg as though condi. That and condi effects have there own build in counter to the counters your talking about that is simply having a cover condi effect. Most removal do not let you chose what your clearing. So to clear that high hitting condi effect you must clear all condis over all costing a few skills where the condi player is only burning 1 to 2. It just dose not work out.
Ppl who use vipers tend to run other means of def be that stealth build in taking 0 dmg. The power dmg is ok on things like vipers but with out a crit dmg over all its not that effective for the pure condi builds. Trailblazers as giving condi dmg condi duration vit and def is very powerful for over all play and has no counter gear set up.
I am not sure why you think full trailblazers is not good for condi dmg.
Reading is hard.
Heres the bit you misunderstood again.
same damage output with trailblazers, than it can with vipers
To further enhance this: damage =/= condition damage.
snip
People always overlook the fact that power and precision do stuff, even for condition builds.
“So unless you actually have any constructive advice on “how to handle conditions” I suggest you try another thread.”
Your just a TROLL , a complete and utter troll that’s the only explanation how can you defend this meta? why do you defend this meta? is someone paying you ?
going to make this pretty obvious why this is a rude and pointless post only meant to troll and irritate people. . .
IT’ IS IMPOSSIBLE TO CLEANSE AFTER BEING HIT BY AN EPI BOMB, ANY SKILL WILL KILL YOU FROM CONFUSION!!!! GOOD LUCK EVEN HAVING A SINGLE FRAME TO ACTIVATE SKILLS OR EVEN SEE THE CONDITIONS. It’s UTTERLY unbelievable how people think epidemic is a “fair skill” please kitten you are completely and utterly wrong.
I agree to cap conditions if u cap direct damage too. THey are the same thing : with direct damage i lose 5000 vitality with one hit … with condi damage i lose 5000 vitality with 5 tick of 1000 … but they are both given from a single skill. Avoid a condi burst or avoid a direct bust is the same ( dodge, block … ) . I don’t play necromancer or reaper but i have understood that when i play a weak class to condi ( for example core P/P engi ) i usually die becouse i have not block, dodged or avoid in any other way a condi burst . The time i am able to avoid a condi burst … i don’t die and sometime i win .
@ProDecius I do agree with you that epidemic is still a skills that in groupfights can be inbalanced, as it transfers not only the conditions you applied as a necro, but all the conditions currently on the target (up to 25 stacks per condition).
Rarely seen it used with confusion-mesmer though, as it requires a lot of teamwork to pull that off. Confusion has been in the game for a long time and it was always possible to get 25 stacks of confusion on yourself before. It should do around 4000 points of damage on skilluse btw. So yes, it hurts, but confusion alone does not kill you instantly.
One of the biggest issues with Epi specifically is that the animation on the person being casted on has 2 explosions but the spread happens on the first as its being animated… Not even when it expires. Granted I tested this a couple months back to find the Epi “tell” from the receivers end, so things may have changed on the recent patch.
“So unless you actually have any constructive advice on “how to handle conditions” I suggest you try another thread.”
Your just a TROLL , a complete and utter troll that’s the only explanation how can you defend this meta? why do you defend this meta? is someone paying you ?
going to make this pretty obvious why this is a rude and pointless post only meant to troll and irritate people. . .
IT’ IS IMPOSSIBLE TO CLEANSE AFTER BEING HIT BY AN EPI BOMB, ANY SKILL WILL KILL YOU FROM CONFUSION!!!! GOOD LUCK EVEN HAVING A SINGLE FRAME TO ACTIVATE SKILLS OR EVEN SEE THE CONDITIONS. It’s UTTERLY unbelievable how people think epidemic is a “fair skill” please kitten you are completely and utterly wrong.
Step 1) deal with condi before epi.
step 2) oh look, you aren’t dead.
Step 3) victory cheer. You successfully learnt to play. Take a bow.
Try the “L2P” option before throwing around insults.
However if you know someone willing to pay me for wearing a captain obvious hat, please dont send me their names.
PS. drink some water. You look like you’re at risk of death by salt overdose.
“So unless you actually have any constructive advice on “how to handle conditions” I suggest you try another thread.”
Your just a TROLL , a complete and utter troll that’s the only explanation how can you defend this meta? why do you defend this meta? is someone paying you ?
going to make this pretty obvious why this is a rude and pointless post only meant to troll and irritate people. . .
IT’ IS IMPOSSIBLE TO CLEANSE AFTER BEING HIT BY AN EPI BOMB, ANY SKILL WILL KILL YOU FROM CONFUSION!!!! GOOD LUCK EVEN HAVING A SINGLE FRAME TO ACTIVATE SKILLS OR EVEN SEE THE CONDITIONS. It’s UTTERLY unbelievable how people think epidemic is a “fair skill” please kitten you are completely and utterly wrong.
Step 1) deal with condi before epi.
step 2) oh look, you aren’t dead.
Step 3) victory cheer. You successfully learnt to play. Take a bow.Try the “L2P” option before throwing around insults.
However if you know someone willing to pay me for wearing a captain obvious hat, please dont send me their names.PS. drink some water. You look like you’re at risk of death by salt overdose.
Ignoring insulting parts, you are wrong Artemis. Do you even play WvW? Anyway, doesn’t matter. Our voices won’t be heard, unless the Balance Team of what this game has comes in WvW and see for themselves.
Condi bombing works by overwhelming a focused target or area with condition, and the more coordinated it is, the more difficult is to “avoid it”. By avoid I mean either kill them before they can condi bomb you, keep them in CC or whatever pressure to prevent them to do it, but these will only delay the moment. So basically kill them or you will be hit sooner or later.
The problem is that after you are hit, there is no counterplay. It’s over.
How to prevent it? By clearing condis constantly? That helps, but when a focused attack is initiated, they will corrupt those nice, clean boons on you, and then spread it with epi. That’s not really preventing…
The ONLY “counterplay” is to kill them before they can do it… which isn’t counter at all. Should be a way to react after, to remove those condis. But there isn’t. Despite the “nerf” to epi. Just die and respawn.
I prefer this method, works for every character.
No no no, that’s how you apply conditions, not cleanse them.
Moderators have deleted my message. Sorry i really wanted to say something but…. seems like i cannot. :-)
I’m slowly working on a video compilation of frontline zerging without teamspeak, without squad and for the most part on non-bunker builds. When I finish, I’ll happily share what playing properly looks like and how much less of a threat Epidemic and other conditions are compared to direct damage and CC’s.
Cleanses cannot save you if you aren’t in the right position in the first place. It’s like standing in fire and trying to drink water to put the fire out. You need to recognize what positions are safe and which are unsafe. It takes practice but anyone can learn to develop an eye for this if they pay attention to it.
“Cleanses cannot save you if you aren’t in the right position in the first place.”
Dude, just stop, you can’t even dodge the epidemic once someone in your party get’kitten by it. You just die faster then one frame, how can you possibly defend this as fair? just compare that skill to meteor shower and cry after realizing just how much anet hates elementalist and love aids.
[Blasting] a Light Field a day keeps the Necro away.
builds are like rock paper scissors. can’t force a rock to beat paper. got to use strategy scissors to win.
focus and practice on the cleanse. but it takes time. my team we focus now on revives because sometimes it just can’t be handled. we aim to kill first to avoid the condi
builds are like rock paper scissors. can’t force a rock to beat paper. got to use strategy scissors to win.
focus and practice on the cleanse. but it takes time. my team we focus now on revives because sometimes it just can’t be handled. we aim to kill first to avoid the condi
Not in this game being able to go bunker and get dmg from condis lets you be rock and lets say paper at the same time. There is nothing about power dmg that makes you better at dealing with condi or even bunker its only when some one builds full glass when your able to counter it with bunker.
In a lot of ways this game is a 2 type rock and scissor where rock is bunker builds and scissor are glass builds. Condi dmg leans it self to being bunker better then power (i am not saying condi dmg cant be glass but it can be bunker and have high dmg out put) where power needs to go glass to out put enofe dmg to deal with full bunker builds (there simply no good effects for power dmg builds that lets you deal with boon healing etc.. the bunker effects that condi dmg has build in means of dealing with beyond the overwhelming the effects with pure dmg.)
If there was a non condi base / class base counter to healing and boons then power would be ok but that just not how this game works. Most classes who are high condi base tend to have the boon removal needed to deal with bunker builds that often are using condi as there main dmg out put. The same thing can be said for healing effects and there counter only being one condi base effect poison.
More classes need good boon removal or at lest means of making boons less effective and there needs to be a way out side of poison to counter healing effects. Any thing less condi dmg classes / builds are going to out class power dmg builds / classes.
“So unless you actually have any constructive advice on “how to handle conditions” I suggest you try another thread.”
Your just a TROLL , a complete and utter troll that’s the only explanation how can you defend this meta? why do you defend this meta? is someone paying you ?
going to make this pretty obvious why this is a rude and pointless post only meant to troll and irritate people. . .
IT’ IS IMPOSSIBLE TO CLEANSE AFTER BEING HIT BY AN EPI BOMB, ANY SKILL WILL KILL YOU FROM CONFUSION!!!! GOOD LUCK EVEN HAVING A SINGLE FRAME TO ACTIVATE SKILLS OR EVEN SEE THE CONDITIONS. It’s UTTERLY unbelievable how people think epidemic is a “fair skill” please kitten you are completely and utterly wrong.
Step 1) deal with condi before epi.
step 2) oh look, you aren’t dead.
Step 3) victory cheer. You successfully learnt to play. Take a bow.Try the “L2P” option before throwing around insults.
However if you know someone willing to pay me for wearing a captain obvious hat, please dont send me their names.PS. drink some water. You look like you’re at risk of death by salt overdose.
Ignoring insulting parts, you are wrong Artemis. Do you even play WvW? Anyway, doesn’t matter. Our voices won’t be heard, unless the Balance Team of what this game has comes in WvW and see for themselves.
Condi bombing works by overwhelming a focused target or area with condition, and the more coordinated it is, the more difficult is to “avoid it”. By avoid I mean either kill them before they can condi bomb you, keep them in CC or whatever pressure to prevent them to do it, but these will only delay the moment. So basically kill them or you will be hit sooner or later.
The problem is that after you are hit, there is no counterplay. It’s over.
How to prevent it? By clearing condis constantly? That helps, but when a focused attack is initiated, they will corrupt those nice, clean boons on you, and then spread it with epi. That’s not really preventing…
The ONLY “counterplay” is to kill them before they can do it… which isn’t counter at all. Should be a way to react after, to remove those condis. But there isn’t. Despite the “nerf” to epi. Just die and respawn.
You complain about coordinated bombs. That doesn’t require epi.
You complain about having to cleanse constantly. But what do you do to deal with direct damage? You HEAL constantly. or you dodge constantly ( which also works on attacks which apply conditions). Or you simply reposition so they can’t focus on you.
So when epi is nerfed, you’ll be back here QQing about the next skill you manage to notice in a sequence of skills used to “bomb”.
tl:dr: problem isn’t the skills, it’s you ability to not get hit in the face by the lawnmower zerg.
Coordinated bombs are fine, that’s part of skilled play. Any other bombs are mostly wasted.
Condi cleansing when needed, without wasting cooldowns too fast, is also normal play, nothing wrong in having to cleanse condi.
Epi after corruption, leaves nothing to do, being instantly downed at least, in a WvW group play. Isn’t a question of – I’m “skilled” enough to avoid it — but instead, it is a fun play using it, or being hit by it? A game has to be fun.
It’s not me who started this thread, I just contributed. The balance team needs to consider WvW group play too when balancing, though, true balance cannot be ever achieved, but extreme problems should be taken care of at least.
There has to be a something that we can do, to either avoid being hit by epi corruption – a special, visible AOE marker on the ground, for 1-2s, before area being hit, or some other function we can use after being hit; to cleanse high stacks of confusion and then the most damaging condi stacks next. So we can blame ourselves for dying from epi.
Coordinated bombs are fine, that’s part of skilled play. Any other bombs are mostly wasted.
Condi cleansing when needed, without wasting cooldowns too fast, is also normal play, nothing wrong in having to cleanse condi.
Epi after corruption, leaves nothing to do, being instantly downed at least, in a WvW group play. Isn’t a question of – I’m “skilled” enough to avoid it — but instead, it is a fun play using it, or being hit by it? A game has to be fun.
It’s not me who started this thread, I just contributed. The balance team needs to consider WvW group play too when balancing, though, true balance cannot be ever achieved, but extreme problems should be taken care of at least.
There has to be a something that we can do, to either avoid being hit by epi corruption – a special, visible AOE marker on the ground, for 1-2s, before area being hit, or some other function we can use after being hit; to cleanse high stacks of confusion and then the most damaging condi stacks next. So we can blame ourselves for dying from epi.
Please refer to step 1 ( hint, you previously quoted it).
Also, confusion doesn’t get applied by epi. Consider asking for the cause to be fixed, not a symptom. – Stop thinking like a big corporation ( selling drugs to relieve symptoms because they are more profitable long term, than selling the cure).
(edited by Artemis Thuras.8795)
[…] confusion doesn’t get applied by epi. Consider asking for the cause to be fixed, not a symptom
Confusion is part of the Corrupt process. See there:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Corrupt_Boon
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Well_of_Corruption
I’m asking for a counterplay, something that can be done after being hit – or a way to avoid being hit, beyond just being lucky or staying away from the heat of battle and letting others being hit. Similar to Meteor Shower for example, one can see it, the damage comes in waves and there is time to react.
[…] confusion doesn’t get applied by epi. Consider asking for the cause to be fixed, not a symptom
Confusion is part of the Corrupt process. See there:
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Corrupt_Boon
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Well_of_CorruptionI’m asking for a counterplay, something that can be done after being hit – or a way to avoid being hit, beyond just being lucky or staying away from the heat of battle and letting others being hit. Similar to Meteor Shower for example, one can see it, the damage comes in waves and there is time to react.
right, and when did epi start corrupting boons?
Or are you complaining about multiple skills being used in a sequence?
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