Guild Wars 2

I’m not Impress at all at this new implementation of “Traps and Tricks Outfitter.”

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-May-14-2013

Instead of giving each non-stealth classes a permanent anti-stealth utility in dealing with stealth class they decided that “consumable anti-stealth” was ‘fair and square’.

Well it aint “fair and square”

“Traps have been added as a new purchasable consumable utility item. Two unique variants are available”.

I call that Punishment for non thief classes because this “new feature” isn’t fair and Balanced at all.

So in other word, the only way to “fight and win a stealth thief class” is to Pay a Price?.

“Traps are sold by the vendor for 15 badges and 525 karma; they will stack to 250 and are account-bound”.

This by far isn’t creative design ‘by a long shot’.

This new features states this-

‘Sorry that you’re not a stealth class but if you want to fight and win a stealth class, you must pay a price; 15 badges and 525 karma.. and if you choose not too, you will continue to be Demolished by the invisible one..’

As I stated, I’m not impressed and obviously yet again,

In addition this new "anti-Stealth trap purpose is to Punish and Cripple our mobilities in wvw. In other word, it only leaves us more Vulnerable

Totally,
Poor Design and mechanics.

oh yeah I forgot this one “Traps cost 10 supply to place”.

Can you imagine the Chaos in wvw… instead of focusing on what needs to be done, we are given a Painful burden and duty to "equip this anti-stealth utility’

This not only adds more work for the Commanders but stresses and distracts their purpose in wvw.

I leave room for comments

Burnfall.9573:

So in other word, the only way to "fight and win a stealth thief class" is to Pay a Price... 15 badges and 525 karma...I leave room for comments

I take the stance that this means "ha ha, I’m forcing you into something". It makes me feel all warm fuzzy tingly that I’m forcing someone to go out of their way to counter me.

Thief, OH YEAH! Fear the powah!

As posted in the the thread.

The traps are overpriced at 15 badges, the trigger area is actually just a tiny 600 length box which can be blinked or shadowshot through. If a thief sees you placing the trap, it will be quite easy for them to avoid the small area in question.

The additional opportunity costs of 10 supply alone would have been sufficient.

Really hard to justify paying 15 badges for a possibility of a 30 second chance to chase after the fastest most mobile class in wvw…..to gain a possible 2 badges.

It’s a little pricey, but if it was too easy you’d screw over the stealth mechanic too much. This is not for dueling a thief, it’s mainly for a stealthed enemy hiding in a keep you just flipped.

Yeah I won’t waste badges on them, to be honest, rangers should be able to trait to track stealth. Call me crazy here but I doubt a theif could hide from a ranger, lore wise. It doesn’t make sense. Rangers can hunt and track with extrordinary skill. 15 badges…wow! It seems badges and siege will become more valuable: seige despawning, ascended gear purchased with badges being rumored, etc. But to spend 15 badges on a trap, I don’t know, I’ll stick to my ranger traps.

Overall I dislike the idea because, like, rangers are the primary trappers. So you decide to counter one mechanic using another profession’s mechanic? Why don’t we just give everyone purchasable warrior banners? Heck, 100 badges, and your ranger can carrry a hammer and CC too! You get a mechanic! You get a mechanic! You get a mechanic!

Nevertheless, it isn’t the end of the world and might actually turn out tk be tons of fun. But I’m skeptical, to say the least.

nothing.7941:

It’s a little pricey, but if it was too easy you’d screw over the stealth mechanic too much. This is not for dueling a thief, it’s mainly for a stealthed enemy hiding in a keep you just flipped.

I’m glad you pointed that out, thanks. I feel a little better now.

I have to admit Burnfall has a point. This is a purchasable item intended as a counter to a class mechanic. Not sure this is a great precedent. What comes next? Special Items to strip all buffs from guardians and elementalists? A trap which can immobilize warriors specced to ignore roots and snares? A device that puts a giant flaming arrow over the real mesmer and stays visible even if the mesmer stealths?

It seems these traps trigger on ppl who dont stealth/carry supply aswell. So its easy to run ahead of the zerg and be a human-minesweeper. So yah, horribly overpriced.

Only Thieves are going to get good use out of traps because they can stealth and place it right underneath a zerg unseen.

I still think it opens up new game-play options. The thief trap is a little over-priced to fight a thief, but could be cathartic to pound one of them for once w/o stealth to hide behind (although they will still probably outrun). The supply trap will be best for small teams of 2-3 people who want to scout out the zerg and relay their position/direction so that someone up the road can place a supply trap. Or alternatively, follow the zerg and trap up the exits to the camp they just flipped! Hooray for scouting and empowering the roamers!

Burnfall.9573:

I’m not Impress at all at this new implementation of “Traps and Tricks Outfitter.”

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-May-14-2013

Instead of giving each non-stealth classes a permanent anti-stealth utility in dealing with stealth class they decided that “consumable anti-stealth” was ‘fair and square’.

Well it aint “fair and square”

“Traps have been added as a new purchasable consumable utility item. Two unique variants are available”.

I call that Punishment for non thief classes because this “new feature” isn’t fair and Balanced at all.

So in other word, the only way to “fight and win a stealth thief class” is to Pay a Price.

“Traps are sold by the vendor for 15 badges and 525 karma; they will stack to 250 and are account-bound”.

This by far isn’t creative design ‘by a long shot’.

This new features states this-

‘Sorry that you’re not a stealth class but if you want to fight and win a stealth class, you must pay a price; 15 badges and 525 karma.. and if you choose not too, you will continue to be Demolished by the invisible one..’

As I stated, I’m not impressed and obviously yet again,

In addition this new "anti-Stealth trap purpose is to Punish and Cripple our mobilities in wvw. In other word, it only leaves us more Vulnerable

Totally,
Poor Design and mechanics.

oh yeah I forgot this one “Traps cost 10 supply to place”.

Can you imagine the Chaos in wvw… instead of focusing on what needs to be done, we are given a Painful burden and duty to "equip this anti-stealth utility’

This not only adds more work for the Commanders but stresses and distracts their purpose in wvw.

---

I leave room for comments

If I was you, I’d be mad too. When you now die to a thief who has no stealth, you won’t have any more excuses. Excuses are better than the truth that some people are just more talented than others.

You make it sound like the only way to beat stealth claases is with these traps…

This isn’t to counter thiefs.

It is a trap that can be laid down when facing zergs to have an advantage and render their veils useless. Somehow people still think that WvW should be balanced around 1V1s rofl.

WyldKat.4712:

Burnfall.9573:

So in other word, the only way to “fight and win a stealth thief class” is to Pay a Price… 15 badges and 525 karma…I leave room for comments

I take the stance that this means “ha ha, I’m forcing you into something”. It makes me feel all warm fuzzy tingly that I’m forcing someone to go out of their way to counter me.

Thief, OH YEAH! Fear the powah!

lol this is the player base the devs are favoring over 90% of the remainder of the player base?

Does the first player over it pop the trap or does it linger in place?

Seems rather pointless to me to drop an unstealth trap in front of a veiling zerg, only to have the commander pop up. Its not like he is desperate for stealth anyway, 90% likely to be a Guardian or Warrior.

Same thing when just running, for supply and stealth traps alike.

Lots of serious WvW players have stacks and stacks of unused badges sitting around. Karma, too. For them, the cost is entirely inconsequential.

I already have lots of ideas how to make these things very usable in small scale combat even with the 4s channel and 10 supply.

Thinking people are going to stick to the honor system and just use them in keeps against stealth abusers is incredibly naive.

Benjamin.7893:

This isn’t to counter thiefs.

It is a trap that can be laid down when facing zergs to have an advantage and render their veils useless. Somehow people still think that WvW should be balanced around 1V1s rofl.

The main intention may not be to counter thieves but what class most rely’s on stealth? It not a direct nerf to thieves but it is a situational nerf. You’d be kitten if you think that people are going to use this more for veils then trying to catch a thief. That 10 supply will more useful in other places then using it to catch a veil that your probably going to be aware of.

1v1? Nothing is balanced around 1v1 hence no dueling…

The point is 30s is a long time for a thief to not be able to stealth while in a fight. Since Stealth is the main mechanic for thieves, getting it removed for long periods in time breaks quite a few builds. Thieves are the only class this truly effects, mesmers to a point.

lol, these are looking like they will end up as I originally said, useless to use to fight thieves, but now bads cant complain about stealth anymore, and good players will continue to win fights against thieves 99% of the time.

This is a step in the right direction but it simply isn’t good enough.

This obviously isn’t meant to counter 1v1 situations, it’s meant to reveal zergs that are veiled (which is next to useless), and to flush out thieves in group situations (which in essence is next to useless as well.

Stealth needs an appropriate counter (like many agree), but it can’t come in the forum of traps; it either needs to come in the form of balancing the thief class, or giving other classes something to counter it. For instance, some ranger pets should be able to see/track stealth. It seems only fitting due to the heightened senses

I like the idea of adding traps to the battlefield for additional effects and zerg counters, but the stealth trap really needs to go. As the OP mentioned, in no way shape or form should anybody have to pay to counter a particular class. If that’s the case, give all classes some stupid ability that others need to pay for to counter.

The traps not aimed at thfs its aimed to vale and stander trick ppl use or even port bombs.

The trap is not ment only for thieves, geez. I can give you some examples of situations.

Someone is downed and is affected by the trap – none of his teammates can stealth him to prevent a stomp.

Revealing a mesmer coming to make portal (very situational, I agree, but possibility).

No veil for zerg.

No stealth to affected when they leap through smoke field or use blast finisher.

Some of them are really situational, but stealthing a downed player is pretty awesome way to help them out on small scale battles, just saying.

Traps are expensive in terms of badges. Won’t even waste a single one on both options. Just not worth it.

Well, this gives our developers an idea of what they need to work with in WVW. Unless, they deem it very very very easy to get badges, this is just a no go scenario.

That’s a whole lot of post for such a meaningless topic. If you honestly have that much of an issue with thieves…dunno what to say. This is mainly to combat door taggers and other minor encounters.

As for those suggesting this as a true anti-veil mechanic…not really. 4 seconds to deploy, limited number of tags, small range, etc. all for something (veil) that lasts briefly.

It’s a gimmick. That’s ALL it is.

It has been stated already, but let me reiterate. These traps are not designed for dueling nor should they be.

Traps have no place in WvW when siege isn’t even working right or balanced IMO.

KnattyDreads.1856:

It has been stated already, but let me reiterate. These traps are not designed for dueling nor should they be.

Lol I agree with you but the first thief to try to fight me I’m going to drop shadow refuge and then drop a trap. Just sayin…

I think the supply traps are and excellent idea

And then everyone will cry evasion op when thieves star rolling s/d…

This is obviously for zerg v zerg veil combat or thieves ressing mesmers. I assume it’s an AoE pulse type of reveal? Either way, traps for badges is a stupid idea. Even less well thought out than the AC buff… First, if they went in the direction they’re going, traps should be free and unlimited (not an NPC item) but cost 5 supply to place.

If they wanted to implement reveal effect, add it as an additional effect to one of the ranger traps, one of the thief traps, one of the warrior’s warhorn skills, stuff like that. Only on a high cooldown skill.

Great buff for thiefs- now they can stealth up and place a supply draining trap..as the stealth revealing trap is WAY overpriced considering it is triggered by practically anything…and bang back you all go for supplies . Ten supples AND badges- who thinks of these things…

The way to deal with stealth is to have a 10 second pot usable by any class with a 2 minute cooldown.

Burnfall.9573:

I’m not Impress at all at this new implementation of “Traps and Tricks Outfitter.”

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-May-14-2013

Instead of giving each non-stealth classes a permanent anti-stealth utility in dealing with stealth class they decided that “consumable anti-stealth” was ‘fair and square’.

Well it aint “fair and square”

“Traps have been added as a new purchasable consumable utility item. Two unique variants are available”.

I call that Punishment for non thief classes because this “new feature” isn’t fair and Balanced at all.

So in other word, the only way to “fight and win a stealth thief class” is to Pay a Price?.

“Traps are sold by the vendor for 15 badges and 525 karma; they will stack to 250 and are account-bound”.

This by far isn’t creative design ‘by a long shot’.

This new features states this-

‘Sorry that you’re not a stealth class but if you want to fight and win a stealth class, you must pay a price; 15 badges and 525 karma.. and if you choose not too, you will continue to be Demolished by the invisible one..’

As I stated, I’m not impressed and obviously yet again,

In addition this new "anti-Stealth trap purpose is to Punish and Cripple our mobilities in wvw. In other word, it only leaves us more Vulnerable

Totally,
Poor Design and mechanics.

oh yeah I forgot this one “Traps cost 10 supply to place”.

Can you imagine the Chaos in wvw… instead of focusing on what needs to be done, we are given a Painful burden and duty to "equip this anti-stealth utility’

This not only adds more work for the Commanders but stresses and distracts their purpose in wvw.

---

I leave room for comments

you leave room for comments but clearly you’re a thief player. is someone upset that ArenaNet made it so you can’t just kitten around in stealth anymore? i guess they’re starting to realize the damage capabilities of their prized rogue profession.

Zephyrus.9680:

First, if they went in the direction they’re going, traps should be free and unlimited (not an NPC item) but cost 5 supply to place.

You wouldn’t be able to take two steps without springing a trap.

nothing.7941:

It’s a little pricey, but if it was too easy you’d screw over the stealth mechanic too much. This is not for dueling a thief, it’s mainly for a stealthed enemy hiding in a keep you just flipped.

^^ This.

The anti stealth trap wasn’t so a person can beat a thief. It was to make sweeping keeps and towers a bit easier. Got a dead mesmer hanging out in your keep? Drop a trap on top of him. Got a thief CnDin guards/archers and can’t nail him down between his stealths? Use a trap.

Like ppl already said, those traps are not for 1v1’s or small scale group fights. It’s not even for fights in the open at all. Do you expect ppl responding to thief stealthing with “omg, he’s gone, lets STAND STILL FOR 4 SEC AND MAKE A TRAP.” and then you’re dead without even finishing it. It’s not a mechanism to counter thief stealth. If you will take thief out of stealth he will run away and go into stealth again = you wasted your trap and you got no more supply.

This is to counter huge groups using veil-push tactics. If you’re not playing in an organised group (and from OP post its clear he’s not) those traps won’t affect you at all.

Lol anti stealth, it is useless for anything but cleaning out a keep for mesmers. The price + 4 second channel, who is ever going to use it? With the current price, nobody is going to let simply put them around at random either.

The price is very fair. It’s good that it costs badges of honor. Less pay to win please.

Lightsbane.9012:

you leave room for comments but clearly you’re a thief player. is someone upset that ArenaNet made it so you can’t just kitten around in stealth anymore? i guess they’re starting to realize the damage capabilities of their prized rogue profession.

LOL pretty sure the OP hates thieves and gets ganked rather regularly by them.

WyldKat.4712:

Burnfall.9573:

So in other word, the only way to “fight and win a stealth thief class” is to Pay a Price… 15 badges and 525 karma…I leave room for comments

I take the stance that this means “ha ha, I’m forcing you into something”. It makes me feel all warm fuzzy tingly that I’m forcing someone to go out of their way to counter me.

Thief, OH YEAH! Fear the powah!

This dude on the other hand….obviously a thief lol.

If someone is that desperate to kill my thief for 15 badges + karma, so be it.

So i guess now anyone who has refused all this time to l2counter stealth will just post up in their trap and not leave… lol.

DeadlySynz.3471:

If that’s the case, give all classes some stupid ability that others need to pay for to counter.

I would just like to say that giving people the ability to pay badges and karma to straight counter someones class specific type abilities would be hilarious. Can you imagine being able to drop 15 badges to strip an ele or grd of the ability to apply boons for 30 seconds? How fast do you think theyd die at that point? How about 15 badges and some karma to remove an engineers access to turrets, potions and kits? Or better yet! 15 badges and some karma to remove a mesmers ability to summon clones or phantasms or apply any amount of confusion? We could make one for necros too that remove minions and dont let them apply any conditions to anything. After that we can move on to warriors, and remove their ability to use any CC and makes their max HP total half of what it naturally is.

You guys all know that this is exactly what youre asking for right? A money sink to hard counter a specific class. That’s some BS, and you guys should feel ashamed.

style.6173:

If I was you, I’d be mad too. When you now die to a thief who has no stealth, you won’t have any more excuses. Excuses are better than the truth that some people are just more talented than others.

And what about when we end up facerolling said thieves, then? What does that mean?

I’ve taken down thieves with stealth in sPvP, I sure as hell can take them on without it in WvW, even as a level 18.

People aren’t QQ’n because they’re baddies (most of the time, anyway). We’re QQ’n ’cause thieves are ridiculous strong with stealth in the WvW environment.

You said the same thing 5 times.

zTales.4392:

People aren’t QQ’n because they’re baddies (most of the time, anyway). We’re QQ’n ’cause thieves are ridiculous strong with stealth in the WvW environment.

No, theyre pretty much QQing because theyre bad. It takes all of 3-4 hits from a tank to kill a thief who can clobber you 3 seconds, less if youre a glass cannon yourself. L2P and thief isnt much of an issue.

Frankly, keep the traps as a Thief main, I could care less.

However, the thief shouldnt pay for someone elses mistake. If i run over the trap, I deserve to be revealed for 30 seconds. But if someone else within 1200 range of me triggers that trap. Any thieves in a 1200 area will pay for it.

That’s what bothers me.

Is a total waste D :
Just a 30 sec fair fight?
(Yes, i said fair, my main was a thief)
No thanks. I will spend my badges in siege ^^

I said 2 days ago…
Don t worry antistealth trap will be costly and UP

I think the WvW forum needs a random skill testing question before each post you make. Random tidbits from each class, if you get it wrong it gives you the right answer and you proceed to posting. The idea would be to force people to learn about all the classes in the game, and hopefully prevent uninformed drivel.

I play the “Laughing stock of WvW” with a LB/SB Ranger if you go by Forum’s feedback and I rarely have issues with thieves….

People running GC setups shouldn’t be the ones complaining about thieves as they are just begging to be slaughtered out there….balanced setup/Knowledge is your friend.

If your strategy vs thieves doesn’t work, time to find a new strategy. Or play one long enough to know what they have at their disposal so you can recognize/counter?

That being said with over 2500 Badges/1 million Karma the trap has its uses and I will likely have a few simply for the lolz/situational use.

Oh please!

This is not to balance a class mechanic. REVEALED was meant to balance the class mechanic. TRAPS are for stealthed ZERGS. Come on people.

Trap is not for beating a thief to the ground. If you think contrary, be my guest.

Thief >>> walk to trap >>> oh I cannot stealth for 30s, but wait a minute, I have shadow step and heart seeker. >>> Bye2

Correct scenario:
Tower wall down, but your team hold on using siege. 1 of enemy mesmer try to use invisibility to go in to drop portal. Luckily one or two of your team have put anti stealth trap. Bye2 mesmer. Portal fail.

Tra kitten ituational. Not for instant result. (4 s to deploy ? Do you think you can deploy it before a thief down you ? NO).

But yeah, the price of trap kittening high. 15 badge with karma ? Wow, I can buy 2 ac with that, or 3 if I converge the karma to badge.

next trap will prevent the use of a 2H weapon for 30s ….
fair ?