Guild Wars 2

I ask that ANET if possible, please tell us what the population balance is about ahead of time before the beta patch. I can understand that when it comes to rewards and etc, there’s no need to disclose that information. However, population is no joke to mess around with. For example, if ANET decides to remove servers, players in those servers that will be removed deserve to know what they need to do for their communities and guilds way ahead of time.

I’m curious to see how anet handles population balance, but at the same time I could just see them adjust gem transfer rates again. If it’s a huge change, please inform us ahead of time.

That be great, so we don’t go blindly into it the same day of the patch.

Isn’t that what the open beta testing is for? Everyone can try and see what it is about? There is little point to try explain every detail before the actual beta because most people misunderstand everything and start some stupid campaign against changes.

Wait for it to go live. Try it. Then decide if it’s good or bad.

I’m with FogLeg on this, they have pointed out several times that they want beta testing where people can try things on live, AND that they can adjust or shut-down things at need (very quickly). So pretty certain they have a backup solution to roll-back if it doesn’t work or prove unpopular enough (So tempted to replace with "when" instead of "if".)

Is it really a beta when it’s being dropped on the live servers?
A little foresight for organized groups, who like to organize and prepare for things, might be appropriate. OP +1’d in the hopes of someone might notice at Anet.

You guys need to understand the way ANET works. If they think players won’t like the changes, they don’t announce them to the last minute.

Given that this is a live beta I expect the changes to be minor and not very disruptive, along the lines of relative population in WvW being taken into account in the scoring. Which is not enough.

ANET said that they are not releasing any details about population balance until the patch notes.

morrolan.9608:

Given that this is a live beta I expect the changes to be minor and not very disruptive, along the lines of relative population in WvW being taken into account in the scoring. Which is not enough.

They also said if the beta seems too disruptive to the live match, they’ll end it before the end of the match.

My doctor always says he’s not going to hurt me just before he does

Forbes.1569:

ANET said that they are not releasing any details about population balance until the patch notes.

Yes, however, they meant the live beta patch notes. It was meant as a contrast to posting it to dev blog.

style.6173:

You guys need to understand the way ANET works. If they think players won’t like the changes, they don’t announce them to the last minute.

^This, smoke and mirrors. Hype train is revving up the engine all aboard!

Anet doesn’t want their posts to obligate them to a decision that might not work well technically. This is pretty common in systems this complex. Keep everything vague until the technical issues are ironed out.

IMO the fundamental ANet problem is they have gone almost completely dark with the communication. Also since release many of their general statements of upcoming items have been abandoned without any followup which has led to trust issues. Basically ANet needs better communication with their users even if it occasionally bites them.

Hey, they announced they’re busy with another season of living story and an expac.. Very busy!

FogLeg.9354:

Wait for it to go live. Try it. Then decide if it’s good or bad.

That really sums up the whole experience of the last year or two.

Well since it is officially intended to be a beta test there should be enough space for feedback after launch and there is no real need for perfection right from the start. Many people will forget this and expect a 100% stable and awesome wvw after the patch.

Rather let them work on the other things right now. They can’t change things within 2 weeks anyways.

Forbes.1569:

ANET said that they are not releasing any details about population balance until the patch notes.

There will be nothing in the patch notes on any balance fix. There will be a post stating to the effect:

“We’re sorry. We weren’t able to get the population balance patch working to our satisfaction and so did not include it in today’s patch. We continue to work on this important issue and will release it as soon as we feel it is ready.”

Anet let the balance problem fester until it became a fully gangrenous limb, I am not sure they realize that it’s reached the torso. I guarantee they are still trying to save that dead limb which is not possible, no matter what “the community” says or Anet thinks.

Case and point, they are just going to overlay the gimmicks from the desert BL to the alpine BL, the fact that they are spending even a minute of dev time porting Tactivators over to the Alpine map boggles my mind.

Anet just likes to drop a bomb out of stealth.

Tspatula.9086:

the fact that they are spending even a minute of dev time porting Tactivators over to the Alpine map boggles my mind.

Tactivators = guild upgrades.

Guild upgrades cost gold. $$$

Guild upgrades also require HoT. $$$

Everything has to be infested with the HoT garbage, because they haven’t actually learned a thing.

+1 for some information and communication from Anet.

Fix the reward system; pve and pvp have great “incentives” for players to do their content. However, keep in mind that what motivates one person to play a game type might not be the best motivation for someone else. For wvw, contributing to war score, large-scale fights, and roaming are just a few of the major things people find fun about wvw. But imagine if you’re on the losing side, and you die a lot. What’s the motivation to continue fighting a losing battle? At the moment, WvW doesn’t have one. Players get discouraged and go do something else.

I helped build up a guild hall, and I found that to be fun. Not because I like the arduous task of farming flax seeds and elder wood, but because I was contributing to something larger than just one person: my guild. I used to think of WvW servers in the same way, but in the end, tallying up the war score at the end of the week had no long lasting accomplishments, like building a guild hall. Couple the lack of server obedience with the ease of which guilds could move servers, you end up with what we’ve got right now: T1 and T2 hogging the zergs, and barren wastelands everywhere else.

msalakka.4653:

FogLeg.9354:

Wait for it to go live. Try it. Then decide if it’s good or bad.

That really sums up the whole experience of the last year or two.

Skyhammer, EoTM, Deserted BL, Golem week, Stability changes, tournaments…….

Forbes.1569:

ANET said that they are not releasing any details about population balance until the patch notes.

So let me guess – they mess up what they’ve got even more than before – then promise to fix it when its too late?

I wonder if this will be RED/BLUE/GREEN (bit like EOTM style) and abolish WvW Home Servers – like we have been talking about before in the past and raged against as it destroys the communities already built up over such a long period of time.

FogLeg.9354:

Isn’t that what the open beta testing is for? Everyone can try and see what it is about? There is little point to try explain every detail before the actual beta because most people misunderstand everything and start some stupid campaign against changes.

Wait for it to go live. Try it. Then decide if it’s good or bad.

I think you need to google the definitions. What the OP is suggesting is not unreasonable. Any programming is usually preceded by design and design is usually divided into concept and figures. Allowing the community to comment on concepts can save a developer alot of time and effort. In fact, taking feedback from a community is best done there before resources have been allocated and further effort has been spent. A beta is a question of play-testing, usually with a broad test spread to test things like performance issues and spotting issues that appear under stress or can be easily edged out before going live. It is something you do on what is essentially a finished product, with all components connected. Programmers tend to know implementation better and designers know figures better while a community tend to have valuable perspectives on conceptual design, because they play it and can later be used to play it in tests for figure adjustments.

In fact, most of the issues we have in WvW stem from concept design not being revealed and (negative-) feedback from testing and initial live play-through being concept-oriented. That was the issue with both EotM and the DBL. The issues with population balance are a bit different (the scoring component simply stems from lack of iteration or attention whereas the gameplay component stems from only superficially evaluating playerbase concerns), but it is still a fair argument from the OP to suggest such a process for the re-design of what has essentially become a phenomenon now: population balance.

They really should tell us now, before they throw away another year of work because we don’t like a swisscheesed almost completed product when revealed for playtesting where everyone can spot the holes and no one actually tests the integrity of a good concept.

And I think you have already misunderstood my comment, which was my main point – people tend to misunderstand, mix up, confuse and misread. Population balance is complicated topic with many things affecting the final result. People tend to pick one single word from larger concept and then demand next 4 years to fulfill EXACTLY that.

For example you have already picked the words “beta test” and have decided what it is, hwo much it will change and what the end result will be before it started, before you even tried it.

I can not wait until this update. if you look at t2 it has become extremely toxic right now with TC buying up t1 guilds and there is a severe to say the least population imbalance. FA and DB as two servers cannot match TCs numbers and coverage. I for one can not wait for the april update.

jrambo.8467:

I can not wait until this update. if you look at t2 it has become extremely toxic right now with TC buying up t1 guilds and there is a severe to say the least population imbalance. FA and DB as two servers cannot match TCs numbers and coverage. I for one can not wait for the april update.

I dunno how much was paid to the kitten alliance to move to TC but certainly the events of today show that the beta changes need to be communicated well in advance so players can make informed decisions.

morrolan.9608:

jrambo.8467:

I can not wait until this update. if you look at t2 it has become extremely toxic right now with TC buying up t1 guilds and there is a severe to say the least population imbalance. FA and DB as two servers cannot match TCs numbers and coverage. I for one can not wait for the april update.

I dunno how much was paid to the kitten alliance to move to TC but certainly the events of today show that the beta changes need to be communicated well in advance so players can make informed decisions.

Are they that bored with t1? So the same guilds that were in t1 drop to t2, dominate it and then go right back up to t1. It doesn’t make sense

I thought they abandoned trying to fix population balance because it was a huge project. And rather than waiting months and months for a big fix they’re going to implement smaller changes earlier.

So I don’t think we’re getting any population balance fix in April.

Johje Holan.4607:

I thought they abandoned trying to fix population balance because it was a huge project. And rather than waiting months and months for a big fix they’re going to implement smaller changes earlier.

So I don’t think we’re getting any population balance fix in April.

Not true. Anet said it is the population beta too.

“The live beta test for rewards and population is coming this month as part of the big April update.”

Source: https://www.reddit.com/user/Anet-TylerB

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/4ebntq/massive_war_in_tier_2_the_rebellion_needs_you/d1yo8w2

And if indeed a handful had insider info, Anet just ticked off everyone else….

Liston.9708:

And if indeed a handful had insider info, Anet just ticked off everyone else….

Spot on

–]Anet-TylerB 10 points an hour ago
If I were you, I’d wait to see what we are doing with the population beta before transferring servers. Feel free to do what’s in your heart though

From that Reddit thread…. Oh well.

morrolan.9608:

Liston.9708:

And if indeed a handful had insider info, Anet just ticked off everyone else….

Spot on

And appears they did…. DR ranked 18 ticking 685 presently…..

DR is not really a good fit for TW and co. No one is going to stick on their pin, or voltron much. Plus I am sure LUN alone has more numbers than the whole of DR. So I really doubt that. Many ppl on DR are there for smaller scale fights and not for the mapqueue war efforts. So while I think TC and Dr are a nice fit, the alliance thing makes no sense.

Dream In A Dream.7213:

DR is not really a good fit for TW and co. No one is going to stick on their pin, or voltron much. Plus I am sure LUN alone has more numbers than the whole of DR. So I really doubt that. Many ppl on DR are there for smaller scale fights and not for the mapqueue war efforts. So while I think TC and Dr are a nice fit, the alliance thing makes no sense.

DR will handle your PPT side. That’s all they’re good at.