Guild Wars 2

I am in agreement with most, the downed state should be removed in WvW. As I tend to roam a lot solo to recap camps, etc. it is frustrating to have a camp almost capped and three or four enemy rush in to ninja it. Many times I could handle those three or four but not when they rally while I am fighting the others as I cannot spare the time to stomp the downed players.

The mechanic does not reward the better player, it rewards the larger group.

Epic.3950:

So you got one guy from NSP and one guy from FC. you just downed them both in a 3 way fight but what do you do? as soon as you stomp one, the other rallies, if you stomp the other guy the other guy rallies. good luck killing them both at the exact same time.
Do you see the problem? At this point IDC about downstate. OK its rly dumb and this and that but the RALLYING is what I cant stand. you already have sooooooo much HP in downstate and you can rally yourself if left alone for long enough. Why not remove rallying off killing someone in WVW to at least SORT OF make zerging less forgiving. If Im in a 2v4 and me and my buddy manage to down 2 of them shouldnt we be rewarded by having gotten 2 of them out of the fight rather than having them keep 1 spamming us as their bunker ally revives them through our mad attempts of DPS and attempting to stomp? Not only that. If I have 2 down and my friend gets stomped then both come back up and eat me alive rather than I kill both of them and deal with the other 2 on my time. See the dilemma here?
Anet wants to reward smaller groups more? easy fix rallying in downstate for at least WVW to make it less forgiving and more situational (see a opening to help your buddy up since he is momentarily out of danger) NOT well ima just keep the DPS and OHHH LOOK hes back up im so helpful!!!11!!!11!1

Um..Anet devs don’t want to cater to small groups..they cater to zerglings and casuals.

It doesn’t seem like that customer base is going to keep their coffers filled just judging from the guilds mass quitting wvw now. The new match up system was the last nail in the coffin.

Oh well..I guess some people have to learn the hard way.

There is not ONE situation that doesnt make rally bad.

1- Ridiculous in PvP
2- Trivialise PvE
3- Useless or OP in solo depending on professions

One day someone at Anet is going to have to stand and remove this bullkitten. But it wont happend before 2 or 3 years, these kind of change* requieres insight and courage so never happends when the game is on the "rising".

(* that and stealth, buff range, healing reliability, AoE limit...)

Rally is convenient.

Imagine your dryer folding your clothes for you after it’s done drying. Removing that kind of convenience will not be met without complaints. The casuals love this feature.

Had something simular happen to me this week. Ran across a HOD and a FC duking it out. Jumped them both and downed them both at the same time. Stomped the guy from HOD, which rallied the guy from FC. I was ready for this to happen though so I just quickly jumped back on the FC guy and was able to finish him off as well rather quickly.

Here’s the thing. I chose to stomp the HOD player first because his class had a better chance at taking me down that the guy from FC. I also made sure to put myself in stealth (yes my alt is a DD theif and its fun to play, cry about it later) so that as soon as the other guy was up I could jump over and back stab him as quick as possible. I knew this was going to happen and made sure to put some sort of strategy in place before engaging….

Personally I have no problem with the downed state. I see all the people complain about it and give reasons why. But none of it makes sense to me. The downed state was put in the game for a reason. It was a major part of the game when the beta’s I played were introduced. In fact it was one of the first things the game taught you about when facing your lvl 1 character creation boss. I loved it then, I love it now. Sucks to see so many people complain about something that is actually a fun feature of a game thats not… WoW…. Please don’t turn this into a WoW game or DAOT or whatever game you used to play with complaints that the game has a different mechanic.

The downed state/rally mechanic is neither interesting, strategic, or skillful. It takes no effort to blob around in a zerg, tag a few things, then have a bunch of possible rally options. Those of you who think it requires skill or strategy to hit a few targets from a group of 30+ are only fooling yourselves.

What some fail to realize is that there are enough things going on in a fight where simply sauntering over to your downed target to stomp them is rarely a consideration. More often than not, a downed target will rally unless at least 2-3 people are focused on them to finish them off, even a glass target. This shouldn’t be the case This is where larger numbers play a huge roll, no matter how bad they are.

Case and point, I play a full glass ranger, I should be an easy target for any 1v1 or small group situation correct? When our server faced SoR, I ended up in a 5v1 situation behind the main zerg battle and ended up downing all 5 of them (and killing 2) before some of the zerg came back to finish off the other 3. Why did I survive while they met their demise? I rallied 3 times in that encounter, because I did something apparently so skillful and strategic according to some people….

I dropped barrage on the front line (like I always do) shortly before the 5 engaged me.. Highly skillful and strategic right???…. This is a prime example as to why it shouldn’t be in WvW.. there is no way I should have survived that.

If rallying/downed state is to stay, then it should be made into a grandmaster trait. Make players build their class around it if they insist on having it.

DeadlySynz.3471:

The downed state/rally mechanic is neither interesting, strategic, or skillful.

You can support downed. It does make things different.
Rally however is completely stupid. Just because your target spammed some AoEs and hit some wolf or naked lowby running by he deserves not to get stomped? Seriously?

Actually Rally MAKES downed looks bad because it completely screws the rez/stomp system.

Calae.1738:

Rally is convenient.

Imagine your dryer folding your clothes for you after it’s done drying. Removing that kind of convenience will not be met without complaints. The casuals love this feature.

Im a casual(only really play WvW small man on weekends), and i think it’s a way too forgiving mechanic that needs to be addressed. I should put some fraps together of our small man vs mini zergs for a visual reference.

Chorazin.4107:

Calae.1738:

Rally is convenient.

Imagine your dryer folding your clothes for you after it’s done drying. Removing that kind of convenience will not be met without complaints. The casuals love this feature.

Im a casual(only really play WvW small man on weekends), and i think it’s a way too forgiving mechanic that needs to be addressed. I should put some fraps together of our small man vs mini zergs for a visual reference.

When do you guys play, I honestly don’t recognize your tag (though I bet I’ll see it every 2 minutes from now on, knowing how that kinda thing goes)?

Anyhow, the rally on kill needs to be addressed because it favors numbers over skill. Just cap the number of people that can rally off of it because I’m tired of seeing an entire guild rally on a minotaur outside of Bay.

Its not just a forgiving mechanic, its a mechanic of sheer frustration.

“ahah! Downed you, now to.. kitten, he got back up. C’mere you, there, now stay down while i.. ow kitten , not again. There! Now you better not dare… AARGH!!!”

And then he ends up killing you because he got 3 extra lives for some random AoE he did earlier.
Gee, that sounds totally fun for the guy that was granted chance after chance after chance.
Sadly for the person who actually beat him 3x and still ended up buying the farm, its sheer, utter, pure, unadultered, frustration.

Skill has absolutely nothing to do with this anymore. Its more often not a random event, and the longer you manage to stay alive while downed the more likely you are to eventually get a Rally.
Which then plays into how horribly unbalanced Downed State is.

Its not a fun mechanic to be on the receiving end up. It is devoid of skill, unbalanced and utterly frustrating. Deus ex machina kind of kitten desciding the outcome of a fight. No one can take that kind of PvP serious.
Imagine an FPS game where if you’re killed, but you randomly actually arent. Think something like that would ever have a glimmer of a hope as a competitive game?

innocent ouarior.1954:

DeadlySynz.3471:

The downed state/rally mechanic is neither interesting, strategic, or skillful.

You can support downed. It does make things different.
Rally however is completely stupid. Just because your target spammed some AoEs and hit some wolf or naked lowby running by he deserves not to get stomped? Seriously?

Actually Rally MAKES downed looks bad because it completely screws the rez/stomp system.

The downed states need work too. They are VERY unbalanced and are only 3 kitten skills. Compare say thief/ele downed state to eng downed… it’s a kitten joke.

The penalty for being downed needs to be greater, and there needs to be a DR on the healing that multiple players can do.

ALL of these things contribute to why zergballing is the current way to go.

I do deal with/use these unskilled cheeze things every day but it’s still bullkitten.

Down state sure needs some work, revive I believe is good but rally shouldn’t be there. After almost one year now I gave up any hope to see it removed from wvw….

Take out rally, keep downed and helped res.

Yeah its kittened

Make the ability for downed state to even occur a grandmaster trait. Force players who want it to have to spec for it. Everybody is happy then.

The Rallying System, and the Down System in general is just awful… It supports massive Zerg Ball Tactics and hurts small man game play.

I mean, its ok for PVE, cause I get what they were trying to do, remove the trinity and you needed a resser (Though must better ways could of been done to fix this problem)

However for Mass Scale PvP, it is honestly the worst system i’ve seen in an MMO to date for PvP… and i’ve been playing MMO’s since UO….

I use to rate the Collision system in Warhammer pretty lowly for friendlies (For enemies I had no problem with it, but for friendlies, I always had some fat Orc behind me blocking me while i was trying to kite on my Squig Herder) but the down system in this game though….Good Lord..

I know this is an old post… but omg…

I think most of you do not understand the alive/not alive system in this game… You have not killed anything when you’ve downed someone…they’re NOT defeated…nor is the downed state intended to be a “you’re dead but you can come back” state. you’ve DOWNED someone…

i.e. say i just shot you in the kneecap and the the face (non fatal blow..clean in and out)..did i just severely hamper your survivability …hell ya… you’re PRETTY MUCH…down and out…if I walk away will you survive?…
or better yet…
if i make (obviously b/c of the turn of events) a mistake, or you can still w/ all the disadvantages thrown at your survivability take an obviously lop-sided advantage and turn it around and perhaps even finish ME off instead of me killing you when you’re at your weakest…
well… you just freaking pwnt my buttox….

The rallying system and mechanic in itself is quite (potentially) fun, useful, strategic, and even smaller groups…w/ good coordination, know-how, situational and environmental awareness can turn rallying into a pro for their side instead of a dreaded “omg this feature sux b/c it impairs my ability to win”

If rallying has repeatedly and recently been detrimental instead of beneficial to you… how about you 1. practice…. 2. study up and 3. theorize new and out-of-the-box ways to benefit from entering this state and the best ways to exit this state in the preffered manner (NOT dying)…

you have to think of this as another opportunity rather than a stupid unstrategic unfair flawed game system…. I down myself sometimes when in group situations just for the swap of skills….I know what I can and cannot do/get away with.

As a P/D thief… in small group situations…When I am at 40% or less and an opponent is being exceptionally (and this happens quite often… it is a build that is common when built correctly) slippery and hard to finish off that last 5-15%…. I’ll run straight upto and slam my face into the closest opponent to the said slippery opponent, downing myself…allowing my wep 1 skill to naturally aoe and cripple…and slow the intended target down…allowing one of my few allies to down them…. and I just shadowstep out of danger or to the next nearest opponent that is not a danger to finishing me, use smoke bomb………BOOM… just made an uncatchable, killable and stealthed myself for a prepared backstab when i rally off the crippled opponents defeat all without using any utilities or initiative….
Downed state can be a 3rd weapon set if you are brave and bold enough to pull it off…just don’t expect no mistakes and to never die off bad luck or mistiming/miscommunication/what have you…

You cannot win all the time every time and should not expect to… just try and have being downed and the rally process be benefical for you more than half the time, and try to raise your historical and expected success with this as a TOOL in your arsenal from there…

The rally mechanic is making a lot of organized wvw guilds run tagless and not want random pugs to follow them and purposely trying to lose them. ALL because one of them going down will rally a bunch of enemy downs. This goes against what the devs say they want, exclusion of gw2 players because of ill-though out game mechanics.

I know this is an old post… but omg…
…

None of that that however means that downed state and power ressing couldn’t use a small nerf. Currently these are balanced solely PvE in mind. PvE where you are all the time fighting bosses that deal massive damage.

As a P/D thief… in small group situations…When I am at 40% or less and an opponent is being exceptionally (and this happens quite often… it is a build that is common when built correctly) slippery and hard to finish off that last 5-15%…. I’ll run straight upto and slam my face into the closest opponent to the said slippery opponent, downing myself…allowing my wep 1 skill to naturally aoe and cripple…and slow the intended target down…allowing one of my few allies to down them…. and I just shadowstep out of danger or to the next nearest opponent that is not a danger to finishing me, use smoke bomb………BOOM… just made an uncatchable, killable and stealthed myself for a prepared backstab when i rally off the crippled opponents defeat all without using any utilities or initiative….

Cool story. Now try to do that as engineer.

Also, do realise that people who hate downed mechanics are often still very well aware how to abuse them. It’s just they don’t like such cheap and strange rally baiting gameplay to be part of WvW.

Downed state can be a 3rd weapon set if you are brave and bold enough to pull it off.

That’s a terrible idea unless if you are fighting complete rookies or if you are just want to show off when the fight has already been won.

One player getting defeated should not rally multiple opponents. I like downed as a chance to be brought up, but rally should just go away and a defeat should require a portal in WvW. Don’t care how it works in PvE.

If ANet wanted to get really fancy Rally could be a bonus mechanic of outnumbered.