Guild Wars 2

SoR completely dominated TC and SBI last time.

Primarily because SBI didn’t really have a chance (and thus, gave up)…

SoR then was free to completely focus on TC.

It wasn’t a “fair” battle. SoR’s numbers were just more massive for all times during the day.

Even when they had us (Tarnished Coast) pushed back to our spawn point… We were still taking out more of them than they were of us. They just had like 30 people (at like 2am EDT) compared to our 10.

Numbers mean everything in WvW.

If ArenaNet found a decent way to adjust for that, then battles would be vastly more even.

(Give realms low on players extra Veteran NPCs that follow the server’s players around, for example…)

The funny thing here is every1 in this post is w8 for a Anet response and u will not any. In the past week they make clear that they don’t mind the opnion of the wvw players

Diashame.6328:

They mentioned other things as to why reset, like tier 8 having a massive disadvantage to jump out of it’s tier due to total points being so low AND they are modifying the points score.

A couple of weeks of boredom to give everyone an equal chance of finding their natural home is fine by me.

…tell me which server that is currently in T8 doesn’t BELOND in T8 or T7.

Minos.5168:

SoR completely dominated TC and SBI last time.

Primarily because SBI didn’t really have a chance (and thus, gave up)…

SoR then was free to completely focus on TC.

It wasn’t a “fair” battle. SoR’s numbers were just more massive for all times during the day.

Even when they had us (Tarnished Coast) pushed back to our spawn point… We were still taking out more of them than they were of us. They just had like 30 people (at like 2am EDT) compared to our 10.

Numbers mean everything in WvW.

If ArenaNet found a decent way to adjust for that, then battles would be vastly more even.

(Give realms low on players extra Veteran NPCs that follow the server’s players around, for example…)

…this week, SBI has had the most fun they’ve had in weeks. This is at the price of several weeks of getting smashed. With populations now mostly stable, the trend shouldn’t change.

WHICH part of what you said justifies the rating reset?

A single Anet employee is playing on a server that is getting steamrolled.

Therefore the only solution is……. we must reset ALL THE SERVERS!!!!

Convenant.7092:

…this week, SBI has had the most fun they’ve had in weeks. This is at the price of several weeks of getting smashed. With populations now mostly stable, the trend shouldn’t change.

WHICH part of what you said justifies the rating reset?

I’m just not understanding what the opposition to a rating reset is…

It’ll be based off of the results from the current match-ups, right?

So whatever happens this week determines next week’s match-ups.

Which seems to be in agreement with what you said about SBI finally getting “stabilized.”

With all the unequal matches previously (whether due to population shifts or whatever), it’s clear that the prior ratings weren’t correct.

Oh, and need I re-iterate…

The un-balanced match that I was speaking of happened just last week. Not weeks ago.

So I’m not sure why you think that the current “ratings” will balance out any quicker than new ratings.

I’m sure they’ll be smart and not drop T1 servers down to T6.

It’s in ArenaNet’s best interest to keep WvW fun.

Minos.5168:

Convenant.7092:

…this week, SBI has had the most fun they’ve had in weeks. This is at the price of several weeks of getting smashed. With populations now mostly stable, the trend shouldn’t change.

WHICH part of what you said justifies the rating reset?

I’m just not understanding what the opposition to a rating reset is…

It’ll be based off of the results from the current match-ups, right?

So whatever happens this week determines next week’s match-ups.

Which seems to be in agreement with what you said about SBI finally getting “stabilized.”

With all the unequal matches previously (whether due to population shifts or whatever), it’s clear that the prior ratings weren’t correct.

The current ratings are a hell of a lot more accurate than they will be for the next month if this reset goes through.

Minos.5168:

I’m sure they’ll be smart and not drop T1 servers down to T6.

And yet the logical conclusion from what they said is that that is exactly what will happen and they haven’t denied it.

If they continue on this path we need from Anet a specific justification well before reset addressing the quite reasonable points raised by players here.

Minos.5168:

Convenant.7092:

…this week, SBI has had the most fun they’ve had in weeks. This is at the price of several weeks of getting smashed. With populations now mostly stable, the trend shouldn’t change.

WHICH part of what you said justifies the rating reset?

I’m just not understanding what the opposition to a rating reset is…

It’ll be based off of the results from the current match-ups, right?

So whatever happens this week determines next week’s match-ups.

Which seems to be in agreement with what you said about SBI finally getting “stabilized.”

With all the unequal matches previously (whether due to population shifts or whatever), it’s clear that the prior ratings weren’t correct.

The opposition is, as far as we can tell, the biggest winners of this week will go on to face each other.

Example:
T5 Ehmry Bay is significantly beat the other two servers.
Likewise T8 Sorrow’s Furnace is doing the same.

Because these two servers are winning by the biggest margins, they will be in T1 next week(from what we can tell) facing Kaineng. ProTip, Kaineng’s population coverage is going to crush those two servers.

T1 JQ SoR and SoS, being one of if not the most balanced matchup, are splitting points and therefore (as of right now)won’t remain in T1 or even be in T2 next week.

The only saving grace to having a reset is if they weighted the scores for this week’s matchup… but then that kind of defeats the purpose of a reset. >_>

TL;DR: in today’s ranking, a reset will only cause more chaos than good because we have already stabilized. (for the most part)

Sorry – wrong thread. Apologies.

Minos.5168:

Oh, and need I re-iterate…

The un-balanced match that I was speaking of happened just last week. Not weeks ago.

So I’m not sure why you think that the current “ratings” will balance out any quicker than new ratings.

I’m sure they’ll be smart and not drop T1 servers down to T6.

It’s in ArenaNet’s best interest to keep WvW fun.

The rating system work this way if u hold a 650+ tick u will get alot of rating point, so for example NA server Sorrow’s Furnace will be in t1 next week and they are un t8 right now. it not like ohhh we are Anet so we will set this server vs this server NO. the rating u have decide. So yeah next week u will have a T1 server fight againt a T5 or a T6

you are in the wrong thread

morrolan.9608:

Minos.5168:

I’m sure they’ll be smart and not drop T1 servers down to T6.

And yet the logical conclusion from what they said is that that is exactly what will happen and they haven’t denied it.

If they continue on this path we need from Anet a specific justification well before reset addressing the quite reasonable points raised by players here.

Exactly!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Coming-Soon-WvW-Rating-Reset/1313585

We expect several weeks of volatility while the ratings settle down but we believe that it will ultimately yield a more correct result more quickly than letting the current ratings persist.

Unfortunately, the bold part simply isn’t true. <3 them for trying though. (no sarcasm)

T1 servers dropping down more than one tier is exactly what “we expect several weeks of volatility” means.

I believe Anet needs to reset WvW ratings because of the new formula, which will be better in a long term.

They need to leave things be as they are. The transfer fest hasn’t had time to settle down yet. They are doing something based on too little to practically no data. To make an intelligent decision they need to wait a bit and see where things settle. Even then there will always be anomalies. Some servers wont fit well into the tier they are in or the one above and below them. That’s the way it is and there will always be those servers.

Toggles.1783:

morrolan.9608:

Minos.5168:

I’m sure they’ll be smart and not drop T1 servers down to T6.

And yet the logical conclusion from what they said is that that is exactly what will happen and they haven’t denied it.

If they continue on this path we need from Anet a specific justification well before reset addressing the quite reasonable points raised by players here.

Exactly!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Coming-Soon-WvW-Rating-Reset/1313585

We expect several weeks of volatility while the ratings settle down but we believe that it will ultimately yield a more correct result more quickly than letting the current ratings persist.

Unfortunately, the bold part simply isn’t true. <3 them for trying though. (no sarcasm)

T1 servers dropping down more than one tier is exactly what “we expect several weeks of volatility” means.

That is EXACTLY my point. I go on and get quotes and data, and everyone ignores them and still gives the same arguments.. silly how people respond after reading the first line of the thread.

Iris Ng.9845:

I believe Anet needs to reset WvW ratings because of the new formula, which will be better in a long term.

I think it will change very little, which is one of the issues. The math changes are to allow servers that suffer mass loss of players settle faster to their more appropriate rank, awesome idea… about 2 months ago. With the end of free transfers, situations like HoD and ET will simply not happen again.

Couple of issues with the OPs analysis: your not includig the current queue bug issues, if we went back to having the proper number of people per zone i think youd see that the matchups would become much less ballenced.

I currently play in Tier 1, Anet have announced a rating reset and likely my server will fall to tier 3-4-5 at the end of this week as we are in a hard struggle. We will fight on.

It is likely three different teams will be in tier 1 at the end of the week. I will congratulate them and fight on.

Next week we will fight again and if good enough we will move up a tier or two.

If we earn it we will return to tier 1. Not a fan of the reset but it is just a new challenge.

Tammuz.7361:

Couple of issues with the OPs analysis: your not includig the current queue bug issues, if we went back to having the proper number of people per zone i think youd see that the matchups would become much less ballenced.

I think you are overestimating the impact of queue bugs. There is no queue bugs in most tiers.

elkirin.8534:

I currently play in Tier 1, Anet have announced a rating reset and likely my server will fall to tier 3-4-5 at the end of this week as we are in a hard struggle. We will fight on.

It is likely three different teams will be in tier 1 at the end of the week. I will congratulate them and fight on.

Next week we will fight again and if good enough we will move up a tier or two.

If we earn it we will return to tier 1. Not a fan of the reset but it is just a new challenge.

It won’t be a challenge though, you’ll be a tier 1 server fighting tier 5 servers. It’s just a minor hassle.

Cosmic.6047:

There is no disconnection. With all the transfers & last minute transfers many tiers
are totally lopsided ( 3 tiers where the leading server has more points than the other 2 combined ). Does the reset make the next few weeks more volatile yes but servers are going to find there right spot more quickly because the history got wiped. Many servers are stuck in a tier where they don’t belong because of the history in the rating system. Is it unfortunate for some ? Yes. But it’s good for most.

I’m not sure what matchups you are looking at, but the NA matchups this week are about as close to balanced as they are going to get. A couple servers here and there might be off by a tier, but its a good ranking list. So please, identify these “many servers” that are stuck in the wrong tier. Maybe the EU side is really messed up but the NA side is in a good spot right now and the reset will destroy balance for several weeks only to bring us back to where we are now.

I agree that a reset is fair after free transfers end.

However they should have put a week or two of fast matchups of 1 or 3 days not more.

This, although not perfect, would have saved us a lot of boring weeks.

Next week in EU we are having 2 servers moving up more than 20 posts in the classification, this is quite an aberration.

I doubt they do this for money as most of the people will trade gold for gems if they want to transfer, they will not buy with cash.

I agree that for some strange reason Anet has mistreated WvW players since launch, with crap updates if any.

I think the disconnection the OP talks about sadly happens in every big game and this one is no exception.

It is difficult to listen to the player base as it always has a variety of contradictory opinions, but I dont understand this case, where it is obvious that the WvW population is the one keeping the game alive and running.

Or anyone imagines this game without WvW and its players?

As stated on the MoS site:

“ANet has not announced the math yet so the site will use the old formula and the ‘next matchup table’ may be innacurate.”

So SF/EB/K in T1 won’t happen (sorry guys).

I would be very surprised if we aren’t informed of the new formulas in the next day or two. It would have made sense for them to do it last week when they announced the reset.

Actinotus.6410:

As stated on the MoS site:

“ANet has not announced the math yet so the site will use the old formula and the ‘next matchup table’ may be innacurate.”

So SF/EB/K in T1 won’t happen (sorry guys).

I would be very surprised if we aren’t informed of the new formulas in the next day or two. It would have made sense for them to do it last week when they announced the reset.

The math does not matter. Whichever servers win by the largest margins will be the new T1 if they are truly resetting the ranking points. The math will only come into play in subsequent weeks when severs have different amounts of ranking points. So yes, we will see SF/EB/K in T1 or something similarly absurd.

I don’t get why we are trusting the info from a third party site.

But I do agree that we need to squeeze-out more information from Arenanet about this new maths. Work week is just starting, which is probably why we don’t get any answers yet.

Kraken.7514:

I agree that a reset is fair after free transfers end.

However they should have put a week or two of fast matchups of 1 or 3 days not more.

This, although not perfect, would have saved us a lot of boring weeks.

Next week in EU we are having 2 servers moving up more than 20 posts in the classification, this is quite an aberration.

I doubt they do this for money as most of the people will trade gold for gems if they want to transfer, they will not buy with cash.

I agree that for some strange reason Anet has mistreated WvW players since launch, with crap updates if any.

I think the disconnection the OP talks about sadly happens in every big game and this one is no exception.

It is difficult to listen to the player base as it always has a variety of contradictory opinions, but I dont understand this case, where it is obvious that the WvW population is the one keeping the game alive and running.

Or anyone imagines this game without WvW and its players?

You talk alot of sense. I know from the 500+ guild I am a member of thatplayers are spending less time in game…APART from the WvW community which is growing as understandably more and more playersare seeking something new, less predictable and more challenging overall.

Of course the one thing that puts the kKarbosh on that is very unbalanced matchups.

I cannot arrange a guild event to introduce inexperienced people to WvW when a Bandwagon server is spawn camping everything with their hordes after having utterly dominated the map for days on end.

To be honest it somewhat feels as a way to draw attention from all the issues that still plague WvW.

This Feb WvW better be here soon and it’d better have some fixes.

I have to wonder why they didn’t just use a mathematical formula to tighten the ratings up instead of resetting them.

they seem to have this “our game will be screwed up for a couple weeks but thats OK” attitude.

some people will just stop playing the game if they can’t have fun playing WvW for a couple of weeks. they’ve shown with the ET and HOD incident they are just fine with that for some reason.

People are talking about “new math..”

In my original post, I’ve put up a quote in which they’ve already admitted to have weeks of turmoil. All your “new maths” argument is completely, utterly invalid.

The point is: NEW MATH OR NOT,

reset = weeks of turmoil (as ArenaNet stated)
no reset = all good matchups

We need 48 hour match-ups. That is the way to get the ratings in order.

Let’s be honest. Most matches are decided by the 48 hour mark. For uneven match-ups that means the servers are just waiting for reset.

Not looking forward to the next several weeks at all.

Everyone who got an even match this week will have low ratings.
Everyone who had an uneven match will send one or two teams shooting down and one other team rocketing up.

Tier 1 next week is just going to be whatever teams happened to do the best out of their individual tiers. That’s gonna be a week of complete suck.

style.6173:

We need 48 hour match-ups. That is the way to get the ratings in order.

Let’s be honest. Most matches are decided by the 48 hour mark. For uneven match-ups that means the servers are just waiting for reset.

I completely disagree with this.
I’m on a server that’s very strong on the week days, stronger than on weekends. This means that during the weekend we might appear weaker and then catch up during the week.

3 day matchups for 21 days and then back to one week. Or just leave them at 3 days. One week matches suck by wednesday anyway.

yriafelc.6124:

I don’t get why we are trusting the info from a third party site.

But I do agree that we need to squeeze-out more information from Arenanet about this new maths. Work week is just starting, which is probably why we don’t get any answers yet.

Because the third party site has been providing us that information for months, reliably, why wouldn’t we be trusting them?

yriafelc.6124:

I don’t get why we are trusting the info from a third party site.

But I do agree that we need to squeeze-out more information from Arenanet about this new maths. Work week is just starting, which is probably why we don’t get any answers yet.

are u seriously asking that question???
that third party is eons ahead of what excel sheet copy paste that u get from Anet once every 3 weeks.

I never type in the forums but this topic has forced me ^.^. The OP is absolutely correct, there is no need at all for a server reset. Lets just look at the servers that have had (in my view watching from inside WvW and the matchups every week) large alliance movements:-
Based on the “old” matchup system scoring"
Kain – Moved up several tiers, this week in tier 3 with expectation to go to T2 next week
Answer – correctly balanced
DBrand/Mag – Moved up a tier or two over the past weeks into T3
Answer – Correct position for these servers currently
CD Appeared to lose some strength and has dropped down to T4
Answer = Correct Tier
SBI/IOJ Lost major guilds which caused rapid drops from T1/T2 down to T4/T5
Answer = Within a tier of balance, maybe SBI is T5/T4, maybe IoJ is T6/T5 but they are relatively competitive in this weeks matchups.

Same with EU servers, Arbor and Btide had already lost matches and were headed to the bottom 2 tiers already which would have been completed this or next week .

The ONLY reason I can see for an adjustment of the scoring system is to stop the bottom Tier becoming “marooned”. My suggestion to this would be for the bottom Tier only to have a “winner gets promoted system”. This would at least give the bottom tier something to fight for each week rather than knowing no matter what happened theyd be facing the same two forever….
I did consider forgetting the scoring system completely and saying top goes up a tier, bottom drops a tier but although it would make different natches every week for everyone and possibly more interesting, the downside as I can see it is that the 3rd placed Tier would get ganged up on to keep them down which is not a good result.

I really just hope there is a math adjustment to help T8 without the reset everyone to 1500 which will be a total fiasco. Having looked at the Mil predictions for next week (if they are correct), I see only one match that would possibly be competitive and that is the way to kill WvW anet…….

100% agree with OP.

If you think the match up reset is a good thing, are you arguing that it would produce a faster track to stable, balanced match ups? I think the trends on millenium are pretty clear that we’ll be stable and balanced in 1-2 weeks.

Or are you arguing that it will produce a totally different set of balanced, stable tier match ups? Since WvW is largely dictated by numbers, I don’t see this happening. The upper tier servers are upper tier due to their coverage and numbers. Resetting the ratings isn’t going to change that. The lower tiers are lower because of numbers. (Note that skill is important, but I think it is way over shadowed by numbers).

I think it would be nice to see some form of ANET response on this topic, are they even considering what all of us mere players think?

Another thread on the same topic: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/wuvwuv/Why-are-we-wrecking-the-WvW-matchups-when/first#postkitten 44