Guild Wars 2

When they mentioned that “defending will be more important”, I thought that was a good direction. The funnest battles for me are when the enemy team is either trying to take down our keep and we have to defend. Or we are running into the castle while its being defended. I know EoTM is kinda a karma train right now but I could see that being turned around if defending objectives granted you more rewards then just running around and capping, and running away and letting other people flip it back. I know even now Eternal Battlegrounds has become like that in many ways where Ill see the enemy team running around flipping camps and towers, but then just running away and letting us flip it back.

One thing that also got me thinking and I apologize I dont remember who said it but someone else mentioned it in another thread, but giving more NPC interactions in WvW might be a way to help balance out server population differences. One thing that got me thinking about it was they mentioned a MOBAish inspired SPvP map, Stronghold and one of the underlying things in MOBA games is that there is always a constant NPC and Human threat. And if you are defending from the NPC threat its usually not a big deal. But if you ignore it then it can overwhelm you and defeat you. Maybe one way they could implement that in WvW is for there to be more NPC threats that are not only attacking caravans/camps but also attacking towers and keeps. Maybe the NPCS could be buffed/debuffed based on your current server map population/presence and/or maybe increased or decreased in amount based on that too.

Either way I think they have a good foundation for WvW set, but I am looking forward to the changes to make it more fun and engaging.

I like your ideas, and I agree, buffing NPC’s that are on your side could help out with pop issues.

The only fix is queuing the overpopulated sides to match lower population…

Then servers will balance my migrations.

As of now the low pop servers just don’t do WvW because really whats the point…we could just lick a light socket and have more fun.

Well keep in mind this is totally off the top of my head and purely selfish rather than oriented around any sort of balance but it would be totally awesome to summon a Legendary NPC to fight on your side when you’re outnumbered. The mechanic kind of already exists with the NPC commanders. Another way to obtain them that already exists could be through the capture and defending of npc camps like the Centaurs and what not.

I’d love to be able to summon like Rytlock or Braham, have them give everyone in the vicinity a buff, and attack a couple towers or something.

@mistsim.2748

Thanks, and yeah I think it could help. It wont completely replace a person in terms of usability, but it could give a smaller server a fighting chance!

@Skeletor.9360

Yeah I definitely think there are many pathways to helping with server population balance, the introdcution of more NPC interactions/buffs/debuffs etc. is just something Ive thought might be fun and should be relatively easy to implement, I think!

@Quells.2498

Exactly what I was thinking! For servers who are low on population, they could get a super kitten NPC to help them fight their way to towers and what not like the commanders. I was also thinking that on the flipside, servers that are dominating a map, like maybe they own over 50% of the map and the castle. Maybe NPCS could be sent out to attack their keeps and towers. Maybe even like a big dragon could swoop down and start raining down fire on keeps. This would keep the winning side engaged and keep it exciting for them. While also giving the smaller pop servers a chance while the winning side is engaged and distracted to start making small gains and get back territory. Ive been on both sides, when we are completely crushing the map and when we are completely crushed and honestly neither is that fun for me. I like when things are frantic, when things are being disrupted and when general there is good fighting going on.

I’m not sure buffing/bringing more NPCs would be the correct solution to population imbalances.

I’m also not sure if making people queue more would help either. Maybe if the transfers would be significantly cheaper (but still time gated), but otherwise not.

Incidentally, EotM does solve most of the population problems and ensures all sides have more or less the same population. Unfortunately the map has a lot of other issues, mostly in the reward scheme, and it also lacks any means and/or reasons to make it properly competitive.

In any case, I’m pretty sure most of the biggest population problems will disappear for a while when HoT launches, due to the inevitable surge of new and returning players. Time will tell how long it will last, though.

Adding more cheesy NPC mechanics won’t help population in the longer term.

WvW needs new maps, new mechanics and a new reward system designed from the ground up so that it attracts and keeps new and existing players and makes it worthwhile for people to keep playing it after the first 500 ranks.

Yes they need to improve/give a reason to defend but they after make it rewarding to do so. If they make it just take longer, then they just effectively reduce the rewards.

Defending can be potently very, very rewarding as well as awesome fun.

During a tournament once I took part in defending our home keep through the night, both the other servers hated our server so were pretty much only attacking us. Around a 100 of server a (not sawing names to avoid thread degeneration) attacked, once we beat them, a 100 of server b attacked and so on through the night.

It was a desperate battle of defense on our part, we held out for 5-6 hours before they finally took the keep which by that time literally had no walls, you could walk through the keep! Reward wise for the defenders it was pretty awesome, you could tag for loot 20-50 enemies per incoming attack wave and we had to set up a rotation so 5 players could empty there bags at a time, so we always had enough defenders.

I have played GW2 since day 1 and have been lucky enough to be involved in a few of those kind of epic battles. But they are ultra rare nowadays. Sadly…

I prefer to keep my NPC stuff in PvE.

Forcing higher population servers to have a lower queue to suite the weakest link server is by far the worst idea. It’s the fastest way to destroy WvW

rewarding for defending has always been a good suggestion. Attacking still needs to be more rewarding. Otherwise, why would anyone attack?

Meglobob.8620:

Yes they need to improve/give a reason to defend but they after make it rewarding to do so. If they make it just take longer, then they just effectively reduce the rewards.

Defending can be potently very, very rewarding as well as awesome fun.

During a tournament once I took part in defending our home keep through the night, both the other servers hated our server so were pretty much only attacking us. Around a 100 of server a (not sawing names to avoid thread degeneration) attacked, once we beat them, a 100 of server b attacked and so on through the night.

It was a desperate battle of defense on our part, we held out for 5-6 hours before they finally took the keep which by that time literally had no walls, you could walk through the keep! Reward wise for the defenders it was pretty awesome, you could tag for loot 20-50 enemies per incoming attack wave and we had to set up a rotation so 5 players could empty there bags at a time, so we always had enough defenders.

I have played GW2 since day 1 and have been lucky enough to be involved in a few of those kind of epic battles. But they are ultra rare nowadays. Sadly…

80 is the pop cap per server per map. Just saying…

coglin.1867:

I prefer to keep my NPC stuff in PvE.

Forcing higher population servers to have a lower queue to suite the weakest link server is by far the worst idea. It’s the fastest way to destroy WvW

rewarding for defending has always been a good suggestion. Attacking still needs to be more rewarding. Otherwise, why would anyone attack?

To win the matchup? You know, like why you should play WvW in the first place?

It’s a great change, but there is just one problem, I think the following will sum it up (read to the tune of 1 potato 2 potato song):

1 AC
2 AC
3 AC
4
5 AC
6 AC
7 AC
More
9 AC
10 AC
11 AC
Woah!
13 AC
14 AC
15 AC
Noooooooooooooo!!!
17 AC
18 AC
19 AC….
……OK now you’re “fighting” a german server…..

And that’ll just be the ACs, superior ones of course :P

@Meglobob.8620

That is exactly the kind of battles that I hope happen more often. Those are so fun and even though you lost it was a good battle, well fought. That is the funnest part of WvW!

@Victory.2879
They already have it to some extent with NPCs attacking camps and caravans if you flip them to your side. But this would be a bigger involvement of NPCs so I think it would have to be tested before being fully implemented. And definitely if more people enter the map the NPC numbers should be reduced/debuff to give the players a chance for more player versus player battles.

@Pinkamena Diane Pie.8054

I hoping defending also means defending the towers or keeps they just flipped too, so hopefully when they come in to your territory so to speak, by the time you reach the tower to take it back, they are still there working to keep it. I feel like those kind of battles will be better if they kind of fight to the last man so to speak, to hold on to it as long as possible.

Im kinda new to the game (level 50ish on 2 characters) but im really interested in roaming, from what i’ve seen on streams seems really fun however i saw few people saying that HoT WvW changes will completely kill roaming, can some of the more experienced WvW players tell me how true is that ? (from HoT changes that we know will happen)

Prevas.9305:

Im kinda new to the game (level 50ish on 2 characters) but im really interested in roaming, from what i’ve seen on streams seems really fun however i saw few people saying that HoT WvW changes will completely kill roaming, can some of the more experienced WvW players tell me how true is that ? (from HoT changes that we know will happen)

It’s impossible to know whether HoT changes will kill roaming until we get our hands on the new map.

All Anet have said is that the towers will be situated on strategically important ground. If you want to control movement around the map, you will need to control the towers.

Besides possibly limiting the scope of the area in which you can roam, it’s not going to affect roaming at all.

Anet has also said the areas are partially closed off by walls (that are connected to towers). If the walls are long enough the roamers could plausibly blast through them at a remote point quickly enough.

I think it’s a good change, assuming there will be some kind of chance for the roamers to hide and escape within those walls, enabling nice cat&mouse chases “behind enemy lines”.

At the moment, there is not really any reason to go hunt for roamers, because even if you catch them they can be back at the same location in a few minutes tops.

Solo roamers are probably in a bit less useful position in the new maps, but I don’t think solo roaming is something they should build the WvW experience upon anyway.

@Prevas.9305

As far as the new Borderland map is concerned, Im completely in the dark as to what it could be. So I can really only speculate on the current Borderlands map, but my guess is that if defending becomes more important, roaming and flipping camps will only be part of the process, the other part will be staying there and defending it for as long as possible too. I hope that will just mean more PvP battles in the long run as people really fight to try and hold positions even as small as camps, but I think that will make it more engaging and fun!

Lots of npc at EOTM was what turned it into a farm ground.

@Aeolus.3615

Hey Aeolus, ah sorry I should clarify these wouldnt necessarily be stationary NPCs that could even be farmed/killed so to speak. This would be more active NPCs that are either actively attacking towers/keeps. My hope is that it would give lower population servers and groups a chance to start slowly regaining territory while keeping the higher population servers distracted but also engaged. I feel like they would only be used during those times to help keep the combat going during those periods of time when either someone is completely dominating or being completely dominated. But yeah I understand your concern though too and I wouldnt want it to turn into a kinda farm fest either, just a way to keep things more active and engaging.

Aeolus.3615:

Lots of npc at EOTM was what turned it into a farm ground.

What? Please explain.

The amount of rewards vs. effort compared to other parts of the game is what turned EotM into farm ground, along with removing any realm pride with the megaserver technology.

Ok some of those rewards come from the champion bags and in EotM there are more champions to kill per door bashed than in normal WvW.

Still, it’s not the NPCs fault. It’s the designers’ fault of putting too many rewards into a map that should be just a queuing map for “real” WvW.