Guild Wars 2

At this rate, if we continue losing we’ll end up in T1

Our server keeps losing and we can’t seem to get out of t1. What gives?

Sir, I respectfully submit that you’ve barely scratched the surface of Glicko Hell. You must fall deeper into the Abyss, to the place where the winning server loses points while the losing server gains points.

Welcome to the club! We lost rather badly in T5 and moved up to T4. Wut? And so, of course, got our kitten handed to us in a wonderful kittenstorm of double-teaming (although, granted, maybe downgrade double-teaming to simply “they each stay out of each other’s BLs but make sure they wipe ours at least once a day”). After that matchup, we’d have to drop, right? Nope! Same one again this week! Same colors! Same behavior from both servers! Same results! WONDER HOW IT’S GONNA TURN OUT ON FRIDAY GUYS

what an adorable kitty cat =(^_^)=

You don’t know the glicko hell… Only Sorrow’s Furnace, Fergusson’s Crossing and Eredon Terrace been there. And it ceased to exist very long ago…

Ring of Fire is losing for about the 6th week in a row and we can’t get out of this tier. We’re actually going points this week.

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490:

Ring of Fire is losing for about the 6th week in a row and we can’t get out of this tier. We’re actually going points this week.

Because Ring of Fire is very close to Baruch Bay (Score-wise), and BB is 14th and RoF is 18th, glicko expect that BB should be roflstomping you and Drakkar Lake. Since it’s not the case, Glicko punish BB by giving rating to RoF and DL.

Also ThrillerMiller’s Sound, which is the server at 19th, is losing rating due Dzagonur be winning the matchup so far… Which doesn’t help RoF either…

But it could be worse… You could be stuck 14 weeks straight in the last tier without ever changing your oponents because of the rating gap and having nowhere to drop.

Jeknar.6184:

You don’t know the glicko hell… Only Sorrow’s Furnace, Fergusson’s Crossing and Eredon Terrace been there. And it ceased to exist very long ago…

amen to that.

if the “winning” server is beating the other two by DOUBLE the other two’s COMBINED score… and STILL has no chance to pull out of the tier… something is WRONG.

thankfully that was finally adjusted. it may not be ideal. it may not even be good, but it’s better than it was, and i can live with that.

Karizee sir, you may think you know where the surface of glicko hell is, but all due respect the thin red line is getting greyer by the day. Aforementioned point distribution system is a way of rounding down or up, so that when glicko makes a mistake, it can in all good conscience simply balance the equation by one of two ways:
Give a double teamed server a rise in a tier.
Keep a losing server in the same tier while no other server has enough “points”, and I use the word generously here sir, to switch places with said losing server.

Pls sir.
Pls.

My dear Stand The Wall, I understand your pain, I truly do. Having watched my previous server’s excruciatingly slow, painful, drawn out descent from Tier 1 to T6 last year (it took 18 weeks of losses just to leave T1), I thought I knew what Glicko Hell was.

But it turns out Glicko Hell goes deeper than Dante’s Inferno. I’ve entered a new circle: Glicko is now running backwards and pushing us up the ranks even though we are losing against a higher ranked server.

Wazuuuup Kitty has only one thing to say about this….

Jeknar.6184:

Because Ring of Fire is very close to Baruch Bay (Score-wise), and BB is 14th and RoF is 18th, glicko expect that BB should be roflstomping you and Drakkar Lake. Since it’s not the case, Glicko punish BB by giving rating to RoF and DL.

Also ThrillerMiller’s Sound, which is the server at 19th, is losing rating due Dzagonur be winning the matchup so far… Which doesn’t help RoF either…

But it could be worse… You could be stuck 14 weeks straight in the last tier without ever changing your oponents because of the rating gap and having nowhere to drop.

And why Gliko did not throw AS more points while they were stomping us 5 long weeks. And I mean stomping, like 5vs50 – 24/7.

Hule.8794:

And why Gliko did not throw AS more points while they were stomping us 5 long weeks. And I mean stomping, like 5vs50 – 24/7.

I took a look at the previous weeks of Arborstone. They did got around 124 rating points over these 5 weeks… Aparently, since Drakkar Lake was very close on the last 3 weeks (DL actually won the last one), AS didn’t got much rating to go up to 15th. If wasn’t for RNG matchups, you’d be facing Arborstone again.

Jeknar.6184:

You don’t know the glicko hell… Only Sorrow’s Furnace, Fergusson’s Crossing and Eredon Terrace been there. And it ceased to exist very long ago…

We were the kings of T8 way back when >.>

Ok sir, its been fun, but I believe I have been outdone.
Well played sir. Well played.
But still:

Glicko does not care whether you win or lose. really, it doesn’t.

what Glicko cares about is, did your server score better or worse than expected? if you do better than expected you get points, if you do worse than expected you lose points.

this means that if you lose, but you lose by less than Glicko predicted, you will gain points. likewise, if you win, but you win by less than Glicko predicted, you will lose points.

I have a spreadsheet somewhere that can be used to calculate how big your score needs to be compared to your opponents in order for you to gain (or lose) points. so for example, in T1 NA, if TC wants to lose points they must ensure that they have less than 4k point or so for every 10k of combined points from JQ and BG. so if JQ and BG scores add up to 100K, TC should have less than 40K points in order to lose points. assuming I’m reading the spreadsheet right, it’s been a long time since I made it.

-ken

Snowreap, I would be very interested in seeing that spreadsheet if you can dig it up. I admit I’m baffled by how it calculates atm.

best way to move a sever for the next wvw is go to eotm. that’s what I’ve been doing for this match up and still pop in too wvw and still see the outmen buff /yawn. i find there is day’s wvw will die in my heart to not care anymore just a pass and go to la from cs.

I went back to look at the spreadsheet again and this is a more accurate way to phrase things:

TC needs to get fewer than 7991 points for every 10000 points JQ has, in order to lose rating points to JQ.

TC needs to get fewer than 8266 points for every 10000 points BG has, in order to lose rating points to BG.

I can’t attach the spreadsheet itself because the forum software won’t take Excel files. since it’s a binary file, putting a .txt extension on it probably wouldn’t work.

-ken

Thank you for typing that out for me, Snowreap. I do appreciate it.

I’m still in the dark as to how those numbers are calculated, can you give the formula you are using? I would like to see how Glicko forms an expectation of a server’s performance. I can create my own spreadsheet from there

Stand The Wall.6987:

Our server keeps losing and we can’t seem to get out of t1. What gives?

On TC?

I felt your pain if you are…

I left TC after moving from a very good and organized server that never wins either – and the problem with that statement is this – it’s HoD the winner of the last Silver Season…

So it’s not TC… it IS ANET not caring that many servers are in the wrong tiers!

katz.8376:

Jeknar.6184:

You don’t know the glicko hell… Only Sorrow’s Furnace, Fergusson’s Crossing and Eredon Terrace been there. And it ceased to exist very long ago…

amen to that.

if the “winning” server is beating the other two by DOUBLE the other two’s COMBINED score… and STILL has no chance to pull out of the tier… something is WRONG.

thankfully that was finally adjusted. it may not be ideal. it may not even be good, but it’s better than it was, and i can live with that.

Keep saying it in postings – many servers are in the wrong tiers.

here are some links that explain how Glicko-2 works:
http://www.guildwars2guru.com/news/884-the-math-behind-wvw-ratings/
http://www.glicko.net/glicko/glicko2.pdf

-ken